Endgame for GW2? Not sure if there really is endgame per se. There's a lot of things to do though - achievements, getting that armor set you always wanted, maxing out crafting, and so on. Does it keep people playing? Well, if you look at GW1, that game has a max level gap of 20, which you reach way before you're done with the storyline of the campaign. There's no gear grind, and no raids (unless you count the 12 man areas in Factions). There is plenty of content though. And a lot of people have invested thousands of hours into it, including myself, even though the game doesn't have a clearly defined end game.
As long as there's enough choices presented on what you can do around the world, I know I'll find things to do for a good few thousand hours, being the completionist that I am.
I'd like to know if the game has interesting pve on the long term.
I haven't been on beta and can't be annoyed to read all the promotionnal stuff about the game, so forgive me for asking:
Is there a lot of 5, 10, 20man content? Is it challenging, does it require teamwork or is it mostly a zergfest?
Did anyone actually test the endgame during the beta?
I usually pvp a lot in traditionnal mmos so I assume I would enjoy GW2, but I know a lot of people who almost never pvp and they speak of GW2 like it's the 2nd coming. Unless the magic of hype turn them all into hardcore pvpers, are they gonna enjoy the game more than a few weeks?
Weren't you asking this question above?
So why did you follow it up by making this statement when you probably already knew the answer? (below)
Well I'm not buying all the hype for any game so yeah, I have no interest in watching hours of youtube video of people doing the starter zones. I've also checked the first pages in general discussion & review and couldn't find anything about endgame. [mod edit]
Thanks to Sebber I know there are 8 lairs which offer some variations. For some reason I can't find any review of these so I assume they're not the game strongpoint. Again I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just that a lot of mmo pvers who are waiting for GW2 like their life depends on it are in for a strong disappointment.
Someone explained to you that endgame starts at lvl 2. You either need to experience it or watch someone playing the game to understand and you will get what we're talking about. You didn't play the game enough or watch actual play to form your own opinion so how can you listen to other peoples takes on the game and form your own logical point of view. Makes no sense. Can't really form an opinion of a game on beta also. Sounds to me like you need to reserve judgement about 3 months after launch and then tell us mmo pvers whether or not we will be disappointed.
I do love RvR, but GW2 does not really have an open world pvp, which is the only bummer for me tbh. We will see how it plays out because into hardcore pvp, nothing more really. Perhaps they might add a open world pvp map after launch.
An open world pvp map would just be a WvWvW map without points to take in it... how is that even necessary?
WvWvW IS 4 open pvp maps that you can also focus on objectives in.
Open world map would be consistant, WvWvW would be for only 2 weeks. It would be fun to have something like guildvguild on the same server as you, no worrying about taking keeps.
That's what spvp is...
Structure pvp is awsome, but you can hardly get 1v1s on those map its just too small and very limited. Open world pvp gives me the option to fight more people and get those 1v1s in. As i said though im not stressing because this is a pvp game and they will prob add open world pvp i hope.
Open world pvp EXISTS, then you asked for gvg... Which I said is achievable in spvp (you can create custom games of various sized team matchups and whatnot) then you ask for 1v1?
I'm not quite sure we're on the same page as to what words mean.
Open world pvp to me = a map that you do stuff in naturally where you can HAPPEN upon pvp.
GvG: predetermined fights between teams made up guild members fighting teams from other guilds.
1v1's can be arranged in spvp custom matches, and can HAPPEN naturally in WvW if you roam.
It just doesn't seem like you're aware of what the game offers, because so far it has everything you're asking for.
Im kind of light headed atm, so ill get back to u whenever im thinking right
Well I'm not buying all the hype for any game so yeah, I have no interest in watching hours of youtube video of people doing the starter zones. I've also checked the first pages in general discussion & review and couldn't find anything about endgame. [mod edit]
Thanks to Sebber I know there are 8 lairs which offer some variations. For some reason I can't find any review of these so I assume they're not the game strongpoint. Again I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just that a lot of mmo pvers who are waiting for GW2 like their life depends on it are in for a strong disappointment.
So you don't know anything about the game, don't want to watch videos to learn about the game, don't try to get a BWE key, and yet have decided that players are going to be disapointed. When you make statements like this, are you actually looking for a discussion?
And seriously, why is it anyone else's responsibility to educate you about a game? You are a consumer, it is up to you to educate yourself and make an informed decision.
"Loading screens" are not "instances". Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
I think people seem to miss the point in these types of discussions, or too quickly dismiss the "traditional" endgame as a broken model. There is a reason why so many people play existing mmo's such as WoW and Rift so frequently and for so long after hitting max level, and for many that is tied directly to the reward system of the so called Gear Tread Mill. Some people on these forums say those three words like they're curse words, but very few will be able to offer up (to me at least) a convincing alternative to keep players interested in the game long term.
Personally I am looking forward to giving GW2 a good solid try. There's no doubt in my mind -- having played the beta weekends and both stress tests, that the game is solid and quite fun to play, while leveling at least. I think that the world seems well designed, and the combat is especially fun. I cannot and have not, however, seen anything to yet convince me that I will be held in the game for long once hitting max level (and perhaps doing so on an alt or two).
I'll bring up RIft as an example and point of comparison. Rift can be compared to WoW and other traditional mmos in many ways. It draws on WoW heavily, just as WoW borrowed generously from mmos and muds that came before it. Rift on the other hand, has a metric ton of dynamic content happening along side of the more standard raids and dungeons. There are Rifts, zone wide invasions, instant adventures, soloable versions of the raid instances, diverse crafting, seasonal events and more. It's a pretty broad game now that it's a year old. Yet despite all of that great and varied content, it's pretty easy to eat it all up and get tired of it within a handful of months, if you're not raiding and progressing through that sort of endgame content.
It's the carrot on a stick which makes all of the other systems -- the rifts, crafting, fishing, adventures, etc. -- seem worthwhile, because all of those gameplay systems give micro rewards which can be then used in the highly difficult raid environments to beat complex boss encounters.
Back over to GW2, it seems there's no doubt that the game is going to have almost as many (and likely more, eventually) dynamic things to do in the game world after hitting max level -- but without that top level reward system. Without the dreaded gear treadmill, will it be enough? I somehow doubt that it will, and I regret that, because I otherwise think that the game has been masterfully designed.
I AM looking at this from a PvE perspective mainly, as I think WvWvW will add "some" additional drive to people who pvp, but from the PvE point of view, I fear that endgame will be lacking.
There's a question that keeps coming up in my head everytime I see the word "Endgame"
If there's no real endgame in gw2, does that mean we'll play it forever never reaching the end? @__@ ;
That reminds me, actually, that it's a shame they put levels in at all. I think that would have been a much clearer message about the intent of their take on "endgame". It's my understand that this used to be the case (no levels) but they caved in at some point. Too bad.
There's a question that keeps coming up in my head everytime I see the word "Endgame"
If there's no real endgame in gw2, does that mean we'll play it forever never reaching the end? @__@ ;
No people are saying it because it's like a single player game, the game is good when it starts and good when it ends. So you can't say if there is a endgame, because you don't know when it snart.
There's a question that keeps coming up in my head everytime I see the word "Endgame"
If there's no real endgame in gw2, does that mean we'll play it forever never reaching the end? @__@ ;
It means the game is about the journey not the destination and it also means that it's not split into two games, one pre-endgame and one at the endgame.
Block the trolls, don't answer them, so we can remove the garbage from these forums
I think people seem to miss the point in these types of discussions, or too quickly dismiss the "traditional" endgame as a broken model. There is a reason why so many people play existing mmo's such as WoW and Rift so frequently and for so long after hitting max level, and for many that is tied directly to the reward system of the so called Gear Tread Mill. Some people on these forums say those three words like they're curse words, but very few will be able to offer up (to me at least) a convincing alternative to keep players interested in the game long term.
Curse words...probably not. However, 'end game' in MMO's is there for only 1 reason....to keep the devourers of content playing, and thus paying, until new content can come out for them to devour. This is the only way the developers of these games can keep costs of development under control. They have created content that isn't really content....it's just a place to do something while content is created. This is a reason that MMO's are generally considered broken by those that play them...at least those that have looked behind the curtains and realized how they are being manipulated by these companies for their $$$. If you understand this and find that playing this type of content is fun for you and not work, great! For many the realization that they are paying hard earned $$$ to work isn't fun for them anymore.
I think people seem to miss the point in these types of discussions, or too quickly dismiss the "traditional" endgame as a broken model. There is a reason why so many people play existing mmo's such as WoW and Rift so frequently and for so long after hitting max level, and for many that is tied directly to the reward system of the so called Gear Tread Mill. Some people on these forums say those three words like they're curse words, but very few will be able to offer up (to me at least) a convincing alternative to keep players interested in the game long term.
Personally I am looking forward to giving GW2 a good solid try. There's no doubt in my mind -- having played the beta weekends and both stress tests, that the game is solid and quite fun to play, while leveling at least. I think that the world seems well designed, and the combat is especially fun. I cannot and have not, however, seen anything to yet convince me that I will be held in the game for long once hitting max level (and perhaps doing so on an alt or two).
I'll bring up RIft as an example and point of comparison. Rift can be compared to WoW and other traditional mmos in many ways. It draws on WoW heavily, just as WoW borrowed generously from mmos and muds that came before it. Rift on the other hand, has a metric ton of dynamic content happening along side of the more standard raids and dungeons. There are Rifts, zone wide invasions, instant adventures, soloable versions of the raid instances, diverse crafting, seasonal events and more. It's a pretty broad game now that it's a year old. Yet despite all of that great and varied content, it's pretty easy to eat it all up and get tired of it within a handful of months, if you're not raiding and progressing through that sort of endgame content.
It's the carrot on a stick which makes all of the other systems -- the rifts, crafting, fishing, adventures, etc. -- seem worthwhile, because all of those gameplay systems give micro rewards which can be then used in the highly difficult raid environments to beat complex boss encounters.
Back over to GW2, it seems there's no doubt that the game is going to have almost as many (and likely more, eventually) dynamic things to do in the game world after hitting max level -- but without that top level reward system. Without the dreaded gear treadmill, will it be enough? I somehow doubt that it will, and I regret that, because I otherwise think that the game has been masterfully designed.
I AM looking at this from a PvE perspective mainly, as I think WvWvW will add "some" additional drive to people who pvp, but from the PvE point of view, I fear that endgame will be lacking.
There are more Gamers than MMORPG players.
Maybe trying to get some of the non MMORPG gamers is a better way of growing than fighting for the gamers that are already happy and invested in their games.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
It might be, that in the case of GW2, end game and longlevity are not equals..
Its all about the voyage in PvE, and the voyage just continous at max level.
And endgame PvP is directly accessible from level 1
Its exsactly the case of GW2 that endgame and longevity is not the same. And we can say that for sure because that was the case in gw1.
What we really need is a Endgame Anonymous group to refer all the addicts that keeps being puzzled about how a game can end, with out having the illusion of endless progressing orcestered by even more endless grind.
I'd like to know if the game has interesting pve on the long term.
I haven't been on beta and can't be annoyed to read all the promotionnal stuff about the game, so forgive me for asking:
Is there a lot of 5, 10, 20man content? Is it challenging, does it require teamwork or is it mostly a zergfest?
Did anyone actually test the endgame during the beta?
I usually pvp a lot in traditionnal mmos so I assume I would enjoy GW2, but I know a lot of people who almost never pvp and they speak of GW2 like it's the 2nd coming. Unless the magic of hype turn them all into hardcore pvpers, are they gonna enjoy the game more than a few weeks?
lol inever understand why people talk about endgame when a game is not even release yet ,and not forgetting all new content the game still have to come to do and more improvement
End game pvp may be accessible from Lvl 1but you will Get easily beaten by people who have leveled due to gear. So its like coming in a bg with greens against dudes in purple. It is no fun. Pve endgame we have yet to see for gw2. Does it exist?
I think people misunderstand their own questions. If the question is, are there Raids? Hell no. Thank god. Regardless of what else is in the game, Tank and spank and item grinding breeds the Raiding mentality. So no that' is not there.
PC Gamer has a preview of one of the level 50 dungeons and the first dungeon boasts a bunch of videos. It's not giving in to the hype machine to look at some videos and do some research. You want to know if there is teamwork, these will give u a good example and show the type of teamwork that exists in the game.
If you define teamwork as, this guy heals, this guy does dps and this guy stands in front of the enemy and hits, no, you won't find a lot of that. But, even in the dynamic events, I felt more teamwork than i have in some of the most difficult dungeons i've been in. Higher level dynamic events require strategy to defeat. In early events you can get away wit hdoing your own thing. But when i got in the 20s, there were some events where it was neccessary to pay attention and listen to the chat window of where to go and what to do. Where we needed to concentrate on trapping the creature or when we needed to concentrate on backing away and healing the fallen.
To sum it all up for you: There is NO endgame in guild wars 2.
While there will be level 80 themed dungeons and areas, there will NOT be an exclusive content feel to the game.
Its unlikely that they will be making an 'endgame'
the endgame of guild wars 2 is the adventure! You go through every part of the world enjoying all the quests and missions and world.
It is NOT going to hold your hand and go 'hey, this is a level 80 raids and this is the level 80 stuff and this is where you play'
I played in the tests, they are planning to make content across all level ranges, as the game levels you down you can simply go back to an area and enjoy the new additions freely, rather than a dull stale model of 'hey, lets make exclusive max level areas ,raids, dungeons and content and leave all the newbies dry!'
It might be, that in the case of GW2, end game and longlevity are not equals..
Its all about the voyage in PvE, and the voyage just continous at max level.
And endgame PvP is directly accessible from level 1
Its exsactly the case of GW2 that endgame and longevity is not the same. And we can say that for sure because that was the case in gw1.
What we really need is a Endgame Anonymous group to refer all the addicts that keeps being puzzled about how a game can end, with out having the illusion of endless progressing orcestered by even more endless grind.
/
This..
Plus the endgame of GW2 is just that, its when you are not having fun anymore and or feel you have accomplished all you can..
Believe it or not every game has an end and it usually comes soon after those infamous words we all know to well..YAWN, IM BORED..
No dev team on the face of the earth could give us content lusting gamers enough to keep us indefinitely happy and busy..
The open WvW PVP is certainly very entertaining for a long time, since it is vast and dynamic and complex. Generally I can't say, since I was only in open beta. We never know. But the 5 playable races have all vast different areas on the first 30 or so levels. So at least you gonna see a lot of replayability in playing different races.
I think in our days where every month a new MMO is launched we generally do not have the longevity anymore as we had in the days of UO and Everquest, and I doubt that will ever return. Alas. But since GW2 is free, it will definitely keep people playing much longer and return much more likely. So I think GW2's longevity will be better than that of any other MMO launched in the last few years. But that is just my guesstimation.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
The open WvW PVP is certainly very entertaining for a long time, since it is vast and dynamic and complex. Generally I can't say, since I was only in open beta. We never know. But the 5 playable races have all vast different areas on the first 30 or so levels. So at least you gonna see a lot of replayability in playing different races.
I think in our days where every month a new MMO is launched we generally do not have the longevity anymore as we had in the days of UO and Everquest, and I doubt that will ever return. Alas. But since GW2 is free, it will definitely keep people playing much longer and return much more likely. So I think GW2's longevity will be better than that of any other MMO launched in the last few years. But that is just my guesstimation.
I think it does come down to the word endgame.
Stop thinking about it, erease it from your brain with this game. Too many games talk about "endgame" and rush players to the end to discover "the real game".
AS Anet has said, why do you spend a a few weeks to play the real game. From round 1 you can get in and get challenging PVE content that changes. You get to your first dungeons at level 30. There are above ground dungeons as well. One of the most fun I discovered was at level 10 in the Charl land in a vampire crypt. I'd gone in there 5 times with 5 other players and we died each. A bit of cordination helped us finally push through. Team work is not a set role. It's a fluid motion. watching what others do, and doing what needs to be done. It brings tactics to MMOs. The fun part is, if you fail, you can't yell at the tank for not "tanking" or micromanaging the healer. Instead, i find myself having conversations after a failed DE. It's very fun to go at someting using a variety of tactics as opposed to treating every encounter like a role call. "Tank! check, Healer check! etc". Instead, conversations are more like, okay, do you want me to drop back and start ressing and when? What area are we trying to get this guy to stay around. Where are you going to drop your areas, we should try to maneuver into there.
every MMO has an endgame. however, there are games with a short levelling phase, or to be more precise, with a very flat vertical progression. these games usually also enable you to use all features at Lvl 1 theoretically. people call that "endgame starts at Lvl1". a MMORPG without endgame does not exist. because such games are called single-player-RPGs and are no MMOs.
GW2 is such a game with flat vertical progression. a pretty sanboxish approach and very unusual for a theme-park. we will see, how this works in a theme-park regarding longevity.
i am not sad, that they have no raids. on the other hand, it would be easy to implement multigroup dungeons in GW2. the difference would be, that according to ArenaNets philosophy you would just get cosmetic upgrades like in group-dungeons. i doubt, that a lot of hardcore raiders will get used to cosmetic progression at all. so GW2 could have raids, but introducing a stat-based item treadmill would be against their philosophy.
regarding open World PVP, i dont see that this is possible. You would need huge continents for GvG and you would need a reason to conquer land. usually this is human greed about ressources. but, in order to make this work, you need a player-driven economy. and this would impact the entire game design heavily. so no, dont expect open, persistent, terrirtorial PvP in GW2.
every MMO has an endgame. however, there are games with a short levelling phase, or to be more precise, with a very flat vertical progression. these games usually also enable you to use all features at Lvl 1 theoretically. people call that "endgame starts at Lvl1". a MMORPG without endgame does not exist. because such games are called single-player-RPGs and are no MMOs.
GW2 is such a game with flat vertical progression. a pretty sanboxish approach and very unusual for a theme-park. we will see, how this works in a theme-park regarding longevity.
i am not sad, that they have no raids. on the other hand, it would be easy to implement multigroup dungeons in GW2. the difference would be, that according to ArenaNets philosophy you would just get cosmetic upgrades like in group-dungeons. i doubt, that a lot of hardcore raiders will get used to cosmetic progression at all. so GW2 could have raids, but introducing a stat-based item treadmill would be against their philosophy.
regarding open World PVP, i dont see that this is possible. You would need huge continents for GvG and you would need a reason to conquer land. usually this is human greed about ressources. but, in order to make this work, you need a player-driven economy. and this would impact the entire game design heavily. so no, dont expect open, persistent, terrirtorial PvP in GW2.
I disagree, EVE comes as close to is as probably is possible, or you could argue that endgame really does start as soon as you leave the tutorial.
It seems to me that GW2 might not be the game for people who put a lot of value on continuous progression of their avatar, (ad infinitum) and is more designed to favor the explorer mind set.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I'd like to know if the game has interesting pve on the long term.
I haven't been on beta and can't be annoyed to read all the promotionnal stuff about the game, so forgive me for asking:
Is there a lot of 5, 10, 20man content? Is it challenging, does it require teamwork or is it mostly a zergfest?
Did anyone actually test the endgame during the beta?
I usually pvp a lot in traditionnal mmos so I assume I would enjoy GW2, but I know a lot of people who almost never pvp and they speak of GW2 like it's the 2nd coming. Unless the magic of hype turn them all into hardcore pvpers, are they gonna enjoy the game more than a few weeks?
Who cares? The game is 50 bucks. I've payed more than that for a few weeks of fun. Hell, some of us pay that for a 'night' of fun. Just use cost/benefit math.
Here's a simple example:
Min wage:California = $8.00 | Cost of game = ~$50.00
50/8 = 6.25 hours of work to pay for the game.
.......and you're asking questions about something that might take you 60+ hours to get to?
And some people wonder why people say forums lower your IQ. Let me play next though, cause this looks fun.
Other things people could spend $50.00 on.......and then complain about.
How will these shoes keep me interested for more than a couple of weeks?
What is the end game at Disney Land? I can't believe they have a cash shop even though I bought a ticket.
I bought this blue-ray TV series, finished the show....now what? The special features interface is really clunky. Cmon! This is 2012, how could they possibly let this get past beta? Where are the updates? Nerf fast-forward!
I have this 1/5th of Hendricks Gin...........no complaints here. (ok so this one doesn't work).
I think you all get the point. $50.00 = 6.25 hours.........think about it. Quit thinking the world owes you anything.
Comments
Endgame for GW2? Not sure if there really is endgame per se. There's a lot of things to do though - achievements, getting that armor set you always wanted, maxing out crafting, and so on. Does it keep people playing? Well, if you look at GW1, that game has a max level gap of 20, which you reach way before you're done with the storyline of the campaign. There's no gear grind, and no raids (unless you count the 12 man areas in Factions). There is plenty of content though. And a lot of people have invested thousands of hours into it, including myself, even though the game doesn't have a clearly defined end game.
As long as there's enough choices presented on what you can do around the world, I know I'll find things to do for a good few thousand hours, being the completionist that I am.
Weren't you asking this question above?
So why did you follow it up by making this statement when you probably already knew the answer? (below)
Well I'm not buying all the hype for any game so yeah, I have no interest in watching hours of youtube video of people doing the starter zones. I've also checked the first pages in general discussion & review and couldn't find anything about endgame. [mod edit]
Thanks to Sebber I know there are 8 lairs which offer some variations. For some reason I can't find any review of these so I assume they're not the game strongpoint. Again I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just that a lot of mmo pvers who are waiting for GW2 like their life depends on it are in for a strong disappointment.
Someone explained to you that endgame starts at lvl 2. You either need to experience it or watch someone playing the game to understand and you will get what we're talking about. You didn't play the game enough or watch actual play to form your own opinion so how can you listen to other peoples takes on the game and form your own logical point of view. Makes no sense. Can't really form an opinion of a game on beta also. Sounds to me like you need to reserve judgement about 3 months after launch and then tell us mmo pvers whether or not we will be disappointed.
Im kind of light headed atm, so ill get back to u whenever im thinking right
So you don't know anything about the game, don't want to watch videos to learn about the game, don't try to get a BWE key, and yet have decided that players are going to be disapointed. When you make statements like this, are you actually looking for a discussion?
And seriously, why is it anyone else's responsibility to educate you about a game? You are a consumer, it is up to you to educate yourself and make an informed decision.
"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.
I think people seem to miss the point in these types of discussions, or too quickly dismiss the "traditional" endgame as a broken model. There is a reason why so many people play existing mmo's such as WoW and Rift so frequently and for so long after hitting max level, and for many that is tied directly to the reward system of the so called Gear Tread Mill. Some people on these forums say those three words like they're curse words, but very few will be able to offer up (to me at least) a convincing alternative to keep players interested in the game long term.
Personally I am looking forward to giving GW2 a good solid try. There's no doubt in my mind -- having played the beta weekends and both stress tests, that the game is solid and quite fun to play, while leveling at least. I think that the world seems well designed, and the combat is especially fun. I cannot and have not, however, seen anything to yet convince me that I will be held in the game for long once hitting max level (and perhaps doing so on an alt or two).
I'll bring up RIft as an example and point of comparison. Rift can be compared to WoW and other traditional mmos in many ways. It draws on WoW heavily, just as WoW borrowed generously from mmos and muds that came before it. Rift on the other hand, has a metric ton of dynamic content happening along side of the more standard raids and dungeons. There are Rifts, zone wide invasions, instant adventures, soloable versions of the raid instances, diverse crafting, seasonal events and more. It's a pretty broad game now that it's a year old. Yet despite all of that great and varied content, it's pretty easy to eat it all up and get tired of it within a handful of months, if you're not raiding and progressing through that sort of endgame content.
It's the carrot on a stick which makes all of the other systems -- the rifts, crafting, fishing, adventures, etc. -- seem worthwhile, because all of those gameplay systems give micro rewards which can be then used in the highly difficult raid environments to beat complex boss encounters.
Back over to GW2, it seems there's no doubt that the game is going to have almost as many (and likely more, eventually) dynamic things to do in the game world after hitting max level -- but without that top level reward system. Without the dreaded gear treadmill, will it be enough? I somehow doubt that it will, and I regret that, because I otherwise think that the game has been masterfully designed.
I AM looking at this from a PvE perspective mainly, as I think WvWvW will add "some" additional drive to people who pvp, but from the PvE point of view, I fear that endgame will be lacking.
