from proper non bias website that will do same test for each card, and 290x is a bit faster than 780ti when both are overclocked , game performance always differ from title to title but anyone that have been following benchmarks knows that, as some titles prefers ati some nvidia
But if you ask me both cards are sham and waste of money, wait for new generation and not for old generation refreshes just before new consoles coming out, know how well console games performed on pc in the past, those 2 cards will probably struggle , so waiting a bit would be smart choice
from proper non bias website that will do same test for each card, and 290x is a bit faster than 780ti when both are overclocked , game performance always differ from title to title but anyone that have been following benchmarks knows that, as some titles prefers ati some nvidia
But if you ask me both cards are sham and waste of money, wait for new generation and not for old generation refreshes just before new consoles coming out, know how well console games performed on pc in the past, those 2 cards will probably struggle , so waiting a bit would be smart choice
When asus msi xfx club2d and also those companys come with 2 fans and prolly more silent why should i wait another year for next generation if 290 prolly cost 350 euros YES YOU REA IT RIGHT top end card for only 350 OC it and be same as 780ti that cost 650 EUROS?
I got my 7970 the moment it was launched im not waiting for another year which i don't know shit what product will come from AMD or NVIDIA while i can have card thats as fast as titan if OC but cost almost nothing hehe.
To some of posters here who are fanbois of nvidia pls dont give false information about performance of 290s it looks cheap, most major reviewers that realy count show different bench then you claim and its obvious most 3dmarkscores or firestrikes DONT LIE.
Im also comapare it to my 7970 and 290 is so much faster its valid to buy a new card i dont realy care what nvidia have 290 is a huge leap forward from 7970.
350 euros more for bit faster NO THX.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77 CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now)) MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB PSU:Corsair AX1200i OS:Windows 10 64bit
Originally posted by vission You could have at least tried to proofread your post before submitting it. It's just a chore to read otherwise. Mine may not be perfect but they are at least easy to understand. Also, don't make additional posts covering the same thing.
Ill bet if someone makes more post about nvidia you would not complain.
Plus its not the same i state facts on a importend videocard released which is a real new card other topic was a gues or announcement topic.
Ever hear of spell check? It is a chore to read your posts. Proof read and at least spell correctly please.
Originally posted by vission You could have at least tried to proofread your post before submitting it. It's just a chore to read otherwise. Mine may not be perfect but they are at least easy to understand. Also, don't make additional posts covering the same thing.
Ill bet if someone makes more post about nvidia you would not complain.
Plus its not the same i state facts on a importend videocard released which is a real new card other topic was a gues or announcement topic.
Ever hear of spell check? It is a chore to read your posts. Proof read and at least spell correctly please.
But you still understood what he/she was saying, forum spelling nazi's are worse than the people they are complaining about.
One thing to keep in mind as more and more retail versions of the AMD R9 290X and 290 become available is a serious issue with consistency. There have been a number of cases showing an average of nearly 300Mhz difference in performance compared to those reviewed by the majority sites prior to the official release. We always have to deal with the silicon lottery but that seems a bit extreme. AMD claims it's merely a software issue and will be fixed with a driver update, one can only hope that is the case.
EDIT: This might also explain why TTL had such drastically different results for the card vs other major review sites. He may have simply received one of these lesser quality boards.
Originally posted by Kazuhiro I used to use ATI cards, from the x9700xtx to the 1680, then I got a 670 nvidia card as it was the best at the time, and I'm not sure I can ever go back to ATI cards now. (AMD now technically.) ATI may be cheaper, much cheaper in fact. But your getting a knockoff GPU basically. I can't even begin to describe how much better Nvidia drivers are, or the fact that they just run with less issues.
I remember that for Skyrim I bought a top of the line ATI card for the game, and had so many damn issues with it, from frame-skipping, to stutters, and worse. Ended up getting a Nvidia card some time later that was only marginnaly more powerful, and the game ran like a dream. (And Skyrim is a ATI/AMD advertised game fyi.) In short, it seems like you buy a ATI/AMD card when you can't afford an NVIDIA card.
The ATI/AMD card will always have some major drawback to balance out it's lower price. (In the case of the card your mentioning, it will melt a hole through your pc, through your desk, then through the floor, and then finnaly encase itself in molten stone beneath the earth.) So in the end, I just look at ATI/AMD cards are cheaper/lower tier GPUs.
You need to come into the modern age. Here we go with the driver argument again... that's how you know someone is uninformed. And I didn't think we'd see the "poor people" argument again, that was a surprise from left field. Whatever it takes to justify paying the nVidia tax and make yourself feel better...
Originally posted by Siveria Last I checked it took 4 of these ati cards to match the power of 2 titans, so I don't think it beats it at all. It does not even match the titan, it takes 2 of these ati cards to just barely be better than 1 titan, so I don't see how its better for half the price if it takes 2 to match the nvidia card.
And someone who hasn't read any of the reviews, obviously. It's almost like nVidia paid a bunch of people to come over here on this thread and post a bunch of BS - except they don't have to pay them, they just do it of their on volition for some reason.
Originally posted by miguksaram One thing to keep in mind as more and more retail versions of the AMD R9 290X and 290 become available is a serious issue with consistency. There have been a number of cases showing an average of nearly 300Mhz difference in performance compared to those reviewed by the majority sites prior to the official release. We always have to deal with the silicon lottery but that seems a bit extreme. AMD claims it's merely a software issue and will be fixed with a driver update, one can only hope that is the case.
I saw something about this - the word now is that the reference fan apparently wasn't spinning at the proper RPM per voltage, and the firmware was going to static voltages rather than actually monitoring the fan RPM. Both are problems. Supposedly the driver update is in the lastest beta driver, we shall see. At least it's not as bad as the 590 driver problem, for those readers who are still hung up on the "better drivers" argument and want to keep score.
Originally posted by CowboyHat Really tired of the bad driver's excuse. I have had multiple ATI cards and nvidia cards and I have not had a driver problem with any of them.
I feel like this who thread is a Apple vs. PC discussion....
Its always one side only who dig up old cow thats been death for long time.
Funny thing is in past few years ive seen complains MANYTIMES from other camp who had problems with hardware and drivers in some major games.
Also i dont understand whole hatred EVERYBODY benefit if both doing well.
If AMD loses believe me nvidia loses also competitions hold them sharp plus it benefit all gamers with prices.
You would never have suddenly a videocard from nvidia for 200 or 300 dollars cheaper if AMD not release there cards at good price.
P.S Are you apple fan? i would never mention apple first ...just kidding:P
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77 CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now)) MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB PSU:Corsair AX1200i OS:Windows 10 64bit
Originally posted by Sanguinelust Originally posted by ClassicstarOriginally posted by vissionYou could have at least tried to proofread your post before submitting it. It's just a chore to read otherwise. Mine may not be perfect but they are at least easy to understand. Also, don't make additional posts covering the same thing.
Ill bet if someone makes more post about nvidia you would not complain.Plus its not the same i state facts on a importend videocard released which is a real new card other topic was a gues or announcement topic.Ever hear of spell check? It is a chore to read your posts. Proof read and at least spell correctly please.
Sorry about that to lazy ignore my reply's problem solved.
But i agree my english is terible.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77 CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now)) MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB PSU:Corsair AX1200i OS:Windows 10 64bit
Originally posted by CowboyHat Really tired of the bad driver's excuse. I have had multiple ATI cards and nvidia cards and I have not had a driver problem with any of them.
I feel like this who thread is a Apple vs. PC discussion....
Its always one side only who dig up old cow thats been death for long time.
Funny thing is in past few years ive seen complains MANYTIMES from other camp who had problems with hardware and drivers in some major games.
Also i dont understand whole hatred EVERYBODY benefit if both doing well.
If AMD loses believe me nvidia loses also competitions hold them sharp plus it benefit all gamers with prices.
You would never have suddenly a videocard from nvidia for 200 or 300 dollars cheaper if AMD not release there cards at good price.
P.S Are you apple fan? i would never mention apple first ...just kidding:P
I'm far from being an Apple fan, and probably never will be. You are correct in stressing the importance of competition. That being said it is sort of disappointing to see the lack of a response from nvidia. The price drops announced thus far can hardly be considered competitive imo.
I also find grammar nazis irritating. People often forget that English is not the first language of many people.
You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.
Originally posted by miguksaram One thing to keep in mind as more and more retail versions of the AMD R9 290X and 290 become available is a serious issue with consistency. There have been a number of cases showing an average of nearly 300Mhz difference in performance compared to those reviewed by the majority sites prior to the official release. We always have to deal with the silicon lottery but that seems a bit extreme. AMD claims it's merely a software issue and will be fixed with a driver update, one can only hope that is the case.
I saw something about this - the word now is that the reference fan apparently wasn't spinning at the proper RPM per voltage, and the firmware was going to static voltages rather than actually monitoring the fan RPM. Both are problems. Supposedly the driver update is in the lastest beta driver, we shall see. At least it's not as bad as the 590 driver problem, for those readers who are still hung up on the "better drivers" argument and want to keep score.
I don't believe that it's purely a driver problem. It's a problem of flawed hardware, with a cooler that isn't adequate to the card. There are trade-offs between heat and noise, and AMD is trying to have the best of both worlds, getting people to focus on noise when it's clocked down and getting people to focus on performance when it's clocked up and noisier.
Still, it's not nearly as bad as the GTX 590 that you bring up; we didn't see a bunch of cards that didn't survive the review, as we did with the GTX 590. It's also fixable by aftermarket cards with better coolers; the problem with the GTX 590 is that an honest TDP in the ballpark of 450 W would have overwhelmed the better aftermarket coolers, too.
Originally posted by miguksaram One thing to keep in mind as more and more retail versions of the AMD R9 290X and 290 become available is a serious issue with consistency. There have been a number of cases showing an average of nearly 300Mhz difference in performance compared to those reviewed by the majority sites prior to the official release. We always have to deal with the silicon lottery but that seems a bit extreme. AMD claims it's merely a software issue and will be fixed with a driver update, one can only hope that is the case.
I saw something about this - the word now is that the reference fan apparently wasn't spinning at the proper RPM per voltage, and the firmware was going to static voltages rather than actually monitoring the fan RPM. Both are problems. Supposedly the driver update is in the lastest beta driver, we shall see. At least it's not as bad as the 590 driver problem, for those readers who are still hung up on the "better drivers" argument and want to keep score.
I don't believe that it's purely a driver problem. It's a problem of flawed hardware, with a cooler that isn't adequate to the card. There are trade-offs between heat and noise, and AMD is trying to have the best of both worlds, getting people to focus on noise when it's clocked down and getting people to focus on performance when it's clocked up and noisier.
Still, it's not nearly as bad as the GTX 590 that you bring up; we didn't see a bunch of cards that didn't survive the review, as we did with the GTX 590. It's also fixable by aftermarket cards with better coolers; the problem with the GTX 590 is that an honest TDP in the ballpark of 450 W would have overwhelmed the better aftermarket coolers, too.
Purchasing an AMD card IMO can be a gamble. There can be;
a) heat issues
b) cheap assembly issues
c) compatibility problems with games
d) delayed driver updates for games and bugs (delayed compared to Nvidia releases)
Nvidia for the time being (and I don't see this changing anytime soon) is the safer option if you don't want a headache after assembling a new Rig. I really don't give a flying turd if AMD cards these days are 7.69% faster...every card i've ever purchased from AMD par the 9800Pro had a cheaper build quality compared to it's Nvidia rival card.....this is the reason to me that they are cheaper...they have quality assurance issues. It is more common for people to have problems with AMD cards than Nvidia...all you gotta do is read.
I'll admit though....the 9800Pro back in the day was F legendary.
i'll always feel safer overclocking a nvidia card...
edit: Crossfire using PCI bus is great. If it does indeed net much performance, expect Nvidia to follow suit. My points still stand though.
You get what you pay for. Especially when it comes to GPU. I run both ATI and nVidia in multiple boxes, only run into problems when dealing with ATI unfortunately.
They're still trying to push but I don't think ATI is there just yet, I give them a swift handshake for not giving up.
I had a long post but decided the easy way is to just say keyword>>Benchmarks.
Look over the past 30 years,we should have learned a lot about marketing hype.I personally used to buy new PC stuff every 12-18 months,i NEVER saw the type of numbers advertised.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
You get what you pay for. Especially when it comes to GPU. I run both ATI and nVidia in multiple boxes, only run into problems when dealing with ATI unfortunately.
They're still trying to push but I don't think ATI is there just yet, I give them a swift handshake for not giving up.
It has been that way since the two began operations.I have learned my lesson over the years,Intel and Nvidia offer the best hardware,others are usually cheaper and for good reason,as stated "you get what you pay for".
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
After reviewing several benchmarks and determining my price point for my new build, I went with the r9 290. Will let you folks know if I happen to have any issues, as it stands I expect performance comparable to a 780 with the normal fluctuations, at a reduced price. If heat becomes an issue I'll remedy it, but I suspect that it will be fine. Now if only AMD had a chip to compete with Intel's ; love rotating between intel and amd each build.
Originally posted by nerovipus32 You could buy a ps4 and a couple of games for that price.
Yea, I will be buying PS4 instead of buying a new PC.
Might be buying a new PC a year or 2 later as it is too costly to get a higher spec PC than PS4 / Xbox.
Anyone can advice me whether if a good or bad idea for me to do this?
If you have a decent comp that can play MMOs I say go with the PS4 you get High level graphics in slightly below full HD quality for only $400 bucks plus you get all the amazing Sony exclusives. I say buy PS4 then get a new comp in a year or two from now most big games aside from MMOs will be one the PS4, and even the MMO part may change this gen.
Also on topic with both the PS4 and X1 using an AMD APU and an AMD GPU I see games being far more optimized towards AMD this Gen than they have ever been. I have been hearing NVidia has been pretty pissed at both Microsoft and Sony giving them the cold shoulder. XD
Originally posted by nerovipus32 You could buy a ps4 and a couple of games for that price.
Yea, I will be buying PS4 instead of buying a new PC.
Might be buying a new PC a year or 2 later as it is too costly to get a higher spec PC than PS4 / Xbox.
Anyone can advice me whether if a good or bad idea for me to do this?
If you have a decent comp that can play MMOs I say go with the PS4 you get High level graphics in slightly below full HD quality for only $400 bucks plus you get all the amazing Sony exclusives. I say buy PS4 then get a new comp in a year or two from now most big games aside from MMOs will be one the PS4, and even the MMO part may change this gen.
Or alternatively you can upgrade your computer this year and buy a PS4 next year when it will probably be even cheaper and those exclusives actually exist in some quantity and aren't just unnamed and coming soon.
Comments
http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/61505-amd-radeon-r9-290x/?page=12 290x OC
vs
http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/graphics/62085-nvidia-geforce-gtx-780-ti/?page=11 780ti OC
from proper non bias website that will do same test for each card, and 290x is a bit faster than 780ti when both are overclocked , game performance always differ from title to title but anyone that have been following benchmarks knows that, as some titles prefers ati some nvidia
But if you ask me both cards are sham and waste of money, wait for new generation and not for old generation refreshes just before new consoles coming out, know how well console games performed on pc in the past, those 2 cards will probably struggle , so waiting a bit would be smart choice
When asus msi xfx club2d and also those companys come with 2 fans and prolly more silent why should i wait another year for next generation if 290 prolly cost 350 euros YES YOU REA IT RIGHT top end card for only 350 OC it and be same as 780ti that cost 650 EUROS?
I got my 7970 the moment it was launched im not waiting for another year which i don't know shit what product will come from AMD or NVIDIA while i can have card thats as fast as titan if OC but cost almost nothing hehe.
To some of posters here who are fanbois of nvidia pls dont give false information about performance of 290s it looks cheap, most major reviewers that realy count show different bench then you claim and its obvious most 3dmarkscores or firestrikes DONT LIE.
Im also comapare it to my 7970 and 290 is so much faster its valid to buy a new card i dont realy care what nvidia have 290 is a huge leap forward from 7970.
350 euros more for bit faster NO THX.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77
CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k
GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now))
MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB
PSU:Corsair AX1200i
OS:Windows 10 64bit
So I highly doubt a 7970 suffered with frame skipping on it.
Probably something to do with your drivers. As you point out, gamebryo and its derivatives like the skyrim engine are AMD optimised engines.
Ever hear of spell check? It is a chore to read your posts. Proof read and at least spell correctly please.
But you still understood what he/she was saying, forum spelling nazi's are worse than the people they are complaining about.
One thing to keep in mind as more and more retail versions of the AMD R9 290X and 290 become available is a serious issue with consistency. There have been a number of cases showing an average of nearly 300Mhz difference in performance compared to those reviewed by the majority sites prior to the official release. We always have to deal with the silicon lottery but that seems a bit extreme. AMD claims it's merely a software issue and will be fixed with a driver update, one can only hope that is the case.
EDIT: This might also explain why TTL had such drastically different results for the card vs other major review sites. He may have simply received one of these lesser quality boards.
You need to come into the modern age. Here we go with the driver argument again... that's how you know someone is uninformed. And I didn't think we'd see the "poor people" argument again, that was a surprise from left field. Whatever it takes to justify paying the nVidia tax and make yourself feel better...
And someone who hasn't read any of the reviews, obviously. It's almost like nVidia paid a bunch of people to come over here on this thread and post a bunch of BS - except they don't have to pay them, they just do it of their on volition for some reason.
I saw something about this - the word now is that the reference fan apparently wasn't spinning at the proper RPM per voltage, and the firmware was going to static voltages rather than actually monitoring the fan RPM. Both are problems. Supposedly the driver update is in the lastest beta driver, we shall see. At least it's not as bad as the 590 driver problem, for those readers who are still hung up on the "better drivers" argument and want to keep score.
Really tired of the bad driver's excuse. I have had multiple ATI cards and nvidia cards and I have not had a driver problem with any of them.
I feel like this who thread is a Apple vs. PC discussion....
You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.
Its always one side only who dig up old cow thats been death for long time.
