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Why do you Raid?
Arathir86
Member UncommonPosts: 442
After discussing how GW2 wont be having a traditional raiding system/end-game In this thread, I became curious...
Why do people Raid?
What is your incentive to delve into a large scale scripted encounter?
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Comments
I raid only when the guild I'm in has a slot open and needs someone to fill the space. Otherwise I'd rather be doing something else. It's something I can do every once in awhile, but that's about it.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I don't raid. Next question.
I hate how games design raiding such that you have to schedule your life around the game in order to do it properly. Prescheduling of that sort is terrible game design. Raiding does also bring the problem that if you need a zillion people to do something, then no one person can matter very much.
I raid for the loot (Of course.) but mostly becasue its somthing challenging all my friends and I can do togeather. The reward (loot) is just the iceing on the cake.
You must not play WOW very often as they solved both the issues you bring up as of patch 4.30.
Aparently the blizzard dev's agree with your assesment.
http://www.wowpedia.org/Raid_Finder
I don't raid, and don't play MMO's anymore that focus their endgames around it.
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I raid because it's an awesome feeling to take a new boss that took days, week or maybe months (not that happends today).. Be server first and maybe top 100 in the world.. Great feeling. Ofcourse the challenge, the machanics etc of the encounter counts in aswell.
I used to raid back in the day because we had a fun guild and it was nice to raid with them. Also it was a nice feeling when we got down a new boss and everyone was cheering and all that, it really felt like we achieved something as a team, something I dont feel very often in PvP for example, with a premade it's usually just run-through guaranteed win and with a random group it's pure luck if you win or not. Even with premade vs. premade it does not give that same feeling of achievement, it's fun ofcourse to win but in raiding when you drop a "new" boss it feels like you just took a big step towards something.
I rather PvP and do smaller instances these days since raiding feels too much of a second job and commitment, it feels a bit more rewarding imo but not when put in perspective with the cost of it, not that I could even raid with my current work schedule these days.
I wish devs would come up with more and different kinds of end game options, we've been running with the standard raiding/instancing and pvp (+crafting etc the basic stuff) options for over a decade now, why not come up with something else? We were talking about this with a friend and came up with handful of realistic ideas about "something else" in a short time, I dont know how well most of them would be received, but with new games that have already the basic stuff the devs could really try something new or modified versions of the standard MMO stuff.
I'm enjoying the space shooter in TOR for just this reason, to do something "else" for a while to level or kill time, too bad it has no multiplayer component, in a mmorpg -.- I hope the add that soon to it, or make multiplayer scenarios separately, but more than anything it's a good example that you can really add anything to your game, devs just seem unwilling to come up with anything most of the time, or they do it half-arsed and the feature gets booed to hell because of that and then they can answer "see it's not a good thing to add anything new, we can now safely stick with adding new raids and BG's because you people didnt like our crappy made half thought out new feature" ... Sorry for derailing, had to get that out
other
I don't raid, I will never raid in the normally understood word again (used to be hardcore server first guild in wow) IE doing the same largescale scripted encounter over and over every week at a set times(s) in order to upgrade some numbers on my character.
I'm not sure but I think wow has improved this by making much easier version that you can pug through using the automatic lfg system, great if you just wanna do it one or two times to see it which is really all the times anyone should do such content..
I would raid because there wasn't anything fun to do in the game.
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I used to raid, when I played EQ1. When I did raid, I thought it was fun and addicting. I didn't necessarily do it for the gear, since I always seemed to lose some big loot rolls anyway. It was fun going with my friends to take down a big monster, especially going through the Planes and killing the Gods. That was an incredible experience.
After we beat the Plane of Time we went on to other expansions, but it wasn't as fun as the Planes of Power, it didn't seem as satisfying to me. Raiding started to get boring, especially since I wasn't one of the strongest so I was just a backup. I would spend more time talking to people during the raid than actually doing anything.
It also felt more like a job because I had to be on nearly every night and stick around for at least 3 hours, if not more. It burnt me out and I ended up quitting EQ1.
From then on, I told myself I would never raid again like that. I've gone on some other raids since but they are all pretty much the same, pretty boring unless you are one of the main tanks or main healers. Or in the cases when I went casually, I was one of two or three healers and so it was very stressful.
I don't like to be bored or stressed when playing a game, so I'm not very fond of raiding anymore.
That's my point of view, though.
Do you want some cheese with that whine?
Personally, I haven't raided since the second week after the Lich King encounter was released, to do a bunch of the hardmodes that were finally made available to us. I think that was roughly early february almost 2 years ago. I finally got fed up with having to schedule life around raid nights, even though we only raided *casually* for a couple hours 2 or 3 nights a week. Having to be online at a given time made me eventually not want to be on at all. I can't see myself ever dedicating myself to a gaming schedule ever again. I'll still play games a lot, but on my own time.
When I did raid, however, I did so for every single one of the reasons listed in the poll. I can't really choose a single reason because no one of them alone would be enough to entice me to raid. It was the combination of all of those things that made raiding fun.
As far as role dilution goes, I prefer a small (10 or so players) raid setting to a large one (20+), where you can tangibly feel your impact on events.
AoC was the first game were i raided regulary in a raid alliance (around 15 months + a few at start in random raidgroups) and probably it will be the last.
Rading is only fun so much times and drunken players with drunken skill doing drunken trashtalk is even less fun.
But as i dont like PvP in AoC (and yes i have a slightly positive but low K/D ratio) it was the only thing left to do.
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The challenge and because I find them fun.
I think raids are awesome. Nothing feels better to me than downing a boss with 15 - 40 other people after a couple of wipes. Plus getting gear is fun as well.
You're right that I don't play WoW very often. I quit back in 2006 and it's extremely unlikely that I'll ever play it again. There was a long list of things that I disliked about WoW when I quit, and my understanding is that some of them have since been fixed. But even if they fixed everything else except for the boring combat, I still wouldn't be interested. If a game is mostly about combat, and the combat is boring, then the game is bad and the rest of the details don't matter. And yes, combat that consists mostly of, wait for a battle to end, so that you can eat and drink and start another battle, and then wait for it to end, too, is boring.
That's derailing the thread, though. Prescheduling was hardly the only problem with raids. Raid lockouts, long play sessions, DKP, pigeonholed class functions, forced respecs, and having to do the same raid a zillion times to gear up for the next were all problems. (Actually, DKP wasn't the problem in itself; it was an attempt at mitigating the impact of idiotic loot rules built into the game.)
And then there's the killer problem that I don't see a way to address, even if you could build a new game from scratch. If I'm going to play a game, I want the outcome to depend on something I did. If you need 40 people (or 56 or 24 or whatever; the number varies by game, and sometimes by raid within a single game, but the precise number doesn't matter so long as it is large) for a raid, then one person probably doesn't make much of a difference.
That's just problems specific to raiding. I'd be shocked if Blizzard could meaningfully address the "combat is boring" problem without tearing apart their game and rebuilding it to the extent that it was unrecognizable.
I raid to get gear, and help friends get gear. Once I am fully equipped and my friends don't need help then I see no reason to go back to it. That is the point in the game where I roll alt's or do endgame pvp till i want to shoot myself in the head with a fireball (or slice my neck with a lightsaber) Whichever you prefer.
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Huh, well you are locking yourself out of a shitload of games with that complaint. Pretty much any large scale team game. I
I tried raiding...
It is just "too busy" for my 8086 processor of a brain to handle
Up to 10 man raids is OK, but get into the 25 and 40 man and there is just too much going on for me. I don't raid if I don't have to. It is just not the gameplay I look for in a MMO.
- Al
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Same here but when I did, it was mostly because there was nothing else to do @ endgame.
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I liked Raids in the old days when people were laid back about it and you could join, tag along and have a chat. I love world bosses too where you get hundreds of people all together taking on one big boss and it's a right laugh.
What I hate is what WoW did to Raids when you needed this gear, needed to be this class with this spec and if you miss an ability they you get shouted at and kicked from the guild or something. Like that wasn't any fun to me and they wanted you to dedicate your life to raiding and it was more stressful than anything.
Sadly this is what people remember as a raid and not the fun laid back times of older MMOs.
I also detest the dimwitted mentality of game designers who apparently think grinding raid mobs to get uber gear to grind raid mobs to get even more uber gear... on and on, ad nauseum... is both stumulating and interesting. WRONG! I'd rather stick forks into my legs. Raiding is a virtual hamster-wheel that keeps the nerds interested way past the time everyone else has quit the game in boredom. (The nerds do love their damage-meters and gear scores, though, don't they!
Poor, sad things...)
The poll needs a vote option for "I wouldn't Raid if I was paid to."
I stopped raiding a long time ago. I don't know who invented raids and I don't really care, but man what a waste of time they are. You spend 3-4 hours with 15-40 guys in the hopes of getting your loot drop. A boss that drops 2 items after killing him with 20 guys does not equal fun to me. I really like the idea of working with 30 other people to take down a boss, but in practice it just doesn't work for me, it feels so poorly executed. Both my most fun and most terrible MMO experiences come from raiding. Most fun because figuring out how to do something and executing something with a large group is insanely rewarding. Most terrible because most of the time you basically spend 2-4 hours running through trash mobs and bosses you killed a dozen time already in order for the 5% chance you get your item.
I hope we move away from the raid model. I don't really mind its presence in games, but it's getting to the point where endgame = raiding, which is just no fun to me.
I answered "To stay in my guild", because after a while I just stopped caring about the 2% item upgrade that could drop for me, and started showing up just for the sake of showing up.
RIFT-raids moved in the right direction for me with the world invasions. Technically it's not a raid, but it's the same feeling, except only the fun parts. Looking forward to see those mechanics improve rather than the WoW dungeon crawl-type raids.
I raid to have power over others. At times I have been the Main Tank and raid leader of an organized guild. It is a position of authority. Can't get that playing solo or running 5 mans in the dungeon finder.
Every time when I think about my raiding experiences with a high ranked guild in WOW, all that keeps coming up in my mind is "Lord of the Flies". Thank goodness that phase only lasted a year for me.
because it is fun