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Bot/RMT issues?
Game looks good overall I wont get in that.
From what I read on other forums though there are bots already?
RMT and botting was a real problem in most korean games I remember.
Real enough that the economy was useless and ruined the game for alot of people.
How can I trust a little crappy company like Frogster (EU) keeping it under control? or even enmasse or whatever it is for US, havent heard of those either.
Comments
From what i heard not that big of an issue. The addition of chronoscroll make it so there is a legit way to change real money to in game money. As for bots they will always exist in every game, but i haven't heard that they were a big issue in korea.
Which means they don't care about RMT as long as they're getting a cut of it.
They don't gain any extra money off chronoscrolls. If I buy a chronoscroll, I will spend more money so that I can sell it for gold, but the one who will spend gold on it won't pay for that month's subscription.
Do you think EVE developers don't care about RMT? Some people will keep this kind of market alive. I don't see why the money from those transactions should go to the money farmers and not the actual developers.
Well, the money is going to the publishers, not the developers, technically.
I always thought it was interesting how developers/publishers denounce RMT, but then they go ahead and create something where they do it themselves. So it was only bad when they weren't getting a cut, not that it was bad according to some game ethics.
It's still bad imo. The thing is, if you can't beat it, it seems a more practical approach to try and control it. Less problems for customers as well, less card fraud, less accounts hacked, etc.
How does that chronoscroll work exactly?
something like PLEX in EvE ?
I guess you don't understand, they are not making any more money off of this.
That person who buys the chronoscroll, sells it to someone in game, the person who buys it now does not have to pay the subscription for that month. It's just a way to make real world trading less serious, instead of buying gold from a third-party site people can buy a chronoscroll from En Masse, which is a trusted company and sell it to someone in game, benefiting both the person selling and buying the chronoscroll as well as having no negative implications on the company.
It's not like it's "hey buy these chronoscrolls from our shop and sell them to vendors for 10million gold."
I do understand, but since I haven't seen the pricing model, and until I do, I'm going to assume the cost isn't going to be 1:1. Like PLEX in EVE where you spend $35 on 2 PLEX, which accounts for 2 months of subscription, which would otherwise cost $30, so the developer takes in $5.
I'm not saying it's good or bad, just noting the hypocritical theme.
Edit note: I can't remember if I got the prices right, but since that's not the focus of the message please don't focus on that.
All games have some gold farming/selling and botting, Tera won't be any different.
The real question is, how dfficult is it for the average player to earn gold by playing the games.
If it's pretty easy, like in SWTOR, there won't be a very large market demand for it and it shouldn't be much of an issue.
However if its really hard to earn gold, and there's some really great items worth paying for then you'll see the market for gold buying/selling explode
There's already a site out there specifically for selling only Tera gold/keys/accounts and the going price is $98.00/50M. No idea if one needs 50M gold for some reason, depends on the economy I suppose.
But if the best armor/weapons can be purchased for gold expect people to buy it from outside vendors.
What's more important to me is what Tera will do about in game gold spam, I find that to be the most annoying thing. I assume in game if bots get too annoying people will just kill them.
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50M is not that much, Steparu was still sitting at 200m+ gold after enchanting his warrior swords to +12.
Apparently most of the best armor will be BoP, from rift rewards or craftable. The tier 13 from the new dungeons is not able to be luxed(go from +9 to +12), so while it is good, it's not the best.
Don't quote me on this though because I'm not positive, also things can change for NA/EU release.
This chronoscroll is interesting.
When I can get to the point where gold is plentiful, once a month I can buy a chronoscroll from a player and not have to pay cash for subscription. It's hardcore farming to pay for subscription.
Since the other player paid cash for the scroll and ends up with gold, for them it's like buying gold using chronoscroll as currency.
I can see how this keeps both sides happy.
What is the major gold sink in game? Otherwise everyone gets rich and the economy goes to pot.
Enchanting would be that gold sink I would say.
enchanting, crafting, dye, and templete for armor look all are very big gold sinks.
Lol dye and templates are not gold sinks. :P
This would be true only if there is actualy no Chronoscrolls in the game for sale for fluctuating ingame money value.
If chronoscrolls however function like PLEX'es do, the publishing company makes money from it. (And through publisher making money, developerement teams get to keep their jobs longer and make bonuses).
Your statement that 1 CS = 1 Month of play time, thus 1 bought CS = Another wont buy CS is fundamentally flawed is the exchange rates fluctuate and the CS have a pool of them in market.
First everyone pays monthly fees, their value is standard, we call it 10$.
Then chronoscrolls come into pictuer, we call their value 10$, with ingame value of 100g
An event will occur where A pays for monthly fee, but pays another for CS to turn it into 100g
Usully CS would cost more than monthly fee, but we ignore that way of making money.
At this point publisher anyway made extra 10$ as no one bougth the item yet, everyone paid their fees, and there is 1 CS in pool.
This takes place for a while, the pool crows into 150 units of CS, while some did buy them with ingame money thus effectively nullifying the money put into buying them originally, there is still exess of 150 units, or 1500$ in the company coffin.
Just as a sidenote, PLEX pool is currently raging in tens of thousands of these items in EVE. (+interest from investing it = real value). And cost of paying back these eventually, is upkeep cost of the servers after calling off the PLEX selling service, which is obviously less than what ever PLEX gives them income, as every monthly fee generates profit even now.
Stage 2
The player who bought the CS did it to get extra gold to use in gold sinks, instead of spending the time making the gold in game. The one who bought the CS bought it because he does have sufficient amount of time or gold to pay for playing for free.
This ofcourse works a driver for two things, those who play alot will play even more, some for free, and those who play less pay more CS but create demand for gold.
Now as everyone knows, more supply lowers the value. Say 150 of these on the market, people start to undercut, CS value drops to 90g.
This means it becomes less viable way to buy CS for gold, but more viable to buy them for free months. We can iterate a value of 1 CS in ingame-time-spent from the amount of gold sinks, their interst/activity level and the gold/hour an average player earns.
Lower CS golds value means less sold CS, but more people will farm gold to pay with CS. This increases CS demand, and thus prices. Higher CS gold value means more sold CS, thus bigger CS pool.
Being the beings we are. All this subliminally generates an extra incentive to play the game, "just another hour of farming, so I can pay on my accounts with CS". Or, 10$ being considerably smal amount, and when legit, "oh well if I have an average salary job I can pay my accounts and another 30$ without a problem" - emerges.
We end up playing more, and in a way, paying more per month be it game time value, or pure money.
Just by accident publisher adds several new gold sinks to lower the actual value of ingame money and you see how it suddenly feeds into the multipliers.
I hope I made some sense.
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Oh yeah, I know what you are saying.
People pay their subscription and buy a scroll(s) and intend to use them at some point, so it is just there, as extra money to the company at this point because nobody has used it yet.
I also totally get the other statement, people will just grind more to make the money to buy them to play for free instead of quitting because they don't have the money to pay for a sub, therefore increasing company revenue.
What I was just explaining to the person who I was quoting was that the company isn't doing some under-handed scheme to rip off the players and that it's nothing like third-party RMT as in it doesn't run the risk of scam or fraud and doesn't negatively affect the company.
RMT from a third-party source is nothing like this and the reason companies are against it is because these gold farmers/traders are the ones making bots, hacking accounts and negatively impacting the company/community. They also have high risk of fraud and other issues, these things should not be tolerable by any company.
Comparing chronoscrolls to third-party gold sellers is just non-sense.
I recently subbed back to Aion. Most I have seen is one spam in a 3-4 hr session.
I also play EQ2, get maybe one spam in the mail every now and then.
Recetly played SWTOR from launch for 2 months, maybe saw one spam to buy currency.
Don't know where all these gold spammers are but I barely see them in the games I am playing.
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That they assume (correctly) that a lot of people won't see the connection, or otherwise won't care, would be my guess.
I find it funny when people will try to split hairs and twist it all around to make it seem like cash shops or things like PLEX or chronoscrolls are anything but sanctioned RMT. I mean, going on a "lesser of two evils" angle, you can at least know the money's going back to the developers and not into funding RMT/botters to continue their crap.
The thing that matters most to me is how aggressively the developer fights RMT/botting. Here's hoping NCSoft's way of not handling RMT isn't something else Blue Hole took with them, along with the original Lineage 3 code.
3rd party company making money off IP of creator company, bad. Creator company offering an option to host it themselves, good.
It's not mandatory. It's a way for people with more time to get a benefit from that time. I hope they do add a fee onto it since it will take x amount of staff to manage it and I'd rather it pay for itself for those that use it. I doubt I will ever use the system but I'm glad a legitimate option exists.
It's already been mentioned why the trying to cut out the 3rd party is a good thing. I just wanted to comment on the "hypocritical" parts since I'm against illegal RMT. I won't say this will get rid of bots/spammers but if you make it painful enough for then while also being diligent on banning accounts they will eventually move on to the next big thing.
Just not worth my time anymore.
RMT: Bots grind the money 24/7, inflating the ingame economy greatly. They hack people's pc's and steal credit card info, or just phish game accounts and steal gold to sell on. Sometimes stolen credit cards are used to pay for game accounts for new bots after a wave has been banned.
People buying gold have a very high chance of being ripped off, hacked or worse.
Chronoscrolls: People with excess gold pay for chronoscrolls which others have bought with real money. This does not unbalance the economy since the gold doesnt come from 'nowhere' like it does with bots.
Chronoscrolls do not drop anywhere in the game, they have to be bought from EME. In other words, someone who buys a chronoscroll with real money pays for someone else's subscription. Both people win - One gets his gold, all legit and legal, the other gets to play 'for free'.
The first situation, RMT, is a loss for both the devs and the players in ways i hope are blatantly obvious.
The second is a win-win for everyone involved EXCEPT the botters/gold sellers, and i don't see how that is a bad thing.
Bots and gold sellers in EVE have all but vanished. They can't compete with a legit way to buy ingame currency and they know it - Reducing weeks of 24/7 botting to a single plex (EVE's chronoscrolls), with gold sellers getting extremely desperate to sell anything at all, if they're not leaving alltogether.
Tera adopting this is a good thing, no matter how you spin it. It would happen in one way or another, legalizing and regulating it in this way is a win for everyone involved except the people who wanted to do it illegally.
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You see the problem is your looking at Chronoscrolls as a pay-to-win item where the more money you spend the more in game currency you get. This is true but if you look at it from another point of view, if you plan on playing a lot like me and are generally pretty good at the whole MMO thing you just got yourself a game without a subscription fee. We will have to wait and see just how expensive these Chronoscrolls end up to be.
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Its already been stated in an interview with EME that chornoscroll sells will be regulated. that means there will be limits on how many some one can buy with in a period of time. Also having money doesn't get you the best gear because they are BoP. So if you want it you still got to work for it, but will be lot easier for you to enchant them =P