Vanguard was the same as EQ2 and since we have and have played thousands of hours of both,we don't need to copy either game.
I want to play a game that has improved on shallow game play,improved on problem areas and add in missing pieces that other games were reluctant to put in.
Sadly my heart tells me that on a rather small budget,i should not expect anymore than just a rehash of EQ1-2/Vngd.I scoffed at Wow on release because i figured it was a cheap resemblance of EQ2,so now fast forward ,i am not about to play yet another copy.
I have read a lot of what this game is going to try and do,it does sound good and what i like in mmorpg's but doing it the exact same way is what would bore me.I was really hoping and banking on this game to return to mmorpg gaming but now i am just playing single player games,getting back into real sports and if a good mmorpg comes along great,if not no big deal.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
But frankly if I wanted to play EQ - the original is still available, is it not ?
Is this the joke of the day?
I do agree Vanguard class concepts were better then EQ but that's about the only thing I would take from Vangaurd. EQ had far better battle mechanics. Vanguard combat was way too spammy, it felt more like EQ2 then EQ1. That 5 dot system made me want to vomit, as did the ease of solo play.
And giving clerics tanking abilities is everything that's wrong with MMO's today. Pick a role and be happy with it, if anyone rolls a Cleric expecting to tank they are pretty slow.
Vanguards crafting? Race design? World design?
Sorry but EQ doesn't beat Vanguard in any of those things and neither does Pantheon.
Pantheon's race designs suck even more than the first version when Vhalens was in charge of them.
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
But frankly if I wanted to play EQ - the original is still available, is it not ?
Is this the joke of the day?
I do agree Vanguard class concepts were better then EQ but that's about the only thing I would take from Vangaurd. EQ had far better battle mechanics. Vanguard combat was way too spammy, it felt more like EQ2 then EQ1. That 5 dot system made me want to vomit, as did the ease of solo play.
And giving clerics tanking abilities is everything that's wrong with MMO's today. Pick a role and be happy with it, if anyone rolls a Cleric expecting to tank they are pretty slow.
Vanguards crafting? Race design? World design?
Sorry but EQ doesn't beat Vanguard in any of those things and neither does Pantheon.
Pantheon's race designs suck even more than the first version when Vhalens was in charge of them.
So why are you posting on this forum again?
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
Sadly my heart tells me that on a rather small budget,i should not expect anymore than just a rehash of EQ1-2/Vngd.
doing it the exact same way is what
would bore me
That's my one major issue as well (concerns on other aspects i may have, but they are far lower on the hierarchy and frankly a healthy thing to have). But what you just touched on is.. yeah.. A major issue And judging from the lack of responses to certain topics/questions of mine, as well as the sadly predictable, ultimately conservative responses in yet others? An issue that's not going to disappear.
(especially the conservatism, it kills me. It's like he froze in the 90s and in a bad way. Not everything past that era was shit, systems/concepts-wise. Games, they were. Some of their systems were not. I frankly doubt he's even aware of some of them; he just neither needs nor cares to incorporate them.. too many people happy with blindfolded, straight ole-rehashing; why bother for different/deeper when everyone's happy, lol)
Our only difference is that unlike you, i would play a rehash. Hence my strongly supporting Pantheon. I do however regret, really regret, this god damn.. conservatism; lack of vision; lack of.. thinking. Thinking doesn't have a budget. Either you're capable of it or you're not
edit: and frankly? Even if you're not capable of it, what about learning? Two decades of empirical evidence at your disposal. What happened with those?
Nobody has ever had better class design then Vangaurd, no one is even close. Loved the crit chain system, the sound of those crits lept me going, no game has ever produced something like that for me. Pantheon, are you listening? Bring us back the crack of the crit chain!!
No way can I agree with this.
EQ had the best class design ever, and no MMORPG is remotely close.
That's because class roles changed depending on group makeup. My Ranger could be puller, tank, kite bait, or crowd control depending on group make up and mob types. While VG had some cool class designs, the classes just didnt have the depth that EQ has.
Best thing about the VG combat system was offensive and defensive targeting.
Sorry, but the title of best class design and grouping system goes to City of Heroes. I can't think of one class that sucked in that game and it had the best CC system ever. I'd also say that FFXI was a better EQ.
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
I think there's a large portion of peeps who underestimate the power of old style mmo playing with updated graphics and new lands to explore, I would not be surprised at all to see Pantheon hold over a million subs for years to come. Love you post its spot on and totally agree.
Over a million subs? Try to contain your enthusiasm. As far as I know the only MMO in the west that has retained over a million subs over several years is WoW. At the peak EQ had somewhere around 400k or so (I think). A million subs would overwhelm the expectation that VR says they have and I would expect bad things...
EQ also became popular when there was about 1/15th of the people that are currently on the internet. Just something to think about, because there hasn't been anything remotely like it since, so theres no data to suggest otherwise (no, I don't believe VG and EQ2 were even close to on par with classic EQ).
The game is still a long ways out, and it remains to be seen whether they can achieve everything they aspire to, but if they do, a million subs is not at all unrealistic.
FFXI was a better version of EQ with cooler classes. Even the first Pantheon team were drawing influence from FFXI.
CoH had a better grouping system and more fun classes. It also had awesome CC.
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
LOL @ FFXI being a better version of EQ. Man that's hilarious.
If by better you mean combat was 1/2 the speed, running around the world felt like running through molasses, and leveling took 2-3x as long (for no real reason), and lot of stupid arbitrary time sinks like having to do a massive quest every 5 levels just to keep leveling (let's not forget said quest typically had 1 mob that dropped the item needed in the entire world, so you literally had 50-100+ people standing around waiting in line to kill this mob just so they could keep leveling)... as better, than yes, it was better.
It was a good game, but it was also the game that helped define the "Asian Grind" mmo.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
I liked FFXI, but it always seemed like a generic version of EQ with a Final Fantasy theme. Was still more enjoyable to me than modern MMOs and it had a lot of things about it that I liked (music, multi-classing, groupcentric, great graphics, good lore, among other things), but I think claiming it was better is like claiming RC Cola is better than Coke. Ultimately a matter of taste, but few who played classic EQ considered XI a better game.
Comments
I want to play a game that has improved on shallow game play,improved on problem areas and add in missing pieces that other games were reluctant to put in.
Sadly my heart tells me that on a rather small budget,i should not expect anymore than just a rehash of EQ1-2/Vngd.I scoffed at Wow on release because i figured it was a cheap resemblance of EQ2,so now fast forward ,i am not about to play yet another copy.
I have read a lot of what this game is going to try and do,it does sound good and what i like in mmorpg's but doing it the exact same way is what would bore me.I was really hoping and banking on this game to return to mmorpg gaming but now i am just playing single player games,getting back into real sports and if a good mmorpg comes along great,if not no big deal.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Sorry but EQ doesn't beat Vanguard in any of those things and neither does Pantheon.
Pantheon's race designs suck even more than the first version when Vhalens was in charge of them.
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
That's my one major issue as well (concerns on other aspects i may have, but they are far lower on the hierarchy and frankly a healthy thing to have). But what you just touched on is.. yeah.. A major issue
And judging from the lack of responses to certain topics/questions of mine, as well as the sadly predictable, ultimately conservative responses in yet others? An issue that's not going to disappear.
(especially the conservatism, it kills me. It's like he froze in the 90s and in a bad way. Not everything past that era was shit, systems/concepts-wise. Games, they were. Some of their systems were not. I frankly doubt he's even aware of some of them; he just neither needs nor cares to incorporate them.. too many people happy with blindfolded, straight ole-rehashing; why bother for different/deeper when everyone's happy, lol)
Our only difference is that unlike you, i would play a rehash. Hence my strongly supporting Pantheon. I do however regret, really regret, this god damn.. conservatism; lack of vision; lack of.. thinking. Thinking doesn't have a budget. Either you're capable of it or you're not
edit: and frankly? Even if you're not capable of it, what about learning? Two decades of empirical evidence at your disposal. What happened with those?
Pride, honour and purity
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
FFXI was a better version of EQ with cooler classes. Even the first Pantheon team were drawing influence from FFXI.
CoH had a better grouping system and more fun classes. It also had awesome CC.
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
LOL @ FFXI being a better version of EQ. Man that's hilarious.
If by better you mean combat was 1/2 the speed, running around the world felt like running through molasses, and leveling took 2-3x as long (for no real reason), and lot of stupid arbitrary time sinks like having to do a massive quest every 5 levels just to keep leveling (let's not forget said quest typically had 1 mob that dropped the item needed in the entire world, so you literally had 50-100+ people standing around waiting in line to kill this mob just so they could keep leveling)... as better, than yes, it was better.
It was a good game, but it was also the game that helped define the "Asian Grind" mmo.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche