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Do you believe in a God
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"The greatest trick the devil played on humanity in the 20th century was convincing them that he didn't exist." (Paraphrasing) C.S. Lewis
"If a mother can kill her own child, what is left before I kill you and you kill me?" -Mother Teresa when talking about abortion after accepting the Nobel Peace Prize in 1979
well the thing that really i hate hate hate about most religions view of god is forgiveness.
i dont believe in absolute forgiveness some deeds should stick and you should never be forgiven. Or if you are forgiven you have to do 10 times as much as the 7 great labors of hercules.
i believe serial killers, rapists, sadists, and things of that nature shouldnt even be allowed to exist in the first place.
this also gets me to a point that i often debate. i see god the pure father of jesus as the source of all evil.
if god created us the angels, and everyone that means god was the first thing that means all come from god.
so that means every part of us and the angels all represent parts of god. So if god created lucifer then god had to have some evil in him, now this doesnt mean he acts with it.
JRR tolkein also if u read his book the silmarillion basically takes this point.
98% of the teenage population does or has tried smoking pot. If you''re one of the 2% who hasn''t, copy & paste this in your signature.
In our little worlds that we run around in (mmorpgs) playing heroes of several different types. I wonder if any like me stop and think. That maybe that blob on the screen is worth more then XP.
I mean perhaps my fearless warrior sometimes sits down after I log out and utterly weeps at the mass genoicde his hands have commited.
He must wonder what for! Oh why did 100s have to die that day.
Little knowing that for me the reason was quite clear. It was XP you see.
Perhaps this "hero" of mine has developed vast arrays of thoughts to explain his actions that day. Maybe he is comforted in his hours before sleep thinking that tommorow he will not do such things. Little knowing that todays actions where only a small drop in the bucket needed for that next level.
He really need be concerned with only one thing though. If he does not follow one command I gave him then he is getting deleted. I mean could you imagine the audacity if my character was to attempt to tell me what he was going to do when I logged on to play.
No mercy! The very first time that hero goes left when I hit d (go right) and then proceeds to tell me how I "should" be ... Well realisticly I'll probably just report a bug but aye I liked running with the story.
I understand where you're coming from, Vampyr. My own belief of forgiveness, however, is that you don't forgive others because they necessarily deserve it. But when you forgive others, your burden of scalding, black, despair-causing hatred alleviates, evaporates, lifts off of your shoulders, allowing you to be less miserable and more at peace in life, as you deserve. So in other words, even if you know of no reason why a certain hideously-evil-seeming person should be forgiven, you should seriously consider forgiving them anyways (while still trying to stop their evil actions, and never condoning them), for YOUR sake, so that YOU feel as good as you deserve to feel.
There's also the whole point of view that emotional possession, spiritual possession, mental imbalance, intelligence deficiency and/or gross ignorance can limit or eliminate a human's self control or ability to act properly instead of carelessly or sadistically. There are also some plain Jane evil people as well, of course, but how can you tell them apart from the innocent victims of their own overpowering psychological bent-ness? Add to these concepts the underlying truth that anger/hate causes compulsive, almost demonic abusiveness in ALL people, to one degree or another, and you have a formula to explain much of what goes on in this world. The sad fact is, unfortunately, that in hating the hate-twisted, we inevitably become somewhat demonized ourselves--which causes us to lose some of our own self control, our own perfection of self, and in times of extreme pain or distress perhaps a LOT of self control is lost...and the cycle continues...till one day...wifey gets a broken jaw...bar fight...WWIII...nukes...BOOM!!! Take THAT motherfuckers! YOU DESERVED IT!!! Oh wait, all of humanity's children's flesh is melting off...Hmm, perhaps our heroic warrior intentions went astray somewhere...you think?!? Nahh... DEATH TO THE HATERS!!! And so forth. Judgement IS anger, and anger IS misery and abuse. And abuse always finds an innocent target, or two. Given the above, an argument could be made that forgiveness may well be the lesser of evils.
Anyways, those are my thoughts. Something to ponder, at least.
P.S. I agree that it seems like a gross mistake for God to have allowed beings the power to put other beings into torment of various sorts. I do believe in God, but frankly that's a big bone I have to pick with the guy. Of course, the allowance of torture may have been an accident... Or not. One day, you and me will find out, I warrant (i.e. through meditation, prayer, and/or death). In the meantime, God can hardly be surprised at having a lack of unquestioning worshipers, given the human condition.
-Golden
"Which makes you think...Maybe God doesn't reign destruction down on people at all...Maybe the fact of the matter is the only reason this earth isn't a hellish wasteland, completely maimed and destroyed by Satan, is for the whole fact of God's mercy in protecting the good and the righteous."
If that were the case, then God would not be as powerful as the church would like you to believe then would he?
In fact, if that were true, then as far as the world balance is concerned "Satan" would be the more powerful.
Also, God does not do more for the righteous, even for someone who believes in christianity you should know this. The Bible says this world belongs to Satan, and therefore good comes to those people not the righteous.
Anyways, its kind of irrelevant. If God exists he is an unconcious god, because we live in a systematic universe. Religion is created out of fear of the unknown, that is all. If there is something there, which I believe there will be some life after I die here, it is NOT anything we know everything about. I know the unknown is a very natural human fear, but get over it, reason is much more important than indulging your weakness of fear.
If you really need a religion, find one that doesn't try and spoon feed you everything. The point of trying to understand god is in your own questioning and understanding.
I have to say i dont believe in God and i really dont like the Christian church they come all happy with smiles and it's just all false in my oppinion. Anyway i'll share a little of my mind here.
Where to start...ahhh yes, think about it how long has Christianity been around 2000 years maybe a little less, wouldn't it make more sense that if a dvine being did create the Universe then his religion would of been the very first the religion of the first living man?
Lets take the Bible the Bible is a big book of contradictions, and the present day version of it has changed so much from the original. I'm not just talking about translation but also that it HAS been changed by numerous people mainly the early Christian Church and the Vatican. So to people today how can a book that has been manipulated be the words of God.
Also have you noticed that every civilization of man since the beginning of our existance has had some form of 'religion' IMO religion is something created by the human mind to help explain things we can or couldn't understand. 'Oh no a big burning ball of fire fell from the sky'....'Wait its ok it was just God' <--- theres a little scenario in fact it was a asteroid but if you dont know just say it was God its just so easy. Also religion could be a form of explaining death, we create it subcontiously so that we have something to believe in something to care about and to stop our fear.
The main reason that most of Europe is Christian is mostly because Emperor Constantine of the Roman Empire converted and he and his men made sure that nearly all of Europe did also, erdaicating so called 'Pagan' (which isn't devil worship) relgions along the way.
The name of God has been twisted and turned so much over history, some of the worst crimes in history have been done 'in the name of God'. Killing 10,000 people is a tragedy, killing 100,000 because it was Gods will makes you a saint.
Thats just a few of my theories and thoughts, in no way or form is this flaming or having a go at anyone, just my oppinion. Thanks for reading.
Thanks reroller.
I have a completely open mind.
I dont believe because I have seen nothing in life nor heard any argument to make me believe.
I have read the bible 3 times cover to cover and the Koran twice.... does absolutely nothing for me... just a good read... no more convincing than lord of the rings...
As I said however I retain an open mind and would not be at all surprised to find out god exists...
But the real question that keeps me from believing is.... which god exists....
All you religious types cant all be right... some of you are wrong.... either the christians or the muslims or the bhudists or whatever.... only one group of you can be right...
Thats the real problem.... millions of you, or all of you, or some of you are suffering from a dire form of mass delusion....
Me... Im open to all sugestions that make sense.... but none of you do that very often.
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"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
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"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
Close your eyes, close your ears, and think. For once in your life, stop letting others tell you whats going on, and think for yourself. And if your anything more than a compleate idiot, the truth will come to you. And when it does, it will be beautifull. You will never appriciate life, or freedom more than you do that moment.
Humans have had the largest thinking copasity of all known life for quite some time now. Its about time to take off the dipars and use our brains, instead of our natural fears and gulability, to reason our existance.
And if reality is to hard to deal with, then go jump off a bridge. We need less weak-minded people anyway.
Ohh, p.s. I spell like shit, and couldent care less.
"It is in your nature to do one thing correctly; Before me, you rightfully tremble. But, fear is not what you owe me. You owe me awe." ~Francis Dolarhyde
Bullshit.
Or maybe i should make up a religion that says rape 8 year olds all day, then, for me atleast, it would be moraly decent to do such? Bullshit.
People dont refrain from raping and murdering because some invisable dude in the sky frowns apon it. They generaly refrain from such acts, because all humans, except for the unbalanced, and the corrupt, dont want to hurt others. Everyone has at one point thought of how fun it would be to kill that person thats always mean to you or whatever, but normaly we dont do it. Why? A.) We fear the concequences. And B.) Killing someone, means hurting them, and hurting thouse around them.
To sum up, we get our morals from where ever we want. Some get them from invisable people, some dont. Some make bad morals, and these, we punish, because we are a sociaty, we need to protect eachother from harm. I myself make my own morals, and to say that without religion, thier are no morals, is wrong. To say that morals are based on religon is wrong.
Morals are a set of rules that are internal, enforced by yourself. We have had pretty much the same morals since long before religion. We have them, because they help us, as a whole, to survive. And before religion, thats all thier was, a little race of 2 legged people, trying to survive.
"It is in your nature to do one thing correctly; Before me, you rightfully tremble. But, fear is not what you owe me. You owe me awe." ~Francis Dolarhyde
I'm with Goldee, I believe that God is love, but I believe a little differently. I don't believe in hell. I DO believe God can be angry and wrathful, but I believe his punishments are corrective, and not out of spite. I believe that one day, every man, woman, and child will be saved.
As for God must be angry because we're made in his image... Sort of true in my opinion. I believe we're STILL being made in his image today. Life is to experience things and learn... I don't really believe in free will, because that would give us more power then God.
Even God himself said there would be people in the future that lied about him, and would use him to make money (don't know the specific scriptures)
This is just a bit of my beliefs really.
All religions are basically clubs for people who are so terrified of their imminent death, they'll buy into fairytales and obvious myth in order to soothe that fear.
This wouldn't be a problem in itself (people are free to live a lie if they so wish) but since religion is the number one cause of hatred, bigotry, war and intolerance I think it should be cause for concern.
If you're trying to figure out the world and universe you're a part of, there are more rational starting points than "Well I guess an invisible man must have made it all.... DER-HYUK!".
This is pretty much dead on, but its a bit more than that. Religion was ORIGINALY these 'clubs' you speak of, but you really cant blame them. I mean, these werent high thinkers, we were dumb back then. The top mind of the land at about the time religion was invented, was a guy (cant remember the name) who stated that because of the clean whitness he noticed in the teeth of dead dog sharks, that for people to attain such clean whitness of the teeth, we should all scrub our teeth with the cooked brains of a dead dog shark twice a year.
But the problem is, we are obviously not that dumb anymore. Then why dose anyone still belive in invisable people in the sky? Well, because mommy and daddy said so. From the day your born, GOD is the awnser to everything. God this, God that. From the day were born, 2+2=4, grass is green, and god is real. My best friend is a god person, he thinks hes being all "open mined" when he tells me that when his daughter is 13, he will let her decide her faith on her own. Dude... youve been sending her to over night religion camps every weekend since she was three! Its like, your son turns 13, and you say; "Ok boy, some people belive that when your happy, you need to frown, and i want you to decide if you belive that also."
The human race has only 2 chances for salvation.
1.) Everyone starts being reasonably sceptic, and starts thinking for themselves. (HAHAHAH! HAAAAAHAHAHAHA!)
2.) Scientists in japan invent a huge space ship, and decide to let everyone whos not a dumbass on board. Then leave the idiots here on earth to belive in invisable people and farm.
Sidenote; I belive farming is a very important and honorable profession, I simplaly used it as an example of a very old way of life.
"It is in your nature to do one thing correctly; Before me, you rightfully tremble. But, fear is not what you owe me. You owe me awe." ~Francis Dolarhyde
It's simple.....
God is a con, the amount of power and wealth churchs used to recieve was phenominal. They nearly compete a king for power.
It was all created to explain wierd things that happened centuries ago when there was no knowledge of the sciences we have now. Also comfort those who didn't know ho to turn to in time of trouble.
God is a con, no other way to put it
Agreed. God is nothing more than a way to get people to follow you. Have to admit it works wonderfully, seeing how many people still blindly follow some fairytale books.
No, i don't believe in a God. And even if i would want to believe in a God I would not know which one to pick. Who knows if the Christian god is the right one, or the God of the Muslims or the Gods of the ancient Greeks? Heck, maybe the God from some tribe in Africa the is the only existing God and all of you Christians and Muslims (and me
) are all doomed for eternity. It's so small a chance that I believe in the right God that I don't find it worth the trouble.
Believing in a God because you can't understand how the universe started is just silly. How would you explain the existance of God? Or can you comprehend a God just came out of nothing (or has always been there, with no beginning or end to it's existance) but you can't comprehend a universe that was suddenly there?
It just shows that people have learned nothing from the past. People used to think that things like solar eclipses had to be the work of some God because they could not explain how it happened. So people just search for something else we can't explain just yet and say "Look, my tiny mind can't understand how that can be, thus God exists".
I found this thread quite interesting...have to admit i got a chuckle from a couple of comments.
However, let's be considerate of one another when it comes to this issue...it can be just as volitile as politics.
With that said, I believe many of you guys know I used to be a Priest in the Anglican Church before hanging up my stole.
I left for inside church reasons and it had nothing to do with believing in God. I left for more "trivial matters"
Now, with that said...I want to put my two cents in.
Some people say that others embrace religion because they are afraid of the possibility of dieing and then *poof* that's it..nothing.
However, before I was a Priest I was a die hard athiest (I became a Christian when I was 19). I even had the official Athiest membership club....yup...i frigging paid yearly dues to be part of Athiest.org
However, I did not convert on the basis that I was scared. I could have cared less as an Athiest when I died....well....because an Athiest "belief" is that there is utterly nothing after this corporal mortal life
If you believe in ghosts, etc, then you are not an Athiest...you are something else.
I spent 8 years in college and seminary to be a Priest. True, it was more scholar work than anything....however when I actually was assigned to a church, that's where i got my hands into the muck and mire (so to speak)
For anyone who claims they are an athiest and believe that after you die there is nothing else...well...I sorta hate to break your bubble there lol. I've seen things that would give you nightmares for weeks. During my time as a Priest, I have blessed around 23 houses amongst other priestly duties. Let me tell you that the things I have seen...if you were their, your philsophy of athiesm would fall to pieces.
I've seen apparitions, Ive been pushed almost through a piece of drywall, etc. Out of the 23 houses I blessed (when a priest bless a house it is because the owners think that house is haunted and wants a Priest to "drive away the spirits"), 7 of them were downright haunted. Im talking about Poltergeist the movie haunted.
One blessing, I was confronted by an apparition of a man in his 60's wearing an untucked plaid shirt, overalls, and well....no feet....it pretty much was a nothing when it got that low. It was in Virginia where I blessed this house. He said nothing but the anger in his eyes when I walked into the bedroom to bless that section will FOREVER be in my conscious. 1. Ever seen a ghost before?? 2. Ever seen a pissed off ghost before??? I have and it was one of the most stressful parts of my job.
My point? My point is I have seen supernatural things while being a Priest that simply makes the theory of Atheism null and void. It's sorta like saying we dont believe that the Eiffel Tower exists....yet Im staring at it right smack in the face.
Everyone's entitled to their beliefs and that is fine. I just wanted to share with you why I believe in God and the proof I encountered to know that something exists on the other side....and it's not blackness of nothingness...and it's not always daisies and roses either.
People who have to create conspiracy and hate threads to further a cause lacks in intellectual comprehension of diversity.
Even though Im not a beleiver I would encourage others who do not believe to think about this.
The vast majority of the worlds population are religious. (like 90%)
This leads to 2 possible conclusions....
1. Most of the worlds population are suffering a mass phsycosis..... or
2. There is some form of higher being
What I think everyone should do is exercise some respect and restraint in thier comments because after al NONE OF US CAN PROVE OUR THEORIES!
Ergo your opinion, whatever it is, is as valid as mine.... or as invalid if you prefer.
The religious folk can no more give us a rational explanation to prove gods existence, than you atheiests can to prove the big bang theory. We can all cut and paste from google all day but do we REALLY understand either Jesus's true mind and nature or how a singularity works ? I think not.
That is why the truly inteligent person does two things.
1. Keep an open mind
2. Respect the beliefs of others
If you can do that then you will keep both friends and your opinions and your self respect intact.
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"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
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"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
And then he wisely double posts
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"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
-+-+-+-+-+-+
"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
I really hate to get off subject, but were you an...exorcist?
Excuse me while I add exorcist to your list of 6 Jobs in the past 15 years.
"Whoever controls the media controls the mind..-'Jim Morrison"
"When decorum is repression, the only dignity free men have is to speak out." ~Abbie Hoffman
I have seen demons, Iiiii have seen beasts with 6 eyes. But to this day, I have never seen the likes of you.
Ghosts and such are all just in your mind, what you saw was probably just a reflection of light bouncing off a mirror as the sun shon through the window, that appeared to be a ghostly old man.
I believe in GOD.. not like Christians but...
Ghosts are not in your mind.. well they are in most people's but I live in a haunted house so I now know better.
Before I live in the house I would have thought anyone who said they saw a ghost was nuts!
I don't preach it but I know what I saw.. and it came with the lot... sudden temperature drop, vision, the works... I was too shocked to even be scared.
When you see one you also feel it.. like an cold anvil in your throat.
Yeah I have lived in a haunted house before, six people died in it, so I have seen my share of ghosts
And my Grandmother use to take care of an old woman, this old woman would stay up all night and talk to something, and sometimes scream, in the morning she would have scrathes all over her chest, if it was self induced or not I don't know
That shows you there is alot of things that are hard to explain
Don't you worry little buddy. You're dealing with a man of honor. However, honor requires a higher percentage of profit
No, that shows you that people like spooky stories.
There are no ghosts. There's no Santa. There's no Easter Bunny. Superman isn't real. There's no god.
Glad we could clear that up.
Don't you worry little buddy. You're dealing with a man of honor. However, honor requires a higher percentage of profit