Elite rip-off

DeSadeWhirlfist

Any company that doesn't stand behind their product shouldn't warrant your money. Take it from me I purchased the early access/kick starter/crowdfunding/ whatever you want to call it. I then asked for my money back, sure some will say I knew what I was doing when I purchased therefor shouldn't receive a refund. Well I look at it more like real life and what you able to do for most if not all purchases, which is return the product if your not happy with it. This puts companies directly behind their products and keeps their customers happy. I have supposedly played the game for 23hrs course this counts any afk time, which once you count remapping, reading the manual while alt tabbed, searching websites for relevant info on what to do in the game, and lastly getting over the cumbersome UI. Since Frontier Developments refuses to stand behind their product, by offering refunds to disgruntled customers. Well as a customer my recourse is to take my "gaming" time to forums and other forms of social media. If i had to do it over again I would not invest my money in Elite: Dangerous. 

 

Cons-

UI is clunky and initially takes a bit to get used to, once used to it you realize unless using a VR/IR tech you actually need to take eyes off driving your ship, very non user friendly.

Lack of real economy make losing your ship feel meaningless.

No person to person trading be it market/auction house/personal

Universe is so large, the game will require a population that the game will never achieve. Think eve online but space so big you can go months/years/forever possibly without ever seeing another player.

PVP since universe so large lack of suitable "fun" pvp is few and far between, you'd be better off pvping a friend to coordinate where to meet up.

Graphics remind me of something I have played on Playstation or XBox rather then something that is new.

Pros-

Well it was a neat concept after folks play this game they will know what they don't like thanks for moving the genre forward.

Learned not to ever buy from Frontier again regardless of game they put out

Hopefully this post will save someone their hard earned money.

 

Sincerely,

31 year veteran gamer. Atari got played at the age of 4, hooked on NES/Arcade at 5yr old. Gamer of more hours then any employee at Frontier Development.

mcrippins

I enjoy the game quite a bit, and I feel their development path is fine. You seem like a person who is hard to please. Sorry you didn't like the game, but I personally don't think you deserve a refund. Even though you will probably get one if you complain enough.

Kyleran

As you said, you are old enough to have understood what you were signing up for and to bear the consequences of your decision.

Also correct not to buy from them again, same decision I made when Zeninax refused to refund my ESO purchase, but the holy crusade is way over the top and entirely pointless and unnecessary.

Take a deep breath and let it go, likely won't be your last or worst buying decision.

rpmcmurphy

All your points are like those from someone who made an uninformed decision. After 31 years of gaming you should be aware of the pitfalls of pre-purchasing, if you're not certain you're going to get what you want then don't press buy, simple.

Perhaps there's a reddit trade / sale section?

Erillion

Sounds like E:D would be your kind of game if you would have waited the two extra years it needs to become all it is supposed to be. They had to release it early - for monetary reasons. The game is still far from complete and I agree with quite a few of the points you mentioned. I personally still consider it a good, enjoyable game - with lots of room for improvement.

My recommendation .. keep the game, put it aside for at least a year .. come back to it and take a second look around.

 

Have fun

Boneserino

Originally posted by DeSadeWhirlfist

Any company that doesn't stand behind their product shouldn't warrant your money. Take it from me I purchased the early access/kick starter/crowdfunding/ whatever you want to call it. I then asked for my money back, sure some will say I knew what I was doing when I purchased therefor shouldn't receive a refund. Well I look at it more like real life and what you able to do for most if not all purchases, which is return the product if your not happy with it. This puts companies directly behind their products and keeps their customers happy. I have supposedly played the game for 23hrs course this counts any afk time, which once you count remapping, reading the manual while alt tabbed, searching websites for relevant info on what to do in the game, and lastly getting over the cumbersome UI. Since Frontier Developments refuses to stand behind their product, by offering refunds to disgruntled customers. Well as a customer my recourse is to take my "gaming" time to forums and other forms of social media. If i had to do it over again I would not invest my money in Elite: Dangerous. 

 

Cons-

UI is clunky and initially takes a bit to get used to, once used to it you realize unless using a VR/IR tech you actually need to take eyes off driving your ship, very non user friendly.

Lack of real economy make losing your ship feel meaningless.

No person to person trading be it market/auction house/personal

Universe is so large, the game will require a population that the game will never achieve. Think eve online but space so big you can go months/years/forever possibly without ever seeing another player.

PVP since universe so large lack of suitable "fun" pvp is few and far between, you'd be better off pvping a friend to coordinate where to meet up.

Graphics remind me of something I have played on Playstation or XBox rather then something that is new.

Pros-

Well it was a neat concept after folks play this game they will know what they don't like thanks for moving the genre forward.

Learned not to ever buy from Frontier again regardless of game they put out

Hopefully this post will save someone their hard earned money.

 

Sincerely,

31 year veteran gamer. Atari got played at the age of 4, hooked on NES/Arcade at 5yr old. Gamer of more hours then any employee at Frontier Development.

ROFLMAO!!! 

Stone_Fountain

Compared to AA and what they have done, E:D is pretty darn good OP. 

Bladestrom

There were loads of warnings and articles that talked about the perceived issues the OP referred to before release. personally I took a punt and paid for it, played for a few hours, absolutely loved the game, but realised it needed another year so u shelved it. No regrets because I know I will go back to it once it matures, and I remember elite and frontier fondly. Got to be responsible for your own decisions op, but that asside, I advise shelve for 6 months and wait for a couple big patches - game will be there when you return.

ViSioN_BCN

I completely agree with you, It happened exactly the same to me, even talked to my bank and no way to return me the money back, They are modern thieves, consumers are completely helpless against this type of manipulation. I just installed the game and the difficulty of handling I have left and lost over 200 €.

The good thing about this case is that this advantage they have, they themselves are burying every day because fewer people will believe them and at the end of that no one will invest  1€ in any game of this type.

Caldrin

I am really enjoying Eltie and it is worth every penny I spent on it..

Muke

Originally posted by DeSadeWhirlfist

 

Sincerely,

31 year veteran gamer. Atari got played at the age of 4, hooked on NES/Arcade at 5yr old. Gamer of more hours then any employee at Frontier Development.

Serious, if you haven't played original Pong, original Pacman/Space Invaders and the like, Magnavox-ves-Spectrum-Atari 2600-C64 then you are not a veteran. :P

rpmcmurphy

Originally posted by ViSioN_BCN
I completely agree with you, It happened exactly the same to me, even talked to my bank and no way to return me the money back, They are modern thieves, consumers are completely helpless against this type of manipulation. I just installed the game and the difficulty of handling I have left and lost over 200 €.
 

Is that a valid reason for a refund though? The game is too hard to control with my peripherals, I want my money back. Would you go in a book store and buy something on quantum mechanics and then expect a refund because your brain hurts?

Perhaps they should give refunds for every reason but they've got to draw the line somewhere.

ReaperUk

I'm as surprised as you are OP that you've played the game for 23 hours as you certainly have many misconceptions about the game.

First of all, the things I agree with:

Clunky UI. Quite why they decided to reinvent the wheel and use WASD and the space key to navigate menus I don't know... unless it's because it will make porting to a console controller easier later.

No person to person trading. True but what would you use it for? There is no crafting and everything you need to buy currently apart from ammo and repairs can be resold back for the original purchase price.

Things you got wrong:

"losing your ship feel meaningless" Insurance cost are quite hefty once you progress beyond the starter ships. What's more, if someone forgets to keep sufficient credits back for that, they lose the whole ship and it's modules  That can take anything from days to weeks to replace. Hardly meaningless.

Large Universe...it's called realism. Most people have no need to go into the unkown but it's there for the people that like exploring.

Universe too large for PvP? Well that ties in with the previous misunderstanding of the game. One of the main gripes on the ED forums is actually that there's too much PvP for the people that don't want it. The core systems are all relatively populated and people that want PvP have no problem finding it.

Graphics are as as good as is necessary to depict what is mostly empty space. I'm not sure how you think that could be improved?

Expect a refund after 23 hours online with the game? Good luck with that. You'll have to invite me to your world because that certainly doesn't happen in the real one I live in.

ViSioN_BCN

Originally posted by rpmcmurphy

Originally posted by ViSioN_BCN
I completely agree with you, It happened exactly the same to me, even talked to my bank and no way to return me the money back, They are modern thieves, consumers are completely helpless against this type of manipulation. I just installed the game and the difficulty of handling I have left and lost over 200 €.
 

Is that a valid reason for a refund though? The game is too hard to control with my peripherals, I want my money back. Would you go in a book store and buy something on quantum mechanics and then expect a refund because your brain hurts?

Perhaps they should give refunds for every reason but they've got to draw the line somewhere.

Is not about brains, perhaps your brains because of incapability of read properly....if I cannot control the game by keyboard and mouse and to understand the game a bibble (ton of instructions) is mut need it. Also the game is a shit and worthless. Perhaps only for complex flightsim fans with no land-spacescapes, like Star Citizen. 

And for short, consumers needs an internet law if for some reason we are not  agree or whatever with a product to have a refound back, specially if is a BETA, because is a TEST and if is a TEST then we dont need to pay nothing at all, even if is a crowfounding ( theft ). period

Gruug

I do not dislike ED. In fact, I think the game has some potential. The problem I see is that the game is still far from being complete. You can basically do trade runs; explore the galaxy or become a bounty hunter. That is it. While you can do any or all of these things solo or in a group, it all gets very repetitive very quickly. There is no in your face story or ramdom events that make any sense in this game...at least not readily noticable unless you pay attention at the right time and place. Again, do not get me wrong. I like the game for what it has...it just doesn't have that much.

CrazKanuk

Originally posted by Muke

Originally posted by DeSadeWhirlfist

 

Sincerely,

31 year veteran gamer. Atari got played at the age of 4, hooked on NES/Arcade at 5yr old. Gamer of more hours then any employee at Frontier Development.

Serious, if you haven't played original Pong, original Pacman/Space Invaders and the like, Magnavox-ves-Spectrum-Atari 2600-C64 then you are not a veteran. :P

Pong? How about a pong console?!??!? Now THAT is hardcore. 

 

Sorry, but I find it VERY difficult to believe that you were alt-tabbed for 23 hours. Oh! On top of that, I would definitely try taking a console game back to Wal-Mart or Gamestop after you've only played it for 23 hours and tell them you just didn't like it. Sorry, they won't take it back. Maybe buying games without a trial isn't the best idea for the OP. 

Arawulf

You really can't return video games just because you don't like them. It's like going to the theater saying, "I want a refund because the advertisement said it was a good movie." 

Pala

I am confused here, are you an investor in Elite as you say in the final paragraph? If so what was the investment deal? Or are you a customer and did you purchase the game? Or were you a backer of the project? Which is it because they are all different things?

UserUndeleted

As someone who received a full refund as a result of the offline mode cancellation, I found that Trading Standards in the UK are aware of Frontier Developments & their questionalble business practices. What was interesting to me was how they, Trading Standards, look upon crowd funding in its simple form as 'advertsiing'. That is how they treat it, crowdfunding is a form of advertising to them. In their view people are buying into a product based on an advertisement. Not a pledge for, or promise of a product & the ambigous terms that surround it.

You may have a case for a refund if you contact Trading Standard, assuming you're in the UK.

 

I also agree that Frontier Developments are a dodgy outfit.

Pala

Originally posted by UserUndeleted

As someone who received a full refund as a result of the offline mode cancellation, I found that Trading Standards in the UK are aware of Frontier Developments & their questionalble business practices. What was interesting to me was how they, Trading Standards, look upon crowd funding in its simple form as 'advertsiing'. That is how they treat it, crowdfunding is a form of advertising to them. In their view people are buying into a product based on an advertisement. Not a pledge for, or promise of a product & the ambigous terms that surround it.

You may have a case for a refund if you contact Trading Standard, assuming you're in the UK.

 

I also agree that Frontier Developments are a dodgy outfit.

So you received a full refund and yet they are a dodgy outfit. `Questionable` - perhaps they are new and different due to kickstarter and Trading Standards are therefore aware and a bit miffed (government institutions dont like new ways of doing things). 

So the fact that Trading Standards could only categorize crowdfunding as advertising says more about them than the companies that use crowdfunding to raise money.  I know this because about 15 years I started trading shares as a gift product and Trading Standards were completely confused by the whole thing. 

Why the need to write in the way you did? 

rpmcmurphy

Originally posted by ViSioN_BCN

Is not about brains, perhaps your brains because of incapability of read properly....if I cannot control the game by keyboard and mouse and to understand the game a bibble (ton of instructions) is mut need it. Also the game is a shit and worthless. Perhaps only for complex flightsim fans with no land-spacescapes, like Star Citizen. 

And for short, consumers needs an internet law if for some reason we are not  agree or whatever with a product to have a refound back, specially if is a BETA, because is a TEST and if is a TEST then we dont need to pay nothing at all, even if is a crowfounding ( theft ). period

 

It seems the incapacity to read and understand is purely on your end. I'm sure most people would get a headache trying to understand quantum mechanics which was the sole reason I used it as a metaphor....

Would you buy something like Assetto Corsa, find you can't control it sufficiently without a racing wheel and expect Valve / Steam to refund you? I'd be surprised if they would consider it a valid reason for a refund.

We don't need laws, we need people to do their homework and take responsibilty for their actions. Elite was free of any NDA from its first alpha test, there were many write-ups / videos talking about control methods, the tonne of options etc etc.

voltt

I remember back in the day you when there was no such thing as a refund on buying a game. You bought it, like it or not it was yours then. What has changed??? i dont think you should get a refund. 

rpmcmurphy

Originally posted by voltt

I remember back in the day you when there was no such thing as a refund on buying a game. You bought it, like it or not it was yours then. What has changed??? i dont think you should get a refund. 

 

Maybe the same people got used to getting early access keys for a $5 deposit from Amazon and then getting a refund when the early access finishes.

Tyggs

Originally posted by voltt

I remember back in the day you when there was no such thing as a refund on buying a game. You bought it, like it or not it was yours then. What has changed??? i dont think you should get a refund. 

 I remember a day when a game wasn't playable until finished. I agree people shouldn't be asking for refunds, but people should be playing finished products at the same time. It's just the way things are going now.

Mardukk

Originally posted by Gruug
I do not dislike ED. In fact, I think the game has some potential. The problem I see is that the game is still far from being complete. You can basically do trade runs; explore the galaxy or become a bounty hunter. That is it. While you can do any or all of these things solo or in a group, it all gets very repetitive very quickly. There is no in your face story or ramdom events that make any sense in this game...at least not readily noticable unless you pay attention at the right time and place. Again, do not get me wrong. I like the game for what it has...it just doesn't have that much.

Is there any PvE in the game?  Any loot from PvE activities/combat?  I have heard contradicting reports so not sure what is correct.

 

I don't know why people are blowing money on unfinished games.  They either have a lot a free money to throw around or they really really trust the developer.

 

Edit:  Thanks to the poster below me.

TheYear1500

Originally posted by Mardukk

Originally posted by Gruug
I do not dislike ED. In fact, I think the game has some potential. The problem I see is that the game is still far from being complete. You can basically do trade runs; explore the galaxy or become a bounty hunter. That is it. While you can do any or all of these things solo or in a group, it all gets very repetitive very quickly. There is no in your face story or ramdom events that make any sense in this game...at least not readily noticable unless you pay attention at the right time and place. Again, do not get me wrong. I like the game for what it has...it just doesn't have that much.

Is there any PvE in the game?  Any loot from PvE activities/combat?  I have heard contradicting reports so not sure what is correct.

 

I don't know why people are blowing money on unfinished games.  They either have a lot a free money to throw around or they really really trust the developer.

Yes there is lots of PvE in the game and there is loot from PvE activities.