Smart only does this so he can feel like some what in the public eye. This guy had 10 lawsuits in 2014 and 2013 against different companies, the only reason why he is getting press right now is because he is now after SC. If any of you remember he tried this same BS with planetside 2 and SOE at the time. For those that might think I am a SC fanboy no I am not am I a backer yes. But I will leave you with this.
I just read Smart's newest addition to his blog on the matter. It's very lengthy and he backs everything he says up with links and such.
RSI/Roberts/StarCitizen has big time trouble coming. Anybody that can read thru that article and believe otherwise would have to be the most blind fanboi ever.
Yup, Derek would not be wasting his time and resources if he did not know what he is talking about.
I have read the article and I have to agree with Derek, this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.
Forget the fact that some people might or might not like Derek's games, but what is at stake here is that plain out scamming coming from that RSI/CIG company that is making Star Citizen.
The worst blind is the one that does not want to see.
Do you not understand what an accusation is (it must first be proven)... Secondly you obviously already made up your mind based on your opinion."this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.".. yet call others blind and not wanting to see... irony to the say the least...
Anything could be true here... including DS being full of it..
Kind of agree, but the thing is, when lawyers get involved, it usually means there is blood in the water, they are just sharks at the end of the day, and they don't care much who the victim is, as long as they get to eat.
Interesting times indeed.
So true. If a legal firm is willing to advance the costs and fees to file a class action you can bet there is blood in the water. If a court formally recognizes the suit, then it's on. They get to depose CIG employees, they get to subpoena documents all part of the discovery phase. If any irregularities are found guess what. The feds get involved. Now we are talking criminal. Bashing Derek Smart, his game etc: has no relevance on what can happen if a suit is file and a judge recognizes it. I guess we will see what happens in the near future.
I just read Smart's newest addition to his blog on the matter. It's very lengthy and he backs everything he says up with links and such.
RSI/Roberts/StarCitizen has big time trouble coming. Anybody that can read thru that article and believe otherwise would have to be the most blind fanboi ever.
Yup, Derek would not be wasting his time and resources if he did not know what he is talking about.
I have read the article and I have to agree with Derek, this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.
Forget the fact that some people might or might not like Derek's games, but what is at stake here is that plain out scamming coming from that RSI/CIG company that is making Star Citizen.
The worst blind is the one that does not want to see.
Do you not understand what an accusation is (it must first be proven)... Secondly you obviously already made up your mind based on your opinion."this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.".. yet call others blind and not wanting to see... irony to the say the least...
Anything could be true here... including DS being full of it..
Kind of agree, but the thing is, when lawyers get involved, it usually means there is blood in the water, they are just sharks at the end of the day, and they don't care much who the victim is, as long as they get to eat.
Interesting times indeed.
So true. If a legal firm is willing to advance the costs and fees to file a class action you can bet there is blood in the water. If a court formally recognizes the suit, then it's on. They get to depose CIG employees, they get to subpoena documents all part of the discovery phase. If any irregularities are found guess what. The feds get involved. Now we are talking criminal. Bashing Derek Smart, his game etc: has no relevance on what can happen if a suit is file and a judge recognizes it. I guess we will see what happens in the near future.
Agree, law firm should smell something or they wouldn't do it. Interesting time indeed.
I just read Smart's newest addition to his blog on the matter. It's very lengthy and he backs everything he says up with links and such.
RSI/Roberts/StarCitizen has big time trouble coming. Anybody that can read thru that article and believe otherwise would have to be the most blind fanboi ever.
Yup, Derek would not be wasting his time and resources if he did not know what he is talking about.
I have read the article and I have to agree with Derek, this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.
Forget the fact that some people might or might not like Derek's games, but what is at stake here is that plain out scamming coming from that RSI/CIG company that is making Star Citizen.
The worst blind is the one that does not want to see.
Do you not understand what an accusation is (it must first be proven)... Secondly you obviously already made up your mind based on your opinion."this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.".. yet call others blind and not wanting to see... irony to the say the least...
Anything could be true here... including DS being full of it..
Kind of agree, but the thing is, when lawyers get involved, it usually means there is blood in the water, they are just sharks at the end of the day, and they don't care much who the victim is, as long as they get to eat.
Interesting times indeed.
Ok, first of all, when is there NOT blood in the water? Someone is always doing something that a forensic analyst is going to find to be shady. However, there are 50 shades of grey (like how I did that?). Do I think that CR is out buying a new car on a weekly basis because he can? No. Do I think that he's doing lavish or extravagant team lunches? Probably. At the same time, I have no problems with that. He's essentially trying to hire the best of the best to do something that Derek Smart says is "impossible" <-- yes, that's a literal quote from Derek Smart. Yet, at every corner we are seeing more and more. Including the most recent Star Marine update which seemed pretty damn smooth, for the 15 seconds of content or so.
If you want the best employees you need to spoil them, especially if you're overly demanding, like what CR is purported to be.
@Seelinnikoi ; I would disagree ENTIRELY!!! Derek Smart has invested $15 million, apparently, in Line of Defence MMO. Meanwhile, is he showing any sort of regard for the 15 employees (he reportedly has) or ANY of THEIR families by pursuing this legal action? How about the employees of Quest Online (Alganon Online) for which he is President? Anyone in an executive position, such as Derek Smart, should be providing guidance to the projects the company is working on. Derek runs TWO companies. However, he's occupied himself solely with this endeavour to prove something, when all he's really doing is showing his employees that he has absolutely no care for them, their families, their kids. I'd be GONE in a heartbeat.
ON TOP OF THAT!!! Derek also claims to be the Lead Developer / Lead Designer. So this is what I'm talking about. He's foolishly pursuing a lawsuit with complete and utter disregard for his own responsibilities. Right there, in itself, is conduct detrimental to the company. I'm not sure what the settlement was with Quest Online, but I'm sure they sold him controlling share because if they didn't I'm sure that he would be ejected from there by now. I'm really sorry, but if I was a developer working for Derek, I would be SERIOUSLY concerned about my future. I would be out of there in a flash.
Oh, and one last thing, he shows absolute concern for the fans. He's doing this all for us. Yet, in all of this, what about the fans, the PAYING CUSTOMERS for both LOD and Alganon Online? Well the Alganon blog hasn't been updated in 3 months. LoD is a god damn mess. So much so, that they are issuing bug fixes on a weekly basis (sometimes multiple bug fixes), yet the game is still broken and, on top of that, looks horrible.
If Derek had his shit together, it wouldn't be about Derek's projects. However, since he, himself, has a game in early access and he is using his own time to fight battles other than publishing his own game, which is late by nearly a year itself, he is COMPLETELY out of line and his accusations against CIG could just as easily be turned around against him in a class action lawsuit. Only problem is that there aren't enough people who bought his game to give a shit.
I just read Smart's newest addition to his blog on the matter. It's very lengthy and he backs everything he says up with links and such.
RSI/Roberts/StarCitizen has big time trouble coming. Anybody that can read thru that article and believe otherwise would have to be the most blind fanboi ever.
Yup, Derek would not be wasting his time and resources if he did not know what he is talking about.
I have read the article and I have to agree with Derek, this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.
Forget the fact that some people might or might not like Derek's games, but what is at stake here is that plain out scamming coming from that RSI/CIG company that is making Star Citizen.
The worst blind is the one that does not want to see.
Do you not understand what an accusation is (it must first be proven)... Secondly you obviously already made up your mind based on your opinion."this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.".. yet call others blind and not wanting to see... irony to the say the least...
Anything could be true here... including DS being full of it..
Kind of agree, but the thing is, when lawyers get involved, it usually means there is blood in the water, they are just sharks at the end of the day, and they don't care much who the victim is, as long as they get to eat.
Interesting times indeed.
Ok, first of all, when is there NOT blood in the water? Someone is always doing something that a forensic analyst is going to find to be shady. However, there are 50 shades of grey (like how I did that?). Do I think that CR is out buying a new car on a weekly basis because he can? No. Do I think that he's doing lavish or extravagant team lunches? Probably. At the same time, I have no problems with that. He's essentially trying to hire the best of the best to do something that Derek Smart says is "impossible" <-- yes, that's a literal quote from Derek Smart. Yet, at every corner we are seeing more and more. Including the most recent Star Marine update which seemed pretty damn smooth, for the 15 seconds of content or so.
If you want the best employees you need to spoil them, especially if you're overly demanding, like what CR is purported to be.
@Seelinnikoi ; I would disagree ENTIRELY!!! Derek Smart has invested $15 million, apparently, in Line of Defence MMO. Meanwhile, is he showing any sort of regard for the 15 employees (he reportedly has) or ANY of THEIR families by pursuing this legal action? How about the employees of Quest Online (Alganon Online) for which he is President? Anyone in an executive position, such as Derek Smart, should be providing guidance to the projects the company is working on. Derek runs TWO companies. However, he's occupied himself solely with this endeavour to prove something, when all he's really doing is showing his employees that he has absolutely no care for them, their families, their kids. I'd be GONE in a heartbeat.
ON TOP OF THAT!!! Derek also claims to be the Lead Developer / Lead Designer. So this is what I'm talking about. He's foolishly pursuing a lawsuit with complete and utter disregard for his own responsibilities. Right there, in itself, is conduct detrimental to the company. I'm not sure what the settlement was with Quest Online, but I'm sure they sold him controlling share because if they didn't I'm sure that he would be ejected from there by now. I'm really sorry, but if I was a developer working for Derek, I would be SERIOUSLY concerned about my future. I would be out of there in a flash.
