He is trying to force CCP to choose between the laissez-faire sandbox ideal that they have always espoused
If they ever did, there would be no high sec and many restrictive rules.
On the contrary, what makes EVE sandbox is the "practical need to have a functional gaming environment".
You just still impose your play style and view upon others...such approach is mutually exclusive with sandbox principles.
I personally believe that highsec and restrictive rules are concessions to keep the sheep in the game. Although for obvious PC reasons if you were CCP you can't say this outright.
Either way its part of the sandbox to impose my playstyle and views upon others in the box with me, on the flipside its their right to do the same to me. For example there is a small coalition called the NRDS (anti-pirate) coalition that I philosophically disagree with, they are trying to impose their way of thinking thru artifical player rules that they have invented. They enforce their ideals by blowing up "pirates" that do not agree with their rules. They are doing something about people like goons actively and without CCP intervention, they are miners and industrialists too but with teeth and for this I do respect them much more than someone who simply ask the devs to solve player problems for them.
New player here, but that sounds like a corp to get in with! I hate "Pirates". I got killed last night in a badger mk I By a carrier with a scout buddy and all he had was a warp disrupter and a MWD to close the gap. Warped in to 80 KM from me, and jsut as i was kicking into warp drive, nope!
1 run more than paid for my ship, but I swear i will get payback on these "Pirates". Hope you feel bad launching 15 heavy drones to kill a single badger industry ship. (Still took you 2 minutes with my shields going)
When people run around killing badger mk1's, thats not PvP, thats not "Pirating" (I hadn't even started so i had 0 inventory), That is ganking, and i will have my payback one day! Have fun losing a 1bil isk ship trying to kill a transport.
(Obviously not saying you were this pirate haha, just my general feeling towards what i've found the community of EvE to be)
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
After every major suicide-ganking spree in EVE, CCP has usually made changes to hisec to "discourage" the gankers. Changes to Concord response times, removal of insurance payouts, etc. did in fact have an effect on the "economics" of ganking, so that eventually only high-value targets were "worth" the cost of a suicide gank.
But a determined ganker is very inventive
What the goons have done is to basically refund the "cost" of suicide-ganking, making Hulks a viable target. So once again, a "workaround" has been found to negate the penalties that CCP had instituted. Of course, this campaign is self-funding in a sense, because if enough Hulks are removed from the belts, the price of hisec minerals will rise, leading to much greater profits for organised and defended corporate mining ops. Emergent gameplay at it's best ?
But if base minerals increase in price, everything in EVE increases in price, which hits new players the hardest. That is perhaps the most negative aspect of an extended Hulkageddon. However, it will also mean that the cost of suicide ganking will rise as well, because replacing the gank ships will become more and more expensive. So the goons will have to keep increasing the bounty if they want to sustain the campaign. Market manipulation on a grand scale ?
It will be very interesting to see how CCP reacts this time, because the standard disincentives are no longer effective.
Originally posted by Gdemami We are running in circles within your narrow-minded perception...as I said before you are mistaking PVP for sandbox. Those two are not the same as you make them out to be.Being sheep or having teeth does not make one more important or valuable over another. They are both different play styles and in order to be a sandbox game, you need to cater them both equally.
In a sandbox it's only nartural for someone to come by and stomp on your castle. It's happening in every sandbox where children are playing and building castles, every day. And consequences for treating another player bad allways happen afterwards and not upfront.
Deal with it and stop complaining. A sandbox without unconsentual PvP is not a sandbox anymore, but a walled garden.
We've got enough walled gardens in the MMO-landscape, and EvE will never be turned into one.
What the goons are trying to achieve is not to force CCP into making EvE more carebear-friendly actually. What they try to do is driving away the riskless gameplay from high-sec into low or null-sec.
Mining ice in high-sec has to go, aswell as AFK-mining low-mins. Jita has to go as the single trading hub - there should be a trading hub for every empire, with the empires divided by low-sec, like it was a long time ago.
As CCP isn't doing away with the riskless gameplay - especially in the economic activities like mining and trading - goons are trying to turn EvE into what it should be themselves. And rightfully so.
For example there is a small coalition called the NRDS (anti-pirate) coalition that I philosophically disagree with, they are trying to impose their way of thinking thru artifical player rules that they have invented. They enforce their ideals by blowing up "pirates" that do not agree with their rules. They are doing something about people like goons actively and without CCP intervention, they are miners and industrialists too but with teeth and for this I do respect them much more than someone who simply ask the devs to solve player problems for them.
We are running in circles within your narrow-minded perception...as I said before you are mistaking PVP for sandbox. Those two are not the same as you make them out to be.
Being sheep or having teeth does not make one more important or valuable over another. They are both different play styles and in order to be a sandbox game, you need to cater them both equally.
Your saying something needs to be catered to, I'm saying they both exist on the same plane. If one happens to gain superiority over the other, to me, that is a consequence of them both existing in nature together and thats fine because it is the nature of the virtual world that is being similated here. You are saying the state of nature is not fine and that nature needs to be restructured to be more like the kind of world we exist in rather than be the virutal world that is being simulated.
I'm saying the cruel pvp slanted world that EVE is today is fine, it doesn't need to be watered down to be something that it isn't just because its more pleasing for the mainstream.
He is trying to force CCP to choose between the laissez-faire sandbox ideal that they have always espoused
If they ever did, there would be no high sec and many restrictive rules.
On the contrary, what makes EVE sandbox is the "practical need to have a functional gaming environment".
You just still impose your play style and view upon others...such approach is mutually exclusive with sandbox principles.
I personally believe that highsec and restrictive rules are concessions to keep the sheep in the game. Although for obvious PC reasons if you were CCP you can't say this outright.
Either way its part of the sandbox to impose my playstyle and views upon others in the box with me, on the flipside its their right to do the same to me. For example there is a small coalition called the NRDS (anti-pirate) coalition that I philosophically disagree with, they are trying to impose their way of thinking thru artifical player rules that they have invented. They enforce their ideals by blowing up "pirates" that do not agree with their rules. They are doing something about people like goons actively and without CCP intervention, they are miners and industrialists too but with teeth and for this I do respect them much more than someone who simply ask the devs to solve player problems for them.
New player here, but that sounds like a corp to get in with! I hate "Pirates". I got killed last night in a badger mk I By a carrier with a scout buddy and all he had was a warp disrupter and a MWD to close the gap. Warped in to 80 KM from me, and jsut as i was kicking into warp drive, nope!
1 run more than paid for my ship, but I swear i will get payback on these "Pirates". Hope you feel bad launching 15 heavy drones to kill a single badger industry ship. (Still took you 2 minutes with my shields going)
When people run around killing badger mk1's, thats not PvP, thats not "Pirating" (I hadn't even started so i had 0 inventory), That is ganking, and i will have my payback one day! Have fun losing a 1bil isk ship trying to kill a transport.
(Obviously not saying you were this pirate haha, just my general feeling towards what i've found the community of EvE to be)
This is exactly how you feed the trolls.
For them, 1 bil isk is recoupable, and not a big deal.
You will never get any "payback" because you assume you could "hurt" them like you were "hurt".
He is trying to force CCP to choose between the laissez-faire sandbox ideal that they have always espoused
If they ever did, there would be no high sec and many restrictive rules.
On the contrary, what makes EVE sandbox is the "practical need to have a functional gaming environment".
You just still impose your play style and view upon others...such approach is mutually exclusive with sandbox principles.
I personally believe that highsec and restrictive rules are concessions to keep the sheep in the game. Although for obvious PC reasons if you were CCP you can't say this outright.
Either way its part of the sandbox to impose my playstyle and views upon others in the box with me, on the flipside its their right to do the same to me. For example there is a small coalition called the NRDS (anti-pirate) coalition that I philosophically disagree with, they are trying to impose their way of thinking thru artifical player rules that they have invented. They enforce their ideals by blowing up "pirates" that do not agree with their rules. They are doing something about people like goons actively and without CCP intervention, they are miners and industrialists too but with teeth and for this I do respect them much more than someone who simply ask the devs to solve player problems for them.
New player here, but that sounds like a corp to get in with! I hate "Pirates". I got killed last night in a badger mk I By a carrier with a scout buddy and all he had was a warp disrupter and a MWD to close the gap. Warped in to 80 KM from me, and jsut as i was kicking into warp drive, nope!
1 run more than paid for my ship, but I swear i will get payback on these "Pirates". Hope you feel bad launching 15 heavy drones to kill a single badger industry ship. (Still took you 2 minutes with my shields going)
When people run around killing badger mk1's, thats not PvP, thats not "Pirating" (I hadn't even started so i had 0 inventory), That is ganking, and i will have my payback one day! Have fun losing a 1bil isk ship trying to kill a transport.
(Obviously not saying you were this pirate haha, just my general feeling towards what i've found the community of EvE to be)
This is exactly how you feed the trolls.
For them, 1 bil isk is recoupable, and not a big deal.
You will never get any "payback" because you assume you could "hurt" them like you were "hurt".
You can't, in any way, shape or form.
All you will do is waste your time and resources.
Its like trying to get payback on entropy.
Actually getting a carrier killed trying to gank some random indy ship would be lulz worthy and probably get you kicked from the alliance I'm in, since we consider ourselves a PvP alliance. Shitting up our stats with something stupid like that would be kick worthy, and thats after all the comments on the killboard intended to make the carrier pilot feel like shit for derping. People have been trolled by their own alliance for less stupid losses.
Wolvards, mail me the guys game name and where he hangs out. Lets see if he does it often
He is trying to force CCP to choose between the laissez-faire sandbox ideal that they have always espoused
If they ever did, there would be no high sec and many restrictive rules.
On the contrary, what makes EVE sandbox is the "practical need to have a functional gaming environment".
You just still impose your play style and view upon others...such approach is mutually exclusive with sandbox principles.
I personally believe that highsec and restrictive rules are concessions to keep the sheep in the game. Although for obvious PC reasons if you were CCP you can't say this outright.
Either way its part of the sandbox to impose my playstyle and views upon others in the box with me, on the flipside its their right to do the same to me. For example there is a small coalition called the NRDS (anti-pirate) coalition that I philosophically disagree with, they are trying to impose their way of thinking thru artifical player rules that they have invented. They enforce their ideals by blowing up "pirates" that do not agree with their rules. They are doing something about people like goons actively and without CCP intervention, they are miners and industrialists too but with teeth and for this I do respect them much more than someone who simply ask the devs to solve player problems for them.
New player here, but that sounds like a corp to get in with! I hate "Pirates". I got killed last night in a badger mk I By a carrier with a scout buddy and all he had was a warp disrupter and a MWD to close the gap. Warped in to 80 KM from me, and jsut as i was kicking into warp drive, nope!
1 run more than paid for my ship, but I swear i will get payback on these "Pirates". Hope you feel bad launching 15 heavy drones to kill a single badger industry ship. (Still took you 2 minutes with my shields going)
When people run around killing badger mk1's, thats not PvP, thats not "Pirating" (I hadn't even started so i had 0 inventory), That is ganking, and i will have my payback one day! Have fun losing a 1bil isk ship trying to kill a transport.
(Obviously not saying you were this pirate haha, just my general feeling towards what i've found the community of EvE to be)
This is exactly how you feed the trolls.
For them, 1 bil isk is recoupable, and not a big deal.
You will never get any "payback" because you assume you could "hurt" them like you were "hurt".
You can't, in any way, shape or form.
All you will do is waste your time and resources.
Its like trying to get payback on entropy.
Actually getting a carrier killed trying to gank some random indy ship would be lulz worthy and probably get you kicked from the alliance I'm in, since we consider ourselves a PvP alliance. Shitting up our stats with something stupid like that would be kick worthy, and thats after all the comments on the killboard intended to make the carrier pilot feel like shit for derping. People have been trolled by their own alliance for less stupid losses.
Wolvards, mail me the guys game name and where he hangs out. Lets see if he does it often
Sounds enticing, tell me more about the 4chan of games...
Sounds enticing, tell me more about the 4chan of games...
Because if something is not your cup of tea it automatically becomes invalid. I still don't know if you have ever experienced the EVE community or if you are just taking drive by shots at it.
Sounds enticing, tell me more about the 4chan of games...
Because if something is not your cup of tea it automatically becomes invalid. I still don't know if you have ever experienced the EVE community or if you are just taking drive by shots at it.
I didnt say its invalid or bad.
I said it sounds like 4chan, in space.
I did play EVE, and from time to time i still do, because believe it or not, behind all the goons, the pvp, the "hardcoreness" there -is- a game i want to play, its just the "community" is bent on not letting me do that.
CCP created a truly -amazing- game.
It must be, because i keep comming back to be abused by it over and over again, and im not even masochistic.
...but we can't blame the makers of a game for the kind of community it attracts. Then again, they really do tote the 'cutthroat nature' and laud every major scam that happens around. Maybe they *are* asking for it.
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He is trying to force CCP to choose between the laissez-faire sandbox ideal that they have always espoused
If they ever did, there would be no high sec and many restrictive rules.
On the contrary, what makes EVE sandbox is the "practical need to have a functional gaming environment".
You just still impose your play style and view upon others...such approach is mutually exclusive with sandbox principles.
I personally believe that highsec and restrictive rules are concessions to keep the sheep in the game. Although for obvious PC reasons if you were CCP you can't say this outright.
Either way its part of the sandbox to impose my playstyle and views upon others in the box with me, on the flipside its their right to do the same to me. For example there is a small coalition called the NRDS (anti-pirate) coalition that I philosophically disagree with, they are trying to impose their way of thinking thru artifical player rules that they have invented. They enforce their ideals by blowing up "pirates" that do not agree with their rules. They are doing something about people like goons actively and without CCP intervention, they are miners and industrialists too but with teeth and for this I do respect them much more than someone who simply ask the devs to solve player problems for them.
New player here, but that sounds like a corp to get in with! I hate "Pirates". I got killed last night in a badger mk I By a carrier with a scout buddy and all he had was a warp disrupter and a MWD to close the gap. Warped in to 80 KM from me, and jsut as i was kicking into warp drive, nope!
1 run more than paid for my ship, but I swear i will get payback on these "Pirates". Hope you feel bad launching 15 heavy drones to kill a single badger industry ship. (Still took you 2 minutes with my shields going)
When people run around killing badger mk1's, thats not PvP, thats not "Pirating" (I hadn't even started so i had 0 inventory), That is ganking, and i will have my payback one day! Have fun losing a 1bil isk ship trying to kill a transport.
(Obviously not saying you were this pirate haha, just my general feeling towards what i've found the community of EvE to be)
This is exactly how you feed the trolls.
For them, 1 bil isk is recoupable, and not a big deal.
You will never get any "payback" because you assume you could "hurt" them like you were "hurt".
You can't, in any way, shape or form.
All you will do is waste your time and resources.
Its like trying to get payback on entropy.
Actually getting a carrier killed trying to gank some random indy ship would be lulz worthy and probably get you kicked from the alliance I'm in, since we consider ourselves a PvP alliance. Shitting up our stats with something stupid like that would be kick worthy, and thats after all the comments on the killboard intended to make the carrier pilot feel like shit for derping. People have been trolled by their own alliance for less stupid losses.
Wolvards, mail me the guys game name and where he hangs out. Lets see if he does it often
I will get his name down if I see him again. Dang tard got lucky, i was scouting out a new system looking for some Jaspet, and had to use the restroom, i get back to the comp and i'm warp disrupted! i'm like aww nah this aint happenin!!! needless to say it happened about 10 heavy assault drones, and it still took him time to kill me (3 medium shield rechargers). But i got away in my pod so i saved all my implants.
Anywho, what i'm posting about is a question, a question on damage. Me and a buddy have a plan, long run plan, but still a plan... We are thinking stealth bombers, with a Caldari Mantacor (?). Do you think one would have the damage to take out a carrier/super carrier? I know they are made for anti-battleship type warfare, but what about Carriers? (Keep in mind i'm not even 7 days in)
Couple ways we've thought of doing this, baiting gankers into an asteroid belt, or camping other miners in low sec space, and pick our fights. My corp (who i just joined) uses this system often, and don't get ganked cause they run a full mining op, but obviously when it's just me and my miner buddy, we are the perfect meal. Is stealth bomber dps enough to effectively kill a carrier with 10-15 heavy drones? More so, Fast enough? Or should we plan on being a jump away from an asteroid belt, with some bigger, higher dps output ships?
Thanks for any advice! I really hope i get some lulz and piss some gankers off, kill them enough times, i doubt they want to keep re-fitting ships for some Badger MK1's haha.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
Wolvards it's goint to take a whole lot more than some stealth bombers to take out a carrier.
I am not sure where this happened, low sec or null, guess it doesn't matter. If you the guy with the carrier is dumb enough to be out in space, away from a pos or station, he can be baited. Just need to bait him with a battleship or something that can tank a bit, have your fleet nearby, get him agressed and away from a station or pos and jump him. Depending on this fit and how much dps you have, it could take a while to kill him.
It's obviously more complicated than that. Keep at it though, someday you might get some payback. You have the right attitude
...but we can't blame the makers of a game for the kind of community it attracts. Then again, they really do tote the 'cutthroat nature' and laud every major scam that happens around. Maybe they *are* asking for it.
I have given up hope on CCP doing anything about anything that happens ingame.
CCP likes their games image and they want to keep it as the polar opposite of WoW.
What im afraid of is that they will extend their philosophy to WoD, because we dont need EvE with vampires, we really don't.
Wolvards it's goint to take a whole lot more than some stealth bombers to take out a carrier.
I am not sure where this happened, low sec or null, guess it doesn't matter. If you the guy with the carrier is dumb enough to be out in space, away from a pos or station, he can be baited. Just need to bait him with a battleship or something that can tank a bit, have your fleet nearby, get him agressed and away from a station or pos and jump him. Depending on this fit and how much dps you have, it could take a while to kill him.
It's obviously more complicated than that. Keep at it though, someday you might get some payback. You have the right attitude
See thats what i wanted to know! So what are bombers effective at killing? Or are they effective still? Couple big boom bombs won't do anything?
Not sure about difference between null/low/high, but it was in .4, so no concord That's why, 2 jumps from a station too, just for some info. He had a buddy in a TINY ship, think all he had equiped was a MWD and a warp disruptor, cause i got back to my comp, seen him warp in, i tried to turn and he was on top of me disrupting me. I almost got him with one 150mm rail gun though! haha.
Anyways, if a stealth bomber ain't what i should go for, atleast for griefing greifers, what should i go for?
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
So we had Burn Jita, and now an extended Hulkageddon. In Mittens latest installment of Sins of a Solar Empire, he speaks on some motivating factors of why goons sponsor such events.
Think what you will of the man, the controversy surrounding him, or that all us goons are nothing but gankers who want to "destroy EVE". He makes very valid points here, points that can be verified with a quick trip to EVE's general discussion forums.
While I undestand, and fully support, the idea that a game like EVE requires the non-pvp carebear (of which I am one of), events like these aren't intended to impact that group of people. We know what game we play, we're aware of the inherent risk of undocking even in hi-sec space. Unfortunetly, there is a rather large segment of players who don't get it.
I thought it was an intersting read. Maybe because it mirrors my own feelings about the MMO genre and an element existing within the EVE universe. Or maybe it's just becuase he's my supreme overlord and ruler.
"One of the stark lessons of Burn Jita and Hulkageddon is that the vast majority of players in EVE are completely unplugged from the game’s community; they do not read forums, check twitter, read blogs, or keep track of the gaming media. Every day during Hulkageddon miners would be ganked and comment that they’d never heard of Hulkageddon before, even though this was the fifth iteration of the contest. Despite more than a month of warning - with unprecedented alerts posted by CCP on the login screen - countless freighters blundered into Jita during our invasion and died, their pilots screaming their unjustified surprise, running to the forums for the first time to announce that (gasp) EVE wasn’t actually safe."
The fascinating thing is that some people seem to think this being unplugged is a bad thing. Maybe some EVE players haven't realized that there is a world outside of video games that some of the rest of us engage with more frequently than this game we have as a leisure activity?
He is trying to force CCP to choose between the laissez-faire sandbox ideal that they have always espoused
If they ever did, there would be no high sec and many restrictive rules.
On the contrary, what makes EVE sandbox is the "practical need to have a functional gaming environment".
You just still impose your play style and view upon others...such approach is mutually exclusive with sandbox principles.
I personally believe that highsec and restrictive rules are concessions to keep the sheep in the game. Although for obvious PC reasons if you were CCP you can't say this outright.
Either way its part of the sandbox to impose my playstyle and views upon others in the box with me, on the flipside its their right to do the same to me. For example there is a small coalition called the NRDS (anti-pirate) coalition that I philosophically disagree with, they are trying to impose their way of thinking thru artifical player rules that they have invented. They enforce their ideals by blowing up "pirates" that do not agree with their rules. They are doing something about people like goons actively and without CCP intervention, they are miners and industrialists too but with teeth and for this I do respect them much more than someone who simply ask the devs to solve player problems for them.
New player here, but that sounds like a corp to get in with! I hate "Pirates". I got killed last night in a badger mk I By a carrier with a scout buddy and all he had was a warp disrupter and a MWD to close the gap. Warped in to 80 KM from me, and jsut as i was kicking into warp drive, nope!
1 run more than paid for my ship, but I swear i will get payback on these "Pirates". Hope you feel bad launching 15 heavy drones to kill a single badger industry ship. (Still took you 2 minutes with my shields going)
When people run around killing badger mk1's, thats not PvP, thats not "Pirating" (I hadn't even started so i had 0 inventory), That is ganking, and i will have my payback one day! Have fun losing a 1bil isk ship trying to kill a transport.
(Obviously not saying you were this pirate haha, just my general feeling towards what i've found the community of EvE to be)
This is exactly how you feed the trolls.
For them, 1 bil isk is recoupable, and not a big deal.
You will never get any "payback" because you assume you could "hurt" them like you were "hurt".
You can't, in any way, shape or form.
All you will do is waste your time and resources.
Its like trying to get payback on entropy.
Actually getting a carrier killed trying to gank some random indy ship would be lulz worthy and probably get you kicked from the alliance I'm in, since we consider ourselves a PvP alliance. Shitting up our stats with something stupid like that would be kick worthy, and thats after all the comments on the killboard intended to make the carrier pilot feel like shit for derping. People have been trolled by their own alliance for less stupid losses.
Wolvards, mail me the guys game name and where he hangs out. Lets see if he does it often
Sounds like a charming, well-adjusted group of people.
So we had Burn Jita, and now an extended Hulkageddon. In Mittens latest installment of Sins of a Solar Empire, he speaks on some motivating factors of why goons sponsor such events.
Think what you will of the man, the controversy surrounding him, or that all us goons are nothing but gankers who want to "destroy EVE". He makes very valid points here, points that can be verified with a quick trip to EVE's general discussion forums.
While I undestand, and fully support, the idea that a game like EVE requires the non-pvp carebear (of which I am one of), events like these aren't intended to impact that group of people. We know what game we play, we're aware of the inherent risk of undocking even in hi-sec space. Unfortunetly, there is a rather large segment of players who don't get it.
I thought it was an intersting read. Maybe because it mirrors my own feelings about the MMO genre and an element existing within the EVE universe. Or maybe it's just becuase he's my supreme overlord and ruler.
"One of the stark lessons of Burn Jita and Hulkageddon is that the vast majority of players in EVE are completely unplugged from the game’s community; they do not read forums, check twitter, read blogs, or keep track of the gaming media. Every day during Hulkageddon miners would be ganked and comment that they’d never heard of Hulkageddon before, even though this was the fifth iteration of the contest. Despite more than a month of warning - with unprecedented alerts posted by CCP on the login screen - countless freighters blundered into Jita during our invasion and died, their pilots screaming their unjustified surprise, running to the forums for the first time to announce that (gasp) EVE wasn’t actually safe."
The fascinating thing is that some people seem to think this being unplugged is a bad thing. Maybe some EVE players haven't realized that there is a world outside of video games that some of the rest of us engage with more frequently than this game we have as a leisure activity?
There's a word for people who are "unplugged" from the log-in screen: botters
He is trying to force CCP to choose between the laissez-faire sandbox ideal that they have always espoused
If they ever did, there would be no high sec and many restrictive rules.
On the contrary, what makes EVE sandbox is the "practical need to have a functional gaming environment".
You just still impose your play style and view upon others...such approach is mutually exclusive with sandbox principles.
I personally believe that highsec and restrictive rules are concessions to keep the sheep in the game. Although for obvious PC reasons if you were CCP you can't say this outright.
Either way its part of the sandbox to impose my playstyle and views upon others in the box with me, on the flipside its their right to do the same to me. For example there is a small coalition called the NRDS (anti-pirate) coalition that I philosophically disagree with, they are trying to impose their way of thinking thru artifical player rules that they have invented. They enforce their ideals by blowing up "pirates" that do not agree with their rules. They are doing something about people like goons actively and without CCP intervention, they are miners and industrialists too but with teeth and for this I do respect them much more than someone who simply ask the devs to solve player problems for them.
New player here, but that sounds like a corp to get in with! I hate "Pirates". I got killed last night in a badger mk I By a carrier with a scout buddy and all he had was a warp disrupter and a MWD to close the gap. Warped in to 80 KM from me, and jsut as i was kicking into warp drive, nope!
1 run more than paid for my ship, but I swear i will get payback on these "Pirates". Hope you feel bad launching 15 heavy drones to kill a single badger industry ship. (Still took you 2 minutes with my shields going)
When people run around killing badger mk1's, thats not PvP, thats not "Pirating" (I hadn't even started so i had 0 inventory), That is ganking, and i will have my payback one day! Have fun losing a 1bil isk ship trying to kill a transport.
(Obviously not saying you were this pirate haha, just my general feeling towards what i've found the community of EvE to be)
This is exactly how you feed the trolls.
For them, 1 bil isk is recoupable, and not a big deal.
You will never get any "payback" because you assume you could "hurt" them like you were "hurt".
You can't, in any way, shape or form.
All you will do is waste your time and resources.
Its like trying to get payback on entropy.
Actually getting a carrier killed trying to gank some random indy ship would be lulz worthy and probably get you kicked from the alliance I'm in, since we consider ourselves a PvP alliance. Shitting up our stats with something stupid like that would be kick worthy, and thats after all the comments on the killboard intended to make the carrier pilot feel like shit for derping. People have been trolled by their own alliance for less stupid losses.
Wolvards, mail me the guys game name and where he hangs out. Lets see if he does it often
Sounds like a charming, well-adjusted group of people.
If you can't take the heat get out of the oven, being able to take a hazing well could be grounds for letting the derp stay. Some groups prefer to be half decent at this game, and have a core of players that are generally "good" and don't "fail" too often, this isn't something that is inherently bad
This game should be more like "Space Pirates Online". Most Eve players wont admit it, but being ganked/killed for no reason that 'cause you can' or some such thing is dumb. Now theyre suidicde ganking people in hisec just to harass them. The community on this game is really bad now.
This game should be more like "Space Pirates Online". Most Eve players wont admit it, but being ganked/killed for no reason that 'cause you can' or some such thing is dumb. Now theyre suidicde ganking people in hisec just to harass them. The community on this game is really bad now.
It's a FFA PvP game. Isn't the idea to kill the other guy and make a profit? The community hasn't changed a bit. It's your corp vs the world.
"Take what you can, give nothing back".
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own. -- Herman Melville
Wolvards it's goint to take a whole lot more than some stealth bombers to take out a carrier.
I am not sure where this happened, low sec or null, guess it doesn't matter. If you the guy with the carrier is dumb enough to be out in space, away from a pos or station, he can be baited. Just need to bait him with a battleship or something that can tank a bit, have your fleet nearby, get him agressed and away from a station or pos and jump him. Depending on this fit and how much dps you have, it could take a while to kill him.
It's obviously more complicated than that. Keep at it though, someday you might get some payback. You have the right attitude
See thats what i wanted to know! So what are bombers effective at killing? Or are they effective still? Couple big boom bombs won't do anything?
Not sure about difference between null/low/high, but it was in .4, so no concord That's why, 2 jumps from a station too, just for some info. He had a buddy in a TINY ship, think all he had equiped was a MWD and a warp disruptor, cause i got back to my comp, seen him warp in, i tried to turn and he was on top of me disrupting me. I almost got him with one 150mm rail gun though! haha.
Anyways, if a stealth bomber ain't what i should go for, atleast for griefing greifers, what should i go for?
You always have to adapt to the situation at hand. Technically, you COULD kill a carrier with nothing but stealth bombers...if you had over 100 of them and the carrier's friends didn't show up...
Best thing you could do for griefing griefers is to have as many friends as possible hiding in a nearby system that (hopefully) the griefers don't know about, and you can set up an ambush...but remember that most griefers are VERY good at what they do, and will undoubtedly be checking as many places as possible for your backup. The ship that you yourself would fly would depend on which of the various roles you would want to be in that fleet of yours. For example, if you wanted to be the bait to lure the griefers in, you would have to be in something that has a LOT of defences and ideally is not well known as a bait ship. Or you could be in the support fleet as tackle, logistics, ewar, DPS...lots of options for you.
Technically, you COULD kill a carrier with nothing but stealth bombers...if you had over 100 of them and the carrier's friends didn't show up...
This is plainly untrue, a swarm of about 20 bombers is more than sufficient to kill a single carrier in a timely manner, before his friends could react, as happened here:
We deployed a drag bubble way off the station and aligned it towards a POS that their ships were known to warp from to the station. We had a covert cyno cloaked off the bubble, as soon as our carrier friend here found himself hundreds of KMs away from the station we dropped with just over 20 bombers and recons. The carrier explodes 2 minutes later, just in time for his buddies to start getting warp ins, they trickle one at a time and die. Then a sizable group finally warps in as we are withdrawing from the bubble.
...but we can't blame the makers of a game for the kind of community it attracts. Then again, they really do tote the 'cutthroat nature' and laud every major scam that happens around. Maybe they *are* asking for it.
I have given up hope on CCP doing anything about anything that happens ingame.
CCP likes their games image and they want to keep it as the polar opposite of WoW.
What im afraid of is that they will extend their philosophy to WoD, because we dont need EvE with vampires, we really don't.
No, we need WoW with vampires. There are so many Eve clones that the market is flooded.
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own. -- Herman Melville
Comments
New player here, but that sounds like a corp to get in with! I hate "Pirates". I got killed last night in a badger mk I By a carrier with a scout buddy and all he had was a warp disrupter and a MWD to close the gap. Warped in to 80 KM from me, and jsut as i was kicking into warp drive, nope!
1 run more than paid for my ship, but I swear i will get payback on these "Pirates". Hope you feel bad launching 15 heavy drones to kill a single badger industry ship. (Still took you 2 minutes with my shields going)
When people run around killing badger mk1's, thats not PvP, thats not "Pirating" (I hadn't even started so i had 0 inventory), That is ganking, and i will have my payback one day! Have fun losing a 1bil isk ship trying to kill a transport.
(Obviously not saying you were this pirate haha, just my general feeling towards what i've found the community of EvE to be)
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
After every major suicide-ganking spree in EVE, CCP has usually made changes to hisec to "discourage" the gankers. Changes to Concord response times, removal of insurance payouts, etc. did in fact have an effect on the "economics" of ganking, so that eventually only high-value targets were "worth" the cost of a suicide gank.
But a determined ganker is very inventive
What the goons have done is to basically refund the "cost" of suicide-ganking, making Hulks a viable target. So once again, a "workaround" has been found to negate the penalties that CCP had instituted. Of course, this campaign is self-funding in a sense, because if enough Hulks are removed from the belts, the price of hisec minerals will rise, leading to much greater profits for organised and defended corporate mining ops. Emergent gameplay at it's best ?
But if base minerals increase in price, everything in EVE increases in price, which hits new players the hardest. That is perhaps the most negative aspect of an extended Hulkageddon. However, it will also mean that the cost of suicide ganking will rise as well, because replacing the gank ships will become more and more expensive. So the goons will have to keep increasing the bounty if they want to sustain the campaign. Market manipulation on a grand scale ?
It will be very interesting to see how CCP reacts this time, because the standard disincentives are no longer effective.
In a sandbox it's only nartural for someone to come by and stomp on your castle. It's happening in every sandbox where children are playing and building castles, every day. And consequences for treating another player bad allways happen afterwards and not upfront.
Deal with it and stop complaining. A sandbox without unconsentual PvP is not a sandbox anymore, but a walled garden.
We've got enough walled gardens in the MMO-landscape, and EvE will never be turned into one.
What the goons are trying to achieve is not to force CCP into making EvE more carebear-friendly actually. What they try to do is driving away the riskless gameplay from high-sec into low or null-sec.
Mining ice in high-sec has to go, aswell as AFK-mining low-mins. Jita has to go as the single trading hub - there should be a trading hub for every empire, with the empires divided by low-sec, like it was a long time ago.
As CCP isn't doing away with the riskless gameplay - especially in the economic activities like mining and trading - goons are trying to turn EvE into what it should be themselves. And rightfully so.
Your saying something needs to be catered to, I'm saying they both exist on the same plane. If one happens to gain superiority over the other, to me, that is a consequence of them both existing in nature together and thats fine because it is the nature of the virtual world that is being similated here. You are saying the state of nature is not fine and that nature needs to be restructured to be more like the kind of world we exist in rather than be the virutal world that is being simulated.
I'm saying the cruel pvp slanted world that EVE is today is fine, it doesn't need to be watered down to be something that it isn't just because its more pleasing for the mainstream.
This is exactly how you feed the trolls.
For them, 1 bil isk is recoupable, and not a big deal.
You will never get any "payback" because you assume you could "hurt" them like you were "hurt".
You can't, in any way, shape or form.
All you will do is waste your time and resources.
Its like trying to get payback on entropy.
Actually getting a carrier killed trying to gank some random indy ship would be lulz worthy and probably get you kicked from the alliance I'm in, since we consider ourselves a PvP alliance. Shitting up our stats with something stupid like that would be kick worthy, and thats after all the comments on the killboard intended to make the carrier pilot feel like shit for derping. People have been trolled by their own alliance for less stupid losses.
Wolvards, mail me the guys game name and where he hangs out. Lets see if he does it often
Sounds enticing, tell me more about the 4chan of games...
Because if something is not your cup of tea it automatically becomes invalid. I still don't know if you have ever experienced the EVE community or if you are just taking drive by shots at it.
I didnt say its invalid or bad.
I said it sounds like 4chan, in space.
I did play EVE, and from time to time i still do, because believe it or not, behind all the goons, the pvp, the "hardcoreness" there -is- a game i want to play, its just the "community" is bent on not letting me do that.
CCP created a truly -amazing- game.
It must be, because i keep comming back to be abused by it over and over again, and im not even masochistic.
HA, it basically is...
...but we can't blame the makers of a game for the kind of community it attracts. Then again, they really do tote the 'cutthroat nature' and laud every major scam that happens around. Maybe they *are* asking for it.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I will get his name down if I see him again. Dang tard got lucky, i was scouting out a new system looking for some Jaspet, and had to use the restroom, i get back to the comp and i'm warp disrupted! i'm like aww nah this aint happenin!!! needless to say it happened
about 10 heavy assault drones, and it still took him time to kill me (3 medium shield rechargers). But i got away in my pod so i saved all my implants.
