Grand Theft Spaceship..

Ianb4all

Been a Eve online player since 2004...one thing about that game I loved is the downright  brutality of it when out and about and getting into a fight...if the odds aren't with you that day...you loose your ship and if really unlucky you get podded in the process... brutal but there is nothing like it in any mmo and the ONLY mmo I really pvp in due to this...

Now after watching that Gamescon (wonder if that guy got fired...lol .....either to much beer and kinda ignoring the boss!) but back on track....
You buy you nice new shiny ship......go out into space....now you either have a few friends with you or you get attacked and boarded yourself....will the people taking over the ship keep it..leaving you with nothing but having to go back and buy another ship? what about ship losses?

I like the idea of the multi crew ships.....but I can see mega drama if a guy goes and buys a nice big multi crew ship...then has some noobs crew it and be totally incompetent at shooting/flying etc etc which in turn can loose that ship ( I know you say tried and tested crews--but gotta recruit and start from scratch at some point and wont know your crew ability till truly tested)

These are the things I really want to know about......if it will be a brutal universe like EvE Online where you can loose your ship or have ppl disable it and board it and steal it.....

If so ...Sign me up as a pirate lol...I will make it my business to go steal other peoples ships and ransom/sell it back to them or others lol!!

Grand Theft Spaceship............bring it on!

Coman

I doubt people be happy if they lose there 300 dollar spaceship.

Ianb4all

Coman...yea to a degree...but what will the risk/reward be then if you cant takeover or destroy another persons ship?
Will just be a fancy space sim with no real consequences and in this day and age of mmo staleness we need a proper challenge where the risk is equal to the reward..

bartoni33

Well if you were smart you wouldn't use the ships you spent actual money on to dick around in training a fighter crew. But you do raise some good questions OP. I would assume your insurance would cover theft, though I have not heard anything about theft in SC.

Muke

I don't think the devs have figured this one out yet. I doubt you can permanently destroy/steal items in this game they have bought with real money. Imagine the outrage.
The current WoW generation are used to just respawn with all items intact and give it a go without risk.
If they did that SC as CCP does with EVE Online this game would just be another niche game as EVE Online is. And I bet the devs want SC to be a mainstream MMO with hundreds of thousands of players. And not being limited to 15k players + 60k alts.

Ianb4all

Muke said:

I don't think the devs have figured this one out yet. I doubt you can permanently destroy/steal items in this game they have bought with real money. Imagine the outrage.
The current WoW generation are used to just respawn with all items intact and give it a go without risk.
If they did that SC as CCP does with EVE Online this game would just be another niche game as EVE Online is. And I bet the devs want SC to be a mainstream MMO with hundreds of thousands of players. And not being limited to 15k players + 60k alts.

Will be a pity if it is this...otherwise just a fancy mmo for geeks with high end machines.....
May look good but  tbh will get real boring if there's no real consequences of exploration...you blow up and end up back at a planet or starbase.....

The real money for spaceships has me worried...I love the idea and concept but if its going to be the people with the biggest wallets winning due to been able to afford all the big ships and such so early....then I cannot see this game been a mainstream huge success but more  like a space sim for Rich players......

bartoni33

Ianb4all said:

Muke said:

I don't think the devs have figured this one out yet. I doubt you can permanently destroy/steal items in this game they have bought with real money. Imagine the outrage.
The current WoW generation are used to just respawn with all items intact and give it a go without risk.
If they did that SC as CCP does with EVE Online this game would just be another niche game as EVE Online is. And I bet the devs want SC to be a mainstream MMO with hundreds of thousands of players. And not being limited to 15k players + 60k alts.

Will be a pity if it is this...otherwise just a fancy mmo for geeks with high end machines.....
May look good but  tbh will get real boring if there's no real consequences of exploration...you blow up and end up back at a planet or starbase.....

The real money for spaceships has me worried...I love the idea and concept but if its going to be the people with the biggest wallets winning due to been able to afford all the big ships and such so early....then I cannot see this game been a mainstream huge success but more  like a space sim for Rich players......

I don't understand your statement "the people with the biggest wallets winning". "Winning" what? SC isn't a race, though their are races in it currently. How do you "win" a MMO or whatever you want to call SC?

Also, "a space sim for Rich players"? SC IS a space sim. SC does not require you to pay cash for ships. Yes people with more money than sense have spent stupid amounts for ships in SC but that does not hinder anyone elses ability to play or have fun playing. You seem to be stuck on the whole RMT for ships thing. Relax, it won't matter at all in a few months after the game goes live. Hell, it won't matter the moment it goes live.

Gruug

You don't actually loose your ship. The actual mechanic has not been detailed but it has been stated by CR that you will not loose your ship.
 

TalulaRose

Send
Cash

DrunkWolf

This will be another game where dieing wont really mean anything because they arnt going to take away ships people have spent hundreds of dollars on. and if your ship doesnt blow up then whats really the point to death in a game like this? how can a economy even work if you cant lose the most important part?

Erillion

Yes, you can steal a ship. It then belongs to you. You will need a new transponder as the old one will be registered as stolen.

You can steal a ship by force or ambush or stealth  (example was given : hide in cargo crate, crawl out, murder crew in their sleep ... if crew is too lazy and dumb to scan its cargo, if they do they can space you as a stowaway).

If you smear the pilots body parts across the cockpit screen, the pilot has one more "life lost" on his permadeath score  (works a bit like this (no fixed numbers yet) --> Death 1-3 no problem (wakes up in escape pod), Death 4-5 bionics (eye, hand, wakes up in hospital), Death 6-7 heavy cybernetics (new arm, leg, metal plate on skull), Death 8 ... bye bye ... your next of kin / heir  takes over ... create a new character).

Same can happen to you as a boarder if the ship crew repels your boarding attempt.

There are many EVE organizations (e.g. Goonies--> Goonrathi) on standby in Star Citizen to swarm and board (with small inexpensive ships) the big expensive ships with stupid solo pilots with NPC crews.

No, the owner won't loose it permanently as insurance will cover the hull and replace the modules with vanilla basic versions. Insurance cost will be low  and many pilots will have LTI (Lifetime insurance) anyway since the crowdfunding campaign.

Any pimped up modules/weapons  (e.g. military ones from mission rewards or tuned up ones) are lost and belong to the thief. Cargo belongs to the thief (many containers will be registered as stolen).

Bigger ships (especially capital ships) will NOT be replaced immediately as they are NOT instantly crafted by the economy. So you are not hoping into your shiny new Idris within 50 seconds flat. They will also NOT be available at every system immediately.

You cannot 100 % avoid PvP as in Elite:Dangerous, but you can reduce the chance  (PvE/PvP slider to max PvE, stay in secure inner systems with heavy police presence, use stealth ships, use fast ships, use better sensors to evade before PvP player detects you). SC is not QUITE as deadly as EVE, but its no walk in the park either.


Have fun

Muke

Erillion said:

There are many EVE organizations (e.g. Goonies--> Goonrathi) on standby in Star Citizen

Now you have just put me off this game, no need to get spammed holocaust referrals in chat channels by exploiting griefing players and other filth lol.

booniedog96

Ok, so if you can steal a ship and it belongs to you, what's to stop people from exploiting that feature?  Take people with LTI for instance.  Let's say I was one of the backers who got a Constellation w/ LTI due to being an early backer.  I want my little brother to play SC as well so when it launches I have him steal my Constellation so he can get one of his own, then I claim my lost Constellation with LTI and now we both have one.  Is this what will be expected?  If so, it is majorly flawed.

Erillion

booniedog96 said:

Ok, so if you can steal a ship and it belongs to you, what's to stop people from exploiting that feature?  Take people with LTI for instance.  Let's say I was one of the backers who got a Constellation w/ LTI due to being an early backer.  I want my little brother to play SC as well so when it launches I have him steal my Constellation so he can get one of his own, then I claim my lost Constellation with LTI and now we both have one.  Is this what will be expected?  If so, it is majorly flawed.

This is a heavily discussed topic in the forum and still in flux.

Basically it will boil down to the solution the "real world" insurance companies have found ... there will be an investigation. If the ship theft is suspect  (e.g. ship now in possession of a member of your own org (or an org allied with your org)) you may only get a basic Aurora as replacement instead of your original ship.

If you continually have ships stolen from you in a short amount of time, you will lose insurance altogether and may only get a basic Aurora as replacement instead of your original ship.

There will be  inofficial insurance channels in the pirate systems (for insurance of stolen or alien ships) ... but it will be an adventure in itself to get there, find them and NOT cross them (they will do more than void your insurance, they will void YOU ... in a game with a version of permadeath).


Have fun

MagikarpsGhost

Ianb4all said:

Coman...yea to a degree...but what will the risk/reward be then if you cant takeover or destroy another persons ship?
Will just be a fancy space sim with no real consequences and in this day and age of mmo staleness we need a proper challenge where the risk is equal to the reward..

i for one would like a space sim mmo without the loss of a ship. eve online is allready filled with trolls who love picking on the new players we dont need anymore.

Erillion

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/12820-Insurance-FAQ-And-Update

http://starcitizen.wikia.com/wiki/Lifetime_Insurance

http://starcitizen.wikia.com/wiki/Frequently_Asked_Questions



Have fun

Thane

Coman said:

I doubt people be happy if they lose there 300 dollar spaceship.

i doubt people already realized what they spend their money on there :pleased: 

Erillion

Thane said:

Coman said:

I doubt people be happy if they lose there 300 dollar spaceship.

i doubt people already realized what they spend their money on there :pleased: 

They won't lose their spaceships.

Read FAQ links above.


Have fun

Ianb4all

Erillion said:

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/12820-Insurance-FAQ-And-Update

http://starcitizen.wikia.com/wiki/Lifetime_Insurance

http://starcitizen.wikia.com/wiki/Frequently_Asked_Questions



Have fun

Thank you

Hell yeah bring it on this is defo Grand Theft Spacehip!!!

If you can steal a ship and get a fake id for it and such and use it...then I love this game already!

Suckers all your ships belong to me !!!!!

Warlyx

TalulaRose said:

Steal
Cash

FTFY :

booniedog96

Erillion said:

This is a heavily discussed topic in the forum and still in flux.

Basically it will boil down to the solution the "real world" insurance companies have found ... there will be an investigation. If the ship theft is suspect  (e.g. ship now in possession of a member of your own org (or an org allied with your org)) you may only get a basic Aurora as replacement instead of your original ship.

If you continually have ships stolen from you in a short amount of time, you will lose insurance altogether and may only get a basic Aurora as replacement instead of your original ship.

There will be  inofficial insurance channels in the pirate systems (for insurance of stolen or alien ships) ... but it will be an adventure in itself to get there, find them and NOT cross them (they will do more than void your insurance, they will void YOU ... in a game with a version of permadeath).

Ok, taking into consideration that LTI is transferable via trade with another player, what's to stop someone or a group from circle jerking new ships using LTI over multiple accounts.  It doesn't have to be used with LTI as well since you can get normal insurance with ships.  Third party gold farmers will have a hootin good time exploiting this and selling ships on their sites just like they do with WoW accounts. 

Insurance fraud also does not stop with ships because as far as I have read up on the subject you can have your cargo insured too.  This poses another flaw in the insurance mechanic.

"A risk 3 policy for cargo will cover you for all cargo losses in a risk 3 system or below. The higher the risk level of the policy the more it will cost.  As with the base insurance this will not be crippling financially but instead be a reasonable running cost that relates to the risk / reward profile of the systems flown."

Why go out hunting space truckers when you can create your own scenario more efficiently?  It could be as easy as person A telling person B, "Hey Mr. B, my insurance policy is about to run out, come steal this hauler from me real quick so we can turn a profit off of it".  The one thing well known about most MMO players is the fact that they search for the path of least resistance towards success, even if it means exploitation of a game mechanic.

spankybus

What gets me is, in the hangar...you open the doors of the ship by pressing a button....not a security code on a keypad, or a figure print scanner, no retina scanner or key fob held my the pilot. Any moron can walk up, push a button, and enter the craft. Guess I need to get a dog to guard my crap.

Instigator-Jones

booniedog96 said:

Erillion said:

 ... there will be an investigation. If the ship theft is suspect  (e.g. ship now in possession of a member of your own org (or an org allied with your org)) you may only get a basic Aurora as replacement instead of your original ship.

If you continually have ships stolen from you in a short amount of time, you will lose insurance altogether and may only get a basic Aurora as replacement instead of your original ship.

There will be  inofficial insurance channels in the pirate systems (for insurance of stolen or alien ships) ... but it will be an adventure in itself to get there, find them and NOT cross them (they will do more than void your insurance, they will void YOU ... in a game with a version of permadeath).

Insurance fraud also does not stop with ships because as far as I have read up on the subject you can have your cargo insured too.  This poses another flaw in the insurance mechanic...

...The one thing well known about most MMO players is the fact that they search for the path of least resistance towards success, even if it means exploitation of a game mechanic.

Goon Squads + Insurance Fraud = Tricked System, and don't think it won't happen because you know it will.

Also, WHO will make the decisions about what's legit or not? File a ticket to a GM? Wait X amount of time? File a grievance because it didn't work out the way you wanted? File another ticket? 

This just has so much room for failure. I'm finding it harder and harder to see how this "vision" is going to come into fruition. I really hope they figure it out though, and make it so that you don't need a degree in business, and economics to play... Spreadsheet Space Sim part Duex!

Erillion

It will happen. That is what Alpha and Beta playtesting and server wipes after Beta are for.

Have fun

Kefo

Erillion said:

It will happen. That is what Alpha and Beta playtesting and server wipes after Beta are for.

Have fun

Having alpha and beta testing isn't a surefire guarantee. I've been in a few games alpha testing where they were never able to get off the ground

adamlotus75

I don't think the stealing ships thing is going to work - at least not permanently stealing them.  Maybe you will get to 'borrow' them for like 10 hours or something.  Otherwise the insurance scheme could lead to people churning out ships and selling them / giving them away.  

If i've paid $1500 for a virtual ship (not I'm not that stupid) and it gets stolen I'm surely going to want my ship back or a replacement. If a replacement comes along then my ship just got duplicated.