know the old saying "fool me once..." they played at creating a sequel not once but twice! I'll believe it when I see it finished, published, reviewed (by real independent reviewers!), till then they can go to the bad place and rot.
Originally posted by Chiram Would you guys rather have SOE take over? blizztard?. No matter which way you swing it, at least mythic TRIED to bring back some old shool after EA buthcered it with expansions and uber leet gear. I remember a post a while back where a mythic dev was trying hard to get some official pre-t2a or progression servers in, obviously the EA execs turned that down.
Just like the former Mythic RvR head is trying to get instances removed from Elderscrolls Online. Instead the execs forced him to compromise and have phasing instancing AND public dungeons, which do NOT work together.
The point is, the execs have too much control, so no one should bother.
And yes, I'd rather have SoE do it. Vanguard and Planetside proves they at least remember what good MMOs were about.
Blizzard... hell no.
I would agree with the SOE bit as long as Brad and Richard got to work together on it .
I guess the assumption by many people is that the folks at Mythic didn't learn anything from WAR. A strange assumption, but I guess it is a common thought.
My assumption is that Mythic wants to make money. Going further with my assumption, I believe that they will take a look at what made UO so iconic, what made WAR less so. I assume that they will also look at other games to see the good and the bad.
Because of this, I believe that they will adapt and build on the successes and failures of the past.
Mythic didn't seem to learn anything about what made DAoC successful when they created WAR and ruined DAoC with TOA (I might even argue SI was the begining of the end with spell crafting). While EA has a knack for ruining MMO's, they are not responsible for bad decisions Mythic made to DAoC. Even if we gave a pass to Mythic for all of that, it doesn't matter anyway because Mythic as we knew it doesn't exist anymore.
There is no market for a game like the original game
There's no market for WoW clones either, but that didn't stop every MMO company from making one or two for the last 7 years. There's probably a much MUCH better chance of making a profit from UO2 than there ever was with SWTOR. Its uncontested.
Actually, in the strictest sense of the word there was a HUGE market for WOW clones, at least from a market reserach pov. Expecially before it was clear if WoW was the odd duckling or the new norm. Ofc today we know that it was the odd duckling. But think of this, if nobody manages to pinch a healthy amount of players from a stack of about lets say 3-4 million (the WoW stock of US and EU) How is anyone going to pinch a healthy stock from a pool of players that is 1/10 at best and if we limit our sefl to the source material (WoW vs UO) not even a fraction.
From a investor PoV there is no market for a game based on UO1. And if they did not even managed to get enough people to go for the previous UO2... Why should it be any different now?
Ofc if someone were to make a more userfriendly and slightyl more structured version i can see how it could get some attention. But that would.. as mentioned make the fanatic sandbox crowd a bit... unhinged.
There is no market for a game like the original game
There's no market for WoW clones either, but that didn't stop every MMO company from making one or two for the last 7 years. There's probably a much MUCH better chance of making a profit from UO2 than there ever was with SWTOR. Its uncontested.
Actually, in the strictest sense of the word there was a HUGE market for WOW clones, at least from a market reserach pov. Expecially before it was clear if WoW was the odd duckling or the new norm. Ofc today we know that it was the odd duckling. But think of this, if nobody manages to pinch a healthy amount of players from a stack of about lets say 3-4 million (the WoW stock of US and EU) How is anyone going to pinch a healthy stock from a pool of players that is 1/10 at best and if we limit our sefl to the source material (WoW vs UO) not even a fraction.
Because the WoW market is entirely different from the rest of the market. We know the market exists for hardcore sandbox games. We know that number is AT LEAST a million strong (bigger than the majority of modern day MMO subscription rates). We also know that that genre is almost completely untapped. UNLIKE WOW'S MARKET which is already tapped by WoW, and the 7 WoW clones from AAA companies, and the 20 WoW clones from little companies peeling off the scraps.
We KNOW WoW is an outlier, we KNOW sandbox MMOs aren't.
There was barely any hope in my eyes after reading this. The first thought to my mind wasn't excitement. It was "will it be pre-trammel based?". Or will it be your generic MMO with the same rinse and repeat gameplay?
Since I don't believe that EA would want to finance a pure P2P or pure B2P (without Cash Shop not like in GW2 where there is cash shop) since for me biggest strenght of UO was that it was virtual world where someone being crafter making house furnitre and cosmetic things could have viable gameplay as well as warrior.
Then I don't support it.
Because I think EA / Mythic would do some kind of casualized, simplified experience with cash shop or / and rmah or / and gold selling.
Since I am not interested in that - I don't support it. Simple.
All the talent that was a part of Mythic has been gutted by EA.
There are now more Bioware employees in Mythic than former Mythic guys.
Between EA and Bioware... I don't want to them to even think about touching Ultima Online 2, especially not after seeing the horrible Ultima 4 remake they're doing.
Bioware has been working to further destroy DAoC for the last 2 years or so.
EA has not once been involved in a good MMO. Every MMO they touch dies. Do NOT let this happen. They already cancelled DAoC 2 and Imperator.
DAoC is a themepark, UO is a sandbox, that's the number one reason Mythic would never be able to develop a good UO game.
Second, it's not the same Mythic, they are Bioware 2 now.
Third, noone but Garriot should attempt an UO 2.
And im not even sure i would want UO 2 developed by Garriot....
I'd hardly call DAoC a themepark. Hell, the term "themepark" rarely applies to any game that isn't a WoW clone. Just because DAoC wasn't as sandboxy as UO doesn't mean it was a "themepark". Themepark implies being led by the nose and developer imparted safety. These things were not in DAoC.
DAoC is a themepark MMO, just like EQ & Lineage 2.
Just because they weren't a wow clone with streamlined linear questing doesn't mean they aren't themeparks.
By your definition, GW2 is a sandbox.....
Btw im not calling DAoC casual, shallow and linear, that's what todays themeparks are, old themeparks had more freedom and depth, but they where still themeparks.
Themeparks, by their very definitions, are about casual users, casual gameplay, simple mechanics, and keeping the users safe by never letting them off the rails.
Um.... no.
Wait, did you just said that EQ wasn't a themepark?
There are casual and hardcore themeparks, just like there are casual and hardcore sandboxes, being casual doesn't have anything to do with being a themepark.
Themeparks are safe.
EQ was NOT a safe game.
Themepark is a NEW term that refers to NEW games.
EQ is an OLD game.
Please, just try to understand for even a second.
You actually should probably try to understand for a minute. Much longer then that second. Themparks term had nothing to do about safe or unsafe. It had to do about how the game was organized. Start in zone A follow quest line to B then C etc. Yes EQ was an early themepark. Nowhere near as oversimplified as they make them now but still it was a themepark. And yes EQ was safe when you compare it to games like UO and SB
There is no market for a game like the original game
There's no market for WoW clones either, but that didn't stop every MMO company from making one or two for the last 7 years. There's probably a much MUCH better chance of making a profit from UO2 than there ever was with SWTOR. Its uncontested.
There obvious IS a market for WOW like games. LOTRO is doing fine. DDO is doing fine. Rift is still running.
Sure TOR may crash and burn, but that is not the only "wow clone". Many are still running, and doing decent business.
Since I don't believe that EA would want to finance a pure P2P or pure B2P (without Cash Shop not like in GW2 where there is cash shop) since for me biggest strenght of UO was that it was virtual world where someone being crafter making house furnitre and cosmetic things could have viable gameplay as well as warrior.
Then I don't support it.
Because I think EA / Mythic would do some kind of casualized, simplified experience with cash shop or / and rmah or / and gold selling.
Since I am not interested in that - I don't support it. Simple.
Well, i am interested to see how it turns out. Particulary it probably fix many UO's problem, and more focus on combat gameplay instead of mining and what-not.
If so, i am interested, and i will suport it. Simple.
There is no market for a game like the original game
There's no market for WoW clones either, but that didn't stop every MMO company from making one or two for the last 7 years. There's probably a much MUCH better chance of making a profit from UO2 than there ever was with SWTOR. Its uncontested.
There obvious IS a market for WOW like games. LOTRO is doing fine. DDO is doing fine. Rift is still running.
Sure TOR may crash and burn, but that is not the only "wow clone". Many are still running, and doing decent business.
LotRO didn't get nearly as many subs as they thought they would. It is the biggest IP in the world and they still had to go FTP.
DDO was a money sink for YEARS and didn't start making money until it went FTP 4 years after launch.
Rift already had to merge servers months ago.
These games limp along with fewer subs than old MMOs had back in dial up days.
Since I don't believe that EA would want to finance a pure P2P or pure B2P (without Cash Shop not like in GW2 where there is cash shop) since for me biggest strenght of UO was that it was virtual world where someone being crafter making house furnitre and cosmetic things could have viable gameplay as well as warrior.
Then I don't support it.
Because I think EA / Mythic would do some kind of casualized, simplified experience with cash shop or / and rmah or / and gold selling.
Since I am not interested in that - I don't support it. Simple.
Well, i am interested to see how it turns out. Particulary it probably fix many UO's problem, and more focus on combat gameplay instead of mining and what-not.
If so, i am interested, and i will suport it. Simple.
You can support whatever you want, it's clear that this game will never see the light of day, EA doesn't have any confidence in the Ultima IP, they canned the last 2 sequels.
UO was a unique game, making it more like everything else, making it more generic and boring so that the average joe who works at Mc Donalds can play it would be a terrible idea.
Fist, because the average joe who works at Mc Donalds and plays casual mmos never heard about the Ultima IP.
Second, because the people who actually want to play an Ultima game would never be interested in a 2 month clear-the-content-and-quit MMO
"Dogs are the leaders of the planet. If you see two life forms, one of them's making a poop, the other one's carrying it for him, who would you assume is in charge."
"The idea behind the tuxedo is the woman's point of view that men are all the same; so we might as well dress them that way. That's why a wedding is like the joining together of a beautiful, glowing bride and some guy" -Seinfeld
Since I don't believe that EA would want to finance a pure P2P or pure B2P (without Cash Shop not like in GW2 where there is cash shop) since for me biggest strenght of UO was that it was virtual world where someone being crafter making house furnitre and cosmetic things could have viable gameplay as well as warrior.
Then I don't support it.
Because I think EA / Mythic would do some kind of casualized, simplified experience with cash shop or / and rmah or / and gold selling.
Since I am not interested in that - I don't support it. Simple.
Well, i am interested to see how it turns out. Particulary it probably fix many UO's problem, and more focus on combat gameplay instead of mining and what-not.
If so, i am interested, and i will suport it. Simple.
You can support whatever you want, it's clear that this game will never see the light of day, EA doesn't have any confidence in the Ultima IP, they canned the last 2 sequels.
UO was a unique game, making it more like everything else, making it more generic and boring so that the average joe who works at Mc Donalds can play it would be a terrible idea.
Fist, because the average joe who works at Mc Donalds and plays casual mmos never heard about the Ultima IP.
Second, because the people who actually want to play an Ultima game would never be interested in a 2 month clear-the-content-and-quit MMO
I do. I play Ultima 4 to 6 .. 6 is the best in the series.
There is no market for a game like the original game
There's no market for WoW clones either, but that didn't stop every MMO company from making one or two for the last 7 years. There's probably a much MUCH better chance of making a profit from UO2 than there ever was with SWTOR. Its uncontested.
Actually, in the strictest sense of the word there was a HUGE market for WOW clones, at least from a market reserach pov. Expecially before it was clear if WoW was the odd duckling or the new norm. Ofc today we know that it was the odd duckling. But think of this, if nobody manages to pinch a healthy amount of players from a stack of about lets say 3-4 million (the WoW stock of US and EU) How is anyone going to pinch a healthy stock from a pool of players that is 1/10 at best and if we limit our sefl to the source material (WoW vs UO) not even a fraction.
Because the WoW market is entirely different from the rest of the market. We know the market exists for hardcore sandbox games. We know that number is AT LEAST a million strong (bigger than the majority of modern day MMO subscription rates). We also know that that genre is almost completely untapped. UNLIKE WOW'S MARKET which is already tapped by WoW, and the 7 WoW clones from AAA companies, and the 20 WoW clones from little companies peeling off the scraps.
We KNOW WoW is an outlier, we KNOW sandbox MMOs aren't.
Who are we and what numbers are you qouting... Afaik there is ONE sandbox that have come out since UO that was not a horrid mess or the very defenition of a niche game. And i am not so sure Eve's players will leave it to go play in the new UO2.
And 1 mil users for sandbox is nothing if you compare it to the total market of the themepark.
I am not saying that it will fail.. i am just saying it makes little sense from a investor PoV.
I think UO2 would be awesome if done right with the technology we have today. I also think that they wouldn't be able to make the game even half as good as the original, heh.
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
I wouldn't trust EA/Mythic to even roll over and die properly. As good as UO was in the day, as great the memories, let it live as an icon and build something new in its vein. Sadly everything that made UO good and special is anathema to the majority of modern gamers.
Hordcore leveling curve? Vanguard is 8x easier to level adventuring than at launch, people still whine about how slow and grindy it is. The days of taking 3-4 months of heavy play to cap level have become the WoW'ified 2-3 weeks to solo to cap.
Gear and Cash grinds? Replaced with cash shops and Monty Haul mob drops.
Its not even an MMO. Considering what they have done to Ultima Online, which imo in no way currently resembles what it once was, I don't trust them with it. I want to remember UO as the classic mmo it once was, before they totally changed it into something else.
There is no market for a game like the original game
There's no market for WoW clones either, but that didn't stop every MMO company from making one or two for the last 7 years. There's probably a much MUCH better chance of making a profit from UO2 than there ever was with SWTOR. Its uncontested.
Actually, in the strictest sense of the word there was a HUGE market for WOW clones, at least from a market reserach pov. Expecially before it was clear if WoW was the odd duckling or the new norm. Ofc today we know that it was the odd duckling. But think of this, if nobody manages to pinch a healthy amount of players from a stack of about lets say 3-4 million (the WoW stock of US and EU) How is anyone going to pinch a healthy stock from a pool of players that is 1/10 at best and if we limit our sefl to the source material (WoW vs UO) not even a fraction.
Because the WoW market is entirely different from the rest of the market. We know the market exists for hardcore sandbox games. We know that number is AT LEAST a million strong (bigger than the majority of modern day MMO subscription rates). We also know that that genre is almost completely untapped. UNLIKE WOW'S MARKET which is already tapped by WoW, and the 7 WoW clones from AAA companies, and the 20 WoW clones from little companies peeling off the scraps.
We KNOW WoW is an outlier, we KNOW sandbox MMOs aren't.
Who are we and what numbers are you qouting... Afaik there is ONE sandbox that have come out since UO that was not a horrid mess or the very defenition of a niche game. And i am not so sure Eve's players will leave it to go play in the new UO2.
And 1 mil users for sandbox is nothing if you compare it to the total market of the themepark.
I am not saying that it will fail.. i am just saying it makes little sense from a investor PoV.
I think those numbers were made up, or pulled out of some dark place. The only concrete argument I could make for them would be the number of people who have signed up for Day Z. But that includes a significant number of FPS-heads who'd probably not care about or add much to a sandboxy game.
Sandbox fans overestimate their numbers and underestimate the difficulty of making such a game now, imo. If a developer didn't overblow their expenses, and had realistic expectations, it should be doable though.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
I, like many others, have lots of nostalgia for the old place, but I still feel drained from the old flamewars.
The community can't decide on what UO is ... the secret sauce is different for everyone... but how can I support a theoretical sequel when I can't imagine getting more than handful of people to agree on any one design?
That is kinda what happens when in every game, there is a great demand for a ´classic server´.. everyone picks a different point in time to go back to.
For me, the game wasn´t so great when there was only full pvp. It was exciting and fun.. but it felt like a game I played for 20 mins. Once they created Trammel and allowed players to relax and ´live in a world´.. It felt like an amazing, open game with a vibrant economy and community. You could literally get lost in the world for hours and hours. When most of your time was spent fending yourself from that naked theif who you could kill hundreds of times and never get anything.. but yet that 1 in 100 time he got away with you he got something great.
The funny thing is. I wonder if people even know that for like the first 4 years of UO, there was not a single quest! None.. there was nothing that told you to go somewhere.... there was no reason to crawl a dungeon... nothing. Just spawn points.
I think the first quest I remember was a witch (something about a cauldren). Then they did those mass crafting things (BODS) that were kinda like a quest for crafters.
For me, the best time was probably the year right before AOS was released. You had all the ´new´crafting stuff in like. The game died (for me) with AOS because for the first time, monster drops just dwarfed anything you could craft. The entire economy turned from crafting based to a diablo type drop system. the only way to keep my mall stocked was to grind balrons instead of crafting.
There is no market for a game like the original game
There's no market for WoW clones either, but that didn't stop every MMO company from making one or two for the last 7 years. There's probably a much MUCH better chance of making a profit from UO2 than there ever was with SWTOR. Its uncontested.
Actually, in the strictest sense of the word there was a HUGE market for WOW clones, at least from a market reserach pov. Expecially before it was clear if WoW was the odd duckling or the new norm. Ofc today we know that it was the odd duckling. But think of this, if nobody manages to pinch a healthy amount of players from a stack of about lets say 3-4 million (the WoW stock of US and EU) How is anyone going to pinch a healthy stock from a pool of players that is 1/10 at best and if we limit our sefl to the source material (WoW vs UO) not even a fraction.
