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ONLY 4 or 5 classes on release! Say it isn't so........
naezgul
Member Posts: 374
You definitely would have........
Tank
Healer
So what would you want the other two or three classes to be? And is this going to be enough to really feel "right".
Comments
What happens when you log off your characters????.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
Dark Age of Camelot
Since this is an RvR game, I would dare to question even the tank.
Why not start with a healer, a range dd and an melee dd? I know we all would miss some classes ( my main was a mind-sorcerer ).
But hey, if this means that the game at launch has a real solid gameplay and is fun to play, why not adding multiple meaningful classes later on? With meaningful I want to say classes which do not something other classes can do already.
MMO's played so far:
UO,EQ,DAOC,EQ2,GW,ROM,WOW,WAR,AOC,LOTRO,RIFT,TSW,GW2,POE
Looking forward to: Camelot Unchained, Star Citizen
Tank brings a hard to kill toon, usually protection aspects (ie. Guard) ... staggers/stuns/roots. I think they are a great addition to most teams honestly. In the right situation, they can swap over to a more offensive style - two handed specs or dual wield. Some classes we have seen in the past like SKs/Pally bring auras to buff groups which can be well suited to the right teams.
Vymm
I would be fine with four or five WELL CHOSEN classes on start, sort of.......
They would need to show restraint and not make them all into GW2 style toons, that pretty much makes all the classes the same with minor differences.
I can free you from the fear that you will get classes which have only minor differences. MJ statet in an early Foundation Principle that classes will have roles they have to fulfill. Not every class can heal or ressurrect for example.
Which I think is a good thing. I like to play GW2, but I miss the differgence of the classes, too.
MMO's played so far:
UO,EQ,DAOC,EQ2,GW,ROM,WOW,WAR,AOC,LOTRO,RIFT,TSW,GW2,POE
Looking forward to: Camelot Unchained, Star Citizen
IM SO OVER COOKIE CUTTER.
One of my most favorite parts about DAOC was how unique each realms classes were. I believe it was the "realm Pride" article that stated how players should feel akin to their realm. Maybe it was some of the comments from players, regardless I believe it to be true.
How can you have realm pride when each realm has the same classes albeit with different pixels to show them off. It comes down to p***** in a few players cheerios who can;t handle the fact that they have been beaten. There is always an excuse whether its population, server imbalance, lag, gear or something else these people will find the excuse and exploit it. But you can't develop a game for these people because they are also the ones who leave after 30 days.
IMO each realm should have their own set of unique classes that perform their own unique roles. Keep to the trinity and Rock paper scissors but approach it differently for each realm by looking at the lore.
A quick example would be having 5 classes, 4 main trinity and a hybrid for each realm.
(using old school DAOC names lol)
Albion
Armsman / Mercenary / Friar / Wizard / Paladin or Scout
Midgard
Warrior / Berserker / Shaman / Runemaster / Savage or Shadowblade
Hibernia
Hero / Blademaster / Druid / Eldritch / Warden or Nightshade
Depending on the realm their hybrid or 5th class would in some way be related to the realm. Maybe a Valkriye for Vikings or another magic user for Hibernia. They would each need to perform a similar role of course whether DPS or off tank etc.
Just a few brief examples but each of these classes had their own unique ability/weapons etc and way to perform their role. I do not believe MMOs should stray from this. While mainstream MMOs may not have the development time with PVE/end game etc to deal with a game solely focused on RvR SHOULD be able to balance this.
My 2 cents
I'm really hoping 6 for this reason
Healer
2 caster type
2 melee type
stealth ( archer spec & melee spec options but 1 assassin scout class )
With those, you can mix in.. speed / CC / debuffers / aoe spec etc. And hopefully they can do it like daoc where all 3 realms have different types of speed classes ( ie. hib bard, mid skald etc. ) Gives more of a unique feel tot he realm instead of all speed classes being melee based. To do this you have to have 2 options for melee / caster so you can still have a focus damage caster / melee.
I would like to see 7, to throw in a special class that defines the realms : Albion - paladin type, TNN - extra caster type, mid - extra melee type
Ozek - DAOC
Niix - Other games that sucked
I very much agree. This kind of asynchronicity seems to be what makes games with 3 factions great (at least for DAoC and Starcraft, I can't think of any others right now).
In my opinion, all classes should be hybrids of the following roles:
-Tank
-Damage dealer
-Healer
-Crowd controller
-Buffer/Debuffer
-Stealther (if the game is to have stealth)
Mix 2 or 3 of these roles at a time when making classes to avoid classes being too boring. And most importantly, change the formula for each realm.
As an example, I loved how the main crowd controllers in DAoC worked so differently.
Alb Sorcerers were CC, debuffers and damage dealers, and had longer range and wider radius.
Mid Healers were CC, Healers and buffers, and had a wider array of insta CC.
Hib Bards were CC, buffers and healers, and had instan-amnesia to interrupt enemies casting.
All worked differently, but all had their advantages and disadvantages to winning the "mez battle" in the start of every fight. I loved this. Sure, the other 2 realms always had it easier, but that's how it'll always be
(Edit)
To add upon my post, and just to draw more examples from DAoC, I would pick classes that filled their realms roles differently, and that added to the overall feel of the realm.