Oh, and one last thing, he shows absolute concern for the fans. He's doing this all for us. Yet, in all of this, what about the fans, the PAYING CUSTOMERS for both LOD and Alganon Online? Well the Alganon blog hasn't been updated in 3 months. LoD is a god damn mess. So much so, that they are issuing bug fixes on a weekly basis (sometimes multiple bug fixes), yet the game is still broken and, on top of that, looks horrible.
If Derek had his shit together, it wouldn't be about Derek's projects. However, since he, himself, has a game in early access and he is using his own time to fight battles other than publishing his own game, which is late by nearly a year itself, he is COMPLETELY out of line and his accusations against CIG could just as easily be turned around against him in a class action lawsuit. Only problem is that there aren't enough people who bought his game to give a shit.
How does this contribute to what might happen if he does file a class action and a court recognizes it? Unfortunately this is not about Derek Smart as much as you are trying to make it about him. As I stated earlier generally in class action suits, the lawyer advances all of the costs and fees and, if the
lawsuit is successful, petitions the court to award attorney fees and
reimburse out-of-pocket costs. If the case is unsuccessful, the
plaintiff's lawyer absorbs the loss. If any firm is willing to bet their money they are betting there is something there for them to win.
In the latest salvo fired across the bow of the Roberts Space Industries ship, Derek Smart has hired the legal firm of De La Pena & Holiday LLP that has sent a letter demanding, among other things, immediate refunds to all parties requesting them regardless of Terms of Service restriction, a forensic accounting of the fund-raising activities of RSI along with a completion date for Star Citizen. All these are demanded via the letter "to avoid legal action" on behalf of Derek Smart.
How does this contribute to what might happen if he does file a class action and a court recognizes it?
Unfortunately this is not about Derek Smart as much as you are trying to make it about him. As I stated earlier generally in class action suits, the lawyer advances all of the costs and fees and, if the
lawsuit is successful, petitions the court to award attorney fees and
reimburse out-of-pocket costs. If the case is unsuccessful, the
plaintiff's lawyer absorbs the loss. If any firm is willing to bet their money they are betting there is something there for them to win.
Except there is no class action going on... They just send in Smart's behalf a letter full of his regular bs. In other words, his rants are now official.
That in no way implies there is any basis for class action.
How does this contribute to what might happen if he does file a class action and a court recognizes it?
Unfortunately this is not about Derek Smart as much as you are trying to make it about him. As I stated earlier generally in class action suits, the lawyer advances all of the costs and fees and, if the
lawsuit is successful, petitions the court to award attorney fees and
reimburse out-of-pocket costs. If the case is unsuccessful, the
plaintiff's lawyer absorbs the loss. If any firm is willing to bet their money they are betting there is something there for them to win.
Except there is no class action going on... They just send in Smart's behalf a letter full of his regular bs. In other words, his rants are now official.
That in no way implies there is any basis for class action.
Lawyers don't get involved in these things for fun, they do it for money, which means that as far as they are concerned there is basis for some kind of class action, if there wasn't, then lawyers would definitely not be involved in the process. Lawyers tend to like 2 things, money, and winning, but definitely money, as the second is cash negotiable.
How does this contribute to what might happen if he does file a class action and a court recognizes it?
Unfortunately this is not about Derek Smart as much as you are trying to make it about him. As I stated earlier generally in class action suits, the lawyer advances all of the costs and fees and, if the
lawsuit is successful, petitions the court to award attorney fees and
reimburse out-of-pocket costs. If the case is unsuccessful, the
plaintiff's lawyer absorbs the loss. If any firm is willing to bet their money they are betting there is something there for them to win.
Except there is no class action going on... They just send in Smart's behalf a letter full of his regular bs. In other words, his rants are now official.
That in no way implies there is any basis for class action.
Sure we are all aware that no class action has been filed. Lets see what the future holds. They have 30 days to respond to his new demands. I am sure they will not meet the first demand. Then it will be Derek's turn to make his next move.
"For these reasons and to avoid legal action, Mr. Smart, among other things, hereby demands the following to occur within the next 30 days:
1. A complete forensic accounting (for which Mr. Smart will pay all costs) of expenses to said consumers who have provided $87.5 million to this crowd-funded campaign. Absent full disclosure and transparency, Mr. Smart is concerned that Your conduct constitutes prohibited “unfair or deceptive acts," misrepresentations or deceptive omissions of material fact, unjust enrichment, breach of contract and other violations, all to the detriment of those that have "invested" in Your companies and or the product;
2. A completion date for the delivery of the project as promised, now that the Nov 2014 ship date has been missed;
3. A refund for all those who backed the campaign on Kickstarter or your own website, and who are now requesting a refund."
Lawyers don't get involved in these things for fun, they do it for money, which means that as far as they are concerned there is basis for some kind of class action, if there wasn't, then lawyers would definitely not be involved in the process. Lawyers tend to like 2 things, money, and winning, but definitely money, as the second is cash negotiable.
And you think that laywer company did not get paid for sending that letter...?
You need no basis for class action to send a letter...
Also, in most cases lawyers get paid regardless whether they win the case or not.
Lawyers don't get involved in these things for fun, they do it for money, which means that as far as they are concerned there is basis for some kind of class action, if there wasn't, then lawyers would definitely not be involved in the process. Lawyers tend to like 2 things, money, and winning, but definitely money, as the second is cash negotiable.
And you think that laywer company did not get paid for sending that letter...?
You need no basis for class action to send a letter...
Also, in most cases lawyers get paid regardless whether they win the case or not.
Here is an article for you. I recall I was a participant in a class action due to an external disc drive I bought. The plaintiffs won the case. My award was a $25.00 coupon off another drive haha.
How does this contribute to what might happen if he does file a class action and a court recognizes it?
Unfortunately this is not about Derek Smart as much as you are trying to make it about him. As I stated earlier generally in class action suits, the lawyer advances all of the costs and fees and, if the
lawsuit is successful, petitions the court to award attorney fees and
reimburse out-of-pocket costs. If the case is unsuccessful, the
plaintiff's lawyer absorbs the loss. If any firm is willing to bet their money they are betting there is something there for them to win.
Except there is no class action going on... They just send in Smart's behalf a letter full of his regular bs. In other words, his rants are now official.
That in no way implies there is any basis for class action.
Lawyers don't get involved in these things for fun, they do it for money, which means that as far as they are concerned there is basis for some kind of class action, if there wasn't, then lawyers would definitely not be involved in the process. Lawyers tend to like 2 things, money, and winning, but definitely money, as the second is cash negotiable.
OF COURSE THEY WOULD!!!! You're talking as though no lawyer has ever chased an ambulance. You said it yourself, lawyers love money. Secondly, it's the United States of Murca, Land of the free!! Home of the frivolous lawsuit. There are 85+ million reasons that a lawyer is going to jump at this case and you know damn well that's enough for any lawyer to jump on-board with it. Lawyers do work like this all the time, and they're really good at it. You know, proving that some idiot who was trimming his hedges with a lawnmower should be awarded damages for his injuries because there wasn't a label telling him not to do that!!! Or someone suing McDonald's because they "made them fat".
IMO, this gets thrown out quickly and I hope that Smart gets charged for it, too. They do have laws governing this, since shit's basically gotten out of control. In the end, justice will be just and I hope it ends up costing Smart dearly.
@ShortyBible ; Ummmmmmm, I already did comment on how it impacts gaming. It actually hurts CIG and it hurts crowdfunding, in general, because it creates an environment where we don't "shoot for the stars" and, instead, only propose games that are "safe". It doesn't promote innovation, creativity or anything that could be considered revolutionary. The message here is "Don't dream, don't take risks, and don't ask for support from the community."
As far as it being about Derek Smart, it's entirely about Derek Smart. Why would you think otherwise? Fuck! Even Derek Smart thinks it's about Derek Smart.
Sure we are all aware that no class action has been filed. Lets see what the future holds. They have 30 days to respond to his new demands. I am sure they will not meet the first demand. Then it will be Derek's turn to make his next move.
"For these reasons and to avoid legal action, Mr. Smart, among other things, hereby demands the following to occur within the next 30 days:
1. A complete forensic accounting (for which Mr. Smart will pay all costs) of expenses to said consumers who have provided $87.5 million to this crowd-funded campaign. Absent full disclosure and transparency, Mr. Smart is concerned that Your conduct constitutes prohibited “unfair or deceptive acts," misrepresentations or deceptive omissions of material fact, unjust enrichment, breach of contract and other violations, all to the detriment of those that have "invested" in Your companies and or the product;
2. A completion date for the delivery of the project as promised, now that the Nov 2014 ship date has been missed;
3. A refund for all those who backed the campaign on Kickstarter or your own website, and who are now requesting a refund."
But what if they do number 2 and just said: Yeah yeah ok, the game is launching on January 13, 2017!
What people gonna do? Wait and see if its true?
I am not sure how that will work our with that demand though. Number 1 I doubt will ever happen. Number 3 I think its the most feasible here and probably the one CIG/RSI will do.
Though I hope Derek goes deeper down the rabbit hole and truly finds out what Chris and company are really doing with all that money and no game.
Sure we are all aware that no class action has been filed. Lets see what the future holds. They have 30 days to respond to his new demands. I am sure they will not meet the first demand. Then it will be Derek's turn to make his next move.
"For these reasons and to avoid legal action, Mr. Smart, among other things, hereby demands the following to occur within the next 30 days:
1. A complete forensic accounting (for which Mr. Smart will pay all costs) of expenses to said consumers who have provided $87.5 million to this crowd-funded campaign. Absent full disclosure and transparency, Mr. Smart is concerned that Your conduct constitutes prohibited “unfair or deceptive acts," misrepresentations or deceptive omissions of material fact, unjust enrichment, breach of contract and other violations, all to the detriment of those that have "invested" in Your companies and or the product;
2. A completion date for the delivery of the project as promised, now that the Nov 2014 ship date has been missed;
3. A refund for all those who backed the campaign on Kickstarter or your own website, and who are now requesting a refund."
But what if they do number 2 and just said: Yeah yeah ok, the game is launching on January 13, 2017!
What people gonna do? Wait and see if its true?
I am not sure how that will work our with that demand though. Number 1 I doubt will ever happen. Number 3 I think its the most feasible here and probably the one CIG/RSI will do.
Though I hope Derek goes deeper down the rabbit hole and truly finds out what Chris and company are really doing with all that money and no game.
Ok, so on #2, it's already been delivered. Arena Commander is a "game" It's been delivered. Is it what was promised? No. Do they say they are bringing us more? Yes. However, it should be noted that there really isn't an obligation beyond delivering that as their finished game. Elite: Dangerous is an example of that. They killed their entire single-player plans which made some rumblings. Since Arena Commander is, technically, a game, this could easily be considered a scaled-down version of SC, branded as SC and they simply say that they have plans to release patches in the future. Then who wins?
As far as #1 goes, what company on EARTH would openly agree to a forensic accounting analysis? The government wouldn't. I'll bet Derek Smart wouldn't. It's not even because it's going to uncover anything. It's because it's a disruptive force and when you're trying to get things done, it's just impairing your ability to do so. Plus, CIG doesn't owe him sweet fuck all!
So if you're pissed, go email CIG and ask for your money back. I honestly hope that they record your name, address, etc. and bar you from ever playing, just like they did with Derek Smart, and that should be the condition. If you haven't seen enough proof that something great is coming then you don't deserve to come back in at a later date.
This guy got his money refunded and has no further stake in the game. What position is he in to be making any kind of demands?
Well according to Smart's website they haven't sent him the money yet, CiG said they would but didn't, it's listed in his Comments section here in this article:
"First, no, I haven’t received a refund. " - (quoting dsmart about midway down the comments section)
The day after the refund he said he did get the money back and was making fuss that giving his money back is just saying that he was right about his claims and RSI is scamming everyone. And now he says he did not get money back, this guy is a fucking con artist. @nbtscan If you know Derek [mod edit] Smart's history you would know he is a 1st class con man, he conned his way into several companies, kicked the founders and took over and then turned their games into shit. The last one was Quest online and their game Alganon, Alganon was suppose to be a sandbox open world experience which he turned into "WoW Clone" after kicking the founder of the company and taking it for himself, this guy is just like that, [mod edit]
Post edited by Vaross on
Boobs are LIFE, Boobs are LOVE, Boobs are JUSTICE, Boobs are mankind's HOPES and DREAMS. People who complain about boobs have lost their humanity.
@nbtscan If you know Derek [mod edit] Smart's history you would know he is a 1st class con man, he conned his way into several companies, kicked the founders and took over and then turned their games into shit. The last one was Quest online and their game Alganon, Alganon was suppose to be a sandbox open world experience which he turned into "WoW Clone" after kicking the founder of the company and taking it for himself, this guy is just like that [mod edit]
The other player in this fits this description equally well, so who to trust? I would go with option C - None of the above.
I just read Smart's newest addition to his blog on the matter. It's very lengthy and he backs everything he says up with links and such.
RSI/Roberts/StarCitizen has big time trouble coming. Anybody that can read thru that article and believe otherwise would have to be the most blind fanboi ever.
Yup, Derek would not be wasting his time and resources if he did not know what he is talking about.
I have read the article and I have to agree with Derek, this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.
Forget the fact that some people might or might not like Derek's games, but what is at stake here is that plain out scamming coming from that RSI/CIG company that is making Star Citizen.
The worst blind is the one that does not want to see.
Do you not understand what an accusation is (it must first be proven)... Secondly you obviously already made up your mind based on your opinion."this whole Star Citizen is the biggest scam in gaming I have ever seen.".. yet call others blind and not wanting to see... irony to the say the least...
Anything could be true here... including DS being full of it..
Kind of agree, but the thing is, when lawyers get involved, it usually means there is blood in the water, they are just sharks at the end of the day, and they don't care much who the victim is, as long as they get to eat.
Interesting times indeed.
So true. If a legal firm is willing to advance the costs and fees to file a class action you can bet there is blood in the water. If a court formally recognizes the suit, then it's on. They get to depose CIG employees, they get to subpoena documents all part of the discovery phase. If any irregularities are found guess what. The feds get involved. Now we are talking criminal. Bashing Derek Smart, his game etc: has no relevance on what can happen if a suit is file and a judge recognizes it. I guess we will see what happens in the near future.
Agree, law firm should smell something or they wouldn't do it. Interesting time indeed.
All the law firms care about is getting paid.
The dishonest ones will egg you on and give you unrealistic expectations.
Ever heard of a Patent Troll? Well I'd classify Derek as a Legal Troll.
This guy got his money refunded and has no further stake in the game. What position is he in to be making any kind of demands?
Well according to Smart's website they haven't sent him the money yet, CiG said they would but didn't, it's listed in his Comments section here in this article:
The only thing I agree with DS on is that people who want a refund need to be able to get one. They are very late and completely changed the scope of the project. Not everyone will be happy with that. It's the best PR move they can make.
DS needs to drop it, if people want to be fooled into giving money to a scam artist, it is their problem, there have been plenty of warnings and people need to have better common sense.
This guy got his money refunded and has no further stake in the game. What position is he in to be making any kind of demands?
Well according to Smart's website they haven't sent him the money yet, CiG said they would but didn't, it's listed in his Comments section here in this article:
"First, no, I haven’t received a refund. " - (quoting dsmart about midway down the comments section)
The day after the refund he said he did get the money back and was making fuss that giving his money back is just saying that he was right about his claims and RSI is scamming everyone. And now he says he did not get money back, this guy is a fucking con artist. @nbtscan If you know Derek [mod edit] Smart's history you would know he is a 1st class con man, he conned his way into several companies, kicked the founders and took over and then turned their games into shit. The last one was Quest online and their game Alganon, Alganon was suppose to be a sandbox open world experience which he turned into "WoW Clone" after kicking the founder of the company and taking it for himself, this guy is just like that, [mod edit]
[mod edit]
Mr. Roberts was relevant decades ago when he helped create a fairly decent series of space games. Since then he has run a game company into the ground for mismanagement and turned his back on the gaming industry to try his hand at making movies with, in my opinion, very shitty results (I did enjoy lord of war so I will give him that). Since he sucked at making movies he came crawling back to games and is using crowdfunded dollars to make a game which has suffered numerous delays (I understand shit happens in gaming) but so far he is showing all the signs he did at Digital Anvil and I wouldnt be terribly surprised if he does the same shit he did there with CIG.
Feel free to have skepticism towards Derek's motives, I know I do, but I think you should also wake up a little and pay attention to CR's past history and how he seems to be repeating past mistakes.
Sure we are all aware that no class action has been filed. Lets see what the future holds. They have 30 days to respond to his new demands. I am sure they will not meet the first demand. Then it will be Derek's turn to make his next move.
"For these reasons and to avoid legal action, Mr. Smart, among other things, hereby demands the following to occur within the next 30 days:
1. A complete forensic accounting (for which Mr. Smart will pay all costs) of expenses to said consumers who have provided $87.5 million to this crowd-funded campaign. Absent full disclosure and transparency, Mr. Smart is concerned that Your conduct constitutes prohibited “unfair or deceptive acts," misrepresentations or deceptive omissions of material fact, unjust enrichment, breach of contract and other violations, all to the detriment of those that have "invested" in Your companies and or the product;
2. A completion date for the delivery of the project as promised, now that the Nov 2014 ship date has been missed;
3. A refund for all those who backed the campaign on Kickstarter or your own website, and who are now requesting a refund."
But what if they do number 2 and just said: Yeah yeah ok, the game is launching on January 13, 2017!
What people gonna do? Wait and see if its true?
I am not sure how that will work our with that demand though. Number 1 I doubt will ever happen. Number 3 I think its the most feasible here and probably the one CIG/RSI will do.
Though I hope Derek goes deeper down the rabbit hole and truly finds out what Chris and company are really doing with all that money and no game.
Ok, so on #2, it's already been delivered. Arena Commander is a "game" It's been delivered. Is it what was promised? No. Do they say they are bringing us more? Yes. However, it should be noted that there really isn't an obligation beyond delivering that as their finished game. Elite: Dangerous is an example of that. They killed their entire single-player plans which made some rumblings. Since Arena Commander is, technically, a game, this could easily be considered a scaled-down version of SC, branded as SC and they simply say that they have plans to release patches in the future. Then who wins?
As far as #1 goes, what company on EARTH would openly agree to a forensic accounting analysis? The government wouldn't. I'll bet Derek Smart wouldn't. It's not even because it's going to uncover anything. It's because it's a disruptive force and when you're trying to get things done, it's just impairing your ability to do so. Plus, CIG doesn't owe him sweet fuck all!
So if you're pissed, go email CIG and ask for your money back. I honestly hope that they record your name, address, etc. and bar you from ever playing, just like they did with Derek Smart, and that should be the condition. If you haven't seen enough proof that something great is coming then you don't deserve to come back in at a later date.
Problem is CR has said multiple times that Arena Commander is a module and that it doesnt represent the finished game in any sense of the word and is just one small aspect of it. He can try to say AC is the finished game but there is past statements that would completely destroy his arguments if it were taken to court.
As for refunds I hear that some are getting the refunds while some are struggling at getting CIG to recognize that they should get one.
This game reeks of scam. Instead of showing progress they front up their next ship model(which they revise or change multiple times) and their half assed modules. WAIT! There is a game you can play if you pay out the money! Its called Arena Commander; where the most expensive ship wins.
Comments
DS own game of what he is filing a lawsuit on SC http://i.imgur.com/OifDYwY.jpg
DS lawsuit crazy https://dockets.justia.com/search?query=derek+smart
If a court formally recognizes the suit, then it's on.
They get to depose CIG employees, they get to subpoena documents all part of the discovery phase.
If any irregularities are found guess what. The feds get involved. Now we are talking criminal.
Bashing Derek Smart, his game etc: has no relevance on what can happen if a suit is file and a judge recognizes it.
I guess we will see what happens in the near future.
http://www.entropiapartners.com/?r=22415
Ok, first of all, when is there NOT blood in the water? Someone is always doing something that a forensic analyst is going to find to be shady. However, there are 50 shades of grey (like how I did that?). Do I think that CR is out buying a new car on a weekly basis because he can? No. Do I think that he's doing lavish or extravagant team lunches? Probably. At the same time, I have no problems with that. He's essentially trying to hire the best of the best to do something that Derek Smart says is "impossible" <-- yes, that's a literal quote from Derek Smart. Yet, at every corner we are seeing more and more. Including the most recent Star Marine update which seemed pretty damn smooth, for the 15 seconds of content or so.
If you want the best employees you need to spoil them, especially if you're overly demanding, like what CR is purported to be.
@Seelinnikoi ;
I would disagree ENTIRELY!!! Derek Smart has invested $15 million, apparently, in Line of Defence MMO. Meanwhile, is he showing any sort of regard for the 15 employees (he reportedly has) or ANY of THEIR families by pursuing this legal action? How about the employees of Quest Online (Alganon Online) for which he is President? Anyone in an executive position, such as Derek Smart, should be providing guidance to the projects the company is working on. Derek runs TWO companies. However, he's occupied himself solely with this endeavour to prove something, when all he's really doing is showing his employees that he has absolutely no care for them, their families, their kids. I'd be GONE in a heartbeat.
ON TOP OF THAT!!! Derek also claims to be the Lead Developer / Lead Designer. So this is what I'm talking about. He's foolishly pursuing a lawsuit with complete and utter disregard for his own responsibilities. Right there, in itself, is conduct detrimental to the company. I'm not sure what the settlement was with Quest Online, but I'm sure they sold him controlling share because if they didn't I'm sure that he would be ejected from there by now. I'm really sorry, but if I was a developer working for Derek, I would be SERIOUSLY concerned about my future. I would be out of there in a flash.
Oh, and one last thing, he shows absolute concern for the fans. He's doing this all for us. Yet, in all of this, what about the fans, the PAYING CUSTOMERS for both LOD and Alganon Online? Well the Alganon blog hasn't been updated in 3 months. LoD is a god damn mess. So much so, that they are issuing bug fixes on a weekly basis (sometimes multiple bug fixes), yet the game is still broken and, on top of that, looks horrible.
If Derek had his shit together, it wouldn't be about Derek's projects. However, since he, himself, has a game in early access and he is using his own time to fight battles other than publishing his own game, which is late by nearly a year itself, he is COMPLETELY out of line and his accusations against CIG could just as easily be turned around against him in a class action lawsuit. Only problem is that there aren't enough people who bought his game to give a shit.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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Unfortunately this is not about Derek Smart as much as you are trying to make it about him.
As I stated earlier generally in class action suits, the lawyer advances all of the costs and fees and, if the lawsuit is successful, petitions the court to award attorney fees and reimburse out-of-pocket costs. If the case is unsuccessful, the plaintiff's lawyer absorbs the loss.
If any firm is willing to bet their money they are betting there is something there for them to win.
http://www.entropiapartners.com/?r=22415
a) those who try to get attention by their works and idea
b) those who try to get attention by bitching OTHER people's work
derek smart? yea, have a guess which grp he is :pleased:
usualy i'd say don't feed the troll, let him rage... but don't give him attention, please.
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
That in no way implies there is any basis for class action.
Lets see what the future holds. They have 30 days to respond to his new demands.
I am sure they will not meet the first demand. Then it will be Derek's turn to make his next move.
"For these reasons and to avoid legal action, Mr. Smart, among other things, hereby
demands the following to occur within the next 30 days:
1. A complete forensic accounting (for which Mr. Smart will pay all costs) of expenses to
said consumers who have provided $87.5 million to this crowd-funded campaign. Absent
full disclosure and transparency, Mr. Smart is concerned that Your conduct constitutes
prohibited “unfair or deceptive acts," misrepresentations or deceptive omissions of
material fact, unjust enrichment, breach of contract and other violations, all to the
detriment of those that have "invested" in Your companies and or the product;
2. A completion date for the delivery of the project as promised, now that the Nov 2014 ship
date has been missed;
3. A refund for all those who backed the campaign on Kickstarter or your own website, and
who are now requesting a refund."
http://www.entropiapartners.com/?r=22415
You need no basis for class action to send a letter...
Also, in most cases lawyers get paid regardless whether they win the case or not.
The plaintiffs won the case. My award was a $25.00 coupon off another drive haha.
Edit: I just recalled. It was against Scandisk
http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielfisher/2013/12/11/with-consumer-class-actions-lawyers-are-mostly-paid-to-do-nothing/
http://www.entropiapartners.com/?r=22415
IMO, this gets thrown out quickly and I hope that Smart gets charged for it, too. They do have laws governing this, since shit's basically gotten out of control. In the end, justice will be just and I hope it ends up costing Smart dearly.
@ShortyBible ;
Ummmmmmm, I already did comment on how it impacts gaming. It actually hurts CIG and it hurts crowdfunding, in general, because it creates an environment where we don't "shoot for the stars" and, instead, only propose games that are "safe". It doesn't promote innovation, creativity or anything that could be considered revolutionary. The message here is "Don't dream, don't take risks, and don't ask for support from the community."
As far as it being about Derek Smart, it's entirely about Derek Smart. Why would you think otherwise? Fuck! Even Derek Smart thinks it's about Derek Smart.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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What people gonna do? Wait and see if its true?
I am not sure how that will work our with that demand though. Number 1 I doubt will ever happen. Number 3 I think its the most feasible here and probably the one CIG/RSI will do.
Though I hope Derek goes deeper down the rabbit hole and truly finds out what Chris and company are really doing with all that money and no game.
New players can get a welcome package and old/returning players can also get a welcome back package and 7 days free subscription time! Just click here to use my referral invitation
On #3, people are, apparently, getting refunds.
As far as #1 goes, what company on EARTH would openly agree to a forensic accounting analysis? The government wouldn't. I'll bet Derek Smart wouldn't. It's not even because it's going to uncover anything. It's because it's a disruptive force and when you're trying to get things done, it's just impairing your ability to do so. Plus, CIG doesn't owe him sweet fuck all!
So if you're pissed, go email CIG and ask for your money back. I honestly hope that they record your name, address, etc. and bar you from ever playing, just like they did with Derek Smart, and that should be the condition. If you haven't seen enough proof that something great is coming then you don't deserve to come back in at a later date.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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@nbtscan If you know Derek [mod edit] Smart's history you would know he is a 1st class con man, he conned his way into several companies, kicked the founders and took over and then turned their games into shit. The last one was Quest online and their game Alganon, Alganon was suppose to be a sandbox open world experience which he turned into "WoW Clone" after kicking the founder of the company and taking it for himself, this guy is just like that, [mod edit]
Boobs are LIFE, Boobs are LOVE, Boobs are JUSTICE, Boobs are mankind's HOPES and DREAMS. People who complain about boobs have lost their humanity.
The dishonest ones will egg you on and give you unrealistic expectations.
Ever heard of a Patent Troll? Well I'd classify Derek as a Legal Troll.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Well I'd bet that Derek wiped his ass with the check and flushed it down the shitter.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
As far as the threatened suit, what a joke.
want 7 free days of playing? Try this
http://www.swtor.com/r/ZptVnY
Mr. Roberts was relevant decades ago when he helped create a fairly decent series of space games. Since then he has run a game company into the ground for mismanagement and turned his back on the gaming industry to try his hand at making movies with, in my opinion, very shitty results (I did enjoy lord of war so I will give him that). Since he sucked at making movies he came crawling back to games and is using crowdfunded dollars to make a game which has suffered numerous delays (I understand shit happens in gaming) but so far he is showing all the signs he did at Digital Anvil and I wouldnt be terribly surprised if he does the same shit he did there with CIG.
Feel free to have skepticism towards Derek's motives, I know I do, but I think you should also wake up a little and pay attention to CR's past history and how he seems to be repeating past mistakes.
Problem is CR has said multiple times that Arena Commander is a module and that it doesnt represent the finished game in any sense of the word and is just one small aspect of it. He can try to say AC is the finished game but there is past statements that would completely destroy his arguments if it were taken to court.
As for refunds I hear that some are getting the refunds while some are struggling at getting CIG to recognize that they should get one.
MurderHerd