I think the problem is that a lot of the team probably didn't play MMO's, and those who did, only played WoW. And then stopped playing as WoW had to innovate a bit to keep their cherished spot. Yes, I hate WoW, but they had to make their quests a bit more in-depth, reduce the emphasis on 40 man raids, diversify rewards, etc.
have to completely disagree with you there i don't think a SINGLE person who developed this game has ever played anything other then SPRPG games, they didn't even bring in kids as experts on this one and it shows with what all they missed.
I joined the beta in march and as of today the skill trees are almost identical and the ac mechiniques either have 1 minor addition or none depending on ac. In that time many testers made posts about the game play being dull and repetitive all were ignored or called hate.
From march till june the devs made a few post on the beta forums but not many. After june new waves of invites started coming in and what little feedback we had gotten died. With the massive influx of fanboys in the beta all constuctive feedback got labeled as hate and if you didnt give the game a 9 or 10 on the forums polls you were also consider a hater.
So i think what doomed this game was a flat out inablitiy to give or receive constructive feedback.
So i think what doomed this game was a flat out inablitiy to give or receive constructive feedback.
Hardly any of them do anymore. Which begs the question why waste your time testing these games unless you just want a free peek?
...and then people wonder why many want to get into testing just to do that. Gee, I don't know maybe because the companies market it that way and the majority of the time don't heed the testers anyways that do provide feedback?
So... there's that...
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
You don't risk 200+ million dollar investment on something unproven, unless you have SO much money you can stand to take a bet on that 200 million.
TOR isn't a WoW killer, and no game will ever be because the only things killing WoW are
A) age
itself
The Western made AAA mega-budget Sandbox MMO is not happening people - better you start to accept it.
GW2 is the closest we are going to get for a long, long while.
However:
The Undead Labs L4 or whatever it is might just suprise us though, I'm waiting to see.
Of course, always the possibility EQNext or Titan will completely redefine the genre.
agree here I don't think anything will outright kill wow...
but if this is the end result of $200+ milliion dollars I feel this eq/wow clone mmo sub genre is dead.. the videos of some upcoming games have some hope in them but overal if developers are going to continue this mindset of because it worked for wow it will be a cash cow for me I feel at least for me this genre is done... game doesn't have to be sandbox to reinvent the themepark not in the slightest...
I joined the beta in march and as of today the skill trees are almost identical and the ac mechiniques either have 1 minor addition or none depending on ac. In that time many testers made posts about the game play being dull and repetitive all were ignored or called hate.
From march till june the devs made a few post on the beta forums but not many. After june new waves of invites started coming in and what little feedback we had gotten died. With the massive influx of fanboys in the beta all constuctive feedback got labeled as hate and if you didnt give the game a 9 or 10 on the forums polls you were also consider a hater.
So i think what doomed this game was a flat out inablitiy to give or receive constructive feedback.
I said this a lot back during the stress test and was laughed at saying no way developers would not consider feedback of potential paying customers.. after the removal of the "match to chest feature" it solidified my feeling the devs 100% felt they know exactly what customers want no matter what the feedback is...
To make a WoW killer, Bioware should have used all the good features of WoW and some little personal extra on top.
They did the extra (voice overs and story), but decided to leave out some of the good features like: user friendly auction house, dungeon gear sets, attunement quests for heroics and raids, LFG (not LFD) tool, alternative leveling zones, seasonal events, arena PVP, achievements etc.
Many of these features are minor, but those features are "the spice" which is missing in SWTOR. Something you can not put your finger on, but you know it should be in (at least some of them).
SWTOR rather gave WOW some more life to go on a few more years, and took off its shoulders the burden of being the laughing stock of the forums. Great work by Bioware lol.
SWTOR rather gave WOW some more life to go on a few more years, and took off its shoulders the burden of being the laughing stock of the forums. Great work by Bioware lol.
To be fair the MMO community is some of the most vile players out there. At least FPS competitive types can hide under the guise of 'talking trash.'
This is a MASSIVE MULTIPLAYER ONLINE game. There is nothing massive about tiny raids, tiny groups, and instanced PvP.
They completely ignored the social realm. How on earth can you be a dev and not realize the importance of good virtual community. This replaced SOCIAL with STORY. Thus, we now have this Massive Co'op Game that people must pay monthly for.
SWTOR is the ultimate example of ADVERTISING & HYPE over GAMEPLAY & ORIGINALITY.
To make a WoW killer, Bioware should have used all the good features of WoW and some little personal extra on top.
They did the extra (voice overs and story), but decided to leave out some of the good features like: user friendly auction house, dungeon gear sets, attunement quests for heroics and raids, LFG (not LFD) tool, alternative leveling zones, seasonal events, arena PVP, achievements etc.
Many of these features are minor, but those features are "the spice" which is missing in SWTOR. Something you can not put your finger on, but you know it should be in (at least some of them).
things like dungeons - sure copy from wow
but PVP? copy PVP from a game with good PVP - e.g. NOT WOW
So i think what doomed this game was a flat out inablitiy to give or receive constructive feedback.
Hardly any of them do anymore. Which begs the question why waste your time testing these games unless you just want a free peek?
...and then people wonder why many want to get into testing just to do that. Gee, I don't know maybe because the companies market it that way and the majority of the time don't heed the testers anyways that do provide feedback?
So... there's that...
I think a lot of it is, yes I am going to use it...wait for it...."old school" beta testers used to get in to actually test the game and give feedback while it was actually still in the development process, now when you get an invite to any beta the game itself is done. They are not going to or be able make any real change to the actual game. Sure beta testers now may identify and fix a few bugs usually involving grammer or textures, test server loads, maybe a few quest bugs, game balance but the game world and general game mechanics are already done and will not change.
Beta test today just means stress test our game, and a hype machine to entice pre-order suckers. That is why you almost never get to test the "end game" and test in weekends or weeks rather than year(s) like it use to be.
I think a lot of it is, yes I am going to use it...wait for it...."old school" beta testers used to get in to actually test the game and give feedback while it was actually still in the development process, now when you get an invite to any beta the game itself is done. They are not going to or be able make any real change to the actual game. Sure beta testers now may identify and fix a few bugs usually involving grammer or textures, test server loads, maybe a few quest bugs, game balance but the game world and general game mechanics are already done and will not change.
Beta test today just means stress test our game, and a hype machine to entice pre-order suckers. That is why you almost never get to test the "end game" and test in weekends or weeks rather than year(s) like it use to be.
I completely agree. Really though I don't think most are referring to core concepts of the game. Least I'm not anyways. I'm more referring to mechanics like ui customization, lfg mechanics, bartering system, etc. Things that obviously still take time to refine and develop but I think are something that should still be heeded by developers how players react to what is in place and listen to their assessments of it. Considering that is their potential future player base.
Far as class design, world design, etc. while I suppose it never hurts to give feedback on those types of things I certainly agree it isn't feasible to think or expect any of that to change unless it is an overall minor revamp such as traveling, porting, death penalties, etc.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
This is one of the major problems ( i can see) with working on an MMO, or any project with a long development/conceptual phase. Before you can start developing you need a concept, player trends during one period may be completely different by the end of the final conceptual period, meaning your concept is already outdated.
Keeping up with these trends is possible ( GW2) but i think they already had a plan to move away from the WOW model and expand (impressively) on their own design and concepts.
You aslo have to consider seamlessness and flow, the game has to tie togther, each facet should facilitate the next, which is already at ricky subject with TOR, it's not there, but much further in "mixing it up" they'd have a Frankenstein's monster on their hands, IMO anyway.
I agree with the general thought behind this, but listing GW2 is not a good example. For all we know, GW2 may not even have their servers up for the first week. If you're listing an example, you have to list a game that is already on store shelves. Otherwise, all your credibility goes right out the window. Don't worry though, credible or not, GW2 fanboys will still back you.
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This is one of the major problems ( i can see) with working on an MMO, or any project with a long development/conceptual phase. Before you can start developing you need a concept, player trends during one period may be completely different by the end of the final conceptual period, meaning your concept is already outdated.
Keeping up with these trends is possible ( GW2) but i think they already had a plan to move away from the WOW model and expand (impressively) on their own design and concepts.
You aslo have to consider seamlessness and flow, the game has to tie togther, each facet should facilitate the next, which is already at ricky subject with TOR, it's not there, but much further in "mixing it up" they'd have a Frankenstein's monster on their hands, IMO anyway.
I agree with the general thought behind this, but listing GW2 is not a good example. For all we know, GW2 may not even have their servers up for the first week. If you're listing an example, you have to list a game that is already on store shelves. Otherwise, all your credibility goes right out the window. Don't worry though, credible or not, GW2 fanboys will still back you.
always lovely to see SWTOR fans cannibalize each other. SWTOR reminds me of my first girlfriend, a beautiful mess.
