As I said, a healthy dose of skepticism is good. Too many people promise the moon, the sun, etc. and deliver road apples.
I agree this is all GREY. But for some it IS black and white, hence why this forum's mess.
I don't expect the great game ever, I never recommended it as that either. I do not defend that SC is going to deliver everything they promised either. I expect a fun game to play and that's it, that's what I buy games for.
That's what you said for the Frontier forums as well.
Anyway, I made the point I wanted, I'll leave you to it.
That's in the list of reasons I left it!
Those poisonous snakes that just wanted to rile people up on discussions so they would breach the forum rules, then it was a circle-jerking of reports. They weren't achieving their goal with me, things started becoming aggressive and uncomfortable, together with the ones who registered one account and/or alt accounts just to attack me, I left.
And it seems those peeps at Frontier are not happy enough with me leaving the forum, they have to come here as well to continue the mud-slinging show!
You come here implying I did that, it is not the truth. I am no longer the toy for those people to circle-jerk around.
That's what you said for the Frontier forums as well.
Anyway, I made the point I wanted, I'll leave you to it.
That's in the list of reasons I left it!
Those poisonous snakes that just wanted to rile people up on discussions so they would breach the forum rules, then it was a circle-jerking of reports. They weren't achieving their goal with me, things started becoming aggressive and uncomfortable, together with the ones who registered one account and/or alt accounts just to attack me, I left.
And it seems peeps at Frontier are not happy enough with me leaving the forum, they have to come here as well to continue the mud-slinging show!
You come here implying I did that, it is not the truth.
Mate, it is the truth, you just don't like it.
Also I've been reading these forums for years, I didn't follow you here, I just recognized you since I also read the Frontier forums (among half a dozen others). Can you please stop being so incredibly arrogant and think everything revolves around you just because I made a comment about you?
"Poisonous snakes?" Jezus... I can see you're quite emotionally involved and it's making me uncomfortable talking to you.
"Poisonous snakes?" Jezus... I can see you're quite emotionally involved and it's making me uncomfortable talking to you.
It is not the truth. You're twisting and being manipulative to attack me with it.
It is not the truth!
You're darn right I'm also uncomfortable, you come here shamelessly attack me and implying things as that, you felt the NEED to do that in here, on this thread. You got a reaction out of me, are you happy now?!
Why don't you go badmouthing me on Frontier? It seems I'm not even there and I just hear back from other people of accusations that X or Y guy is my alt-account. Seriously!
Sovrath said: not sure why the "lol" as your statement was that no half-decent enterprise is going to sit on a pile of cash.
...because you are trying to make an argument by linking random quotes for the web - that alone is "funny", unfortunatelly it just shows your lack of understanding in the matter(no offense).
Majority of the ALL corporate cash reserves is owned by few wealthiest (mostly tech)enterprises on planet.
So unless you are implying that RSI belongs among those, let's say TOP 50, your "point" is moot...
Sovrath said: not sure why the "lol" as your statement was that no half-decent enterprise is going to sit on a pile of cash.
...because you are trying to make an argument by linking random quotes for the web - that alone is "funny", unfortunatelly it just shows your lack of understanding in the matter(no offense).
Majority of the ALL corporate cash reserves is owned by few wealthiest (mostly tech)enterprises on planet.
So unless you are implying that RSI belongs among those, let's say TOP 50, your "point" is moot...
I looked up cash reserves for companies and there are major companies that have cash reserves. You said essentially that companies don't do this, good companies. You are wrong here.
I also look up and found several articles on how much small companies should keep in cash reserves. So "yes" there is discussion on companies having cash reserves.
I've worked for companies that had cash reserves.
In truth I highly doubt you have any understanding in the matter as I really think you just pulled this out of thin air and are just saying things to "say things".
edit: I'll also add that there is a harvard business review article on companies having cash reserves as "companies do have cash reserves".
here let me remind you of your quote that prompted me to find an article on "half decent companies": No half-decent enterprise is going to sit on pile of cash unless it is required by nature of their business.
here you go, read about small businesses and cash reserves.
So 2+ years to deliver more than 1 star system. Damn, that is pathetic. How long is 10 or 20 or 100 going to take?
And then we have the infamous "you don't understand game development". I think you know very well it's not the solar system itself that is taking all this time, it's what's necessary to make it happen on the first place, especially on tech and PG.
As you see on the roadmap they do want to release many of the professions and so forth before even open up a new system, so you can see that's not where their priority is.
Sovrath said: I looked up cash reserves for companies and there are major companies that have cash reserves. You said essentially that companies don't do this, good companies. You are wrong here.
I never said anything of that sort, that is just your insertion.
Sovrath said: I looked up cash reserves for companies and there are major companies that have cash reserves. You said essentially that companies don't do this, good companies. You are wrong here.
I never said anything of that sort, that is just your insertion.
Well, this was your quote, so not sure why you are denying it unless you mean something different by "half-decent enterprise" or "sit on a pile of cash".
No half-decent enterprise is going to sit on pile of cash unless it is required by nature of their business.
And for the record, I'm not saying that Star Citizen's developers "definitely" have this money. Who knows, they can be lying for all we know. But if they claim to have cash on hand then it doesn't fall outside of common sense for a business.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Whoa Whoa Whoa!!!!! I'm not sure WTF has happened before, but I sincerely hope you aren't including me in this list of usual suspects. For me the only web forums other than here I happen to visit are those of IMDB.com, as Rat_Fink, which for the uninitiated is a film discussion site, and Finalgear.com, as Misterzebub which is a car show site.
No no nothing related, this was about something on another forum that ties here. I just got irritated with that accusation thrown against me here, that is simply untrue.
Sovrath said: Well, this was your quote, so not sure why you are denying it unless you mean something different by "half-decent enterprise" or "sit on a pile of cash".
Read stuff you are posting...
In your last link, the cash reserves for listed businesses were estimated to last not even a month. However that isn't the case here, your 24M or Robert's "reserve to finish the game" is no cash reserve, it would be useless pile of cash to sit on, in case of RSI, a freaking huge pile and fall completely "outside of common sense for a business".
That's what you said for the Frontier forums as well.
Anyway, I made the point I wanted, I'll leave you to it.
I'm pretty sure you have the wrong Max. This Max has stated repeatedly that he hates drama. I'm absolutely positive you will never see him posting in a "drama" thread...........yeah.
DKLond said: However, he's said countless times before - that they're going to adjust both the scope and the manpower continously - so even IF the money stopped coming AND SQ42 profit didn't come along - Star Citizen would still be released, only with an adjusted scope.
Yup it's all a matter of plan ahead, if there's too much pressure there's the need to cut both in staff and the game's scope to get a commercial release and worry about continuing development afterwards.
The point is the game is currently doing just fine, also shown by the company continuous growing on employee counts that they do have the money to spend, so shows the health of the crowdfunding that once again beaten the record of funding previously beaten on 2015.
This is why the doomsday preachers get so frustrated, they've been announcing the imminent collapse of the project for almost 2 years now "this time is for realz!".
Totally agree, the mystic megs surrounding this game started sounding like a demented Chicken Little a year ago. That said, that does not mean those of you who are interested in this game as something other than a train wreck should give the company a free pass every time a deadline is missed. Backers, the people who really want this game to succeed and are willing to put their money where their mouth is are the people that really matter to this project. Alienating them by taking too long to make their dreams come true could be truly devastating to the project as a whole. I see the "it will be finished when its finished" mind set to be the true potential landmine in this game's road to success. Why? Because they're doing this shit with other people's money and clearly need the continued good will and patronage of donors to see the project through. That good will gets pushed too far and drys up, the game project could actually end up deeply fucked. I for one don't want to see that happen.
What do you mean by giving them a pass?
If you look at big and ambitious AAA games during the history of the industry - how many of them would you say have been delayed?
I'd say at least 7-8 out 10 - based on my 34 years of being a passionate gamer following the industry.
Now, some of those have been shorter delays - but a lot have been longer delays.
Also, lest we forget, those other games have been under IMMENSE publisher pressure - which means delays are NOT given "a pass" internally. Even so, they happen constantly.
Every single delay in this context means people bitch and moan about it. They always do that - and I used to do that a lot, too.
Then I realised that the only thing that really matters - and I mean the ONLY thing - is that the game is released and that it's good. After that, the delays are completely and utterly forgotten - or certainly put in the "trivial facts" box by almost everyone who cares about playing good games.
Giving a pass or not giving a pass means absolutely nothing here.
These arent delays. They are in year 6 and they are still in the concept phase.
Year 6? Pray tell what was going on over 5 years ago - almost a year before the KS was launched. CR coding SC alone perhaps? Gee what an incredible guy CR is! Glad you mentioned it.
These arent delays. They are in year 6 and they are still in the concept phase.
Year 6? Pray tell what was going on over 5 years ago - almost a year before the KS was launched. CR coding SC alone perhaps? Gee what an incredible guy CR is! Glad you mentioned it.
Yes, and let's not also conveniently forget how both the scope and the team exploded due to massive popularity as well as backer stipulation
The current scope of Star Citizen with a sufficiently capable team has had little more than 2 years in development, beyond the concept/design stage. If that.
