Option to spend more?? Horrible idea,sure it works for the developer,it is terrible for the integrity of the game. Do i actually need to post my 3+ paragraphs on the WHY it is bad,i would hope after all the years of seeing cash shops at work that most realize it is a terrible way to run your game. I like that others try to convey the longevity of past subscription games,Everquest 1/2 FFXi...ahem Wow ; ; lol. I might also add that player retention was pretty solid,big time better than what we see in games now a days other than the esport craze but that is a whole other story into the mind of a naive, not so smart gamer.Long story short...people seem t o think they are living the dream,they will become an esport super star..a legend,all they are doing is making a cheap game developer rich...ahem ..cough Hearthstone as an example and all the cheap moba's.Remove th eEsport and those games disappear as fast as they arrived,the ancient relic mmorpg's survived on merit alone.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Guess i also need to explain further into WHY....and present day crap.
The reason certain ideas like subscriptions are not or APPEAR to not be doable is because all these games now are 99% total garbage,of course they could not charge a subscription because they are not good enough to warrant one. I am 100% a firm believer that if you deliver a good game,players will come and will pay a subscription.Personally if a game warranted it,i would pay perhaps as high as 50 bucks a month,just to keep the integrity of the game and cash shop OUT.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
i agree with both dmkano and wizardry even though they are contrary.
I kind of get it. I'd like to agree with Wizardry but the fact is DMKano is speaking the truth when he says:
"Without other ways of generating revenue - pure P2P = suicide"
I'd even go so far to say P2P is suicide period unless you're WoW or a recently released / heavily hyped game. I mean even WoW had to go free to level 20 and introduce their own version of PLEX. And they've had a cash shop for years the way I understand it. It's slowly becoming a freemium title. And EVE went straight up freemium last month so...
I liked 15/mo = Full access to everything while it lasted but it's simply not viable in 2016. Hasn't been for years. Theres more important things to squabble over IMO.
graphically game looks great, combat looks horrible, hope they work on that. I hate combat that doesn't feel interactive. Guy just swings sword, no physical restrictions and no contact made with the monsters
All you have to do in this industry is throw out a few catchwords/phrases and everyone will think its great....In the end it turns out to be something worse than UO and youre left disappointed again.
graphically game looks great, combat looks horrible, hope they work on that. I hate combat that doesn't feel interactive. Guy just swings sword, no physical restrictions and no contact made with the monsters
it basically looks like any random AAA game created in the last 10+ years. i dont get why people keep falling for the exact same game play and literally 'look forward to it'
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
graphically game looks great, combat looks horrible, hope they work on that. I hate combat that doesn't feel interactive. Guy just swings sword, no physical restrictions and no contact made with the monsters
Yeah, I hope that changes as a fleshed out action combat system is what I prefer. It's still in pre alpha so there's still time for them to improve it still. There's a suggestion box in their forum, maybe if people blow it up about these things, they'll come through!?!?
Dude this game idk, it looks like the creator of the game just played a couple hours with the Unreal Engine(which is garbage to begin with). Honestly it must have been hard but it doesn't change the fact that it won't make it. Though it would be a good master thesis or smth xD
Dude this game idk, it looks like the creator of the game just played a couple hours with the Unreal Engine(which is garbage to begin with). Honestly it must have been hard but it doesn't change the fact that it won't make it. Though it would be a good master thesis or smth xD
Those environments look like a whole lot more then a couple hours worth of work to me...
Cash Shop for cosmetic items (So, no required subscription?).
No box fee (No box to sell).
Um... WoW may have gotten away with it because the amount of players it hemorrhaged still left millions to spare. How will a new game get away with this, without players to hemorrhage, much less spare?
Currently Playing:
Fallout 4 (Xbox One)
Puzzle Pirates (PC) Dreadtooth on Emerald Ocean
"Dying's the easy way out. You won't catch me dying. They'll have to kill me before I die!"
I've only ever had one good guild leader. Usually, they're just wannabe elitist, so that's probably my biggest concern with this game; it's being created by a wannabe game creator now. To an extent, I just think a guild leader is less capable of making a game than the average person.
Is noone in this thread aware of horrible scaling and performance issues when UE4 is used in MMOs with lots of players in one area?
I guess not.. heh
Also subscription only model..... HAHAHAHAHAHA .. sorry couldnt help it but that's just hillarious - they do realize it's not 2004 anymore, right?
I would play this if it is decent, sub games are always better when there is no pay 2 win cash shop like all mmos out now. Hopefully it is just popular enough to come out, and keep the worthless rmt clowns away, and maybe just maybe a UO game will be born once again.
I bet you throw away more then 15 dollars worth of stuff every month ...into the Trash hahahah
I do - far more than $15 - but you completely missed my point - I wasn't laughing at the price, $15 is nothing - I was laughing at there be no other options of generating revenue.
Imagine you are a business owner - and you own a store - where each person is only allowed to spend $15 a month - and if they want to spend more, the only option is to wait for another month, or maybe pay in advance for several months.
What is the obvious flaw above - yeah the hard limit on how much each person can spend, right?
It's a HORRIBLE model from the business perspective - putting a hard limit of how much each person can spend is just absurd as disposable incomes vary greatly and some people can afford to drop $1000s every month and not even blink an eye.
A pure subscription model is unsustainable in todays market in vast majority of cases - unless it is supplemented in other ways (like cash shop, DLCs etc...) - because over time playerbase #s decrease - which means without other sources of income - the model only loses money over time - hence unsustainable.
The proof is "in the pudding" as no game has stayed with 100% pure subscription model - all of them have added cash shops, etc...
I bet you throw away more then 15 dollars worth of stuff every month ...into the Trash hahahah
I do - far more than $15 - but you completely missed my point - I wasn't laughing at the price, $15 is nothing - I was laughing at there be no other options of generating revenue.
Imagine you are a business owner - and you own a store - where each person is only allowed to spend $15 a month - and if they want to spend more, the only option is to wait for another month, or maybe pay in advance for several months.
What is the obvious flaw above - yeah the hard limit on how much each person can spend, right?
It's a HORRIBLE model from the business perspective - putting a hard limit of how much each person can spend is just absurd as disposable incomes vary greatly and some people can afford to drop $1000s every month and not even blink an eye.
A pure subscription model is unsustainable in todays market in vast majority of cases - unless it is supplemented in other ways (like cash shop, DLCs etc...) - because over time playerbase #s decrease - which means without other sources of income - the model only loses money over time - hence unsustainable.
The proof is "in the pudding" as no game has stayed with 100% pure subscription model - all of them have added cash shops, etc...
That's what I was laughing about
Unsustainable maybe if your a greedy nut sack, and need to make 1000% profit. Eq project 1999 has had a constant 1000 people, and dont give me no crap about 15000 a month is not a sustainable income. The server to run a game like that, which prolly wont have many people, would only cost like 1000 a month, so yeah... As long as they aren't greedy nut sacks, that need to make 10 mil a year, it is sustainable. Pay 2 win garbage games, like Arche age, BDO, SWTOR, and the rest of that ilk, are designed to get people suckered into gambling, and that is a horrid business model.
Your talk about business makes it sound like its ok to be a immoral bastard, as long as its making you money. I am sure the people who did business with Hitler would agree with you, can't make no damn money only funding one side of the war, gotta do both.
A cash shop in the game does nothing for game integrity. Good or bad. Nothing. It's all about the items and your own view of them.
So when you immerse yourself into a game world where the players create the economy and the crafts,the intregrity is not lost when Joe A gamer shows up with the best of everything on his first day because he simply bought it all from the cash shop?
Hint,you do NOT have a game world or even an immersive one if an outside entity is supplying the players.How can you have or design an economy if it is influenced by unpredictable cash shop ideas?Why do players WORK to get things in a game if they can just buy it,throw the game in the garbage and call it a day?
it would be like all a sudden i am walking around with millions in my pockets,so much money it is falling out as i walk.Someone walks up to me and asks where i got all the money from,i say a money tree,that person says ...SAY WHAT?Oh yeah it doesn't actually exist in this world but i bought it from some magical cash shop in the sky.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
My immersion is not dependent on the payment model. I have no idea how people get their items in the game today, whether they camped them for a year, paid for them or got them from a friend and I really could care less. What another person chooses to do very rarely effects what I choose to do and how I spend my time or money.
No YOU personally do not have a game world or immersion if outside influences bug you. They don't bug me. My immersion is unaffected by them.
I control my immersion. I control what I do, what I feel and generally what I think. Not some silly game or some silly people in a game I will never meet.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
My immersion is not dependent on the payment model. I have no idea how people get their items in the game today, whether they camped them for a year, paid for them or got them from a friend and I really could care less. What another person chooses to do very rarely effects what I choose to do and how I spend my time or money.