I really don't think your post makes any sense.
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Had the game been made back in 2005 when they first announced it.
I honestly think they did a lot of research on all the MMO's before they announced they were doing it, and then stopped. It doesn't seem like they've taken into account what has worked in MMO's the past 7 years, and what hasn't.
Why don't you make a list of the things that "worked" and see if you can get more than 50% of the community to agree with you.
Spoiler: You'll see that all the things you think worked will have many people disagreeing with you.
Honestly when I look at the interviews of the TOR development team t, I am also reminded of company meeitings with powerpoint. Heartless business models just dont work on mmorpgs. There is no winning formula because every fantasy genre and fan base is different. What I was worried about and what actually did happen was EA games sees players as an easily manipulated herd, but thats what has always ruined their mmorpgs in the end.Whenever thier shareholders see moneysigns they step in to fix what was never broken to begin with. When the brass started calling shots on UO and hired Chilton they ripped UO apart from the inside out, With TOR they didn't even get off to a good start. A generic mmo with little to the imagination and totally dissapoints the Star Wars fan base from the onset. If you ask any Star Wars fan what they wanted in a Star Wars mmorpg then you will find out of ten options 9 of those were not met for that fan. For that alone the R@D deparment for EA games should be ashamed. They opted for the players are idiots approach and will now pay for it, the same way the NGE paid for it.
Also the question remains if the NGE was obviously what people DID NOT want why would you essntially make a dumbed down version of the NGE ( wow clone ) and expect different results? I think the WOW clone with lightsabers theory has failed twice now, dispite the hard headedness of game developers to force people to accept it. If anything the TOR experiment has validated the NGE was and still is a bad idea. No one wanted NGE 2.0 but thats what they got. Sadly this is probably the last Star Wars mmorpg that was ever going to be made and they got it wrong TWICE now.
anyone with a small amount of imagination and common sense knew that this game wasnt going to kill anything.
it was obvious this game had no end-game.
it was obvious this game lacked any content aside from the linear quest line.
it was obvious this game would not be social at all.
it was obvious it would be a single-player online game.
it was obvious this game was going to be pretty shallow to accomodate the play station crowd.
those who didnt see it were blinded by the hype orchestrated by BioWare and a few forum sites.
Blizzard surely is having a laugh and wishing more developers keep trying to emulate their game. Ironically, they are the only ones who seem to know that people who want to play that sort of game (and a polished one at that) are already playing it - or will return after their subscribers try a broken clone as its to be expected during the early months of any game.
Had the game been made back in 2005 when they first announced it.
I honestly think they did a lot of research on all the MMO's before they announced they were doing it, and then stopped. It doesn't seem like they've taken into account what has worked in MMO's the past 7 years, and what hasn't.
I agree. This game is essentially the brainchild of Gordon Walton who nursemaided this entire project from the time he left SOE and went to Bioware in exactly 2005. This game is essentially a souped-up version of Everyquest 2, the last game he was working on at SOE and which was supposed to be the first 'WoW-killer'. Well, it wasn't.
This is one of the major problems ( i can see) with working on an MMO, or any project with a long development/conceptual phase. Before you can start developing you need a concept, player trends during one period may be completely different by the end of the final conceptual period, meaning your concept is already outdated.
Keeping up with these trends is possible ( GW2) but i think they already had a plan to move away from the WOW model and expand (impressively) on their own design and concepts.
You aslo have to consider seamlessness and flow, the game has to tie togther, each facet should facilitate the next, which is already at ricky subject with TOR, it's not there, but much further in "mixing it up" they'd have a Frankenstein's monster on their hands, IMO anyway.
I think the problem is that a lot of the team probably didn't play MMO's, and those who did, only played WoW. And then stopped playing as WoW had to innovate a bit to keep their cherished spot. Yes, I hate WoW, but they had to make their quests a bit more in-depth, reduce the emphasis on 40 man raids, diversify rewards, etc.
I'd guess this is untrue, many of their devs are from older MMOs like DAOC, SWG, WAR, Shadowbane, etc, etc...
Had the game been made back in 2005 when they first announced it.
I honestly think they did a lot of research on all the MMO's before they announced they were doing it, and then stopped. It doesn't seem like they've taken into account what has worked in MMO's the past 7 years, and what hasn't.
I have my doubts, in 2005 people would have been amazed about the video stories but at the end the same critics would arise like now from a part of the mmo gamers. Why should it be different ?
This is one of the major problems ( i can see) with working on an MMO, or any project with a long development/conceptual phase. Before you can start developing you need a concept, player trends during one period may be completely different by the end of the final conceptual period, meaning your concept is already outdated.
Keeping up with these trends is possible ( GW2) but i think they already had a plan to move away from the WOW model and expand (impressively) on their own design and concepts.
You aslo have to consider seamlessness and flow, the game has to tie togther, each facet should facilitate the next, which is already at ricky subject with TOR, it's not there, but much further in "mixing it up" they'd have a Frankenstein's monster on their hands, IMO anyway.
I think the problem is that a lot of the team probably didn't play MMO's, and those who did, only played WoW. And then stopped playing as WoW had to innovate a bit to keep their cherished spot. Yes, I hate WoW, but they had to make their quests a bit more in-depth, reduce the emphasis on 40 man raids, diversify rewards, etc.
I'd guess this is untrue, many of their devs are from older MMOs like DAOC, SWG, WAR, Shadowbane, etc, etc...
There's a difference between developing a game and actually playing it. One of the classic rules of the MMO world: players know their game better than the Devs. A developer can code a system. But they can't tell you if it actually works in the game. Only a player can do that.
uhh.. wat?
There's a classic rule that developers follow too: The players don't know what they want.
Lastly, if the developers did not playtest, take surveys, design prototypes, and document the entire game to the core then you'd have something. But, sorry.. the 'gamers' don't know more about the game than the developers. They may be more skilled, but that doesn't mean you have a greater understanding of the underworkings of the system itself. Only the developers would know that.
The players try to play a know-it all role when the game isn't design specifically for them.
Anyone can make a low budget game, liquidate the hype of the developers (yay its made by bioware) reduce cost, and liquidate the concept that its starwars (yay, its starwars) and reduce cost some more
Reduce cost means, less manpower on the project, an outdated gaming engine
All in all, with a dash good ads/hype = $$$
And its what we see now..................
Annnnnndddd.....the story contiunes............
AoC did it, Warhammer Online did it, and just about every other MMO is doing it, and thats the market trend........period
Not only these games are WoW clones, but crappy ones too......
Really they are not WoW clones though, just cheap garbage....MMORPGs are the greatest gimmick in video games for the 21st century.....
One would think with all the demand it would create an enviroment of competition to reduce cost or increased innovation to win the customers over.............NOT
[Mod Edit]
Video games espically MMOS can be made much, much more better in all aspects
We are just copying a 2004 business model in an industury that moves very quickly
This is one of the major problems ( i can see) with working on an MMO, or any project with a long development/conceptual phase. Before you can start developing you need a concept, player trends during one period may be completely different by the end of the final conceptual period, meaning your concept is already outdated.
Keeping up with these trends is possible ( GW2) but i think they already had a plan to move away from the WOW model and expand (impressively) on their own design and concepts.
You aslo have to consider seamlessness and flow, the game has to tie togther, each facet should facilitate the next, which is already at ricky subject with TOR, it's not there, but much further in "mixing it up" they'd have a Frankenstein's monster on their hands, IMO anyway.
I agree with the general thought behind this, but listing GW2 is not a good example. For all we know, GW2 may not even have their servers up for the first week. If you're listing an example, you have to list a game that is already on store shelves. Otherwise, all your credibility goes right out the window. Don't worry though, credible or not, GW2 fanboys will still back you.
always lovely to see SWTOR fans cannibalize each other. SWTOR reminds me of my first girlfriend, a beautiful mess.
I really don't think your post makes any sense.
all of his GW2 straw man posts and SWTOR praise was mighty credible, but i guess he's not so credible anymore.
Complete sentences are your friend.
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This is one of the major problems ( i can see) with working on an MMO, or any project with a long development/conceptual phase. Before you can start developing you need a concept, player trends during one period may be completely different by the end of the final conceptual period, meaning your concept is already outdated.
Keeping up with these trends is possible ( GW2) but i think they already had a plan to move away from the WOW model and expand (impressively) on their own design and concepts.
You aslo have to consider seamlessness and flow, the game has to tie togther, each facet should facilitate the next, which is already at ricky subject with TOR, it's not there, but much further in "mixing it up" they'd have a Frankenstein's monster on their hands, IMO anyway.
I agree with the general thought behind this, but listing GW2 is not a good example. For all we know, GW2 may not even have their servers up for the first week. If you're listing an example, you have to list a game that is already on store shelves. Otherwise, all your credibility goes right out the window. Don't worry though, credible or not, GW2 fanboys will still back you.
Are you hurt by yet another mention of GW2 in the SWTOR forum? GW2 is a fine example for the point he's trying to make. Never did he describe GW2 as a "great game" or "the WOW killer".
A generic mmo with little to the imagination and totally dissapoints the Star Wars fan base from the onset. If you ask any Star Wars fan what they wanted in a Star Wars mmorpg then you will find out of ten options 9 of those were not met for that fan. For that alone the R@D deparment for EA games should be ashamed. .
How can u talk for majority of the sw fans, are u some kind of an authorized person?
?m a fan since 82 and the game makes me feel like im in sw universe.
Comments
I joined the beta in march and as of today the skill trees are almost identical and the ac mechiniques either have 1 minor addition or none depending on ac. In that time many testers made posts about the game play being dull and repetitive all were ignored or called hate.
From march till june the devs made a few post on the beta forums but not many. After june new waves of invites started coming in and what little feedback we had gotten died. With the massive influx of fanboys in the beta all constuctive feedback got labeled as hate and if you didnt give the game a 9 or 10 on the forums polls you were also consider a hater.
So i think what doomed this game was a flat out inablitiy to give or receive constructive feedback.
Hardly any of them do anymore. Which begs the question why waste your time testing these games unless you just want a free peek?
...and then people wonder why many want to get into testing just to do that. Gee, I don't know maybe because the companies market it that way and the majority of the time don't heed the testers anyways that do provide feedback?
So... there's that...
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
agree here I don't think anything will outright kill wow...
but if this is the end result of $200+ milliion dollars I feel this eq/wow clone mmo sub genre is dead.. the videos of some upcoming games have some hope in them but overal if developers are going to continue this mindset of because it worked for wow it will be a cash cow for me I feel at least for me this genre is done... game doesn't have to be sandbox to reinvent the themepark not in the slightest...
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html
I said this a lot back during the stress test and was laughed at saying no way developers would not consider feedback of potential paying customers.. after the removal of the "match to chest feature" it solidified my feeling the devs 100% felt they know exactly what customers want no matter what the feedback is...
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html
To make a WoW killer, Bioware should have used all the good features of WoW and some little personal extra on top.
They did the extra (voice overs and story), but decided to leave out some of the good features like: user friendly auction house, dungeon gear sets, attunement quests for heroics and raids, LFG (not LFD) tool, alternative leveling zones, seasonal events, arena PVP, achievements etc.
Many of these features are minor, but those features are "the spice" which is missing in SWTOR. Something you can not put your finger on, but you know it should be in (at least some of them).
In order to kill any other game SWTOR has to survive itself in first place.
Let's see again in a year.
SWTOR rather gave WOW some more life to go on a few more years, and took off its shoulders the burden of being the laughing stock of the forums. Great work by Bioware lol.
An honest review of SW:TOR 6/10 (Danny Wojcicki)
To be fair the MMO community is some of the most vile players out there. At least FPS competitive types can hide under the guise of 'talking trash.'
+1
things like dungeons - sure copy from wow
but PVP? copy PVP from a game with good PVP - e.g. NOT WOW
I think a lot of it is, yes I am going to use it...wait for it...."old school" beta testers used to get in to actually test the game and give feedback while it was actually still in the development process, now when you get an invite to any beta the game itself is done. They are not going to or be able make any real change to the actual game. Sure beta testers now may identify and fix a few bugs usually involving grammer or textures, test server loads, maybe a few quest bugs, game balance but the game world and general game mechanics are already done and will not change.
Beta test today just means stress test our game, and a hype machine to entice pre-order suckers. That is why you almost never get to test the "end game" and test in weekends or weeks rather than year(s) like it use to be.
I completely agree. Really though I don't think most are referring to core concepts of the game. Least I'm not anyways. I'm more referring to mechanics like ui customization, lfg mechanics, bartering system, etc. Things that obviously still take time to refine and develop but I think are something that should still be heeded by developers how players react to what is in place and listen to their assessments of it. Considering that is their potential future player base.
Far as class design, world design, etc. while I suppose it never hurts to give feedback on those types of things I certainly agree it isn't feasible to think or expect any of that to change unless it is an overall minor revamp such as traveling, porting, death penalties, etc.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I agree with the general thought behind this, but listing GW2 is not a good example. For all we know, GW2 may not even have their servers up for the first week. If you're listing an example, you have to list a game that is already on store shelves. Otherwise, all your credibility goes right out the window. Don't worry though, credible or not, GW2 fanboys will still back you.
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I really don't think your post makes any sense.
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Why don't you make a list of the things that "worked" and see if you can get more than 50% of the community to agree with you.
Spoiler: You'll see that all the things you think worked will have many people disagreeing with you.
Honestly when I look at the interviews of the TOR development team t, I am also reminded of company meeitings with powerpoint. Heartless business models just dont work on mmorpgs. There is no winning formula because every fantasy genre and fan base is different. What I was worried about and what actually did happen was EA games sees players as an easily manipulated herd, but thats what has always ruined their mmorpgs in the end.Whenever thier shareholders see moneysigns they step in to fix what was never broken to begin with. When the brass started calling shots on UO and hired Chilton they ripped UO apart from the inside out, With TOR they didn't even get off to a good start. A generic mmo with little to the imagination and totally dissapoints the Star Wars fan base from the onset. If you ask any Star Wars fan what they wanted in a Star Wars mmorpg then you will find out of ten options 9 of those were not met for that fan. For that alone the R@D deparment for EA games should be ashamed. They opted for the players are idiots approach and will now pay for it, the same way the NGE paid for it.
Also the question remains if the NGE was obviously what people DID NOT want why would you essntially make a dumbed down version of the NGE ( wow clone ) and expect different results? I think the WOW clone with lightsabers theory has failed twice now, dispite the hard headedness of game developers to force people to accept it. If anything the TOR experiment has validated the NGE was and still is a bad idea. No one wanted NGE 2.0 but thats what they got. Sadly this is probably the last Star Wars mmorpg that was ever going to be made and they got it wrong TWICE now.
[Mod Edit]
anyone with a small amount of imagination and common sense knew that this game wasnt going to kill anything.
it was obvious this game had no end-game.
it was obvious this game lacked any content aside from the linear quest line.
it was obvious this game would not be social at all.
it was obvious it would be a single-player online game.
it was obvious this game was going to be pretty shallow to accomodate the play station crowd.
those who didnt see it were blinded by the hype orchestrated by BioWare and a few forum sites.
Blizzard surely is having a laugh and wishing more developers keep trying to emulate their game. Ironically, they are the only ones who seem to know that people who want to play that sort of game (and a polished one at that) are already playing it - or will return after their subscribers try a broken clone as its to be expected during the early months of any game.
I agree. This game is essentially the brainchild of Gordon Walton who nursemaided this entire project from the time he left SOE and went to Bioware in exactly 2005. This game is essentially a souped-up version of Everyquest 2, the last game he was working on at SOE and which was supposed to be the first 'WoW-killer'. Well, it wasn't.
There isn't a spec of DAOC in SWTOR
I have my doubts, in 2005 people would have been amazed about the video stories but at the end the same critics would arise like now from a part of the mmo gamers. Why should it be different ?
uhh.. wat?
There's a classic rule that developers follow too: The players don't know what they want.
Lastly, if the developers did not playtest, take surveys, design prototypes, and document the entire game to the core then you'd have something. But, sorry.. the 'gamers' don't know more about the game than the developers. They may be more skilled, but that doesn't mean you have a greater understanding of the underworkings of the system itself. Only the developers would know that.
The players try to play a know-it all role when the game isn't design specifically for them.
Anyone can make a low budget game, liquidate the hype of the developers (yay its made by bioware) reduce cost, and liquidate the concept that its starwars (yay, its starwars) and reduce cost some more
Reduce cost means, less manpower on the project, an outdated gaming engine
All in all, with a dash good ads/hype = $$$
And its what we see now..................
Annnnnndddd.....the story contiunes............
AoC did it, Warhammer Online did it, and just about every other MMO is doing it, and thats the market trend........period
Not only these games are WoW clones, but crappy ones too......
Really they are not WoW clones though, just cheap garbage....MMORPGs are the greatest gimmick in video games for the 21st century.....
One would think with all the demand it would create an enviroment of competition to reduce cost or increased innovation to win the customers over.............NOT
[Mod Edit]
Video games espically MMOS can be made much, much more better in all aspects
We are just copying a 2004 business model in an industury that moves very quickly
Complete sentences are your friend.
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Are you hurt by yet another mention of GW2 in the SWTOR forum? GW2 is a fine example for the point he's trying to make. Never did he describe GW2 as a "great game" or "the WOW killer".
How can u talk for majority of the sw fans, are u some kind of an authorized person??m a fan since 82 and the game makes me feel like im in sw universe.
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