There's a question that keeps coming up in my head everytime I see the word "Endgame"
If there's no real endgame in gw2, does that mean we'll play it forever never reaching the end? @__@ ;
That reminds me, actually, that it's a shame they put levels in at all. I think that would have been a much clearer message about the intent of their take on "endgame". It's my understand that this used to be the case (no levels) but they caved in at some point. Too bad.
No people are saying it because it's like a single player game, the game is good when it starts and good when it ends. So you can't say if there is a endgame, because you don't know when it snart.
It means the game is about the journey not the destination and it also means that it's not split into two games, one pre-endgame and one at the endgame.
Block the trolls, don't answer them, so we can remove the garbage from these forums
Curse words...probably not. However, 'end game' in MMO's is there for only 1 reason....to keep the devourers of content playing, and thus paying, until new content can come out for them to devour. This is the only way the developers of these games can keep costs of development under control. They have created content that isn't really content....it's just a place to do something while content is created. This is a reason that MMO's are generally considered broken by those that play them...at least those that have looked behind the curtains and realized how they are being manipulated by these companies for their $$$. If you understand this and find that playing this type of content is fun for you and not work, great! For many the realization that they are paying hard earned $$$ to work isn't fun for them anymore.
There are more Gamers than MMORPG players.
Maybe trying to get some of the non MMORPG gamers is a better way of growing than fighting for the gamers that are already happy and invested in their games.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
It might be, that in the case of GW2, end game and longlevity are not equals..
Its all about the voyage in PvE, and the voyage just continous at max level.
And endgame PvP is directly accessible from level 1
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Its exsactly the case of GW2 that endgame and longevity is not the same. And we can say that for sure because that was the case in gw1.
What we really need is a Endgame Anonymous group to refer all the addicts that keeps being puzzled about how a game can end, with out having the illusion of endless progressing orcestered by even more endless grind.
lol inever understand why people talk about endgame when a game is not even release yet ,and not forgetting all new content the game still have to come to do and more improvement
Pve endgame we have yet to see for gw2. Does it exist?
Not dismissing the wow game play, but it's wow.
I think people misunderstand their own questions. If the question is, are there Raids? Hell no. Thank god. Regardless of what else is in the game, Tank and spank and item grinding breeds the Raiding mentality. So no that' is not there.
PC Gamer has a preview of one of the level 50 dungeons and the first dungeon boasts a bunch of videos. It's not giving in to the hype machine to look at some videos and do some research. You want to know if there is teamwork, these will give u a good example and show the type of teamwork that exists in the game.
If you define teamwork as, this guy heals, this guy does dps and this guy stands in front of the enemy and hits, no, you won't find a lot of that. But, even in the dynamic events, I felt more teamwork than i have in some of the most difficult dungeons i've been in. Higher level dynamic events require strategy to defeat. In early events you can get away wit hdoing your own thing. But when i got in the 20s, there were some events where it was neccessary to pay attention and listen to the chat window of where to go and what to do. Where we needed to concentrate on trapping the creature or when we needed to concentrate on backing away and healing the fallen.
Endgame starts at lvl 1 (or lvl 2 with pve) as it's still the same difficulty level and you can't outlevel content due to scaling.
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
you couldnt be bothered to read?
Lazy...
To sum it all up for you: There is NO endgame in guild wars 2.
While there will be level 80 themed dungeons and areas, there will NOT be an exclusive content feel to the game.
Its unlikely that they will be making an 'endgame'
the endgame of guild wars 2 is the adventure! You go through every part of the world enjoying all the quests and missions and world.
It is NOT going to hold your hand and go 'hey, this is a level 80 raids and this is the level 80 stuff and this is where you play'
I played in the tests, they are planning to make content across all level ranges, as the game levels you down you can simply go back to an area and enjoy the new additions freely, rather than a dull stale model of 'hey, lets make exclusive max level areas ,raids, dungeons and content and leave all the newbies dry!'
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This..
Plus the endgame of GW2 is just that, its when you are not having fun anymore and or feel you have accomplished all you can..
Believe it or not every game has an end and it usually comes soon after those infamous words we all know to well..YAWN, IM BORED..
No dev team on the face of the earth could give us content lusting gamers enough to keep us indefinitely happy and busy..
Playing GW2..