Funny thing is in past few years ive seen complains MANYTIMES from other camp who had problems with hardware and drivers in some major games.
Also i dont understand whole hatred EVERYBODY benefit if both doing well.
If AMD loses believe me nvidia loses also competitions hold them sharp plus it benefit all gamers with prices.
You would never have suddenly a videocard from nvidia for 200 or 300 dollars cheaper if AMD not release there cards at good price.
P.S Are you apple fan? i would never mention apple first ...just kidding:P
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77
CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k
GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now))
MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB
PSU:Corsair AX1200i
OS:Windows 10 64bit
Ever hear of spell check? It is a chore to read your posts. Proof read and at least spell correctly please.
Sorry about that to lazy ignore my reply's problem solved.
But i agree my english is terible.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77
CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k
GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now))
MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB
PSU:Corsair AX1200i
OS:Windows 10 64bit
I'm far from being an Apple fan, and probably never will be. You are correct in stressing the importance of competition. That being said it is sort of disappointing to see the lack of a response from nvidia. The price drops announced thus far can hardly be considered competitive imo.
I also find grammar nazis irritating. People often forget that English is not the first language of many people.
You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.
I don't believe that it's purely a driver problem. It's a problem of flawed hardware, with a cooler that isn't adequate to the card. There are trade-offs between heat and noise, and AMD is trying to have the best of both worlds, getting people to focus on noise when it's clocked down and getting people to focus on performance when it's clocked up and noisier.
Still, it's not nearly as bad as the GTX 590 that you bring up; we didn't see a bunch of cards that didn't survive the review, as we did with the GTX 590. It's also fixable by aftermarket cards with better coolers; the problem with the GTX 590 is that an honest TDP in the ballpark of 450 W would have overwhelmed the better aftermarket coolers, too.
An update to that subject:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-r9-290-driver-fix,3666.html
Yup, exactly what I thought:
They were trying to drive the fan via voltage, rather than going off RPM.
Easy software fix that is done and removes the variability, it's not some wicked hardware flaw in the PCB design or anything.
Crappy reference cooler is still crappy. I agree with their assessment: good chip, wait for a better cooler
Purchasing an AMD card IMO can be a gamble. There can be;
a) heat issues
b) cheap assembly issues
c) compatibility problems with games
d) delayed driver updates for games and bugs (delayed compared to Nvidia releases)
Nvidia for the time being (and I don't see this changing anytime soon) is the safer option if you don't want a headache after assembling a new Rig. I really don't give a flying turd if AMD cards these days are 7.69% faster...every card i've ever purchased from AMD par the 9800Pro had a cheaper build quality compared to it's Nvidia rival card.....this is the reason to me that they are cheaper...they have quality assurance issues. It is more common for people to have problems with AMD cards than Nvidia...all you gotta do is read.
I'll admit though....the 9800Pro back in the day was F legendary.
i'll always feel safer overclocking a nvidia card...
edit: Crossfire using PCI bus is great. If it does indeed net much performance, expect Nvidia to follow suit. My points still stand though.
You get what you pay for. Especially when it comes to GPU. I run both ATI and nVidia in multiple boxes, only run into problems when dealing with ATI unfortunately.
They're still trying to push but I don't think ATI is there just yet, I give them a swift handshake for not giving up.
I had a long post but decided the easy way is to just say keyword>>Benchmarks.
Look over the past 30 years,we should have learned a lot about marketing hype.I personally used to buy new PC stuff every 12-18 months,i NEVER saw the type of numbers advertised.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
It has been that way since the two began operations.I have learned my lesson over the years,Intel and Nvidia offer the best hardware,others are usually cheaper and for good reason,as stated "you get what you pay for".
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Yea, I will be buying PS4 instead of buying a new PC.
Might be buying a new PC a year or 2 later as it is too costly to get a higher spec PC than PS4 / Xbox.
Anyone can advice me whether if a good or bad idea for me to do this?
Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language
If you have a decent comp that can play MMOs I say go with the PS4 you get High level graphics in slightly below full HD quality for only $400 bucks plus you get all the amazing Sony exclusives. I say buy PS4 then get a new comp in a year or two from now most big games aside from MMOs will be one the PS4, and even the MMO part may change this gen.
Also on topic with both the PS4 and X1 using an AMD APU and an AMD GPU I see games being far more optimized towards AMD this Gen than they have ever been. I have been hearing NVidia has been pretty pissed at both Microsoft and Sony giving them the cold shoulder. XD
Or alternatively you can upgrade your computer this year and buy a PS4 next year when it will probably be even cheaper and those exclusives actually exist in some quantity and aren't just unnamed and coming soon.