Originally posted by ScriptZ In an MMO world I doubt something like the 1k NPCS/PCS would work as well as that the closest thing I can think of in an MMO is Aion where you have some NPCS on the screen fighting with players in a siege type fight for a castle, but even that was a bit laggy.
I think technology is not a problem anymore,im just wondering if people really want to separate PvP from PvE completely.
Like somehow PvP is bad or PvE is bad ,but what if there is a way to do it "right"
is there ?
I am curtious to know how you think that technology is not a problem to create something like that?
It's done in just a few singleplayer games, what makes you think it's possible with today's tech to do this in a MMORPG.
Sure we are seeing tech evolve by seeing more and more people able to play online in the same area close together. But also that has it's limited untill you'll see players getting performance issue.
But to answer your OP. Sure I would love to see something like that happen, but I am sure tech. isn't ready yet.
Cant really give you accurate answer but if theres 1000-3000? ship battles in EVE and how old is that technology.
Originally posted by ScriptZ In an MMO world I doubt something like the 1k NPCS/PCS would work as well as that the closest thing I can think of in an MMO is Aion where you have some NPCS on the screen fighting with players in a siege type fight for a castle, but even that was a bit laggy.
I think technology is not a problem anymore,im just wondering if people really want to separate PvP from PvE completely.
Like somehow PvP is bad or PvE is bad ,but what if there is a way to do it "right"
is there ?
I am curtious to know how you think that technology is not a problem to create something like that?
It's done in just a few singleplayer games, what makes you think it's possible with today's tech to do this in a MMORPG.
Sure we are seeing tech evolve by seeing more and more people able to play online in the same area close together. But also that has it's limited untill you'll see players getting performance issue.
But to answer your OP. Sure I would love to see something like that happen, but I am sure tech. isn't ready yet.
There is, like you say, a big difference between single/multi player games that have heavuly scripted events and a dynamic MMO battle. You will need massive ammounts of calculations when the event is no longer scripted.
And if it was so heavily scripted in an MMO I would not want to touch it.
There is, like you say, a big difference between single/multi player games that have heavuly scripted events and a dynamic MMO battle. You will need massive ammounts of calculations when the event is no longer scripted.
And if it was so heavily scripted in an MMO I would not want to touch it.
I would much prefer to have a heavily scripted events in an MMO. I have yet to see a big dynamic battle done well in a PvE MMO. The only big dynamic battle that works is pvp.
Player freedom seems like a factor -- for example, War3 made it almost a requirement to farm PVE mobs before you got to play RTS PVP against someone, and played significantly worse than LOL where PVE and PVP are options at virtually every point in the game (although one might successfully argue that at the highest tiers of play early PVP is a much riskier path than farming CS all day.)
The density of actual PVP is also a major factor for players like myself. When I want to PVP I want to PVP! Some "PVP MMORPGs" involve such a ridiculous amount of time not PVPing that it becomes a bit comical.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Player freedom seems like a factor -- for example, War3 made it almost a requirement to farm PVE mobs before you got to play RTS PVP against someone, and played significantly worse than LOL where PVE and PVP are options at virtually every point in the game (although one might successfully argue that at the highest tiers of play early PVP is a much riskier path than farming CS all day.)
The density of actual PVP is also a major factor for players like myself. When I want to PVP I want to PVP! Some "PVP MMORPGs" involve such a ridiculous amount of time not PVPing that it becomes a bit comical.
hmm theres no cure for that,except this new hip thing "offline" playing,which is ridiculous if you ask me so heres another ridiculous idea.
Offline PvP combat v1.0 player goes offline,avatar stays in game and plays good/bad based on some skill,until killed by death ,can collect exp and stuff
when killed then someone elses avatar takes his place
offline mode possible only when less than 20 players in battle
what a mess i must say hehee,but offline playing seems to be a new cool thing so here it goes.
Would it make a difference if player does not know if theres a real player controlling the avatar ?
to me it does right away,maybe could give some satisfaction to kill someones avatar but somehow it just doesnt feel right.
and something for PvE side i just cant think right now,edit maybe something like theres on Age of Wushu.
but hey this is KUF2 based MMORPG fight ,theres allways more than 200 players online,so it wont happen.
Originally posted by grvmpybear Didn't Aion already do PvPvE?
yeah on the sieging area u can be attacked by the balaur (the npc faction) and they can also take over fortresses. but they dont form alliances with other factions.
hmm theres no cure for that,except this new hip thing "offline" playing,which is ridiculous if you ask me so heres another ridiculous idea.
