thats because this genre is dead and stale. The last game I played serious in a mmorpg was ESO and quit when they announced free to play with no content for months. I tried playing GW2 wildstar and even old EQ2 after dabbling and I just couldnt bring myself to chasing another boring quest Ive seen in all games 100 times over. I cant even call it burnout in this genre any longer. To me its been there done that 100 times over and over again. The only fun I find anymore in anything multiplayer is survival games like Ark and 7 Days to Die. At least you actually have creative freedom in both and do not have to follow a boring story arc that is a copy and past of the last game. WOW is dying because people are bored to death of this genre. Last time I played wow people logged into raid a couple of times a week or socialize and you wouldnt see them for 3 or 4 days again. Its been going on like that everytime I went back to wow. Games like this grow stale when they are void of not being able to come up with anything new to offer.
Subjective
Since you say its subjective - which MMOs received 5m players that dont play WoW?
I said it couple of years ago - MMO genre is losing players because MMOs are super stale, and any deviation from that (GW2) is met by uprising that "its not true MMO" (true MMO being, ofcourse, clone of vanilly EQ/WoW) by self proclaimed "MMOers"
the market is still growing, players are just spread over more games now
how many new mmos have they opened ? how many shut down?
in the old days, you had maybe 20 to chose from
now there are hundreds, some of them bigger, than the old school games
just because your favorite band isnt in the top 10 list anymore, doesnt mean that the music business is dead
Of course, if you flag ANY online game as MMO, MMOs are growing.
If you stick to actual definition, they are declining hard for quite a while now, and no, 6+ million didnt go and play some F2P MMO, online game - probably, MMO no.
And how many of those missing customers are not in WoW because they are playing other Blizzard games?
You mean from those that left WoW? I suppose some went to Diablo 3, though if I had to guess most of them are now either in ESO, FFXIV or GW2 and SWTOR.
It's not like WoW is the only Blizzard's game to be doing worse than ever.
1. HotS while a damn fine super-casual Moba, has been on a steady decline, as they obviously can't compete with Smite, Dota, LoL and probably a bunch of others.
2. Heartstone, another pretty casual game which has seen a huge sucess. However HS was never anything innovative or "new" in this "card games genre". As the game is leaning very much towards P2W, and it's another Blizzard design where luck > skill + huge balance issues, it's not a big wonder that HS has lost the majority of it's players, though it remains pretty active as F2P games go. Anyways Heartstone brought "only" ~$17 million in revenue in May 2015 (New low), which is very low by Blizzard's standards.
3. Starcraft is pretty much dead at this point. I wonder how well the new expansion will do next month, though I'm quite skeptical about it. I'd say too little too late. Besides Fallout 4 releases next month, so that's where most of the gamers will spend their time till the end of this year at least.
4. Overwatch. That game has a failure writen all over it. It's probably Blizzard's last attempt at E-sports.
5. Diablo 3. Doing better than ever, though the last expansion came 1.5 years ago and the game got stale for the most of the players. If they don't want to follow the rest of Blizzard's games going downwards, they really need to get the new expansion out very soon.
I think Blizzard can milk WoW for next 5-10 easily. F2P transition for current players would expand WoW's life by who knows how many years and provide steady income. B2P progression server for "old WoW players" like myself would probably give them huge one-time cash injection etc. There are ways, it's just strange that Blizzard is holding so firmly to this P2P+cash shop business model, since it's obvious that P2P part of the model is holding them back (together with low quality expansions).
I think Blizzard can milk WoW for next 5-10 easily. F2P transition for current players would expand WoW's life by who knows how many years and provide steady income. B2P progression server for "old WoW players" like myself would probably give them huge one-time cash injection etc. There are ways, it's just strange that Blizzard is holding so firmly to this P2P+cash shop business model, since it's obvious that P2P part of the model is holding them back (together with low quality expansions).
As long as they rake in amounts they rake in with minimal effort they wont particualrly care.
if anyone is still deluded that Blizzard invests much in WoW over last 5-ishyears...well, bridges to sell and all that.
They would be quite happy with what WoW brought in over the years if ti shut down tomorrow.
5 million subs at $15 USD a pop is still 75 million per month before figuring in cash shop pets and game service sales like name changes.
People over in the Star Citizen forums are jumping around and throwing confetti because their unfinished crowdfunded project has raised nearly 100 million. Blizzard makes that six or seven times a year... from one game. I'm pretty sure that if and when they want to revitalize the game, then they'll be able to.
The other consideration is that maybe they're working on other projects or moving into new areas. Hearthstone, for instance, has been fantastically profitable and popular for a fraction of the development resources that it takes to put out a WoW expansion.
They may simply put WoW on life support and move onto other projects like all the other AAA publishers have done. Blizzard is not a stupid company. They've been able to read changes in the gaming landscape before. There's a good reason that WoW wasn't Warcraft 4... they realized quickly that MMO's were going to dominate the market before they did and they got ahead of the curve by capitalizing on their popular Warcraft series.
the market is still growing, players are just spread over more games now
how many new mmos have they opened ? how many shut down?
in the old days, you had maybe 20 to chose from
now there are hundreds, some of them bigger, than the old school games
just because your favorite band isnt in the top 10 list anymore, doesnt mean that the music business is dead
The fact remains; there aren't any GOOD mmo's being launched.
Most are F2P ingame cash shop milking machines, WoW is turning into one as they are bleeding subs. Many MMO players demand a fast gratification model.
How many MMO's are out there that are 'world simulators' where you have to explore without being told exactly where to go, where it is dangerous 'out there' and that needs actual skill to survive. Where people are playing that game for the adventure, not to feed their " I need to get to max level fast so I can enjoy endgame raiding" addiction. Where they reach end level and burn out+leave.
I happen to be in a non level, non raid sandbox MMO that was growing for over 12 years -not WoW- but due to player age and player retention that sub base has been going down steadily. Also there is not much need for keeping alt accounts subbed so that contributes too. This is normal in the lifecycle of a MMO.
As they need new players to replace the old ones it became apparent that the newer players can hardly cope with a exploration game and demand insta-gratification before their trial expires otherwise they will leave again. So I see some content being 'simplified' to accomodate those players, to keep those aboard.
Imo, great that so many moneygrab MMO's die out there, only the real good games should survive, and if the self entitled insta gratification community leaves because of lack of choice, the better. MMO's were rare a lot of fun in the days before the ' WoW boom', if those days come back, yes please.
and i want to be young again, and experience my first love a second time
water under the bridge , buddy..just keep those precious memories, cause they wont be coming back
wow did to mmos, what cans did for food
if you want the old ways back, better get your buddies together for some old school pen&paper RPG
the industry isnt the answer to this problem, they go for the big numbers
"Down to 5.6 million"
I like how that is said like it is a bad thing that a 13 year old game with a sub still out-pops almost every mmo on the market.
I'm sure Blizzard are weeping all the way to the bank.
thats because this genre is dead and stale. The last game I played serious in a mmorpg was ESO and quit when they announced free to play with no content for months. I tried playing GW2 wildstar and even old EQ2 after dabbling and I just couldnt bring myself to chasing another boring quest Ive seen in all games 100 times over. I cant even call it burnout in this genre any longer. To me its been there done that 100 times over and over again. The only fun I find anymore in anything multiplayer is survival games like Ark and 7 Days to Die. At least you actually have creative freedom in both and do not have to follow a boring story arc that is a copy and past of the last game. WOW is dying because people are bored to death of this genre. Last time I played wow people logged into raid a couple of times a week or socialize and you wouldnt see them for 3 or 4 days again. Its been going on like that everytime I went back to wow. Games like this grow stale when they are void of not being able to come up with anything new to offer.
Subjective
Since you say its subjective - which MMOs received 5m players that dont play WoW?
I said it couple of years ago - MMO genre is losing players because MMOs are super stale, and any deviation from that (GW2) is met by uprising that "its not true MMO" (true MMO being, ofcourse, clone of vanilly EQ/WoW) by self proclaimed "MMOers"
the market is still growing, players are just spread over more games now
how many new mmos have they opened ? how many shut down?
in the old days, you had maybe 20 to chose from
now there are hundreds, some of them bigger, than the old school games
just because your favorite band isnt in the top 10 list anymore, doesnt mean that the music business is dead
Of course, if you flag ANY online game as MMO, MMOs are growing.
If you stick to actual definition, they are declining hard for quite a while now, and no, 6+ million didnt go and play some F2P MMO, online game - probably, MMO no.
Haha must be a great life to just pull out information from your a$$ try to turn it into a fact and tell people to disprove your made up fact.
So what are you going to say when WoW hits 10 million with legion? Will the genre be growing since 6 million people came back?
Each Game like Ffxiv, Swtor, ESO have more players then all your old school MMORPGS combined ever did.
The fact that games like ESO, Ffxiv, Swtor, STO, Rift, LOTRO continue to push out content and xpacs proves your made up information as false.
There are more quality video games in general out today then ever before. The fact that mmos are still pumping out contents, still pumping out massive revenues, still attracting new players just fuels the desperate bitter vets doom and gloom machine more and more.
thats because this genre is dead and stale. The last game I played serious in a mmorpg was ESO and quit when they announced free to play with no content for months. I tried playing GW2 wildstar and even old EQ2 after dabbling and I just couldnt bring myself to chasing another boring quest Ive seen in all games 100 times over. I cant even call it burnout in this genre any longer. To me its been there done that 100 times over and over again. The only fun I find anymore in anything multiplayer is survival games like Ark and 7 Days to Die. At least you actually have creative freedom in both and do not have to follow a boring story arc that is a copy and past of the last game. WOW is dying because people are bored to death of this genre. Last time I played wow people logged into raid a couple of times a week or socialize and you wouldnt see them for 3 or 4 days again. Its been going on like that everytime I went back to wow. Games like this grow stale when they are void of not being able to come up with anything new to offer.
Subjective
Since you say its subjective - which MMOs received 5m players that dont play WoW?
I said it couple of years ago - MMO genre is losing players because MMOs are super stale, and any deviation from that (GW2) is met by uprising that "its not true MMO" (true MMO being, ofcourse, clone of vanilly EQ/WoW) by self proclaimed "MMOers"
the market is still growing, players are just spread over more games now
how many new mmos have they opened ? how many shut down?
in the old days, you had maybe 20 to chose from
now there are hundreds, some of them bigger, than the old school games
just because your favorite band isnt in the top 10 list anymore, doesnt mean that the music business is dead
Of course, if you flag ANY online game as MMO, MMOs are growing.
If you stick to actual definition, they are declining hard for quite a while now, and no, 6+ million didnt go and play some F2P MMO, online game - probably, MMO no.
Haha must be a great life to just pull out information from your a$$ try to turn it into a fact and tell people to disprove your made up fact.
So what are you going to say when WoW hits 10 million with legion? Will the genre be growing since 6 million people came back?
Each Game like Ffxiv, Swtor, ESO have more players then all your old school MMORPGS combined ever did.
The fact that games like ESO, Ffxiv, Swtor, STO, Rift, LOTRO continue to push out content and xpacs proves your made up information as false.
There are more quality video games in general out today then ever before. The fact that mmos are still pumping out contents, still pumping out massive revenues, still attracting new players just fuels the desperate bitter vets doom and gloom machine more and more.
You realize WoW probably has almost as many players as all of those games combined right?
thats because this genre is dead and stale. The last game I played serious in a mmorpg was ESO and quit when they announced free to play with no content for months. I tried playing GW2 wildstar and even old EQ2 after dabbling and I just couldnt bring myself to chasing another boring quest Ive seen in all games 100 times over. I cant even call it burnout in this genre any longer. To me its been there done that 100 times over and over again. The only fun I find anymore in anything multiplayer is survival games like Ark and 7 Days to Die. At least you actually have creative freedom in both and do not have to follow a boring story arc that is a copy and past of the last game. WOW is dying because people are bored to death of this genre. Last time I played wow people logged into raid a couple of times a week or socialize and you wouldnt see them for 3 or 4 days again. Its been going on like that everytime I went back to wow. Games like this grow stale when they are void of not being able to come up with anything new to offer.
Subjective
Since you say its subjective - which MMOs received 5m players that dont play WoW?
I said it couple of years ago - MMO genre is losing players because MMOs are super stale, and any deviation from that (GW2) is met by uprising that "its not true MMO" (true MMO being, ofcourse, clone of vanilly EQ/WoW) by self proclaimed "MMOers"
the market is still growing, players are just spread over more games now
how many new mmos have they opened ? how many shut down?
in the old days, you had maybe 20 to chose from
now there are hundreds, some of them bigger, than the old school games
just because your favorite band isnt in the top 10 list anymore, doesnt mean that the music business is dead
Of course, if you flag ANY online game as MMO, MMOs are growing.
If you stick to actual definition, they are declining hard for quite a while now, and no, 6+ million didnt go and play some F2P MMO, online game - probably, MMO no.
Haha must be a great life to just pull out information from your a$$ try to turn it into a fact and tell people to disprove your made up fact.
So what are you going to say when WoW hits 10 million with legion? Will the genre be growing since 6 million people came back?
Each Game like Ffxiv, Swtor, ESO have more players then all your old school MMORPGS combined ever did.
The fact that games like ESO, Ffxiv, Swtor, STO, Rift, LOTRO continue to push out content and xpacs proves your made up information as false.
There are more quality video games in general out today then ever before. The fact that mmos are still pumping out contents, still pumping out massive revenues, still attracting new players just fuels the desperate bitter vets doom and gloom machine more and more.
You realize WoW probably has almost as many players as all of those games combined right?
I do that's why I didn't mention it. The "other" games alone show continued success in the mmorpg market. If this weren't the case we wouldn't have new xpacs every year, new content rolling out on a consistent basis.
If you take WoW out of the equation and compare the following with MMORPGS of today and MMORPGS of 2005. Today wins hands down.
thats because this genre is dead and stale. The last game I played serious in a mmorpg was ESO and quit when they announced free to play with no content for months. I tried playing GW2 wildstar and even old EQ2 after dabbling and I just couldnt bring myself to chasing another boring quest Ive seen in all games 100 times over. I cant even call it burnout in this genre any longer. To me its been there done that 100 times over and over again. The only fun I find anymore in anything multiplayer is survival games like Ark and 7 Days to Die. At least you actually have creative freedom in both and do not have to follow a boring story arc that is a copy and past of the last game. WOW is dying because people are bored to death of this genre. Last time I played wow people logged into raid a couple of times a week or socialize and you wouldnt see them for 3 or 4 days again. Its been going on like that everytime I went back to wow. Games like this grow stale when they are void of not being able to come up with anything new to offer.
Subjective
Since you say its subjective - which MMOs received 5m players that dont play WoW?
I said it couple of years ago - MMO genre is losing players because MMOs are super stale, and any deviation from that (GW2) is met by uprising that "its not true MMO" (true MMO being, ofcourse, clone of vanilly EQ/WoW) by self proclaimed "MMOers"
the market is still growing, players are just spread over more games now
how many new mmos have they opened ? how many shut down?
in the old days, you had maybe 20 to chose from
now there are hundreds, some of them bigger, than the old school games
just because your favorite band isnt in the top 10 list anymore, doesnt mean that the music business is dead
Of course, if you flag ANY online game as MMO, MMOs are growing.
If you stick to actual definition, they are declining hard for quite a while now, and no, 6+ million didnt go and play some F2P MMO, online game - probably, MMO no.
Haha must be a great life to just pull out information from your a$$ try to turn it into a fact and tell people to disprove your made up fact.
So what are you going to say when WoW hits 10 million with legion? Will the genre be growing since 6 million people came back?
Each Game like Ffxiv, Swtor, ESO have more players then all your old school MMORPGS combined ever did.
The fact that games like ESO, Ffxiv, Swtor, STO, Rift, LOTRO continue to push out content and xpacs proves your made up information as false.
There are more quality video games in general out today then ever before. The fact that mmos are still pumping out contents, still pumping out massive revenues, still attracting new players just fuels the desperate bitter vets doom and gloom machine more and more.
You realize WoW probably has almost as many players as all of those games combined right?
I do that's why I didn't mention it. The "other" games alone show continued success in the mmorpg market. If this weren't the case we wouldn't have new xpacs every year, new content rolling out on a consistent basis.
If you take WoW out of the equation and compare the following with MMORPGS of today and MMORPGS of 2005. Today wins hands down.
Player base? Today
Revenue ? Today
Competition ? Today
ROFL
Even if you take out WoW out of equalsion ALL of those games had more players at release than ever after in their lifetime. what the "others" games show is constant decline, just like WoW now. Even EvE. It just took those 2 a little longer to reach decline status.
And math is not your strong side, 2015-5=2005? primary school first grade.
EVEN if you go back to 2005 Lineage 1 and Lineage 2 had more than all those games today combined. And even those 2 dropped DRASTICALLY since then. I bet you dont have a clue that those games are no.2 and no.3 in history.
Time to face the facts, even hyped up media cannot and dont ignore facts any more.
Unfortunately it seems that eveythig in the industry is 4-5 years behind on current situation and need super long time to catch up on any development. And thats one of the reasons this genre is in steep decline.
Blizzard isnt company that will stick its head in the sand and pretend everything is rainbows and unicorns. They know VERY well whats going on and thats why they cancelled their MMO (losing awesome amount of money on that) and invest VERY little in WoW and proceeded to make TCG and moba that made up for it 10 fold.
thats because this genre is dead and stale. The last game I played serious in a mmorpg was ESO and quit when they announced free to play with no content for months. I tried playing GW2 wildstar and even old EQ2 after dabbling and I just couldnt bring myself to chasing another boring quest Ive seen in all games 100 times over. I cant even call it burnout in this genre any longer. To me its been there done that 100 times over and over again. The only fun I find anymore in anything multiplayer is survival games like Ark and 7 Days to Die. At least you actually have creative freedom in both and do not have to follow a boring story arc that is a copy and past of the last game. WOW is dying because people are bored to death of this genre. Last time I played wow people logged into raid a couple of times a week or socialize and you wouldnt see them for 3 or 4 days again. Its been going on like that everytime I went back to wow. Games like this grow stale when they are void of not being able to come up with anything new to offer.
Subjective
Since you say its subjective - which MMOs received 5m players that dont play WoW?
I said it couple of years ago - MMO genre is losing players because MMOs are super stale, and any deviation from that (GW2) is met by uprising that "its not true MMO" (true MMO being, ofcourse, clone of vanilly EQ/WoW) by self proclaimed "MMOers"
the market is still growing, players are just spread over more games now
how many new mmos have they opened ? how many shut down?
in the old days, you had maybe 20 to chose from
now there are hundreds, some of them bigger, than the old school games
just because your favorite band isnt in the top 10 list anymore, doesnt mean that the music business is dead
Of course, if you flag ANY online game as MMO, MMOs are growing.
If you stick to actual definition, they are declining hard for quite a while now, and no, 6+ million didnt go and play some F2P MMO, online game - probably, MMO no.
Haha must be a great life to just pull out information from your a$$ try to turn it into a fact and tell people to disprove your made up fact.
So what are you going to say when WoW hits 10 million with legion? Will the genre be growing since 6 million people came back?
Each Game like Ffxiv, Swtor, ESO have more players then all your old school MMORPGS combined ever did.
The fact that games like ESO, Ffxiv, Swtor, STO, Rift, LOTRO continue to push out content and xpacs proves your made up information as false.
There are more quality video games in general out today then ever before. The fact that mmos are still pumping out contents, still pumping out massive revenues, still attracting new players just fuels the desperate bitter vets doom and gloom machine more and more.
You realize WoW probably has almost as many players as all of those games combined right?
I do that's why I didn't mention it. The "other" games alone show continued success in the mmorpg market. If this weren't the case we wouldn't have new xpacs every year, new content rolling out on a consistent basis.
If you take WoW out of the equation and compare the following with MMORPGS of today and MMORPGS of 2005. Today wins hands down.
Player base? Today
Revenue ? Today
Competition ? Today
ROFL
Even if you take out WoW out of equalsion ALL of those games had more players at release than ever after in their lifetime. what the "others" games show is constant decline, just like WoW now. Even EvE. It just took those 2 a little longer to reach decline status.
And math is not your strong side, 2015-5=2005? primary school first grade.
EVEN if you go back to 2005 Lineage 1 and Lineage 2 had more than all those games today combined. And even those 2 dropped DRASTICALLY since then. I bet you dont have a clue that those games are no.2 and no.3 in history.
Time to face the facts, even hyped up media cannot and dont ignore facts any more.
Unfortunately it seems that eveythig in the industry is 4-5 years behind on current situation and need super long time to catch up on any development. And thats one of the reasons this genre is in steep decline.
Blizzard isnt company that will stick its head in the sand and pretend everything is rainbows and unicorns. They cancelled their MMO (losing awesome amount of money on that) and proceeded to make TCG and moba that made up for it 10 fold.
Facts? In 15 years lineage made around $1.5 billion. Let's do some math shall we?
1,500,000,000 / 15 =100,000,000
Swtor alone surpasses that every year. I bet you didn't have a clue on that.
Sure you can have your korean fantasy. But when I talk about old school games it's EQ, SWG you know the games the old vets on this site played.
Its time to face the facts the genre has never been better. No matter how much doom and gloom and QQing the old bitter vets do the facts will remain what they are.
And reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Never said 2015-5=2005. Try slowing down and not getting so emotional.
If you take WoW out of the equation and compare the following with MMORPGS of today and MMORPGS of 2005. Today wins hands down.
Player base? Today
Revenue ? Today
Competition ? Today
For themeparks with 1000 player/server limit: yes.
For sandbox games: no.
I love being in a sandbox where the players control the landscape and we have pvp battles from 10 vs 10 to 1000 vs 3000.
I really do hope someday you guys get your sandbox. I don't think you ever will as in my honest opinion there isn't that big of a player base asking for it anymore.
I really do hope someday you guys get your sandbox. I don't think you ever will as in my honest opinion there isn't that big of a player base asking for it anymore.
Not even here, when this site was once the unofficial internet home of SWG glory dayz of yore pining and Sandbox=Win cheer leading.
On the other hand, just you have to look and Minecraft and think "There's a definite appeal to someone. Just look at allllllll those someones and their dollars."
I suspect someone's (you, MMO developers) just not finding the right ways to monetize the potential.
Or (perhaps) the best format for sandbox isn't MMO.
Even if you take out WoW out of equalsion ALL of those games had more players at release than ever after in their lifetime. what the "others" games show is constant decline, just like WoW now. Even EvE. It just took those 2 a little longer to reach decline status.
And math is not your strong side, 2015-5=2005? primary school first grade.
EVEN if you go back to 2005 Lineage 1 and Lineage 2 had more than all those games today combined. And even those 2 dropped DRASTICALLY since then. I bet you dont have a clue that those games are no.2 and no.3 in history.
Time to face the facts, even hyped up media cannot and dont ignore facts any more.
Unfortunately it seems that eveythig in the industry is 4-5 years behind on current situation and need super long time to catch up on any development. And thats one of the reasons this genre is in steep decline.
Blizzard isnt company that will stick its head in the sand and pretend everything is rainbows and unicorns. They cancelled their MMO (losing awesome amount of money on that) and proceeded to make TCG and moba that made up for it 10 fold.
Facts? In 15 years lineage made around $1.5 billion. Let's do some math shall we?
1,500,000,000 / 15 =100,000,000
Swtor alone surpasses that every year. I bet you didn't have a clue on that.
Sure you can have your korean fantasy. But when I talk about old school games it's EQ, SWG you know the games the old vets on this site played.
Its time to face the facts the genre has never been better. No matter how much doom and gloom and QQing the old bitter vets do the facts will remain what they are.
And reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Never said 2015-5=2005. Try slowing down and not getting so emotional.
Facts? L1 alone made over 1,8 billion in 15 years.
SWTOR surpasses that only in your dreams. Once EA discloses how much SWTOR mades you can come back and report.
I dont give a rats ass about "old school" and selective cherry picking of facts to present skewed reality, or what you "ment".
FACT is EVERY MMO since WoW DECLINED in population since their respective launch, and WoW drops down more and more with each xpack.
Unfortunately reality and facts arent your strong points. Along with math.
FACT: Blizzard cancelled their MMO and does minimal investment on WoW and made TCG and moba instead which make as much monies as WoW
FACT: no AAA MMOs in production
FACT: other genres are still growing and pulling more and more players and money each year, while MMOs decline each year
FACT: random internet numbrz you present as "facts" are laughable
I have no idea why people think this is a good thing. Do folks honestly think this is good for the MMO industry? Regardless of it's faults, WoW is still the best all around game out right now. We've been watching the so called "WoW killers" crash and burn for years now. Do people honestly think Blizzard will let this die without a fight???
My prediction is it will go F2P if the movie doesn't renew interest in the game, and if it can be ported over to console, they will put it on there since Destiny and ESO are doing so well there.
Even if you take out WoW out of equalsion ALL of those games had more players at release than ever after in their lifetime. what the "others" games show is constant decline, just like WoW now. Even EvE. It just took those 2 a little longer to reach decline status.
And math is not your strong side, 2015-5=2005? primary school first grade.
EVEN if you go back to 2005 Lineage 1 and Lineage 2 had more than all those games today combined. And even those 2 dropped DRASTICALLY since then. I bet you dont have a clue that those games are no.2 and no.3 in history.
Time to face the facts, even hyped up media cannot and dont ignore facts any more.
Unfortunately it seems that eveythig in the industry is 4-5 years behind on current situation and need super long time to catch up on any development. And thats one of the reasons this genre is in steep decline.
Blizzard isnt company that will stick its head in the sand and pretend everything is rainbows and unicorns. They cancelled their MMO (losing awesome amount of money on that) and proceeded to make TCG and moba that made up for it 10 fold.
Facts? In 15 years lineage made around $1.5 billion. Let's do some math shall we?
1,500,000,000 / 15 =100,000,000
Swtor alone surpasses that every year. I bet you didn't have a clue on that.
Sure you can have your korean fantasy. But when I talk about old school games it's EQ, SWG you know the games the old vets on this site played.
Its time to face the facts the genre has never been better. No matter how much doom and gloom and QQing the old bitter vets do the facts will remain what they are.
And reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Never said 2015-5=2005. Try slowing down and not getting so emotional.
Facts? L1 alone made over 1,8 billion in 15 years.
SWTOR surpasses that only in your dreams. Once EA discloses how much SWTOR mades you can come back and report.
I dont give a rats ass about "old school" and selective cherry picking of facts to present skewed reality, or what you "ment".
FACT is EVERY MMO since WoW DECLINED in population since their respective launch, and WoW drops down more and more with each xpack.
Unfortunately reality and facts arent your strong points. Along with math.
FACT: Blizzard cancelled their MMO and does minimal investment on WoW and made TCG and moba instead which make as much monies as WoW
FACT: no AAA MMOs in production
FACT: other genres are still growing and pulling more and more players and money each year, while MMOs decline each year
FACT: random internet numbrz you present as "facts" are laughable
[mod edit] I said Lineage=L1 made 1.5 billion oh sorry off by a few million. So on average that's 120,000,000. So in 2013 Swtor did 165,000,000 in revenue.
Again nobody here talks about l1 or l2 I was referring to the games people talk about here like EQ and Swg. Now if you want to talk l1 or l2 I'm sure there are some Korean sites [mod edit]
So again based on what I was talking about my facts hold up...[mod edit]
I have no idea why people think this is a good thing. Do folks honestly think this is good for the MMO industry? Regardless of it's faults, WoW is still the best all around game out right now. We've been watching the so called "WoW killers" crash and burn for years now. Do people honestly think Blizzard will let this die without a fight???
My prediction is it will go F2P if the movie doesn't renew interest in the game, and if it can be ported over to console, they will put it on there since Destiny and ESO are doing so well there.
I think Blizzard have decided, if silently, that World of Warcraft is lumbering towards obscurity.
They're not going to waste money trying to prop it up any more. If you haven't noticed they've gone to great lengths to divest themselves of the reliance on WoW to meet their targets. They've had more success in, and now earn more money from, smaller titles such as Hearthstone and Heroes of the Storm. Overwatch will certainly add to this wide portfolio.
Added to this is the fact that their internal projections now assume moderate to weak performance from World of Warcraft, and that's what they'll be working to when they allocate development resources. They've moved large chunks of the WoW team to the Diablo, Starcraft, Overwatch, Hearthstone and Heroes of the Storm teams, and have moved very little back. The majority of the new hires are focused on their other titles, not World of Warcraft.
It should be clear at this point that, when it comes to World of Warcraft, Blizzard are looking to take the path of least resistance coupled with a controlled downward trend that allows them to bridge the earnings gap it will leave comfortably and over time. Peace-meal solutions, such as a total shift to F2P, will likely come at some point but they most certainly won't be pitched towards "saving" or "relaunching" World of Warcraft to new heights of success. Instead, they'll be moves designed to mitigate and control the decline of the product, and each time they'll likely bring a new product to the table to replace the losses from WoW.
World of Warcraft is no longer the golden boy at Blizzard, and it hasn't been for a very, very long time. It's more akin to an aging donkey that gets a new saddle every year.
Needs to go BTP. It'll be waaaay on top again if it does. Blizzard are just being a bit stubborn.. BTP/FTP makes almost EVERY MMO more profitable and more populated. WoW would go through the roof.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Comments
If you stick to actual definition, they are declining hard for quite a while now, and no, 6+ million didnt go and play some F2P MMO, online game - probably, MMO no.
It's not like WoW is the only Blizzard's game to be doing worse than ever.
1. HotS while a damn fine super-casual Moba, has been on a steady decline, as they obviously can't compete with Smite, Dota, LoL and probably a bunch of others.
2. Heartstone, another pretty casual game which has seen a huge sucess. However HS was never anything innovative or "new" in this "card games genre". As the game is leaning very much towards P2W, and it's another Blizzard design where luck > skill + huge balance issues, it's not a big wonder that HS has lost the majority of it's players, though it remains pretty active as F2P games go. Anyways Heartstone brought "only" ~$17 million in revenue in May 2015 (New low), which is very low by Blizzard's standards.
3. Starcraft is pretty much dead at this point. I wonder how well the new expansion will do next month, though I'm quite skeptical about it. I'd say too little too late. Besides Fallout 4 releases next month, so that's where most of the gamers will spend their time till the end of this year at least.
4. Overwatch. That game has a failure writen all over it. It's probably Blizzard's last attempt at E-sports.
5. Diablo 3. Doing better than ever, though the last expansion came 1.5 years ago and the game got stale for the most of the players. If they don't want to follow the rest of Blizzard's games going downwards, they really need to get the new expansion out very soon.
F2P transition for current players would expand WoW's life by who knows how many years and provide steady income.
B2P progression server for "old WoW players" like myself would probably give them huge one-time cash injection etc.
There are ways, it's just strange that Blizzard is holding so firmly to this P2P+cash shop business model, since it's obvious that P2P part of the model is holding them back (together with low quality expansions).
This post is all my opinion, but I welcome debate on anything i have put, however, personal slander / name calling belongs in game
where of course you're welcome to call me names im often found lounging about in EvE online.
Use this code for 21days trial in eve online https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=d385aff2-794a-44a4-96f1-3967ccf6d720&action=buddy
if anyone is still deluded that Blizzard invests much in WoW over last 5-ishyears...well, bridges to sell and all that.
They would be quite happy with what WoW brought in over the years if ti shut down tomorrow.
Crazkanuk
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Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
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Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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5 million subs at $15 USD a pop is still 75 million per month before figuring in cash shop pets and game service sales like name changes.
People over in the Star Citizen forums are jumping around and throwing confetti because their unfinished crowdfunded project has raised nearly 100 million. Blizzard makes that six or seven times a year... from one game. I'm pretty sure that if and when they want to revitalize the game, then they'll be able to.
The other consideration is that maybe they're working on other projects or moving into new areas. Hearthstone, for instance, has been fantastically profitable and popular for a fraction of the development resources that it takes to put out a WoW expansion.
They may simply put WoW on life support and move onto other projects like all the other AAA publishers have done. Blizzard is not a stupid company. They've been able to read changes in the gaming landscape before. There's a good reason that WoW wasn't Warcraft 4... they realized quickly that MMO's were going to dominate the market before they did and they got ahead of the curve by capitalizing on their popular Warcraft series.
I wouldnt be too surprised if its still around in 20 or even 30 years, actually.
Doesnt SOE still run EQ ?
Isnt UO still around ?
So yeah, why would WoW not continue as well ?
and i want to be young again, and experience my first love a second time
water under the bridge , buddy..just keep those precious memories, cause they wont be coming back
wow did to mmos, what cans did for food
if you want the old ways back, better get your buddies together for some old school pen&paper RPG
the industry isnt the answer to this problem, they go for the big numbers
So what are you going to say when WoW hits 10 million with legion? Will the genre be growing since 6 million people came back?
Each Game like Ffxiv, Swtor, ESO have more players then all your old school MMORPGS combined ever did.
The fact that games like ESO, Ffxiv, Swtor, STO, Rift, LOTRO continue to push out content and xpacs proves your made up information as false.
There are more quality video games in general out today then ever before. The fact that mmos are still pumping out contents, still pumping out massive revenues, still attracting new players just fuels the desperate bitter vets doom and gloom machine more and more.
No surprise.
Be the Ultimate Ninja! Play Billy Vs. SNAKEMAN today!
If you take WoW out of the equation and compare the following with MMORPGS of today and MMORPGS of 2005. Today wins hands down.
Player base? Today
Revenue ? Today
Competition ? Today
For sandbox games: no.
I love being in a sandbox where the players control the landscape and we have pvp battles from 10 vs 10 to 1000 vs 3000.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Even if you take out WoW out of equalsion ALL of those games had more players at release than ever after in their lifetime. what the "others" games show is constant decline, just like WoW now. Even EvE. It just took those 2 a little longer to reach decline status.
And math is not your strong side, 2015-5=2005? primary school first grade.
EVEN if you go back to 2005 Lineage 1 and Lineage 2 had more than all those games today combined. And even those 2 dropped DRASTICALLY since then. I bet you dont have a clue that those games are no.2 and no.3 in history.
Time to face the facts, even hyped up media cannot and dont ignore facts any more.
Unfortunately it seems that eveythig in the industry is 4-5 years behind on current situation and need super long time to catch up on any development. And thats one of the reasons this genre is in steep decline.
Blizzard isnt company that will stick its head in the sand and pretend everything is rainbows and unicorns. They know VERY well whats going on and thats why they cancelled their MMO (losing awesome amount of money on that) and invest VERY little in WoW and proceeded to make TCG and moba that made up for it 10 fold.
1,500,000,000 / 15 =100,000,000
Swtor alone surpasses that every year. I bet you didn't have a clue on that.
Sure you can have your korean fantasy. But when I talk about old school games it's EQ, SWG you know the games the old vets on this site played.
Its time to face the facts the genre has never been better. No matter how much doom and gloom and QQing the old bitter vets do the facts will remain what they are.
And reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Never said 2015-5=2005. Try slowing down and not getting so emotional.
On the other hand, just you have to look and Minecraft and think "There's a definite appeal to someone. Just look at allllllll those someones and their dollars."
I suspect someone's (you, MMO developers) just not finding the right ways to monetize the potential.
Or (perhaps) the best format for sandbox isn't MMO.
SWTOR surpasses that only in your dreams. Once EA discloses how much SWTOR mades you can come back and report.
I dont give a rats ass about "old school" and selective cherry picking of facts to present skewed reality, or what you "ment".
FACT is EVERY MMO since WoW DECLINED in population since their respective launch, and WoW drops down more and more with each xpack.
Unfortunately reality and facts arent your strong points. Along with math.
FACT: Blizzard cancelled their MMO and does minimal investment on WoW and made TCG and moba instead which make as much monies as WoW
FACT: no AAA MMOs in production
FACT: other genres are still growing and pulling more and more players and money each year, while MMOs decline each year
FACT: random internet numbrz you present as "facts" are laughable
My prediction is it will go F2P if the movie doesn't renew interest in the game, and if it can be ported over to console, they will put it on there since Destiny and ESO are doing so well there.
http://www.gamebreaker.tv/games/world-of-warcraft-mmorpg/star-wars-the-old-republic-broke-165-million-last-year/
[mod edit]
165,000,000 > 120,000,000
[mod edit]
Again nobody here talks about l1 or l2 I was referring to the games people talk about here like EQ and Swg. Now if you want to talk l1 or l2 I'm sure there are some Korean sites [mod edit]
So again based on what I was talking about my facts hold up...[mod edit]
They're not going to waste money trying to prop it up any more. If you haven't noticed they've gone to great lengths to divest themselves of the reliance on WoW to meet their targets. They've had more success in, and now earn more money from, smaller titles such as Hearthstone and Heroes of the Storm. Overwatch will certainly add to this wide portfolio.
Added to this is the fact that their internal projections now assume moderate to weak performance from World of Warcraft, and that's what they'll be working to when they allocate development resources. They've moved large chunks of the WoW team to the Diablo, Starcraft, Overwatch, Hearthstone and Heroes of the Storm teams, and have moved very little back. The majority of the new hires are focused on their other titles, not World of Warcraft.
It should be clear at this point that, when it comes to World of Warcraft, Blizzard are looking to take the path of least resistance coupled with a controlled downward trend that allows them to bridge the earnings gap it will leave comfortably and over time. Peace-meal solutions, such as a total shift to F2P, will likely come at some point but they most certainly won't be pitched towards "saving" or "relaunching" World of Warcraft to new heights of success. Instead, they'll be moves designed to mitigate and control the decline of the product, and each time they'll likely bring a new product to the table to replace the losses from WoW.
World of Warcraft is no longer the golden boy at Blizzard, and it hasn't been for a very, very long time. It's more akin to an aging donkey that gets a new saddle every year.