To those complaining about PVP, full loot etc...

Seronys

I heard Mists of Pandaria just came out, why don't you go boss it up as a cuddly wuddly panduh, dawwwww.

 

No but seriously, this game is a hardcore PVP game, if you can't deal with PVP, if you can't deal with losing you're precious pixels, stop posting, stop looking at the game, and just go play something else, cause this is what it is and this is how it should be. Carebear themepark mmos have ruined the mmo genre as we all know and leave no room for original content, DF is original, it's got something everything nowadays doesn't. This game is already dumbing down it's combat system so some of the "slower" players can keep up.

 

If you guys like action-packed skill-based pvp thrillrides (anyone who thinks otherwise about the skill part more than likely sucked at this part),  massive siege warfare where you fight 50 VS 50, 100 VS 100, where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot ( perfect example, each one of those spells individually aimed, the target called) for control over resources, dominance over land, than this game is for you. There's more to DF than just this ofc, but this is the part I found most enjoyable.

Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot 

and that's the problem with DF's playerbase. Don't get me wrong, I really like DF as a concept, but it's this arena mentality that's keeping it from becoming a true sandbox.

Seronys

Originally posted by Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot 

and that's the problem with DF's playerbase. Don't get me wrong, I really like DF as a concept, but it's this arena mentality that's keeping it from becoming a true sandbox.

elaborate on the arena mentality please, cause as far as i see it, wanting less PVP and more PVE turns into more of a mob grind than a sandbox, im stating that you're fighting over the sandcastle in the sandbox, as a clan, as a group, where each individual counts, where you're army is the strength of you're clan, where you fight for the resources, the control to make yourselves stronger. Isn't that the idea, to become king of the sandbox? Also i was describing 1 aspect of the game.

Falesh

Darkfall may not be the perfect sandbox but imposing themepark restrictions like safe zones, PvE servers, limiting full loot, etc will only make it less of a sandbox. Yes Darkfall could attract more players by turning into something it was not designed to be but what is the point of that? There are plenty of PvE/consensual PvP games out there so why change games that try to do something different into something that is already abundant?

jake-off

Seriously, Darkfall and UO is all we've got. Everyone needs to stop trying to make AV turn this game into something it's not.

naljeja

call it 'arena pvp' game as much as you want. I have played this game since launch and the game is not that. Period

SirBalin

Originally posted by Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot 

and that's the problem with DF's playerbase. Don't get me wrong, I really like DF as a concept, but it's this arena mentality that's keeping it from becoming a true sandbox.

Wow...mmorpg.com should ban for posting bad information...because this is so wrong.  I'm assuming you mean arena because the post above you said 100 vs 100, 50 vs 50, etc....that was just an example...this game is far from arena based and is totally ow sandbox...

TsaboHavoc

Originally posted by Seronys

Originally posted by Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot 

and that's the problem with DF's playerbase. Don't get me wrong, I really like DF as a concept, but it's this arena mentality that's keeping it from becoming a true sandbox.

elaborate on the arena mentality please, cause as far as i see it, wanting less PVP and more PVE turns into more of a mob grind than a sandbox, im stating that you're fighting over the sandcastle in the sandbox, as a clan, as a group, where each individual counts, where you're army is the strength of you're clan, where you fight for the resources, the control to make yourselves stronger. Isn't that the idea, to become king of the sandbox? Also i was describing 1 aspect of the game.

the problem is .... the zealot were a marine, a ghost, a marauder, a hidralisk, a defiler, a templar, alltogether and heavliy relying on macros and scripts to be effetive... 

so darkfall is not a sandbox mmorpg but an FPS arena with king of the hill? serious question

 

Falesh

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the problem is .... the zealot were a marine, a ghost, a marauder, a hidralisk, a defiler, a templar, alltogether and heavliy relying on macros and scripts to be effetive...  so darkfall is not a sandbox mmorpg but an FPS arena with king of the hill? serious question  

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Darkfall has PvP, PvE, crafters making the majority of the gear you wear, enchanters enchanting that gear, trade, lots and lots of politics, exploration, and so on. So no, it is not "an FPS arena with king of the hill". Yes the game is not perfect but it suffers most from myths spread by people who have not played it long enough to find out what it actually is.

Kyleran

First point of order.  A MMO can be a sandbox without FFA Full Loot PVP.

EVE is a sandbox style game, and it has a very elaborate set of rules in place to enable players to control their level of risk hence some folks favor its design. But I'm not going to debate that here, not the point.

Problem is the shortage of sandbox style titles.  The very few created in recent years have all included FFA full loot PVP, leaving those who like the sandbox concept but not with full loot out in the cold. (Think AC many years ago)

I'm not saying DF:UW should be anything else but what it is, just saying it's understandable why people would invade the space here hoping for a different design.

 

Falesh

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Originally posted by Kyleran First point of order.  A MMO can be a sandbox without FFA Full Loot PVP. EVE is a sandbox style game, and it has a very elaborate set of rules in place to enable players to control their level of risk hence some folks favor its design. But I'm not going to debate that here, not the point. Problem is the shortage of sandbox style titles.  The very few created in recent years have all included FFA full loot PVP, leaving those who like the sandbox concept but not with full loot out in the cold. (Think AC many years ago) I'm not saying DF:UW should be anything else but what it is, just saying it's understandable why people would invade the space here hoping for a different design.  

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EVE is a sandbox game in spite of the safe zones, much like Darkfall is a sandbox game in spite of other sandbox deficiencies it has. And yes I agree about the lack of sandbox games out there. However the PvE/Safezone crowd have games like ArcheAge to play whereas the people who yearn for a game like Darkfall have no alternatives because only Darkfall dares to do what it does.

Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

Originally posted by Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot 

and that's the problem with DF's playerbase. Don't get me wrong, I really like DF as a concept, but it's this arena mentality that's keeping it from becoming a true sandbox.

elaborate on the arena mentality please, cause as far as i see it, wanting less PVP and more PVE turns into more of a mob grind than a sandbox, im stating that you're fighting over the sandcastle in the sandbox, as a clan, as a group, where each individual counts, where you're army is the strength of you're clan, where you fight for the resources, the control to make yourselves stronger. Isn't that the idea, to become king of the sandbox? Also i was describing 1 aspect of the game.

don't get me wrong, nothing personal, but what I previously quoted from your original post points to a timed deathmatch = arena. I like the FFA full loot aspect of DF but there's so much more in a sandbox that's it's doing it a disservice to focus only on the PvP.

As you yourself said, you are describing one aspect of the game; you like the clan warfare part. That's fine and very much understood. However, others may like to collect herbs and brew potions, explore and mine rare ore to craft armor/weapons/whatnot, build a small farmhouse and cultivate the land to grow and cook food, etc. A sandbox must give these types of players the option to engage in these activities if they so wish. Not risk-free, but viably so. In its implementation, DF1 did not allow for anything else other than fighting. Let's hope DF:UW will exoand on the sandbox options.

Seronys

Originally posted by TsaboHavoc

Originally posted by Seronys

Originally posted by Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot 

and that's the problem with DF's playerbase. Don't get me wrong, I really like DF as a concept, but it's this arena mentality that's keeping it from becoming a true sandbox.

elaborate on the arena mentality please, cause as far as i see it, wanting less PVP and more PVE turns into more of a mob grind than a sandbox, im stating that you're fighting over the sandcastle in the sandbox, as a clan, as a group, where each individual counts, where you're army is the strength of you're clan, where you fight for the resources, the control to make yourselves stronger. Isn't that the idea, to become king of the sandbox? Also i was describing 1 aspect of the game.

the problem is .... the zealot were a marine, a ghost, a marauder, a hidralisk, a defiler, a templar, alltogether and heavliy relying on macros and scripts to be effetive... 

so darkfall is not a sandbox mmorpg but an FPS arena with king of the hill? serious question

They are suppose to be changing this in DF:UW, (macros scripts and all), and no i wouldn't look at it like an FPS arena, the aspects of the MMO are still there, most people assume that just because it isnt tab target, 4 str, 4 stam leather belt game, its an arena, the combat is FPS yes, adding some skill requirement to be good at it, you PVP because you want the enemies stuff, you want their resources, you want their gear, so you can progress yourself further, or maybe you're just at war with them. The choice to kill the people you come across is the choice of the player, you aren't forced, people just did it because its more lucrative and fun. If you wanna assume that it's more king of the hill, you could say the same for any other MMO that sports territory control.

Kyleran

Originally posted by Falesh

 

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Originally posted by Kyleran First point of order.  A MMO can be a sandbox without FFA Full Loot PVP. EVE is a sandbox style game, and it has a very elaborate set of rules in place to enable players to control their level of risk hence some folks favor its design. But I'm not going to debate that here, not the point. Problem is the shortage of sandbox style titles.  The very few created in recent years have all included FFA full loot PVP, leaving those who like the sandbox concept but not with full loot out in the cold. (Think AC many years ago) I'm not saying DF:UW should be anything else but what it is, just saying it's understandable why people would invade the space here hoping for a different design.  

