The big difference between the game and these forums...

fantasyfreak112

Originally posted by sludgebeard

The point of this thread isnt to say that there are no issues, its to say that people on these forums blow things out of proportion to push an agenda. Its like watching a political race where one gaff leads to outrage, I just cant believe that a forum dedicated to "Fans" of MMO's can become such a breeding ground for this drama.

 

1. The Guild Bank bug: Again I havent seen anyone mention it in game, let alone how its portrayed here as a reason to cancel your sub and forget any faith in Zenimax as a company. The in game economy is most deifently not screwed either besides iron ore dropping from 700G for a 100 stack to around 600 gold a stack. That is literally nothing!

 

2. Gold Spammers: Yes they are an annoyance, and yes I get at least one letter in the mail everyday, but you know what you can do? Click ignore, delete the message, and keep playing. Most people in the chat that talk about Gold Spammers just make fun of them, not spew nonsense about how their ruining the entire game. Again its a mild annoyance but its nothing serious.

 

And finally...

 

3. The Bots:

 

This is the biggest one to me, because Yes, they are prevalent, especially in low level areas, and yes they should be dealt with. But again, they arent taking anything away from the player, in most cases, they are crowded into the same bubble with stupid names like "XaaxvbNB" or "AaaCC" and get the same couple of mobs everytime they spawn. 

But again, ive never seen a scenario where tons more enemies didnt spawn right afterwards, a few feet to the left of the bots for players to kill. Its not like they are preventing players from continuing quests, or getting the mobs they need, they are just cheaply spamming the same area for 1 gold and a few exp a pop.

 

Again, should these issues be dealt with? Yes, of course they should. Is this really a sign of Zenimax's incompetence and the game failing as a whole? No, again its a minimal issues that doesnt need to have more than one forum post or one discussion a week on the topic. 

 

Unfortunatly for you, fanboi's also have an agenda. To get as much positive confirmation as possible in order to justify their 60$ purchase.

 

You see this behavior all the time with every kind of purchase. People who pay to see a movie in a theatre often give obscenely higher reviews then those that watched it on DVD. Often the DVD watchers are much more honest because they invested far less(if anything gg internet) and therefore can be much less bias. Producers think their product is stellar because they invested thousands of hours into it only to find out the customer thinks it's trash and can't imagine why. The answer is bias.

 

How you can apply this to TESO is; for instance, a friend buying the game and his room mate playing on his account. It's 100x more likely to get a realistic review out of the room mate then the purchaser. Why?

Bias

udon

There are three types of people who are talking about this game.

1.  People who are playing it and are going to continue to pay for the privilege.

2.  The people who are currently playing but won't be in a month.

3.  The people who are not playing it and probably never will.

Zenimax should care very much what group 1 and 2 has to say as those are customers who have already spent money on the game so they at least have a shot at them continuing to.  Although some lose is going to happen no matter what they do.  Some of group 3 might be able to be won over but there is also a element of doomsayers in their that short of a complete rework like F2P they will always hate the game.

For what it's worth I keep flopping between 1 and 2 myself so I'm still not sure where I will land.

udon

Originally posted by fantasyfreak112

Originally posted by sludgebeard

 

Unfortunatly for you, fanboi's also have an agenda. To get as much positive confirmation as possible in order to justify their 60$ purchase.

 

You see this behavior all the time with every kind of purchase. People who pay to see a movie in a theatre often give obscenely higher reviews then those that watched it on DVD. Often the DVD watchers are much more honest because they invested far less(if anything gg internet) and therefore can be much less bias. Producers think their product is stellar because they invested thousands of hours into it only to find out the customer thinks it's trash and can't imagine why. The answer is bias.

 

How you can apply this to TESO is; for instance, a friend buying the game and his room mate playing on his account. It's 100x more likely to get a realistic review out of the room mate then the purchaser. Why?

Bias

Bias very much goes both ways you know?  One person might be just as apt to undervalue the game because of a need to justify not purchasing it as someone else might be justifying purchasing it.  For all it's fan base ESO has a equal if not larger group cheering on it's failure for one reason or another. 

Kailash

Welcome to MMORPG.com.

Jacxolope

Originally posted by udon

Originally posted by fantasyfreak112

Originally posted by sludgebeard

 

Unfortunatly for you, fanboi's also have an agenda. To get as much positive confirmation as possible in order to justify their 60$ purchase.

 

You see this behavior all the time with every kind of purchase. People who pay to see a movie in a theatre often give obscenely higher reviews then those that watched it on DVD. Often the DVD watchers are much more honest because they invested far less(if anything gg internet) and therefore can be much less bias. Producers think their product is stellar because they invested thousands of hours into it only to find out the customer thinks it's trash and can't imagine why. The answer is bias.

 

How you can apply this to TESO is; for instance, a friend buying the game and his room mate playing on his account. It's 100x more likely to get a realistic review out of the room mate then the purchaser. Why?

Bias

Bias very much goes both ways you know?  One person might be just as apt to undervalue the game because of a need to justify not purchasing it as someone else might be justifying purchasing it.  For all it's fan base ESO has a equal if not larger group cheering on it's failure for one reason or another. 

Yes- There is wisdom in understanding that EVERYONE has bias and agenda. YOU must measure the bias based on the person and the discussion.

What the above poster is saying, is that generally a positive bias towards something has more weight in a situation where the person has some vested interest or commitment to said product. That isnt to say there isnt bias for many reasons from blind haters and people with an opposing bias or agenda (for whatever reason)

 

That isnt to say bias not go both ways- Also factor in blatant trolling and playing a 'strawman' and the whole thing becomes murky and convaluted.

-Then theres the people who just want to discuss games. They are lost in the fray...

 

Trust no one. We might even be A.I...And there are no girls on the internet (its been proven)

GeezerGamer

Originally posted by udon

There are three types of people who are talking about this game.

1.  People who are playing it and are going to continue to pay for the privilege.

2.  The people who are currently playing but won't be in a month.

3.  The people who are not playing it and probably never will.

Zenimax should care very much what group 1 and 2 has to say as those are customers who have already spent money on the game so they at least have a shot at them continuing to.  Although some lose is going to happen no matter what they do.  Some of group 3 might be able to be won over but there is also a element of doomsayers in their that short of a complete rework like F2P they will always hate the game.

For what it's worth I keep flopping between 1 and 2 myself so I'm still not sure where I will land.

You forgot group 4, who should also be of importance to ZM.

People who are waiting for the dust to settle before jumping in.

mark2123

Originally posted by Robokapp

Nobody at my workplace complains about difficulty of getting a job...yet the unemployed people keep saying how hard it is.

 

OP, you're using the game as a filter for the game. Of course you'll see the separation between black and white with such a filter.

This is exactly the case.

mark2123

Originally posted by Kinado

The game is too heavily focused on questing. Questing in MMO's are just a means to an end. In TESO its 90% of the game.

 

I get this feeling too.  The game is all about going from place to place to place doing quests, and mostly, with other people who are there anyway, rarely accept your invitation to group and rarely have time for or even see your messages.

Lot's of good MMOs have a multitude of things to do, but as there is no auction house, even crafting is laborious and only for it's own sake, as you end up selling your stuff for face value.

This game is going to bore people real fast.

d_20

Originally posted by Siug
A lot of people posting here just hate MMOs and especially those who like them. Most posters hating ESO have never even played it. If you scan through a few threads you know who I mean. 

This.

 

I wouldn't blame this whole forum. I started a thread the other day and most of the people who posted in it were quite decent in terms of writing about their experiences or sharing information.

 

However, in the 10-page thread (the last time I checked it) there were maybe 4 or 5 people who were just trolling/negative and offensive. I was quite happy that they so clearly identified themselves. What I then do is block them, so that I can read my threads happily without seeing the toxic posts. Well, you can still see them because people do quote and feed the trolls, but it's not so bad that way.

 

Basically, most of the people at this forum are pretty reasonable, but there are a few trolls. You get to know who they are, so you can just read them for amusement or block them.

ohioastro

My bottom line is that sometimes I look at criticisms of a game and say "I can see why people would think that" or "I remember seeing something like that".  In this forum it honestly looks as if people have created some alternative universe where they're talking about a game that has nothing to do with the one I'm playing.   Yup, there are gold spammers (especially in the starter zones) and the occasional bot running around in circles.  Yup, there are occasional quest glitches.  A few (stress that word) people in large crafting guilds had bank problems.  And...that's it.  People in game are nice and helpful; it's a blast to play; and it would be great if this was a place where it was possible to talk about it.

Instead it's all doom and gloom and horror stories.  I've seen games that really were in bad shape at launch, but this alternative reality experience is one of the most bizarre things I've ever seen.

Distopia

Originally posted by lifeordinary

Originally posted by DamonVile

Originally posted by DEAD.line

Originally posted by sludgebeard

 I wonder how anyone can consider the activity on here, "Healthy" from a social standpoint. 

 

So let's recap and see if i got this straight.

You're unhappy that a bunch of random people on an internet forum said bad things about a game you like, so you decided to create a thread on said forum to express said unhapiness instead of doing the normal and logical thing about said situation and simply ignore the comments and carry on playing the game you enjoy.

So, you're apparently so attached to the game that you can't take someone having a negative opinion on it, therefore, you made this thread and call others out by saying they're trolls.

Hmmmm, sounds to me like you're the one with an unhealthy obssession, not just with ESO but with these forums aswell.

Back away from the computer friend.

Actually what he said makes a lot of sense but try telling that to the guys sitting at the window in the old folks home and well.... looks like you already know the answer you'd get.

Why people fight so hard for their right to bitch and moan about a game on a forum no dev is ever going to read, I'll never really understand. No one here is changing the mmo world, that should be obvious by now. You're just gathering all the bitter old vets in one place so you can agree everything used to be better and those damn kids are on your lawn again.

You have over 3K posts and you are asking us this?

Are you telling us you have never participated in such a behavior yourself? people often forget that anyone can see through your posting history on these forums.

Lets not act like we are better than anyone else because we are not.

I hate nothing more than double standards in this world.

Not all of us sit around doing that here. Just because we can find it in your history doesn't mean you'll find it in mine or his. IF I don't like a game the last thing I think of is visiting a forum devoted to it.

lifeordinary

Originally posted by ohioastro

My bottom line is that sometimes I look at criticisms of a game and say "I can see why people would think that" or "I remember seeing something like that".  In this forum it honestly looks as if people have created some alternative universe where they're talking about a game that has nothing to do with the one I'm playing.   Yup, there are gold spammers (especially in the starter zones) and the occasional bot running around in circles.  Yup, there are occasional quest glitches.  A few (stress that word) people in large crafting guilds had bank problems.  And...that's it.  People in game are nice and helpful; it's a blast to play; and it would be great if this was a place where it was possible to talk about it.

Instead it's all doom and gloom and horror stories.  I've seen games that really were in bad shape at launch, but this alternative reality experience is one of the most bizarre things I've ever seen.

Your continuous denial about serious problems related to the game will continue till it loses huge number of subs once free month is over. You can call it alternate universe or bizzare or whatever you feel like but reality isn't going to change.

This is not something new. Fans are never known for prudence thought process because they are always so fascinated by their new addiction. Don't worry..i have seen it all and this is such a deja vu reading all the typical excuses. I think a lot of people already know how this is going to end in couple of months.

lifeordinary

Originally posted by Distopia

 

Not all of us sit around doing that here. Just because we can find it in your history doesn't mean you'll find it in mine or his. IF I don't like a game the last thing I think of is visiting a forum devoted to it.

I did actually but i am not going to bother with copy pasting your history or his or anyone's else.. I don't care that much. I just don't like double standards and holier than thou people.

Distopia

Originally posted by lifeordinary

Originally posted by Distopia

 

Not all of us sit around doing that here. Just because we can find it in your history doesn't mean you'll find it in mine or his. IF I don't like a game the last thing I think of is visiting a forum devoted to it.

I did actually but i am not going to bother with copy pasting your history or his or anyone's else.. I don't care that much. I just don't like double standards and holier than thou people.

Have fun finding me bashing any games at all lol, I know it's a lot to look through, I might as well save you the time. It's like finding a needle in a haystack.

Deddmeat

Some of us can come and post on the forums while waiting for out character to zone, actually you can make a cuppa, read posts, look up info, reply to posts and make another cuppa and see if the game has zoned you.

Which it should, given the state of the game it currently probably hasn't but it's so quick break from the game which we keep being told we should gave anyway.

But for its downsides, it has it's ups ..

ohioastro

Originally posted by lifeordinary

Originally posted by ohioastro

My bottom line is that sometimes I look at criticisms of a game and say "I can see why people would think that" or "I remember seeing something like that".  In this forum it honestly looks as if people have created some alternative universe where they're talking about a game that has nothing to do with the one I'm playing.   Yup, there are gold spammers (especially in the starter zones) and the occasional bot running around in circles.  Yup, there are occasional quest glitches.  A few (stress that word) people in large crafting guilds had bank problems.  And...that's it.  People in game are nice and helpful; it's a blast to play; and it would be great if this was a place where it was possible to talk about it.

Instead it's all doom and gloom and horror stories.  I've seen games that really were in bad shape at launch, but this alternative reality experience is one of the most bizarre things I've ever seen.

Your continuous denial about serious problems related to the game will continue till it loses huge number of subs once free month is over. You can call it alternate universe or bizzare or whatever you feel like but reality isn't going to change.

This is not something new. Fans are never known for prudence thought process because they are always so fascinated by their new addiction. Don't worry..i have seen it all and this is such a deja vu reading all the typical excuses. I think a lot of people already know how this is going to end in couple of months.

What I see here from you is just a string of dismissals and assertions - no evidence, just claims that your superior wisdom and judgement is far greater than that of a mere "fan".  I told you my experiences.  You don't need to even have played the game to know I'm wrong, I guess, since your post shows no evidence at all that you've done so - or that there is any point in discussion, since you're neither presenting evidence nor engaging with anything that I'm saying.

reeereee

Originally posted by ohioastro

Originally posted by lifeordinary

Originally posted by ohioastro

My bottom line is that sometimes I look at criticisms of a game and say "I can see why people would think that" or "I remember seeing something like that".  In this forum it honestly looks as if people have created some alternative universe where they're talking about a game that has nothing to do with the one I'm playing.   Yup, there are gold spammers (especially in the starter zones) and the occasional bot running around in circles.  Yup, there are occasional quest glitches.  A few (stress that word) people in large crafting guilds had bank problems.  And...that's it.  People in game are nice and helpful; it's a blast to play; and it would be great if this was a place where it was possible to talk about it.

Instead it's all doom and gloom and horror stories.  I've seen games that really were in bad shape at launch, but this alternative reality experience is one of the most bizarre things I've ever seen.

Your continuous denial about serious problems related to the game will continue till it loses huge number of subs once free month is over. You can call it alternate universe or bizzare or whatever you feel like but reality isn't going to change.

This is not something new. Fans are never known for prudence thought process because they are always so fascinated by their new addiction. Don't worry..i have seen it all and this is such a deja vu reading all the typical excuses. I think a lot of people already know how this is going to end in couple of months.

What I see here from you is just a string of dismissals and assertions - no evidence, just claims that your superior wisdom and judgement is far greater than that of a mere "fan".  I told you my experiences.  You don't need to even have played the game to know I'm wrong, I guess, since your post shows no evidence at all that you've done so - or that there is any point in discussion, since you're neither presenting evidence nor engaging with anything that I'm saying.

I'm up to VR4 and have seen everything people here are complaining about here and agree with their complaints... except for bots...  I've never seen any type of bot other than spam bots and then only in the starter zones.

Incomparable

Originally posted by Kinado

 

With TESO that doesn't happen, can't happen as a MMO, you are forced to play exactly how Zenimax wants you to play. That's fine as long as there is enough content and diversity to keep you enjoying yourself playing it. Nevermind the bugs, those are many but fixeable. Even the unresponsive combat is fixeable. Even the overpowered skills are fixeable.

MMO's are meant to be a lot of games inside of one big package. Diversity is needed to keep people of different tastes entertained and depth to keep them subscribing. TESO lacks that content diversity and depth at the moment and it's the main reason so many people are getting bored so quickly.

The game is too heavily focused on questing. Questing in MMO's are just a means to an end. In TESO its 90% of the game.

 

 First paragraph is a big enough problem that reviews at launch should have mentioned this. I think they would have not gotten a purchase from many, myself included. Since, it is p2p, so do you think myself and others want to spend that $50 for only 1 month to try the game with so many bugs its basically beta stage quality. I have never played a game where the combat and balancing of damage/mitigation etc was in beta or what could be classified as alpha state in the game.

So when combat is so broken it should not have been marketed to me as a finished product for me to hunker down $50 on what is a wasted experience. The only regret I have is putting up with the slow experience and wasting a lot of time in the game to reach a quest bug not allowing me access to vr content. I cant enjoy pvp as much as I should be due to the aforementioned issues, and there isnt any more content to do due to the last quest bug... but really is really wasting more time in a game that needs time to be patched. 

So basically, the bug for the God of Schemes quests is a blessing in disguise for me to stop wasting my time. I have wasted my money, but at least that bug gave me some perspective. It does rob me of at least of having some sense of accomplishment. I do have a screenshot of defeating the last quest, but the last quest is still in my quest log.

Bigdaddyx

Originally posted by ohioastro

Originally posted by lifeordinary

Originally posted by ohioastro

My bottom line is that sometimes I look at criticisms of a game and say "I can see why people would think that" or "I remember seeing something like that".  In this forum it honestly looks as if people have created some alternative universe where they're talking about a game that has nothing to do with the one I'm playing.   Yup, there are gold spammers (especially in the starter zones) and the occasional bot running around in circles.  Yup, there are occasional quest glitches.  A few (stress that word) people in large crafting guilds had bank problems.  And...that's it.  People in game are nice and helpful; it's a blast to play; and it would be great if this was a place where it was possible to talk about it.

Instead it's all doom and gloom and horror stories.  I've seen games that really were in bad shape at launch, but this alternative reality experience is one of the most bizarre things I've ever seen.

Your continuous denial about serious problems related to the game will continue till it loses huge number of subs once free month is over. You can call it alternate universe or bizzare or whatever you feel like but reality isn't going to change.

This is not something new. Fans are never known for prudence thought process because they are always so fascinated by their new addiction. Don't worry..i have seen it all and this is such a deja vu reading all the typical excuses. I think a lot of people already know how this is going to end in couple of months.

What I see here from you is just a string of dismissals and assertions - no evidence, just claims that your superior wisdom and judgement is far greater than that of a mere "fan".  I told you my experiences.  You don't need to even have played the game to know I'm wrong, I guess, since your post shows no evidence at all that you've done so - or that there is any point in discussion, since you're neither presenting evidence nor engaging with anything that I'm saying.

I doubt he is trying to come across as someone with superior wisdom. Although he is right that once honey moon period is over people start seeing things for what they really are.

For anyone who has been playing games for years now know that it is the same vicious cycle over and over again.

A MMO release with lots of bugs, dupes exploits and other game breaking issues.

Fans are in complete denial.

MMO starts losing players.

F2P annoucement is made after an year to keep the game floating.

Everybody talks about the potential it had.

Soon it is just another MMO swimming in the sea of other has been.

A new MMO releases... haters and fans jump ship..and its all over the same pattern again.

As far as evidence is concerned i don't know what else you are looking for.Everything is in front of you and a click away. 

Knotwood

I don't want to sound like a roll over or nothing, but I have been caught up in the crap you all talk about every day, and I still play.   The reason I can still play every day with a smile on my face, is the fact that there literally is still no game out on the market that comes close to this game as far as RPG in a game.   Its not like other games I would just give up and say I'll find something else.   I literally cannot find another game with this level of gameplay.   It doesn't matter what happens in game, as long as major things get fixed every day, I will continue to stay in game.

 

This game needs time to be polished, I have a grace period for things getting fixed, and its getting there slowly, but what game out there has this level of RPG?   Not one.  I think you can scream from a mountain out there that these bugs are deal breakers, but whats the alternative?   That's what I thought...

Fatalist

@OP Good to hear, because if you went by these forums alone, DOOM!  Excited to get to playing soon.

Grimmx

Originally posted by Erda

I've pretty much have come to expect harsh criticism against this game--- forums, gaming sites, etc.   I do see quite a bit of complaining in zone chat followed up by "stfu and play WoW " or other such nonsense.  Seems as if people have lost the ability to converse with one another in a respectful manner.  I am a bit shocked at the degree of negativity towards ESO overall.  Heck, one of my hubby's coworkers wouldn't even try it due to everything he heard.  He finally picked it up and now loves it.  Seems that ESO is the game to hate.

Personally, I can't be happier with my experience.  I've encountered my share of bugs to include losing my bank spaces that have never been restored nor me reimbursed.   I've encountered a handful of bugs and other glitches that have been resolved logging out.   I'm a bit unhappy with the gold spam and the bots camping dungeons.   The dupe bugs are also pretty bad since I don't like things that impact the economy.  In the greater scheme of things, ESO has been a positive experience and I'm having fun.  I've played a few games that have been horror shows at launch.....Vanguard anyone?   Loved Vanguard but most of my friends moved on and couldn't get through the bugs and growing pain of that game.

Hopefully Zenimax finds their stride and gets everything under control.  With WildStar just around the corner, I'm sure that every bit of gaming angst will be directed towards that for a bit.   Gamers are a hard bunch to please and I don't envy the job of a developer.

This was a good post.

Despite the negativity i still enjoy the game. And i have faith the bugs and dupes wont be gamebreaking in the long run, AND that they will get everything under control.

If people want to find excuses to quit just do it and move on. 

lifeordinary

I like how OP is claiming that 'no one' is discussing these issues in game when that is all i see. i didn't even have to try hard or go looking for it because it is an everyday thing on US server. So i captured these screenshots to prove that in OP's case 'ignorance is bliss'.

The discussion started when some people were defending those who exploited and duped items.

 

 

 

 

And it goes on and on and then i got bored. But i hope i made my point.

 

SavageHorizon

Originally posted by lifeordinary

I like how OP is claiming that 'no one' is discussing these issues in game when that is all i see. i didn't even have to try hard or go looking for it because it is an everyday thing on US server. So i captured these screenshots to prove that in OP's case 'ignorance is bliss'.

The discussion started when some people were defending those who exploited and duped items.

And it goes on and on and then i got bored. But i hope i made my point.

 

Game set and match the OP is found to be nothing but a person who can't handle others not liking ESO,

Your post just proves he is a liar when he says no one is complaining in game lol.

Uhwop

According to another post the OP made, he's barely played the game himself. 

You seem to be doing the complete opposite of the people you're complaining about.  Spending your time here trying to convince people the game is fine, as apposed to actually playing it. 

And of course you're not seeing anyone complaining in game, you've barely played it in the last month.