The open WvW PVP is certainly very entertaining for a long time, since it is vast and dynamic and complex. Generally I can't say, since I was only in open beta. We never know. But the 5 playable races have all vast different areas on the first 30 or so levels. So at least you gonna see a lot of replayability in playing different races.
I think in our days where every month a new MMO is launched we generally do not have the longevity anymore as we had in the days of UO and Everquest, and I doubt that will ever return. Alas. But since GW2 is free, it will definitely keep people playing much longer and return much more likely. So I think GW2's longevity will be better than that of any other MMO launched in the last few years. But that is just my guesstimation.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
I think it does come down to the word endgame.
Stop thinking about it, erease it from your brain with this game. Too many games talk about "endgame" and rush players to the end to discover "the real game".
AS Anet has said, why do you spend a a few weeks to play the real game. From round 1 you can get in and get challenging PVE content that changes. You get to your first dungeons at level 30. There are above ground dungeons as well. One of the most fun I discovered was at level 10 in the Charl land in a vampire crypt. I'd gone in there 5 times with 5 other players and we died each. A bit of cordination helped us finally push through. Team work is not a set role. It's a fluid motion. watching what others do, and doing what needs to be done. It brings tactics to MMOs. The fun part is, if you fail, you can't yell at the tank for not "tanking" or micromanaging the healer. Instead, i find myself having conversations after a failed DE. It's very fun to go at someting using a variety of tactics as opposed to treating every encounter like a role call. "Tank! check, Healer check! etc". Instead, conversations are more like, okay, do you want me to drop back and start ressing and when? What area are we trying to get this guy to stay around. Where are you going to drop your areas, we should try to maneuver into there.
every MMO has an endgame. however, there are games with a short levelling phase, or to be more precise, with a very flat vertical progression. these games usually also enable you to use all features at Lvl 1 theoretically. people call that "endgame starts at Lvl1". a MMORPG without endgame does not exist. because such games are called single-player-RPGs and are no MMOs.
GW2 is such a game with flat vertical progression. a pretty sanboxish approach and very unusual for a theme-park. we will see, how this works in a theme-park regarding longevity.
i am not sad, that they have no raids. on the other hand, it would be easy to implement multigroup dungeons in GW2. the difference would be, that according to ArenaNets philosophy you would just get cosmetic upgrades like in group-dungeons. i doubt, that a lot of hardcore raiders will get used to cosmetic progression at all. so GW2 could have raids, but introducing a stat-based item treadmill would be against their philosophy.
regarding open World PVP, i dont see that this is possible. You would need huge continents for GvG and you would need a reason to conquer land. usually this is human greed about ressources. but, in order to make this work, you need a player-driven economy. and this would impact the entire game design heavily. so no, dont expect open, persistent, terrirtorial PvP in GW2.
played: Everquest I (6 years), EVE (3 years)
months: EQII, Vanguard, Siedler Online, SWTOR, Guild Wars 2
weeks: WoW, Shaiya, Darkfall, Florensia, Entropia, Aion, Lotro, Fallen Earth, Uncharted Waters
days: DDO, RoM, FFXIV, STO, Atlantica, PotBS, Maestia, WAR, AoC, Gods&Heroes, Cultures, RIFT, Forsaken World, Allodds
At least in guild wars 2 everything is self explanitory and easy to learn etc. Not once did I ever see any 'noob;
question in the map chat!
I disagree, EVE comes as close to is as probably is possible, or you could argue that endgame really does start as soon as you leave the tutorial.
It seems to me that GW2 might not be the game for people who put a lot of value on continuous progression of their avatar, (ad infinitum) and is more designed to favor the explorer mind set.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Who cares? The game is 50 bucks. I've payed more than that for a few weeks of fun. Hell, some of us pay that for a 'night' of fun. Just use cost/benefit math.
Here's a simple example:
Min wage:California = $8.00 | Cost of game = ~$50.00
50/8 = 6.25 hours of work to pay for the game.
.......and you're asking questions about something that might take you 60+ hours to get to?
And some people wonder why people say forums lower your IQ. Let me play next though, cause this looks fun.
Other things people could spend $50.00 on.......and then complain about.
I think you all get the point. $50.00 = 6.25 hours.........think about it. Quit thinking the world owes you anything.