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Pay 2 Win or Pay to Faster?
Which one is it?
Just from reading myself, it looks like its just play to get there faster.
I'm ok with not getting their faster.
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Currently playing:
FFXIV on Behemoth, FFXI on Eden, and Gloria Victis on NA.
Comments
there is absolutely no p2w in archeage. i kinda enjoy their pay model.
basically its pay 2 craft/own land.
Totally agree with the point you make about either sub it or CS it.
However, the problem with the LP pots is that LP's affect everything, loot, building, crafting, all sorts of stuff. If a player buys enough LP pots to keep their crafting up then they're going to have some nice gear come L50. For those that don't spend that cash, well they're not going to have that gear. See where this is going?
In a PvP centric game CS items that allow you to get better gear faster creates an unfair advantage in my book. So yeah, I'd call that pay to win.
Except you didn't buy a box, so how do they get their money back without pushing you to CS? I can't understand the whingeing about this game being a money grab when you pay nothing for the game. Compare other sub games where you buy the game for $50 and then pay $15 a month. That would be $215 for a year of play and I bet you would spend less in the CS than that over a year in AA.
it may be an "advantage" early on if you are rushing, but eventually it levels out - so the impatient can get there faster and techinically "win" for a short time before others catch up. But that doesnt really make it pay 2 win.
Pay 2 win means people who pay money can get Items / Gear / Skills / Etc. that free players cannot ever get just by playing the game.
DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann
I am tending towards agreeing with this. F2p can't really farm craft compared to patron but other than that seem decent.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
I self identify as a monkey.
Then MMOs aren't for you, because the guy that started his sub before you has the same advantage.
Seriously, based on what you wrote there, even if the ability to pay for boosts was there, you still would find it hard to enjoy. Other F2P players find it fine. The ones that find it enjoyable to accelerate aspects of the game can do so. A player can get farther sooner, but that's true of ANY subscription MMO. Now, If AA had early-L2's leveling curve, I might agree with you, but AA's leveling is far from that.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Definately helps to use labor pots . I was new to game
so didnt know the system well , bought $100 credits to boost
labor
It's pay for quality of life improvements... honestly, if you play even for a small amount of time you will realize that your bags are full, that you have no labor points, yadda yadda. I'd have to say that they devised a game in which HAVING quality of life improvements IS the name of the game.
If you don't pay, I can assure you, you will end up running out of storage space in no time... then your play comes to a grinding halt whilst you slowly tackle the task of freeing up space. You can't do anything short of just PVP without storage space...
So technically it is pay to faster... because without the storage space, you will be moving at a snails pace.
ArcheAge can be anything each player want. F2P, P2P, P2W, P2Getfaster, P2Queue, P2Troll, P2NotPlay, P2BeRich, P2BeCool.
For me is P2EnjoyAlot (13euros/month) and still a little P2Queue and sometimes P2NotPlay like yesterday cause of loggin problems servers had.
In the end its the way players see things, i can get everthing in game gold even the monthly fee, so this payment model is not bother me at all.
It's pay to faster, but that's still p2w for me. My main problem with the model is that unless you pay money there's nothing for you to do at certain points.
I got to 50 and I love crafting, but I found myself always out of Labor Points, and Patron alone isn't going to fix the lack of Labor Points for me. So I see it as a money grab game (like almost all f2p games). I hate games that take you out of the game unless you pay this much money. You run out of labor pots and they might as well just say "You're done for the day, unless you give us money!" And then you're out of points quickly after that.
I'm not a f2p player. I was a Patron, and I still ran out of points. If I'm paying a subscription, I want to be able to play it 24/7. In AA, if you're a Patron and a craftsman, like myself, you pay a subscription for a few hours a day. You could pay more, but I simply can't stand nickel and dime business models. Just tell me what you want me to pay to play and i'll gladly pay. If they made Patron $25 a month for like unlimited labor points, I'd be happier. There's just something that erks me when I'm playing and I get a pop-up saying, you have to buy this to continue.
I'm with you buddy!
No problem getting there faster or not. Just taking my time and enjoy what the game has to offer. No rush here :-)
I'm in it for the skill system and mounts! I am liking it so far.
In a race, paying-to-faster IS pay-to-win. That's what a race IS.
In a game where the race is a major factor, paying-to-faster is indirectly pay-to-win. This usually crops up in competitive games that otherwise limit daily activities (where people THINK it's pay-to-faster but it also becomes pay-to-exceed-the-limit). Usually facebook games. That's how they get the whales. The whales pay-to-faster because pay-to-faster IS pay-to-win especially when your daily activities are limited by an energy system and there are lots of competitive aspects in the game.
It's very devious. People think "Oh, they're just paying for convenience" but anyone who really analyzes it, which most whales do, realize that it's pay-to-win.
Several people have referred to Archeage's labor system as akin to facebook games. They're kinda correct, although it isn't as bad as facebook games still. But it's there, moreso than other MMOs, especially since, like FB games, Archeage is pretty much all competition at the end... but again, not as bad as FB games.
So in comparison to your typical pay-to-faster = pay-to-win FB game, Archeage is kiiiiinda there but not as bad. Whether that constitutes pay-to-win depends on your standards for pay-to-win.
I rent out my small farm to a Freeb guildie in return for their labour on my other holdings. Though they won't ever be up there with a patron, I think farming is very much open to freebs with networking skills and the imagination to strike a deal.
OP, it's pay to get there faster. The pay to win thing is a fallacy based on lazy received wisdom by people that just wanna hate.
I remember the time where MMO's with a cash shop were always called Pay 2 Win. It seems like the western MMO community is slowly accepting nickel and dime strategies, that were main course in the east.
And now we are even coming up with new names to distinguish with "better" types of cash shop?
Anyway, the answer to OP's question is Pay 2 Win, whether it's under the old meaning or under the new meaning.
Since you view MMOs as a race to the end, and that the faster you get to the end the sooner you 'win', is it your contention that if you don't start playing the day of release, there's no point in playing ever?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Where in that sentence did I say MMOs are a race? Perhaps you should read the rest of the post instead of RACING to reply next time.
So, basically from reading this thread, the impression i'm getting is that ArcheAge basically operates the same way as farmville and all of those ridiculous facebook games, in so much as, you get a certain number of spendable "credits" (or whatever they term the spendable unit) every hour or every 24 hours or whatever. Which you use to purchase things in game, whether its land, stuff to put on the land, etc, but if you want to pay for more of these said credits, you can, and then you dont have to wait.
Explain to me how thats not the definition of pay to win?
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche