Originally posted by Kyleran The tourists are leaving the genre, soon we'll have it all to ourselves again.
The only problem with this is that when tourists leave, so does their money. As soon as these tourists "move on" do you really think that things are going to get better? The big complaints right now are about innovation, but will less money make that better? Meh..... The biggest innovations will be about how lean a dev team can be and still get work done. With reduced budgets, MMORPG development is going to be like pissing through a pinhole, super messy, mostly pointless, and it's just something you really just want to try.
I thought this was a very short-sighted comment as well. This is not the first time someone mistakenly thinks that once everyone else leaves, MMOs will be fun again. I wonder, are the folks still playing Wildstar or AA having fun yet? We all know that an empty MMO is not fun. We all know that when an MMO gets the label "ghost town" that it's pretty much over. And yes, once players who just like to have fun instead of making it their life's work leave a game, they take their money with them.
Originally posted by Kyleran The tourists are leaving the genre, soon we'll have it all to ourselves again.
I'm getting that impression too.
There's hope.
If you hang out in Twitch a lot like i do ,you see the trends of gamer's.They are buying anything and everything that is even remotely popular,so yes the MMO genre will struggle because of it.
Blizzard can still sell anything as gamer's in general,not even Blizz fanbois seem to jump in every game that comes out.I see streamers playing LOL then all a sudden Hots the next day,why bother when you have LOL why jump over to HOTS.Same for Hearthstone,i see so many new streamers that are imo not really good gamer's they again just jump in on every single Blizzard game.
Then i see tons of games that look some young kids weekend pet project ,yet people are still buying these things.
I really believe streamers are the driving force,they feel in the mood for something different so they buy it,then all of a sudden chat is all over that game no matter how crap it is and tons more are buying it.
Point is that there is no logic at all for supporting games,that really makes it tough for developers thinking of making a very costly game when they can just make rubbish and have the same results.I have lost track at how many rubbish games i see popular that last a week or two ,some a month or two then disappear right off the charts.
No wonder so many early access/Alpha games getting rich,all they need is to release a game in any state,get rich selling it for a week or two then forget about it,no more investment needed.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Not trying to be a smartass but I have not been reading the forums much and generally not keeping up but what are the very good RPG games on PC and the ones that have just come out (last year or so) and are coming out please ?
Originally posted by kitarad Not trying to be a smartass but I have not been reading the forums much and generally not keeping up but what are the very good RPG games on PC and the ones that have just come out (last year or so) and are coming out please ?
Witcher 3, Pillars of Eternity, Dark Souls 2 ... there are plenty.
Just because there's good singleplayer games coming out, doesn't mean MMOs are doomed lol.
Honestly, the last singleplayer games I bought and beat, were GTA 5, Watch Dogs. I bought Dying Light and it was garbage so I never played it again. And after that, Killzone for PS3 lol.
When all is said and done, more is always said than done.
Just because there's good singleplayer games coming out, doesn't mean MMOs are doomed lol.
It also does not mean that MMOs are not doomed.
Players only have so many hours a day to play games. One hour that someone plays a SP game is one that he is not playing a MMO. You do understand different types of entertainment compete with one another, right?
Just because there's good singleplayer games coming out, doesn't mean MMOs are doomed lol.
It also does not mean that MMOs are not doomed.
Players only have so many hours a day to play games. One hour that someone plays a SP game is one that he is not playing a MMO. You do understand different types of entertainment compete with one another, right?
Oh, no I didn't realize that. Ya, u right.
When all is said and done, more is always said than done.
I can't get into single player games at all. I have to be playing with or competing against real players, its what drives me. I want to make my own story and my own mark and I want other real people to know about it and feel it.
Just because there's good singleplayer games coming out, doesn't mean MMOs are doomed lol.
It also does not mean that MMOs are not doomed.
Players only have so many hours a day to play games. One hour that someone plays a SP game is one that he is not playing a MMO. You do understand different types of entertainment compete with one another, right?
Do you understand that some folks will play MMORPG's and only MMORPG's, right?
MMO's have been competing against other forms of entertainment for over 15 years, and still are going strong, no real danger of them fading completely away.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Originally posted by kitarad Not trying to be a smartass but I have not been reading the forums much and generally not keeping up but what are the very good RPG games on PC and the ones that have just come out (last year or so) and are coming out please ?
Witcher 3, Pillars of Eternity, Dark Souls 2 ... there are plenty.
Grand Theft Auto 5 is also a single player game and it allows a lot more to do then just steal cars. Aside from the better story, gameplay, and graphics you can also play golf, play tennis, go to strip clubs, do a marathon, bicycle race, dirt bike race, race water vehicles, play darts, play the stock market, flying planes/helicopters, and I'm probably missing a lot of other things. You can also play online though I haven't done that.
MMOs seem to offer a more simplistic gameplay outside of raiding. Most of the game is just killing and looting in different ways.
Do you understand that some folks will play MMORPG's and only MMORPG's, right?
Are there enough of them? In fact, I know no one in real life (except may be on this forum) who will play MMORPGs and only MMORPGs.
Most people i know play single player games, MOBAs, other online games, watch tv, whatever that is on netflix and a bunch of other entertainment.
In fact, at least from my anecdotal observations (and yes, I will be the first to admit I have no statistics .. and if you do .. please share), most people do NOT only play MMORPGs and only MMORPGs.
Do you understand that some folks will play MMORPG's and only MMORPG's, right?
Are there enough of them? In fact, I know no one in real life (except may be on this forum) who will play MMORPGs and only MMORPGs.
Most people i know play single player games, MOBAs, other online games, watch tv, whatever that is on netflix and a bunch of other entertainment.
In fact, at least from my anecdotal observations (and yes, I will be the first to admit I have no statistics .. and if you do .. please share), most people do NOT only play MMORPGs and only MMORPGs.
I do believe Kyleran was referring specifically to video games and not TV/Netflix/Bowling/Darts/Hockey beer league etc. Some folks really do just enjoy one genre of gaming. I am not one of them, but I know a few.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Originally posted by Kyleran The tourists are leaving the genre, soon we'll have it all to ourselves again.
The AAA devs are also leaving the genre. But I suppose you don't mind indie niche offerings.
This also applies to single player games.
The best examples are Koji Igarashi with his own version of classic Castlevania without Konami (Fck konami), and the old Rare guys making Yooka Laylee. I wonder what Kojima will be up to as well without the now trashy Konami (fck konami).
So its not only the mmos industry experiencing this trend. I hope its all happening for good.
As for the Topic of this thread, well.... it depends on what devs do with upcoming mmos. If they keep making the open world content for solo players and only having instances and raids as group contents then they will have a tough time against single player games which have far superior open world content for solo players with the added bonus of not being at risk of server shutdown ever.
Originally posted by Kyleran The tourists are leaving the genre, soon we'll have it all to ourselves again.
The AAA devs are also leaving the genre. But I suppose you don't mind indie niche offerings.
No, i don't mind AAA devs ignoring "my" genre. They have yet to deliver something of value anyways, so why would i miss them if they leave the house?
MMOs finally replaced social interaction, forced grouping and standing in a line while talking to eachother.
Now we have forced soloing, forced questing and everyone is the hero, without ever having to talk to anyone else. The evolution of multiplayer is here! We won,... right?
Originally posted by kitarad Not trying to be a smartass but I have not been reading the forums much and generally not keeping up but what are the very good RPG games on PC and the ones that have just come out (last year or so) and are coming out please ?
Some additions to the other poster's list:
Dragon Age Inquisition
South Park Stick of Truth
Legend of Grimrock 2
Darkest Dungeon
Divinity: Original Sin
Had a good time with all of them, though admittedly I didn't beat any of them. Would've tried to beat Inquisition but it crashed a lot.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
As a former City of Heroes player I found it hard to get into a new MMO out of fear of losing that game too. I've already been burned by bad MMOs like Neverwinter and Wildstar. OTOH I don't have the hand-eye coordination to do games like Skyrim or Mass Effect. My computer can't handle new games like DA:I or Witcher 3. I'm kind of stuck right now.
Do you understand that some folks will play MMORPG's and only MMORPG's, right?
Are there enough of them? In fact, I know no one in real life (except may be on this forum) who will play MMORPGs and only MMORPGs.
Most people i know play single player games, MOBAs, other online games, watch tv, whatever that is on netflix and a bunch of other entertainment.
In fact, at least from my anecdotal observations (and yes, I will be the first to admit I have no statistics .. and if you do .. please share), most people do NOT only play MMORPGs and only MMORPGs.
I do believe Kyleran was referring specifically to video games and not TV/Netflix/Bowling/Darts/Hockey beer league etc. Some folks really do just enjoy one genre of gaming. I am not one of them, but I know a few.
First, i doubt any people who play video games don't watch movies or tv.
Secondly, even for those who play games mostly ... are there enough who ONLY play MMORPGs? You know a few. I know none. Does anyone actually have statistics?
First, i doubt any people who play video games don't watch movies or tv.
Actually I don't watch a whole lot of TV anymore and only see the occasional movie. I'd rather have an interactive entertainment experience instead of passively watching a screen.
First, i doubt any people who play video games don't watch movies or tv.
Actually I don't watch a whole lot of TV anymore and only see the occasional movie. I'd rather have an interactive entertainment experience instead of passively watching a screen.
Good for you ... and I would rather watch Age of Ultron (or even just the first Avenger movie again) again than playing any virtual world MMO.
I guess i can modify my original comment to "I doubt MANY people who play video games don't watch movies or TV". You *have* seen Age of Ultron, right?
The odd thing is the single player games are becoming more and more like (less buggy versions of) the early mmorpgs: open world, non-linear etc while the newer mmorpgs have become more and more like old single player games.
I think if AAA companies do disappear from mmorpgs it will be better in the long run as I think those AAA companies were all chasing an artificial "wow killer" game rather than a bunch of people trying to make a game they wanted to play and that's why they went wrong.
Comments
I thought this was a very short-sighted comment as well. This is not the first time someone mistakenly thinks that once everyone else leaves, MMOs will be fun again. I wonder, are the folks still playing Wildstar or AA having fun yet? We all know that an empty MMO is not fun. We all know that when an MMO gets the label "ghost town" that it's pretty much over. And yes, once players who just like to have fun instead of making it their life's work leave a game, they take their money with them.
If you hang out in Twitch a lot like i do ,you see the trends of gamer's.They are buying anything and everything that is even remotely popular,so yes the MMO genre will struggle because of it.
Blizzard can still sell anything as gamer's in general,not even Blizz fanbois seem to jump in every game that comes out.I see streamers playing LOL then all a sudden Hots the next day,why bother when you have LOL why jump over to HOTS.Same for Hearthstone,i see so many new streamers that are imo not really good gamer's they again just jump in on every single Blizzard game.
Then i see tons of games that look some young kids weekend pet project ,yet people are still buying these things.
I really believe streamers are the driving force,they feel in the mood for something different so they buy it,then all of a sudden chat is all over that game no matter how crap it is and tons more are buying it.
Point is that there is no logic at all for supporting games,that really makes it tough for developers thinking of making a very costly game when they can just make rubbish and have the same results.I have lost track at how many rubbish games i see popular that last a week or two ,some a month or two then disappear right off the charts.
No wonder so many early access/Alpha games getting rich,all they need is to release a game in any state,get rich selling it for a week or two then forget about it,no more investment needed.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Will be interesting to see how skyforge and blade&soul will do, and the only way those games can make money is by attracting tourists.
Witcher 3, Pillars of Eternity, Dark Souls 2 ... there are plenty.
Just because there's good singleplayer games coming out, doesn't mean MMOs are doomed lol.
Honestly, the last singleplayer games I bought and beat, were GTA 5, Watch Dogs. I bought Dying Light and it was garbage so I never played it again. And after that, Killzone for PS3 lol.
It also does not mean that MMOs are not doomed.
Players only have so many hours a day to play games. One hour that someone plays a SP game is one that he is not playing a MMO. You do understand different types of entertainment compete with one another, right?
Oh, no I didn't realize that. Ya, u right.
Do you understand that some folks will play MMORPG's and only MMORPG's, right?
MMO's have been competing against other forms of entertainment for over 15 years, and still are going strong, no real danger of them fading completely away.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Thank you.
Grand Theft Auto 5 is also a single player game and it allows a lot more to do then just steal cars. Aside from the better story, gameplay, and graphics you can also play golf, play tennis, go to strip clubs, do a marathon, bicycle race, dirt bike race, race water vehicles, play darts, play the stock market, flying planes/helicopters, and I'm probably missing a lot of other things. You can also play online though I haven't done that.
MMOs seem to offer a more simplistic gameplay outside of raiding. Most of the game is just killing and looting in different ways.
Are there enough of them? In fact, I know no one in real life (except may be on this forum) who will play MMORPGs and only MMORPGs.
Most people i know play single player games, MOBAs, other online games, watch tv, whatever that is on netflix and a bunch of other entertainment.
In fact, at least from my anecdotal observations (and yes, I will be the first to admit I have no statistics .. and if you do .. please share), most people do NOT only play MMORPGs and only MMORPGs.
I think this is true. I think its been a bad few years for the AAA companies when it comes to mmo's.
I do believe Kyleran was referring specifically to video games and not TV/Netflix/Bowling/Darts/Hockey beer league etc. Some folks really do just enjoy one genre of gaming. I am not one of them, but I know a few.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
This also applies to single player games.
The best examples are Koji Igarashi with his own version of classic Castlevania without Konami (Fck konami), and the old Rare guys making Yooka Laylee. I wonder what Kojima will be up to as well without the now trashy Konami (fck konami).
So its not only the mmos industry experiencing this trend. I hope its all happening for good.
As for the Topic of this thread, well.... it depends on what devs do with upcoming mmos. If they keep making the open world content for solo players and only having instances and raids as group contents then they will have a tough time against single player games which have far superior open world content for solo players with the added bonus of not being at risk of server shutdown ever.
No, i don't mind AAA devs ignoring "my" genre. They have yet to deliver something of value anyways, so why would i miss them if they leave the house?
MMOs finally replaced social interaction, forced grouping and standing in a line while talking to eachother.
Now we have forced soloing, forced questing and everyone is the hero, without ever having to talk to anyone else. The evolution of multiplayer is here! We won,... right?
Some additions to the other poster's list:
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
First, i doubt any people who play video games don't watch movies or tv.
Secondly, even for those who play games mostly ... are there enough who ONLY play MMORPGs? You know a few. I know none. Does anyone actually have statistics?
Actually I don't watch a whole lot of TV anymore and only see the occasional movie. I'd rather have an interactive entertainment experience instead of passively watching a screen.
Good for you ... and I would rather watch Age of Ultron (or even just the first Avenger movie again) again than playing any virtual world MMO.
I guess i can modify my original comment to "I doubt MANY people who play video games don't watch movies or TV". You *have* seen Age of Ultron, right?
The odd thing is the single player games are becoming more and more like (less buggy versions of) the early mmorpgs: open world, non-linear etc while the newer mmorpgs have become more and more like old single player games.
I think if AAA companies do disappear from mmorpgs it will be better in the long run as I think those AAA companies were all chasing an artificial "wow killer" game rather than a bunch of people trying to make a game they wanted to play and that's why they went wrong.