The hardest part is WHAT patch are they going to go for? Is it going to be 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, etc?
...what makes you think it will be vanilla version at all?
Great question, it could be vanilla like in terms of gameplay but actually be Classic version 1.00.01.
I feel like since it's going to be rebuilt from the ground up, we will end up getting a basic vanilla structure with none of the bugs (hopefully) in the modern engine. I'm hoping they retain all of the vanilla stats and quests and such.
I'm also wondering now, if this is how they are making the servers, does this mean it might have a oldschool runescape update system? Where they have a separate team working on vanilla updates, and adding new content to the vanilla structure instead of just releasing expansions in order? That would be really cool in my opinion.
Not sure but I Don't believe they would be releasing any of the expansions to classic. I would think that once 1.12 hits they would stop with major updates and just keep it as is, otherwise it would no longer be classic.
The further they deviate from Vanilla, the less point there will be in doing it at all. The people who want this want an authentic vanilla experience, not some re-imagined project with new content and changes and other added features. If this project fails to capture the Vanilla experience, people will just go back to the private servers and the entire thing will have been a waste.
The further they deviate from Vanilla, the less point there will be in doing it at all. The people who want this want an authentic vanilla experience, not some re-imagined project with new content and changes and other added features. If this project fails to capture the Vanilla experience, people will just go back to the private servers and the entire thing will have been a waste.
That really depends though. You cannot just leave it at a specific patch and never introduce new content. Which is why I'm saying it could be like OSRS where they just create new content for the vanilla base. Instead of evolving over time into the easy face roll the current game is, they could evolve it to stay difficult and retain the players who want that experience.
You can only keep the same content for so long. Otherwise players get bored and leave. Me personally I want the vanilla experience, but then I hope they add on to it.
With OSRS it started with just the 2007scape base, then they added onto it over time keeping the game systems the same and not deviating like the current modern game did, and have slowly grown in playercount taking over more of the concurrent players than the actual real game does.
The hardest part is WHAT patch are they going to go for? Is it going to be 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, etc?
...what makes you think it will be vanilla version at all?
Great question, it could be vanilla like in terms of gameplay but actually be Classic version 1.00.01.
I feel like since it's going to be rebuilt from the ground up, we will end up getting a basic vanilla structure with none of the bugs (hopefully) in the modern engine. I'm hoping they retain all of the vanilla stats and quests and such.
I'm also wondering now, if this is how they are making the servers, does this mean it might have a oldschool runescape update system? Where they have a separate team working on vanilla updates, and adding new content to the vanilla structure instead of just releasing expansions in order? That would be really cool in my opinion.
Those are good points and bring up good questions.
Will classic be based on a Vanilla (or BC or Wrath) version as a foundation and then modified? What does classic mean to Blizz? Will they be static with no new content or progression or will they be progression based and open up some new classes, races, and features over time? What will be changed from early versions in translation to classic and why? What will stay the same? Those are the things I'll like to see them detail over the next few months.
and what is all this 'UI design' about.
to me that is kinda bigly. You want to 'update' my graphics and do some work on the UI for my classic experience?
So I guess this is the lesser known "I want dated graphics" argument? Are you actually suggesting that the majority of people who want a classic WoW server want it with dated graphics, frustrating defects, dated UIs, etc? Personally, the argument I generally hear is "I wish they'd just update the graphics and re-release it."
Even if they were considering just blowing the dust off the old code and re-releasing it, what makes you think it would even run? What about bots? Do you want the old bot code too? Did you want them to update that code? Or leave it the way it was? How about streaming? What about chat?
I think that your argument is very short-sighted. You're forgetting about all the quality-of-life advancements that have been implemented over the span of 13 years. With all due respect, I think that you'd hear many more cries of hatred if they simply re-released the 2004 code and said "have at it".
The further they deviate from Vanilla, the less point there will be in doing it at all. The people who want this want an authentic vanilla experience, not some re-imagined project with new content and changes and other added features. If this project fails to capture the Vanilla experience, people will just go back to the private servers and the entire thing will have been a waste.
....so you say there are none who want "polished" vanilla experience?
The further they deviate from Vanilla, the less point there will be in doing it at all. The people who want this want an authentic vanilla experience, not some re-imagined project with new content and changes and other added features. If this project fails to capture the Vanilla experience, people will just go back to the private servers and the entire thing will have been a waste.
....so you say there are none who want "polished" vanilla experience?
Polished, as in no bugs and the like, yes. I don't think many people want new features, removed features, aspects from later xpacs, etc. At that point it's no longer classic WoW. From my understanding, the private classic servers that have a big following basically have a very authentic Vanilla experience.
The further they deviate from Vanilla, the less point there will be in doing it at all. The people who want this want an authentic vanilla experience, not some re-imagined project with new content and changes and other added features. If this project fails to capture the Vanilla experience, people will just go back to the private servers and the entire thing will have been a waste.
....so you say there are none who want "polished" vanilla experience?
I think the problem is what to polish and how to polish is different.
Many people might say 'I want a polished version' and if Blizzard says 'we are making a polished version' they think GREAT...that is what I want. but what is polish in one persons mind could be radically different from what Blizzard is thinking.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
The further they deviate from Vanilla, the less point there will be in doing it at all. The people who want this want an authentic vanilla experience, not some re-imagined project with new content and changes and other added features. If this project fails to capture the Vanilla experience, people will just go back to the private servers and the entire thing will have been a waste.
....so you say there are none who want "polished" vanilla experience?
Welcome to the can of worms Blizzard opened with confirming classic servers. No matter what they do SOMEONE is going to be unhappy with what they release. And now that there are classic servers it opens people up to wanting progression, and BC, and Wrath servers. Thing is this type of thing won't ever end.
"Brack says that, as much as Blizzard has been aware of the desires of their community, until recently they just couldn’t see a way to make it happen. "The original problem was that we would have to run two MMOs," he says. "We would have to run Classic WoW, and then current WoW [at the same time]. Classic WoW and current WoW really don’t work the same way any more. Classic WoW has all kinds of bugs and problems, it has all kinds of exploits and hacks that everyone knows about. And in current WoW, we’d done an excellent job of reducing all of those problems, and we didn’t see how we could possibly run two MMOs like this."
The problem is one that goes much deeper than the surface, down to the very base-level programming and hardware that Vanilla World of Warcraft used in 2003. To run Classic servers, Blizzard would have to build an entirely separate server and client architecture different to the current version World of Warcraft uses today. It would mean running two separate, very large MMOs at the same time—a massive technical challenge. Their new solution is still challenging, but Brack says the team has made a breakthrough."
It then goes on to say:
""We think we have a way to run the Classic servers on the modern technical infrastructure," Brack says. "The infrastructure is how we spin up instances and continents, how the database works. It’s those core fundamental pieces, and running two MMOs of that size is a daunting problem. But now we think we have a way to have the old WoW version work on the modern infrastructure and feel really good.""
I wouldn't panic if they modernised it a bit. They did it with the Starcraft 1 remaster and they changed literally nothing about the gameplay. It just looked better and worked better on modern computers. So, give them the benefit of the doubt for now I say.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
The hardest part is WHAT patch are they going to go for? Is it going to be 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, etc?
...what makes you think it will be vanilla version at all?
Great question, it could be vanilla like in terms of gameplay but actually be Classic version 1.00.01.
If you read the job posting, it says:
"Travel Back in Time to a World of Warcraft before the Mists of Pandaria parted, and before Deathwing broke the world. When Blackrock Mountain, the Temple of Ahn’Qiraj, and the floating citadel of Naxxramas were the most difficult challenges in Azeroth."
Naxxramas. That's what, 1.6? WoWHeads feel free to correct me on that.
That answers the question of when Classic WoW is. Argue, of course, because that's surely much more fun.
The hardest part is WHAT patch are they going to go for? Is it going to be 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, etc?
...what makes you think it will be vanilla version at all?
Great question, it could be vanilla like in terms of gameplay but actually be Classic version 1.00.01.
If you read the job posting, it says:
"Travel Back in Time to a World of Warcraft before the Mists of Pandaria parted, and before Deathwing broke the world. When Blackrock Mountain, the Temple of Ahn’Qiraj, and the floating citadel of Naxxramas were the most difficult challenges in Azeroth."
Naxxramas. That's what, 1.6? WoWHeads feel free to correct me on that.
That answers the question of when Classic WoW is. Argue, of course, because that's surely much more fun.
Naxx was in the last patch or second to last. Either way the changes to classes was different at that point than what was introduced on release.
EDIT: it was patch 1.11, second to last patch before Burning Crusade. A lot was changed between 1.0 and 1.11, in fact I think, up to that point, every class had been through balances and tweak to their design.
"Brack says that, as much as Blizzard has been aware of the desires of their community, until recently they just couldn’t see a way to make it happen. "The original problem was that we would have to run two MMOs," he says. "We would have to run Classic WoW, and then current WoW [at the same time]. Classic WoW and current WoW really don’t work the same way any more. Classic WoW has all kinds of bugs and problems, it has all kinds of exploits and hacks that everyone knows about. And in current WoW, we’d done an excellent job of reducing all of those problems, and we didn’t see how we could possibly run two MMOs like this."
The problem is one that goes much deeper than the surface, down to the very base-level programming and hardware that Vanilla World of Warcraft used in 2003. To run Classic servers, Blizzard would have to build an entirely separate server and client architecture different to the current version World of Warcraft uses today. It would mean running two separate, very large MMOs at the same time—a massive technical challenge. Their new solution is still challenging, but Brack says the team has made a breakthrough."
It then goes on to say:
""We think we have a way to run the Classic servers on the modern technical infrastructure," Brack says. "The infrastructure is how we spin up instances and continents, how the database works. It’s those core fundamental pieces, and running two MMOs of that size is a daunting problem. But now we think we have a way to have the old WoW version work on the modern infrastructure and feel really good.""
So, yes. There will be significant core systems recoding to run on "modern technical infrastructure".
One point he made is excellent. regarding bugs and exploits, reason is you have to factor in all the fixes while at the same time not introducing new content that existed when those fixes where in place and your patches might not work that way.
however this whole bit of 'its hard to run two MMOs' is annoying.
What he means to say is 'running two MMOs on the same hardware. They could very well run classic on an completely different physical farm. I can understand why they would not want to do that but it is a choice its not that 'running two MMOs is a technical juggernaut of a challenge' its running two on the same system that is the challenge.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Completely different target market than the group who has been wanting vanilla servers.
...so?
You are stuck in the loop of this black & white perception that there are either vanilla purists or those who like latest itteration of WoW, nothing else exists.
The pure vanilla private servers have been the most popular. Those people are the ones who have been asking for a vanilla server time and time again for years. Their persistence is in large part the reason that this is happening.
The pure vanilla private servers have been the most popular. Those people are the ones who have been asking for a vanilla server time and time again for years. Their persistence is in large part the reason that this is happening.
wait..private pure vanilla servers already exist.
good to know, I did not know that.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
The pure vanilla private servers have been the most popular.
...do you know what servers were even more popular?
We have been through that already....
Does it matter?
"Brack says they’re committed to recreating an authentic Vanilla World of Warcraft experience."
"Brack is clear that using modern server architecture doesn’t mean that these Classic servers will have the same features that current World of Warcraft does. There won’t be cross-realm servers or Looking For Raid and Dungeon Finder automatic party matchmaking."
"I think there will be a lot of tourists," he adds. "But it doesn’t matter what I think because once we’re committed to doing this at a Blizzard level, which we are, whatever happens is going to happen. If millions of people show up and play for years, that’s awesome. And if just tens of people show up and play for years, we’re fine either way. What’s important to us is that we have this Classic experience people can enjoy, that people do have the opportunity to go back to."
The pure vanilla private servers have been the most popular.
...do you know what servers were even more popular?
We have been through that already....
Does it matter?
"Brack says they’re committed to recreating an authentic Vanilla World of Warcraft experience."
"Brack is clear that using modern server architecture doesn’t mean that these Classic servers will have the same features that current World of Warcraft does. There won’t be cross-realm servers or Looking For Raid and Dungeon Finder automatic party matchmaking."
"I think there will be a lot of tourists," he adds. "But it doesn’t matter what I think because once we’re committed to doing this at a Blizzard level, which we are, whatever happens is going to happen. If millions of people show up and play for years, that’s awesome. And if just tens of people show up and play for years, we’re fine either way. What’s important to us is that we have this Classic experience people can enjoy, that people do have the opportunity to go back to."
The pure vanilla private servers have been the most popular.
...do you know what servers were even more popular?
We have been through that already....
Does it matter?
"Brack says they’re committed to recreating an authentic Vanilla World of Warcraft experience."
"Brack is clear that using modern server architecture doesn’t mean that these Classic servers will have the same features that current World of Warcraft does. There won’t be cross-realm servers or Looking For Raid and Dungeon Finder automatic party matchmaking."
"I think there will be a lot of tourists," he adds. "But it doesn’t matter what I think because once we’re committed to doing this at a Blizzard level, which we are, whatever happens is going to happen. If millions of people show up and play for years, that’s awesome. And if just tens of people show up and play for years, we’re fine either way. What’s important to us is that we have this Classic experience people can enjoy, that people do have the opportunity to go back to."
Comments
Not sure but I Don't believe they would be releasing any of the expansions to classic. I would think that once 1.12 hits they would stop with major updates and just keep it as is, otherwise it would no longer be classic.
You can only keep the same content for so long. Otherwise players get bored and leave. Me personally I want the vanilla experience, but then I hope they add on to it.
With OSRS it started with just the 2007scape base, then they added onto it over time keeping the game systems the same and not deviating like the current modern game did, and have slowly grown in playercount taking over more of the concurrent players than the actual real game does.
So I guess this is the lesser known "I want dated graphics" argument? Are you actually suggesting that the majority of people who want a classic WoW server want it with dated graphics, frustrating defects, dated UIs, etc? Personally, the argument I generally hear is "I wish they'd just update the graphics and re-release it."
Even if they were considering just blowing the dust off the old code and re-releasing it, what makes you think it would even run? What about bots? Do you want the old bot code too? Did you want them to update that code? Or leave it the way it was? How about streaming? What about chat?
I think that your argument is very short-sighted. You're forgetting about all the quality-of-life advancements that have been implemented over the span of 13 years. With all due respect, I think that you'd hear many more cries of hatred if they simply re-released the 2004 code and said "have at it".
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
Many people might say 'I want a polished version' and if Blizzard says 'we are making a polished version' they think GREAT...that is what I want. but what is polish in one persons mind could be radically different from what Blizzard is thinking.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
"Brack says that, as much as Blizzard has been aware of the desires of their community, until recently they just couldn’t see a way to make it happen. "The original problem was that we would have to run two MMOs," he says. "We would have to run Classic WoW, and then current WoW [at the same time]. Classic WoW and current WoW really don’t work the same way any more. Classic WoW has all kinds of bugs and problems, it has all kinds of exploits and hacks that everyone knows about. And in current WoW, we’d done an excellent job of reducing all of those problems, and we didn’t see how we could possibly run two MMOs like this."
The problem is one that goes much deeper than the surface, down to the very base-level programming and hardware that Vanilla World of Warcraft used in 2003. To run Classic servers, Blizzard would have to build an entirely separate server and client architecture different to the current version World of Warcraft uses today. It would mean running two separate, very large MMOs at the same time—a massive technical challenge. Their new solution is still challenging, but Brack says the team has made a breakthrough."
It then goes on to say:
""We think we have a way to run the Classic servers on the modern technical infrastructure," Brack says. "The infrastructure is how we spin up instances and continents, how the database works. It’s those core fundamental pieces, and running two MMOs of that size is a daunting problem. But now we think we have a way to have the old WoW version work on the modern infrastructure and feel really good.""
Read the whole thing here: http://www.pcgamer.com/this-is-how-blizzard-plans-to-finally-bring-back-vanilla-wow-servers/
So, yes. There will be significant core systems recoding to run on "modern technical infrastructure".
If you read the job posting, it says:
"Travel Back in Time to a World of Warcraft before the Mists of Pandaria parted, and before Deathwing broke the world. When Blackrock Mountain, the Temple of Ahn’Qiraj, and the floating citadel of Naxxramas were the most difficult challenges in Azeroth."
Naxxramas. That's what, 1.6? WoWHeads feel free to correct me on that.
That answers the question of when Classic WoW is. Argue, of course, because that's surely much more fun.
EDIT: it was patch 1.11, second to last patch before Burning Crusade. A lot was changed between 1.0 and 1.11, in fact I think, up to that point, every class had been through balances and tweak to their design.
however this whole bit of 'its hard to run two MMOs' is annoying. What he means to say is 'running two MMOs on the same hardware. They could very well run classic on an completely different physical farm. I can understand why they would not want to do that but it is a choice its not that 'running two MMOs is a technical juggernaut of a challenge' its running two on the same system that is the challenge.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
You are stuck in the loop of this black & white perception that there are either vanilla purists or those who like latest itteration of WoW, nothing else exists.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
good to know, I did not know that.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
We have been through that already....
"Brack says they’re committed to recreating an authentic Vanilla World of Warcraft experience."
"Brack is clear that using modern server architecture doesn’t mean that these Classic servers will have the same features that current World of Warcraft does. There won’t be cross-realm servers or Looking For Raid and Dungeon Finder automatic party matchmaking."
"I think there will be a lot of tourists," he adds. "But it doesn’t matter what I think because once we’re committed to doing this at a Blizzard level, which we are, whatever happens is going to happen. If millions of people show up and play for years, that’s awesome. And if just tens of people show up and play for years, we’re fine either way. What’s important to us is that we have this Classic experience people can enjoy, that people do have the opportunity to go back to."
http://www.pcgamer.com/this-is-how-blizzard-plans-to-finally-bring-back-vanilla-wow-servers/
How much more clear can they make it.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
if that is true, why is this such a hard project?
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
We have been through that already, why going back?
I read "It’s a big project" "It’s a larger endeavor than people might imagine"
http://www.pcgamer.com/this-is-how-blizzard-plans-to-finally-bring-back-vanilla-wow-servers/
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee