Of the myriad of reasons I saw people quit Wildstar, the sub was mentioned mostly in second passing. There was always a FIRST flaw (or several first flaws) that made people say "it's not worth the sub". Without that first flaw, the subbing wouldn't have been an issue. Hell, lots of people quitting had several months worth of credd stacked up and still quit despite how playing for a bit longer was basically free.
Lots of people on these forums keep saying MMOs are a matter of taste and that one man's trash is another man's treasure, etc, but I think maybe someone else put it best when they said "Maybe Wildstar just isn't a good game."
Wildstar locked its content behind layers of boring. You want to raid, well guess what. You're going to have to waste time. You'll have to run dungeons where if someone screws up 50 minutes in - you're done. You had to put an hour or so aside where you couldn't piss, couldn't let the dog out or deal with a phone call because they figure hardcore = time limit. I don't know about most people but I don't have all the time in the world to game these days, so blowing an hour or more on trying to silver a dungeon just felt like work instead of fun. I'm not asking for easy content, I'm asking for fair to the average person with a life content. I want to play a game, I want to see the content. I don't want to have to stop my life for 3 hours just to progress a little towards seeing that content.
I tried to tell you guys all this back in May.... posted this 5/8/14;
Originally posted by Tredo
Worst game hype in history.... this is the worst grind game I have yet to see. Nothing ground breaking to see here... the graphics are in line with Free Realms. If you have seen Free Realms, Wildstar is a graphical copy. Grind then grind some more and you get to level 10 maybe before you start questioning how bad is this game.
I find humorous that certain people will blame the Combat as the main culprit. While the combat was 9nteresting, it was by far the best part of the game....regardless of your personal opinions the greatest majority of gamers who played enjoyed it. My only gripe about the combat was it felt like it should of been a reticule based combat system in much the same vein as Neverwinter or Tera. Combining Tab Target with Action....much the same way GW2 did is a recipe for half-assed system.
Now on the other hand......That WoW clone feeling. Not one person who quit that I know (which is a guild of over 120+) said the game was anything other then a linear Themepark clone of WoW and that it felt like the same game they've been playing for the last 10 years.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
While playing this and Rift I felt like I was playing WOW so I just couldn't continue. Been there done that kind of feeling.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Good maybe now this will put to rest that raiding isn't as popular as the vocal minority claims. I never cared to even try Wildstar cause its philosophy was "hardcore" raiding.
The only place raiding was fun was in the original Everquest in the open world with a bunch of tards you barely even knew, sometimes in their undies...ok alot of times in their undies, not with some dufus with a voice enhancer and military demeanor or with hipsters....mmkay.
Originally posted by Kaizermos It's easy to see what went wrong. It's what 90% of people were saying - Sub + Box is moronic now days
Precisely. When I first heard about this game, I thought, "Eh, I don't really care much because it looks like another WoW clone, but I'll give it the benefit of the doubt and check it out. Why not?", thinking it was a free to play game (because who in their right mind would actually attempt to make another subscription based game in 2014?!!). As soon as I saw that it had a monthly fee, I laughed out loud and closed the tab on my browser.
That's a good question. I had issues with Wilstar's eye watering flashy graphics, the cartoony art style, the forced, trying way to hard humor, but none of that stopped me from playing the game. What killed Wildstar for me was it was just dull as hell. The classes, the combat, the game world itself just felt lifeless and tedious to me. After a week I found myself dreading to even log in.
I played the beta but chose not to buy the game as for me it just didn't grab me tbh.
The PvP, which is what i was mainly interested in, was very very poorly done and was just a spam fest and while the PvE was decent it did nothing that really grabbed me enough to want to keep playing.
The game isn't bad by any means but it does nothing special or really well and many of us have played these type of games so many times i think we are burnt out and unless they are really different i doubt we will stay in any of them long term.
The biggest issue I feel is it focused to much on the 'hardcore' and to little on easing people in. Really though I think the big issues come down to...
Start off hard and end hard (Difficulty): While I don't mind hard games, a big issue is wildstar forces itself out the gate on being hard. I really love how difficult it is and how much it practically laughs away at WoWs childish mechanics. The issue is, it really doesn't give much room for leaning and just throws you in head first with little chance to learn. It was quite apparent early on that dungeons DESTROYED so many people. Not only was it more active combat, but very punishing combat with little room for learning. It really needed more to 'ramp up' the difficulty. I dont' think it needed to be super easy, but it should ease into the difficulty a lot better.
Tedius Acitivies =/= Hardcore: This is really a BIG issue. A lot of the pain in getting into raiding was a rather tedius quest. The issue is a LOT of work in it involved point blank grind. There were areas of the quest that were entertaining, and others that were lazy and just dull. Its not hardcore to have to grind everything and feel required to do so to go anywhere.
Raiding Can be Hard, but it needs to be accessible: A big issue is Wildstar hides its raiding behind a long quest chain. While I feel people should have an idea of what they are doing before they raid, there needs to be a way for them to get in rather easy even if its to just 'get a taste' of it. They really needed to make getting into raids easier (again avoiding tedium). It can be hard as heck, but when you make it very difficult to even get in to see how it is, you got a problem.
Though getting old (ok, middle aged), I enjoyed the action-y combat. However, with action combat (like shooters), the Time To Kill on your average mob needs to be lower, otherwise it becomes exhausting after a while.
I didn't mind the avatars, but felt the environment could have used more detail.
Didn't really feel like raiding, so once I had a decent enough house, I lost interest. Also, as great as the housing was, its detachment from the world was disappointing (no nice vistas to enjoy).
It's a little silly to me to see how many people hated on the attunement quest for raiding in the game. I mean, you did some flavor quests here and there that barely took any time, and then you had to become proficient at each of the eight max-level instances (four adventures, four dungeons). At first, 'proficiency' was being able to get through them at a decent clip and not die a lot; now you can even take as long as you want to finish each of them, timer requirement removed. I don't think it's asking people too much to be able to at least finish all instanced content before they shuffle on to Raidtown; other games make you do it for the loot to be able to succeed in raids, this one does it to introduce people to more complicated mechanics and ever-increasing amounts of red that must be dodged.
I do think there is still hope for the game, and I'm still playing despite getting almost as irritated as others over things like the QA issues and proper balancing/bugtesting. My major worry for the game are that not enough take pleasure from merely surmounting an obstacle and being able to say 'Yeah, that was tough but I freakin' DID IT.' No, grinding =! hardcore, it's true, but there are some fights in the game that are 100% execution (Drokk earlier on, Mordechai and Raina later come to mind) that make you feel damned good to finally finish correctly.
That's where I personally think they've gone wrong and need to step it up. Moments like those need to actually be accented, shown, and rewarded properly... which is to say, in a method that people appreciate and can show off. If a game is going to sell itself on being challenging, it needs to work damned hard at giving people a reason to want to pass the challenges, and thus far WS has been lackluster in that regard.
Knew it would fail as the hype machine was strong with this game. It had the same feel as SWTOR on release and it copied another very well known mmo far too much.
Hardcore raids and pvp are all well and good, but games also need something there for the people who just have an hour or so to play rather than the 3 to 4 hours doing raids. Plus the time it takes to get a 24 person raid team going.
Put in more solo content and small group dungeons for the max level for those people who only have a few hours to spare each night or week, and Carbine may see more interest in the casual players who just want to do small group stuff.
Also levels and class systems are getting tired and old lets go back to how it use to be done with Ultima Online and the original SWG. This skill system alone added more to the game than any dungeon or raid.
I played my first month barely and gave up. Way too grindy and the hub quest system is been there and done that too much to stay. That and the combat has too many moving parts. I'll admit the telegraph system was intriguing but having to shuck and jive and roll and strafe continually while still trying to adhere to rotation, hots and dots wAs just too much. It was overly complicated just for complicateds sake. It is like expecting a surgeon to build a table, while performing surgery and then asking him to play the violin too. There's a whole lot of work with no reason.
Yes games need to have challenge but endless frustration or tedious boredom aren't good hallmarks of gaming either.
1) lag, terrible lag, especially in cities - this I guess some day would be resolved, also would add, many did not have this problem, but many of us had
2) single toolar - only real reason game was doomed for me in instant I have discovered this, I really hate button mashing games and having single toolbar spells that
3) another thing I can not swallow down in any game, that disgusting mini games, like pressing F at intervals or even more remembering colors - but at least this problem was easily solved using addons; if not, this would be again reason to not to play at all
I played. I had to stop for a few days and guild member said saw my character. I logged into the game to find someone was playing a character. I logged in. I did not get a response that the game already had someone logged in and try again. I tried to log in with a character. It said another character was in game and please wait for them to log out. It did not tell me could not log in because account was being used but to wait for current person to be logged out.
I reported and got back an e-mail telling me to check my computer and such. The problem is that my account was hacked. Check my computer and e-mail. I had already taken care of those things. I asked about the fact that I was enter the game while someone else was logged into the account and they were not kicked out since it did let me log in. I never got a reply. I was just told should use the app for secondary security. I do not trust Carbine. Sounds like I made the right decision.
Comments
Of the myriad of reasons I saw people quit Wildstar, the sub was mentioned mostly in second passing. There was always a FIRST flaw (or several first flaws) that made people say "it's not worth the sub". Without that first flaw, the subbing wouldn't have been an issue. Hell, lots of people quitting had several months worth of credd stacked up and still quit despite how playing for a bit longer was basically free.
Lots of people on these forums keep saying MMOs are a matter of taste and that one man's trash is another man's treasure, etc, but I think maybe someone else put it best when they said "Maybe Wildstar just isn't a good game."
Wildstar locked its content behind layers of boring. You want to raid, well guess what. You're going to have to waste time. You'll have to run dungeons where if someone screws up 50 minutes in - you're done. You had to put an hour or so aside where you couldn't piss, couldn't let the dog out or deal with a phone call because they figure hardcore = time limit. I don't know about most people but I don't have all the time in the world to game these days, so blowing an hour or more on trying to silver a dungeon just felt like work instead of fun. I'm not asking for easy content, I'm asking for fair to the average person with a life content. I want to play a game, I want to see the content. I don't want to have to stop my life for 3 hours just to progress a little towards seeing that content.
I would have bought wildstar if it did not have a sub.
its a good thing that most mmos will fail in future maybe the devs. will realise then that we don't want boring quest grinds.
I don't know why it failed it looked like a normal mmo to that's why I am not that interested in mmos anymore.
That was pretty much it. The game itself seemed pretty good.
I tried to tell you guys all this back in May.... posted this 5/8/14;
Originally posted by Tredo
Worst game hype in history.... this is the worst grind game I have yet to see. Nothing ground breaking to see here... the graphics are in line with Free Realms. If you have seen Free Realms, Wildstar is a graphical copy. Grind then grind some more and you get to level 10 maybe before you start questioning how bad is this game.
I find humorous that certain people will blame the Combat as the main culprit. While the combat was 9nteresting, it was by far the best part of the game....regardless of your personal opinions the greatest majority of gamers who played enjoyed it. My only gripe about the combat was it felt like it should of been a reticule based combat system in much the same vein as Neverwinter or Tera. Combining Tab Target with Action....much the same way GW2 did is a recipe for half-assed system.
Now on the other hand......That WoW clone feeling. Not one person who quit that I know (which is a guild of over 120+) said the game was anything other then a linear Themepark clone of WoW and that it felt like the same game they've been playing for the last 10 years.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Good maybe now this will put to rest that raiding isn't as popular as the vocal minority claims. I never cared to even try Wildstar cause its philosophy was "hardcore" raiding.
The only place raiding was fun was in the original Everquest in the open world with a bunch of tards you barely even knew, sometimes in their undies...ok alot of times in their undies, not with some dufus with a voice enhancer and military demeanor or with hipsters....mmkay.
WHAT WENT WRONG?
1. subscription required!
2. terrible graphics~!
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
Precisely. When I first heard about this game, I thought, "Eh, I don't really care much because it looks like another WoW clone, but I'll give it the benefit of the doubt and check it out. Why not?", thinking it was a free to play game (because who in their right mind would actually attempt to make another subscription based game in 2014?!!). As soon as I saw that it had a monthly fee, I laughed out loud and closed the tab on my browser.
It's a free to play genre now.
I played the beta but chose not to buy the game as for me it just didn't grab me tbh.
The PvP, which is what i was mainly interested in, was very very poorly done and was just a spam fest and while the PvE was decent it did nothing that really grabbed me enough to want to keep playing.
The game isn't bad by any means but it does nothing special or really well and many of us have played these type of games so many times i think we are burnt out and unless they are really different i doubt we will stay in any of them long term.
I don't know about anyone else but I got terrible performance. Like 5-10 fps at the lowest settings
That's what killed it for me.
The biggest issue I feel is it focused to much on the 'hardcore' and to little on easing people in. Really though I think the big issues come down to...
If that is how you judge games then you shouldnt be allowed to play anymore.
Though getting old (ok, middle aged), I enjoyed the action-y combat. However, with action combat (like shooters), the Time To Kill on your average mob needs to be lower, otherwise it becomes exhausting after a while.
I didn't mind the avatars, but felt the environment could have used more detail.
Didn't really feel like raiding, so once I had a decent enough house, I lost interest. Also, as great as the housing was, its detachment from the world was disappointing (no nice vistas to enjoy).
Its so beyond obvious what went wrong with this game.
To everyone that bought into the "Best MMO ever" hype, think before purchasing next time.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
It's a little silly to me to see how many people hated on the attunement quest for raiding in the game. I mean, you did some flavor quests here and there that barely took any time, and then you had to become proficient at each of the eight max-level instances (four adventures, four dungeons). At first, 'proficiency' was being able to get through them at a decent clip and not die a lot; now you can even take as long as you want to finish each of them, timer requirement removed. I don't think it's asking people too much to be able to at least finish all instanced content before they shuffle on to Raidtown; other games make you do it for the loot to be able to succeed in raids, this one does it to introduce people to more complicated mechanics and ever-increasing amounts of red that must be dodged.
I do think there is still hope for the game, and I'm still playing despite getting almost as irritated as others over things like the QA issues and proper balancing/bugtesting. My major worry for the game are that not enough take pleasure from merely surmounting an obstacle and being able to say 'Yeah, that was tough but I freakin' DID IT.' No, grinding =! hardcore, it's true, but there are some fights in the game that are 100% execution (Drokk earlier on, Mordechai and Raina later come to mind) that make you feel damned good to finally finish correctly.
That's where I personally think they've gone wrong and need to step it up. Moments like those need to actually be accented, shown, and rewarded properly... which is to say, in a method that people appreciate and can show off. If a game is going to sell itself on being challenging, it needs to work damned hard at giving people a reason to want to pass the challenges, and thus far WS has been lackluster in that regard.
Knew it would fail as the hype machine was strong with this game. It had the same feel as SWTOR on release and it copied another very well known mmo far too much.
Hardcore raids and pvp are all well and good, but games also need something there for the people who just have an hour or so to play rather than the 3 to 4 hours doing raids. Plus the time it takes to get a 24 person raid team going.
Put in more solo content and small group dungeons for the max level for those people who only have a few hours to spare each night or week, and Carbine may see more interest in the casual players who just want to do small group stuff.
Also levels and class systems are getting tired and old lets go back to how it use to be done with Ultima Online and the original SWG. This skill system alone added more to the game than any dungeon or raid.
Yes games need to have challenge but endless frustration or tedious boredom aren't good hallmarks of gaming either.
Loved game, enjoyed a lot first 2 months but:
1) lag, terrible lag, especially in cities - this I guess some day would be resolved, also would add, many did not have this problem, but many of us had
2) single toolar - only real reason game was doomed for me in instant I have discovered this, I really hate button mashing games and having single toolbar spells that
3) another thing I can not swallow down in any game, that disgusting mini games, like pressing F at intervals or even more remembering colors - but at least this problem was easily solved using addons; if not, this would be again reason to not to play at all
I played. I had to stop for a few days and guild member said saw my character. I logged into the game to find someone was playing a character. I logged in. I did not get a response that the game already had someone logged in and try again. I tried to log in with a character. It said another character was in game and please wait for them to log out. It did not tell me could not log in because account was being used but to wait for current person to be logged out.
I reported and got back an e-mail telling me to check my computer and such. The problem is that my account was hacked. Check my computer and e-mail. I had already taken care of those things. I asked about the fact that I was enter the game while someone else was logged into the account and they were not kicked out since it did let me log in. I never got a reply. I was just told should use the app for secondary security. I do not trust Carbine. Sounds like I made the right decision.