For instance, if I only got to pick 4 classes for each realm, I would go with 3 melee damage dealers in Midgard, 3 magicians in Hibernia, and a 2/2 balance in Albion. Here's how that might look:
Midgard:
- Skald (dps/buffs)
- Berserkers (melee dps)
- Warrior/Huscarl (tank)
- Runemasters (healers and crowd controllers)
Hibernia:
- Eldritch (caster dps)
- Enchanter (caster dps, crowd control)
- Druid (healing, buffs)
- Champion (tank)
Albion:
- Cleric (healing, caster dps)
- Armsman/Knight (tank)
- Minstrel (melee dps, crowd control)
- Wizard (caster dps, buffs)
Unique combinations of roles for each realm, and as iconic classes as possible.
MJ has already stated that classes won't be mirrored across realms. An Arthurian tank (Knight?) will be different than a Viking Warrior.
Right now we are at Tank, DPS (caster), Healer, and Support. Some kind of Scout or Rogue might also make it. That's about all we know.
Keep in mind that even though this is a small number, MJ has said that all classes are going to be distinct, there will be ways to specialize and differentiate your character from another of the same class.
So four to five classes, each with (conservative estimate) three different styles of basic build equals twelve to fifteen classes in effect.
I can't wait for the inevitable char planner!
http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/PerfArt
Hybridizing=bad, sorry but keep the classes relatively clean......casting tanks....no thank you
Agreed!
Now MJ had developed two different ways.
In DAOC you started as a starter class and choose your advanced profession.
In Warhammer you started as the class of choice.
So advanced classes may still be in effect turning 5 classes into a potential odf 10-15 unique advanced classes. But this also leaves little room for customization unless you make a choice and your stuck with it. Still I don't believe there is any sort of confirmation on this.
Why is it bad there is no PvE? If they can perform a vital role in the group to kill people or heal etc etc they are just as viable.
I don't mean an Eldritch in plate armor but a Paladin was just awesome alone and in a group but could get wrecked by certain classes. Viable IMO.
That's nonsense. What is your reasoning? Is this just because hybrids in DAoC didn't always work out well?
In my opinion hybrids are a must to make characters interesting, and fun to play. Fill only one role, and your class becomes stale. The more potential, the more fun. Easy to learn, hard to master is a good rule to follow.
MJ has indeed stated that there are no prestige classes, but that the way you level will specialize your skills within your profession. I didnt meam fifteen literal classes... Just builds. And it was just a guesstimate hehe.
He said, on an interview on this very site, that once you pick a class, you are that class.
At least that's how he feels now.
http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/PerfArt
I'm fine with almost all of daoc classes. I took hybridizing as the classes ala GW2.
Ah thank you for the clarification!
And the 15 was more my own maths than a reference but I see what you are saying. I personally am happy about this. I never liked being able to respec your class. Consequence needs to make a comeback in some form.
And no prestige classes is also OK by me.
http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/PerfArt
hmm you guys would like to have almost all classes from start and maybe a new 2 or 3 in the long run, I always find holding classes back more a annoyance, since I don't like to make several chars, and if lets say I like paladins and knights calsses or gunners, they launch only 5 basics classes then in 3 months they make more classes let's say a paladin kind, I would not be that happy to ahve to reroll again.
also if for example I know tey will launch a new class in 3 months after I pretty much would no play till that class is out but by then I can forgot andor be too busy with another game to care to try.
so you guys don't think its better have all classes out now tehn keep making clsses over the time?
Vague...
what does this constitute?
which, if any of daoc classes were...static/generic?
The only thing that worries me about fewer classes with very specific roles, very distinct set of skills etc, is that when the time comes to add new classes, is that those new ones might be harder to create, and keep them unique.
Eventually there would have to be more "mirror effect" between realms, although you can have hybrid classes i.e. a new viking hybrid class could end up having the abilities of lets say a tank in arthurians and caster in TDD.
There's only so much you can invent / create as new skills or spells, eventually, they'd have to be mirrored to get new classes.
Just a thought.
Bowbow (kob hunter) Infecto (kob cave shammy) and Thurka (troll warrior) on Merlin/Midgard DAoC
Thurka on WAR
The more specific the rolls, the EASIER it is going to be to create new classes......
the more hybridized they are the more they will all seem alike.
no offense but, i hope this is exactly the direction MJ does NOT take. this type of flexibility in spec is what many of us have come to hate in all of the new MMO genre. skill respec should be available for your tune, but at large cost/time sink. Similar to DAOC classic/si with respec stones from the dragon/sidi dungeons.
As for classes: I vote 6 initial types
- Healer
- Ranged DPS / Utility / minimal CCer
- Melee DPS / Tank / Disruptor
- Speed Class / CCer / Disruptor
- Pure Utility (buff, debuff, some cc, possibly mana battery / auras / resists )
- Stealther / Scout
None. I loved daoc's classes. And what I meant is that MJ said that specialization within your class was possible.
http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/PerfArt
Yup, it's called making a new main and putting the old one on the alt shelf!
I thought I started playing daoc pretty early in the game. I know ws before SI, I think that was first expansion.
made a scout, when stealth was tough, and he was SB fodder.
Ok, question is ....how many classes on release per realm? Where there any classes added before an "expansion".
and if anyone really knows...what were original classes.