Because the WoW market is entirely different from the rest of the market. We know the market exists for hardcore sandbox games. We know that number is AT LEAST a million strong (bigger than the majority of modern day MMO subscription rates). We also know that that genre is almost completely untapped. UNLIKE WOW'S MARKET which is already tapped by WoW, and the 7 WoW clones from AAA companies, and the 20 WoW clones from little companies peeling off the scraps.
We KNOW WoW is an outlier, we KNOW sandbox MMOs aren't.
Who are we and what numbers are you qouting... Afaik there is ONE sandbox that have come out since UO that was not a horrid mess or the very defenition of a niche game. And i am not so sure Eve's players will leave it to go play in the new UO2.
And 1 mil users for sandbox is nothing if you compare it to the total market of the themepark.
Actually, 1 million steady subs would be over double what the most successful themepark MMO outside of WoW is reeling in. The themepark market is oversaturated, you don't seem to understand basic economics.
UO, Eve, SWG, all huge games, and sandbox. The market for these games is almost completely uncontested
Comments
EA Mythic : Hell no
Mythic Entertainment : Sure
EA is the destroyer of mmo's. Every mmo they touch strivels up and dies.
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
know the old saying "fool me once..." they played at creating a sequel not once but twice! I'll believe it when I see it finished, published, reviewed (by real independent reviewers!), till then they can go to the bad place and rot.
I would agree with the SOE bit as long as Brad and Richard got to work together on it
.
Also, just because it seems appropriate.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXpnAs8Z9g4
What's the kill count at now?
Ultima Online
Imperator
Dark Age of Camelot
Dark Age of Camelot 2
DAoC Origins
Warhammer Online
Earth and Beyond
Sims Online?
I don't think theres a worse MMO company out there.
Mythic didn't seem to learn anything about what made DAoC successful when they created WAR and ruined DAoC with TOA (I might even argue SI was the begining of the end with spell crafting). While EA has a knack for ruining MMO's, they are not responsible for bad decisions Mythic made to DAoC. Even if we gave a pass to Mythic for all of that, it doesn't matter anyway because Mythic as we knew it doesn't exist anymore.
Actually, in the strictest sense of the word there was a HUGE market for WOW clones, at least from a market reserach pov. Expecially before it was clear if WoW was the odd duckling or the new norm. Ofc today we know that it was the odd duckling. But think of this, if nobody manages to pinch a healthy amount of players from a stack of about lets say 3-4 million (the WoW stock of US and EU) How is anyone going to pinch a healthy stock from a pool of players that is 1/10 at best and if we limit our sefl to the source material (WoW vs UO) not even a fraction.
From a investor PoV there is no market for a game based on UO1. And if they did not even managed to get enough people to go for the previous UO2... Why should it be any different now?
Ofc if someone were to make a more userfriendly and slightyl more structured version i can see how it could get some attention. But that would.. as mentioned make the fanatic sandbox crowd a bit... unhinged.
This have been a good conversation
Because the WoW market is entirely different from the rest of the market. We know the market exists for hardcore sandbox games. We know that number is AT LEAST a million strong (bigger than the majority of modern day MMO subscription rates). We also know that that genre is almost completely untapped. UNLIKE WOW'S MARKET which is already tapped by WoW, and the 7 WoW clones from AAA companies, and the 20 WoW clones from little companies peeling off the scraps.
We KNOW WoW is an outlier, we KNOW sandbox MMOs aren't.
Since I don't believe that EA would want to finance a pure P2P or pure B2P (without Cash Shop not like in GW2 where there is cash shop) since for me biggest strenght of UO was that it was virtual world where someone being crafter making house furnitre and cosmetic things could have viable gameplay as well as warrior.
Then I don't support it.
Because I think EA / Mythic would do some kind of casualized, simplified experience with cash shop or / and rmah or / and gold selling.
Since I am not interested in that - I don't support it. Simple.
You actually should probably try to understand for a minute. Much longer then that second. Themparks term had nothing to do about safe or unsafe. It had to do about how the game was organized. Start in zone A follow quest line to B then C etc. Yes EQ was an early themepark. Nowhere near as oversimplified as they make them now but still it was a themepark. And yes EQ was safe when you compare it to games like UO and SB
There obvious IS a market for WOW like games. LOTRO is doing fine. DDO is doing fine. Rift is still running.
Sure TOR may crash and burn, but that is not the only "wow clone". Many are still running, and doing decent business.
Well, i am interested to see how it turns out. Particulary it probably fix many UO's problem, and more focus on combat gameplay instead of mining and what-not.
If so, i am interested, and i will suport it. Simple.
LotRO didn't get nearly as many subs as they thought they would. It is the biggest IP in the world and they still had to go FTP.
DDO was a money sink for YEARS and didn't start making money until it went FTP 4 years after launch.
Rift already had to merge servers months ago.
These games limp along with fewer subs than old MMOs had back in dial up days.
You can support whatever you want, it's clear that this game will never see the light of day, EA doesn't have any confidence in the Ultima IP, they canned the last 2 sequels.
UO was a unique game, making it more like everything else, making it more generic and boring so that the average joe who works at Mc Donalds can play it would be a terrible idea.
Fist, because the average joe who works at Mc Donalds and plays casual mmos never heard about the Ultima IP.
Second, because the people who actually want to play an Ultima game would never be interested in a 2 month clear-the-content-and-quit MMO
"Dogs are the leaders of the planet. If you see two life forms, one of them's making a poop, the other one's carrying it for him, who would you assume is in charge."
"The idea behind the tuxedo is the woman's point of view that men are all the same; so we might as well dress them that way. That's why a wedding is like the joining together of a beautiful, glowing bride and some guy"
-Seinfeld
I do. I play Ultima 4 to 6 .. 6 is the best in the series.
Who are we and what numbers are you qouting... Afaik there is ONE sandbox that have come out since UO that was not a horrid mess or the very defenition of a niche game. And i am not so sure Eve's players will leave it to go play in the new UO2.
And 1 mil users for sandbox is nothing if you compare it to the total market of the themepark.
I am not saying that it will fail.. i am just saying it makes little sense from a investor PoV.
This have been a good conversation
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/also.. if anyone missed it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultima_Online_2
This have been a good conversation
I wouldn't trust EA/Mythic to even roll over and die properly. As good as UO was in the day, as great the memories, let it live as an icon and build something new in its vein. Sadly everything that made UO good and special is anathema to the majority of modern gamers.
Hordcore leveling curve? Vanguard is 8x easier to level adventuring than at launch, people still whine about how slow and grindy it is. The days of taking 3-4 months of heavy play to cap level have become the WoW'ified 2-3 weeks to solo to cap.
Gear and Cash grinds? Replaced with cash shops and Monty Haul mob drops.
Gah...
There were, iirc, 3 attempts to do UO2. All met a sad fate long before launch.
I think those numbers were made up, or pulled out of some dark place. The only concrete argument I could make for them would be the number of people who have signed up for Day Z. But that includes a significant number of FPS-heads who'd probably not care about or add much to a sandboxy game.
Sandbox fans overestimate their numbers and underestimate the difficulty of making such a game now, imo. If a developer didn't overblow their expenses, and had realistic expectations, it should be doable though.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
That is kinda what happens when in every game, there is a great demand for a ´classic server´.. everyone picks a different point in time to go back to.
For me, the game wasn´t so great when there was only full pvp. It was exciting and fun.. but it felt like a game I played for 20 mins. Once they created Trammel and allowed players to relax and ´live in a world´.. It felt like an amazing, open game with a vibrant economy and community. You could literally get lost in the world for hours and hours. When most of your time was spent fending yourself from that naked theif who you could kill hundreds of times and never get anything.. but yet that 1 in 100 time he got away with you he got something great.
The funny thing is. I wonder if people even know that for like the first 4 years of UO, there was not a single quest! None.. there was nothing that told you to go somewhere.... there was no reason to crawl a dungeon... nothing. Just spawn points.
I think the first quest I remember was a witch (something about a cauldren). Then they did those mass crafting things (BODS) that were kinda like a quest for crafters.
For me, the best time was probably the year right before AOS was released. You had all the ´new´crafting stuff in like. The game died (for me) with AOS because for the first time, monster drops just dwarfed anything you could craft. The entire economy turned from crafting based to a diablo type drop system. the only way to keep my mall stocked was to grind balrons instead of crafting.
Actually, 1 million steady subs would be over double what the most successful themepark MMO outside of WoW is reeling in. The themepark market is oversaturated, you don't seem to understand basic economics.
UO, Eve, SWG, all huge games, and sandbox. The market for these games is almost completely uncontested