I don't know how I feel about this honestly. I like the TSW B2P model but it sells content equally to all people regardless of when you play it. On the other hand I guess this could be considered a loyalty reward for all those people who played the content when it came out, bought keys and participated in the gem exchange regardless of if they where on the gold to gem or cash to gem side of the equation. ANET doesn't care which side you are on as both are needed to keep it working.
GW2 is a game that needs people playing it and participating in the GEM market to work. These living story quests where incentive for people to keep logging in so I guess I can see where they wouldn't want to give them away for mass consumption after the fact. What they stretched out over 6 months or so someone could probably login and consume in 1-2 days which wouldn't really entice them to use the GEM market would it?
Kind of the point of the OP was that he would NOT use the gems now either. So they lose anyhow right off the bat.
If they want to get people to return kind of a smack in the face and a good reason to just say no to people it seems. Just delete game and move on. Or people that were thinking of returning, just see this stuff and think no as well.
Dunno, right or wrong does not enter into it. Just what people think of a game that is buy to play. They do not expect to run into paywalls, and if they do...easier to just delete game and move on to something else. Buy to play with expansions are one thing. Buy for each thing as you play seems strange. Even grinding to get them will turn off a lot of folks i think.
I think what is rubbing people wrong with this is not so much that you are paying for content as much as you are paying for content that was given free to others. If Anet had charged everyone for this content like DLC all along it would have come across differently. But then, I don't think the community would have much liked the idea of being charged every 2 weeks for a tiny bit of new content. Charging people now for this content on a per chapter basis is basically the same thing but with the added rub of making people who had to put the game on hold feel like they are being punished for doing so. A lot of people bought this game because they felt that the B2P model would give them the flexibility to set the game aside at will without feeling like they were wasting money on a subscription that was ticking only to find out that they were going to be charged after the fact for having the temerity to do other things for a while.
The point is that this charge leaves people feeling a bit swindled. It is immaterial if they were swindled in fact or not. Making your customers feel stupid or cheated is not the best way to keep them.
Instead of charging per episode I think it would have come off much better if Anet had done a one time charge off say $20 to unlock access to the whole story journal. Then they would have been selling a major feature rather than the content itself which would have worked better with the whole B2P concept. Never mind that it is a feature that allows them access to that content. The perception would have been much more positive. They kind of blew that opportunity with this who have already returned but they could still pull it off with those yet to return.
*ding ding ding ding ding*
Honestly, I haven't played GW2 in probably 6 months now. Just so many other games taking priority over it right now, in my opinion, and I don't know if I'll go back now. The problem with this whole model is that you've got your loyal crowd (who would probably pay for an expansion btw), you've got your new customers (who are very costly to acquire at this point and wll probably stick around for 6 months) and you've got your lapsed players (like me). Honestly, it's probably 10 times less costly to bring me back into the game than it is to bring in a new customer (maybe more) so why the hell would you throw up such ridiculous payment barriers? First of all, it simply pisses people off (the ones you're wanting to come back). Secondly, there's probably a much greater opportunity for you to sell me a $10 or $15 quarterly unlock than you ever will to unlock content more regularly. On top of that, for people who actually care, I'm sure there will be apps specifically designed to log you in on a regular basis, so it's not a sustainable model either. I'll bet Nexen came up with it.
I don't think its more costly for them to bring in a new player. In fact bringing in new players is specifically how they make their money. With the last sale, they sold plenty of copies. People who didn't get a chance to see the living story and people that are more than likely willing to spend extra money on that content because they didn't have accounts at the time to be granted access to that content.
I'm just saying, it being less costly to have you come back to not spend money isn't nearly as profitable as having a new player come in that is willing to spend money on things they missed previously. At the end of the day with the 5 dollar sale, if they bought all the living story content, they would end up with almost the cost of the original box sale that you paid for in the first place.
I have yet to see an industry where the cost to acquire a new customer is less than retaining an existing customer. It's, generally, not even close. It's almost always 5-10 times more costly to acquire a new customer. You need to remember that even though they're selling a game to someone on sale, it's not like it's all profit. They still have marketing costs, revenue shares, etc., etc. that need to be paid. Whereas, for someone like you, you can throw me a pet Corgi and I'd probably come back in just to claim it (maybe not that easy). Give me gems, give me gold. These are relatively cost-free things you can do to bring me back, whereas you still need to sell a box to someone new.