Offline PvP combat v1.0 player goes offline,avatar stays in game and plays good/bad based on some skill,until killed by death ,can collect exp and stuff
when killed then someone elses avatar takes his place
offline mode possible only when less than 20 players in battle
what a mess i must say hehee,but offline playing seems to be a new cool thing so here it goes.
Would it make a difference if player does not know if theres a real player controlling the avatar ?
to me it does right away,maybe could give some satisfaction to kill someones avatar but somehow it just doesnt feel right.
and something for PvE side i just cant think right now,edit maybe something like theres on Age of Wushu.
but hey this is KUF2 based MMORPG fight ,theres allways more than 200 players online,so it wont happen.
Well that's not really "offline PVP" so much as bots taking over offline players, and is sort of separate from the conversation at hand (every PVP game tends to have some way of handling offline players, even if the usual way is to just let them go offline and maybe auto-teambalance.)
By density I really meant more like the frequency of PVP-related decisions compared with other stuff. In many "PVP" MMORPGs there are giant holes of downtime between PVP fights, which is actually less PVP than a game like WOW where you can probably spend most of your time actually PVPing, or a pure PVP game like non-MMORPGs where you can literally spent 99% of your time PVPing.
Personally I don't hold a high opinion of zerg-PVP MMORPGs since none of them control for even teams, so they largely devolve into "bring more friends 2 win", which is pretty shallow PVP. With population limits, large-scale PVP can avoid this (and even turn population management into a fantastic layer of strategy; managing where your players went was great in Planetside 1.) Large scale PVP isn't even really a requirement for PvEvP though, as indicated by my earlier mention of LoL, but either can be fun with population limits.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Comments
Cant really give you accurate answer but if theres 1000-3000? ship battles in EVE and how old is that technology.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=TLqb-m1ZZUA
We really should see some ideas from developers today that we are getting something like on that KUF2 video.
Let's internet
There is, like you say, a big difference between single/multi player games that have heavuly scripted events and a dynamic MMO battle. You will need massive ammounts of calculations when the event is no longer scripted.
And if it was so heavily scripted in an MMO I would not want to touch it.
I would much prefer to have a heavily scripted events in an MMO. I have yet to see a big dynamic battle done well in a PvE MMO. The only big dynamic battle that works is pvp.
It really depends on the implementation.
Player freedom seems like a factor -- for example, War3 made it almost a requirement to farm PVE mobs before you got to play RTS PVP against someone, and played significantly worse than LOL where PVE and PVP are options at virtually every point in the game (although one might successfully argue that at the highest tiers of play early PVP is a much riskier path than farming CS all day.)
The density of actual PVP is also a major factor for players like myself. When I want to PVP I want to PVP! Some "PVP MMORPGs" involve such a ridiculous amount of time not PVPing that it becomes a bit comical.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
hmm theres no cure for that,except this new hip thing "offline" playing,which is ridiculous if you ask me so heres another ridiculous idea.
Offline PvP combat v1.0
player goes offline,avatar stays in game and plays good/bad based on some skill,until killed by death ,can collect exp and stuff
when killed then someone elses avatar takes his place
offline mode possible only when less than 20 players in battle
what a mess i must say hehee,but offline playing seems to be a new cool thing so here it goes.
Would it make a difference if player does not know if theres a real player controlling the avatar ?
to me it does right away,maybe could give some satisfaction to kill someones avatar but somehow it just doesnt feel right.
and something for PvE side i just cant think right now,edit maybe something like theres on Age of Wushu.
but hey this is KUF2 based MMORPG fight ,theres allways more than 200 players online,so it wont happen.
Let's internet
yeah on the sieging area u can be attacked by the balaur (the npc faction) and they can also take over fortresses. but they dont form alliances with other factions.
Well that's not really "offline PVP" so much as bots taking over offline players, and is sort of separate from the conversation at hand (every PVP game tends to have some way of handling offline players, even if the usual way is to just let them go offline and maybe auto-teambalance.)
By density I really meant more like the frequency of PVP-related decisions compared with other stuff. In many "PVP" MMORPGs there are giant holes of downtime between PVP fights, which is actually less PVP than a game like WOW where you can probably spend most of your time actually PVPing, or a pure PVP game like non-MMORPGs where you can literally spent 99% of your time PVPing.
Personally I don't hold a high opinion of zerg-PVP MMORPGs since none of them control for even teams, so they largely devolve into "bring more friends 2 win", which is pretty shallow PVP. With population limits, large-scale PVP can avoid this (and even turn population management into a fantastic layer of strategy; managing where your players went was great in Planetside 1.) Large scale PVP isn't even really a requirement for PvEvP though, as indicated by my earlier mention of LoL, but either can be fun with population limits.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver