Big Pledge Package = p2w?

Lurv

I see there's packages going well above $1,000 to $10k. Are these people going to be superior to the $50 pledge players? Is this going to have a p2w effect? Need to know before I drop any money on this. If some guy is gonna drop $5k just to be way ahead and superior to me then hell with that.

MagikarpsGhost

best thing to do is to compare the two.

Ascendant's Pledge

$10,000

• Unlimited VIP Access
• Alpha access
• Beta access
• Early name reservation
• 2 Digital copies of the game
• Additional character slot
• Game Title: Pantheon Explorer
• Stack of Minor Illusion Flasks
• Explorer's Backpack
• Tunic of the Ages
• Keepsake Vanity Pet
• Ring of the Fallen
• 5 item renaming vouchers
• Name appears in game credits
• Lifetime Game Subscription
• Invite to Founder's Guild
• Digital Lore and Art Book
• In game Ascendant nameplate
• Terminus Cloth Map
• Postcard From Team
• Tester credit in game credits
• Tester forum tag
• Limited Edition Framed Print
• Pre-Alpha Tester access*
• Design dungeon or raid
  with design team

that is what it gives you, nothing really GAME advancing, I mean for that price the life time sub is the least they can do lol.

Brunlin

Lurv said:

I see there's packages going well above $1,000 to $10k. Are these people going to be superior to the $50 pledge players? Is this going to have a p2w effect? Need to know before I drop any money on this. If some guy is gonna drop $5k just to be way ahead and superior to me then hell with that.

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/#vip

 You could just read what it gives you and make your mind up yourself as they are very transparent on the bonuses that you get. 

Its typical these days for games that ask for pledges to have some extremely insane pledging options outside of the normal packages. Its for the whales out there,and I cant say that I blame them. In todays market where you have peeps dumping 1k on their favorite streamer like Ninja while playing Fortnite, very much proves there are players with a ton of money that dont mind parting with it on a streamer or a game that they like. So if you are a game developer asking for pledges,you want to offer the whales something to encourage them to depart with their money. At the same time you dont want to alienate your community. Im sure its a fine line that they are walking.

 I myself, will not pledge. I am planning on playing this game, but I am ok with waiting for the game to release, than buying it for box price and subbing from there.

 All I know is if I had 10k to drop on a game it better have a cruise or a very good family vacation package bundled in with it... ROTFLMAO!!!!

 

Albatroes

What's the difference between the VIP access and the sub?

blamo2000

Brunlin said:

Lurv said:

I see there's packages going well above $1,000 to $10k. Are these people going to be superior to the $50 pledge players? Is this going to have a p2w effect? Need to know before I drop any money on this. If some guy is gonna drop $5k just to be way ahead and superior to me then hell with that.

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/#vip

 You could just read what it gives you and make your mind up yourself as they are very transparent on the bonuses that you get. 

Its typical these days for games that ask for pledges to have some extremely insane pledging options outside of the normal packages. Its for the whales out there,and I cant say that I blame them. In todays market where you have peeps dumping 1k on their favorite streamer like Ninja while playing Fortnite, very much proves there are players with a ton of money that dont mind parting with it on a streamer or a game that they like. So if you are a game developer asking for pledges,you want to offer the whales something to encourage them to depart with their money. At the same time you dont want to alienate your community. Im sure its a fine line that they are walking.

 I myself, will not pledge. I am planning on playing this game, but I am ok with waiting for the game to release, than buying it for box price and subbing from there.

 All I know is if I had 10k to drop on a game it better have a cruise or a very good family vacation package bundled in with it... ROTFLMAO!!!!

 

Why would someone pay 1k to someone they watch play videogames?  These people shouldn't be called whales.  Whales pay money to make themselves more powerful in games they play.  People that send 1k willy-nilly to people they watch play games are called insane retards.  

Kyleran

blamo2000 said:

Brunlin said:

Lurv said:

I see there's packages going well above $1,000 to $10k. Are these people going to be superior to the $50 pledge players? Is this going to have a p2w effect? Need to know before I drop any money on this. If some guy is gonna drop $5k just to be way ahead and superior to me then hell with that.

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/#vip

 You could just read what it gives you and make your mind up yourself as they are very transparent on the bonuses that you get. 

Its typical these days for games that ask for pledges to have some extremely insane pledging options outside of the normal packages. Its for the whales out there,and I cant say that I blame them. In todays market where you have peeps dumping 1k on their favorite streamer like Ninja while playing Fortnite, very much proves there are players with a ton of money that dont mind parting with it on a streamer or a game that they like. So if you are a game developer asking for pledges,you want to offer the whales something to encourage them to depart with their money. At the same time you dont want to alienate your community. Im sure its a fine line that they are walking.

 I myself, will not pledge. I am planning on playing this game, but I am ok with waiting for the game to release, than buying it for box price and subbing from there.

 All I know is if I had 10k to drop on a game it better have a cruise or a very good family vacation package bundled in with it... ROTFLMAO!!!!

 

Why would someone pay 1k to someone they watch play videogames?  These people shouldn't be called whales.  Whales pay money to make themselves more powerful in games they play.  People that send 1k willy-nilly to people they watch play games are called insane retards.  

I dunno, seems a lot less insane than people who buy these, which are for 1 Game and don't even include the price of airfare and hotels.

Super Bowl 52 ticket prices

Website	Low	High
SeatGeek	$3,380	$55,000
Vivid Seats	$3,441	$57,306
StubHub	$3,550	$66,655
NFL Exchange	$4,290	$40,000

Face it, there are a lot of people who are flipping rich, and they spend money on things the average Joe either can't or won't. 

Ungood

Kyleran said:

blamo2000 said:

Brunlin said:

Lurv said:

I see there's packages going well above $1,000 to $10k. Are these people going to be superior to the $50 pledge players? Is this going to have a p2w effect? Need to know before I drop any money on this. If some guy is gonna drop $5k just to be way ahead and superior to me then hell with that.

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/#vip

 You could just read what it gives you and make your mind up yourself as they are very transparent on the bonuses that you get. 

Its typical these days for games that ask for pledges to have some extremely insane pledging options outside of the normal packages. Its for the whales out there,and I cant say that I blame them. In todays market where you have peeps dumping 1k on their favorite streamer like Ninja while playing Fortnite, very much proves there are players with a ton of money that dont mind parting with it on a streamer or a game that they like. So if you are a game developer asking for pledges,you want to offer the whales something to encourage them to depart with their money. At the same time you dont want to alienate your community. Im sure its a fine line that they are walking.

 I myself, will not pledge. I am planning on playing this game, but I am ok with waiting for the game to release, than buying it for box price and subbing from there.

 All I know is if I had 10k to drop on a game it better have a cruise or a very good family vacation package bundled in with it... ROTFLMAO!!!!

 

Why would someone pay 1k to someone they watch play videogames?  These people shouldn't be called whales.  Whales pay money to make themselves more powerful in games they play.  People that send 1k willy-nilly to people they watch play games are called insane retards.  

I dunno, seems a lot less insane than people who buy these, which are for 1 Game and don't even include the price of airfare and hotels.

Super Bowl 52 ticket prices

Website	Low	High
SeatGeek	$3,380	$55,000
Vivid Seats	$3,441	$57,306
StubHub	$3,550	$66,655
NFL Exchange	$4,290	$40,000

Face it, there are a lot of people who are flipping rich, and they spend money on things the average Joe either can't or won't. 

Keep in mind, not all these people are rich, some of them are middle, they just save up for these things.

Kyleran

Ungood said:

Kyleran said:

blamo2000 said:

Brunlin said:

Lurv said:

I see there's packages going well above $1,000 to $10k. Are these people going to be superior to the $50 pledge players? Is this going to have a p2w effect? Need to know before I drop any money on this. If some guy is gonna drop $5k just to be way ahead and superior to me then hell with that.

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/#vip

 You could just read what it gives you and make your mind up yourself as they are very transparent on the bonuses that you get. 

Its typical these days for games that ask for pledges to have some extremely insane pledging options outside of the normal packages. Its for the whales out there,and I cant say that I blame them. In todays market where you have peeps dumping 1k on their favorite streamer like Ninja while playing Fortnite, very much proves there are players with a ton of money that dont mind parting with it on a streamer or a game that they like. So if you are a game developer asking for pledges,you want to offer the whales something to encourage them to depart with their money. At the same time you dont want to alienate your community. Im sure its a fine line that they are walking.

 I myself, will not pledge. I am planning on playing this game, but I am ok with waiting for the game to release, than buying it for box price and subbing from there.

 All I know is if I had 10k to drop on a game it better have a cruise or a very good family vacation package bundled in with it... ROTFLMAO!!!!

 

Why would someone pay 1k to someone they watch play videogames?  These people shouldn't be called whales.  Whales pay money to make themselves more powerful in games they play.  People that send 1k willy-nilly to people they watch play games are called insane retards.  

I dunno, seems a lot less insane than people who buy these, which are for 1 Game and don't even include the price of airfare and hotels.

Super Bowl 52 ticket prices

Website	Low	High
SeatGeek	$3,380	$55,000
Vivid Seats	$3,441	$57,306
StubHub	$3,550	$66,655
NFL Exchange	$4,290	$40,000

Face it, there are a lot of people who are flipping rich, and they spend money on things the average Joe either can't or won't. 

Keep in mind, not all these people are rich, some of them are middle, they just save up for these things.

Well that would be me, but I choose not to spend this kind of money to watch people play games, online or otherwise.

I do spend far more a year supporting my local church, which puts me in the insane category in many folk's eyes.

I was just making a point that dropping 1K on a twitch streamer isn't the act of a mentally challenged individual.

Amathe

If you spend $10,000 on a video game, you have not paid to win. You just lost.

blamo2000

Kyleran said:

Ungood said:

Kyleran said:

blamo2000 said:

Brunlin said:

Lurv said:

I see there's packages going well above $1,000 to $10k. Are these people going to be superior to the $50 pledge players? Is this going to have a p2w effect? Need to know before I drop any money on this. If some guy is gonna drop $5k just to be way ahead and superior to me then hell with that.

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/#vip

 You could just read what it gives you and make your mind up yourself as they are very transparent on the bonuses that you get. 

Its typical these days for games that ask for pledges to have some extremely insane pledging options outside of the normal packages. Its for the whales out there,and I cant say that I blame them. In todays market where you have peeps dumping 1k on their favorite streamer like Ninja while playing Fortnite, very much proves there are players with a ton of money that dont mind parting with it on a streamer or a game that they like. So if you are a game developer asking for pledges,you want to offer the whales something to encourage them to depart with their money. At the same time you dont want to alienate your community. Im sure its a fine line that they are walking.

 I myself, will not pledge. I am planning on playing this game, but I am ok with waiting for the game to release, than buying it for box price and subbing from there.

 All I know is if I had 10k to drop on a game it better have a cruise or a very good family vacation package bundled in with it... ROTFLMAO!!!!

 

Why would someone pay 1k to someone they watch play videogames?  These people shouldn't be called whales.  Whales pay money to make themselves more powerful in games they play.  People that send 1k willy-nilly to people they watch play games are called insane retards.  

I dunno, seems a lot less insane than people who buy these, which are for 1 Game and don't even include the price of airfare and hotels.

Super Bowl 52 ticket prices

Website	Low	High
SeatGeek	$3,380	$55,000
Vivid Seats	$3,441	$57,306
StubHub	$3,550	$66,655
NFL Exchange	$4,290	$40,000

Face it, there are a lot of people who are flipping rich, and they spend money on things the average Joe either can't or won't. 

Keep in mind, not all these people are rich, some of them are middle, they just save up for these things.

Well that would be me, but I choose not to spend this kind of money to watch people play games, online or otherwise.

I do spend far more a year supporting my local church, which puts me in the insane category in many folk's eyes.

I was just making a point that dropping 1K on a twitch streamer isn't the act of a mentally challenged individual.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that last point.  

GeezerGamer

DMKano said:

How can a PvE game be P2W?

So assume another player buys all his power and does all the PvE content before you do - this impacts you how exactly?

It's not like dungeons and bosses in Pantheon can only be cleared once - everything respawns, it doesn't make any difference who does it first.

Assume that someone will do it first - assume that there will be players who will play more than you, be in guilds that are stronger than yours and be better geared - is this a problem for you?

What does it matter?

For me the notion that a purely PvE focused game can somehow be "P2W" is just so silly

I know that there will be better more powerful players in Pantheon then me - how they got there is frankly none of my business as it doesn't impact me one bit.

If they bought their accounts, if they paid the devs, or they just played a lot - or whatever - what difference does it make to anyone else?

Because of some imaginary epeen "first" contest?

Oh come on, does that question really need an answer?
You know dam well, how it works when you can't keep up with BiS players in PVE.

Kyleran

GeezerGamer said:

DMKano said:

How can a PvE game be P2W?

So assume another player buys all his power and does all the PvE content before you do - this impacts you how exactly?

It's not like dungeons and bosses in Pantheon can only be cleared once - everything respawns, it doesn't make any difference who does it first.

Assume that someone will do it first - assume that there will be players who will play more than you, be in guilds that are stronger than yours and be better geared - is this a problem for you?

What does it matter?

For me the notion that a purely PvE focused game can somehow be "P2W" is just so silly

I know that there will be better more powerful players in Pantheon then me - how they got there is frankly none of my business as it doesn't impact me one bit.

If they bought their accounts, if they paid the devs, or they just played a lot - or whatever - what difference does it make to anyone else?

Because of some imaginary epeen "first" contest?

Oh come on, does that question really need an answer?
You know dam well, how it works when you can't keep up with BiS players in PVE.

I actually don't, do they put a lien on your computer or something?  

I understand needing raid gear to complete certain content,  but I rarely recall ever having a BIS item, like say an orange item back in Vanilla WOW days.

TwoTubes

Ya, he's a joke, just move on. hah

Kyleran

blamo2000 said:

Kyleran said:

Ungood said:

Kyleran said:

blamo2000 said:

Brunlin said:

Lurv said:

I see there's packages going well above $1,000 to $10k. Are these people going to be superior to the $50 pledge players? Is this going to have a p2w effect? Need to know before I drop any money on this. If some guy is gonna drop $5k just to be way ahead and superior to me then hell with that.

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/join/#vip

 You could just read what it gives you and make your mind up yourself as they are very transparent on the bonuses that you get. 

Its typical these days for games that ask for pledges to have some extremely insane pledging options outside of the normal packages. Its for the whales out there,and I cant say that I blame them. In todays market where you have peeps dumping 1k on their favorite streamer like Ninja while playing Fortnite, very much proves there are players with a ton of money that dont mind parting with it on a streamer or a game that they like. So if you are a game developer asking for pledges,you want to offer the whales something to encourage them to depart with their money. At the same time you dont want to alienate your community. Im sure its a fine line that they are walking.

 I myself, will not pledge. I am planning on playing this game, but I am ok with waiting for the game to release, than buying it for box price and subbing from there.

 All I know is if I had 10k to drop on a game it better have a cruise or a very good family vacation package bundled in with it... ROTFLMAO!!!!

 

Why would someone pay 1k to someone they watch play videogames?  These people shouldn't be called whales.  Whales pay money to make themselves more powerful in games they play.  People that send 1k willy-nilly to people they watch play games are called insane retards.  

I dunno, seems a lot less insane than people who buy these, which are for 1 Game and don't even include the price of airfare and hotels.

Super Bowl 52 ticket prices

Website	Low	High
SeatGeek	$3,380	$55,000
Vivid Seats	$3,441	$57,306
StubHub	$3,550	$66,655
NFL Exchange	$4,290	$40,000

Face it, there are a lot of people who are flipping rich, and they spend money on things the average Joe either can't or won't. 

Keep in mind, not all these people are rich, some of them are middle, they just save up for these things.

Well that would be me, but I choose not to spend this kind of money to watch people play games, online or otherwise.

I do spend far more a year supporting my local church, which puts me in the insane category in many folk's eyes.

I was just making a point that dropping 1K on a twitch streamer isn't the act of a mentally challenged individual.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that last point.  

No need, I proved my point, your agreement isn't necessary.

Mendel

MagikarpsGhost said:

best thing to do is to compare the two.

Ascendant's Pledge

$10,000

• Unlimited VIP Access
• Alpha access
• Beta access
• Early name reservation
• 2 Digital copies of the game
• Additional character slot
• Game Title: Pantheon Explorer
• Stack of Minor Illusion Flasks
• Explorer's Backpack
• Tunic of the Ages
• Keepsake Vanity Pet
• Ring of the Fallen
• 5 item renaming vouchers
• Name appears in game credits
• Lifetime Game Subscription
• Invite to Founder's Guild
• Digital Lore and Art Book
• In game Ascendant nameplate
• Terminus Cloth Map
• Postcard From Team
• Tester credit in game credits
• Tester forum tag
• Limited Edition Framed Print
• Pre-Alpha Tester access*
• Design dungeon or raid
  with design team

that is what it gives you, nothing really GAME advancing, I mean for that price the life time sub is the least they can do lol.

There's not much there worth that much.  Maybe the life-time subscription could approach that after a period of time.   666 months, assuming $15/month.  That's either ominous or they've learned from other lifetime subscription offers.  (That's over 55 years of subscription time, who is really planning to live that long?  Those whose mother doesn't notice a really big charge on her Platinum card?)

This, like so many other in-development titles, this kind of purchase is all ego.  In that case, the 'name in credits' and 'design w/team' are the most likely draws.  I fully expect to see people to really put the screws in claiming some kind of imagined prestige for having donated, even more than they already are.

I think it is laughable to think that this type of personality is going to be the core of a "great gaming community".

P2W, no.  Pay-to-gloat, expect it.

Amathe

If you are a power gamer or big time raider who cares about getting ahead, most or all of the items on that list won't mean anything to you. It's just not that much of an advantage. 

But what this does, unfortunately, is drive OCD collectors/completionists up a tree. They want to collect all the collectibles, and right out of the gate that is put financially out of their reach.

I know it doesn't take $10,000 to get the in game collectibles like the pet (so far as I can tell). But it still costs what for some people is a lot, and spoils their goal of collecting a complete set of something. 

Wellspring

Amathe said:

If you are a power gamer or big time raider who cares about getting ahead, most or all of the items on that list won't mean anything to you. It's just not that much of an advantage. 

But what this does, unfortunately, is drive OCD collectors/completionists up a tree. They want to collect all the collectibles, and right out of the gate that is put financially out of their reach.

I know it doesn't take $10,000 to get the in game collectibles like the pet (so far as I can tell). But it still costs what for some people is a lot, and spoils their goal of collecting a complete set of something. 

Doesn't the cost/rarity factor into the value of a collection though?

If everything was freely given to everyone at launch, wouldn't that kind of defeat the joy these people get for completing their own collection.

Wellspring

Rhoklaw said:

GeezerGamer said:

DMKano said:

How can a PvE game be P2W?

So assume another player buys all his power and does all the PvE content before you do - this impacts you how exactly?

It's not like dungeons and bosses in Pantheon can only be cleared once - everything respawns, it doesn't make any difference who does it first.

Assume that someone will do it first - assume that there will be players who will play more than you, be in guilds that are stronger than yours and be better geared - is this a problem for you?

What does it matter?

For me the notion that a purely PvE focused game can somehow be "P2W" is just so silly

I know that there will be better more powerful players in Pantheon then me - how they got there is frankly none of my business as it doesn't impact me one bit.

If they bought their accounts, if they paid the devs, or they just played a lot - or whatever - what difference does it make to anyone else?

Because of some imaginary epeen "first" contest?

Oh come on, does that question really need an answer?
You know dam well, how it works when you can't keep up with BiS players in PVE.

Well, let's just take a stroll down poor $50 package Joe's adventure through Pantheon. Joe can still play the game when it launches. Joe can still pay $15 a month to keep playing it the next month and so on till he doesn't feel like paying that subscription. Joe has access to all the same character classes, races, dungeons, zones and gear of someone who spent $10,000 on their package. Does Joe feel the affects of a player with $10,000? No and he never will because in PvE games, the competition is between you and the... get this... the game. You are not required to compete with other players.

I agree with you that these packages are not P2W.

But disagree with you about PvE = not competing with other players. If this were a single player game (or an MMORPG with heavy instancing, so it played like a single player or co-op game), then sure.

However, in games like EQ1, with no instances and contested content, people very much competed with each other, even on the PvE servers. Instead of killing each other, players/guilds would race to mobilize and dps race the other players to get credit for the kill and loot.

Amathe

Wellspring said:

If everything was freely given to everyone at launch, wouldn't that kind of defeat the joy these people get for completing their own collection.

Those sorts of people are not looking for a handout. They just want to earn their collections in game, without having to buy things for it out of game. 

Kyleran

Wellspring said:

Rhoklaw said:

GeezerGamer said:

DMKano said:

How can a PvE game be P2W?

So assume another player buys all his power and does all the PvE content before you do - this impacts you how exactly?

It's not like dungeons and bosses in Pantheon can only be cleared once - everything respawns, it doesn't make any difference who does it first.

Assume that someone will do it first - assume that there will be players who will play more than you, be in guilds that are stronger than yours and be better geared - is this a problem for you?

What does it matter?

For me the notion that a purely PvE focused game can somehow be "P2W" is just so silly

I know that there will be better more powerful players in Pantheon then me - how they got there is frankly none of my business as it doesn't impact me one bit.

If they bought their accounts, if they paid the devs, or they just played a lot - or whatever - what difference does it make to anyone else?

Because of some imaginary epeen "first" contest?

Oh come on, does that question really need an answer?
You know dam well, how it works when you can't keep up with BiS players in PVE.

Well, let's just take a stroll down poor $50 package Joe's adventure through Pantheon. Joe can still play the game when it launches. Joe can still pay $15 a month to keep playing it the next month and so on till he doesn't feel like paying that subscription. Joe has access to all the same character classes, races, dungeons, zones and gear of someone who spent $10,000 on their package. Does Joe feel the affects of a player with $10,000? No and he never will because in PvE games, the competition is between you and the... get this... the game. You are not required to compete with other players.

I agree with you that these packages are not P2W.

But disagree with you about PvE = not competing with other players. If this were a single player game (or an MMORPG with heavy instancing, so it played like a single player or co-op game), then sure.

However, in games like EQ1, with no instances and contested content, people very much competed with each other, even on the PvE servers. Instead of killing each other, players/guilds would race to mobilize and dps race the other players to get credit for the kill and loot.

Very likely those who are masters at playing the game and willing to put in long hours will win those races, as the pretty much do in every game.

It will not be won by what people pledged in the store.

blamo2000

Kyleran said:

blamo2000 said:

We'll have to agree to disagree on that last point.  

No need, I proved my point, your agreement isn't necessary.

I proved my point.

If I was in trouble and sat down with a lawyer that told me he just sent 1k to someone he likes watching play video games online I would call him a fucking idiot and immediately walk out.  Even if it meant I had to represent myself.

If he told me he spent 1k on crack I would trust him far more and probably stay.   I trust crackhead lawyers with my very freedom more than I trust the cognitive abilities of anyone who would send 1k to someone they watch play video games online.

Kajidourden

Anyone care to meme the seagulls from Finding Nemo?  "P2w?"  "p2W?" "P2W!?!?!"

This forum is a one-trick pony.

Cryomatrix

blamo2000 said:

Kyleran said:

blamo2000 said:

We'll have to agree to disagree on that last point.  

No need, I proved my point, your agreement isn't necessary.

I proved my point.

If I was in trouble and sat down with a lawyer that told me he just sent 1k to someone he likes watching play video games online I would call him a fucking idiot and immediately walk out.  Even if it meant I had to represent myself.

If he told me he spent 1k on crack I would trust him far more and probably stay.   I trust crackhead lawyers with my very freedom more than I trust the cognitive abilities of anyone who would send 1k to someone they watch play video games online.

Umm, i would never trust a crackhead over someone who donates $1000. Some people have a lot of money and are veey generous. The crackhead is fucked up by a chemically induced rat race he/she cannot win. People throw their lives and others and commit crimes on drugs and to feed their habit. I've heard of doctors stealing their colleagues prescription pads to write themselves narcotics.

Someone who donates to a streamer likely has a ton of money and is feeling generous. If I watched streamers and I wasn't a cheap bastard, i would donate to them too.

CheechGLG

With a purely pve game, can there even be P2W???

blamo2000

Cryomatrix said:

blamo2000 said:

Kyleran said:

blamo2000 said:

We'll have to agree to disagree on that last point.  

No need, I proved my point, your agreement isn't necessary.

I proved my point.

If I was in trouble and sat down with a lawyer that told me he just sent 1k to someone he likes watching play video games online I would call him a fucking idiot and immediately walk out.  Even if it meant I had to represent myself.

If he told me he spent 1k on crack I would trust him far more and probably stay.   I trust crackhead lawyers with my very freedom more than I trust the cognitive abilities of anyone who would send 1k to someone they watch play video games online.

Umm, i would never trust a crackhead over someone who donates $1000. Some people have a lot of money and are veey generous. The crackhead is fucked up by a chemically induced rat race he/she cannot win. People throw their lives and others and commit crimes on drugs and to feed their habit. I've heard of doctors stealing their colleagues prescription pads to write themselves narcotics.

Someone who donates to a streamer likely has a ton of money and is feeling generous. If I watched streamers and I wasn't a cheap bastard, i would donate to them too.

I can understand why someone smokes crack.  It gets you high, and then you get addicted, so you keep doing it, knowing it is bad and you shouldn't.  I'm not saying its good and people should give crack a try - I'm just saying I can understand why there are crackheads.  I cannot understand people going out of their way to watch people play video games online, when they own the fucking video game and can play it themselves.  I can understand people watching the best of the best playing each other in competition, which is not what happens 99.9% of the time.  It makes no sense at all to me, and as I said, I do not trust the cognitive ability of someone who does so.  Now compound that distrust if the person is sending 1k to someone they watch play a video game online.

Also, I have no desire to smoke crack.  But I would much rather smoke crack than watch someone play a vide game online.  Smoking crack would mean I have poor judgement.  Watching other people play video games online means I am lacking the cognitive process necessary to make a judgement. 

I'm a biased?  Yes.  Close-minded?  Probably.  Correct?  I certainly believe so.  Fair?  Yes.  I love my kids with a fanatical passion.  My kids love watching people play video games online far more than playing video games, and I certainly wouldn't trust them to represent me as legal council either.  

Kyleran

blamo2000 said:

Cryomatrix said:

blamo2000 said:

Kyleran said:

blamo2000 said:

We'll have to agree to disagree on that last point.  

No need, I proved my point, your agreement isn't necessary.

I proved my point.

If I was in trouble and sat down with a lawyer that told me he just sent 1k to someone he likes watching play video games online I would call him a fucking idiot and immediately walk out.  Even if it meant I had to represent myself.

If he told me he spent 1k on crack I would trust him far more and probably stay.   I trust crackhead lawyers with my very freedom more than I trust the cognitive abilities of anyone who would send 1k to someone they watch play video games online.

Umm, i would never trust a crackhead over someone who donates $1000. Some people have a lot of money and are veey generous. The crackhead is fucked up by a chemically induced rat race he/she cannot win. People throw their lives and others and commit crimes on drugs and to feed their habit. I've heard of doctors stealing their colleagues prescription pads to write themselves narcotics.

Someone who donates to a streamer likely has a ton of money and is feeling generous. If I watched streamers and I wasn't a cheap bastard, i would donate to them too.

I can understand why someone smokes crack.  It gets you high, and then you get addicted, so you keep doing it, knowing it is bad and you shouldn't.  I'm not saying its good and people should give crack a try - I'm just saying I can understand why there are crackheads.  I cannot understand people going out of their way to watch people play video games online, when they own the fucking video game and can play it themselves.  I can understand people watching the best of the best playing each other in competition, which is not what happens 99.9% of the time.  It makes no sense at all to me, and as I said, I do not trust the cognitive ability of someone who does so.  Now compound that distrust if the person is sending 1k to someone they watch play a video game online.

Also, I have no desire to smoke crack.  But I would much rather smoke crack than watch someone play a vide game online.  Smoking crack would mean I have poor judgement.  Watching other people play video games online means I am lacking the cognitive process necessary to make a judgement. 

I'm a biased?  Yes.  Close-minded?  Probably.  Correct?  I certainly believe so.  Fair?  Yes.  I love my kids with a fanatical passion.  My kids love watching people play video games online far more than playing video games, and I certainly wouldn't trust them to represent me as legal council either.  

I assume then you wouldn't trust anyone who donates money for other entertainment purposes, say such as a local orchestra or art museum?

Or those folks who donate on crowd funding to promising authors,  musicians or whatever.

Not saying I've done any of those, but I don't judge the streamer donation any differently.

I also try to tone down the hyperbole in my comparisons,  there is no world where smoking crack by you or others is the preferred choice.

Well, unless they announce the earth will be hit by a giant asteroid later this year, wiping out all life, maybe in that scenario...maybe.