Great ideas, but it's all in the execution. Now to wait until the dev announces that the pre-alpha will be released in (late) 2022. With major delays. And $600 founder packs.
Sigh, another buzzword-laden article about a supposed 'crack team' of industry veterans attempting to 'save' a genre which really doesn't need saving. These things are becoming so frequent I should start keeping track of how often certain claims, words, and phrases appear.
AN' DERE AIN'T NO SUCH FING AS ENUFF DAKKA, YA GROT! Enuff'z more than ya got an' less than too much an' there ain't no such fing as too much dakka. Say dere is, and me Squiggoff'z eatin' tonight!
We are born of the blood. Made men by the blood. Undone by the blood. Our eyes are yet to open. FEAR THE OLD BLOOD.
Originally posted by Rhoklaw It will be interesting to see what price they come up with for purchasing additional lineage. While one could play the game for a year with the initial box price. That is only true if you don't die from being ganked or latency death and so on. Just imagine if you were fighting a difficult battle and the internet or game drops you, causing you to die. You now just lost a month of play time or whatever, because of something out of your control? Yeah, I'm not sure that's going to work out so well.
Q. How much does the game cost? How much does a life cost?
No exact price has been set, but we anticipate it will be on par with the retail cost of other PC games. Lives will be roughly the cost of a game expansion.
Do not see much that i would find worth the bother to play really. Some ideas that sound ok...but the way they are monetizing them sounds screwy to me.
Course just a bunch of words now. If this goes anywhere may take a look in a year or 2-3 and see then.
Not to sound like a whiney carebare, but why cant some one make a sandbox style game that doesnt involve full loot. I get it, you would need a PVE element which detracts from the sandbox, but still, something with exploration, bosses, crafting but where its not me vs everyone.
It seems its either PVE themepark or PVP sandbox, with no inbetween....
I wish them luck, the Sandbox crowd have been neglected for a long time, I just wish for something that bridged the two genres...
You don't sound like that asinine word at all, I'm also looking forward to a PvE-oriented, open world, skill based sandbox and am willing to support it quite generously. There are some options out there right now, one specifically comes to mind, but it's not open world and another that's in the proverbial hopper but I don't believe it's skill based.
I wish CoE the best of luck and if for some reason they decide to have a separate server or options I'll gladly support it. They would have a leg up on the competition already out and coming out. There are a lot of open world PvP sandboxes circling the MMO-Sphere at the moment, they might want to get ahead of the pack.
Originally posted by Rhoklaw It will be interesting to see what price they come up with for purchasing additional lineage. While one could play the game for a year with the initial box price. That is only true if you don't die from being ganked or latency death and so on. Just imagine if you were fighting a difficult battle and the internet or game drops you, causing you to die. You now just lost a month of play time or whatever, because of something out of your control? Yeah, I'm not sure that's going to work out so well.
Q. How much does the game cost? How much does a life cost?
No exact price has been set, but we anticipate it will be on par with the retail cost of other PC games. Lives will be roughly the cost of a game expansion.
Do not see much that i would find worth the bother to play really. Some ideas that sound ok...but the way they are monetizing them sounds screwy to me.
Course just a bunch of words now. If this goes anywhere may take a look in a year or 2-3 and see then.
100 lives is nothing to a PVPer. That said...Nothing better to kill motivation than costing money upon failure, good luck getting people to take part in truly challenging content with this system.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
They lost me after "The world must be dynamic" ... The first point was ok, the rest weird. I mean stating the obvious ?
Hype train aside, this will not work. Too many competing mechanics and too vague a world concept.
I don't think they're revealing the entire world concept just yet. And I doubt that someone who spent years jotting down ideas and mechanic illustrations would only have the vague concept hinted in this article. I presume there's much more to hear about this game in the future, but they aren't handing out all their eggs at once so to speak.
Also the perma death/soul heritage thing that's mentioned isn't really competing with anything. It sounds like simply making a new character except that it's based on the family tree of your previous one and it merely obtains enhanced progressions for abilities you had with your previous character.
No word on whether the "destiny" aspect that was quoted is in fact to take place real world years after your character is made, or in game years. So it may not be competing, and in the case that it is real world years then they'd need one damn strong loyal player base, and probably for the "destiny" to be associated with the family heritage and not simply one character.
This is sad. All fuss about features, but in reality it's one of the thousands text about "never seen before" in last few years (or more) and it's end just there.
Originally posted by Ozmodan I wish them luck, but in practice getting your ideas to work well in game mechanisms constitutes a very difficult task.
A little voice inside my head keeps saying this to me too. I only wish the best for them, let's hope what's being written about here, and on their official website can be done justice to mechanically, for it sounds like CoE has real potential.
I have often thought how great it would be to have players create tasks for other players, the challenge is to create a system that works, and keeps working as the server matures - will be very interesting to see howrhat will turn out.
Anyways it all sound pretty good, but we seen just as great ideas on paper before, and there is a long way from idea across theboundaries of reality to an actual game.. An epic journey.
The idea sounds good and bla bla et cetera et cetera.. but honestly I'm tired of all this "Indie" and works in progress and hype that ends in nothing. Just call me when the game is ready and I'll try it. And if it is good I'll buy it. That's all. Best luck for your project.
So, it has a legacy system and a government system where people can give their friends a spawn area and lock out everyone else? Been there, done that. Warmth / cool system, seen it before. Freeze to death drinking lemonade to restore hp while wearing max warmth clothing. No thanks. But still, it all sounds good in theory.
The prospect of permanent death has always been at the cost of Role Playing, simply because the aspect of Time.
Some problems with regards to this:
If characters don't age at the same rate we do: Real life will get in the way, and people will age too fast to have a meaningful storyline. Sometimes to even get a single event done (or major point in a character or a group of characters) it could take weeks if not months. Numerous reasons for this: The fact that it's a group and everyone has to be on, good stories aren't rushed, everyone wants to play the game every now and then as opposed to sitting still and typing, etc.
In addition, it will lead way to differences in the age of characters, especially if two characters are supposed to have grown up together or are siblings. This is a huge immersion breaker if you log in one day, and find that your twin is an old man or your wife is three times your age.
How will this be fixed by players? They simply won't play their characters. Assuming that you only age if you're logged in, people will hold of on logging in until they all communicate on skype or whatever and then log in. People might even just RP outside of the game and in a chat system -- altogether just forgetting about the game as a whole.
If age is forwarded no matter if you are online or not, then still there are massive problems. Such as, when you get knocked out, you age. Which leads to the above problem again of not playing, and completely breaks immersion in several ways.
In addition, the prospect could also just be completely disregarded by people, or ruin an ongoing story. Someone of your group could die while not actually dying in the Role Play or the story you all have together. If there's an ongoing theme, or someone is secretly the bad guy, and they suddenly die, then what? It could be disregarded, people will start anew, but they likely won't be able to fight with their friends anymore as their character needs to be trained again (and even with a boost, it may take awhile). But there will, again, be the problem of the age difference after that happens (as I assume they will force your character to have grey hair after a time).
The narrative would have to be something incredibly special -- and unique for every character -- to provide a story of itself that people can jump into. Not the same story for everyone, as the main reason people have their own stories and characters / character history is because otherwise everyone would have the same past and story. If it's set up for you to make your own narrative, then all of the problems above come into play if you ever intend to associate with other people while being immersed or Role Playing.
I will just find it weird, personally, to be a baker and have someone who started at the same time with me -- be the same age one day -- suddenly come back the next and he's an old man with a long beard because he kept on getting killed (no matter how it happened). In fact, the first time I see this, I'd likely log out and find a RP friendly game. That or just say to myself the game isn't for RP and just play like it doesn't even matter -- I'll get a boost, anyway, if a character dies. Not too different from single player rogue games.
Due to frequent travel in my youth, English isn't something I consider my primary language (and thus I obtained quirky ways of writing). German and French were always easier for me despite my family being U.S. citizens for over a century. Spanish I learned as a requirement in school, Japanese and Korean I acquired for my youthful desire of anime and gaming (and also work now). I only debate in English to help me work with it (and limit things). In addition, I'm not smart enough to remain fluent in everything and typically need exposure to get in the groove of things again if I haven't heard it in a while. If you understand Mandarin, I know a little, but it has actually been a challenge and could use some help.
Also, I thoroughly enjoy debates and have accounts on over a dozen sites for this. If you wish to engage in such, please put effort in a post and provide sources -- I will then do the same with what I already wrote (if I didn't) as well as with my responses to your own. Expanding my information on a subject makes my stance either change or strengthen the next time I speak of it or write a thesis. Allow me to thank you sincerely for your time.
When I see some game play or be able to play the game in beta then I might be excited about it. Right now it is just a dream and may or may not come to pass.
Sounds good on paper but so has all the other young pretenders.. I'm still waiting for someone to actually deliver what they waved under my nose to get my attention.
I'll be sticking with EQ2 TLE for a long while yet..
The prospect of permanent death has always been at the cost of Role Playing, simply because the aspect of Time.
Some problems with regards to this:
If characters don't age at the same rate we do: Real life will get in the way, and people will age too fast to have a meaningful storyline. Sometimes to even get a single event done (or major point in a character or a group of characters) it could take weeks if not months. Numerous reasons for this: The fact that it's a group and everyone has to be on, good stories aren't rushed, everyone wants to play the game every now and then as opposed to sitting still and typing, etc.
In addition, it will lead way to differences in the age of characters, especially if two characters are supposed to have grown up together or are siblings. This is a huge immersion breaker if you log in one day, and find that your twin is an old man or your wife is three times your age.
How will this be fixed by players? They simply won't play their characters. Assuming that you only age if you're logged in, people will hold of on logging in until they all communicate on skype or whatever and then log in. People might even just RP outside of the game and in a chat system -- altogether just forgetting about the game as a whole.
If age is forwarded no matter if you are online or not, then still there are massive problems. Such as, when you get knocked out, you age. Which leads to the above problem again of not playing, and completely breaks immersion in several ways.
In addition, the prospect could also just be completely disregarded by people, or ruin an ongoing story. Someone of your group could die while not actually dying in the Role Play or the story you all have together. If there's an ongoing theme, or someone is secretly the bad guy, and they suddenly die, then what? It could be disregarded, people will start anew, but they likely won't be able to fight with their friends anymore as their character needs to be trained again (and even with a boost, it may take awhile). But there will, again, be the problem of the age difference after that happens (as I assume they will force your character to have grey hair after a time).
The narrative would have to be something incredibly special -- and unique for every character -- to provide a story of itself that people can jump into. Not the same story for everyone, as the main reason people have their own stories and characters / character history is because otherwise everyone would have the same past and story. If it's set up for you to make your own narrative, then all of the problems above come into play if you ever intend to associate with other people while being immersed or Role Playing.
I will just find it weird, personally, to be a baker and have someone who started at the same time with me -- be the same age one day -- suddenly come back the next and he's an old man with a long beard because he kept on getting killed (no matter how it happened). In fact, the first time I see this, I'd likely log out and find a RP friendly game. That or just say to myself the game isn't for RP and just play like it doesn't even matter -- I'll get a boost, anyway, if a character dies. Not too different from single player rogue games.
I will have to disagree, the game is very much for rp, just freeform non scripted rp. The only ones who will have an issue with this are scripted "Tell half the story before I've even done anything in the actual game itself" rpers. Which unfortunately are many. I'm a huge rper and if this game gets done I'll be more than happy to play it with the constraints that some can see. For me rping is acting so the rules of this world don't impact me one bit and if anything make me excited to play out the things that scripted rpers may not like.
Thank god I'm a freeform roleplayer who prefers the world to dictate my situation and not the other way around. Unfortunately scripted rpers tend to thrive better in themeparks where they can play in their own little uncontested unchanging world to their hearts content where they can ignore the world around them for the sake of their story.
"Oh the world is being attacked by demons in game right at this moment? That didn't happen -in MY story, so I'm not including it!!" - scripted rper
"The world is being attacked by demons! We have to do something about it!" - freeform rper
I don't see how a game that allows you to become a hero based on your -actions- is a bad thing. Better than sitting in a tavern talking about exploits your character never had which are just based on some forum story you created. Such is the stink of themepark roleplaying.
Scripted rpers play with the world
Freeform rpers play in it
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
This concept sounds truly amazing now to eagerly watch the execution...another round of waiting to see if hopes and dreams of a truly awesome game comes true.
Eyy, I reserve the right to judge once I see more. Cause while some of this sounds really fun, some of this also sounds like it'd be game breaking.
The weather affecting your character bit, which I assume also means you need to eat regularly, makes it sound like one of the survival games, or like one of the 300 mods I got for Skyrim. I'm just saying, its really not that new nor special. I also don't think its the greatest of ideas when linked with...
'Soft'-perma-death. People have been talking about doing this type of shtick, and have done, for years, but there's a reason it never gets off the ground all that well. People put so much time and effort into their characters, so seeing them dying is really not something they want to do. This whole 'rebirth' thing also sounds sketchy, I don't want to just inhabit my kids body after my character dies, unless I can also control every aspect of how my kid looks. The idea that you might get a buff for the profession your 'father' was in sounds great and all. Until you realize that that means that this buff will likely only last one life, which would be the way to go and also bad. By the way to go I mean you should get some kind of reward for spending all that effort, but if you went down a different profession and died then your next kid should only get a buff for their most recent profession so as to avoid people just getting uber with all the professions. But then that makes the problem that you then could shoehorn a player into a single path with each continuing character, as I know for a fact I wouldn't want to have to start over and over again on different things.
TLDR: I don't think perma death works, that being said I am looking forward to seeing how much of their 'vision' changes as they continue to develop the game.
You only have one life. Are you living it the way you should?
Comments
Great ideas, but it's all in the execution. Now to wait until the dev announces that the pre-alpha will be released in (late) 2022. With major delays. And $600 founder packs.
Sigh, another buzzword-laden article about a supposed 'crack team' of industry veterans attempting to 'save' a genre which really doesn't need saving. These things are becoming so frequent I should start keeping track of how often certain claims, words, and phrases appear.
Pretty much this, just with corporate buzzwords.
AN' DERE AIN'T NO SUCH FING AS ENUFF DAKKA, YA GROT! Enuff'z more than ya got an' less than too much an' there ain't no such fing as too much dakka. Say dere is, and me Squiggoff'z eatin' tonight!
We are born of the blood. Made men by the blood. Undone by the blood. Our eyes are yet to open. FEAR THE OLD BLOOD.
#IStandWithVic
You don't sound like that asinine word at all, I'm also looking forward to a PvE-oriented, open world, skill based sandbox and am willing to support it quite generously. There are some options out there right now, one specifically comes to mind, but it's not open world and another that's in the proverbial hopper but I don't believe it's skill based.
I wish CoE the best of luck and if for some reason they decide to have a separate server or options I'll gladly support it. They would have a leg up on the competition already out and coming out. There are a lot of open world PvP sandboxes circling the MMO-Sphere at the moment, they might want to get ahead of the pack.
They lost me after "The world must be dynamic" ... The first point was ok, the rest weird. I mean stating the obvious ?
Hype train aside, this will not work. Too many competing mechanics and too vague a world concept.
100 lives is nothing to a PVPer. That said...Nothing better to kill motivation than costing money upon failure, good luck getting people to take part in truly challenging content with this system.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I don't think they're revealing the entire world concept just yet. And I doubt that someone who spent years jotting down ideas and mechanic illustrations would only have the vague concept hinted in this article. I presume there's much more to hear about this game in the future, but they aren't handing out all their eggs at once so to speak.
Also the perma death/soul heritage thing that's mentioned isn't really competing with anything. It sounds like simply making a new character except that it's based on the family tree of your previous one and it merely obtains enhanced progressions for abilities you had with your previous character.
No word on whether the "destiny" aspect that was quoted is in fact to take place real world years after your character is made, or in game years. So it may not be competing, and in the case that it is real world years then they'd need one damn strong loyal player base, and probably for the "destiny" to be associated with the family heritage and not simply one character.
Current games;
Star treck online
Rift
Eve online
Firefall
A little voice inside my head keeps saying this to me too. I only wish the best for them, let's hope what's being written about here, and on their official website can be done justice to mechanically, for it sounds like CoE has real potential.
I have often thought how great it would be to have players create tasks for other players, the challenge is to create a system that works, and keeps working as the server matures - will be very interesting to see howrhat will turn out.
Anyways it all sound pretty good, but we seen just as great ideas on paper before, and there is a long way from idea across theboundaries of reality to an actual game.. An epic journey.
"I am my connectome" https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HA7GwKXfJB0
Kickstarter in 3...2...1...
The idea sounds good and bla bla et cetera et cetera.. but honestly I'm tired of all this "Indie" and works in progress and hype that ends in nothing. Just call me when the game is ready and I'll try it. And if it is good I'll buy it. That's all. Best luck for your project.
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
The prospect of permanent death has always been at the cost of Role Playing, simply because the aspect of Time.
Some problems with regards to this:
If characters don't age at the same rate we do: Real life will get in the way, and people will age too fast to have a meaningful storyline. Sometimes to even get a single event done (or major point in a character or a group of characters) it could take weeks if not months. Numerous reasons for this: The fact that it's a group and everyone has to be on, good stories aren't rushed, everyone wants to play the game every now and then as opposed to sitting still and typing, etc.
In addition, it will lead way to differences in the age of characters, especially if two characters are supposed to have grown up together or are siblings. This is a huge immersion breaker if you log in one day, and find that your twin is an old man or your wife is three times your age.
How will this be fixed by players? They simply won't play their characters. Assuming that you only age if you're logged in, people will hold of on logging in until they all communicate on skype or whatever and then log in. People might even just RP outside of the game and in a chat system -- altogether just forgetting about the game as a whole.
If age is forwarded no matter if you are online or not, then still there are massive problems. Such as, when you get knocked out, you age. Which leads to the above problem again of not playing, and completely breaks immersion in several ways.
In addition, the prospect could also just be completely disregarded by people, or ruin an ongoing story. Someone of your group could die while not actually dying in the Role Play or the story you all have together. If there's an ongoing theme, or someone is secretly the bad guy, and they suddenly die, then what? It could be disregarded, people will start anew, but they likely won't be able to fight with their friends anymore as their character needs to be trained again (and even with a boost, it may take awhile). But there will, again, be the problem of the age difference after that happens (as I assume they will force your character to have grey hair after a time).
The narrative would have to be something incredibly special -- and unique for every character -- to provide a story of itself that people can jump into. Not the same story for everyone, as the main reason people have their own stories and characters / character history is because otherwise everyone would have the same past and story. If it's set up for you to make your own narrative, then all of the problems above come into play if you ever intend to associate with other people while being immersed or Role Playing.
I will just find it weird, personally, to be a baker and have someone who started at the same time with me -- be the same age one day -- suddenly come back the next and he's an old man with a long beard because he kept on getting killed (no matter how it happened). In fact, the first time I see this, I'd likely log out and find a RP friendly game. That or just say to myself the game isn't for RP and just play like it doesn't even matter -- I'll get a boost, anyway, if a character dies. Not too different from single player rogue games.
+1 real talk.
When I see some game play or be able to play the game in beta then I might be excited about it. Right now it is just a dream and may or may not come to pass.
Please do not feed the hype train.
Sounds good on paper but so has all the other young pretenders.. I'm still waiting for someone to actually deliver what they waved under my nose to get my attention.
I'll be sticking with EQ2 TLE for a long while yet..
I will have to disagree, the game is very much for rp, just freeform non scripted rp. The only ones who will have an issue with this are scripted "Tell half the story before I've even done anything in the actual game itself" rpers. Which unfortunately are many. I'm a huge rper and if this game gets done I'll be more than happy to play it with the constraints that some can see. For me rping is acting so the rules of this world don't impact me one bit and if anything make me excited to play out the things that scripted rpers may not like.
Thank god I'm a freeform roleplayer who prefers the world to dictate my situation and not the other way around. Unfortunately scripted rpers tend to thrive better in themeparks where they can play in their own little uncontested unchanging world to their hearts content where they can ignore the world around them for the sake of their story.
"Oh the world is being attacked by demons in game right at this moment? That didn't happen -in MY story, so I'm not including it!!" - scripted rper
"The world is being attacked by demons! We have to do something about it!" - freeform rper
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
Eyy, I reserve the right to judge once I see more. Cause while some of this sounds really fun, some of this also sounds like it'd be game breaking.
The weather affecting your character bit, which I assume also means you need to eat regularly, makes it sound like one of the survival games, or like one of the 300 mods I got for Skyrim. I'm just saying, its really not that new nor special. I also don't think its the greatest of ideas when linked with...
'Soft'-perma-death. People have been talking about doing this type of shtick, and have done, for years, but there's a reason it never gets off the ground all that well. People put so much time and effort into their characters, so seeing them dying is really not something they want to do. This whole 'rebirth' thing also sounds sketchy, I don't want to just inhabit my kids body after my character dies, unless I can also control every aspect of how my kid looks. The idea that you might get a buff for the profession your 'father' was in sounds great and all. Until you realize that that means that this buff will likely only last one life, which would be the way to go and also bad. By the way to go I mean you should get some kind of reward for spending all that effort, but if you went down a different profession and died then your next kid should only get a buff for their most recent profession so as to avoid people just getting uber with all the professions. But then that makes the problem that you then could shoehorn a player into a single path with each continuing character, as I know for a fact I wouldn't want to have to start over and over again on different things.
TLDR: I don't think perma death works, that being said I am looking forward to seeing how much of their 'vision' changes as they continue to develop the game.
You only have one life. Are you living it the way you should?
Lol, so I'm not the only he thinks the gullible are being fatting up by mmorpg.com to start getting they're cash out.