HA! I honestly cannot tell if you are serious or not....
Sure you should get free content from now till the end of days
Not quite, I've played Guild Wars 1 until the release of GW2 and I never had to pay for anything except when new expansion were released, and I would have gladly payed for HoT, and I already spent some money on the in game store for pets and clothes.
I just dont think it's fair to pay 200 gems for each quest of the main story.
Ok let me get this straight. Buying the gems required to unlock every single step in the S2 living story costs £8.99! That's the regular subscription for a P2P MMO.
You haven't lost access to anything. It's like complaining that a game got a dlc and you can't play it for free. Look at it that way, the game got a DLC worth of content and they are charging a fairly below average price for a DLC - £9.
In GW1 there were mission packs which you had to buy and those were not included in the expansions. So you're statement of "I never had to pay for anything except when new expansion was released" is wrong. You had to pay to play the story missions.
People have given you like a billion options of how you can get the content for free or to pay for it. It looks like you've created this topic just to troll cause you clearly don't want any input from the rest of us. You just want to bash GW2 and that's what you did in your last 5 posts in this topic.
IF you can't afford 9 bucks or think that it is unfair that they are charging you 9 bucks for what is more than an average sized DLC, then you free to go play something else. Certainly no one will miss you, considering you don't want to a) play the game to unlock the content or b) pay an extremely small amount of money to unlock the content.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Arenanet told in advance that all chapters of the Living Story were going to be FREE if you logged in during the week to unlock them... It´s a valid way to keep people logging & and playing their content...and for FREE.
So OP....you should of have known...
Anyway you can always get the gems by playing the game anyway...it will take you a while...but hey! You´ll be playing & getting it for FREE again...
Some people want companies to work free & at the user´s pace.....
Sorry but that is a dumb move. Either release it for free or do not. Do not do both. Just a recipe to tick some people off.
Saying that they released it for free.. but now it costs cash....and that people expect them to work for free. Kind of a strange argument i think. Since they released it for free.....they want to have it both ways. And it just gives them the bad of both ways as well.
Some people will be turned off and not play the game or buy any further expansions. So it seems that it hurts the company more than any gamers that say meh, not worth my time,
I think what is rubbing people wrong with this is not so much that you are paying for content as much as you are paying for content that was given free to others. If Anet had charged everyone for this content like DLC all along it would have come across differently. But then, I don't think the community would have much liked the idea of being charged every 2 weeks for a tiny bit of new content. Charging people now for this content on a per chapter basis is basically the same thing but with the added rub of making people who had to put the game on hold feel like they are being punished for doing so. A lot of people bought this game because they felt that the B2P model would give them the flexibility to set the game aside at will without feeling like they were wasting money on a subscription that was ticking only to find out that they were going to be charged after the fact for having the temerity to do other things for a while.
The point is that this charge leaves people feeling a bit swindled. It is immaterial if they were swindled in fact or not. Making your customers feel stupid or cheated is not the best way to keep them.
Instead of charging per episode I think it would have come off much better if Anet had done a one time charge off say $20 to unlock access to the whole story journal. Then they would have been selling a major feature rather than the content itself which would have worked better with the whole B2P concept. Never mind that it is a feature that allows them access to that content. The perception would have been much more positive. They kind of blew that opportunity with this who have already returned but they could still pull it off with those yet to return.
*ding ding ding ding ding*
Honestly, I haven't played GW2 in probably 6 months now. Just so many other games taking priority over it right now, in my opinion, and I don't know if I'll go back now. The problem with this whole model is that you've got your loyal crowd (who would probably pay for an expansion btw), you've got your new customers (who are very costly to acquire at this point and wll probably stick around for 6 months) and you've got your lapsed players (like me). Honestly, it's probably 10 times less costly to bring me back into the game than it is to bring in a new customer (maybe more) so why the hell would you throw up such ridiculous payment barriers? First of all, it simply pisses people off (the ones you're wanting to come back). Secondly, there's probably a much greater opportunity for you to sell me a $10 or $15 quarterly unlock than you ever will to unlock content more regularly. On top of that, for people who actually care, I'm sure there will be apps specifically designed to log you in on a regular basis, so it's not a sustainable model either. I'll bet Nexen came up with it.