Considering it's probably the most ambitious computer game of all time, that's not a whole lot.
Comments
It is not a mess - give respect, get respect. After all, opinions are like A&^holes, everyone has one and they all smell.
Anyway, I made the point I wanted, I'll leave you to it.
..Cake..
Those poisonous snakes that just wanted to rile people up on discussions so they would breach the forum rules, then it was a circle-jerking of reports. They weren't achieving their goal with me, things started becoming aggressive and uncomfortable, together with the ones who registered one account and/or alt accounts just to attack me, I left.
And it seems those peeps at Frontier are not happy enough with me leaving the forum, they have to come here as well to continue the mud-slinging show!
You come here implying I did that, it is not the truth.
I am no longer the toy for those people to circle-jerk around.
Also I've been reading these forums for years, I didn't follow you here, I just recognized you since I also read the Frontier forums (among half a dozen others).
Can you please stop being so incredibly arrogant and think everything revolves around you just because I made a comment about you?
"Poisonous snakes?" Jezus... I can see you're quite emotionally involved and it's making me uncomfortable talking to you.
..Cake..
It is not the truth!
You're darn right I'm also uncomfortable, you come here shamelessly attack me and implying things as that, you felt the NEED to do that in here, on this thread. You got a reaction out of me, are you happy now?!
Why don't you go badmouthing me on Frontier? It seems I'm not even there and I just hear back from other people of accusations that X or Y guy is my alt-account. Seriously!
Thanks, Chris Robert Space Industries (lol)
Maybe we should rather wait until 3.0 releases and kill each other in-game?
..Cake..
The only way this game will ever be released is if people stop giving them money.
Multiple solar systems is roadmapped to Alpha 4.0.
Mechanics & Professions first, systems later.
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/schedule-report
(bottom of page).
Majority of the ALL corporate cash reserves is owned by few wealthiest (mostly tech)enterprises on planet.
So unless you are implying that RSI belongs among those, let's say TOP 50, your "point" is moot...
So 2+ years to deliver more than 1 star system. Damn, that is pathetic.
How long is 10 or 20 or 100 going to take?
I also look up and found several articles on how much small companies should keep in cash reserves. So "yes" there is discussion on companies having cash reserves.
I've worked for companies that had cash reserves.
In truth I highly doubt you have any understanding in the matter as I really think you just pulled this out of thin air and are just saying things to "say things".
edit: I'll also add that there is a harvard business review article on companies having cash reserves as "companies do have cash reserves".
here let me remind you of your quote that prompted me to find an article on "half decent companies": No half-decent enterprise is going to sit on pile of cash unless it is required by nature of their business.
here you go, read about small businesses and cash reserves.
http://www.businessnewsdaily.com/9437-small-business-cash-reserves.html
There are lots of others.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
As you see on the roadmap they do want to release many of the professions and so forth before even open up a new system, so you can see that's not where their priority is.
No half-decent enterprise is going to sit on pile of cash unless it is required by nature of their business.
And for the record, I'm not saying that Star Citizen's developers "definitely" have this money. Who knows, they can be lying for all we know. But if they claim to have cash on hand then it doesn't fall outside of common sense for a business.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
In your last link, the cash reserves for listed businesses were estimated to last not even a month. However that isn't the case here, your 24M or Robert's "reserve to finish the game" is no cash reserve, it would be useless pile of cash to sit on, in case of RSI, a freaking huge pile and fall completely "outside of common sense for a business".
If you look at big and ambitious AAA games during the history of the industry - how many of them would you say have been delayed?
I'd say at least 7-8 out 10 - based on my 34 years of being a passionate gamer following the industry.
Now, some of those have been shorter delays - but a lot have been longer delays.
Also, lest we forget, those other games have been under IMMENSE publisher pressure - which means delays are NOT given "a pass" internally. Even so, they happen constantly.
Every single delay in this context means people bitch and moan about it. They always do that - and I used to do that a lot, too.
Then I realised that the only thing that really matters - and I mean the ONLY thing - is that the game is released and that it's good. After that, the delays are completely and utterly forgotten - or certainly put in the "trivial facts" box by almost everyone who cares about playing good games.
Giving a pass or not giving a pass means absolutely nothing here.
All games under development will have things that are still in concept.
Star Citizen has many things out of concept in-so-far as they're playable right now.
That said, even if nothing was playable - the delays would still be delays.
CR coding SC alone perhaps? Gee what an incredible guy CR is! Glad you mentioned it.
The current scope of Star Citizen with a sufficiently capable team has had little more than 2 years in development, beyond the concept/design stage. If that.
Considering it's probably the most ambitious computer game of all time, that's not a whole lot.