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Elder Scrolls Online has ~775,000 subscribers - report
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I think your giving Superdata too much credibility, they do not, and never have had, access to insider data regarding subscriptions, and most of their figures are gained by 'extrapolation' based on existing accessible data that is available to the general public, in that sense they are more akin to journalists, until Zenimax releases some actual data regarding sub numbers, then like the Superdata figures, all we have to rely on, is pretty much guesswork.
So, you're saying they are lying?
"they do not, and never have had, access to insider data regarding subscriptions"
Phry, you're usually rather reasonable, so to make such a concrete statement based on absolutely nothing is odd for you. That you even know they get their numbers "directly from publishers and developers, totaling 50+ publishers and 450+ game titles" and still hold such a stance is beyond odd.
So you think this is a scam they've been running on the financial sector and game industry for over three years and they just haven't been caught yet? You don't think that Microsoft, Google, or any given one of the game developers/publishers would have called them out on it or even stopped buying the reports if they were lying about where they got their data? You don't realize how crazy that sounds, especially when you make your claim as if it was an indisputable fact?
"they do not, and never have had, access to insider data regarding subscriptions"
Srsly?
Some forum clown says they get it from Raptr and you take that as gospel, but when an established company says they get it from the publishers and developers, you say they're full of crap. I don't get it.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
No the "forum clown" said Raptr or something like it.
Publishers and developers e.g. Zynga on games like e.g. Farmville give out information on e.g. Daily Average Users. Numbers released "directly from publishers and developers". And there are hundreds of mobile games and many publishers. So no I am not saying they are lying.
As far as TESO - and other PC mmos go though, as Phry says: "They will not, and never have had, access to insider data regarding subscriptions". I fully support what Phry said. Check out the conference calls that the likes of EA, Activision and so forth host. The data they release is very limited on such things.
If you believe that Zenimax are giving Superdata - and only Superdata, info on TESO then you are, imo, naïve.
So if they are not getting the data from Zenimax were is it coming from? Are they "making it up" - sorry basing it on their behavourial analysis of all those mobile game users? Or are they using some software that "tracks TESO players". Raptr and XFire maybe but there are others. I think tracking software is more likely than trying to relate mobileplay styles to PC mmos but decide for yourself.
The alternative - that Zenimax are secretly releasing actual numbers - to SuperData ... seriously?
So - as I said - don't take the data as "accurate". Allow a huge margin of error.
I guess I'm just naive.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Highlighted is the part I have a problem with. That for some reason (why?) they chose to release exact sub numbers to SuperData, but mask it from the rest of the world in any sort of public annoucement, just doesn't make sense.
It actually does seem more reasonable that SuperData is interpreting the data rather than reporting on actual numbers, since I don't think even they said exactly where they got this figure from.
BTW, I don't think the number reported is unreasonable, could very well be this figure, but all doubt could easily be removed by Zenimax, yet they chose not to, which leaves folks speculating to the accuracy of the figures.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I love the Elder Scrolls games and by no means do I want ESO to fail, but sadly I think it already has. For starters this data means nothing as it's just another attempt to guestimate numbers. With that said, 700k subs on a game that had franchise recognition and a 300 million dollar budget (which was higher than SWToR) is not really a success.
With the game they released it should have been B2P with a cash shop or held off on releasing until the game was more bug free and had some real end game content. I am not saying that the game is terrible, it's just that once you hit max level the game has little to offer. Making you play through the opposing factions story lines is not ample content and is a way for the developers to not have to devote more resources to end game.
I hope they can turn it around, I also hope that they add some real end game content so I can resub again in the future.
I miss the good old days of companies such as Blizzard, Bioware, and CCP releasing offical numbers, and wathcing people fight over if they were lieing or not.
Now, all we get are unofficial numbers from fan sites and unsourced news sites, and people fighing that they are 100% accurate...
What has this world come to :-)
Yay, i am one of those happy subscribers.
Couldnt care less if 10k or 750k or 5 mil as long as my guild is fully packed with active players i can run through cyrodill.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
If you believe Zenimax have given SuperData actual subscription numbers .... OK. I don't.
You're right. It doesn't make sense, because it isn't true. It's available to those who it's relevant to, like all the other numbers they have collected from other developers and publishers. Just because Joe Gamer doesn't have access to it doesn't mean that people who want it don't.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Hah, this is so true. How many times have people picked apart official number announcements and financial calls from the actual studios (<--this is key) and spun the info to fit their pros or cons? Now that unofficial numbers are being released with no back up or confirmation from the actual studio (<-- again this is key), people are still trying to spin to fit their pros and cons.
Until ZOS gives us their numbers, all of this is artificial fluff. Sure they don't have to give us numbers, but why not? They would rather a third party site release their numbers instead of themselves? Doesn't make sense.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
Its not all fluff, NCSoft, CCP and Blizz release their numbers so superdata is place to have it in 1 place, but info is easily available from their financial reports.
But its total random internetz crap for games like ESO and SWTOR because ZOS and EA HAVE NOT released numbers (EA actually hides SWTOR numbers).
Its THAT simple. Their guess is as good as anyone elses on internetz from varius "analysts", even Knotwood.
You claim NCSoft releases thier numbers, but EA/Bioware HIDES their SWTOR numbers. I can find vastly more officialy sourced player number reports for SWTOR than I can for all NCSoft games combined....very curious for a company that hides their numbers
Going back to my initial point.....i miss the days when folks would fight over official numbers, instead of unofficial numbers from fansites and unsourced new sites.
Oh well, please enlighten us of official EAs revenue for SWTOR in 2013. Exactly like NCSfot does for their games (numbers which you can see just copied at superdata from NCSofts financial reports)
And you are quite silly with that "revenue has doubled" ariticle. Doubled from WHAT exactly. Because revenue was so bad at the end of P2P it wasnt really hard to double it.
Yes EA hides SWOTRs numbers behind titles like FIIFA which is notoriously good money machine.
You are narrowing down your initial statement from "EA has never released SWTOR numbers", to "EA hasnt released total revenu 2013 SWTOR numbers by themselves"....I already gave you a link showing EA stating 500k subs and 1.7 million new accounts in mid 2013. How many times has NCSoft released subscription or actvie player counts (the more important number from an MMO player's perspective) for thier MMOs? A few months ago Bioware even stated that SWTOR has a million active players a month, and 10 million "casual" (whatever that means) players that play every now and then. That holds much more weight to me than total earnings or "registered acocunts/copies sold"
In any event I agree with your new statement, not with the previous one I quoted.
This is discussion about revenue numbers and im discussing revenue numbers, if you want to discuss something else, well, make your own thread about it.
And revenue is very important, we can testify what happens whengame is successful (hire more devs, speed up updates) and when its a failure (fire 2/3 of your staff, bring content updates to snail pace and cut your best content from further updates). And yes...gasp...number of people playing (and paying)...oh my gosh...is directly linked to revenue.
So yeah, w/e.
This discussion/thread is about ESO subscriber numbers.....not toal revenu.
The title of this thread is "Elder Scrolls Online has ~ 775,000 subscribers - Report"
The exchange you quoted only mentions official subscriber/player numbers
If you want to talk about total revenu for 2013, then
A) Dont quote my post about subscriber numbers
and
I was under the impression that SuperData is doing what a lot of people on these forums attempt to do. SuperData is taking a large, random sample of a population and from that sample determining population statistics with a known margin of error. This information is accurate enough that people are willing to pay for it, and the information that SuperData collects is non-specific enough that publishers and developers are willing to share it.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
So, from release to June, ESO has had 772K subscribe to the game.
No wonder ZM is keeping quiet.
You tell me that you arnt gonna "let me bait you like I do to others", yet you stalk me from thread to thread? Nowhere in this entire exhange have I bashed any games, so please stop quoting me and claiming that i consistanly bash swtor, ESO, FFXIV etc etc.
Oh really?
So "So far, a subscriber base of 772,374"
and 163m$ for SWTOR is "non-specific"...yeah right and those companies wont even share it with public, in EA case even on shareholders conference calls WHEN DIRECTLY ASKED ABOUT IT. Dude.
The only accurate numbers from that list are those that are AVAILABLE to you to like NCSofts financial reports.
And yes, people are willing to buy lot of crap, theres sucker born every minute. Just look how many "bought" it here rofl.
Just to mention that SWTOR, LOTRO and Rift are not subscription based games in the first place (even Tera i think its F2P worldwide) lol
I'm not exactly sure what you're getting so huffy about here. It's amusing though, so keep it up.
SuperData's research isn't meant to replace investor information. It's also not meant to be an exact measure of a developer's product. So in that regard, no, the numbers are not "accurate". But then the numbers come with a statistic explaining how accurate the people buying the information can expect them to be.
Look at it this way. You are saying that the developers have more information than anyone else. This is absolutely true. They do know more about what's going on than anyone outside of the industry, including people on internet forums. They also know how valuable the information provided by SuperData is. If the information did not provide value, they wouldn't buy it. They buy it because it gives them information that they otherwise would not get. They buy it because it is information that they cannot get from SuperData's website for free.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
"Just to mention that SWTOR, LOTRO and Rift are not subscription based games in the first place (even Tera i think its F2P worldwide)"
Just to clarify, they were P2P in the first place. I know that's not what you were getting at but it is so easily forgotten by those who tell us how great F2P games are.
As to Superdata, best we can get with the caveat that as it is the only source, that's not really saying much.
What only "source"
Internetz is full of sources like that lol
The only sad thing is amount of people that fall for it in this thread alone. Its even more sad if they do it on purpose (choose to ignore the reality of it and accept it on a level of "horoscpope accuracy")
And it really doesnt matter when and if they were P2P. The whole article is so sloppy that it seems as if someone really drunk wanted to play a prank on poor internetz.
These people are almost as bad as the SWTOR fans who really think it's the third most played MMORPG in the world.
SuperData is terrible.
Now, population stats from last year, compared to this year, are less than half on all servers. Just going by that simple fact alone, one could see that it is NOT doing as well as they say. (SWTOR, that is.)
As for TESO, I can't say, but when you're two months into release and your game is on sale for 10$?
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