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Chatbubbles mod?

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Comments

  • HoofzHoofz Member Posts: 12
    For me i would have always felt having to look at a chat window ruins immersion for me.  I'd rather see who is saying what from where as if i'm actually hearing it.

    Playing: D3-RoS, ESO, part-time WoW
    Played: Defiance, FF:RR, Tera, Ultima Online, GW2, EQ1, Diablo1-3.

  • KnotwoodKnotwood Member CommonPosts: 1,103

    I can see chat bubbles for party and say talk.

    -only because you say something in say chat and someone runs of without ever knowing you said anything to them.

     

    I cannot see chat bubbles for NPC's

    -Voice overs are my primary wants for npc chat.

     

  • BadOrbBadOrb Member UncommonPosts: 791
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Originally posted by M0rbid
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Originally posted by M0rbid
    Originally posted by Moar61
     I really don't understand why they haven't given us the option yet. It was one of the highest discussed thing in the beta forums, and all they asked for was the option to turn them on. I'm actually neutral, but I think I might actually like them. 

    I keep reading that the ESO engine is based on the Hero Engine....

     

    If that is true, it may be the same problem as SWTOR has, in that the engine cannot support chat bubbles because it kills the frame rate so much the game becomes unplayable. That is the reason that chat bubbles were in SWTOR originally but were cut before launch.

    No its not...  they started out with the HERO engine in early release...while developing their own engine from scratch... after about a year most of the Hero engine got replaced by their own inhouse developed code-...

     

    However, we will never know how much of the Hero engine secretly made their way into their own engine.  

    The point I am making is that SWTOR's engine is, at it's heart, derived from the Hero Engine. SWTOR has never been able to support chat bubbles without making the game unplayable.

     

    If, as I have read, ESO's engine is also derived from the Hero Engine, perhaps there is something inherent to the Hero Engine that just cannot cut where chat bubbles are concerned.

     

    If so, I fear we may never see them in ESO, just like we will never see them in SWTOR.

     

    I am not convinced this should be the case though, I mean SWG had chat bubbles like 10 years ago...it can't be THAT difficult or demanding on the engine....

    Engines are there to be improved...  If they agree with us chatbubbles are important, the engine Hero or no hero will be upgraded to support them

    Well the nameplates above characters and NPC's ( companions ) heads was also lagging the engine out and they fixed those and yes they are practically the same thing as chat bubbles ( I'm talking SWTOR and hero engine here ). I do believe that the team that fixed the nameplates have now either been sacked or moved on , hence how they can't fix a lot of old bugs and/or let us have our ships as our player housing. So no the hero engine can handle it but the new dev's cannot.

    As for ESO having chat bubbles , well it was the decider for me , in not getting the game , I was going to suggest my ES fanboy friend to get it with me.

    Cheers,

    BadOrb.

    PSO 4 years , EQOA 4 months , PSU 7 years , SWTOR launch ongoing , PSO2 SEA launch ongoing , Destiny 360 launch ongoing.
    "SWG was not fun. Let it go buddy." quote from iiNoSkillzii 10/18/13
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  • M0rbidM0rbid Member Posts: 60
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Moar61
     I really don't understand why they haven't given us the option yet. It was one of the highest discussed thing in the beta forums, and all they asked for was the option to turn them on. I'm actually neutral, but I think I might actually like them. 

    I've seen this enough times now that I feel compelled to chime in. So, despite what apparently a whole lot of people seem to believe, game development doesn't involve flipping switches to turn things on. There isn't some secret chat bubble option that ZOS can just turn on. Any feature in game development requires time, resources, and money, all of which are finite. This means that even if a developer wants to do something, it has to be prioritized.

    Maybe they DO want to do chat bubbles (personal opinion: highly unlikely), but it's #50 on the list of things they need or want to get done. It's also possible that they feel chat bubbles simply don't fit the game. And yet another possibility is that they present technical issues (games are complicated).

    My point is that it's not as simple as people think to 'just add chat bubbles' or 'just add a minimap'. Game development involves making choices based on a whole lot of variables.

    I don't think anyone here doubts the complexity associated with adding any feature to a codebase the size of an mmorpg. I certainly doubt anyone actually thinks this is a case of "flipping a switch". Posters are simply speaking figuratively here.

     

    I think the point is that chat bubbles have been a requested feature for a long time. Given that length of time, Zeni have had ample opportunity to prioritise and allocate resource accordingly. If they have decided that chat bubbles do not sit in line with their vision, they should communicate their stance on this in order that players can set/adjust their expectations accordingly.

     

    That would strike me as the professional thing to do anyway.

     

    Again, if chat bubbles do sit within their vision for the game but are on a "wall of crazy", why not communicate this clearly so that expectations are set appropriately?

     

    With clear communication on the direction of the game, you would not see this question / opinion pop up anywhere near as often and would not feel compelled the chime in....

  • StilerStiler Member Posts: 599

    I do not see how anyone can be against optional chat bubbles.

     

    IMO Chat bubbles are better then the chat "box" we have in most mmo's these days.

     

    UO, SWG, etc it was sooo much easier seeing exactly who said what and everything, on top of this it gives you a sense of local chat.

     

    This is the best thing next to voice chat in game (a la Day z/Rust) where you hear people near you and it gets lower the further away they are until you no longer can hear them.

     

     

  • DibdabsDibdabs Member RarePosts: 3,239
    Originally posted by DeniZg

    I'm wondering why every time chat bubble support in any game is mentioned, there's a squad of haters rushing in, trying to convince everybody how chat bubbles suck and why there shouldn't be chat bubble support in any game ever..

     

    It is a bit strange, all the dislike shown for chat bubbles.  I wouldn't use them, myself, but can't see why it would be a problem to introduce them via the game itself or an addon.  

    If they became an integral part of the game, I'd want an option to turn them off but it's no skin off my nose if people want to use them.  If they were part of an addon, simply don't use the addon and you'll never see them anyway.  

  • WhitebeardsWhitebeards Member Posts: 778
    Originally posted by DeniZg

    I'm wondering why every time chat bubble support in any game is mentioned, there's a squad of haters rushing in, trying to convince everybody how chat bubbles suck and why there shouldn't be chat bubble support in any game ever..

     

    No one was hating till you made that post really. And like already mentioned several times that chat bubbles is something mostly wanted by role players. And majority do not care for role playing or chat bubbles in mmos.

  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Member RarePosts: 9,686
    Originally posted by M0rbid
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Moar61
     I really don't understand why they haven't given us the option yet. It was one of the highest discussed thing in the beta forums, and all they asked for was the option to turn them on. I'm actually neutral, but I think I might actually like them. 

    I've seen this enough times now that I feel compelled to chime in. So, despite what apparently a whole lot of people seem to believe, game development doesn't involve flipping switches to turn things on. There isn't some secret chat bubble option that ZOS can just turn on. Any feature in game development requires time, resources, and money, all of which are finite. This means that even if a developer wants to do something, it has to be prioritized.

    Maybe they DO want to do chat bubbles (personal opinion: highly unlikely), but it's #50 on the list of things they need or want to get done. It's also possible that they feel chat bubbles simply don't fit the game. And yet another possibility is that they present technical issues (games are complicated).

    My point is that it's not as simple as people think to 'just add chat bubbles' or 'just add a minimap'. Game development involves making choices based on a whole lot of variables.

    I don't think anyone here doubts the complexity associated with adding any feature to a codebase the size of an mmorpg. I certainly doubt anyone actually thinks this is a case of "flipping a switch". Posters are simply speaking figuratively here.

     

    I think the point is that chat bubbles have been a requested feature for a long time. Given that length of time, Zeni have had ample opportunity to prioritise and allocate resource accordingly. If they have decided that chat bubbles do not sit in line with their vision, they should communicate their stance on this in order that players can set/adjust their expectations accordingly.

     

    That would strike me as the professional thing to do anyway.

     

    Again, if chat bubbles do sit within their vision for the game but are on a "wall of crazy", why not communicate this clearly so that expectations are set appropriately?

     

    With clear communication on the direction of the game, you would not see this question / opinion pop up anywhere near as often and would not feel compelled the chime in....

    Problem is, as mike said, we can not know how much work actually is involved in adding this feature, but from reading here and in some older developer interviews it seems it requires huge amounts of work.

     

    and if adding bubbles means there is a huge amount of work involved in coding, then we can with some certainty conclude that there will not be chatbubble mods.. Which answers my original question.

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • QuesaQuesa Member UncommonPosts: 1,432
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Moar61
     I really don't understand why they haven't given us the option yet. It was one of the highest discussed thing in the beta forums, and all they asked for was the option to turn them on. I'm actually neutral, but I think I might actually like them. 

    I've seen this enough times now that I feel compelled to chime in. So, despite what apparently a whole lot of people seem to believe, game development doesn't involve flipping switches to turn things on. There isn't some secret chat bubble option that ZOS can just turn on. Any feature in game development requires time, resources, and money, all of which are finite. This means that even if a developer wants to do something, it has to be prioritized.

    Maybe they DO want to do chat bubbles (personal opinion: highly unlikely), but it's #50 on the list of things they need or want to get done. It's also possible that they feel chat bubbles simply don't fit the game. And yet another possibility is that they present technical issues (games are complicated).

    My point is that it's not as simple as people think to 'just add chat bubbles' or 'just add a minimap'. Game development involves making choices based on a whole lot of variables.

    That wasn't a comment on the ease of UI development, it was a comment about a toggle option for enabling/disabling it on the client side.

    Star Citizen Referral Code: STAR-DPBM-Z2P4
  • QuesaQuesa Member UncommonPosts: 1,432
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Originally posted by M0rbid
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Moar61
     I really don't understand why they haven't given us the option yet. It was one of the highest discussed thing in the beta forums, and all they asked for was the option to turn them on. I'm actually neutral, but I think I might actually like them. 

    I've seen this enough times now that I feel compelled to chime in. So, despite what apparently a whole lot of people seem to believe, game development doesn't involve flipping switches to turn things on. There isn't some secret chat bubble option that ZOS can just turn on. Any feature in game development requires time, resources, and money, all of which are finite. This means that even if a developer wants to do something, it has to be prioritized.

    Maybe they DO want to do chat bubbles (personal opinion: highly unlikely), but it's #50 on the list of things they need or want to get done. It's also possible that they feel chat bubbles simply don't fit the game. And yet another possibility is that they present technical issues (games are complicated).

    My point is that it's not as simple as people think to 'just add chat bubbles' or 'just add a minimap'. Game development involves making choices based on a whole lot of variables.

    I don't think anyone here doubts the complexity associated with adding any feature to a codebase the size of an mmorpg. I certainly doubt anyone actually thinks this is a case of "flipping a switch". Posters are simply speaking figuratively here.

     

    I think the point is that chat bubbles have been a requested feature for a long time. Given that length of time, Zeni have had ample opportunity to prioritise and allocate resource accordingly. If they have decided that chat bubbles do not sit in line with their vision, they should communicate their stance on this in order that players can set/adjust their expectations accordingly.

     

    That would strike me as the professional thing to do anyway.

     

    Again, if chat bubbles do sit within their vision for the game but are on a "wall of crazy", why not communicate this clearly so that expectations are set appropriately?

     

    With clear communication on the direction of the game, you would not see this question / opinion pop up anywhere near as often and would not feel compelled the chime in....

    Problem is, as mike said, we can not know how much work actually is involved in adding this feature, but from reading here and in some older developer interviews it seems it requires huge amounts of work.

     

    and if adding bubbles means there is a huge amount of work involved in coding, then we can with some certainty conclude that there will not be chatbubble mods.. Which answers my original question.

    In the scope of game development, it's a drop in the bucket.  In fact, it's such a miniscule detail, relatively to the other things in game development, it's ridiculous it's even a debatable topic.

    Star Citizen Referral Code: STAR-DPBM-Z2P4
  • udonudon Member UncommonPosts: 1,803
    Originally posted by Quesa
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Originally posted by M0rbid
    Originally posted by MikeB
    Originally posted by Moar61
     I really don't understand why they haven't given us the option yet. It was one of the highest discussed thing in the beta forums, and all they asked for was the option to turn them on. I'm actually neutral, but I think I might actually like them. 

    I've seen this enough times now that I feel compelled to chime in. So, despite what apparently a whole lot of people seem to believe, game development doesn't involve flipping switches to turn things on. There isn't some secret chat bubble option that ZOS can just turn on. Any feature in game development requires time, resources, and money, all of which are finite. This means that even if a developer wants to do something, it has to be prioritized.

    Maybe they DO want to do chat bubbles (personal opinion: highly unlikely), but it's #50 on the list of things they need or want to get done. It's also possible that they feel chat bubbles simply don't fit the game. And yet another possibility is that they present technical issues (games are complicated).

    My point is that it's not as simple as people think to 'just add chat bubbles' or 'just add a minimap'. Game development involves making choices based on a whole lot of variables.

    I don't think anyone here doubts the complexity associated with adding any feature to a codebase the size of an mmorpg. I certainly doubt anyone actually thinks this is a case of "flipping a switch". Posters are simply speaking figuratively here.

     

    I think the point is that chat bubbles have been a requested feature for a long time. Given that length of time, Zeni have had ample opportunity to prioritise and allocate resource accordingly. If they have decided that chat bubbles do not sit in line with their vision, they should communicate their stance on this in order that players can set/adjust their expectations accordingly.

     

    That would strike me as the professional thing to do anyway.

     

    Again, if chat bubbles do sit within their vision for the game but are on a "wall of crazy", why not communicate this clearly so that expectations are set appropriately?

     

    With clear communication on the direction of the game, you would not see this question / opinion pop up anywhere near as often and would not feel compelled the chime in....

    Problem is, as mike said, we can not know how much work actually is involved in adding this feature, but from reading here and in some older developer interviews it seems it requires huge amounts of work.

     

    and if adding bubbles means there is a huge amount of work involved in coding, then we can with some certainty conclude that there will not be chatbubble mods.. Which answers my original question.

    In the scope of game development, it's a drop in the bucket.  In fact, it's such a miniscule detail, relatively to the other things in game development, it's ridiculous it's even a debatable topic.

    You really don't know that.  What if the game engine never had chat bubbles coded as a option and they would have to rewrite huge parts of it to support them?  Suddenly what is a "drop in the bucket" starts to look like it could consume several months of developer time to add in.

    I'm not opposed to them even if I wouldn't use them but I'm not going to judge how much time they may or may not end up taking as it could very well be significantly more work than just flipping a switch or adding a few lines of code.

  • niteflynitefly Member Posts: 340

    I don't think it's prioritised. There really is no need for it until they introduce some social elements outside of spamming for groups. In RvR it should clearly not be activated as it could be used as an exploit and there are no RP tools in the game so I don't think RP was ever envisioned by the developers.

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 24,445

    Chat Bubbles are very useful in roleplaying. But when is the last time a MMO developer knew what roleplaying was? I see it as a extremely low priority maybe six months down the line.

    This is a MMO where they think you don't need nameplates (were there in Alpha supposedly) or guild plates. I think they will come sooner maybe a couple of months down the line if enough players complain.

    Any of these things can be turned of in RvR, if that makes for better gameplay, I think we would be all happy with that.

  • TamanousTamanous Member RarePosts: 3,030

    Doesn't seem to appear that many are actually reading what the OP asked for.

     

    This isn't a debate on if ZOS will add chat bubbles. That answer is clear and discussed elsewhere.

    You stay sassy!

  • ElikalElikal Member UncommonPosts: 7,912

    I would agree with Lord Bachus, but he always attacks me if I do. =P

     

    Chat Bubbles are for better coordination in PVP. It#s MUCH better to SEE "INCOMING FROM THE LEFT" in a chat bubble, than just seeing it in zone chat.

    People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert

  • ElikalElikal Member UncommonPosts: 7,912
    Originally posted by Yoda_Clone

    Yes, every day when I talk to people I see chat bubbles over their heads.  Not having them in game really kills immersion due to the missing realism...

    Pardon the sarcasm, but the only bubbles I've ever seen over people's heads in real life were from the cigarettes they were smoking and the only letters in those "bubbles" were O's from their smoke rings.  I don't buy the argument that we need chat bubbles for immersion.  Chat bubbles are simply a convenience to let us recognize who's talking on screen.

    Everyone has their own tastes; I personally dislike chat bubbles.  I agree that it is difficult to know who is talking in a game -- short of using cut-scenes for everything BioWare-style -- but I find chat bubbles to be a poor solution to tht problem.  I'd rather see a character's lips moving and see their head turn towards me... or something like that... to know that they're talking to me.  Or give full voice to all players (local chat only) and add lip movement...  But I don't see that happening anytime soon; it requires too much bandwidth.

    EDIT: Typo

    *headdesk* Seriously. THAT is your agument against them?

    Nothing I can say to this which would not get me banned...

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  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
    Just wondering if the API allows modders to create a mod that shows chatbubbles over peoples heads..

    I doubt it.

     

    Although the API has features that allow you to do things with the chat like color changes, time stamps and possibly even move it from the chat frame to something that floats somewhere on the screen resembling a chat bubble, you would also need the ability to link the chat to the speaker's character, determine his distance to you for chat culling, etc.

     

    These last bits are probably beyond the scope of the API and would need some lower level programming.

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  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Member RarePosts: 9,686
    Originally posted by Elikal

    I would agree with Lord Bachus, but he always attacks me if I do. =P

     

    Chat Bubbles are for better coordination in PVP. It#s MUCH better to SEE "INCOMING FROM THE LEFT" in a chat bubble, than just seeing it in zone chat.

    Just make sure you never agree with me ingame, because i will duell you to death... 

     

    (Grins). Not only for coordination inPvP..  Also for finding the girl that is  blushing and making comments on my great mustache  in a busy tavern

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • GravargGravarg Member UncommonPosts: 3,424
    I actually wouldn't mind chat bubbles.  I've never liked the Chat Box style.  It's not really the game's fault, it's more mine.  I get into my Bloodlust of slaying 500 guys, and I totally forget that there's a Chat Box.  At least with Chat Bubbles, I can see when someone is talking to me...Maybe I could move the chat box to cover my character, but then I can't see how awesome I look slaying things lol.
  • AroukosAroukos Member Posts: 571
    Originally posted by M0rbid

    For me personally, chat bubbles add a layer of immersion because there is nothing more off putting than a screen of characters and npcs that are static and silent the whole time.

     

    Equally, if thre are 20 people on screen and you are trying to RP or have a conversation with one of them, it's almost impossible to do via a chat box due to spam etc.

     

    Finally, speech bubbles tend to come in subtly different "shapes" that denote whether someone is shouting, or whispering or laughing etc which I find more intuitive than having to constantly check a chat box.

     

    Pffft what do I know, SWG Pre CU was my first mmorpg and it spoiled me.

     

    This ^^

  • QuesaQuesa Member UncommonPosts: 1,432
    Originally posted by udon
     

    You really don't know that.  What if the game engine never had chat bubbles coded as a option and they would have to rewrite huge parts of it to support them?  Suddenly what is a "drop in the bucket" starts to look like it could consume several months of developer time to add in.

    I'm not opposed to them even if I wouldn't use them but I'm not going to judge how much time they may or may not end up taking as it could very well be significantly more work than just flipping a switch or adding a few lines of code.

    Simply put, the game engine allows for elements to be put on the screen.  You just need to style it and drop it on an anchor with some behavior stats like when it starts to fade/disapear etc etc, the 3d engine usually takes care of the scale and other basic visual components.  Grabbing the text and regurgitating it on an element is simple.

    Sure, it's a simplistic description but compared to scripting an event or adding a new class, it's a simple process.

    The ability to hook into and parse chat text is already in the API, I haven't looked into what type of UI elements you're able to create and whether you're able to anchor such elements on character models.

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  • ReklawReklaw Member UncommonPosts: 6,495
    Originally posted by Ramanadjinn

    They probably don't want us to have the ability to track where characters are and put things over their heads. 

    I don't think it is possible.

    Although I find it extremely annoying playing a game that doesn't have names over heads and at the same time no bubbles.  I think all weekend in the beta I never got one response to anyone from a /say.  And why would I expect a response.  

    There is no way for them to know who said something to them or when if they even know someone said something at all.  That is just a lot of barriers to communication.  Its a "throwing the baby out with the bathwater" situation imo.

     

    I actually love not seeing those floating names above characters. Yes it's harder to identify player/NPC. I could care less what some unknown persons name is untill I actually meet that person.

    I do have to agree with OP that I really enjoyed it in SWG, but sometimes I could also be anoying because it would clutter your screen with tekst popups all over the place.

    But to be honost I don't know if I would use it in ESO from ingame itself or from a mod. What I like about ESO is mostly it very limited UI blocking the view of the ingame world. Also ESO is more Themeparkish. Think chatbubbles fit a more sandbox MMORPG allot more atleast for me it would.

  • TraugarTraugar Member UncommonPosts: 183
    Originally posted by Yoda_Clone

    Yes, every day when I talk to people I see chat bubbles over their heads.  Not having them in game really kills immersion due to the missing realism...

    Pardon the sarcasm, but the only bubbles I've ever seen over people's heads in real life were from the cigarettes they were smoking and the only letters in those "bubbles" were O's from their smoke rings.  I don't buy the argument that we need chat bubbles for immersion.  Chat bubbles are simply a convenience to let us recognize who's talking on screen.

    Everyone has their own tastes; I personally dislike chat bubbles.  I agree that it is difficult to know who is talking in a game -- short of using cut-scenes for everything BioWare-style -- but I find chat bubbles to be a poor solution to tht problem.  I'd rather see a character's lips moving and see their head turn towards me... or something like that... to know that they're talking to me.  Or give full voice to all players (local chat only) and add lip movement...  But I don't see that happening anytime soon; it requires too much bandwidth.

    EDIT: Typo

    You also don't have to look into a corner to see who is talking to you in real life.  If you don't RP you probably don't care for them. If you RP you probably like them.  For me being able to tell who is saying what along with any emotional accents at a glance is the same as in the real world where through sight and sound I can see who is talking and hear and emotion attached.  The chat bubbles provide the best method for simulating what is provided in a real world interaction in my opinion.  

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Originally posted by DeniZg

    I'm wondering why every time chat bubble support in any game is mentioned, there's a squad of haters rushing in, trying to convince everybody how chat bubbles suck and why there shouldn't be chat bubble support in any game ever..

     

    Probably people who played games like SWG where spam filled your screen any time you hit a busy area because of chat bubbles.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • AvulAvul Member Posts: 196
    Originally posted by Zyxx
    Originally posted by M0rbid

    For me personally, chat bubbles add a layer of immersion because there is nothing more off putting than a screen of characters and npcs that are static and silent the whole time.

     

    Equally, if thre are 20 people on screen and you are trying to RP or have a conversation with one of them, it's almost impossible to do via a chat box due to spam etc.

     

    Finally, speech bubbles tend to come in subtly different "shapes" that denote whether someone is shouting, or whispering or laughing etc which I find more intuitive than having to constantly check a chat box.

     

    Pffft what do I know, SWG Pre CU was my first mmorpg and it spoiled me.

    /signed!

    Yep. /signed I'm a roleplayer.. I want chat bubbles in my game.

    Elite: Dangerous - Space Exploration & Trading.

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