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Henrik Speaks About Territory Control!
username509
Member CommonPosts: 635
Some quotes from IRC and the forums, about Territory Control and a few related subjects such as alliances.
<@HenrikNystrom>; we will add an alliance shortly after the first package is the plan
<@HenrikNystrom>; with some basic feature, to be able to set the correct guild flags
<@HenrikNystrom>; theres a lot behind the new territory system
<@HenrikNystrom>; including prominence points
<@HenrikNystrom>; we are working on giving options to the guild leader to pass on his members to have diff options and access
<@HenrikNystrom>; we are looking over the options to allow players to have better options to sell and buy wares from other players while offline
<@HenrikNystrom>; and with the new npc system in keeps it will open up for a lot of interaction
<@HenrikNystrom>; for instance, a keep owner would want to encourage players to sell wares to their treasuer, due to they get PP
<@HenrikNystrom>; we did add underground room in the keep
<@HenrikNystrom>; one is the map tactical war room
<@HenrikNystrom>; as you all know we have been discussing a gate keeeper for some time now
<@HenrikNystrom>; there are good and bad things with that function
<@HenrikNystrom>; the first step we have taken now, is the optiont to add guards in keep and close to the keep
<@HenrikNystrom>; but at this point, we are still limited in the AI and req more work before we have patroling fully functional guards
<@HenrikNystrom>; so at this point, they have their position
<@HenrikNystrom>; and have their crossbow ready
<@HenrikNystrom>; ah yes, yuou will be able to upgrade the wooden walls later on, that will give a more similar look to that
<@HenrikNystrom>; we have added climbing ladders, so we are now not restricted to have a stair way that req a lot of space, look at those crazy black towers
<@HenrikNystrom>; ya pallisades are not easy at all for us to solve, one way we build it in a way that its not dynamic placed anymore which is the goal, but adds security
<@HenrikNystrom>; in another way we have dynamic placement, but have a huge challenge to work with security
<@HenrikNystrom>; the system must know is the walls intact or not, where are they placed etc
<@HenrikNystrom>; for a gate keeper to work
<@HenrikNystrom>; now when we finaly managed to build a fully working dynamic placement
<@HenrikNystrom>; we want to use that on everything
<@HenrikNystrom>; if possible
<@HenrikNystrom>; I think most agree
<@HenrikNystrom>; we can sacrifice dynamic placement, add have a better controll
<@HenrikNystrom>; right now, we are excited to see how players use dynamic tower controll
<@HenrikNystrom>; there is so much tactics and planning behind the placement
<@HenrikNystrom>; so it req a lot of reseach to be succesful
<@HenrikNystrom>; and gives strenghs or weakness in their control
<@HenrikNystrom>; based on placement
Here’s a bit from Mats Persson on the forums about Territory Control.
Building/maintaining a Tower costs CP from your pool. The Tower will of course earn you those CP back if it starts to expand its area. However an area may only be “counted once”, so although it is possible to build a lot of Towers next to each other, you will gain less CP from that area than it costs to maintain them.
Still it’s a viable strategy if you can transfer those points from somewhere else in the Cluster. But if someone cuts of the supply line, those Towers will be in trouble as they don’t earn their upkeep
I’m very happy you liked the video!
There will be some kind of Q&A later, but I’ll try to answer some of your questions right away:
Quote:
Originally Posted by devencreek
I love it… but is it also possible that these land control points might overlap, so that there are areas that are claimed by different guilds at the same time?
No. First off, a Tower/Control Structure cannot be placed in another Territory. Secondly, a Tower that is set to expand will stop when it encounters another Territory border. It will only expand if the area of the other Tower is decreased, either by your opponent transferring Control Points, or by you destroying it, or parts of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarecrovv
So, I wasn’t entirely sure, does this system include being able to turn off “guards” in the town of your choosing? As in “Your town, your rules”
Yes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aramsm
Now my question: how will we climb that tower?
You see those ladders? Yes..
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeduliMystery
Ok, so what happens when you make someone an outlaw and they go in your territory? Do they automatically turn red? Can you just kill them with impunity?
They are flagged and may be killed by anyone without penalties.
Quote:
You can destroy these control towers right? How many hitpoints do these control towers have?
The Towers can be partially destroyed tier by tier (unlike Houses and Keeps). Compared to other buildings they have a relatively small amount of HP, and doesn’t take as long to construct. All this is to allow for more dynamic game play. Although the numbers will probably need to be rebalanced many times.
Quote:
Is the political miniature map just a decoration? Does it do anything more the what you can already do with teamspeak/website?
The map on the website will only display the owner, number of Control Structures and total Area of a Territory. Your own map will have detailed data about your own Control Structures.
Quote:
So what happens if I own a house in an enemy guilds territory? What happens if I own a house in the territory of a guild I’m neutral to?
You will pay tax to them.
Quote:
Is there an ultimate limit to the number of towers your guild can have?
No, not really.
Quote:
How much gold do these towers cost?
We will see.
Quote:
Can we hire NPC mercs with gold?
Not yet.
Quote:
If you destroy a keep do they automatically lose all there control points?
Yes.
Quote:
Will there be different types of control structures?
Yes, eventually.
Quote:
Can we shoot arrows from the top of the control structure?
The Towers do not come with bows or crossbows, but you can shoot with your own bow. However they may get an “offensive” upgrade later on.
Quote:
Do the control structures have a way of automatically defending themselves from a single player attacking it?
Yes, but I don’t know if they will be able to in the first iteration.
Quote:
What happens with area control overlaps? Ahh so many questions..
That is not possible, see above.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghuldan
So if i understand well, theses towers will be upgradable … will it become real outposts or will it just be an upgrade of hitpoints and radius ?
The Towers have an “under construction” state and three tiers (not counting modules). Only the first tier is visible in the video. The last tier is a stone tower.
Quote:
Does it also means we will be able to climb ladders ?
Yes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by princereaper
We need answerswill there still be 12 keep spots?
Probably.
Quote:
will the territories still be fixed? with the keep with the most points in that area, controlling it?
Hmm, I don’t understand you here. Your Keep is the “starting point” of your Territory. The shape and size of your Territory depends on how and where you place your Towers.
Quote:
also about sieging? how about just a spawnable camp “siege hut” with a chest in it, that you can put boulders in? or have a “wagon” that you can place the boulders in? that needs to be protected?
That would be very nice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firebatt
Did no one notice the part about being able to freely place these control points without designated spots? Erm if this can be done…. can’t such a mechanic be used for houses and such, allowing for free placement instead of designated spots? o.o
The new territory system is the first one to use free placement of persistent structures, and yes, there is definitely a possibility we will use that for other things as well.
Quote:
Anyways, as friggin cool as this looks, I’m not really getting my hopes up… Seen too many vids with things that don’t exist and still don’t exist
You do well in not getting all hyped up. As usual it will take some time before the system is properly balanced and free of bugs. But I can assure you it is really cool already at this stage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mauzi
Any details about how to gain ‘guild points’ ? Would it e.g. allow it to involve PvE to allow non-PvP characters adding themself into the guild’s territory development ?
Yes. We will try to get as many professions and trades as possible to be able to contribute to the Guild Pool.
Quote:
Also, does taking over control imply keeps to change the owner ?
Sorry, not following you here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by princereaper
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3j0F…tailpage#t=67slook at the map, you can see the keep spots. some tower units..they the control points?
Yes, but I believe the objects are placeholder models. They also seem to have a faulty view distance, and float in the air (albeit at the correct X and Y positions)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artorius
-I understand the actual territory system will be deleted and we will have to build these towers to expand our territory, how large are the territory of each tower?
They start with a few meters in radius. That small area yields Control Points (CP). Those CP can be spent on increasing the radius further, meaning more area, in turn earning more CP. Alternatively, you spend those CP on added Defense/Offense or other things.
A Tower can only handle a certain number of CP, but that number can be increased by upgrades (tiers). We are still playing around with and testing the max radii of the Towers and Keeps.
Towers with intersecting areas forms a Cluster, and all CP’s in that Cluster can be freely distributed between the Towers in the Cluster. The goal is therefore to have your Keep and all your Towers in the same Cluster. Towers in the same cluster as the Keep are connected to the “supply chain”.
You can only place Towers within a certain distance from your Towers/Keep, not counting Towers that aren’t part of the supply chain.
In other words, if you “cut off” a Cluster from the supply chain by destroying a Tower in the middle, your opponent cannot expand from that Cluster until the supply chain has been restored. Furthermore, the cut-off Cluster will have its own CP Pool and cannot be boosted by the other Cluster – and vice versa.
Quote:
-What powers does it give us to control a territory? Tax and laws, anything else?
Tax and Laws, to start with. And more CP’s. Eventually you will be able to control other types of structures (buildable or permanent) in the Territory you own.
Quote:
Originally Posted by realnaste
I’m a little afraid of the “Your town, your rules” thingy. Sounds great for vets, but is it possible all towns will end up controlled by red/aggressive guilds? If so what will happen to new players?
Possibly, although not all towns. Tindrem (although right now represented by Fabernum) and Morin Khur are not conquerable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artorius
They carefully said most towns. Let’s bet Tindrem and/or Morin Khur will not be capturable.
Good bet.
Never trust a screenshot or a youtube video without a version stamp!
Comments
Talk has always been his thing, it's a cheap commodity, and I'm not buying any.
Actions speak louder than words.
Of course. Simply go to their website and read through the House of Commons chat logs. Start at the bottom and work your way up. You will be amazed at the number of undelivered or half implemented promises that this guy has made:
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/house-commons-chat-logs/
Talking up the game has always been the best part of MO. It started with a great PowerPoint and has gone downhill from there. Maybe... just maybe Henrick will deliver what he promises THIS time. History however would tell us that there is a very small likelihood of that.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Remember whent he EPIC patch was going to be MO2 . How did that work out again?? I am seriously quite amazed people like Username get excited over anything Henrik says. What he says and what the game is are 2 totally different animals.
What about the "big meetings" @ Gamescom and the developers from DICE?
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/66367-gamescom.html
Spamming "Post Report" Tool
...but if you spam or abuse the report tool, penalties will apply.
Henrik hasn't said much about this, however black opal did say it's being worked on in an off topic post.
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/67413-having-sex.html
Black Opal says
"In China there are even more severe laws for this, to the extent that they had to change the Skeletons to something else."
It's not much but it does allude to the fact that a chinese server is coming.
Never trust a screenshot or a youtube video without a version stamp!
I think Henrik saying that they are making a chinese server eludes to there going to be a chinese server.
And i think Henrik saying that they are making a chinese server eludes to the fact that he is way over his head and does not realise how bad off his own game is. If their are going to be Chinese Servers then Greed is the answer. You can only hope the money gained will be put towards making this POS better.
Bartoni's Law definition: As an Internet discussion grows volatile, the probability of a comparison involving Donald Trump approaches 1.
All, this thread has gone off topic, please stick to the OP's main discussion.
MO2.0 not MO2 there is a difference and the epic patch certainly improved the game but a version 2.0 was a optimistic, also remember anything quoted on irc is never to be considered official its there to give players a little insight into whats happening and their plans so i guess that includes the HOC as well. Also henrik isnt making a chinese server, a chinese company is doing that for them i bleive, chances are it will have little similarity to mo other than the name.
there are 2 types of mmo, imitators and innovaters.
Death, I really dont know what to say about your comment.
So, Henrick can flat out LIE during HOC or IRC and you give him a complete pass? I mean c'mon man. If you read the HOC logs there is maybe (and its a big maybe) 1% accurate. If you take IRC into account and quote Henrick, what percent of things he has said have come to pass or are properly working?
My God man- Its all lies, hype and false promises which mean that either Henrick is intentionally lying to his paying customers or is so utterly clueless as to what can be done with his teams "skill" and the resources they have that he shouldnt be making a freaking facebook game.
This is the CEO of a company dude.. What if the CEO of Ford mortor Company (for example) constantly made promises which were never kept, lied through his teeth , etc. but said "well, thats only a Television interview...Doesnt count unless I say it in the Stockholders meeting"... Dude, that excuse doesnt fly. Never has and has been worn thin as hell.
This has been (one of) the excuses since day 1 and yet the hype, lies and false promises still go on...and on...and on....and on...
When this "TC" bombs, is buggy, server down for a week , systems dont work and are unfinished, old bugs come back, etc. Your going to give him ANOTHER pass because thats what the MO fanboys always do. Its like WAKE UP MAN. History keeps repeating itself and the SAME excuses keep popping up.
No nightmare he called it MO2, was the biggest let down in the game's history. The graphics did get pretty though
I know bro... But remember, the fanboys think Henrick can say anything and it doesnt "count" unless on the Official Forum. And sometimes when he says thing on the Official Forum (where it counts) and it is a lie, it can be Ninja removed/edited so that Henrick can say anything and it NEV ER matters.
Hes the CEO man. Why would we possibly think that things he says should count.
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/54285-what-does-mo-2-0-mean-you.html heres a thread upon the subject just beofre the patch actually went live, clearly everyone is discussing 2.0 and not 2. Henrik even posted a psot explaining the term before the patch even went live so there was no confusion. The reason people are discussing it as 2.0 and not 2 is becuase this is how he labeled it in the HOC.
there are 2 types of mmo, imitators and innovaters.
Back when they first started talking about implimenting a territory control system, they were going to go with a systemthat reward territory based on points earned through killing enemy guild members. I was very vocal in my disaproval of implimenting a system that gave points for killing each other. This was around the time they implimented the forum for select guild representetives to discuss development ideas with the devs.
I continually suggested a control system based on structures being built to expand a guilds area of influence, and avoiding anything that resembled anything like a deathmatch arena point system. I acutally suggested a system very much like the one they're working on now.
The funny thing was, those guild representetives repeatedly told me I didn't know what I was talking about, and that a system that depended on guilds killing each other was needed to encourage guilds to fight, because simply holding territory wasn't enough. That, as an unguilded player I didn't know what was needed to encourage territory control, that a structure system wouldn't be fun, and that it wasn't possible because because they couldn't do dynampic build spots.
Funny how almost a year later, SV is implimenting a structure based control system, with dynamic build locations, and people can't wait to try it.
I was also pretty vocal that just because someone wasn't in a guild, it did't mean that they know what would be good and what wouldn't.
In a sandbox RPG the emphasis should be on building and creating; not destroying and killing. That's what builds immersion and longterm value. It's nice to see someone at SV seems to have some idea of this.
If they can make it work, it'll be the most dynamic territory system in any MMO. I wish them luck.
yea its still a little unclear to me. Theres CP points and PP points. the cp points you gain from having structures and territroy, the PP points you gain from guild actions like trade, killling people being sophisticated etc..
I am not really sure what effect PP points have but im hoping its just asthetic and bragging rights since i imagine it easily exploitable.
but i agree it should be much harder to destroy than create something, otherwise everything gets senslessly destroyed.
with the recent changes- trails cannot hold boulders meaning only active accounts can be used for boulder holding it has made sieging much harder, with the new siege tents, the new defense siege weapons like the scorpio and arbalest and the tier2 pallisade in the works. along with npc sentries. Things are looking up. ninja sieging will likely become harder and harder
there are 2 types of mmo, imitators and innovaters.
....They couldnt make a patcher. Wheres that UI thats been "coming soon"? Town life? AI?
On paper MO and its ideas are awesome- But they have made very little of it "work"
That was exactly one of the points I made. a system that increased territory through killing could just lead to guilds working together to increase the territory of a single guid. Again, I was told I didn't know what I was talking because I wasn't in a guild, never had to build a keep, didn't know how much work was involved, and therefore it couldn't be exploited. Nevermind the people telling me this belonged to, and ran guilds that owned multiple keeps at a time when it was only possible to have more then one keeep through exploiting. I always thought that was a little funny.
I distinctly remember henrik in irc saying "it will be like mo 2
" or something very similar, bullshit does that mean version 2.0, otherwise he wouldnt have said like, it's just typical misinformation to hype people followed by excuses
Jeez man one day the glasses need to come off. He said that right before the patch hit knowing it would be underwhelming. As Cyde said he did say in IRC what cyde said and othere poeple in IRC called him on it he said it would be like a totally different MO look it up in the dev blog if it is still there.
so please tell me what features isnt "working" in mo currently.
also i distinctly remember henrik sayin it will be like MO 2.0
there are 2 types of mmo, imitators and innovaters.
are you serious?
Since we are talking about TC I will say the current TC is listed as a feature and it is not working. lol facepalm
i think Hernik is no worse than the majority of CEOs tbh, i mean look at tasos and darkfall hes even worse in most peoples opinion or that guy over at gearbox who fooled people into buying DNF which turned out to be a shit fest of a game along with a few others.
how can a feature not present be a feature not working?
there are 2 types of mmo, imitators and innovaters.
Instead of further derailment I'll simply point everyone to this thread which has the appropriare quote from Henrick and the confirmation that he did in fact mean to use those exact words:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/292768/Henrick-IRC-chat-New-Epic-Patch-is-so-incredible-it-equals-Mortal-Online-2-Miracle-patch.html
Will Territory Control end up the same way? Well.. going by the track record one would have to say YES. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day though.. and there is always the CHANCE that territory control will be released in the near future, will deliver everything promised, and will be relatively bug/exploit free. I know where I would put my money if I were a betting man, but we shall see...
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Wow, the stuff looks cool, but much of the plans I've seen concerning this game look cool. My experience is that so many of the plans get lost in the coding. The new mount system took all my old mounts away. The new food system meant my character starved because she couldn't cook and had trouble consistently accessing anyone who did.
The probelm I see with this hardcore sandbox is that players are not persistent. We log out from time to time. In my case, for weeks at a time. There needs to be some kind of persistent infrastructure. This plan might work, but I don't think it's enough. And, as I said before, it'll probably be implemented in a less than operational way.
Until the game isn't ruled by muggers and thieves, I'll continue to watch from the sidelines.
TSW, LotRO, EQ2, SWTOR, GW2, V:SoH, Neverwinter, ArchAge, EQ, UO, DAoC, WAR, DDO, AoC, MO, BDO, SotA, B&S, ESO,
The problem is all these systems would maybe owrk if there was a higher population. It is nigh impossible to buy things if there is not a thriving market place with people playing crafters.
There is no incentive to play a crafter as a main. Every combat toon has a crafter alt. And with no tolls to even trade in the game. Sitting by the bank and scream WTB is all you get.