So what do people think, is it now acceptable to charge £50+ for a game and then adding a cash shop?
Ohh look its this thread again.
Yes its perfectly acceptable to charge you for the box and the cash sop items. Its called a business decision and its you who has to make the determination if its worthwhile to you. I dont intend on paying for much in the cash shop (except for bank and storage) so its perfect.
You also seem to think 5 character slots is not enough. TSW is a sub based, pay for the box with a cash shop that only has 3 character slots. Why doesnt your kind go hassle those other forums with your trash, sounds like a nightly episode of the mainstream media.
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
Since GW2 doesn't have a subscription fee, they need some type of microtransaction to generate revenue other than box sales. Look at some of the games out there with a box price, sub fee AND cash shop, greedy bastards.
And since you can always turn ingame gold into gems you are never at a disadvantage. You want that nice sunglasses? No problem, just sell your crafting materials and buy it. You want more account slots? No problem, just save up for a month and you got it.
Usually the business model of a MMO is either F2P with cash shop or subscription model with lower cost purchase. I haven't seen barely any mention on this on the forums, other than when the prices were first announced, so does that mean it is now acceptable to charge £50-120 for an MMO and then tap a cash shop on as well?
I could be more forgiving if the cash shop was just more bank slots like in GW1, but paying for character slots, when I have just purchased a £50 game is a bit greedy in my opinion. Add to that genuine advantages (regardless of how large or small and I know they can be very small advantages) people can get from purchasing consumable items, it seems ridiculous to me to even have these items, Arenanet already stand to make around £100million just for box sales alone (a conservative difference between the amount of prepurchases and beta accounts active)
I can already imagine people posting 'The cash shop is optional and the advantages aren't even that significant'. Regardless of how significant they are, people have the option to run 25% faster than me, even after me paying £50 for a game.
Its like paying £40 for FIFA and then they have a cash shop for all players in squad to run 25% faster, doesn't seem fair for me. I think the initial purchase should make it so everyone is on a level playing field. Don't get me wrong, I'm really looking forward to playing, but this is the only thing that disappoints me.
So what do people think, is it now acceptable to charge £50+ for a game and then adding a cash shop?
As much as i like GW2 i can see your point but i can also see the sence in BTP mmo having the cashshop set up like GW1- and GW2 have.Uncomfortably you are not going to get any one in these forums agreeing with you,it's the GW2 forums and most if not all wont have anything negative said about the game or even meet you half way.
Since there is no monthly sub for this game I fail to see the issue. To me the greater sin is having a cash shop on top of the monthly sub, which a lot of games already have. That crap needs to go.
Cash shop in GW2 is more like a Donation Box with fluff prizes. People are so stupid to understand this. And don't you start on exp buff etc. Experience is fluff in guild wars 2. Just like minipets. The point is not the exp you get from events. The point is to 'experience' the events.
Gem conversion doesnt give you advantage in WvWvW with the siege weapons because you can buy more than you can build in 20 level which you can reach in less than a day. Also high level events gives you more than enough gold/karma/etc.
People should just drop discussing this. It is stupid. If companies all had a cash shop like gw2 do (and the game design that makes those items fluff), it would be awesome.
Originally posted by gaeanprayer You really think just the box price is going to be enough to keep a AAA MMO going for years and years to come? The other option is P2P, and yes, I think cash shop + B2P is a completely acceptable and preferable option.
Absolutely it will. Keep in mind it only has to keep it going for approximately one year at which time the next expansion will be realeased with new box price to pay for the upcoming year. So the "years and years" argument is kind of moot.
That said, the cash shop is really pointless items and will never be anything but....There is strong history pointing to this with the cash shop in GW1.
Okay.. so a P2P MMORPG is perfectly normal (pay for the box as well as $15 per month). But B2P with a COMPLETELY OPTIONAL cash shop is somehow 'only now acceptable'? Amazing logic.
Usually the business model of a MMO is either F2P with cash shop or subscription model with lower cost purchase. I haven't seen barely any mention on this on the forums, other than when the prices were first announced, so does that mean it is now acceptable to charge £50-120 for an MMO and then tap a cash shop on as well?
I could be more forgiving if the cash shop was just more bank slots like in GW1, but paying for character slots, when I have just purchased a £50 game is a bit greedy in my opinion. Add to that genuine advantages (regardless of how large or small and I know they can be very small advantages) people can get from purchasing consumable items, it seems ridiculous to me to even have these items, Arenanet already stand to make around £100million just for box sales alone (a conservative difference between the amount of prepurchases and beta accounts active)
I can already imagine people posting 'The cash shop is optional and the advantages aren't even that significant'. Regardless of how significant they are, people have the option to run 25% faster than me, even after me paying £50 for a game.
Its like paying £40 for FIFA and then they have a cash shop for all players in squad to run 25% faster, doesn't seem fair for me. I think the initial purchase should make it so everyone is on a level playing field. Don't get me wrong, I'm really looking forward to playing, but this is the only thing that disappoints me.
So what do people think, is it now acceptable to charge £50+ for a game and then adding a cash shop?
Who's the Pub? NCSoft. What does it mean? Game's gonna suck. Why would you care? Because Archeage will be alot better. Enough said
If you were referring to NC Soft east, maybe. But we are referring to NCSoft West here....2 of the 3 men in charge being previously in charge of ANet and overseeing GW1 which was anything but "suck".
Regardless, a publisher is nothing more than a glorified investor.....All the design decisions are up to ANet, which means quality.
What I don't understand is why isn't the OP creating this same topic in other MMO forums? I mean if he has an issue with a B2P MMO having an optional cash shop, he should be up in arms over MMOs that have a box price, a cash shop and a subscription fee. Which is pretty much every single AAA MMO out there.
What I don't understand is why isn't the OP creating this same topic in other MMO forums? I mean if he has an issue with a B2P MMO having an optional cash shop, he should be up in arms over MMOs that have a box price, a cash shop and a subscription fee. Which is pretty much every single AAA MMO out there.
BECUZ P2P IS THE ONLY TRUE MMO PAYMENT MODEL, MUCH LIEK HOW THE TRADITIONAL RAIDING ENDGAME BASED MMO IS THE ONLY TRUE AND CORRECT MMO! EVERYTHING ELSE MUST BE PURGED AND THE DISBELIEVERS CONVERTED TO THE PURITY OF TRUE MMODOM!
I think it is great that GW2 has cash shops now what they expect you to buy from this cash shop I don't entirely agree with. 5 character slots to boot bullcrap oh you want more bag space pony up bitch bullcrap. Don't leach your customer base anet for christ sakes. If this is how you roll I would rather just pay a sub fee. Lets just nickle and dime our fanbase so they end up paying more than they would if they had a sub lol we win and our customers are none the wiser for its only $5 here $10 there (suckers).
For the record I enjoy playing GW2 and will most likely play the hell out of it but that doesn't change how I feel about adding additional charges to core game items.
Question: if I unlock additional bag space on one character is it just for that character or is it account wide? I'm guessing that its for that character, I don't recall how many bag unlocks there were but I'm thinking at least 6. Even if you didn't go with extra character slots and expanded your bags for your 5 slots worth of characters your looking at 30 or so expandable bag slots. I don't recall what the pricing was on those but its my guess its not going to be inexpensive.
1) Are you really going to focus on 5 characters all at once? Down the road it may be a problem (assuming they don't add character slots in expansions like GW1), but initially it won't be a problem. And over the course of the year or so it takes you to get to the point where you need more character slots, you could be spending gold on gems to save up for more character slots.
2) Bag space. Currently I believe there are a total of 5 bag slots. Your initial bag is 20 slots. At level 80, you should be able to get 22(I think that's the number) space bag slots available. Not to mention you have 30 bank slots, plus a whole separate tab for materials and collectables in your bank, which you can send your mats to from anywhere in the world. You can also post directly to the TP from anywhere in the world as well. You have plenty of space. People are freaking out because they see the option to purchase bag space in the CS, and they don't have much room currently. Of course you don't have much room currently, you're level 5. I have yet to see a game that allows you to purchase 20 slot bags right at level 5.
All I'm saying is there are other ways to make money then on core game features. Character and bag slots imo is just being greedy. Not saying that I won't have enough bag space or get my fill of characters by the time I would need them I just don't think that should be something I have to pay for when I have already bought the game. I'm fairly certain they will make plenty of money on vanity items alone.
Problem is that not even in P2P games you have unlimited characters. You generally have between 7-10 characters per server. And server architecture is different in GW2. Servers are basically merely for WvW, otherwise they pretty much don't exist. And while we say you should treat this as a single player game as well when considering purchases, you also have to remember that you are storing your character's data on THEIR servers. Meaning every item you collect, and everything about your character is stored in their database. While individually it may not make a difference, when you've got over a million players, it does add up. Which is why you pay about $10 for a new character after your initial 5. You are paying for the extra space being alloted to your account. Or when you buy gems with gold, other people are paying for for the addition to your account.
Finally, remember ArenaNet is a business. There is no such thing as greed, especially if players are willing to pay for it. And when you do the math, it's not that bad. If you purchase the game, that's about $60. Now lets say you want 3 more characters. That's $30. However, you don't need to purchase it all at once, so that purchase will be spread out over the coming months. Now let's say you save up enough gold and purchase enough gems for 1 character slot, that purchase goes down to $20. Now over the course of say 8 months, spending $20 is actually pretty good. When you purchase the game, you get 5 characters, about 5 bag spaces, and a whole world full of content. That's the deal of the purchase. Anything extra, and you're going to need to cough up some more money.
It may sound limiting on paper, but in practice it won't be. Most people have no need for 5 character slots. I'll probably purchase 3 more character slots to level every profession to 80.
Originally posted by Zylaxx
Originally posted by MorpheusMJW
So what do people think, is it now acceptable to charge £50+ for a game and then adding a cash shop?
What I don't understand is why isn't the OP creating this same topic in other MMO forums? I mean if he has an issue with a B2P MMO having an optional cash shop, he should be up in arms over MMOs that have a box price, a cash shop and a subscription fee. Which is pretty much every single AAA MMO out there.
I think the issue might be that all of those cash shops, as well as just about every F2P cash shop has been heavily scrutinzed on this site. There has been thread after thread written about the evils of the cash shop for every game that has one.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
What I don't understand is why isn't the OP creating this same topic in other MMO forums? I mean if he has an issue with a B2P MMO having an optional cash shop, he should be up in arms over MMOs that have a box price, a cash shop and a subscription fee. Which is pretty much every single AAA MMO out there.
I think the issue might be that all of those cash shops, as well as just about every F2P cash shop has been heavily scrutinzed on this site. There has been thread after thread written about the evils of the cash shop for every game that has one.
agree
but people continue to make a new thread about GW2s cash shop almost every week
Usually the business model of a MMO is either F2P with cash shop or subscription model with lower cost purchase. I haven't seen barely any mention on this on the forums, other than when the prices were first announced, so does that mean it is now acceptable to charge £50-120 for an MMO and then tap a cash shop on as well?
I could be more forgiving if the cash shop was just more bank slots like in GW1, but paying for character slots, when I have just purchased a £50 game is a bit greedy in my opinion. Add to that genuine advantages (regardless of how large or small and I know they can be very small advantages) people can get from purchasing consumable items, it seems ridiculous to me to even have these items, Arenanet already stand to make around £100million just for box sales alone (a conservative difference between the amount of prepurchases and beta accounts active)
I can already imagine people posting 'The cash shop is optional and the advantages aren't even that significant'. Regardless of how significant they are, people have the option to run 25% faster than me, even after me paying £50 for a game.
Its like paying £40 for FIFA and then they have a cash shop for all players in squad to run 25% faster, doesn't seem fair for me. I think the initial purchase should make it so everyone is on a level playing field. Don't get me wrong, I'm really looking forward to playing, but this is the only thing that disappoints me.
So what do people think, is it now acceptable to charge £50+ for a game and then adding a cash shop?
The game offers more, as an overall package, than any MMO since the release of WoW. There is no subscription fee. Nothing in the cash shop is required to enjoy the game, nor does anything give a player a power advantage. And, yet, you are going to complain about the model being greedy? Really?
How about the many subscription based games that are now adding cash shops, on top of subscriptions?
Yes, the gem store is "acceptable now" because most objective, mature gamers looking at the business model have understood it's a fantastic deal.
I can play GW2 for a year at a cost of $60.
I can play a new subscription based MMO for $60+($11*15)= $225
If I skip expansions for both games and just want to keep playing the base game, plus free content unpdates, for an additional year, GW2 costs me $0 for year two. Typical Subscription Game costs me another $165!
Two year cost, no paid expansions:
GW2: $60
Typical Sub MMO: $390
Some people will try to produce a "typical cash shop spending scenario" to show how you can spend just as much on GW2. Well, sure, in fact, I intend to find a way to spend $10-$15/month in the gem store to show my support for the game. However, I actually get additional value for those optional expenditures, while my $15 sub fee in another game get's me nothing that GW2 doesn't also offer in it's box price. That sub fee in other games is just an access fee, to a game I already own!
Besides, as pointed out, many sub based games have cash shops now and that trend will continue to expand. Just as with GW2, most of those items are completely optional. That you can spend another $100+ a year on optional purchases doesn't factor into the value of the basic pricing model.
Just to make it crystal clear, GW2 did not compromise on features, world space or depth/breadth of content as a result of the B2P business model. GW2 is not just a slightly glorified F2P game with an initial box price. GW2 offers more, at launch, than any AAA MMO since WoW. It would be one of the best values in the MMO space even if it had a subscription fee. That there is no fee and that the cash shop is completely optional makes it the best MMO gaming value in the history of the genre.
So, you'll have to forgive any of us who look at your post with a bit of justifiable incredulity.
What I don't understand is why isn't the OP creating this same topic in other MMO forums? I mean if he has an issue with a B2P MMO having an optional cash shop, he should be up in arms over MMOs that have a box price, a cash shop and a subscription fee. Which is pretty much every single AAA MMO out there.
I think the issue might be that all of those cash shops, as well as just about every F2P cash shop has been heavily scrutinzed on this site. There has been thread after thread written about the evils of the cash shop for every game that has one.
agree
but people continue to make a new thread about GW2s cash shop almost every week
True but I don't think it's a selective thing, they'll do it to the next one as well as well as the one to follow.:)
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
What I don't understand is why isn't the OP creating this same topic in other MMO forums? I mean if he has an issue with a B2P MMO having an optional cash shop, he should be up in arms over MMOs that have a box price, a cash shop and a subscription fee. Which is pretty much every single AAA MMO out there.
I think the issue might be that all of those cash shops, as well as just about every F2P cash shop has been heavily scrutinzed on this site. There has been thread after thread written about the evils of the cash shop for every game that has one.
agree
but people continue to make a new thread about GW2s cash shop almost every week
True but I don't think it's a selective thing, they'll do it to the next one as well as well as the one to follow.:)
Ya ok, so maybe not everyone visit the GW2 forum every week. Maybe there are new people joining and expressing their opinion.
Let me start by saying that I'm against cash shops in any game that you purchase outright to play, not just the GW2 shop, so please don't take the body of this post to mean that I'm attacking GW2.
I feel like many people only defend this particular cash shop because they love the game so much. To them, I say it's okay to love the game and dislike the idea of a cash shop. For those pro cash shop people, here are my responses to the major arguments for it:
You don't have to use it.
Yes, I know I don't have to use it. That doesn't make it's existence any less intrusive on my gameplay experience. I don't like having to pay convenience fees in any form, and that's exactly what they're doing with reduced bag/bank space and limiting character slots. They have designed the game from the ground up with a cash shop in mind, and the only way to have a successful cash shop without being pay to win is to make the game just inconvenient enough to keep people playing, but to strongly encourage small sales to decrease the inconvenience.
Other games are B2P with sub and cash shop.
So those other games are run more greedily, and that makes this particular cash shop somehow okay by comparison? Many of you HATE the Box Price/Sub/CS combo, and yet won't bat an eye to use it to defend the cash shop in this game. It's a bit hypocritical.
It's a business, they have to make money.
I agree with this argument actually, but there's a difference between trying to make an honest buck for your labors, and trying to turn your customers into a cash faucet, which is what many MMOs are trying to do nowadays, and the cash shop is definitely a tool that facilitates this.
Many of us are under the mistaken assumption that if we contribute to the cash shop, then somehow that translates into more, better game content in the future. In truth, a large portion of those contributions are going to go toward more, better cash shop content.
TL;DR: For me, cash shop and B2P is not acceptable in any game, not just GW2.
It's not so bad really. There are plenty of single player games that have cash shop like DLC such as Dead Space as an example. You can pay cash for overpowered weapons and breeze through the game. Granted it's not multiplayer but I find that to be more strange since it is singleplayer.
Paying $60 for the box and $180 a year for the privledge of using the software you bought is any better?
Ok...
And, btw, where is it written that subscription is inherently better? Some subs are a total rip-off (SWTOR) others a decent value (WoW). Some cash shops are horrible (Perfect World) others are ok (Turbine).
Originally posted by VirgoThree It's not so bad really. There are plenty of single player games that have cash shop like DLC such as Dead Space as an example. You can pay cash for overpowered weapons and breeze through the game. Granted it's not multiplayer but I find that to be more strange since it is singleplayer.
OMG. Dragon Age Origins had a cash shop in the game. As a vendor. I'm like 'cool, there's a vendor at my camp.' Followed by "OMG, WTFBBQ!!!" That was the last (except the SWTOR mistake) full-retail BioWare game ever. I have plenty of good games, waiting a year to buy the game on a super deep discount (if at all) suits me fine.
I think it is great that GW2 has cash shops now what they expect you to buy from this cash shop I don't entirely agree with. 5 character slots to boot bullcrap oh you want more bag space pony up bitch bullcrap. Don't leach your customer base anet for christ sakes. If this is how you roll I would rather just pay a sub fee. Lets just nickle and dime our fanbase so they end up paying more than they would if they had a sub lol we win and our customers are none the wiser for its only $5 here $10 there (suckers).
For the record I enjoy playing GW2 and will most likely play the hell out of it but that doesn't change how I feel about adding additional charges to core game items.
Question: if I unlock additional bag space on one character is it just for that character or is it account wide? I'm guessing that its for that character, I don't recall how many bag unlocks there were but I'm thinking at least 6. Even if you didn't go with extra character slots and expanded your bags for your 5 slots worth of characters your looking at 30 or so expandable bag slots. I don't recall what the pricing was on those but its my guess its not going to be inexpensive.
1) Are you really going to focus on 5 characters all at once? Down the road it may be a problem (assuming they don't add character slots in expansions like GW1), but initially it won't be a problem. And over the course of the year or so it takes you to get to the point where you need more character slots, you could be spending gold on gems to save up for more character slots.
2) Bag space. Currently I believe there are a total of 5 bag slots. Your initial bag is 20 slots. At level 80, you should be able to get 22(I think that's the number) space bag slots available. Not to mention you have 30 bank slots, plus a whole separate tab for materials and collectables in your bank, which you can send your mats to from anywhere in the world. You can also post directly to the TP from anywhere in the world as well. You have plenty of space. People are freaking out because they see the option to purchase bag space in the CS, and they don't have much room currently. Of course you don't have much room currently, you're level 5. I have yet to see a game that allows you to purchase 20 slot bags right at level 5.
All I'm saying is there are other ways to make money then on core game features. Character and bag slots imo is just being greedy. Not saying that I won't have enough bag space or get my fill of characters by the time I would need them I just don't think that should be something I have to pay for when I have already bought the game. I'm fairly certain they will make plenty of money on vanity items alone.
Problem is that not even in P2P games you have unlimited characters. You generally have between 7-10 characters per server. And server architecture is different in GW2. Servers are basically merely for WvW, otherwise they pretty much don't exist. And while we say you should treat this as a single player game as well when considering purchases, you also have to remember that you are storing your character's data on THEIR servers. Meaning every item you collect, and everything about your character is stored in their database. While individually it may not make a difference, when you've got over a million players, it does add up. Which is why you pay about $10 for a new character after your initial 5. You are paying for the extra space being alloted to your account. Or when you buy gems with gold, other people are paying for for the addition to your account.
Finally, remember ArenaNet is a business. There is no such thing as greed, especially if players are willing to pay for it. And when you do the math, it's not that bad. If you purchase the game, that's about $60. Now lets say you want 3 more characters. That's $30. However, you don't need to purchase it all at once, so that purchase will be spread out over the coming months. Now let's say you save up enough gold and purchase enough gems for 1 character slot, that purchase goes down to $20. Now over the course of say 8 months, spending $20 is actually pretty good. When you purchase the game, you get 5 characters, about 5 bag spaces, and a whole world full of content. That's the deal of the purchase. Anything extra, and you're going to need to cough up some more money.
It may sound limiting on paper, but in practice it won't be. Most people have no need for 5 character slots. I'll probably purchase 3 more character slots to level every profession to 80.
Originally posted by Zylaxx
Originally posted by MorpheusMJW
So what do people think, is it now acceptable to charge £50+ for a game and then adding a cash shop?
Ohh look its this thread again.
I was waiting for someone to post this.
Hey lets make a new thread of things already covered in full detail in other forums but I'm far too lazy to read it all so instead I like to make a new 10+ page thread of whine in. or... maybe its because all the problems that he covered was already disputed and he thinks that now his ideas are fresh and noone disputed it 10 pages ago. hmm... I really wonder... >.> <.<
So what do people think, is it now acceptable to charge £50+ for a game and then adding a cash shop?
Personally, I'd much rather pay a sub and have a purely cosmetic CS or no CS at all - however, most people seem to be perfectly happy with GW2's cash shop (as can be seen by the responses in this thread), so I guess it is indeed more or less acceptable.
Um... nobody said WoW is crap. People are pointing out that WoW is a P2P game that has a cash shop as well. Also the mounts do provide an advantage comparable to any advantage GW2 CS provides. Mounts you buy in WoW are instantly unlocked for every character in the game, so you never have to worry about spending gold on mounts. You only need to worry about purchasing the training.
My question for those complaining about character slots, how many characters do you really have? How many characters do you actually focus on. Other than a few select people, most people only focus on a couple characters. I'm not talking about creating 5 alts and having them all sit at level 12. I'm talking about legitimately creating alts that you will spend time on and level.
Raises hand... Yeah, that'd be me. I have 8 characters in GW1 (I have all the campaigns plus EoN). I have 9 characters in LOTRO. I have 6characters in DDO. And at least 25%, usually more, are at cap in any of those games. In LOTRO, before I quit, the lowest level I had was 30 and that was a race-re-roll on my burg. I have 3 at cap, 3 in their 70's as they were moving from the old 65 cap to the new cap and 3 moving up to start Moria (level 50).
Comments
Ohh look its this thread again.
Yes its perfectly acceptable to charge you for the box and the cash sop items. Its called a business decision and its you who has to make the determination if its worthwhile to you. I dont intend on paying for much in the cash shop (except for bank and storage) so its perfect.
You also seem to think 5 character slots is not enough. TSW is a sub based, pay for the box with a cash shop that only has 3 character slots. Why doesnt your kind go hassle those other forums with your trash, sounds like a nightly episode of the mainstream media.
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
Since GW2 doesn't have a subscription fee, they need some type of microtransaction to generate revenue other than box sales. Look at some of the games out there with a box price, sub fee AND cash shop, greedy bastards.
And since you can always turn ingame gold into gems you are never at a disadvantage. You want that nice sunglasses? No problem, just sell your crafting materials and buy it. You want more account slots? No problem, just save up for a month and you got it.
As much as i like GW2 i can see your point but i can also see the sence in BTP mmo having the cashshop set up like GW1- and GW2 have.Uncomfortably you are not going to get any one in these forums agreeing with you,it's the GW2 forums and most if not all wont have anything negative said about the game or even meet you half way.
Im glad I wasn't eating.. I would have had to clean my monitor =P
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Cash shop in GW2 is more like a Donation Box with fluff prizes. People are so stupid to understand this. And don't you start on exp buff etc. Experience is fluff in guild wars 2. Just like minipets. The point is not the exp you get from events. The point is to 'experience' the events.
Gem conversion doesnt give you advantage in WvWvW with the siege weapons because you can buy more than you can build in 20 level which you can reach in less than a day. Also high level events gives you more than enough gold/karma/etc.
People should just drop discussing this. It is stupid. If companies all had a cash shop like gw2 do (and the game design that makes those items fluff), it would be awesome.
Absolutely it will. Keep in mind it only has to keep it going for approximately one year at which time the next expansion will be realeased with new box price to pay for the upcoming year. So the "years and years" argument is kind of moot.
That said, the cash shop is really pointless items and will never be anything but....There is strong history pointing to this with the cash shop in GW1.
If you were referring to NC Soft east, maybe. But we are referring to NCSoft West here....2 of the 3 men in charge being previously in charge of ANet and overseeing GW1 which was anything but "suck".
Regardless, a publisher is nothing more than a glorified investor.....All the design decisions are up to ANet, which means quality.
What I don't understand is why isn't the OP creating this same topic in other MMO forums? I mean if he has an issue with a B2P MMO having an optional cash shop, he should be up in arms over MMOs that have a box price, a cash shop and a subscription fee. Which is pretty much every single AAA MMO out there.
BECUZ P2P IS THE ONLY TRUE MMO PAYMENT MODEL, MUCH LIEK HOW THE TRADITIONAL RAIDING ENDGAME BASED MMO IS THE ONLY TRUE AND CORRECT MMO! EVERYTHING ELSE MUST BE PURGED AND THE DISBELIEVERS CONVERTED TO THE PURITY OF TRUE MMODOM!
Problem is that not even in P2P games you have unlimited characters. You generally have between 7-10 characters per server. And server architecture is different in GW2. Servers are basically merely for WvW, otherwise they pretty much don't exist. And while we say you should treat this as a single player game as well when considering purchases, you also have to remember that you are storing your character's data on THEIR servers. Meaning every item you collect, and everything about your character is stored in their database. While individually it may not make a difference, when you've got over a million players, it does add up. Which is why you pay about $10 for a new character after your initial 5. You are paying for the extra space being alloted to your account. Or when you buy gems with gold, other people are paying for for the addition to your account.
Finally, remember ArenaNet is a business. There is no such thing as greed, especially if players are willing to pay for it. And when you do the math, it's not that bad. If you purchase the game, that's about $60. Now lets say you want 3 more characters. That's $30. However, you don't need to purchase it all at once, so that purchase will be spread out over the coming months. Now let's say you save up enough gold and purchase enough gems for 1 character slot, that purchase goes down to $20. Now over the course of say 8 months, spending $20 is actually pretty good. When you purchase the game, you get 5 characters, about 5 bag spaces, and a whole world full of content. That's the deal of the purchase. Anything extra, and you're going to need to cough up some more money.
It may sound limiting on paper, but in practice it won't be. Most people have no need for 5 character slots. I'll probably purchase 3 more character slots to level every profession to 80.
I was waiting for someone to post this.
I think the issue might be that all of those cash shops, as well as just about every F2P cash shop has been heavily scrutinzed on this site. There has been thread after thread written about the evils of the cash shop for every game that has one.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
agree
but people continue to make a new thread about GW2s cash shop almost every week
EQ2 fan sites
No one like paying taxes. But we dont' have a choice.
I dont' like cash shop in any games, but there's no stopping the game studio from adding them. They want to make money.
The game offers more, as an overall package, than any MMO since the release of WoW. There is no subscription fee. Nothing in the cash shop is required to enjoy the game, nor does anything give a player a power advantage. And, yet, you are going to complain about the model being greedy? Really?
How about the many subscription based games that are now adding cash shops, on top of subscriptions?
Yes, the gem store is "acceptable now" because most objective, mature gamers looking at the business model have understood it's a fantastic deal.
I can play GW2 for a year at a cost of $60.
I can play a new subscription based MMO for $60+($11*15)= $225
If I skip expansions for both games and just want to keep playing the base game, plus free content unpdates, for an additional year, GW2 costs me $0 for year two. Typical Subscription Game costs me another $165!
Two year cost, no paid expansions:
GW2: $60
Typical Sub MMO: $390
Some people will try to produce a "typical cash shop spending scenario" to show how you can spend just as much on GW2. Well, sure, in fact, I intend to find a way to spend $10-$15/month in the gem store to show my support for the game. However, I actually get additional value for those optional expenditures, while my $15 sub fee in another game get's me nothing that GW2 doesn't also offer in it's box price. That sub fee in other games is just an access fee, to a game I already own!
Besides, as pointed out, many sub based games have cash shops now and that trend will continue to expand. Just as with GW2, most of those items are completely optional. That you can spend another $100+ a year on optional purchases doesn't factor into the value of the basic pricing model.
Just to make it crystal clear, GW2 did not compromise on features, world space or depth/breadth of content as a result of the B2P business model. GW2 is not just a slightly glorified F2P game with an initial box price. GW2 offers more, at launch, than any AAA MMO since WoW. It would be one of the best values in the MMO space even if it had a subscription fee. That there is no fee and that the cash shop is completely optional makes it the best MMO gaming value in the history of the genre.
So, you'll have to forgive any of us who look at your post with a bit of justifiable incredulity.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
True but I don't think it's a selective thing, they'll do it to the next one as well as well as the one to follow.:)
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Ya ok, so maybe not everyone visit the GW2 forum every week. Maybe there are new people joining and expressing their opinion.
Let me start by saying that I'm against cash shops in any game that you purchase outright to play, not just the GW2 shop, so please don't take the body of this post to mean that I'm attacking GW2.
I feel like many people only defend this particular cash shop because they love the game so much. To them, I say it's okay to love the game and dislike the idea of a cash shop. For those pro cash shop people, here are my responses to the major arguments for it:
Paying $60 for the box and $180 a year for the privledge of using the software you bought is any better?
Ok...
And, btw, where is it written that subscription is inherently better? Some subs are a total rip-off (SWTOR) others a decent value (WoW). Some cash shops are horrible (Perfect World) others are ok (Turbine).
OMG. Dragon Age Origins had a cash shop in the game. As a vendor. I'm like 'cool, there's a vendor at my camp.' Followed by "OMG, WTFBBQ!!!" That was the last (except the SWTOR mistake) full-retail BioWare game ever. I have plenty of good games, waiting a year to buy the game on a super deep discount (if at all) suits me fine.
Hey lets make a new thread of things already covered in full detail in other forums but I'm far too lazy to read it all so instead I like to make a new 10+ page thread of whine in. or... maybe its because all the problems that he covered was already disputed and he thinks that now his ideas are fresh and noone disputed it 10 pages ago. hmm... I really wonder... >.> <.<
Personally, I'd much rather pay a sub and have a purely cosmetic CS or no CS at all - however, most people seem to be perfectly happy with GW2's cash shop (as can be seen by the responses in this thread), so I guess it is indeed more or less acceptable.
Raises hand... Yeah, that'd be me. I have 8 characters in GW1 (I have all the campaigns plus EoN). I have 9 characters in LOTRO. I have 6characters in DDO. And at least 25%, usually more, are at cap in any of those games. In LOTRO, before I quit, the lowest level I had was 30 and that was a race-re-roll on my burg. I have 3 at cap, 3 in their 70's as they were moving from the old 65 cap to the new cap and 3 moving up to start Moria (level 50).