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EVE is a sandbox game in spite of the safe zones, much like Darkfall is a sandbox game in spite of other sandbox deficiencies it has. And yes I agree about the lack of sandbox games out there. However the PvE/Safezone crowd have games like ArcheAge to play whereas the people who yearn for a game like Darkfall have no alternatives because only Darkfall dares to do what it does.

Yeah, shame that we won't see ArcheAge here in the West for quite a while.  Definitely needs to be more options in the sandbox space, but the good news is Aventurine will build the game the way they envisioned it, so not much chance of it going in another direction.

 

Seronys

Originally posted by Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

Originally posted by Galadourn

Originally posted by Seronys

where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot 

and that's the problem with DF's playerbase. Don't get me wrong, I really like DF as a concept, but it's this arena mentality that's keeping it from becoming a true sandbox.

elaborate on the arena mentality please, cause as far as i see it, wanting less PVP and more PVE turns into more of a mob grind than a sandbox, im stating that you're fighting over the sandcastle in the sandbox, as a clan, as a group, where each individual counts, where you're army is the strength of you're clan, where you fight for the resources, the control to make yourselves stronger. Isn't that the idea, to become king of the sandbox? Also i was describing 1 aspect of the game.

don't get me wrong, nothing personal, but what I previously quoted from your original post points to a timed deathmatch = arena. I like the FFA full loot aspect of DF but there's so much more in a sandbox that's it's doing it a disservice to focus only on the PvP.

As you yourself said, you are describing one aspect of the game; you like the clan warfare part. That's fine and very much understood. However, others may like to collect herbs and brew potions, explore and mine rare ore to craft armor/weapons/whatnot, build a small farmhouse and cultivate the land to grow and cook food, etc. A sandbox must give these types of players the option to engage in these activities if they so wish. Not risk-free, but viably so. In its implementation, DF1 did not allow for anything else other than fighting. Let's hope DF:UW will exoand on the sandbox options.

DF did have most of these things but i can see what your saying, most of that was poorly implemented, and should have been more elaborate then stroke the same bush for 4 hours. Even though the main focus in DF is pvp i wouldn't go as far as saying it's an arena, you do raise a good point though i never really looked at it that way, i was having too much fun PVPing to care

Inlor

Originally posted by jake-off
Seriously, Darkfall and UO is all we've got. Everyone needs to stop trying to make AV turn this game into something it's not.

Correct me pls if I am wrong, as I have not played DF yet (just read a lot about it): Darkfall is all about PvP! Only PvP! That is not necessarily bad, but doesn't it lack all those elements that made UO a so wonderful experience? An extensive crafting system, non instanced housing, IDOCs, taming, treasure hunting, rares collecting, gardening, player owned shops etc.?

UO was not all about PvP! I spend months crafting, gardening, collecting rares, IDOCing, mining, selling horses & dragons & real estate at the WBB...

I wish DF wouldn't focus entirely on PvP...

 

Mardukk

So full loot pvp focused gamers have 2 games. What does the non full loot PvE focused sandbox gamer have? Not that I want PvE server but possibly more quality PvE content.

Maelwydd

Here is a thought...

 

All the FFA pvp types stop flooding the forums of PvE games to INSIST there is PvP and we will do the same for you...

 

I cannot remember the last game I have followed where there wasn't a number of threads from the same few making loud noised to have PvP in the game/better/the focus/all there is.  And I also connt remember the last game that listened that I actually enjoyed.

 

Let the guys that want to have FFA PvP get what they want with this game....perhaps they can then stop asking for it in all the other games.

Creslin321

I loved UO, so I really wanted to like Darfkall, and I played it for a while, but a few things drove me away...

1.  It took an extremely long amount of grinding to become even remotely competitive with veteran players on a pure stat-level, and this grinding was extremely repetive and costly.

2.  The ratio of gankers/griefers to normal players is extremely high, probably due to all the non FFA-PvP games on the market for non-griefers to play.

Falesh

 

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Originally posted by Inlor

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Originally posted by jake-off Seriously, Darkfall and UO is all we've got. Everyone needs to stop trying to make AV turn this game into something it's not.

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Correct me pls if I am wrong, as I have not played DF yet (just read a lot about it): Darkfall is all about PvP! Only PvP! That is not necessarily bad, but doesn't it lack all those elements that made UO a so wonderful experience? An extensive crafting system, non instanced housing, IDOCs, taming, treasure hunting, rares collecting, gardening, player owned shops etc.?

UO was not all about PvP! I spend months crafting, gardening, collecting rares, IDOCing, mining, selling horses & dragons & real estate at the WBB...

I wish DF wouldn't focus entirely on PvP...  

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Darkfall doesn't focus entirely on PvP, that is a myth. In the years I have played Darkfall I have spent more time doing PvE then PvP and I am an avid PvPer. I spent loads of time crafting, since you need to craft gear and enchants rather then getting your equipment from PvE. I also spent loads of time exploring, scouting and map making. Gathering resources is also a big part of the game with people cutting trees, gathering herbs, mining iron and stone.

DF:UW will improve on Darkfall in many ways, but we should not paint a false picture of what Darkfall was.

Annwyn

Originally posted by Seronys

I heard Mists of Pandaria just came out, why don't you go boss it up as a cuddly wuddly panduh, dawwwww.

 

No but seriously, this game is a hardcore PVP game, if you can't deal with PVP, if you can't deal with losing you're precious pixels, stop posting, stop looking at the game, and just go play something else, cause this is what it is and this is how it should be. Carebear themepark mmos have ruined the mmo genre as we all know and leave no room for original content, DF is original, it's got something everything nowadays doesn't. This game is already dumbing down it's combat system so some of the "slower" players can keep up.

 

If you guys like action-packed skill-based pvp thrillrides (anyone who thinks otherwise about the skill part more than likely sucked at this part),  massive siege warfare where you fight 50 VS 50, 100 VS 100, where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot ( perfect example, each one of those spells individually aimed, the target called) for control over resources, dominance over land, than this game is for you. There's more to DF than just this ofc, but this is the part I found most enjoyable.

Yet another ridiculous post by an early defender that can't help but insult the people he's targetting. Why is it so freaking hard to make an argument in favor of your opinion rather than going "you suck nub, gso, go back to WoW carebear"?

Had you made an informative post, your opinion would have a lot more validity,.but of course, you had to destroy all credibily by trashtalking those who may read your post. You're part of the reason why the DarkFall community is perceived as a terrible community, even thought you are only in the minority.

FrodoFragins

Originally posted by Seronys

I heard Mists of Pandaria just came out, why don't you go boss it up as a cuddly wuddly panduh, dawwwww.

 

No but seriously, this game is a hardcore PVP game, if you can't deal with PVP, if you can't deal with losing you're precious pixels, stop posting, stop looking at the game, and just go play something else, cause this is what it is and this is how it should be. Carebear themepark mmos have ruined the mmo genre as we all know and leave no room for original content, DF is original, it's got something everything nowadays doesn't. This game is already dumbing down it's combat system so some of the "slower" players can keep up.

 

If you guys like action-packed skill-based pvp thrillrides (anyone who thinks otherwise about the skill part more than likely sucked at this part),  massive siege warfare where you fight 50 VS 50, 100 VS 100, where the game feels like a game of starcraft, but from the perspective of a zealot ( perfect example, each one of those spells individually aimed, the target called) for control over resources, dominance over land, than this game is for you. There's more to DF than just this ofc, but this is the part I found most enjoyable.

Just don't get mad when nobody plays DF:UW.

Inlor

Originally posted by Falesh

 

DF:UW will improve on Darkfall in many ways, but we should not paint a false picture of what Darkfall was.

 

Thank you for clearing this up! I will definitely give DF:UW a try! 

Jupsto

I wouldn't really call darkfall a true sandbox either, but its no way a themepark. my dream mmo is a sandbox, but no current sandboxes come close to cutting it. And when darkfall has a decent population its more fun than any other current game.

Falesh

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Just don't get mad when nobody plays DF:UW.

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It's just one post, don't go to the other extreme and condemn a game because of some rude post. There are rude posters in every community, if you don't like them then ignore them.

FlawSGI

Originally posted by Falesh

 

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Just don't get mad when nobody plays DF:UW.

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It's just one post, don't go to the other extreme and condemn a game because of some rude post. There are rude posters in every community, if you don't like them then ignore them.

As much as I tend to disagree with Frodo, I feel the need to point out that I think his one liner response was directed at the way the game is described and the way people are discussing this aspect of the game rather than the OP's views and less than polite way of talking down to anyone who questions the PvP aspects of the game itself. I feel that for a game to do well it has to give  over on some things and give different type of players things to do rather than alientating these type of players all together. It's that or lower your standards of success. While I don't feel the way the OP does regarding calling anyone who doesn't want full loot PvP and such as a carebear, I do agree that if you have a problem with it you should look elsewhere. I very much agree with Frodo that if this is your stance towards others that don't like the direction, don't cry when your game is dying.