I agree with the OP, In fact with the way mmo's are just sloping these games together without any real effort to put art or features into the, the large population of independent developers who have made some really fine artistic games are going to surpass the AAA companies of mmo making. Just take a look at the greenlight projects on STEAM, and you'll see so many no name publishers putting features and art ten times more beautiful and dynamic then AAA studios these days. Games like Neo's Land, and Embers of Caerus are already as AAA as SOE's landmark...
Originally posted by Knotwood I agree with the OP, In fact with the way mmo's are just sloping these games together without any real effort to put art or features into the, the large population of independent developers who have made some really fine artistic games are going to surpass the AAA companies of mmo making. Just take a look at the greenlight projects on STEAM, and you'll see so many no name publishers putting features and art ten times more beautiful and dynamic then AAA studios these days. Games like Neo's Land, and Embers of Caerus are already as AAA as SOE's landmark...
You just should not be able to post. You say things with not facts backing it. Wildstar has more content at launch then any MMO I have played in 15 years. No new MMO has launched with this much elder game... Here is a list from another thread. Also as far as polish goes... one of the better games I have played as well. Cant wait to see how launch goes =-)
Veteran Dungeons and Adventures
Open World Bosses
20 man raids
40 man raids
80 man raid for final weapon Imbuements
2v2, 3v3, 5v5 Arenas
Battlegrounds
Warplots (Battle housing including the ability to summon bosses to fight with you)
Paths (Reasons to do additional content of your choosing)
A crafting system with talents and specializations within a chosen craft
Story line that can be done solo, that takes you through the raid dungeons and gives you more lore detail than actually doing the raid.
Elder solo story unlocked level 50 that going to be updated to keep solo gamers playing
Shiphands (Solo dungeon runs you can bring friends on)
Originally posted by Eir_S It's just an average MMO to me. I played the betas and just didn't care to argue one way or the other. It's just kind of .. there.
this is just another mmo that brings nothing to the table.
I agree with this too. In a way its sad that this game is getting people so exited. Is this all we can hope for from mmo dev's from now on. Nothing at all new here.
Originally posted by Knotwood I agree with the OP, In fact with the way mmo's are just sloping these games together without any real effort to put art or features into the, the large population of independent developers who have made some really fine artistic games are going to surpass the AAA companies of mmo making. Just take a look at the greenlight projects on STEAM, and you'll see so many no name publishers putting features and art ten times more beautiful and dynamic then AAA studios these days. Games like Neo's Land, and Embers of Caerus are already as AAA as SOE's landmark...
You just should not be able to post. You say things with not facts backing it. Wildstar has more content at launch then any MMO I have played in 15 years. No new MMO has launched with this much elder game... Here is a list from another thread. Also as far as polish goes... one of the better games I have played as well. Cant wait to see how launch goes =-)
Veteran Dungeons and Adventures
Open World Bosses
20 man raids
40 man raids
80 man raid for final weapon Imbuements
2v2, 3v3, 5v5 Arenas
Battlegrounds
Warplots (Battle housing including the ability to summon bosses to fight with you)
Paths (Reasons to do additional content of your choosing)
A crafting system with talents and specializations within a chosen craft
Story line that can be done solo, that takes you through the raid dungeons and gives you more lore detail than actually doing the raid.
Elder solo story unlocked level 50 that going to be updated to keep solo gamers playing
Shiphands (Solo dungeon runs you can bring friends on)
Zone events
P.S. Thanks Kaladin for making this list.
+ Player Housing & Guild Housing
All Time Favorites: EQ1, WoW, EvE, GW1 Playing Now: WoW, ESO, GW2
"half-finished mmo's?" I'd hate to see how long it takes to make a "finished" mmo. It's like a year wait in between decent ones. I'm still waiting for the eqnext release date in 2050.
Originally posted by samsweet "half-finished mmo's?" I'd hate to see how long it takes to make a "finished" mmo. It's like a year wait in between decent ones. I'm still waiting for the eqnext release date in 2050.
I'm sure he'll say it's finished once Carbine gets the grass to behave properly.
Post like this is the reason I would never be apart of a team making an MMO anymore, gamers are disrespectful and assume devs don't care. I was a gamer that went DEV to see what was going on behide the scenes . I see it both ways but I also know the cost of making an MMO, the devs could make a better game and add everything you want/. But for 60 bucks?? Or less, and all the people to torrent games, hell no. Games need to cost a ton more, people have no idea of the cost to make a MMO.
A lot of good devs are going mobile, way cheaper and easier and less whining. I personally hate working on MMO's now, because of the gamers whining. We sweat blood to make these games and get remarks like this? How about we shit on your work.. Some of you gamers really need to try and make a game, then come talk to us when you do... You really don't understand.
PS: Devs don't have the say, the big shots up stairs do, on what is release as well. just a little FYI..
Originally posted by Knotwood I agree with the OP, In fact with the way mmo's are just sloping these games together without any real effort to put art or features into the, the large population of independent developers who have made some really fine artistic games are going to surpass the AAA companies of mmo making. Just take a look at the greenlight projects on STEAM, and you'll see so many no name publishers putting features and art ten times more beautiful and dynamic then AAA studios these days. Games like Neo's Land, and Embers of Caerus are already as AAA as SOE's landmark...
You just should not be able to post. You say things with not facts backing it. Wildstar has more content at launch then any MMO I have played in 15 years. No new MMO has launched with this much elder game... Here is a list from another thread. Also as far as polish goes... one of the better games I have played as well. Cant wait to see how launch goes =-)
Veteran Dungeons and Adventures
Open World Bosses
20 man raids
40 man raids
80 man raid for final weapon Imbuements
2v2, 3v3, 5v5 Arenas
Battlegrounds
Warplots (Battle housing including the ability to summon bosses to fight with you)
Paths (Reasons to do additional content of your choosing)
A crafting system with talents and specializations within a chosen craft
Story line that can be done solo, that takes you through the raid dungeons and gives you more lore detail than actually doing the raid.
Elder solo story unlocked level 50 that going to be updated to keep solo gamers playing
Shiphands (Solo dungeon runs you can bring friends on)
EOC, is a scam they went off line and scammed people including people that helped.. Enough said there, but I AGREE about the indies because I'm one of those, so I know we are taking it to the next level, we still need to pay for expensive programs.
Maya alone is 3.5k, for one person... So imagine all the software we need. I have right now over 20k in software and no where near done. Have I made that back yet?? Nope... Will I , I hope to one day, so gamers need to understand this.!!
I whole-heartedly agree with the OP. But its not just WildStar its all the MMOs in the last 7 or 8 years. I'll never buy into another MMO again until they prove to me they aren't trying to piggy-back on the themepark formula for "success". And by success i mean take my money for as little effort as possible on the producer/developer's part.
Elder Scrolls Online almost got me because of the IP. But i abstained and of course dodged another bullet.
***Edit*** I wanted to also add that its a greed issue and it'll never go away. So, imo, MMOs are totally screwed and the only hope we have rests with indie developers.
Originally posted by Knotwood I agree with the OP, In fact with the way mmo's are just sloping these games together without any real effort to put art or features into the, the large population of independent developers who have made some really fine artistic games are going to surpass the AAA companies of mmo making. Just take a look at the greenlight projects on STEAM, and you'll see so many no name publishers putting features and art ten times more beautiful and dynamic then AAA studios these days. Games like Neo's Land, and Embers of Caerus are already as AAA as SOE's landmark...
You just should not be able to post. You say things with not facts backing it. Wildstar has more content at launch then any MMO I have played in 15 years. No new MMO has launched with this much elder game... Here is a list from another thread. Also as far as polish goes... one of the better games I have played as well. Cant wait to see how launch goes =-)
Veteran Dungeons and Adventures
Open World Bosses
20 man raids
40 man raids
80 man raid for final weapon Imbuements
2v2, 3v3, 5v5 Arenas
Battlegrounds
Warplots (Battle housing including the ability to summon bosses to fight with you)
Paths (Reasons to do additional content of your choosing)
A crafting system with talents and specializations within a chosen craft
Story line that can be done solo, that takes you through the raid dungeons and gives you more lore detail than actually doing the raid.
Elder solo story unlocked level 50 that going to be updated to keep solo gamers playing
Shiphands (Solo dungeon runs you can bring friends on)
Zone events
P.S. Thanks Kaladin for making this list.
+ Player Housing & Guild Housing
I've been saying for years that no MMO has the right to be called a WoW clone, because none of them launch with at least all of WoWs features. I have always been responded with things like "well its a 10 year old game, dont compare"...or "well it has XXXX new thing, so you shouldnt miss arenas or raids"........this is the first MMO launching with eldergame that at the very minimum includes everything WoW's eldergame does, and actually adds to it. Warplots are one of the craziest things iv ever seen. Warplots could have been a game on its own with the potential likes of dota or LoL. All I can say is I cant wait to see some amaizing things players come up with in warplots on twitch lol.
We've seen this so often. Even I almost bought into the hype. And, at this point, who knows, I may fall into the insanity that is buying this game.
It is insanity for a reason: We keep buying these half-finished MMOs, hoping for that old feeling of adventure. I don't see how this game could possibly be any different. The MMO industry is repeating itself. But this game isn't smooth. It isn't a piece of art.
Art here is important. It is obvious this game isn't a piece of art. If you think I'm wrong, go look how all of the grass on the ground flows at the EXACT same time. It shouldn't. It should flow in waves. This game lacks the fine details that make a game a piece of art. I have yet to find an environment in this game that shows an artist's touch. They are talented, yes, but they aren't putting their souls into this game and it becomes painfully obvious when you take a close look at the textures and animations.
Just like all of the recently mmo releases (Apart from maybe Guild Wars 2?), this game fails in the art department. And unfortunately, that is what makes an MMO a living, breathing thing. It needs the fine details in combat as well as art to make it work, which is why WoW has dominated the scene for so long (Apart from Panda-land, which, regardless of how silly some of the expansion is, the environment is still a work of art).
Deep down, I feel like we all know this. Even my most-excited gamer friends have realized the failure train that this game is on.
you know what we all really know?
your kind.
and we are bored by it. have a nice day and play whatever you play with your negativity.
and if you need some arguments, and since you mentioned wow (and why it was such a huge success according to you):
WoW has FIXED lightning. WoW has no moving grass at all.
so, i wonder, why you like WoW that much and on the other hand flame games which do it actually BETTER than WoW?
your argument is, plain and simple. invalid. and my hair ain't even a bird.
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
This game isn't half finished, but it won't be huge at all for other reasons.
Reason being, this game only appeals to people who enjoy seriously raiding bosses with 19-39 other people while defeating said boss with a limited choice of skills that once pressed will execute a very lame animation in the triangle telegraph in front of your character. While doing this, you must also be wary of red triangles of death that will wipe your raid and cycle interrupt skills. The end.
Jokes aside, the truth is their game is not built to appeal to a wide variety of players. Just the hardcore and "classic wow feels" players.
I'm as hardcore as they come, but this game just isn't for me. The lore is essentially non-existent and I can't take the game seriously at all as a result, my guildies feel the same, and the skill system/combat makes me feel like i'm playing the MOBA smite, and that isn't how I like my raiding. For those that can tolerate those two aspects though, I'm sure they will enjoy the large amounts of raiding content that carbine has planned, or atleast constantly brags about having planned.
So you don't like the game, we get it. Why not just say it's not for you and move on?
I might have even just taken your post at face value, but you - like so many other people who must clearly feel the need to add that extra little jab - had to throw the 'or at least constantly brags about having planned' snide remark at the end.
At that point you just became another troll. Credibility gone.
We've seen this so often. Even I almost bought into the hype. And, at this point, who knows, I may fall into the insanity that is buying this game.
It is insanity for a reason: We keep buying these half-finished MMOs, hoping for that old feeling of adventure. I don't see how this game could possibly be any different. The MMO industry is repeating itself. But this game isn't smooth. It isn't a piece of art.
Art here is important. It is obvious this game isn't a piece of art. If you think I'm wrong, go look how all of the grass on the ground flows at the EXACT same time. It shouldn't. It should flow in waves. This game lacks the fine details that make a game a piece of art. I have yet to find an environment in this game that shows an artist's touch. They are talented, yes, but they aren't putting their souls into this game and it becomes painfully obvious when you take a close look at the textures and animations.
Just like all of the recently mmo releases (Apart from maybe Guild Wars 2?), this game fails in the art department. And unfortunately, that is what makes an MMO a living, breathing thing. It needs the fine details in combat as well as art to make it work, which is why WoW has dominated the scene for so long (Apart from Panda-land, which, regardless of how silly some of the expansion is, the environment is still a work of art).
Deep down, I feel like we all know this. Even my most-excited gamer friends have realized the failure train that this game is on.
you know what we all really know?
your kind.
and we are bored by it. have a nice day and play whatever you play with your negativity.
and if you need some arguments, and since you mentioned wow (and why it was such a huge success according to you):
WoW has FIXED lightning. WoW has no moving grass at all.
so, i wonder, why you like WoW that much and on the other hand flame games which do it actually BETTER than WoW?
your argument is, plain and simple. invalid. and my hair ain't even a bird.
While I admire your passion, his argument does have validity, ten pages worth and counting. There are many people who do not like this game. While you may not appreciate his comments or like them, he is voicing his opinion and many people share his feelings, again making his argument valid. I am truly not trying to antagonize you or upset you, if I did, I am sorry. People of all kinds exists and this site caters to lots of critical and often negative views on many games.
PS: Not everyone shares your opinion. If you are going to make a thread, make some valid details to be argued about rather then some false assumption about what everyone feels about a game. Come on now, its tiring seeing these thread for every game and how useless they are. Just because you want to be in denial over a game, or perhaps being defensive of another game your desperate to be considered good and feel it is threatened by this game, doesn't mean you can magically make everyone else jump to your side.
I'm going to admit that I didn't read any of the previous comments before my post, and I'm just here to state what goes through my mind about Wildstar. Hardcore.
I played Wildstar's beta for a few hours. I got really sick of the introduction area.. not much more than 5 minutes after playing. The questing was generic -- of course I did my best to not read the text and just GTFO of the newbie zone. The combat was a step in the right direction of action-based mmo killing, but it didn't feel good to me. I'm also not a fan of futuristic lasers and space scenery. I would've been much happier being placed on an island, a random starting point away from my allies, and given a compass to find my way back to town. Hardcore.
What makes me accept my view on Wildstar as true ... that the game isn't good .. is the marketing and deception regarding Wildstar's nature. NCsoft sent a small team of employees to give an alienware laptop and free copies of Wildstar to a family in my city (Indianapolis). This is so.. manipulative .. in my eyes .. because it literally has nothing to do with the actual gameplay value of Wildstar. The game isn't better and the company isn't better just because they gave away a one time promotion. I'd be more inclined to play if NCsoft had a Wildstar pvp leaderboard (per server) that gave the top Guild free t-shirts at the end of each season/year for being the best. This actually applies to the game. Hardcore.
Wildstar is also marketed as "hardcore" because Carbine's/NCsoft's voice actor employee persistently uses this term in their marketing videos. I do not view Wildstar as a hardcore mmo by any means. I viewed LINEAGE 1 -- an NCsoft game, fyi -- as a hardcore mmo because it was setup to be a difficult game -- where dying means you lose days of work, months of items lost to your enemies, and overall frustration. You could entitle any game... let's make an example of Black Gold Online... as hardcore because it has the same values as Wildstar (honestly, it probably doesn't even have the same values as Wildstar, but I picked BGO at random)-- but it is actually hardcore? This term can't really be applied anyway, because Hardcore usually refers to DEATH WITHOUT A RESURRECTION in most games. Hardcore.
Nothing in particular about this game interested me. As for whether it'll fail or not, depends on a variety of things. Just cause I don't like it, that doesn't mean it'll fail. It's simply not my cup of tea or yours OP, but clearly there are others who enjoy it.
"For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast, And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed: And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill, And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!" ~Lord George Gordon Byron
You at being deliberately obtuse woe, we all know that carbine refer to hardcore within the context of raiding. It's a classic themepark mmo, it is not Eve. As for the free laptop, maybe you should watch the You tube about the family that got the lap top and be less mean spirited and bitter (all to easy on random forums). Nothing wrong with not liking a game, but why the hate?
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
I'm going to admit that I didn't read any of the previous comments before my post, and I'm just here to state what goes through my mind about Wildstar. Hardcore.
I played Wildstar's beta for a few hours. I got really sick of the introduction area.. not much more than 5 minutes after playing. The questing was generic -- of course I did my best to not read the text and just GTFO of the newbie zone. The combat was a step in the right direction of action-based mmo killing, but it didn't feel good to me. I'm also not a fan of futuristic lasers and space scenery. I would've been much happier being placed on an island, a random starting point away from my allies, and given a compass to find my way back to town. Hardcore.
What makes me accept my view on Wildstar as true ... that the game isn't good .. is the marketing and deception regarding Wildstar's nature. NCsoft sent a small team of employees to give an alienware laptop and free copies of Wildstar to a family in my city (Indianapolis). This is so.. manipulative .. in my eyes .. because it literally has nothing to do with the actual gameplay value of Wildstar. The game isn't better and the company isn't better just because they gave away a one time promotion. I'd be more inclined to play if NCsoft had a Wildstar pvp leaderboard (per server) that gave the top Guild free t-shirts at the end of each season/year for being the best. This actually applies to the game. Hardcore.
Wildstar is also marketed as "hardcore" because Carbine's/NCsoft's voice actor employee persistently uses this term in their marketing videos. I do not view Wildstar as a hardcore mmo by any means. I viewed LINEAGE 1 -- an NCsoft game, fyi -- as a hardcore mmo because it was setup to be a difficult game -- where dying means you lose days of work, months of items lost to your enemies, and overall frustration. You could entitle any game... let's make an example of Black Gold Online... as hardcore because it has the same values as Wildstar (honestly, it probably doesn't even have the same values as Wildstar, but I picked BGO at random)-- but it is actually hardcore? This term can't really be applied anyway, because Hardcore usually refers to DEATH WITHOUT A RESURRECTION in most games. Hardcore.
Wildstar just wasn't a game for me. Hardcore.
The term hardcore has evolved over time, I completely understand your definition of it (cause I was there :P in Lineage), but also Ultima online, EQ 1 online. The hardcore of pve and pvp is what lead to inception of many games we had in the previous generation.
But the term hardcore has evolved over the last decade, since WoW's release to WoW today. Hardcore has become a much more freely used term to describe players who spend a lot of time in a game.
And yes I agree Wildstar is not a hardcore game, they will nerf content and make changes to the game to make it easy for the more casual player. Wildstar tout it's hardcore nature of pve, but then shows there are easy version of the bosses in raids; you can do the hard version but you need more gear. They are more or less speaking or trying to attract the WoW crowd and not just the HARDCORE crowd.
Even if they're so hard on the term hardcore right now, eventually that's gonna go away and they'll change their mind set to more casual friendly environment. Hardcore MMO of EQ1 or Ultima online just doesn't have a niche anymore; because MMO isn't a niche anymore.
If WildStar is half finished , then please God leave it that way it is for a few months ! There is already too much content to pick from at the start. So whatever the op thinks is a finished game, please not yet ! Already 100's if not 1000's of hours of content already, I can wait for it" to be finished" .
And the art ? The art is bad ass! Seems to just be nit picking the hell out of it. WildStar is the most complete MMO to hit the market is how many years , five , ten ? Idk but it's been a long dam time.
This game just isn't for everyone, good luck on you're journey for a finished MMO .
Comments
So I am to die, since I don't own an Apple products?
You just should not be able to post. You say things with not facts backing it. Wildstar has more content at launch then any MMO I have played in 15 years. No new MMO has launched with this much elder game... Here is a list from another thread. Also as far as polish goes... one of the better games I have played as well. Cant wait to see how launch goes =-)
P.S. Thanks Kaladin for making this list.
I agree with this too. In a way its sad that this game is getting people so exited. Is this all we can hope for from mmo dev's from now on. Nothing at all new here.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
+ Player Housing & Guild Housing
All Time Favorites: EQ1, WoW, EvE, GW1
Playing Now: WoW, ESO, GW2
I'm sure he'll say it's finished once Carbine gets the grass to behave properly.
Post like this is the reason I would never be apart of a team making an MMO anymore, gamers are disrespectful and assume devs don't care. I was a gamer that went DEV to see what was going on behide the scenes . I see it both ways but I also know the cost of making an MMO, the devs could make a better game and add everything you want/. But for 60 bucks?? Or less, and all the people to torrent games, hell no. Games need to cost a ton more, people have no idea of the cost to make a MMO.
A lot of good devs are going mobile, way cheaper and easier and less whining. I personally hate working on MMO's now, because of the gamers whining. We sweat blood to make these games and get remarks like this? How about we shit on your work.. Some of you gamers really need to try and make a game, then come talk to us when you do... You really don't understand.
PS: Devs don't have the say, the big shots up stairs do, on what is release as well. just a little FYI..
List updated =-)
EOC, is a scam they went off line and scammed people including people that helped.. Enough said there, but I AGREE about the indies because I'm one of those, so I know we are taking it to the next level, we still need to pay for expensive programs.
Maya alone is 3.5k, for one person... So imagine all the software we need. I have right now over 20k in software and no where near done. Have I made that back yet?? Nope... Will I , I hope to one day, so gamers need to understand this.!!
I whole-heartedly agree with the OP. But its not just WildStar its all the MMOs in the last 7 or 8 years. I'll never buy into another MMO again until they prove to me they aren't trying to piggy-back on the themepark formula for "success". And by success i mean take my money for as little effort as possible on the producer/developer's part.
Elder Scrolls Online almost got me because of the IP. But i abstained and of course dodged another bullet.
***Edit*** I wanted to also add that its a greed issue and it'll never go away. So, imo, MMOs are totally screwed and the only hope we have rests with indie developers.
I've been saying for years that no MMO has the right to be called a WoW clone, because none of them launch with at least all of WoWs features. I have always been responded with things like "well its a 10 year old game, dont compare"...or "well it has XXXX new thing, so you shouldnt miss arenas or raids"........this is the first MMO launching with eldergame that at the very minimum includes everything WoW's eldergame does, and actually adds to it. Warplots are one of the craziest things iv ever seen. Warplots could have been a game on its own with the potential likes of dota or LoL. All I can say is I cant wait to see some amaizing things players come up with in warplots on twitch lol.
you know what we all really know?
your kind.
and we are bored by it. have a nice day and play whatever you play with your negativity.
and if you need some arguments, and since you mentioned wow (and why it was such a huge success according to you):
WoW has FIXED lightning. WoW has no moving grass at all.
so, i wonder, why you like WoW that much and on the other hand flame games which do it actually BETTER than WoW?
your argument is, plain and simple. invalid. and my hair ain't even a bird.
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
So you don't like the game, we get it. Why not just say it's not for you and move on?
I might have even just taken your post at face value, but you - like so many other people who must clearly feel the need to add that extra little jab - had to throw the 'or at least constantly brags about having planned' snide remark at the end.
At that point you just became another troll. Credibility gone.
While I admire your passion, his argument does have validity, ten pages worth and counting. There are many people who do not like this game. While you may not appreciate his comments or like them, he is voicing his opinion and many people share his feelings, again making his argument valid. I am truly not trying to antagonize you or upset you, if I did, I am sorry. People of all kinds exists and this site caters to lots of critical and often negative views on many games.
PS: Not everyone shares your opinion. If you are going to make a thread, make some valid details to be argued about rather then some false assumption about what everyone feels about a game. Come on now, its tiring seeing these thread for every game and how useless they are. Just because you want to be in denial over a game, or perhaps being defensive of another game your desperate to be considered good and feel it is threatened by this game, doesn't mean you can magically make everyone else jump to your side.
I came seeking mmo truth !
EQ2 fan sites
Truth is, everything's subjective. lol
I'm going to admit that I didn't read any of the previous comments before my post, and I'm just here to state what goes through my mind about Wildstar. Hardcore.
I played Wildstar's beta for a few hours. I got really sick of the introduction area.. not much more than 5 minutes after playing. The questing was generic -- of course I did my best to not read the text and just GTFO of the newbie zone. The combat was a step in the right direction of action-based mmo killing, but it didn't feel good to me. I'm also not a fan of futuristic lasers and space scenery. I would've been much happier being placed on an island, a random starting point away from my allies, and given a compass to find my way back to town. Hardcore.
What makes me accept my view on Wildstar as true ... that the game isn't good .. is the marketing and deception regarding Wildstar's nature. NCsoft sent a small team of employees to give an alienware laptop and free copies of Wildstar to a family in my city (Indianapolis). This is so.. manipulative .. in my eyes .. because it literally has nothing to do with the actual gameplay value of Wildstar. The game isn't better and the company isn't better just because they gave away a one time promotion. I'd be more inclined to play if NCsoft had a Wildstar pvp leaderboard (per server) that gave the top Guild free t-shirts at the end of each season/year for being the best. This actually applies to the game. Hardcore.
Wildstar is also marketed as "hardcore" because Carbine's/NCsoft's voice actor employee persistently uses this term in their marketing videos. I do not view Wildstar as a hardcore mmo by any means. I viewed LINEAGE 1 -- an NCsoft game, fyi -- as a hardcore mmo because it was setup to be a difficult game -- where dying means you lose days of work, months of items lost to your enemies, and overall frustration. You could entitle any game... let's make an example of Black Gold Online... as hardcore because it has the same values as Wildstar (honestly, it probably doesn't even have the same values as Wildstar, but I picked BGO at random)-- but it is actually hardcore? This term can't really be applied anyway, because Hardcore usually refers to DEATH WITHOUT A RESURRECTION in most games. Hardcore.
Wildstar just wasn't a game for me. Hardcore.
http://twitch.tv/woetothevanquished
"For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast,
And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed:
And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill,
And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!"
~Lord George Gordon Byron
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
The term hardcore has evolved over time, I completely understand your definition of it (cause I was there :P in Lineage), but also Ultima online, EQ 1 online. The hardcore of pve and pvp is what lead to inception of many games we had in the previous generation.
But the term hardcore has evolved over the last decade, since WoW's release to WoW today. Hardcore has become a much more freely used term to describe players who spend a lot of time in a game.
And yes I agree Wildstar is not a hardcore game, they will nerf content and make changes to the game to make it easy for the more casual player. Wildstar tout it's hardcore nature of pve, but then shows there are easy version of the bosses in raids; you can do the hard version but you need more gear. They are more or less speaking or trying to attract the WoW crowd and not just the HARDCORE crowd.
Even if they're so hard on the term hardcore right now, eventually that's gonna go away and they'll change their mind set to more casual friendly environment. Hardcore MMO of EQ1 or Ultima online just doesn't have a niche anymore; because MMO isn't a niche anymore.
If WildStar is half finished , then please God leave it that way it is for a few months ! There is already too much content to pick from at the start. So whatever the op thinks is a finished game, please not yet ! Already 100's if not 1000's of hours of content already, I can wait for it" to be finished" .
And the art ? The art is bad ass! Seems to just be nit picking the hell out of it. WildStar is the most complete MMO to hit the market is how many years , five , ten ? Idk but it's been a long dam time.
This game just isn't for everyone, good luck on you're journey for a finished MMO .