I don't think its more costly for them to bring in a new player. In fact bringing in new players is specifically how they make their money. With the last sale, they sold plenty of copies. People who didn't get a chance to see the living story and people that are more than likely willing to spend extra money on that content because they didn't have accounts at the time to be granted access to that content.
I'm just saying, it being less costly to have you come back to not spend money isn't nearly as profitable as having a new player come in that is willing to spend money on things they missed previously. At the end of the day with the 5 dollar sale, if they bought all the living story content, they would end up with almost the cost of the original box sale that you paid for in the first place.
I have yet to see an industry where the cost to acquire a new customer is less than retaining an existing customer. It's, generally, not even close. It's almost always 5-10 times more costly to acquire a new customer. You need to remember that even though they're selling a game to someone on sale, it's not like it's all profit. They still have marketing costs, revenue shares, etc., etc. that need to be paid. Whereas, for someone like you, you can throw me a pet Corgi and I'd probably come back in just to claim it (maybe not that easy). Give me gems, give me gold. These are relatively cost-free things you can do to bring me back, whereas you still need to sell a box to someone new.
I think you're right in the sense most industries are less costly in keeping existing customers... but I would stand to reason that Free MMOs and B2P MMOs are different, because they thrive primarily off of customers that are willing to spend money, not necessarily the returning customers.
I mean if you play long enough and hard enough in GW2 you don't have to spend any actual money.. you just grind out gold and transfer it to gems. Telling the users they will get a shiny goldfish for returning might bring players back in.. and in a P2P game.. that actually does spell revenue.
The thing is, in GW2, they say "We have a shiny new fish every month" with the living story and people still didn't return for it. Those that did (as the OP clearly states) aren't willing to really pay for it.... so content wise, their revenue will mostly come from new players. I think with how volatile MMOs are...and the very high turnover rates, games like GW2 and many of the other F2P games or cash shop games realize if they want to be (more) profitable its not about returning customers, its about the casual player who has less time but a lot of money.
I don't even play this game, but I understand the living story concept. If you're not around to experience that story as it's relevant then that's your problem. It's like holiday events in other games: they're only around for a limited time and if you miss out, tough titty. It'll come around next year, but there's still no guarantees it's the same as the one the year before.
So a p2p game would charge you $15 just to come back and look at it with out giving you any new content. GW2 might charge roughly the same to see the new content which is optional. If you keep playing GW2 again for more than a month this time, then guess what? You will not be charged again. If you wanted to play another p2p for another month, guess what? You will have to pay them $15 again for the same content you payed and played for the previous month.
I don't feel bad for you OP. All you had to do was log in when the new episode was released. You didn't even have to move your character one inch in the game world.
On a B2P game adding a pay wall for the first bit of content you try will cause this feeling most times. As gamers this is not an action we should defend. I agree MMOs need to make money but there are some things they should not do. P2W and Pay Walls are 2 of the lowest ways to make money. Anet launched this game as a B2P game you can come and go from to play between other MMOs. As they put it, buy the game and come as go as you please. Thats now a lie. Now its go for to long and go through the pay wall before you come back.
You are wrong. The game you paid for with the box purchase is still there for free. You do not, however get to have extra content for free without paying for it. If you cannot handle that, then you are in the wrong genre of games and should perhaps stick with facebook and yahoo gaming.
Im 100% for supporting a game with my money. Doing it with pay walls I am not. IMO they would do better moving the pay wall down the line at min. Let you start the living story and on the 3rd or 4th installment you have to pay. Its really dumb to run into a pay wall on a B2P game when you log in for the first time in months.
Kind of the point of the OP was that he would NOT use the gems now either. So they lose anyhow right off the bat.
Actually, not sure they lose... let's see:
If they want to get people to return kind of a smack in the face and a good reason to just say no to people it seems. Just delete game and move on. Or people that were thinking of returning, just see this stuff and think no as well.
Possibly ArenaNET don't care if people who never pay for anything anyway return? I know I wouldn't. I'd want people who sometimes pay for things to play my game, so that I can pay my developers and content designers, and not freeloaders who don't ever buy a thing.
Dunno, right or wrong does not enter into it. Just what people think of a game that is buy to play. They do not expect to run into paywalls, and if they do...easier to just delete game and move on to something else. Buy to play with expansions are one thing. Buy for each thing as you play seems strange. Even grinding to get them will turn off a lot of folks i think.
I don't see how expansions are different from this added content, in a game with no monthly fee.
