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Charge Back and Refunds
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Remember that the financial system is siding with you. Else, the charge back wouldn't go through.
Use the reference material in the OP, talk to your bank and get your money back.
There are more people in the system that believes you are in the right. Just look at how the customer protection system is designed to protect YOU.
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Let me answer all of that with
I have not donated a single dollar to SC, and that is for a very good reason. I have no faith what so ever in the project.
But that was not really the point i was making....
My point was that....
..
.
WAY TO MANY PEOPLE TREATED THE CROWDFUNDER AS A PRE-ORDER WHEN THEY SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.
And that they should learn from this mistake by eating the fact that they donated money to a dream and learn from that rather than doing a charge back and blaming their poor decision skills on others.
That was my original point before the manchester cap brigade came in and felt angry for me bringing up that being educated actually help against doing dumb shit like thinking a donation is a pre-order.
This have been a good conversation
Apparently 'higher education' never taught him that breaking the tax law is not a good idea.
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Either way, do you really think someone is paying 10k for a ship? OR are they getting that ship with a 10k pledge that they are giving to support the production?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
HA!
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Have fun with that defense. ROFL!
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
A pre-order comes with a lot more obligations as far as i understand it...?
Now a better term would perhaps have been patronage, but since most people in this day and age have no *bleeeep* clue what that is.... Donation was the simpler term to use even if slightly incorrect.
Point still stands, especially as i do not argue the legal standpoint in any case. What i am arguing is a cultural decay and missfire. People are well within their legal rights to make a charge-back just as i am to express my opinion of doing so being a distinct course of not taking any responsibility for your own actions.
This have been a good conversation
Crowd funding , Star Citizen and so on are piss-ant amounts of money not even on the radar in actual monetary terms.
No one is going to change chargeback rules worrying about anything like this. It's not even a blip on the radar for actual CC companies.
The point is it's not a purchase, it is a contribution to the product. That is the entire point behind crowdfunding. You can argue that CIG may be abusing that, but that is exactly what it is. Crowdfunding... You're taking the place of typical forms of investment.
Going into it with the idea you will definitely receive something is short sighted, because you might not (that's why it's not a purchase). Sure you can circumvent your loses by form of charge-back (because certain rules and regulations, that are not designed for such), that doesn't make it any less what it is. It's a risk plain and simple, what you're supporting may never be made. That's the reality.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
You can think 1+1 is 3 but don't force that thinking to someone else. But if you do, be prepared to be corrected cause what you think is factually wrong.
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge
The first package on that page also contains:
- SelfLand Hangar
- Starting Money: 1,000 UEC
- 3 Month Insurance
- Digital Star Citizen Manual
- Squadron 42 Digital Download
- Star Citizen Digital Download
That is a purchase by anyone's definition and this fantasy that it is a donation is ridiculous.And when it comes to shared blame, what kind of a person would blame the purchaser of a product for not receiving the product? It's completely asinine.
That is actually pretty common in society... Since most people are flexible enough to make the intended connection. Now that ofc does not work on some people on the spectrum. But in general it does work.
Now since we the community care for and like you two... In the way one appreciate a puppy.
And it has been stated twice.
Donation was the best word to describe the nature of the transaction. Patronage would be better but again the metric was how many average people would get the reference. Neither pre-order or purchase works since there is actually no product to sell, and in fact during the KS campaign you pledged money...
Now as i said patronage is the best term but by framing the transaction in the narrative of a donation we separate it from things like getting anew car from the dealer or a pint of milk from the store. People understand how donations work on a basic level (even if they do not understand the legal framework) and as such we can save a lot of time (for most people) and still get the point across.
Now as i said... some people are very literal... Like Drax in the GotG movie... For them this habit makes navigating the every day society an jungle and i am sorry we have caused you this discomfort.
Do you feel you have a better grasp of how the use of the word donation was used here. If not PM me and i will help you further.
This have been a good conversation
Just keep it factual, use the reference material in the OP if you want and get your money back.
At the end of the day it was a transaction that you and CIG made for product A by Y date for delivery. CIG publicly declared they are changing both. Remember that the system is built to protect YOU in situations like this.
We'll now let those who keep on harping about how '1+1 is 3' say why they think that way and laugh. vOv
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I understand that your opinion is that it was a donation, but it really isn't. We can even look to the original Kickstarter to show this is true. The following is what you get for $30. This was intended to be delivered in 2014:
"DIGITAL SCOUT: A digital copy of the finished game for your PC with your RSI Aurora spaceship ready to fly + 1,000 Galatic Credits + Exclusive access to the Alpha + Beta (digital tier, no physical rewards)
There is nothing there about donations. You get a product delivered for a price. Once that product isn't delivered for a price, you can seek recompense (and people have seeked it and gotten it). It's not complicated.
I do find it really silly that you have now decided that it isn't a donation and instead have found a new word to support your argument, patronage. Sorry, but this is neither a donation or patronage. The expectation that should the consumer get nothing out of the transaction that they are out of luck is just false. There are ways to get your money back and there are ways to hold companies accountable.