First: You dont make a community, you accept a community, you are part of the community yourself, you cant control peoples in a pastime.
And you can also choose who you accept to community. I should have said help build community instead just 'make'. Community isnt something that come to you and you just 'accept' it except community that is full of trolls, flames and whining, but such community is worthless in my opinion. Mourning boards here were mostly just these flames, trolls and whining and could say there was no mourning community here in the first place. Thats why I said mourning will probably be better off without forums here.
So you admit they remove a part of a good community.
You also admit they want less visibility. SoE, who are Gods in this domain, accept perfectly well that peoples talk anyway they want about EQ outside of their site, they will clarify everything and let us know, lowly earth creatures, what the secrets of life are.
I can tell you, MMORPG.com staff was personnally interested in the game, having extremely great hopes for the game, yet, they where trying the best way to help your little game. This coverage is another proof they care for you nonetheless, if they would really dislike you, they would delete this whole post, once and for all! Mourning was 1 of the 19 games who have a board without having a finished product. Most of those games have an extremely strong back ground, which Mourning didnt have, yet they still have the support.
If a fly bother you(immature 10 years troll post), then using a mace when it is on your knee is not wise...and what does the MMORPG.com staff do? They still do coverage and help. If I was a member of the staff, I am not sure I would be noble enought to not delete those posts and prevent this subject from happening.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
SPRING BAN FEST = when Mourning banned a number of perfectly peaceful community members for such things as not reporting a bad post, saying 'WTF', etc...
Apparently they covered their tracks and deleted the original post, can't seem to find it... so here's what I copied the day it happened (also, they deleted their "rules" so you're gonna have to fill in the blanks based on the reaction thread): http://syn-con.com/mourning/showthread.htm
There's so much more stuff out there you first-time visitors are missing out on because the Mourning forums were deleted. Chat logs, etc... showing just how badly Mourning devs lack professionalism.
I'm going to have to vote for Runescape, since there are so many posts regarding it. Maybe just a little forum that included questions regarding the free MMORPGs?
I think its great how they (mourning fans) want the game listed (free publicity) but they totally support the removal of the forum (negetive opinions).
Wow after reading all those bans on the mourning forums I must say - they really are trying to destroy their own game. Not by bad development or game mechanics, but by driving their OWN fanbase away because of silly posts or they didn't report other people's offenses. They're community Nazis. They banned people for the following comments:
"I am very dissapointed. By the time this game is released Ill have a choice of more than one new mmorpg. My chance of playing this game is lower now which sucks because it looks like a good game."
"Now, was this the Big Announcement or just a small pre Big Announcement announcement? Or has the Big Announcement been delayed again? If so, could we have an announcement about this?"
That's ridiculous. So someone got a little sarcastic, or didn't report someone else's offense. They drive away their fans by alienating them and punishing them for not doing the moderator's dirty work. If you have a minute go read all the posts they banned people for, the better half of them were silly little posts about the game and from long time community members. It's downright stupid. I'm seriously awe-struck at their stupidity to moderate the pants off a group of SUPPORTERS and ban them for not keeping an eye on everyone in the community to make sure not a single bad word is spoken of the game. I can't even fathom what they were thinking...
I think this whole mess really strikes a blow to the independent game developer. I think this experience will jade most of us to them. You may not agree with SOE on something but at least you know what to expect.
On the other hand, what if they had amazing PR and this behavior was masked. I'm glad I got to see the monsters behind this game before I gave them my cash.
Sheesh, if I was a dev and people I would just slap em or put "I am a poopoo head" on the signature, have some fun with your people. If mourning is banning people for saying what they SHOULD be doing, they should get slapped HARD.
Actually Dan you have probably put forward the most solid argument that Mourning is not scamware that I have heard so far. Your absolutely right that if they wanted to suck people in they would have at least been nice enough to string them along.
I think what we have here is a genuine, bonifide case of gross mismanagement at many levels. Interesting considering the game isnt even in open beta. If this is the trouble they have conjured by by this early stage we can only salivate in morbid anticipation about what release may bring.
It certainly promises to be entertaining.
Drakon, if the Mourning forums here had not been removed and if you had ever read them, you would know the collective knowledge about Mourning amongst the regular posters here is as high as any of that of its most rabid fans.
We know exactly what we are talking about and that is why we have the confidence to post it all in public. If you find it too challenging then simply go back to the Mourning boards where you will only have to listen to milk and honey chat, since all other valid opinions are immediately squashed and their posters banned.
+-+-+-+-+-+ "MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol" http://purepwnage.com -+-+-+-+-+-+ "Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
Originally posted by thedrakon What's all your problems ? your saying shit about a game you don't even know. You heard some rumors and you all make your opinion on that rumors ... Its like saying, that X game gonna suck cuz this guy said their X thing there .. and .. it's might only be someone who haven't been able to enter the Beta and thaT's pretty angry. If your not interested in this game, stop saying shit about it. and If your just a lil kid, just go away in your mother arm and stop saying bad thing. mourning Dev are working damn hard, and .. they listenned to their community ... Just go to Irc ... make some decent post, And you will catch their attention. If they asked mmorpg.com to remove mourning from their forum, it's more like, nothing from all your critiscism are really critict .. I never saw ... This thing sound bad ... they should make this better .. the only thing we saw here are people saying .. mourning is shit .. mourning is ...it's always sound like a bunch of kid angry about and opposing faction .. sorry guys, get mature a bit ...
It goes both ways. You could say, "this game is great just off of rumors and what you read. its like saying that x game is gnona rock because this guy said that x thing was implemented. I could go on, but i would just be saying the same thing, but backwards.
Originally posted by happydan20 LOL they actually censor www.mmorpg.com on their forum now. LOL As mean as it is to say, I just want this game to go away. I can't wait for it's release, or cancellation or something.. ANYTHING.
yeah they censor somethingawful.com from the forums too because of the false lawsuit response
I havnt seen anything on those forums that would make me beleive those guys have a high school education
+-+-+-+-+-+ "MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol" http://purepwnage.com -+-+-+-+-+-+ "Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
Originally posted by Razorback Ok Grunch now your just being silly. I havnt seen anything on those forums that would make me beleive those guys have a high school education
First, i doubt SOE or Blizzard would tolerate forums here at mmorpg.com where posters continuously said their games were scams. And from a commercial point of view i'm sure mmorpg.com would do whatever SOE/ BLizzard asked them.
Second, there were so many scam posts in the Mourning forum here that i don't think the mmorpg.com moderators really did their job properly. If you go to the trouble to have moderators why not police posts amounting to libel??
Finally, we have all lost sight of the actual game. After all, that's why we use mmorpg.com isn't it? To discuss mmorpgs. I find it sad that many members here are more concerned with the PR (or lack thereof) from the Mourning team rather than the pros and cons of the game itself.
I mean a new skill-based PvP game should definitely be a talking point- its unfortunate that it can't be talked about here.
I don't appreciate what you're implying or your blanket statements. Perhaps you should visit WOW's forums and read what the player base has to say... I think you'll find it to be VERY negative to say the least. If they allow it on their own boards why would they have any problem with it being on MMORPG.COM's boards. I couldn't even type my last sentence on a mourning thread it would be censored.
I can't speak for SOE's forums as I don't visit them. Whether or not you buy into the mourning scam thing... Valid points are there. The dev team is extremely secretive and very... different from other game companies. In fact this bizarre difference in conduct is the sole reason MMORPG removed them if you bother to read about it.
I'm not saying it is a scam but theres enough to it to allow discussion. Perhaps if mourning let people SEE the game there wouldn't be such a thought out there. As of now not a single reviewer has seen the game. Every interview has been a Q&A.
I'm not even sure I've seen a wow ad on this site....
"First, i doubt SOE or Blizzard would tolerate forums here at mmorpg.com where posters continuously said their games were scams. And from a commercial point of view i'm sure mmorpg.com would do whatever SOE/ BLizzard asked them.
Second, there were so many scam posts in the Mourning forum here that i don't think the mmorpg.com moderators really did their job properly. If you go to the trouble to have moderators why not police posts amounting to libel??"
Thats exactly right. And thats why it was removed. Because tihs place is run by people who cant moderate their own community. There was "ilegal" stuff being posted here. Yes thats right. Any respectable business men are not going to allow their company name and product to be dragged through the mud by little teenage brats with nothing better to do but make up lies and than have the place where its being posted do NOTHING about it.
If half the people whp post here posted at Gamespot forums or IGN they would be banned a long time ago because those places actually have rules and moderation.
" Perhaps if mourning let people SEE the game there wouldn't be such a thought out there"
Anyone who thinks that way is a FOOL to begin with. Theres people in the games beta right now and have been for YEARS. They even post screenshots of themselves playing on the forums all the time. Not to mention all the press releases associating them with some well known companies and organizations that I guess were just "made up" right?
Please GROW UP people. This place has been taken over by idiots. THATS what happens when theres no rules. I'am moving back GS and IGN forums. At least there they deal with the pre pubescent outcasts of the internet by removing them.
The only thing you managed to do to yourselves mmorpg.com is show what a crappy community you actually managed to build up here by allowing what you allow.
While completely ignoring my points you seem well versed in how crappy this community is. That suggests you have read what the community has to say... I would equally assume you've read where MMORPG.COM staff have repeatedly said the action concerning mourning HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THE FORUMS.
But then again, you know what they say about people that assume...
Originally posted by strouse Please GROW UP people. This place has been taken over by idiots. THATS what happens when theres no rules. I'am moving back GS and IGN forums. At least there they deal with the pre pubescent outcasts of the internet by removing them. The only thing you managed to do to yourselves mmorpg.com is show what a crappy community you actually managed to build up here by allowing what you allow.
Strouse you hypocrite!... I couldnt believe this was you! Almost every post you have in our game hype section is of a extremely negative nature, and constantly so... now your telling others to "grow up", and that the community is "crap"... man YOU are the "crappy" part of this community, and YOU are the one thats not quite "grown up"!
I have a sneaking suspicion that your a Morning Dev or a close associate, your actions towards other games is disgusting, I suspect you do this in a vain attempt to discredit them in favor of Morning!
Have fun where ever you end up
Below was his latest contribution to our community
On Mar 20, 2005 strouse wrote: this game is overhyped vaporware... of course its only overhyped on mmorpg.com though.. every other place knows its proper place.. in the vapor section.
Originally posted by stav1 First, i doubt SOE or Blizzard would tolerate forums here at mmorpg.com where posters continuously said their games were scams. And from a commercial point of view i'm sure mmorpg.com would do whatever SOE/ BLizzard asked them. Second, there were so many scam posts in the Mourning forum here that i don't think the mmorpg.com moderators really did their job properly. If you go to the trouble to have moderators why not police posts amounting to libel?? Finally, we have all lost sight of the actual game. After all, that's why we use mmorpg.com isn't it? To discuss mmorpgs. I find it sad that many members here are more concerned with the PR (or lack thereof) from the Mourning team rather than the pros and cons of the game itself. I mean a new skill-based PvP game should definitely be a talking point- its unfortunate that it can't be talked about here.
1st - Thats just pure speculation on your part. I know that over at the WoW bliz site there is a lot of negativity but they at least let people tell there concerns and ask critical questions. I am sure they have no prob with these boards. As for SOE I am not sure so I won't make blanket statements like you.
2nd - MMORPG IMO does a great job with moderating these boards. They have many games to mod but they do a good job. Mourning site has 1 game and they remove peoples post for the smallest reasons. I don't think IMO they care too much for the new customers. They are fine with the group they have.
3rd - Well I was so hyped to hear about Mourning here and wouldn't have known about them if it wasn't for this site. I went over there and found the devs and mods to be really horrible. I asked about a few concerns and was almost banned and called "Childish, Jerk, ect) by the devs no less. That is what put me off to the game, but like I said I don't think they care about me or the others that have concerns or even questions.
Well I am hoping for D&L to make it! They have a good site and a good base.
Cheers
Bilas
'She just left. She didn't even care enough to cut off my head or set me on fire. I mean, is that too much to ask? You know? Some little sign that she cared?"
Comments
And you can also choose who you accept to community. I should have said help build community instead just 'make'. Community isnt something that come to you and you just 'accept' it except community that is full of trolls, flames and whining, but such community is worthless in my opinion. Mourning boards here were mostly just these flames, trolls and whining and could say there was no mourning community here in the first place. Thats why I said mourning will probably be better off without forums here.
So you admit they remove a part of a good community.
You also admit they want less visibility. SoE, who are Gods in this domain, accept perfectly well that peoples talk anyway they want about EQ outside of their site, they will clarify everything and let us know, lowly earth creatures, what the secrets of life are.
I can tell you, MMORPG.com staff was personnally interested in the game, having extremely great hopes for the game, yet, they where trying the best way to help your little game. This coverage is another proof they care for you nonetheless, if they would really dislike you, they would delete this whole post, once and for all! Mourning was 1 of the 19 games who have a board without having a finished product. Most of those games have an extremely strong back ground, which Mourning didnt have, yet they still have the support.
If a fly bother you(immature 10 years troll post), then using a mace when it is on your knee is not wise...and what does the MMORPG.com staff do? They still do coverage and help. If I was a member of the staff, I am not sure I would be noble enought to not delete those posts and prevent this subject from happening.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
SPRING BAN FEST = when Mourning banned a number of perfectly peaceful community members for such things as not reporting a bad post, saying 'WTF', etc...
Apparently they covered their tracks and deleted the original post, can't seem to find it... so here's what I copied the day it happened (also, they deleted their "rules" so you're gonna have to fill in the blanks based on the reaction thread):
http://syn-con.com/mourning/showthread.htm
Spring Ban Fest Reaction (immediately following tiamat's post):
http://www.realmsoftorment.net/forums/showthread.php3?s=8afce40e30a9baac4f79dd9be2805e21&threadid=17391
There's so much more stuff out there you first-time visitors are missing out on because the Mourning forums were deleted. Chat logs, etc... showing just how badly Mourning devs lack professionalism.
Mourning is doomed to fail, just like it should. Lets hope it drives the developers into bankruptcy.
_____________________
I am the flipside of the coin on which the troll and the fanboy are but one side.
I'm going to have to vote for Runescape, since there are so many posts regarding it. Maybe just a little forum that included questions regarding the free MMORPGs?
-- wrong thread
A supposedly professional company who can't take criticism, and flaming?
hahahaha, have fun with your lovely game, mourning.
They think by deleting every possible criticism and flame post they would get more better impressions from people or something? No, sorry, just no.
lol dan, my thoughts exactly
Wow after reading all those bans on the mourning forums I must say - they really are trying to destroy their own game. Not by bad development or game mechanics, but by driving their OWN fanbase away because of silly posts or they didn't report other people's offenses. They're community Nazis. They banned people for the following comments:
"I am very dissapointed. By the time this game is released Ill have a choice of more than one new mmorpg. My chance of playing this game is lower now which sucks because it looks like a good game."
"Now, was this the Big Announcement or just a small pre Big Announcement announcement?
Or has the Big Announcement been delayed again? If so, could we have an announcement about this?"
That's ridiculous. So someone got a little sarcastic, or didn't report someone else's offense. They drive away their fans by alienating them and punishing them for not doing the moderator's dirty work. If you have a minute go read all the posts they banned people for, the better half of them were silly little posts about the game and from long time community members. It's downright stupid. I'm seriously awe-struck at their stupidity to moderate the pants off a group of SUPPORTERS and ban them for not keeping an eye on everyone in the community to make sure not a single bad word is spoken of the game. I can't even fathom what they were thinking...
Thank you for actually taking the time to research the source of all this, magik.
I think this whole mess really strikes a blow to the independent game developer. I think this experience will jade most of us to them. You may not agree with SOE on something but at least you know what to expect.
On the other hand, what if they had amazing PR and this behavior was masked. I'm glad I got to see the monsters behind this game before I gave them my cash.
---------------------------------------------
Actually Dan you have probably put forward the most solid argument that Mourning is not scamware that I have heard so far. Your absolutely right that if they wanted to suck people in they would have at least been nice enough to string them along.
I think what we have here is a genuine, bonifide case of gross mismanagement at many levels. Interesting considering the game isnt even in open beta. If this is the trouble they have conjured by by this early stage we can only salivate in morbid anticipation about what release may bring.
It certainly promises to be entertaining.
Drakon, if the Mourning forums here had not been removed and if you had ever read them, you would know the collective knowledge about Mourning amongst the regular posters here is as high as any of that of its most rabid fans.
We know exactly what we are talking about and that is why we have the confidence to post it all in public. If you find it too challenging then simply go back to the Mourning boards where you will only have to listen to milk and honey chat, since all other valid opinions are immediately squashed and their posters banned.
+-+-+-+-+-+
"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
-+-+-+-+-+-+
"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
It goes both ways. You could say, "this game is great just off of rumors and what you read. its like saying that x game is gnona rock because this guy said that x thing was implemented.
I could go on, but i would just be saying the same thing, but backwards.
LOL they actually censor www.mmorpg.com on their forum now. LOL
As mean as it is to say, I just want this game to go away.
I can't wait for it's release, or cancellation or something.. ANYTHING.
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
no, the devs are working on a game, and they arent high school students... but... they do need to learn more about PR.
yeah they censor somethingawful.com from the forums too because of the false lawsuit response
http://www.sometingawful.com/articles.php?a=2706
They tarred and feathered themselves
total hypocrite nazis
Ok Grunch now your just being silly.
I havnt seen anything on those forums that would make me beleive those guys have a high school education
+-+-+-+-+-+
"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
-+-+-+-+-+-+
"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
First, i doubt SOE or Blizzard would tolerate forums here at mmorpg.com where posters continuously said their games were scams. And from a commercial point of view i'm sure mmorpg.com would do whatever SOE/ BLizzard asked them.