And seriously... 200 gems is $2.50. For $10 (800 gems) you get more content than any game with a monthly subscriptions of $15 will give in a month. Time to mow a few lawns and wash a few cars to make money, methinks, and relearn that services provides are to be paid for.
And again...how does this hurt a player? He just says no more cash to this company. The company is the only loser here.
The whole point to a buy to play is pay once and done. Not get nickeled and dimed to death also.
And expansion are so different , if you really do not see that no point in trying to talk about anything else here.
Heh last thing how in the world can people that bought the game in the first place now be a freeloader? You really need to stop and think before you use some of these terms i think. If people didn't buy the game, then they would not be there to complain about the paywalls now would they? Kind of duh.
So a p2p game would charge you $15 just to come back and look at it with out giving you any new content. GW2 might charge roughly the same to see the new content which is optional. If you keep playing GW2 again for more than a month this time, then guess what? You will not be charged again. If you wanted to play another p2p for another month, guess what? You will have to pay them $15 again for the same content you payed and played for the previous month.
I don't feel bad for you OP. All you had to do was log in when the new episode was released. You didn't even have to move your character one inch in the game world.
On a B2P game adding a pay wall for the first bit of content you try will cause this feeling most times. As gamers this is not an action we should defend. I agree MMOs need to make money but there are some things they should not do. P2W and Pay Walls are 2 of the lowest ways to make money. Anet launched this game as a B2P game you can come and go from to play between other MMOs. As they put it, buy the game and come as go as you please. Thats now a lie. Now its go for to long and go through the pay wall before you come back.
You are wrong. The game you paid for with the box purchase is still there for free. You do not, however get to have extra content for free without paying for it. If you cannot handle that, then you are in the wrong genre of games and should perhaps stick with facebook and yahoo gaming.
I think people sometimes have a few misconceptions of what it means to be a B2P MMO with a cash shop, its inevitable things will be monetised, they have to generate revenue after all, and 'selling' new content is a pretty good way of handling it, and if it does well enough, they can introduce even more of what could be termed 'adventure packs' i think some people might be in for a bit of a shock, for instance, how would people react if they found out when ESO goes B2P, that they have to pay for access to the campaigns? its such an obvious one after all. B2P means you get the base game, thats pretty much it, it does not mean that everything will be free.
Well, since i've created this thread i've been insulted, understood, had people agree and disagree and read all types of arguments, but I still feel that it is completely unfair because this are no simple seasonal events, they are part of a story, and it makes no sense whatsoever to comeback to the game and pick up the story right this moment without knowing anything about what came before.
I would certainly understand if this were loose quests without relation to each other,. but they are not, they are part of a series, and making me pay 200 gems for every single one released till now is nonsense. And they expect me to buy another box in Heart of Thorns? Why should I, I can't even understand where the story is going unless I pay right now more than 20€...
It is unfair, It wouldnt be if they were completely loose events, like Halloween parties or Christmas etc, but this are part of the main PvE world changing story.
Those purchases pay for the game, you either buy em, gather gold in game for em or play all the other free content and don't worry about it. Your call, it's either that or it would be a sub game, in which case you would be paying every month with no options to get it for Free. Glass half full not empty time.
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Well, since i've created this thread i've been insulted, understood, had people agree and disagree and read all types of arguments, but I still feel that it is completely unfair because this are no simple seasonal events, they are part of a story, and it makes no sense whatsoever to comeback to the game and pick up the story right this moment without knowing anything about what came before.
I would certainly understand if this were loose quests without relation to each other,. but they are not, they are part of a series, and making me pay 200 gems for every single one released till now is nonsense. And they expect me to buy another box in Heart of Thorns? Why should I, I can't even understand where the story is going unless I pay right now more than 20€...
It is unfair, It wouldnt be if they were completely loose events, like Halloween parties or Christmas etc, but this are part of the main PvE world changing story.
You already said that you missed the complete Season 1 of the story so why are you so obsessed with Season 2 now if you don't even know what it's all about?
Well, since i've created this thread i've been insulted, understood, had people agree and disagree and read all types of arguments, but I still feel that it is completely unfair because this are no simple seasonal events, they are part of a story, and it makes no sense whatsoever to comeback to the game and pick up the story right this moment without knowing anything about what came before.
