HTC Vive sales

SEANMCAD

Turns out its not 10

http://www.forbes.com/sites/paullamkin/2016/10/21/htc-vive-vr-headset-sales-revealed/#5c333d8b7d9a

I should also point out that  HTC Vive is the heavest headset and the most expensive VR solution for consumers outside of StarVR if that is even considered a consumer product

Vrika

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

SEANMCAD

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

laserit

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

The number is acceptable for the initial release year.

The real question is:

What will the sale numbers look like next year? Also... when and what will software developers find acceptable before they decide to abandon any kind of substantial investment into the format.  

maskedweasel

Abysmal numbers, and even worse for the Rift.  You can see that both HTC and Facebook are not close to hitting their targets based on the hype of these products.  

But I can't say I didn't see it coming, analyst estimates have been dropping month over month since April.  

They've kept the 2020 prediction in place as they feel that traction will gain extraordinarily by then,  but lest we not forget that by 2017 PSVR was slated as selling 6 MILLION.   Even that estimate is down to 1.9 MILLION... and so far we have only rough numbers but it's said that its just shy of the 200K mark.

This would make it the best selling non cell phone VR set...  but only time will tell if they even reach THEIR new analysis estimate of 2 MILLION units by January. 

SEANMCAD

laserit said:

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

The number is acceptable for the initial release year.

The real question is:

What will the sale numbers look like next year? Also... when and what will software developers find acceptable before they decide to abandon any kind of substantial investment into the format.  

I dont know but I will say my running suggestion to everyone is not not buy new tech the first year it comes out. Yes i did and I somewhat wish I hadnt but in general its advice I usually take myself.

PottedPlant22

Vrika said:

That's really bad result...

In my opinion it's absolutely fantastic for a $800 accessory to maybe 20% of gaming computers out there right now that can actually run it.  On top of that you have GearVR, Oculus and PSVR for competition.

I'm more interested by the end of the year to see where everything lands.  I have a feeling that the world economy is about to take a nose dive hardcore and if/when that happens VR will definitely be affected.

Vrika

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

Are you serious?

You were the one who suggested that maybe PSVR headset pre-orders are only 10 units. I think no-one else ever used that number.
  http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/comment/7025229/#Comment_7025229

Now you're taking your own words out of their context into HTC Vive sales, and creating a thread, for the purpose of discussing how you just won against yourself in a debate?

Phry

Vrika said:

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

Are you serious?

You were the one who suggested that maybe PSVR headset pre-orders are only 10 units. I think no-one else ever used that number.
  http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/comment/7025229/#Comment_7025229

Now you're taking your own words out of their context into HTC Vive sales, and creating a thread, for the purpose of discussing how you just won against yourself in a debate?

Whenever i argue with myself, i usually lose!

Muke

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

I got the Vive, imho it is worth it, I don't use it that often anymore tbh, but for most people the close to $1000 pricetag for each VR glasses is too much.
Also the hardware requirements are pretty steep for many.

SEANMCAD

Vrika said:

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

Are you serious?

You were the one who suggested that maybe PSVR headset pre-orders are only 10 units. I think no-one else ever used that number.
  http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/comment/7025229/#Comment_7025229

Now you're taking your own words out of their context into HTC Vive sales, and creating a thread, for the purpose of discussing how you just won against yourself in a debate?

I never suggested any of the VR sales at sell out where anywhere near that low of a number.

Others however did, not this guy

That post was a sarcastic joke how did you not miss that part? or maybe you did and are just being intentionally disruptive? not sure.

The 'tell' is literally the next line that say (by me) 'makes total sense...no wait it doesnt.'

What I dont understand and would LOVE to is your true motovation

SEANMCAD

Phry said:

Vrika said:

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

Are you serious?

You were the one who suggested that maybe PSVR headset pre-orders are only 10 units. I think no-one else ever used that number.
  http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/comment/7025229/#Comment_7025229

Now you're taking your own words out of their context into HTC Vive sales, and creating a thread, for the purpose of discussing how you just won against yourself in a debate?

Whenever i argue with myself, i usually lose!

read LITERALLY the very next line after his quote of me saying....

wait for it...


'makes total sense...no wait it doesnt.'


could be anymore transparent and obvious? I doubt it

Vrika

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

Are you serious?

You were the one who suggested that maybe PSVR headset pre-orders are only 10 units. I think no-one else ever used that number.
  http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/comment/7025229/#Comment_7025229

Now you're taking your own words out of their context into HTC Vive sales, and creating a thread, for the purpose of discussing how you just won against yourself in a debate?

I never suggested any of the VR sales at sell out where anywhere near that low of a number.

Others however did, not this guy

That post was a sarcastic joke how did you not miss that part? or maybe you did and are just being intentionally disruptive? not sure.

The 'tell' is literally the next line that say (by me) 'makes total sense...no wait it doesnt.'

What I dont understand and would LOVE to is your true motovation

When I read OP of this thread, I though you weren't serious about the number 10.

But then you started using that number in argument against me, so apparently you are seriously arguing against that number.

Since you are the only one who ever used that number, I think the conclusion is that whether you planned to do that or not, you have somehow ended up arguing against your own sarcastic joke.


If that's not true, then please prove me wrong by pointing us ignorant people to the post you are arguing against. Or is this more a case of you not knowing what you're arguing against? If that's the case, then I submit you're arguing against your own post.

SEANMCAD

Vrika said:

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

SEANMCAD said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

yeah well considering many said that VR will not sell peroid because if the weight of the headsets (Vive being the heavest) and because of the cost (Vive being the most expensive) and because people said it was clear only 10 where sold it appears its doing better than people here think

Are you serious?

You were the one who suggested that maybe PSVR headset pre-orders are only 10 units. I think no-one else ever used that number.
  http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/comment/7025229/#Comment_7025229

Now you're taking your own words out of their context into HTC Vive sales, and creating a thread, for the purpose of discussing how you just won against yourself in a debate?

I never suggested any of the VR sales at sell out where anywhere near that low of a number.

Others however did, not this guy

That post was a sarcastic joke how did you not miss that part? or maybe you did and are just being intentionally disruptive? not sure.

The 'tell' is literally the next line that say (by me) 'makes total sense...no wait it doesnt.'

What I dont understand and would LOVE to is your true motovation

When I read OP of this thread, I though you weren't serious about the number 10.

But then you started using that number in argument against me, so apparently you are seriously arguing against that number.

Since you are the only one who ever used that number, I think the conclusion is that whether you planned to do that or not, you have somehow ended up arguing against your own sarcastic joke.


If that's not true, then please prove me wrong by pointing us ignorant people to the post you are arguing against. Or is this more a case of you not knowing what you're arguing against? If that's the case, then I submit you're arguing against your own post.

whatever makes you happy I am putting you on ignore.

rertez

Muke said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

I got the Vive, imho it is worth it, I don't use it that often anymore tbh, but for most people the close to $1000 pricetag for each VR glasses is too much.
Also the hardware requirements are pretty steep for many.

I think the main problem with Vive is that it's a full room experience and it demands a lot of space that not all gamers have. And yes on top of that it's more expensive, it's heavier and it's more complicated to set up compared to its competitors. Those who have a full room with Vive installed might have the best experience among gen1 VR products though. I'd personally wait for gen2-3 to see if the whole VR technology can progress towards more convenient and less costly solutions that don't require that much space. As I see them right now these products are not yet meant for everyday use. They are more like demonstrations of something expected to come in years of further development.

SEANMCAD

rertez said:

Muke said:

Vrika said:

Only 140 000 units sold. That's really bad result when games need to be customized for the hardware. No-one is going to make AAA quality games when potential audience is that small.

I got the Vive, imho it is worth it, I don't use it that often anymore tbh, but for most people the close to $1000 pricetag for each VR glasses is too much.
Also the hardware requirements are pretty steep for many.

I think the main problem with Vive is that it's a full room experience and it demands a lot of space that not all gamers have. And yes on top of that it's more expensive, it's heavier and it's more complicated to set up compared to its competitors. Those who have a full room with Vive installed might have the best experience among gen1 VR products though. I'd personally wait for gen2-3 to see if the whole VR technology can progress towards more convenient and less costly solutions that don't require that much space. As I see them right now these products are not yet meant for everyday use. They are more like demonstrations of something expected to come in years of further development.

we dont have the numbers yet for the oculus however according to your logic Vive should be selling the least of its competition, yet its looking like its actually selling the most of its competition.

meaning, the headset that weighs the most, the most expensive and requires the most space appears to likely be outselling its competition which in this case would not be the cell phone versions.

I dont know that it is, but its just a hunch

donger56

I'm more interested in seeing what the sales will be like next year. I know a lot of people that rushed out to buy this stuff just because they are the type of people who have to have the newest gadget. Then you throw in all the content creators on Youtube and Twitch who got them to do reviews and that sort of thing. Right now it doesn't really look like this latest generation of VR is really taking off, but I think its a bit early to call it a flop. I really think its a gimmick and that not enough people are going to really want to have that thing strapped to their face all the time. If the audience remains small then no one is really going to develop much for it. Right now all the games seem to be more of a  VR demo than an actual game with VR support. 

flizzer

I hope it never does catch on since that will be the end of gaming for me.  No way am I wearing headgear to play an MMO. 

SEANMCAD

donger56 said:

I'm more interested in seeing what the sales will be like next year. I know a lot of people that rushed out to buy this stuff just because they are the type of people who have to have the newest gadget. Then you throw in all the content creators on Youtube and Twitch who got them to do reviews and that sort of thing. Right now it doesn't really look like this latest generation of VR is really taking off, but I think its a bit early to call it a flop. I really think its a gimmick and that not enough people are going to really want to have that thing strapped to their face all the time. If the audience remains small then no one is really going to develop much for it. Right now all the games seem to be more of a  VR demo than an actual game with VR support. 

agreed.

it wasnt until literally this month that people I didnt ever expect to know about VR are approaching me and asking questions because they saw an add about it. So i would say...now...is the 'start' of VR being fully deployed to mainstream. Now lets see how they bite

Phry

I don't think sales of the OR, or the Vive are really all that important at this stage, i don't think they are meant for main stream consumption, once we have some kind of an idea of how popular PS-VR is, then we'll likely see a more competitively priced, and lower system requirements 2nd generation of VR for PC. The Vive is a bit too much of a gimmick, the requirements to even set it up are prohibitive, its unlikely many will have a room in their home that will have enough space for it's use, never mind whether they would also be willing to modify the room for the camera's etc. whether the Vive is superior to the other VR options, is largely irrelevant, for most, i doubt its even an option, particularly when you factor in how much it costs to even buy it. No, at this point in time, its down to the success rate of the PSVR and the next generation of VR devices for PC.

Tiller

flizzer said:

I hope it never does catch on since that will be the end of gaming for me.  No way am I wearing headgear to play an MMO. 

I agree though I doubt they will be able to force it down anyone's throats no mater how hard they try. I already wish there was a way to hide these VR titles in Steam and so do a lot of other Steam users as it's a feature people are shouting for there now.

Last thing I want is to be forced into wearing some stupid gadget over my eyes to play a game. Disney put out a Star Wars tech demo that wasn't really a game, only people with VR headsets were able to experience it, which I hope is not telling of their direction in games. Not every game needs to be VR, and if it is you should be able to play without one. For me it's not the price, it's a number of other reasons I can not get behind this tech as mainstream. 

SEANMCAD

Tiller said:

flizzer said:

I hope it never does catch on since that will be the end of gaming for me.  No way am I wearing headgear to play an MMO. 

I agree though I doubt they will be able to force it down anyone's throats no mater how hard they try. I already wish there was a way to hide these VR titles in Steam and so do a lot of other Steam users as it's a feature people are shouting for there now.

Last thing I want is to be forced into wearing some stupid gadget over my eyes to play a game. Disney put out a Star Wars tech demo that wasn't really a game, only people with VR headsets were able to experience it, which I hope is not telling of their direction in games. Not every game needs to be VR, and if it is you should be able to play without one. For me it's not the price, it's a number of other reasons I can not get behind this tech as mainstream. 

I dont think its going to be a problem.

Just like how not everyone has the specs to play Quantum Break it doesnt mean there are not other gaming options. I dont think VR is going to change the landcape of everything radically as some VR fans suggest, I just dont think that means failure either. I think it will be a viable gaming option 

alakram

Well I tried them once and I loved it, it's awesome, but I'm not buying one until there are good games for it, and I supose most people thinks the same.
And of course the price is something that makes you think it twice.

SlyLoK

AR you are our only hope... Yes I went there. Now with reports of plugging it into your PC to piggy back off its power there is really no reason why anyone should be interested in VR.

SEANMCAD said:

Tiller said:

flizzer said:

I hope it never does catch on since that will be the end of gaming for me.  No way am I wearing headgear to play an MMO. 

I agree though I doubt they will be able to force it down anyone's throats no mater how hard they try. I already wish there was a way to hide these VR titles in Steam and so do a lot of other Steam users as it's a feature people are shouting for there now.

Last thing I want is to be forced into wearing some stupid gadget over my eyes to play a game. Disney put out a Star Wars tech demo that wasn't really a game, only people with VR headsets were able to experience it, which I hope is not telling of their direction in games. Not every game needs to be VR, and if it is you should be able to play without one. For me it's not the price, it's a number of other reasons I can not get behind this tech as mainstream. 

I dont think its going to be a problem.

Just like how not everyone has the specs to play Quantum Break it doesnt mean there are not other gaming options. I dont think VR is going to change the landcape of everything radically as some VR fans suggest, I just dont think that means failure either. I think it will be a viable gaming option 

Seems like you have done a complete about face in regards to VR compared to what you were saying a few months ago.

SEANMCAD

SlyLoK said:

AR you are our only hope... Yes I went there. Now with reports of plugging it into your PC to piggy back off its power there is really no reason why anyone should be interested in VR.

SEANMCAD said:

Tiller said:

flizzer said:

I hope it never does catch on since that will be the end of gaming for me.  No way am I wearing headgear to play an MMO. 

I agree though I doubt they will be able to force it down anyone's throats no mater how hard they try. I already wish there was a way to hide these VR titles in Steam and so do a lot of other Steam users as it's a feature people are shouting for there now.

Last thing I want is to be forced into wearing some stupid gadget over my eyes to play a game. Disney put out a Star Wars tech demo that wasn't really a game, only people with VR headsets were able to experience it, which I hope is not telling of their direction in games. Not every game needs to be VR, and if it is you should be able to play without one. For me it's not the price, it's a number of other reasons I can not get behind this tech as mainstream. 

I dont think its going to be a problem.

Just like how not everyone has the specs to play Quantum Break it doesnt mean there are not other gaming options. I dont think VR is going to change the landcape of everything radically as some VR fans suggest, I just dont think that means failure either. I think it will be a viable gaming option 

Seems like you have done a complete about face in regards to VR compared to what you were saying a few months ago.

nope.

my position has always been that VR is not a failure and likely to not be a failure.

Peoples blindless and bias that is so strong all they can see is red took that to mean I think its going to be a success. despite me constantly and repeatedly saying 'no I am suggesting these data points suggest its not going to be a failure' success is an entirely different conversation.

kids think far to bitwise they think its a football game, either success or failure nothing in between.

so again my position is

'vr appears not to be a failure' (that does NOT mean its a success)

EDIT: 'success' in this context meaning a complete and total take over of gaming

gervaise1

140k - worldwide presumably - is not a number that will make retailers rush to get the item on the shelves like e.g. they did with 3D TVs. (I know!) Which won't help sales - seeing what it can do might.

Nor is 140k a number that will make developers sit up, take notice and rush to develop PC games. (EA are not for example).

Is 140k as many as they hoped to sell? Two factors at play here. If they have struggled to develop units this will impact cash flow. However that might be better than having unsold units "lying around" - which would impact return on investment. Any unsold units will weigh on their investment return. (Remember HTC won't get the RRP as well - the retailer will take a slice, taxes etc.)

And to put 140k in perspective Nintendo's Virtual Boy sold 350k in under 4 months - and they canned it due to poor sales.

It points to a rocky road ahead. Which should surprise no one.