Second, there were so many scam posts in the Mourning forum here that i don't think the mmorpg.com moderators really did their job properly. If you go to the trouble to have moderators why not police posts amounting to libel??
Finally, we have all lost sight of the actual game. After all, that's why we use mmorpg.com isn't it? To discuss mmorpgs. I find it sad that many members here are more concerned with the PR (or lack thereof) from the Mourning team rather than the pros and cons of the game itself.
I mean a new skill-based PvP game should definitely be a talking point- its unfortunate that it can't be talked about here.
I don't appreciate what you're implying or your blanket statements. Perhaps you should visit WOW's forums and read what the player base has to say... I think you'll find it to be VERY negative to say the least. If they allow it on their own boards why would they have any problem with it being on MMORPG.COM's boards. I couldn't even type my last sentence on a mourning thread it would be censored.
I can't speak for SOE's forums as I don't visit them. Whether or not you buy into the mourning scam thing... Valid points are there. The dev team is extremely secretive and very... different from other game companies. In fact this bizarre difference in conduct is the sole reason MMORPG removed them if you bother to read about it.
I'm not saying it is a scam but theres enough to it to allow discussion. Perhaps if mourning let people SEE the game there wouldn't be such a thought out there. As of now not a single reviewer has seen the game. Every interview has been a Q&A.
I'm not even sure I've seen a wow ad on this site....
Second, there were so many scam posts in the Mourning forum here that i don't think the mmorpg.com moderators really did their job properly. If you go to the trouble to have moderators why not police posts amounting to libel??"
Thats exactly right. And thats why it was removed. Because tihs place is run by people who cant moderate their own community. There was "ilegal" stuff being posted here. Yes thats right. Any respectable business men are not going to allow their company name and product to be dragged through the mud by little teenage brats with nothing better to do but make up lies and than have the place where its being posted do NOTHING about it.
If half the people whp post here posted at Gamespot forums or IGN they would be banned a long time ago because those places actually have rules and moderation.
" Perhaps if mourning let people SEE the game there wouldn't be such a thought out there"
Anyone who thinks that way is a FOOL to begin with. Theres people in the games beta right now and have been for YEARS. They even post screenshots of themselves playing on the forums all the time. Not to mention all the press releases associating them with some well known companies and organizations that I guess were just "made up" right?
Please GROW UP people. This place has been taken over by idiots. THATS what happens when theres no rules. I'am moving back GS and IGN forums. At least there they deal with the pre pubescent outcasts of the internet by removing them.
The only thing you managed to do to yourselves mmorpg.com is show what a crappy community you actually managed to build up here by allowing what you allow.
While completely ignoring my points you seem well versed in how crappy this community is. That suggests you have read what the community has to say... I would equally assume you've read where MMORPG.COM staff have repeatedly said the action concerning mourning HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THE FORUMS.
But then again, you know what they say about people that assume...
Strouse you hypocrite!... I couldnt believe this was you!
Almost every post you have in our game hype section is of a extremely negative nature, and constantly so... now your telling others to "grow up", and that the community is "crap"... man YOU are the "crappy" part of this community, and YOU are the one thats not quite "grown up"! 
I have a sneaking suspicion that your a Morning Dev or a close associate, your actions towards other games is disgusting, I suspect you do this in a vain attempt to discredit them in favor of Morning!
Have fun where ever you end up
Below was his latest contribution to our community
this game is overhyped vaporware... of course its only overhyped on mmorpg.com though.. every other place knows its proper place.. in the vapor section.
1st - Thats just pure speculation on your part. I know that over at the WoW bliz site there is a lot of negativity but they at least let people tell there concerns and ask critical questions. I am sure they have no prob with these boards. As for SOE I am not sure so I won't make blanket statements like you.
2nd - MMORPG IMO does a great job with moderating these boards. They have many games to mod but they do a good job. Mourning site has 1 game and they remove peoples post for the smallest reasons. I don't think IMO they care too much for the new customers. They are fine with the group they have.
3rd - Well I was so hyped to hear about Mourning here and wouldn't have known about them if it wasn't for this site. I went over there and found the devs and mods to be really horrible. I asked about a few concerns and was almost banned and called "Childish, Jerk, ect) by the devs no less. That is what put me off to the game, but like I said I don't think they care about me or the others that have concerns or even questions.
Well I am hoping for D&L to make it! They have a good site and a good base.
Cheers
Bilas
'She just left. She didn't even care enough to cut off my head or set me on fire. I mean, is that too much to ask? You know? Some little sign that she cared?"