I would certainly understand if this were loose quests without relation to each other,. but they are not, they are part of a series, and making me pay 200 gems for every single one released till now is nonsense. And they expect me to buy another box in Heart of Thorns? Why should I, I can't even understand where the story is going unless I pay right now more than 20€...
It is unfair, It wouldnt be if they were completely loose events, like Halloween parties or Christmas etc, but this are part of the main PvE world changing story.
You already said that you missed the complete Season 1 of the story so why are you so obsessed with Season 2 now if you don't even know what it's all about?
Since I've came back to the game I've been playing the season 1 (since the part I left it at around lvl 70) and finished it today in the morning, killed Zhaitan for the first time. And there I go, all happy and ready to start season 2 when I see, for the first time, that I had to pay for it...
HA! I honestly cannot tell if you are serious or not....
Sure you should get free content from now till the end of days
Not quite, I've played Guild Wars 1 until the release of GW2 and I never had to pay for anything except when new expansion were released, and I would have gladly payed for HoT, and I already spent some money on the in game store for pets and clothes.
I just dont think it's fair to pay 200 gems for each quest of the main story.
But GW1 wasn't really mmorpg as it was Co-op Multiplayer RPG. They had no ways of monetizing the first game since the game wasn't made with cash shop in mind (and there actually was no cash shop at start).
GW2 is MMORPG and it was built with B2P model in mind and they are working on new stuff for the game, since they have nothing else but their cash shop as main source of income and production of new stuff for game isn't free it's only fair that they charge something for what they're doing.
You can always BUY THE GEMS WITH GOLD and as such you don't have to spend a single dollar on the new content, it only requires you to play the game and get enough gold to purchase the gems.
Also the story was free when it went public and you could've unlocked it if you logged in once the episode was released, so that's their way of rewarding players who are active.
You as a returning player can't expect everything to be handed instantly to you besides what you already payed for (and that's the original game content). So you either have to buy it or play the game long enough to obtain it with in-game golds.
In my opinion the living story is not worth a single dollar / single gold coin.
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life." -------------------------------
I hav ejust returned to the game. Last time I played was during the LA invasion. I quit right after that. Now I return to see this. And while it's not enough to deter me from playing. I still think it's a dick move by ANET even though I'd probably have skipped over it anyway. Which begs the question.....How much are they really making off this? It's not like I am seeing players spamming map looking for more to join them to play though previous episodes. I just don't see this as a money maker. So why do it if all it's doing is pissng off people who probably wouldn't take the time to run through it even if it was for free?
As for the argument that it's temporary and is part of the living world factor..........It seems that's not really the case now is it? Obviously the content is no longer "living" if you can pay to go back through it.
Well, since i've created this thread i've been insulted, understood, had people agree and disagree and read all types of arguments, but I still feel that it is completely unfair because this are no simple seasonal events, they are part of a story, and it makes no sense whatsoever to comeback to the game and pick up the story right this moment without knowing anything about what came before.
I would certainly understand if this were loose quests without relation to each other,. but they are not, they are part of a series, and making me pay 200 gems for every single one released till now is nonsense. And they expect me to buy another box in Heart of Thorns? Why should I, I can't even understand where the story is going unless I pay right now more than 20€...
It is unfair, It wouldnt be if they were completely loose events, like Halloween parties or Christmas etc, but this are part of the main PvE world changing story.
You already said that you missed the complete Season 1 of the story so why are you so obsessed with Season 2 now if you don't even know what it's all about?
Since I've came back to the game I've been playing the season 1 (since the part I left it at around lvl 70) and finished it today in the morning, killed Zhaitan for the first time. And there I go, all happy and ready to start season 2 when I see, for the first time, that I had to pay for it...
No, you actually played through your personal story. You missed the entire first season which was delivered through living story updates. Unlike season two, the first one wasn't limited to maximum level cap characters only.
Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.
Because it was so difficult to spend 60 seconds of your time to log in (and do nothing more) during each 2 week release period of a story patch.
Quite frankly, if you couldn't even give the game that much of a passing glance, you don't deserve said content for free.
You're right! Anyone who didn't play the game during the time the episode was out should not be entitled to even play the content.
Screw you if you had real obligations.
Everything wrong with this community in a nutshell, good thing I uninstalled the game a very long time ago and never looked back. The "CONTENT" is not worth the $2.50.
Well, since i've created this thread i've been insulted, understood, had people agree and disagree and read all types of arguments, but I still feel that it is completely unfair because this are no simple seasonal events, they are part of a story, and it makes no sense whatsoever to comeback to the game and pick up the story right this moment without knowing anything about what came before.
I would certainly understand if this were loose quests without relation to each other,. but they are not, they are part of a series, and making me pay 200 gems for every single one released till now is nonsense. And they expect me to buy another box in Heart of Thorns? Why should I, I can't even understand where the story is going unless I pay right now more than 20€...
It is unfair, It wouldnt be if they were completely loose events, like Halloween parties or Christmas etc, but this are part of the main PvE world changing story.
You already said that you missed the complete Season 1 of the story so why are you so obsessed with Season 2 now if you don't even know what it's all about?
Since I've came back to the game I've been playing the season 1 (since the part I left it at around lvl 70) and finished it today in the morning, killed Zhaitan for the first time. And there I go, all happy and ready to start season 2 when I see, for the first time, that I had to pay for it...
You were NOT playing "Season 1 of the Living Story". You were completing your Personal Story which is a part of the base game available to all players of the appropriate level.
Season 1 is not available to anyone to play since its completion months and months ago. (ArenaNet has said they would like to find a way for players to access this content, but that it would need a lot of reworking.)
At least with Season 2, for a small gem purchase, you can still play this content and keep up to date with the ongoing story of Tyria--even if you never bothered to log in all this time previously.
Well, since i've created this thread i've been insulted, understood, had people agree and disagree and read all types of arguments, but I still feel that it is completely unfair because this are no simple seasonal events, they are part of a story, and it makes no sense whatsoever to comeback to the game and pick up the story right this moment without knowing anything about what came before.
I would certainly understand if this were loose quests without relation to each other,. but they are not, they are part of a series, and making me pay 200 gems for every single one released till now is nonsense. And they expect me to buy another box in Heart of Thorns? Why should I, I can't even understand where the story is going unless I pay right now more than 20€...
It is unfair, It wouldnt be if they were completely loose events, like Halloween parties or Christmas etc, but this are part of the main PvE world changing story.
You already said that you missed the complete Season 1 of the story so why are you so obsessed with Season 2 now if you don't even know what it's all about?
Since I've came back to the game I've been playing the season 1 (since the part I left it at around lvl 70) and finished it today in the morning, killed Zhaitan for the first time. And there I go, all happy and ready to start season 2 when I see, for the first time, that I had to pay for it...
No, you actually played through your personal story. You missed the entire first season which was delivered through living story updates. Unlike season two, the first one wasn't limited to maximum level cap characters only.
Well, I didnt know that, thats even worse, lol, not only do I have to pay to know what happened in the world recently, I can't even know what happened before unless I read or check Youtube videos... this game is really not made with new players in mind...
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I think what is rubbing people wrong with this is not so much that you are paying for content as much as you are paying for content that was given free to others. If Anet had charged everyone for this content like DLC all along it would have come across differently. But then, I don't think the community would have much liked the idea of being charged every 2 weeks for a tiny bit of new content. Charging people now for this content on a per chapter basis is basically the same thing but with the added rub of making people who had to put the game on hold feel like they are being punished for doing so. A lot of people bought this game because they felt that the B2P model would give them the flexibility to set the game aside at will without feeling like they were wasting money on a subscription that was ticking only to find out that they were going to be charged after the fact for having the temerity to do other things for a while.
The point is that this charge leaves people feeling a bit swindled. It is immaterial if they were swindled in fact or not. Making your customers feel stupid or cheated is not the best way to keep them.
Instead of charging per episode I think it would have come off much better if Anet had done a one time charge off say $20 to unlock access to the whole story journal. Then they would have been selling a major feature rather than the content itself which would have worked better with the whole B2P concept. Never mind that it is a feature that allows them access to that content. The perception would have been much more positive. They kind of blew that opportunity with this who have already returned but they could still pull it off with those yet to return.
I think you hit the nail on the head. I also think it is more of a way to force people to regularly log on and stay relevant.
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
Comments
Kind of the point of the OP was that he would NOT use the gems now either. So they lose anyhow right off the bat.
If they want to get people to return kind of a smack in the face and a good reason to just say no to people it seems. Just delete game and move on. Or people that were thinking of returning, just see this stuff and think no as well.
Dunno, right or wrong does not enter into it. Just what people think of a game that is buy to play. They do not expect to run into paywalls, and if they do...easier to just delete game and move on to something else. Buy to play with expansions are one thing. Buy for each thing as you play seems strange. Even grinding to get them will turn off a lot of folks i think.
I have yet to see an industry where the cost to acquire a new customer is less than retaining an existing customer. It's, generally, not even close. It's almost always 5-10 times more costly to acquire a new customer. You need to remember that even though they're selling a game to someone on sale, it's not like it's all profit. They still have marketing costs, revenue shares, etc., etc. that need to be paid. Whereas, for someone like you, you can throw me a pet Corgi and I'd probably come back in just to claim it (maybe not that easy). Give me gems, give me gold. These are relatively cost-free things you can do to bring me back, whereas you still need to sell a box to someone new.
Crazkanuk
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Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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Ok let me get this straight. Buying the gems required to unlock every single step in the S2 living story costs £8.99! That's the regular subscription for a P2P MMO.
You haven't lost access to anything. It's like complaining that a game got a dlc and you can't play it for free. Look at it that way, the game got a DLC worth of content and they are charging a fairly below average price for a DLC - £9.
In GW1 there were mission packs which you had to buy and those were not included in the expansions. So you're statement of "I never had to pay for anything except when new expansion was released" is wrong. You had to pay to play the story missions.
People have given you like a billion options of how you can get the content for free or to pay for it. It looks like you've created this topic just to troll cause you clearly don't want any input from the rest of us. You just want to bash GW2 and that's what you did in your last 5 posts in this topic.
IF you can't afford 9 bucks or think that it is unfair that they are charging you 9 bucks for what is more than an average sized DLC, then you free to go play something else. Certainly no one will miss you, considering you don't want to a) play the game to unlock the content or b) pay an extremely small amount of money to unlock the content.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Sorry but that is a dumb move. Either release it for free or do not. Do not do both. Just a recipe to tick some people off.
Saying that they released it for free.. but now it costs cash....and that people expect them to work for free. Kind of a strange argument i think. Since they released it for free.....they want to have it both ways. And it just gives them the bad of both ways as well.
Some people will be turned off and not play the game or buy any further expansions. So it seems that it hurts the company more than any gamers that say meh, not worth my time,
I think you're right in the sense most industries are less costly in keeping existing customers... but I would stand to reason that Free MMOs and B2P MMOs are different, because they thrive primarily off of customers that are willing to spend money, not necessarily the returning customers.
I mean if you play long enough and hard enough in GW2 you don't have to spend any actual money.. you just grind out gold and transfer it to gems. Telling the users they will get a shiny goldfish for returning might bring players back in.. and in a P2P game.. that actually does spell revenue.
The thing is, in GW2, they say "We have a shiny new fish every month" with the living story and people still didn't return for it. Those that did (as the OP clearly states) aren't willing to really pay for it.... so content wise, their revenue will mostly come from new players. I think with how volatile MMOs are...and the very high turnover rates, games like GW2 and many of the other F2P games or cash shop games realize if they want to be (more) profitable its not about returning customers, its about the casual player who has less time but a lot of money.
Im 100% for supporting a game with my money. Doing it with pay walls I am not. IMO they would do better moving the pay wall down the line at min. Let you start the living story and on the 3rd or 4th installment you have to pay. Its really dumb to run into a pay wall on a B2P game when you log in for the first time in months.
Thank you OP very much for making this thread.
I seriously had no idea that we need to pay for each Season 2 story quest.
Initially i wanted to buy the next expansion to support GW b2p business model.
Now that i know, i won't buy future expansion and any future Guild Wars game anymore.
And again...how does this hurt a player? He just says no more cash to this company. The company is the only loser here.
The whole point to a buy to play is pay once and done. Not get nickeled and dimed to death also.
And expansion are so different , if you really do not see that no point in trying to talk about anything else here.
Heh last thing how in the world can people that bought the game in the first place now be a freeloader? You really need to stop and think before you use some of these terms i think. If people didn't buy the game, then they would not be there to complain about the paywalls now would they? Kind of duh.
in Guild Wars 2:
1. if you login during each update you get the contents for free
2. making gems is really easy.
3. since they keep their game updated a lot they deserve what they are asking for specially with conditions like this.
my top MMOs: UO,DAOC,WoW,GW2
most of my posts are just my opinions they are not facts,it is the same for you too.
I think people sometimes have a few misconceptions of what it means to be a B2P MMO with a cash shop, its inevitable things will be monetised, they have to generate revenue after all, and 'selling' new content is a pretty good way of handling it, and if it does well enough, they can introduce even more of what could be termed 'adventure packs' i think some people might be in for a bit of a shock, for instance, how would people react if they found out when ESO goes B2P, that they have to pay for access to the campaigns? its such an obvious one after all. B2P means you get the base game, thats pretty much it, it does not mean that everything will be free.
Well, since i've created this thread i've been insulted, understood, had people agree and disagree and read all types of arguments, but I still feel that it is completely unfair because this are no simple seasonal events, they are part of a story, and it makes no sense whatsoever to comeback to the game and pick up the story right this moment without knowing anything about what came before.
I would certainly understand if this were loose quests without relation to each other,. but they are not, they are part of a series, and making me pay 200 gems for every single one released till now is nonsense. And they expect me to buy another box in Heart of Thorns? Why should I, I can't even understand where the story is going unless I pay right now more than 20€...
It is unfair, It wouldnt be if they were completely loose events, like Halloween parties or Christmas etc, but this are part of the main PvE world changing story.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
You already said that you missed the complete Season 1 of the story so why are you so obsessed with Season 2 now if you don't even know what it's all about?
Since I've came back to the game I've been playing the season 1 (since the part I left it at around lvl 70) and finished it today in the morning, killed Zhaitan for the first time. And there I go, all happy and ready to start season 2 when I see, for the first time, that I had to pay for it...
But GW1 wasn't really mmorpg as it was Co-op Multiplayer RPG. They had no ways of monetizing the first game since the game wasn't made with cash shop in mind (and there actually was no cash shop at start).
GW2 is MMORPG and it was built with B2P model in mind and they are working on new stuff for the game, since they have nothing else but their cash shop as main source of income and production of new stuff for game isn't free it's only fair that they charge something for what they're doing.
You can always BUY THE GEMS WITH GOLD and as such you don't have to spend a single dollar on the new content, it only requires you to play the game and get enough gold to purchase the gems.
Also the story was free when it went public and you could've unlocked it if you logged in once the episode was released, so that's their way of rewarding players who are active.
You as a returning player can't expect everything to be handed instantly to you besides what you already payed for (and that's the original game content). So you either have to buy it or play the game long enough to obtain it with in-game golds.
In my opinion the living story is not worth a single dollar / single gold coin.
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life."
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I hav ejust returned to the game. Last time I played was during the LA invasion. I quit right after that. Now I return to see this. And while it's not enough to deter me from playing. I still think it's a dick move by ANET even though I'd probably have skipped over it anyway. Which begs the question.....How much are they really making off this? It's not like I am seeing players spamming map looking for more to join them to play though previous episodes. I just don't see this as a money maker. So why do it if all it's doing is pissng off people who probably wouldn't take the time to run through it even if it was for free?
As for the argument that it's temporary and is part of the living world factor..........It seems that's not really the case now is it? Obviously the content is no longer "living" if you can pay to go back through it.
No, you actually played through your personal story. You missed the entire first season which was delivered through living story updates. Unlike season two, the first one wasn't limited to maximum level cap characters only.
You're right! Anyone who didn't play the game during the time the episode was out should not be entitled to even play the content.
Screw you if you had real obligations.
Everything wrong with this community in a nutshell, good thing I uninstalled the game a very long time ago and never looked back. The "CONTENT" is not worth the $2.50.
You were NOT playing "Season 1 of the Living Story". You were completing your Personal Story which is a part of the base game available to all players of the appropriate level.
Season 1 is not available to anyone to play since its completion months and months ago. (ArenaNet has said they would like to find a way for players to access this content, but that it would need a lot of reworking.)
At least with Season 2, for a small gem purchase, you can still play this content and keep up to date with the ongoing story of Tyria--even if you never bothered to log in all this time previously.
Well, I didnt know that, thats even worse, lol, not only do I have to pay to know what happened in the world recently, I can't even know what happened before unless I read or check Youtube videos... this game is really not made with new players in mind...
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I think you hit the nail on the head. I also think it is more of a way to force people to regularly log on and stay relevant.
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
Play Free and pick up the questlines later with gold
Buy for free and buy the questlines with gems
Wish for the game to be sub based.
Or complain about some free beerz solution over and above the above?
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.