Same color armor is one of the less-obtrusive ways to tell friend from foe in large 3-way PvP battles; Much less obtrusive than nameplates or big flags sticking out of players' backs. For PvE, I prefer highly customizable armor.
I agree that individuality is not that important for PvP, but there a ton of players playing TF2 that would disagree with me. Just because players' armor is the same color, doesn't mean you can't be individual based on your weapons or head-gear or something.
Problem is in games like TF2 pretty much all the gear is "equal", which is not always the case in MMOs. The hat in TF2 means nothing really in the outcome of the match, while a helmet in MMO usually adds to your stats. Colour coding is fine, it's for competetive PvP, it's needed ine one way or another to distinguish players from opposing team. Plenty of time to look at your own character while outside of the PvP scenarios, to the point i assure you, you will be sick of it soon enough xP
They should be able to easily let us keep our armor looks while just setting everythign to max stats and all blue or red color dye sets. It makes sense in pvp. Maybe not in WvWvW. I'm fine with it so far.
They should be able to easily let us keep our armor looks while just setting everythign to max stats and all blue or red color dye sets. It makes sense in pvp. Maybe not in WvWvW. I'm fine with it so far.
Thats a good idea you keep your toon armor skins(from Pve) while stats get boosted to the max (equal) with a (red/bleu)flag you carry in your back .
but its nice to look good as you fight, I like it for my own pleasure not everyone else's so you know, just a simple name tag or cape or I dunno.just not the whole armor
Originally posted by Alot Would any of you prefer for example a glow around your character, indicating your allegiance, rather than your armor being dyed blue/red?
Enemy mobs have a red glow around them so why not do it for enemy players ? Would be better than dying the armour in my opinion.
Colored armor is the most efficient way distinguish allies from enemies. After all nobody cares about armor colors in PvP ...no one I'd take seriously anyway.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
It's a great idea, straight from FPS online play. No reason not to do this, unless you just really want to be pretty while killing other people. PvP should be about violence and mayhem, not a fashion show.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Yeah but notice that you cummulate glory points for better looking armor. What for would i need better armor if 90% of it is either red or blue? No fun in picking colors from dye system, no fun changing stuff based on 3 color areas per item etc.
God forbid they try and make a game about competition and fun rather then "showing off who has the best loot" am I right?
There is an entire world of PvE for showing off loot.
I understood it was an option, like checking a box to Apply to All Sets. I might be wrong or I'm just projecting. Personally, I'd like to keep it on by default, then manually override it when I wished and save sets or pieces with whichever scheme I chose. Basically, get the best of both worlds.
EDIT:
I think I missed the crucial PvP part of this.
I don't find the set piece PvP to be that adversely affected by it since I kind of view it as a more formal contest and the colors act as uniforms for the teams.
I'd have more of a problem with it in WvWvW though.
Why not just make your character appear to you as he/she normally looks but make the other characters appear with the pure red and blue armor? Or just make it something optional?
Why not just make your character appear to you as he/she normally looks but make the other characters appear with the pure red and blue armor? Or just make it something optional?
And what if you are wearing the same colour armour as the enemy team. Wouldn't that cause even more confusion.
I'd have more of a problem with it in WvWvW though.
If anything you'd have to do it in W vs W vs W for a variety of reasons -
More players = more to keep track of, more useful to keep track of friends vs. foes
Performance - much easier for the engine/client/server to load up 8 "unique" looks with matching different color schemes forced then thousands of completely unique characters.
I'd have more of a problem with it in WvWvW though.
If anything you'd have to do it in W vs W vs W for a variety of reasons -
More players = more to keep track of, more useful to keep track of friends vs. foes
Performance - much easier for the engine/client/server to load up 8 "unique" looks with matching different color schemes forced then thousands of completely unique characters.
Well, I was thinking that the other two servers (your opponents) would get painted like in 5v5, but your own server's players would retain their personal colors. Makes the enemy easily identifiable, allows you to tell them apart from one another, but you still be stylin' in front of yo peeps. There would just be red, blue and you.
I don't know what kind of hit that would mean for processing though.
I don't know what kind of hit that would mean for processing though.
Huge.
There is a reason lightning fast FPS games don't (usually) allow for too much in the way of appearance customization and/or why they don't go over a couple dozen players at most (typically)
Why not just make your character appear to you as he/she normally looks but make the other characters appear with the pure red and blue armor? Or just make it something optional?
And what if you are wearing the same colour armour as the enemy team. Wouldn't that cause even more confusion.
I guess if you're unable to keep track of what team you're on it would . But honestly, I don't think there will be many players that are wearing purely red or blue dyed armor.
But really, there are so many pretty easy solutions to this. A lot of games just change the color of the players name over their head. If GW2 doesn't have the name over head thing then they could have standard dyed capes or something like GW1, or a tabard like WoW. I don't see the need to turn everyone into pure red or blue armored characters.
I'm with the side that likes auto-dyeing. It's important for quickly distinguishing who is an ally and who is an enemy. I also like blue and red colors.. so.
I really like it. I'm sure they'll find better iterations later on eventually, but I got an instant reminder of Halo, seeing PvP'ers dawning full red & blue. I think it's nice, personally.
This is the first Ive heard of it, but I dont mind it a bit either. In fact, I sort of like it. You'll look like an army all in similar uniform.
Besides, if people dont like this, then just wait. Does anyone realize how many guilds in the game are going to demand you wear certain colors to identify yourself as part of that guild? It'll be all over the place.
Anyways, regarding the PvP thing, who cares? Its not a fashion show. Its PvP.
Well one guy did mention that you couldn't tell an ele from a necro in the videos and I noticed that as well. I don't think PvP is about looking good but I generally do more PvE so when I work for a pice of gear I want it when I dabble in PvP. If there was a way to let me at least keep the armors and weapon skins I work hard for, and just have the autodye hit me up as whatever color I don't think it's too bad. If they make each class go to some generic armor and color though they need to differentiate the clothys a littel better. The devs did say they wanted players to see someone casting a spell and know what it was they were fixen to get hit with. Kinda makes it tough when you don't know what it is that is fixen to hit you.
From what I understand, gear in Competitive PvP is standardized, just as it is in GW1. You will probably have some options to suit your build, but everyone will have the same options available. In W vs. W vs. W you are supposed to have access to all your gear and it's not equalized for balance.
Auto Dye seems perfectly fine to me for Competitive PvP. Better than a colored aura or a colored cape. World vs. World is maybe a little different, but I think I still would prefer uniform colors for each World, rather than capes/auras. Does anyone know how they handle this in World vs. World?
Originally posted by Ezhae Originally posted by Palebane Same color armor is one of the less-obtrusive ways to tell friend from foe in large 3-way PvP battles; Much less obtrusive than nameplates or big flags sticking out of players' backs. For PvE, I prefer highly customizable armor. I agree that individuality is not that important for PvP, but there a ton of players playing TF2 that would disagree with me. Just because players' armor is the same color, doesn't mean you can't be individual based on your weapons or head-gear or something.
Problem is in games like TF2 pretty much all the gear is "equal", which is not always the case in MMOs. The hat in TF2 means nothing really in the outcome of the match, while a helmet in MMO usually adds to your stats. Colour coding is fine, it's for competetive PvP, it's needed ine one way or another to distinguish players from opposing team. Plenty of time to look at your own character while outside of the PvP scenarios, to the point i assure you, you will be sick of it soon enough xP
PvP in GW2 actually works more like TF2 than like most MMOs. In structured PvP (not WvWvW), your gear doesn't matter, and it's also different from what you wear outside of PvP. There is no point in time when you can look at your character's armor outside of PvP because at that time you won't be wearing the PvP armor. You have a special "loadout" just for PvP matches.
They also confirmed that, like TF2, there will be unlockable hats (among other things) and they won't have any stats on them. The TF2 analogy is perfect, except that the hats in TF2 actually can be dyed.
Personally, I'd rather them make it so either only the main portion of your armor is team-colored and the other two sections are some default color (or changeable), or make it so that it uses three different shades of your team color. As it is, the armor looks very plain, like someone dipped the whole thing in a big can of paint.
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." -Dr. Seuss
They shouldnt add color capes or any type of auto dye at all.
Look at DAoC. (Personal Opinion) The Best PVP Game ever created. You can dye your armor any color you wish, and its very difficult for a newbie to tell the difference between all the classes. This makes the game fun, and those who put the time in to play will become better.
I'd have more of a problem with it in WvWvW though.
If anything you'd have to do it in W vs W vs W for a variety of reasons -
More players = more to keep track of, more useful to keep track of friends vs. foes
Performance - much easier for the engine/client/server to load up 8 "unique" looks with matching different color schemes forced then thousands of completely unique characters.
WvWvW is normal gear, only red vs blue in the hot join and tournement pvp
Originally posted by drazzah They shouldnt add color capes or any type of auto dye at all.
Look at DAoC. (Personal Opinion) The Best PVP Game ever created. You can dye your armor any color you wish, and its very difficult for a newbie to tell the difference between all the classes. This makes the game fun, and those who put the time in to play will become better.
DAoC has race-specific factions. Telling classes apart is irrelevant. You have to be able to tell which team is which.
Also, making a game very difficult for newbies is never good design. My prime example of well-designed objective-based gameplay is TF2. Anyone can join a game, pick a class, and it is immediately apparent exactly what the player is supposed to do: head to the objective and kill anyone of the opposing color along the way. More experienced players are simply better at doing so. Learning how to play should never be hard.
If a player ever asks, "What do I do?" then the game is incomplete and the developers still have work to do. This applies even if the player skips the tutorial.
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." -Dr. Seuss
PvP is about destroying the other players not looking good. I don't think they would use this in WvWvW anyways,get over it
Ditto. I just became aware of this color system, but it seems to me that this is a very good idea.
I think classspecific armor looks and server specific Colors could reduce a lot of lag in WvWvW.....
They should give people the option to choose ... between orriginal armor and color looks and a lot of lag...... or the PvParmors and colors.... and virtually no lag....
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Comments
Problem is in games like TF2 pretty much all the gear is "equal", which is not always the case in MMOs. The hat in TF2 means nothing really in the outcome of the match, while a helmet in MMO usually adds to your stats. Colour coding is fine, it's for competetive PvP, it's needed ine one way or another to distinguish players from opposing team. Plenty of time to look at your own character while outside of the PvP scenarios, to the point i assure you, you will be sick of it soon enough xP
They should be able to easily let us keep our armor looks while just setting everythign to max stats and all blue or red color dye sets. It makes sense in pvp. Maybe not in WvWvW. I'm fine with it so far.
My theme song.
Thats a good idea you keep your toon armor skins(from Pve) while stats get boosted to the max (equal) with a (red/bleu)flag you carry in your back .
Enemy mobs have a red glow around them so why not do it for enemy players ? Would be better than dying the armour in my opinion.
Colored armor is the most efficient way distinguish allies from enemies. After all nobody cares about armor colors in PvP ...no one I'd take seriously anyway.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
It's a great idea, straight from FPS online play. No reason not to do this, unless you just really want to be pretty while killing other people. PvP should be about violence and mayhem, not a fashion show.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
WTF? No subscription fee?
God forbid they try and make a game about competition and fun rather then "showing off who has the best loot" am I right?
There is an entire world of PvE for showing off loot.
Let PvP be about skill.
I understood it was an option, like checking a box to Apply to All Sets. I might be wrong or I'm just projecting. Personally, I'd like to keep it on by default, then manually override it when I wished and save sets or pieces with whichever scheme I chose. Basically, get the best of both worlds.
EDIT:
I think I missed the crucial PvP part of this.
I don't find the set piece PvP to be that adversely affected by it since I kind of view it as a more formal contest and the colors act as uniforms for the teams.
I'd have more of a problem with it in WvWvW though.
Why not just make your character appear to you as he/she normally looks but make the other characters appear with the pure red and blue armor? Or just make it something optional?
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
And what if you are wearing the same colour armour as the enemy team. Wouldn't that cause even more confusion.
If anything you'd have to do it in W vs W vs W for a variety of reasons -
More players = more to keep track of, more useful to keep track of friends vs. foes
Performance - much easier for the engine/client/server to load up 8 "unique" looks with matching different color schemes forced then thousands of completely unique characters.
Well, I was thinking that the other two servers (your opponents) would get painted like in 5v5, but your own server's players would retain their personal colors. Makes the enemy easily identifiable, allows you to tell them apart from one another, but you still be stylin' in front of yo peeps. There would just be red, blue and you.
I don't know what kind of hit that would mean for processing though.
Huge.
There is a reason lightning fast FPS games don't (usually) allow for too much in the way of appearance customization and/or why they don't go over a couple dozen players at most (typically)
I guess if you're unable to keep track of what team you're on it would
. But honestly, I don't think there will be many players that are wearing purely red or blue dyed armor.