No YOU personally do not have a game world or immersion if outside influences bug you. They don't bug me. My immersion is unaffected by them.
I control my immersion. I control what I do, what I feel and generally what I think. Not some silly game or some silly people in a game I will never meet.
Store items should break your immersion. It undoubtedly comes from an external source of the world you are immersed in and that by definition is a complication. Yes, you can simply ignore things going on around you to stay immersed; ignorance is bliss.
You can't participate in an argument that contributes to the overall well being of an MMO for everyone when you're only interested in keeping yourself immersed. The argument of ''What breaks immersion?'' that everyone wants to participating in is under the general assumption that you are a fully self aware person (Only then, can you further your education).
Take this opportunity to put your ability-to-learn at good use and not participate in anymore discussions until you're more aware, less selfish, and dont want to ''control'' things that are clearly above your intellectual capabilities.
Dude this game idk, it looks like the creator of the game just played a couple hours with the Unreal Engine(which is garbage to begin with). Honestly it must have been hard but it doesn't change the fact that it won't make it. Though it would be a good master thesis or smth xD
So, oh great one, which engines aren't garbage...
If you say Unity I will laugh you off this planet.
Definitely has all the features that are underserved in the MMO genre but not extreme with any of them. I like that the game is kinda first person reminds me a bit of EQ1. Looks good.
Not in love with any game that can offer click to move as an option. Also the payment model is going to limit the population by a significant amount...even though subs are popular on this forum. Sub only will kill the game. I saw it with a very functional DFUW game. They couldn't get the free to play in time and the game is dead. Sub only works with WoW and umm AAA MMO's. Just a word of advice for the devs, I'll give it a shot with a sub or not...despite the combat looking less than ideal.
Ultimately my gripes are minimal due to the dying state of this genre. Any new game being made with a small bit of risk vs reward is welcomed.
My immersion is not dependent on the payment model. I have no idea how people get their items in the game today, whether they camped them for a year, paid for them or got them from a friend and I really could care less. What another person chooses to do very rarely effects what I choose to do and how I spend my time or money.
No YOU personally do not have a game world or immersion if outside influences bug you. They don't bug me. My immersion is unaffected by them.
I control my immersion. I control what I do, what I feel and generally what I think. Not some silly game or some silly people in a game I will never meet.
Store items should break your immersion. It undoubtedly comes from an external source of the world you are immersed in and that by definition is a complication. Yes, you can simply ignore things going on around you to stay immersed; ignorance is bliss.
You can't participate in an argument that contributes to the overall well being of an MMO for everyone when you're only interested in keeping yourself immersed. The argument of ''What breaks immersion?'' that everyone wants to participating in is under the general assumption that you are a fully self aware person (Only then, can you further your education).
Take this opportunity to put your ability-to-learn at good use and not participate in anymore discussions until you're more aware, less selfish, and dont want to ''control'' things that are clearly above your intellectual capabilities.
Insults. A sure sign that you really don't have an argument.
Why should store items break my immersion? Because you say so?
I choose what breaks my immersion. Not you.
Ignoring things is what the essence of immersion is. Ignore what is going on around me because I'm concentrating on this. That is immersion.
This line here doesn't even make sense " The argument of ''What breaks immersion?'' that everyone wants to participating in is under the general assumption that you are a fully self aware person (Only then, can you further your education)."
Everyone has their own criteria of immersion. You don't even really need to be self aware for it. I would hope that most humans are self aware though. Although these forums make me wonder.
I can't control other people. I don't know what they like or don't like. I have no intention of telling them what they should like, should not like, how they should play, or what they should do.
I'll leave that to fascists to tell people the things they should like, what should matter to them in entertainment product and what they should do.
Post edited by VengeSunsoar on
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Comments
Horrible idea,sure it works for the developer,it is terrible for the integrity of the game.
Do i actually need to post my 3+ paragraphs on the WHY it is bad,i would hope after all the years of seeing cash shops at work that most realize it is a terrible way to run your game.
I like that others try to convey the longevity of past subscription games,Everquest 1/2 FFXi...ahem Wow ; ; lol.
I might also add that player retention was pretty solid,big time better than what we see in games now a days other than the esport craze but that is a whole other story into the mind of a naive, not so smart gamer.Long story short...people seem t o think they are living the dream,they will become an esport super star..a legend,all they are doing is making a cheap game developer rich...ahem ..cough Hearthstone as an example and all the cheap moba's.Remove th eEsport and those games disappear as fast as they arrived,the ancient relic mmorpg's survived on merit alone.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
The reason certain ideas like subscriptions are not or APPEAR to not be doable is because all these games now are 99% total garbage,of course they could not charge a subscription because they are not good enough to warrant one.
I am 100% a firm believer that if you deliver a good game,players will come and will pay a subscription.Personally if a game warranted it,i would pay perhaps as high as 50 bucks a month,just to keep the integrity of the game and cash shop OUT.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
"Without other ways of generating revenue - pure P2P = suicide"
I'd even go so far to say P2P is suicide period unless you're WoW or a recently released / heavily hyped game. I mean even WoW had to go free to level 20 and introduce their own version of PLEX. And they've had a cash shop for years the way I understand it. It's slowly becoming a freemium title. And EVE went straight up freemium last month so...
I liked 15/mo = Full access to everything while it lasted but it's simply not viable in 2016. Hasn't been for years. Theres more important things to squabble over IMO.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Company Owner
MMO Interactive
Did I read that last part correctly?
(Required?) $15 monthly fee.
Cash Shop for cosmetic items (So, no required subscription?).
No box fee (No box to sell).
Um... WoW may have gotten away with it because the amount of players it hemorrhaged still left millions to spare. How will a new game get away with this, without players to hemorrhage, much less spare?
Currently Playing:
Fallout 4 (Xbox One)
Puzzle Pirates (PC)
Dreadtooth on Emerald Ocean
"Dying's the easy way out. You won't catch me dying. They'll have to kill me before I die!"
Your talk about business makes it sound like its ok to be a immoral bastard, as long as its making you money. I am sure the people who did business with Hitler would agree with you, can't make no damn money only funding one side of the war, gotta do both.
Hint,you do NOT have a game world or even an immersive one if an outside entity is supplying the players.How can you have or design an economy if it is influenced by unpredictable cash shop ideas?Why do players WORK to get things in a game if they can just buy it,throw the game in the garbage and call it a day?
it would be like all a sudden i am walking around with millions in my pockets,so much money it is falling out as i walk.Someone walks up to me and asks where i got all the money from,i say a money tree,that person says ...SAY WHAT?Oh yeah it doesn't actually exist in this world but i bought it from some magical cash shop in the sky.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
No YOU personally do not have a game world or immersion if outside influences bug you. They don't bug me. My immersion is unaffected by them.
I control my immersion. I control what I do, what I feel and generally what I think. Not some silly game or some silly people in a game I will never meet.
You can't participate in an argument that contributes to the overall well being of an MMO for everyone when you're only interested in keeping yourself immersed. The argument of ''What breaks immersion?'' that everyone wants to participating in is under the general assumption that you are a fully self aware person (Only then, can you further your education).
Take this opportunity to put your ability-to-learn at good use and not participate in anymore discussions until you're more aware, less selfish, and dont want to ''control'' things that are clearly above your intellectual capabilities.
If you say Unity I will laugh you off this planet.
~~ postlarval ~~
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Not in love with any game that can offer click to move as an option. Also the payment model is going to limit the population by a significant amount...even though subs are popular on this forum. Sub only will kill the game. I saw it with a very functional DFUW game. They couldn't get the free to play in time and the game is dead. Sub only works with WoW and umm AAA MMO's. Just a word of advice for the devs, I'll give it a shot with a sub or not...despite the combat looking less than ideal.
Ultimately my gripes are minimal due to the dying state of this genre. Any new game being made with a small bit of risk vs reward is welcomed.
I have no idea and no way of finding out. So why worry about it.
Why should store items break my immersion? Because you say so?
I choose what breaks my immersion. Not you.
Ignoring things is what the essence of immersion is. Ignore what is going on around me because I'm concentrating on this. That is immersion.
This line here doesn't even make sense " The argument of ''What breaks immersion?'' that everyone wants to participating in is under the general assumption that you are a fully self aware person (Only then, can you further your education)."
Everyone has their own criteria of immersion. You don't even really need to be self aware for it. I would hope that most humans are self aware though. Although these forums make me wonder.
I can't control other people. I don't know what they like or don't like. I have no intention of telling them what they should like, should not like, how they should play, or what they should do.
I'll leave that to fascists to tell people the things they should like, what should matter to them in entertainment product and what they should do.
http://www.ashesofcreation.com/forums/topic/faqs-about-ashes-of-creation/