You have no definition of what "delivery" is. On many projects, you have what are known as milestones, you reach said milestone, you get funded for the next milestone, you don't reach said milestone, you can become unfunded or only partially funded. Not kickstarter terms... contract terms. Depends on the contract.
So, you can be fully delivered and not actually deliver an end product because you are only meeting milestones... such as building a part of the final product. So in 2009 when 60% were fully delivered does that really say 60% of the games on kickstarter went live or merely meeting milestones in the project? We don't know that. I seriously doubt they did go live, only met some milestone.
It probably simply means that they fullfilled the promise of the kickstarter campaign.
Overall, the overall ongoing project rate is 58% (which you get from 100% – 37% (full project delivery) – 3% (project cancellation) – 3% (formal hiatus)). Partially delivered projects are considered to be ongoing projects, since they have more to deliver. It’s arguable that projects on official hiatus should be classified as ongoing projects as well, but I considered those projects stopped for the moment and therefore shouldn’t be considered ‘ongoing’. If you wish to use a definition where the partial deliver rate counts as a ‘full’ project delivery, add that result to the above calculation – you still end up with about half of projects not having delivered to backers.
the author does not call the 58% failures but they missed their estimated deadline
I am sure you have a link to back up...."the majority of games released so far via kickstarter have been very popular ... Decent reviews and good sales numbers" I mean a statement like that would have some hard evidence to back it up. I can't imagine someone just making that up to make something they support look better...right?
OK I will just do the metascores I guess on the games I listed as I dont have the time to do anything else.
They all have decent enough ratings for that site really but it gives you a bit of an idea I guess.
So 5 games with decent reviews is the majority?
Sorry it's clear you have no leg to stand on just admit you pulled that saying out of no where and have ZERO evidence to back it up and we can move on.
You could always just search it by keyword like this
Technically the majority of the games here with metacritic ratings are positive, but does it even matter? You're looking for a silver bullet here, but the whole topic of conversation is surrounding whether or not Kickstarter is a scam or is producing anything worthwhile, or somehow exposing Kickstarter for the shady operator it is. I think it was already mentioned somewhere here (may have been you) that ~366 game projects have been fully funded through Kickstarter. If we even say that 1 in 5 games that are successfully Kickstarted find their way onto Steam, I think that's pretty decent. Also, the simple fact that Steam is supporting these games should give credibility to Kickstarter.
Your basic argument is that Kickstarter doesn't deliver and is, therefore, a scam. I think it's been demonstrated quite extensively that Kickstarter does deliver. If we're going to nit-pick about physical goods delivery, then why don't you go and source out some supporting stats that say that retail Collector's Editions always ship their physical items. That would be very interesting. In my experience I a delay about half the time on one item or another. Let's see if Destiny can put it over the 50/50 mark!
You're asking everyone else to own up and admit they were wrong, but you're such an asshat that you will sit and hide behind a generic "it's my opinion, so I can't be wrong" argument. /facepalm
Well keep smacking yourself in the face buddy. Here I'll post it again just for you.. I know you like to pick and choose games to help support your cause but here is the truth. I'll highlight the part that proves you wrong.
" Of the projects that have shipped, well-reviewed successes such as FTL: Faster Than Light are UNCOMMON!! and only a very few have cracked an 80 average on Metacritic. Meanwhile, Godus’s miserable alpha launch has all but killed backers’ optimism for Peter Molyneux’s second project at 22 Cans, while the extremely well-funded Ouya has struggled to meet expectations."
Ok, and I'll throw back more stats at you, then, if we're talking about quality:
15 out of 25 games with metascores are >= 70 (or 60%)
I'm trying my best here to be objective, but these articles are just ridiculous. Honestly, I don't really think that the video game industry as a whole does much better than a Kickstarter, does it? That wouldn't be so bad if people working in the gaming industry are WORKING IN THE GAMING INDUSTRY and people in the gaming industry are throwing millions of dollars at games to make them stick. Whereas games like Chivalry are just getting made in mom and dad's basement with whatever funds they can scrounge together for last years technology or software & hardware from 38 Studio's auction.
We shouldn't be bashing Kickstarters we should be throwing support behind we'll thought-out projects with young up-and-coming teams who are passionate about making something revolutionary. That's what it's about.
Those are cute little links but not sure the point of them. You are replying to an article I posted because the poster lied about how the "majority of kickstarter games get good reviews". I never said anything about xb or ps.
Yup, and the majority of games reviewed DO, based on what we can find through metacritic. Majority doesn't mean all, and the link I gave you to steam clearly shows that 60% of the games there are above average (70%+). That's a majority.
I love how you think you're actually proving something. Anyway, I'm done. I can't argue with your opinion anyway.
Keep spinning buddy you are one of the better (saddest) spinners I have seen in this site. Nice work keep up your crusade to give meaning to the three games you play..../claps
I don't need to give meaning to anything, I play those games because I like them, not because they were kickstarter project.
kickstarter does need some sort of liability and should take the lead in sueing scammers out there. 7 days to die for example is coming a long nicely and funded through kickstarter. While its late as can be on when it projected to release they are entering alpha 9 and everyone who has keys to the game are happy with how things are going. Another game though the dead linger was funded and pretty much has done very very little to actually improve the gameplay. They just finished making the graphics better and on steam has zero people playing it most of the time. Kickstarter funds shouldnt just be given out to these companies until they have at the very least a working alpha where most major systems are in then get their funds. Right now its pretty much make a small playable demo that one soul could basically do and collect tons of free money from people who are desperate to play new indie games. This system just leads to salesmen who can swindle free money away and take years to finish a project or walk with your money. Kickstarter should have some sort of safeguards in place for this or they should be liable themselves to pay back ripped off players.
Originally posted by cronius77 kickstarter does need some sort of liability and should take the lead in sueing scammers out there. 7 days to die for example is coming a long nicely and funded through kickstarter. While its late as can be on when it projected to release they are entering alpha 9 and everyone who has keys to the game are happy with how things are going. Another game though the dead linger was funded and pretty much has done very very little to actually improve the gameplay. They just finished making the graphics better and on steam has zero people playing it most of the time. Kickstarter funds shouldnt just be given out to these companies until they have at the very least a working alpha where most major systems are in then get their funds. Right now its pretty much make a small playable demo that one soul could basically do and collect tons of free money from people who are desperate to play new indie games. This system just leads to salesmen who can swindle free money away and take years to finish a project or walk with your money. Kickstarter should have some sort of safeguards in place for this or they should be liable themselves to pay back ripped off players.
If they had the money to make a playable version of their game they probably wouldn't need the funding to begin with. What you are asking for would require a lot of work and kickstarter is a mean to speed up the process to get to that point (alpha gameplay).
There is already a safeguard, the unfunded project attest to that. If you don't prove to people that you can do the job, you won't meet your goal, and so won't receive any money. There will most likely be people that try to profit from it, the same way there are people profiting from charity or other schemes.
Also if there is an obvious fraud, they will be prosecuted by the government.
When you pay money into Kickstarter, you are not a CUSTOMER so you do not have CUSTOMER protection.
When you pay money into kickstarter you are not an INVESTOR so you do not have rights to capital or shares in the company.
When you pay money into Kickstarter you are a BACKER, the same as if you gave that money to charity, do you have any right to say where charities spend the money they collect NO you do not.
Now, there are some shams operating out of kickstarter, same as there are some false charities, so use your own judgement and if something is too good to be true, call it. The Yogscast game was being made by an unproven studio who had never took on anything of that level before and people threw money at it because, lol Yogzcast are funny.
Well look, you have no right to anything really, go ahead, start a civil case, I will be watching with interest because I would love to see the laws tested, but look into what you are paying for.
When you put money into kickstarter you are making a DONATION To some one, to give them a chance to realise their dream, you are not investing in their company, you are not purchasing anything, you give them money to get started and they promise to furnish you with something upon successful completion, but Kickstarter its self warns you projects are NOT guaranteed to be completed.
You paid your bucks, you took your chance, and in this case you lost out. Theres nothing you can really do unless you want to get an actual lawyer involved and test international law on this thing.
But to be honest, dont talk about consumer rights or protections as a BACKER of a kickstarter, you lose any rights other than those that the company gives you. Welcome to the world of startup industries.
Kickstarter is a gamble, all the way through. Though, it is good that the delivery rate (after 2009) is going up and the hiatus and cancellation rates are going down.
The information presented is kind of old though. It would be cool to see some updated statistics.
It shows delivery on time, 37% delivered, 8% partial, 5% cancelled. So while not on time, it could still be as high as 87% delivered but delayed or 55% cancelled. Still early in kickstarter history to get a good trend.
Someone else actually read through all the comments from the article, and the actual delivery rate is something like 58%. Though, I would wonder how that rate compares with the video game industry in general. I'm sure there are a lot of games that get funded, get a little bit written, and then fold.
But yes, more current information that I am far too lazy to accumulate would be very interesting to see.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
When you pay money into Kickstarter, you are not a CUSTOMER so you do not have CUSTOMER protection.
When you pay money into kickstarter you are not an INVESTOR so you do not have rights to capital or shares in the company.
When you pay money into Kickstarter you are a BACKER, the same as if you gave that money to charity, do you have any right to say where charities spend the money they collect NO you do not.
Now, there are some shams operating out of kickstarter, same as there are some false charities, so use your own judgement and if something is too good to be true, call it. The Yogscast game was being made by an unproven studio who had never took on anything of that level before and people threw money at it because, lol Yogzcast are funny.
Well look, you have no right to anything really, go ahead, start a civil case, I will be watching with interest because I would love to see the laws tested, but look into what you are paying for.
When you put money into kickstarter you are making a DONATION To some one, to give them a chance to realise their dream, you are not investing in their company, you are not purchasing anything, you give them money to get started and they promise to furnish you with something upon successful completion, but Kickstarter its self warns you projects are NOT guaranteed to be completed.
You paid your bucks, you took your chance, and in this case you lost out. Theres nothing you can really do unless you want to get an actual lawyer involved and test international law on this thing.
But to be honest, dont talk about consumer rights or protections as a BACKER of a kickstarter, you lose any rights other than those that the company gives you. Welcome to the world of startup industries.
Fraud is still fraud. Probably not worth fighting such a battle yourself tho.
Comments
It probably simply means that they fullfilled the promise of the kickstarter campaign.
fully agree - whenever i pledge for anything i assume a 6+ month delay
on similar note,
commentary from author of 366 videogame study (goto comments)
http://evilasahobby.com/2014/01/18/kickstander-only-around-a-third-of-kickstarted-video-game-projects-fully-deliver-to-their-backers/
Overall, the overall ongoing project rate is 58% (which you get from 100% – 37% (full project delivery) – 3% (project cancellation) – 3% (formal hiatus)). Partially delivered projects are considered to be ongoing projects, since they have more to deliver. It’s arguable that projects on official hiatus should be classified as ongoing projects as well, but I considered those projects stopped for the moment and therefore shouldn’t be considered ‘ongoing’. If you wish to use a definition where the partial deliver rate counts as a ‘full’ project delivery, add that result to the above calculation – you still end up with about half of projects not having delivered to backers.
the author does not call the 58% failures but they missed their estimated deadline
EQ2 fan sites
Yup, and the majority of games reviewed DO, based on what we can find through metacritic. Majority doesn't mean all, and the link I gave you to steam clearly shows that 60% of the games there are above average (70%+). That's a majority.
I love how you think you're actually proving something. Anyway, I'm done. I can't argue with your opinion anyway.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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I don't need to give meaning to anything, I play those games because I like them, not because they were kickstarter project.
Personal insult won't help you make a point btw.
If they had the money to make a playable version of their game they probably wouldn't need the funding to begin with. What you are asking for would require a lot of work and kickstarter is a mean to speed up the process to get to that point (alpha gameplay).
There is already a safeguard, the unfunded project attest to that. If you don't prove to people that you can do the job, you won't meet your goal, and so won't receive any money. There will most likely be people that try to profit from it, the same way there are people profiting from charity or other schemes.
Also if there is an obvious fraud, they will be prosecuted by the government.
Ok here is a simple FACT check for people
When you pay money into Kickstarter, you are not a CUSTOMER so you do not have CUSTOMER protection.
When you pay money into kickstarter you are not an INVESTOR so you do not have rights to capital or shares in the company.
When you pay money into Kickstarter you are a BACKER, the same as if you gave that money to charity, do you have any right to say where charities spend the money they collect NO you do not.
Now, there are some shams operating out of kickstarter, same as there are some false charities, so use your own judgement and if something is too good to be true, call it. The Yogscast game was being made by an unproven studio who had never took on anything of that level before and people threw money at it because, lol Yogzcast are funny.
Well look, you have no right to anything really, go ahead, start a civil case, I will be watching with interest because I would love to see the laws tested, but look into what you are paying for.
When you put money into kickstarter you are making a DONATION To some one, to give them a chance to realise their dream, you are not investing in their company, you are not purchasing anything, you give them money to get started and they promise to furnish you with something upon successful completion, but Kickstarter its self warns you projects are NOT guaranteed to be completed.
You paid your bucks, you took your chance, and in this case you lost out. Theres nothing you can really do unless you want to get an actual lawyer involved and test international law on this thing.
But to be honest, dont talk about consumer rights or protections as a BACKER of a kickstarter, you lose any rights other than those that the company gives you. Welcome to the world of startup industries.
Someone else actually read through all the comments from the article, and the actual delivery rate is something like 58%. Though, I would wonder how that rate compares with the video game industry in general. I'm sure there are a lot of games that get funded, get a little bit written, and then fold.
But yes, more current information that I am far too lazy to accumulate would be very interesting to see.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Fraud is still fraud. Probably not worth fighting such a battle yourself tho.
http://www.geekwire.com/2014/attorney-general-asylum-playing-cards-crowdfunded-project/
I still think that on average kickstarter has been great for gaming.
Fraud exists in ALL markets, not just kickstarter so the fair evaulation is to see if on average is kickstarter better for gaming, for me it is.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me