Remove forced PVP and I'll be back on board for this.
What forced PvP?
It's the illusion that if you knowingly buy a game with an emphasis on pvp that they are forcing you to do pvp.
If that's true then I suppose knowingly buying a game with an emphasis on pve is forced pve.
Those monsters!
I think the context of forced is more if I want to play PvPGameX I am forced to PvP even though all I really want out of it is GameX. Playing the game is voluntary but the conditions played under are not.
Not a PvP fan myself, if I loved the GameX element so much I played regardless I would be forced into situations I'd rather not be in by others. Ultimately, it isn't a genuinely forced situation but I can see how many would feel it to be so.
I simply avoid games where I can't opt of of PvP, though if one were intriguing enough I may give it a try. Sometimes a get a fleeting inkling that such could be fun. But I know if I step into that environment that by my presence I accept all that can come with.
Yeah, but it's still pvp game x. I mean, I get that pvp game x might have some game play elements that could be enticing to people who don't like pvp but it still is what it is.
No one is forcing people to buy it.
But then people buy it and say they are being forced to pvp (because it was right there on the virtual box) and then all the asking for a pve server or "I should be allowed to flag for pvp." etc.
The only thing a person should be allowed to do is to have access to the game. If developers want to change their design that's up to them.
I feel the "forced" moniker is essentially from people who just can't accept that the game they like has elements they don't want at all so they just complain and demand.
Totally agree, but this is really something happening culturally all around us. Not just gaming.
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Remove forced PVP and I'll be back on board for this.
What forced PvP?
It's the illusion that if you knowingly buy a game with an emphasis on pvp that they are forcing you to do pvp.
If that's true then I suppose knowingly buying a game with an emphasis on pve is forced pve.
Those monsters!
I think the context of forced is more if I want to play PvPGameX I am forced to PvP even though all I really want out of it is GameX. Playing the game is voluntary but the conditions played under are not.
Not a PvP fan myself, if I loved the GameX element so much I played regardless I would be forced into situations I'd rather not be in by others. Ultimately, it isn't a genuinely forced situation but I can see how many would feel it to be so.
I simply avoid games where I can't opt of of PvP, though if one were intriguing enough I may give it a try. Sometimes a get a fleeting inkling that such could be fun. But I know if I step into that environment that by my presence I accept all that can come with.
Yeah, but it's still pvp game x. I mean, I get that pvp game x might have some game play elements that could be enticing to people who don't like pvp but it still is what it is.
No one is forcing people to buy it.
But then people buy it and say they are being forced to pvp (because it was right there on the virtual box) and then all the asking for a pve server or "I should be allowed to flag for pvp." etc.
The only thing a person should be allowed to do is to have access to the game. If developers want to change their design that's up to them.
I feel the "forced" moniker is essentially from people who just can't accept that the game they like has elements they don't want at all so they just complain and demand.
I feel the "forced PVP" moniker is more often used by potential customers to explain why they won't be playing a certain game.
Makes sense they would communicate this information to the developers who as you say, have a choice to make, cater to their "demands" to get their money, or stay the course instead.
Amazon walked back on this recently, others have as well since the carebear market has been one they've been unwilling to ignore, at least to date.
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I feel the "forced PVP" moniker is more often used by potential customers to explain why they won't be playing a certain game.
Makes sense they would communicate this information to the developers who as you say, have a choice to make, cater to their "demands" to get their money, or stay the course instead.
Amazon walked back on this recently, others have as well since the carebear market has been one they've been unwilling to ignore, at least to date.
Eh, I more often see it from people that post just to bash PVP - because you see the same posters go in every PVP game's thread to say just that. Sometimes even in games that have no PVP (this is the second thread that I see it happen). And many times even in games that they would not play are have no interest in for other reasons.
That's because they are being forced.
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I feel the "forced PVP" moniker is more often used by potential customers to explain why they won't be playing a certain game.
Makes sense they would communicate this information to the developers who as you say, have a choice to make, cater to their "demands" to get their money, or stay the course instead.
Amazon walked back on this recently, others have as well since the carebear market has been one they've been unwilling to ignore, at least to date.
Eh, I more often see it from people that post just to bash PVP - because you see the same posters go in every PVP game's thread to say just that. Sometimes even in games that have no PVP (this is the second thread that I see it happen). And many times even in games that they would not play are have no interest in for other reasons.
That's because they are being forced.
I think because its the internet, people feel free to bash and make fun in a way they would not be free to do so in person.
Remove forced PVP and I'll be back on board for this.
What forced PvP?
It's the illusion that if you knowingly buy a game with an emphasis on pvp that they are forcing you to do pvp.
If that's true then I suppose knowingly buying a game with an emphasis on pve is forced pve.
Those monsters!
I agree with you on the principle of caveat emptor. However let me just give you my point of view on the games that in my opinion forced PvP on me.
When I bought the game the forums and the developers always told us that we would not be required to go to certain zones(pVp) if we had no wish to. They would not place certain resources or necessary items in those zones.....cough....cough...AION.
By and large those games did live up to their promises. But some outright lied and changed it so that players who were previously under the impression that they could completely avoid a zone was now required to go there to progress because lo and behold they changed the bloody rules because juicy targets were avoiding the zone. Now that I think qualifies as 'forced PvP' because when I bought the game I was under the impression and an impression fully advanced by the developer on the forums that I could play the game and avoid those areas.
I don't buy games that straight up tell me that I will require to PvP to advance. If I can find ways to avoid it or semi-avoid it like in Archeage and Black Desert I do not ever go on any forum and complain about getting killed because I knew exactly what I was getting into. I also played Dark Age of Camelot but PvP in that game was in another zone and one dungeon which is like totally avoidable. I did PvP in that game though and I loved it. I also had pure PvP toons on WoW that I only used to get ranks when that was a thing and earned PvP gear and loved it too.
So I'm not some entrenched bitter PvE vet that is a complainer and saying stuff because I am trying to act victimized. I just hate it when games say one thing and then change the rules to support the PvPers when they complain that there are no easy targets for them to kill.
Your idea that any person buying a game that has PvP cannot claim to be 'forced' isn't true in this case now is it.
Remove forced PVP and I'll be back on board for this.
What forced PvP?
It's the illusion that if you knowingly buy a game with an emphasis on pvp that they are forcing you to do pvp.
If that's true then I suppose knowingly buying a game with an emphasis on pve is forced pve.
Those monsters!
I agree with you on the principle of caveat emptor. However let me just give you my point of view on the games that in my opinion forced PvP on me.
When I bought the game the forums and the developers always told us that we would not be required to go to certain zones(pVp) if we had no wish to. They would not place certain resources or necessary items in those zones.....cough....cough...AION.
By and large those games did live up to their promises. But some outright lied and changed it so that players who were previously under the impression that they could completely avoid a zone was now required to go there to progress because lo and behold they changed the bloody rules because juicy targets were avoiding the zone. Now that I think qualifies as 'forced PvP' because when I bought the game I was under the impression and an impression fully advanced by the developer on the forums that I could play the game and avoid those areas.
I don't buy games that straight up tell me that I will require to PvP to advance. If I can find ways to avoid it or semi-avoid it like in Archeage and Black Desert I do not ever go on any forum and complain about getting killed because I knew exactly what I was getting into. I also played Dark Age of Camelot but PvP in that game was in another zone and one dungeon which is like totally avoidable. I did PvP in that game though and I loved it. I also had pure PvP toons on WoW that I only used to get ranks when that was a thing and earned PvP gear and loved it too.
So I'm not some entrenched bitter PvE vet that is a complainer and saying stuff because I am trying to act victimized. I just hate it when games say one thing and then change the rules to support the PvPers when they complain that there are no easy targets for them to kill.
Your idea that any person buying a game that has PvP cannot claim to be 'forced' isn't true in this case now is it.
For the sake of Pantheon, there is as you put it "forced PvP" if and when its added, it will be on PvP servers. VR has not even talked about a flag system on PvE servers. As for forced PvP in other games. If thats how the game is designed and its told up front. That also cant be called forced as no one is making you play the game. We have options. No matter how you look at it, if you play a game that have an open PvP system, by logging in, its consensual.
So I'm not some entrenched bitter PvE vet that is a complainer and saying stuff because I am trying to act victimized. I just hate it when games say one thing and then change the rules to support the PvPers when they complain that there are no easy targets for them to kill.
That is exactly as valid as the person that follows or comments on a game that clearly states it has PvP and then complains that the PvP is forced on them and the game should start a PvE only server.
I just expect a game to deliver what it says it will. I enjoy PvP games. I enjoy PvE games. I hate it when people just expect every game to fit THEIR preferred game preference.
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So I'm not some entrenched bitter PvE vet that is a complainer and saying stuff because I am trying to act victimized. I just hate it when games say one thing and then change the rules to support the PvPers when they complain that there are no easy targets for them to kill.
That is exactly as valid as the person that follows or comments on a game that clearly states it has PvP and then complains that the PvP is forced on them and the game should start a PvE only server.
I just expect a game to deliver what it says it will. I enjoy PvP games. I enjoy PvE games. I hate it when people just expect every game to fit THEIR preferred game preference.
There's a huge difference between adding PvP to a PvE server versus adding a separate server for PvP. So you might want to clarify that.
No PvE player has ever complained about a PvP server of the game being added. However, plenty of players from the PvP crowd are so stubborn that PvE players asking for a separate PvE server of a PvP game is somehow ruining their game.
Your argument was basically a strawman, so nice try.
No its not.
You are absolutely wrong about the complaining. PvP and PvE need to be balanced differently because AI sucks so stats get out of whack. This is a frequent complaint by PvE players when a suggestion for a PvP server is broached. As well as complaining about resources being diverted. (On a side note they are correct. Adding a PvP server to a PvE game is dumb for the reasons listed). To start ANY argument by claiming "No PvE player has ever..." is kind of silly on it's face value.
As for the reverse... adding PvE only servers to a game that is designed and marketed as PvP can destroy any chance of the original servers having a good balance. IMHO a balance is needed. In these games the players ARE the content, and by segregating the players you often doom the game to fail. Now if that was the design from the beginning... great. But if people are complaining about it and want to CHANGE the design to fit their personal preference then that is bad because it changes the ecosystem the game was built around.
A game designed from the ground up to support separate PvP and PvE servers is quite different from FORCING THEM (see what I did there) into a game that is already designed and sold to people.
So... as you say... nice try.
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'Never absolutely' who even says that but if questions are asked on their forums and they say you will not have to travel through that zone to advance to another area and then they change the rules and make travelling through the PvP zone mandatory they lied plain and simple.
Of course never absolutely does not happen game developers change their minds and they are not going to give those kind of blanket assurances but if I spend money, time and effort based on the game developers assertions which they willingly gave to mislead us into buying the game then I should have also the right to complain when they change those rules to suit them. I've already committed time into the game and then midway you change the game. That is forcing me to play the way they want or I have to leave.
They should have told the damn truth right from the very beginning that is before I bought the game based on the assurances. That is called 'holding out' where you place an individual at a disadvantage when they rely on your assertions. Those circumstances I would call it 'forced PvP'. Not going to change my mind on this because this has happened often enough where developers change what they say after you buy the game. Bloody rogues only want you to buy the game but after they don't care to keep you since you've already invested in the game. Clever tactic.
People don't ask developers questions in a vacuum, they ask those questions to decide whether they want to expend time, money and energy on a game. When you tell half truths or flat out lie then in those situations people have a right to voice their anger.
If a PvP game does not want to add a PvE server that is fine if they say so at the outset. Not say maybe we will think about it and then act surprised when a whole lot of people start asking for it and fights ensue on their forums. Be clear and stop lobbying for the part of the population you are clearly cheating into playing your game. Those players will not play your game if you didn't slyly say things you never intended to do or implement. We will transfer you once the servers are set up. Yeah like never.
Do you know what I value the most? My time. So please don't waste it by telling me half truths about the game and I then make me waste this precious commodity on it. That pisses me off more than anything else. I go to the game forums and ask questions and I expect them to tell me the truth about their game. That is not unreasonaable. If you say I can play your game without engaging in PvP I will hold you to it. Don't force me to travel through PvP zones where gank squads are waiting to pick me off because you decided to funnel us their way after a few months.
I see it is alright for the developers to 'accommodate' other types of players but when those players cry foul you say it's not right because they should have known that developers were lying. Nice double standards there!
I think since you are willing to give the developers leeway you should extend that courtesy to the players that chose to rely on what the developers said when they were trying to sell the game.
If I invest time, energy and money on your game and then you change the rules of the game I would be forced to play something I never signed up for. This is why player claim it is forced PvP. The only other option is to leave. That isn't an option when you have become part of the community and invested so much.
Developers know this and are banking on this fact so I'm going to call it forced whenever they sashay their lies and encourage PvE players to try their game. I am with those players who complain because I did exactly that before I left Aion.
That is hilarious. How many games offer PvP and PvE servers? I can think of dozens just off the top of my head and no, there is no complaining that it's causing stress on resources. Nice deflection from the fact that PvE players simply dont care about PvP servers being added. Plenty of big hit titles have proven that it's a viable approach to pleasing both crowds. The ONLY people who complain about separate servers are PvP players because they don't have easy prey, end of story.
What is hilarious is that you think repeating something makes it true.
I mean, you aren't even making an effort. Here is a thread, on this VERY FORUM, about this VERY GAME... when PvP servers where first announced. The VERY FIRST response is:
"Well, there goes my interest. "Perhaps alternate rule sets..." translates to, no it would cost too much to develop another rule set so we will just make "balance changes" as the game goes along. That worked so well for the PvE in WoW. Shrug. Oh well, "
I feel the "forced PVP" moniker is more often used by potential customers to explain why they won't be playing a certain game.
Makes sense they would communicate this information to the developers who as you say, have a choice to make, cater to their "demands" to get their money, or stay the course instead.
Amazon walked back on this recently, others have as well since the carebear market has been one they've been unwilling to ignore, at least to date.
Eh, I more often see it from people that post just to bash PVP - because you see the same posters go in every PVP game's thread to say just that. Sometimes even in games that have no PVP (this is the second thread that I see it happen). And many times even in games that they would not play and have no interest in for other reasons.
Well c'mon now, some of us are into FFA forum PVP, I've argued both sides of this debate on more than one occasion.
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That is hilarious. How many games offer PvP and PvE servers? I can think of dozens just off the top of my head and no, there is no complaining that it's causing stress on resources. Nice deflection from the fact that PvE players simply dont care about PvP servers being added. Plenty of big hit titles have proven that it's a viable approach to pleasing both crowds. The ONLY people who complain about separate servers are PvP players because they don't have easy prey, end of story.
What is hilarious is that you think repeating something makes it true.
I mean, you aren't even making an effort. Here is a thread, on this VERY FORUM, about this VERY GAME... when PvP servers where first announced. The VERY FIRST response is:
"Well, there goes my interest. "Perhaps alternate rule sets..." translates to, no it would cost too much to develop another rule set so we will just make "balance changes" as the game goes along. That worked so well for the PvE in WoW. Shrug. Oh well, "
If you think that PvE players do not complain about PvP servers being added then YOU are living in a bubble. `
Please... just stop. Both sides do the same thing, which is exactly what I said in my initial comment.
There is some merit on both sides. PvE focused games like Pantheon, when they do add PvP servers. Sometimes it can change the skills for PvE when things get balanced and it does take dev resources.
For PvP players, more MMOs then I can count that were PvP focused have dropped PvP all together because of the outrage of PvE players. They do seem to pit themselves on two sides of the fence.
I think tech has come fan enough that devs dont need to compromise a game that has both PvE and PvP, especially when that game has PvP server and PvE servers. None the less this fight between both sides still has left scars that run deep.
Which is really just code for forced raiding/grouping.
Yeah that is it!! Why is okay to say 'forced grouping' and complain about that and ask for more solo content but when we say 'forced PvP' there is no such thing.
The entitled part is annoying though. Why do people just share the interest and criticism but just not play? The indignation and entitlement at not being catered to is puzzling.
Its not just gaming. It's literally a cultural shift you see all around if you look.
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If I invest time, energy and money on your game and then you change the rules of the game I would be forced to play something I never signed up for.
No. Some particular PVE players say "forced PVP" for all games that are clear up front too. EVE, forced PVP. Albion, forced PVP. Ashes of Creation, forced PVP (the mistake of the poster in this thread). Sea of Thieves, forced PVP.
In most cases it has nothing to do with devs lying, or changing direction, or being interested in the rest of the game. Some PVE players just feel entitled to say that they hate PVP in every PVP thread of every PVP game. I remember a poster once saying they are like a vegan going to a BBQ restaurant and complaining about all the meat. Something I have not seen PVP players do.
Try reading some older New World or SotA threads where PVPers bitterly decry and lament the developers decisions to soften the consequences or restrict PVP in some fashion.
This happens almost every time devs take such actions, saw it all the time in EVE which unfortunately for me CCP took it to heart and made changes to increase player interaction and conflict.
More often than not it resulted in making it easier to kill pve'ers, which cost them having me and some of my friends as customers, after ten years in my case.
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Try reading some older New World or SotA threads where PVPers bitterly decry and lament the developers decisions to soften the consequences or restrict PVP in some fashion.
This is an actual shift in the original direction/ruleset and I find it easier to sympathize with - not only for PVPers but also for PVEers when it happens the other way around, like with all the flip flops in Legends of Aria/Worlds Adrift. If the players bought into the game it's bait and switch with the most fundamental aspect of the game.
But when it comes to a game just saying that it is going to be PVE (like Pantheon or P:G) I can't say I have seen PVP posts saying "boo PVE", whereas I see PVEers very often inPVP game threads do that.
No you're quite wrong there. You haven't met ikcin and a few others, Bcbully too, who have come on the PvE game threads to talk about how the PvE games are simply not the way to go any more and how they are totally out of touch with the current market. Citing League of Legends as the poster child for its cause.
There used to be one individual with a Zod avatar who would start threads here specifically to rattle the PvE players. They were prefaced with highly incendiary titles meant to ensnare the PvE sheep to join in the discussion if you could call the name calling that ensued a discussion. They would also frequent the PvE game threads with their brand of helpful criticism.
We have lost a lot of posters to Reddit and other more lucrative sources of carebear tears. Don't see many of them here any more. They have moved on to greener pastures.
Frankly I also don't see the point of you trying to make that distinction because both sides are equally egregious in this respect. Surely you're not trying to say that PvP players are better people?
Just an example... Sea of Thieves a PvP focused game. Open a new server, copy the game over, turn off PvP mechanics.... wow, that was a lot of work.
NEXT!
If you honestly think its just that easy to do that then I really wonder if you have followed game development for any length of time.
But the point wasn't that. It was your INSISTANCE that and I quote "No PvE player has ever complained about a PvP server of the game being added. " Which as I pointed out, was simply laughable and you even doubled down on it in your follow up post.
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I think what they mean about Alpha being feature complete is thst the small playspace that will be available in the Alpha has all the boxes ticked (quests, dungeons etc). They still have alot of world building, animations, music, tuning, more tuning etc to work on . I really look forward to this game, but i also realize that it’s going to be slaughtered by the newer generation of players for being slow paced and too hard
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All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Makes sense they would communicate this information to the developers who as you say, have a choice to make, cater to their "demands" to get their money, or stay the course instead.
Amazon walked back on this recently, others have as well since the carebear market has been one they've been unwilling to ignore, at least to date.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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Honest mistake. Thanks for the clarification.
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When I bought the game the forums and the developers always told us that we would not be required to go to certain zones(pVp) if we had no wish to. They would not place certain resources or necessary items in those zones.....cough....cough...AION.
By and large those games did live up to their promises. But some outright lied and changed it so that players who were previously under the impression that they could completely avoid a zone was now required to go there to progress because lo and behold they changed the bloody rules because juicy targets were avoiding the zone. Now that I think qualifies as 'forced PvP' because when I bought the game I was under the impression and an impression fully advanced by the developer on the forums that I could play the game and avoid those areas.
I don't buy games that straight up tell me that I will require to PvP to advance. If I can find ways to avoid it or semi-avoid it like in Archeage and Black Desert I do not ever go on any forum and complain about getting killed because I knew exactly what I was getting into. I also played Dark Age of Camelot but PvP in that game was in another zone and one dungeon which is like totally avoidable. I did PvP in that game though and I loved it. I also had pure PvP toons on WoW that I only used to get ranks when that was a thing and earned PvP gear and loved it too.
So I'm not some entrenched bitter PvE vet that is a complainer and saying stuff because I am trying to act victimized. I just hate it when games say one thing and then change the rules to support the PvPers when they complain that there are no easy targets for them to kill.
Your idea that any person buying a game that has PvP cannot claim to be 'forced' isn't true in this case now is it.
I just expect a game to deliver what it says it will. I enjoy PvP games. I enjoy PvE games. I hate it when people just expect every game to fit THEIR preferred game preference.
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"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
You are absolutely wrong about the complaining. PvP and PvE need to be balanced differently because AI sucks so stats get out of whack. This is a frequent complaint by PvE players when a suggestion for a PvP server is broached. As well as complaining about resources being diverted. (On a side note they are correct. Adding a PvP server to a PvE game is dumb for the reasons listed). To start ANY argument by claiming "No PvE player has ever..." is kind of silly on it's face value.
As for the reverse... adding PvE only servers to a game that is designed and marketed as PvP can destroy any chance of the original servers having a good balance. IMHO a balance is needed. In these games the players ARE the content, and by segregating the players you often doom the game to fail. Now if that was the design from the beginning... great. But if people are complaining about it and want to CHANGE the design to fit their personal preference then that is bad because it changes the ecosystem the game was built around.
A game designed from the ground up to support separate PvP and PvE servers is quite different from FORCING THEM (see what I did there) into a game that is already designed and sold to people.
So... as you say... nice try.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Of course never absolutely does not happen game developers change their minds and they are not going to give those kind of blanket assurances but if I spend money, time and effort based on the game developers assertions which they willingly gave to mislead us into buying the game then I should have also the right to complain when they change those rules to suit them. I've already committed time into the game and then midway you change the game. That is forcing me to play the way they want or I have to leave.
They should have told the damn truth right from the very beginning that is before I bought the game based on the assurances. That is called 'holding out' where you place an individual at a disadvantage when they rely on your assertions. Those circumstances I would call it 'forced PvP'. Not going to change my mind on this because this has happened often enough where developers change what they say after you buy the game. Bloody rogues only want you to buy the game but after they don't care to keep you since you've already invested in the game. Clever tactic.
People don't ask developers questions in a vacuum, they ask those questions to decide whether they want to expend time, money and energy on a game. When you tell half truths or flat out lie then in those situations people have a right to voice their anger.
If a PvP game does not want to add a PvE server that is fine if they say so at the outset. Not say maybe we will think about it and then act surprised when a whole lot of people start asking for it and fights ensue on their forums. Be clear and stop lobbying for the part of the population you are clearly cheating into playing your game. Those players will not play your game if you didn't slyly say things you never intended to do or implement. We will transfer you once the servers are set up. Yeah like never.
Do you know what I value the most? My time. So please don't waste it by telling me half truths about the game and I then make me waste this precious commodity on it. That pisses me off more than anything else. I go to the game forums and ask questions and I expect them to tell me the truth about their game. That is not unreasonaable. If you say I can play your game without engaging in PvP I will hold you to it. Don't force me to travel through PvP zones where gank squads are waiting to pick me off because you decided to funnel us their way after a few months.
I think since you are willing to give the developers leeway you should extend that courtesy to the players that chose to rely on what the developers said when they were trying to sell the game.
If I invest time, energy and money on your game and then you change the rules of the game I would be forced to play something I never signed up for. This is why player claim it is forced PvP. The only other option is to leave. That isn't an option when you have become part of the community and invested so much.
Developers know this and are banking on this fact so I'm going to call it forced whenever they sashay their lies and encourage PvE players to try their game. I am with those players who complain because I did exactly that before I left Aion.
I mean, you aren't even making an effort. Here is a thread, on this VERY FORUM, about this VERY GAME... when PvP servers where first announced. The VERY FIRST response is:
"Well, there goes my interest. "Perhaps alternate rule sets..." translates to, no it would cost too much to develop another rule set so we will just make "balance changes" as the game goes along. That worked so well for the PvE in WoW. Shrug. Oh well, "
https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/484340/pantheon-confirmed-to-have-pvp-at-launch
If you think that PvE players do not complain about PvP servers being added then YOU are living in a bubble. `
Please... just stop. Both sides do the same thing, which is exactly what I said in my initial comment.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
For PvP players, more MMOs then I can count that were PvP focused have dropped PvP all together because of the outrage of PvE players. They do seem to pit themselves on two sides of the fence.
I think tech has come fan enough that devs dont need to compromise a game that has both PvE and PvP, especially when that game has PvP server and PvE servers. None the less this fight between both sides still has left scars that run deep.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
This happens almost every time devs take such actions, saw it all the time in EVE which unfortunately for me CCP took it to heart and made changes to increase player interaction and conflict.
More often than not it resulted in making it easier to kill pve'ers, which cost them having me and some of my friends as customers, after ten years in my case.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
There used to be one individual with a Zod avatar who would start threads here specifically to rattle the PvE players. They were prefaced with highly incendiary titles meant to ensnare the PvE sheep to join in the discussion if you could call the name calling that ensued a discussion. They would also frequent the PvE game threads with their brand of helpful criticism.
We have lost a lot of posters to Reddit and other more lucrative sources of carebear tears. Don't see many of them here any more. They have moved on to greener pastures.
Frankly I also don't see the point of you trying to make that distinction because both sides are equally egregious in this respect. Surely you're not trying to say that PvP players are better people?
But the point wasn't that. It was your INSISTANCE that and I quote "No PvE player has ever complained about a PvP server of the game being added. " Which as I pointed out, was simply laughable and you even doubled down on it in your follow up post.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018