But really, there are so many pretty easy solutions to this. A lot of games just change the color of the players name over their head. If GW2 doesn't have the name over head thing then they could have standard dyed capes or something like GW1, or a tabard like WoW. I don't see the need to turn everyone into pure red or blue armored characters.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
I'm with the side that likes auto-dyeing. It's important for quickly distinguishing who is an ally and who is an enemy. I also like blue and red colors.. so.
He who keeps his cool best wins.
This is the first Ive heard of it, but I dont mind it a bit either. In fact, I sort of like it. You'll look like an army all in similar uniform.
Besides, if people dont like this, then just wait. Does anyone realize how many guilds in the game are going to demand you wear certain colors to identify yourself as part of that guild? It'll be all over the place.
Anyways, regarding the PvP thing, who cares? Its not a fashion show. Its PvP.
Well one guy did mention that you couldn't tell an ele from a necro in the videos and I noticed that as well. I don't think PvP is about looking good but I generally do more PvE so when I work for a pice of gear I want it when I dabble in PvP. If there was a way to let me at least keep the armors and weapon skins I work hard for, and just have the autodye hit me up as whatever color I don't think it's too bad. If they make each class go to some generic armor and color though they need to differentiate the clothys a littel better. The devs did say they wanted players to see someone casting a spell and know what it was they were fixen to get hit with. Kinda makes it tough when you don't know what it is that is fixen to hit you.
RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.
From what I understand, gear in Competitive PvP is standardized, just as it is in GW1. You will probably have some options to suit your build, but everyone will have the same options available. In W vs. W vs. W you are supposed to have access to all your gear and it's not equalized for balance.
Auto Dye seems perfectly fine to me for Competitive PvP. Better than a colored aura or a colored cape. World vs. World is maybe a little different, but I think I still would prefer uniform colors for each World, rather than capes/auras. Does anyone know how they handle this in World vs. World?
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
Problem is in games like TF2 pretty much all the gear is "equal", which is not always the case in MMOs. The hat in TF2 means nothing really in the outcome of the match, while a helmet in MMO usually adds to your stats. Colour coding is fine, it's for competetive PvP, it's needed ine one way or another to distinguish players from opposing team. Plenty of time to look at your own character while outside of the PvP scenarios, to the point i assure you, you will be sick of it soon enough xP
PvP in GW2 actually works more like TF2 than like most MMOs. In structured PvP (not WvWvW), your gear doesn't matter, and it's also different from what you wear outside of PvP. There is no point in time when you can look at your character's armor outside of PvP because at that time you won't be wearing the PvP armor. You have a special "loadout" just for PvP matches.
They also confirmed that, like TF2, there will be unlockable hats (among other things) and they won't have any stats on them. The TF2 analogy is perfect, except that the hats in TF2 actually can be dyed.
Personally, I'd rather them make it so either only the main portion of your armor is team-colored and the other two sections are some default color (or changeable), or make it so that it uses three different shades of your team color. As it is, the armor looks very plain, like someone dipped the whole thing in a big can of paint.
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." -Dr. Seuss
They shouldnt add color capes or any type of auto dye at all.
Look at DAoC. (Personal Opinion) The Best PVP Game ever created. You can dye your armor any color you wish, and its very difficult for a newbie to tell the difference between all the classes. This makes the game fun, and those who put the time in to play will become better.
WvWvW is normal gear, only red vs blue in the hot join and tournement pvp
DAoC has race-specific factions. Telling classes apart is irrelevant. You have to be able to tell which team is which.
Also, making a game very difficult for newbies is never good design. My prime example of well-designed objective-based gameplay is TF2. Anyone can join a game, pick a class, and it is immediately apparent exactly what the player is supposed to do: head to the objective and kill anyone of the opposing color along the way. More experienced players are simply better at doing so. Learning how to play should never be hard.
If a player ever asks, "What do I do?" then the game is incomplete and the developers still have work to do. This applies even if the player skips the tutorial.
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." -Dr. Seuss
Ditto. I just became aware of this color system, but it seems to me that this is a very good idea.
I think classspecific armor looks and server specific Colors could reduce a lot of lag in WvWvW.....
They should give people the option to choose ... between orriginal armor and color looks and a lot of lag...... or the PvParmors and colors.... and virtually no lag....
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)