Anywho, what i'm posting about is a question, a question on damage. Me and a buddy have a plan, long run plan, but still a plan... We are thinking stealth bombers, with a Caldari Mantacor (?). Do you think one would have the damage to take out a carrier/super carrier? I know they are made for anti-battleship type warfare, but what about Carriers? (Keep in mind i'm not even 7 days in)
Couple ways we've thought of doing this, baiting gankers into an asteroid belt, or camping other miners in low sec space, and pick our fights. My corp (who i just joined) uses this system often, and don't get ganked cause they run a full mining op, but obviously when it's just me and my miner buddy, we are the perfect meal. Is stealth bomber dps enough to effectively kill a carrier with 10-15 heavy drones? More so, Fast enough? Or should we plan on being a jump away from an asteroid belt, with some bigger, higher dps output ships?
Thanks for any advice! I really hope i get some lulz and piss some gankers off, kill them enough times, i doubt they want to keep re-fitting ships for some Badger MK1's haha.
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
Wolvards it's goint to take a whole lot more than some stealth bombers to take out a carrier.
I am not sure where this happened, low sec or null, guess it doesn't matter. If you the guy with the carrier is dumb enough to be out in space, away from a pos or station, he can be baited. Just need to bait him with a battleship or something that can tank a bit, have your fleet nearby, get him agressed and away from a station or pos and jump him. Depending on this fit and how much dps you have, it could take a while to kill him.
It's obviously more complicated than that. Keep at it though, someday you might get some payback. You have the right attitude
I have given up hope on CCP doing anything about anything that happens ingame.
CCP likes their games image and they want to keep it as the polar opposite of WoW.
What im afraid of is that they will extend their philosophy to WoD, because we dont need EvE with vampires, we really don't.
Agreed, but seeing as how they hope to garner a giant female gamer playerbase - it will be it's own kind of cutthroat.
"that dress makes you look fat!"
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
See thats what i wanted to know! So what are bombers effective at killing? Or are they effective still? Couple big boom bombs won't do anything?
Not sure about difference between null/low/high, but it was in .4, so no concord
That's why, 2 jumps from a station too, just for some info. He had a buddy in a TINY ship, think all he had equiped was a MWD and a warp disruptor, cause i got back to my comp, seen him warp in, i tried to turn and he was on top of me disrupting me. I almost got him with one 150mm rail gun though! haha.
Anyways, if a stealth bomber ain't what i should go for, atleast for griefing greifers, what should i go for?
The "Youtube Pro": Someone who watches video's on said subject, and obviously has a full understanding of what is being said about such subject.
Man, this game is awesome.
That is all.
Carry on.
o7
The fascinating thing is that some people seem to think this being unplugged is a bad thing. Maybe some EVE players haven't realized that there is a world outside of video games that some of the rest of us engage with more frequently than this game we have as a leisure activity?
Sounds like a charming, well-adjusted group of people.
There's a word for people who are "unplugged" from the log-in screen: botters
Give me liberty or give me lasers
If you can't take the heat get out of the oven, being able to take a hazing well could be grounds for letting the derp stay. Some groups prefer to be half decent at this game, and have a core of players that are generally "good" and don't "fail" too often, this isn't something that is inherently bad
This game should be more like "Space Pirates Online". Most Eve players wont admit it, but being ganked/killed for no reason that 'cause you can' or some such thing is dumb. Now theyre suidicde ganking people in hisec just to harass them. The community on this game is really bad now.
It's a FFA PvP game. Isn't the idea to kill the other guy and make a profit? The community hasn't changed a bit. It's your corp vs the world.
"Take what you can, give nothing back".
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
You always have to adapt to the situation at hand. Technically, you COULD kill a carrier with nothing but stealth bombers...if you had over 100 of them and the carrier's friends didn't show up...
Best thing you could do for griefing griefers is to have as many friends as possible hiding in a nearby system that (hopefully) the griefers don't know about, and you can set up an ambush...but remember that most griefers are VERY good at what they do, and will undoubtedly be checking as many places as possible for your backup. The ship that you yourself would fly would depend on which of the various roles you would want to be in that fleet of yours. For example, if you wanted to be the bait to lure the griefers in, you would have to be in something that has a LOT of defences and ideally is not well known as a bait ship. Or you could be in the support fleet as tackle, logistics, ewar, DPS...lots of options for you.
Where's the any key?
This is plainly untrue, a swarm of about 20 bombers is more than sufficient to kill a single carrier in a timely manner, before his friends could react, as happened here:
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=10326472
We deployed a drag bubble way off the station and aligned it towards a POS that their ships were known to warp from to the station. We had a covert cyno cloaked off the bubble, as soon as our carrier friend here found himself hundreds of KMs away from the station we dropped with just over 20 bombers and recons. The carrier explodes 2 minutes later, just in time for his buddies to start getting warp ins, they trickle one at a time and die. Then a sizable group finally warps in as we are withdrawing from the bubble.
No, we need WoW with vampires. There are so many Eve clones that the market is flooded.
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville