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Diablo IV Takes in $666 Million, Reveals Player Stats and Sets Dev 'Campfire Chat' This Friday | MMO

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  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 5,054
    Archandes said:
    Gorwe said:
    Again, not entirely true. While you might be able to edit how it looks like, that's only so far. Crit and Vulnerable are almost mandatory for EVERYONE. Due to how they are handled.

    Besides, don't you think, idk, Grim Dawn or PoE or others have already come up with these ideas and in a better way?

    Bear Druid max Overpower, while Werewolf Max Crit/damage to poisoned/Damage overtime (Vulnerable belongs to Earth/Storm or TornaDOG build).
    I think Barbarian Thorn and Thornmancer + Shield minion also max Thorn above everything else. Like i said, the game has Depth If someone actually tried to explore instead of straight browsing youtube video about META build
     It's always too easy to summarize the whole game (also Diablo 4 is new btw) only on tip of the iceberg if someone doesn't paid any attention or a will to explore And it happened a lot
    Running a lightning/vulnerability and wolves Druid here, no tornado and I am wrecking it on T3 which I have only been at for a day. My core skills increase my basic attack speed and my basic attack increases my core skill damage so I am constantly bouncing them off each other with an as fast as possible weapon while my wolves feed off my debuffs and my hurricane is my spirit builder boost. It requires constantly shifting between ranged and melee but it works like a charm. You just have to put in the effort to make stuff work, there is a ton of possibilities and character building and a lot of depth in D4. Druid boons are boring though, even if they are quite the flexible help in fortifying a certain build.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    ValdemarJ
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 24,429
    edited June 2023
    Uwakionna said:
    And it's prefect fine to have a personal reaction and feeling about something like that.

    As long as you weren't using it as a justification to look the other way when discussing concerns for a game. In that instance there's a reasonable point to be made on team and budget scale.

    What is ABK's excuse with CoD, OW2, and Immortal?

    There remains a division to be made here that many seem to overlook, ironically seemingly because of emotional sentiment to associated title(s) in question, even as the argument of something more broad is trying to be evoked.

    It's an extreme dissonance in sentiment to rationale, and it's leaving a lot of things unanswered.

    I get that people do not enjoy when something they like is attacked by another. At times there is a valid reason point to address, as with the example of Falcom's budget/scale.

    That is not a one size fits all argument to be making though. We can see that reflected in the other issues ABK has created in their other titles. ABK is not an indie company, and their practice's are not parallel to Falcom as they are on the polar side of even mihoyo, demonstrated by the first video noting the massive spike in cost Immortal presents compared to even Genshin. As much as one may disagree with Genshin's model, that doesn't make ABK suddenly better. And one should definitely not be transposing the sentiment of a small studio's issues onto a monolith of the industry.

    This leads to a important distinction to be made in circumstances, as was a main point in my original comment.
    I certainly think no fee for playing as opposed to B2P muddies the waters, but the upfront cost has never been an issue in any game for me. Posters may regard this as arrogance, but a stiff upfront fee puts of the F2P crowd that brings so little to gaming in my eyes.

    Oh and btw games from NW to D4 show you players will pay an upfront fee for a MMO-like game, the idea they won't is just F2P fan hype.

    So for me what is important is what is going on revenue wise after the "box" is purchased. I am quite happy to pay more once in game, it is just what we are paying for and how it effects the dynamics of the game that concern me. When it comes to the D4 gold and obols there is obviously their current usage to consider. But future uses and indeed gameplay changes which may increase the need for those resources needs to be watched. That's the era of gaming we are now in, you always have to have an eye on the revenue dynamic.


    Uwakionna
  • UwakionnaUwakionna Member RarePosts: 1,139
    edited June 2023
    Scot said:
    Uwakionna said:
    And it's prefect fine to have a personal reaction and feeling about something like that.

    As long as you weren't using it as a justification to look the other way when discussing concerns for a game. In that instance there's a reasonable point to be made on team and budget scale.

    What is ABK's excuse with CoD, OW2, and Immortal?

    There remains a division to be made here that many seem to overlook, ironically seemingly because of emotional sentiment to associated title(s) in question, even as the argument of something more broad is trying to be evoked.

    It's an extreme dissonance in sentiment to rationale, and it's leaving a lot of things unanswered.

    I get that people do not enjoy when something they like is attacked by another. At times there is a valid reason point to address, as with the example of Falcom's budget/scale.

    That is not a one size fits all argument to be making though. We can see that reflected in the other issues ABK has created in their other titles. ABK is not an indie company, and their practice's are not parallel to Falcom as they are on the polar side of even mihoyo, demonstrated by the first video noting the massive spike in cost Immortal presents compared to even Genshin. As much as one may disagree with Genshin's model, that doesn't make ABK suddenly better. And one should definitely not be transposing the sentiment of a small studio's issues onto a monolith of the industry.

    This leads to a important distinction to be made in circumstances, as was a main point in my original comment.
    I certainly think no fee for playing as opposed to B2P muddies the waters, but the upfront cost has never been an issue in any game for me. Posters may regard this as arrogance, but a stiff upfront fee puts of the F2P crowd that brings so little to gaming in my eyes.

    Oh and btw games from NW to D4 show you players will pay an upfront fee for a MMO-like game, the idea they won't is just F2P fan hype.

    So for me what is important is what is going on revenue wise after the "box" is purchased. I am quite happy to pay more once in game, it is just what we are paying for and how it effects the dynamics of the game that concern me. When it comes to the D4 gold and obols there is obviously their current usage to consider. But future uses and indeed gameplay changes which may increase the need for those resources needs to be watched. That's the era of gaming we are now in, you always have to have an eye on the revenue dynamic.
    This is part of the point that seems the most apt to keep getting glossed over.

    Not like I'm calling D4 a bad game. I'm playing it myself even.

    The zeal going on right now though makes even the most cursory concerns expressed about the very real habits already established across multiple company titles, and elements that have already been presented for the present title, rather impossible to even acknowledge without someone either screaming 'haters' or launching a whataboutism tirade.

    Just feeling a little disappointed in peeps. Few people seem capable of enjoying a game and being critical about elements of it at the same time. This echo chamber attitude just isn't healthy, and tired of seeing all or nothing mentalities as it kills productive conversation.
    ScotBrainy
  • SKurjSKurj Member UncommonPosts: 162
    edited June 2023

    Archandes said:



    SKurj said:


    game a bit of a let down... but to be fair i have spent a lot of time playing it.. with scaling though... there isn't much difference between lvl 10 and lvl 50, it just feels the same ol same ol.






    This is a completely false statement over here, the only way you can achieve this kind of mediocre-or-even-bellow character performance is by slapping any gear without matching the exact effect to your current build, and this is common problem in every other RPG as well..with or without scaling system.



    The higher level you have in D4, the more accessibility you will unlock. These feature allow you to use build that isn't viable on low level. That's what make Diablo 4 unique, is that there is a lot of build to explore rather than 1 or 2 godlike build that completely surpass others.



    ehh my build is fine, i just had hoped that something more than the same ol same ol diablo repetitive game loop would be added. apart from larger blobs of mobs nothing changes... you clear stuff just as fast if not faster than before (in the same places) so you can just get to do it again. Apart from the marketing dept.. they made no effort to attract a new audience.
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 24,429
    edited June 2023
    Uwakionna said:
    This is part of the point that seems the most apt to keep getting glossed over.

    Not like I'm calling D4 a bad game. I'm playing it myself even.

    The zeal going on right now though makes even the most cursory concerns expressed about the very real habits already established across multiple company titles, and elements that have already been presented for the present title, rather impossible to even acknowledge without someone either screaming 'haters' or launching a whataboutism tirade.

    Just feeling a little disappointed in peeps. Few people seem capable of enjoying a game and being critical about elements of it at the same time. This echo chamber attitude just isn't healthy, and tired of seeing all or nothing mentalities as it kills productive conversation.
    Some players get far too invested in games when they play them, as I have done that myself I try not to cast too many stones. Thinking back to the launch of ESO was the last time I went really overboard. You can get it in our head that someone wants to just take pot shots at the game, regardless of what they have seen or heard.

    I do think the whole of gaming media feeds this behaviour, the massive hype up, the umpteen articles, the endless drama videos where the presenters think they are auditioning for Play of the Week. :)

    This whips fans and detractors up to a point where...they.must.have.their.say! But some of our posters think that's bread and butter for the forums, I don't agree as it can go too much of the rails.
    Uwakionna
  • emperorhades1emperorhades1 Member RarePosts: 421

    Valdheim said:

    To be fair there are some users here like this emperor dude whose whole posting timeline is dedicated to spitting on D4 but on the other hand those may be the loudest but thankfully just they're just a few.



    Anyway this number tho, 100% certain it's generously rounded but I don't mind funny PR like that. I surely wouldn't want to miss out on an occasion like that aswell if I'd be on the PR team.



    Now back to my "Number of the Beast" earworm!

    edit: Somehow the site doesn't let me quote anymore. I always get some blank error window. Weird.



    Actually, I am dedicated to them making a proper sequel to Diablo. This game is trash in the current state.
    AeanderArchandes
  • GorweGorwe Member Posts: 1,609
    Talraekk said:
    Seriously I'm ~40 with all three classes.  It isn't survivability (even though that sucks bats) but skill FUNNESS.  I liked both my rogue and sorcerer better than Druid.  however my druids skills seeem to go together better, and even though they all suck, seems better than rogue or sorcerer.  Considering it takes 5-10 hits to kill anything (depending upon the ass backwards scaling) pure fights suck.  It also takes time to get into fights (Ill; walk 3 minutes no fights)
    My thoughts are ALL d3 skills were fun, wtf is going on here.
    By that same note, class skill should be more random.  Instead, if you ain't perfect, you suck....
    Not to mention that skill trees themselves aren't fun at all. Just a ton of builder / spender mech and small bonuses. Is this the best that Blizz can do? Compared to most other aRPGs, I quickly run out of steam, except if I want to grind equipment(I don't mind this if the game's fun and creative which D4 is ...only partially).
  • eoloeeoloe Member RarePosts: 864
    This $666 number is highly inaccurate and largely underestimated because I just bought a copy!

    :p
    ValdemarJemperorhades1Sovrath
  • ArchandesArchandes Member UncommonPosts: 41
    edited June 2023
    Gorwe said:
    Not to mention that skill trees themselves aren't fun at all. Just a ton of builder / spender mech and small bonuses. Is this the best that Blizz can do? Compared to most other aRPGs, I quickly run out of steam, except if I want to grind equipment(I don't mind this if the game's fun and creative which D4 is ...only partially).
    I begun to see "i pretend to play the game/ not exploring as whole"  pattern over here. I don't think anyone who has a proper knowledge about their character see their builds only in single dimension, since you can either
    1. Amplify the affix, which straight improve that build performance
    2. Combine the skill with Passive/Aspect/paragon then amplify the affix
    The example of first one would be barbarian sword spin, you can use this build early-mid-late game and it's still really impressive because this skill has good synergize with pretty much everything you have (also the most common hardcore build to date)

    Example for second point would be Storm Werewolf Build, ever see a pure werewolf as normal form, yet spitting thunders/tornado left and right on early game? obviously not, because you need unique gear which can be found at WT3/WT4

    You want build that focus that doesn't focus on core skill? then take look at trapper rogue, resetting both 10 and 50 second trap cooldown to near instant with exposure passive.

    You want build that doesn't need basic skill? well, both barbarian and rogue can do that

    You want build that doesn't need core skill? slap edgemaster aspect and go nuts 5 acive 1 basic skill

    lot's of build variety are available on Diablo 4, all you need to do is to actually play the game, like the rest of $666 million dolar buyer

    Actually, I am dedicated to them making a proper sequel to Diablo. This game is trash in the current state.
    You mean if the game isn't trash then it will generate $6666 instead of $666, or a Diablo series where you are the only one who play it?
    Post edited by Archandes on
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    edited June 2023
    Level 71 sorc. I did the T4 capstone solo at 68 and transitioned to playing on torment T4. It's a bit of a tougher transition than T2->T3 in that I still need to gear up with the higher GS items now available to me just like I did when I first started T3 but also because the minimum mob level everywhere is 73. It was rough at 68 but at 71 it's much easier.

    Gearing up mostly through Helltide "mystery chests" and Legion events both of which are also good XP and not as soul-killing as repeatedly doing dungeons with high elite density which is what the real speedy levelers do... I'm not that dedicated to leveling :)

    And still really enjoying the game!
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • UwakionnaUwakionna Member RarePosts: 1,139
    edited June 2023
    I mean if we're just posting personal blog updates now, I had some chili today.

    Enjoyed that pretty well.
    SovrathScot
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 44,059
    Iselin said:
    Uwakionna said:
    Should note there is a difference between long-term GaaS monetisation, and notably free to play, versus out-the-gate monetisation on a buy to play title. 
    There's a difference out of the gate and a difference in that everyone must pay an entry fee but that's the extent of the difference when a game like Genshin has earned more than 4 billion in not quite 3 years.

    Should Genshin's monetization be called clever instead of greedy? Should the term greedy be reserved just for B2P games when F2P games often make much more money through their manipulative tactics?

    I think that's a much more interesting discussion and personally, I don't think the fact that a game can be played for free, albeit always a lesser, more "casual" version of it, necessitates a kinder, gentler, adjective to describe F2P monetization especially when it's gacha P2W.

    Greed is greed regardless of how you go about extarcting your billions from the masses.

    I also find it interesting that Diablo Immortal seems to get more hate than Genshin and the other gacha games around these parts.

    Why does Blizzard deserve more hate for their pay-to-win piece of shit than miHoYo deserves for theirs? 

    I'm seeing double standards. Maybe it's just me.
    I am more than happy to shit on both games over their greedy monetization.  :D

    Except, is it really greedy in either case?

    They are charging whatever the market will bear for a totally optional entertainment product that no one actually "needs" to purchase.

    Sounds more like free market capitalism to me with consumers totally in control on whether or not they'll spend any money at all for the product.

    Take me for example, not a dime spent on either game...no harm, no foul in my book.

    This man actually was right



    ;)




    UwakionnaSovrath

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

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  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Kyleran said:

    This man actually was right




    Isn't that the 3rd deadly sin, or did Ayn Rand cancel that for Christians?


    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

    ― Umberto Eco

    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

  • GorweGorwe Member Posts: 1,609
    edited June 2023
    Archandes said:
    Gorwe said:
    Not to mention that skill trees themselves aren't fun at all. Just a ton of builder / spender mech and small bonuses. Is this the best that Blizz can do? Compared to most other aRPGs, I quickly run out of steam, except if I want to grind equipment(I don't mind this if the game's fun and creative which D4 is ...only partially).
    I begun to see "i pretend to play the game/ not exploring as whole"  pattern over here. I don't think anyone who has a proper knowledge about their character see their builds only in single dimension, since you can either
    1. Amplify the affix, which straight improve that build performance
    2. Combine the skill with Passive/Aspect/paragon then amplify the affix
    The example of first one would be barbarian sword spin, you can use this build early-mid-late game and it's still really impressive because this skill has good synergize with pretty much everything you have (also the most common hardcore build to date)

    Example for second point would be Storm Werewolf Build, ever see a pure werewolf as normal form, yet spitting thunders/tornado left and right on early game? obviously not, because you need unique gear which can be found at WT3/WT4

    You want build that focus that doesn't focus on core skill? then take look at trapper rogue, resetting both 10 and 50 second trap cooldown to near instant with exposure passive.

    You want build that doesn't need basic skill? well, both barbarian and rogue can do that

    You want build that doesn't need core skill? slap edgemaster aspect and go nuts 5 acive 1 basic skill

    lot's of build variety are available on Diablo 4, all you need to do is to actually play the game, like the rest of $666 million dolar buyer

    Actually, I am dedicated to them making a proper sequel to Diablo. This game is trash in the current state.
    You mean if the game isn't trash then it will generate $6666 instead of $666, or a Diablo series where you are the only one who play it?
    And you need what level in order to make all of that work? 50+? If you do, what's the point of the first 50 levels?

    Look, I just want D4 to truly be D4. Currently it seems inferior to every Diablo(except 1, maybe), EXCEPT if you are looking for World of Diablo in specific. I am not. I really am not and never have.

    Now, this is only the launch state. That also has to be taken into consideration. Can't comment on D1, but I can on the other two. D2 really became what it is with 1.07(that would say, Lord of Destruction) and D3 with Reaper of Souls. And I would actually say that it's the best Diablo launch since ... potentially ever.

    The only problem is that it's highly divisive and for no good reason. Blizz played it TOO SAFE imo. And it takes too long to get rolling. See metacritic and all the other scores. Don't want vox populi? Mr.llama SC gave it a fair shakedown and it came to 6 / 10. With which I agree.

    As for $666 million? Yeah, is Justin Bieber the new Bach or Vivaldi? Money means nothing, unless you are a share holder or like following economics / financials.
  • ArchandesArchandes Member UncommonPosts: 41
    Gorwe said:
    And you need what level in order to make all of that work? 50+? If you do, what's the point of the first 50 levels?

    Look, I just want D4 to truly be D4. Currently it seems inferior to every Diablo(except 1, maybe), EXCEPT if you are looking for World of Diablo in specific. I am not. I really am not and never have.

    Now, this is only the launch state. That also has to be taken into consideration. Can't comment on D1, but I can on the other two. D2 really became what it is with 1.07(that would say, Lord of Destruction) and D3 with Reaper of Souls. And I would actually say that it's the best Diablo launch since ... potentially ever.

    The only problem is that it's highly divisive and for no good reason. Blizz played it TOO SAFE imo. And it takes too long to get rolling. See metacritic and all the other scores. Don't want vox populi? Mr.llama SC gave it a fair shakedown and it came to 6 / 10. With which I agree.

    As for $666 million? Yeah, is Justin Bieber the new Bach or Vivaldi? Money means nothing, unless you are a share holder or like following economics / financials.
    One of siliest argument that sounds like "why my Diablo 2 Necro get crappy projectile on early level when, and when you somehow r forced to level said skill for survival, suddenly you get superior bone spear later on which is already superior on level one."

    Except Diablo 4 handle everything better by showing the player their character main skill. At later level, the game will slowly give you an "external tool" for offense,defense,even mobility. Also the ability to constantly change your built at small expense on early level. That's the reason why you spend 50 level on early game, which is to find your character identity and the build that suits your gameplay.

    And why paragon comes at very late game is because these feature always meant to strengthen your current build alongside the aspect that your character currently have. Adding it on early level will easily confuse many player, or resulted in few build variety due to said confusion (thus resulting to use youtube meta build altogether).

    Like it or not, Diablo 4 system allow both casual and tryhard to be efficient at what they do. This game rewards content exploration and build diversity much better than previous series, yes im talking about D1 D2 and D3 altogether.

    If you want to spend hundreds of hour trying only to get a decent  build with a character who suffer mainly early game in order to save skill point that you can show of to your inner circle. Then Diablo 2 vanilla is over there :D
  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 7,098
    edited June 2023
    Archandes said:
    Gorwe said:
    Not to mention that skill trees themselves aren't fun at all. Just a ton of builder / spender mech and small bonuses. Is this the best that Blizz can do? Compared to most other aRPGs, I quickly run out of steam, except if I want to grind equipment(I don't mind this if the game's fun and creative which D4 is ...only partially).
    I begun to see "i pretend to play the game/ not exploring as whole"  pattern over here. I don't think anyone who has a proper knowledge about their character see their builds only in single dimension, since you can either
    1. Amplify the affix, which straight improve that build performance
    2. Combine the skill with Passive/Aspect/paragon then amplify the affix
    The example of first one would be barbarian sword spin, you can use this build early-mid-late game and it's still really impressive because this skill has good synergize with pretty much everything you have (also the most common hardcore build to date)

    Example for second point would be Storm Werewolf Build, ever see a pure werewolf as normal form, yet spitting thunders/tornado left and right on early game? obviously not, because you need unique gear which can be found at WT3/WT4

    You want build that focus that doesn't focus on core skill? then take look at trapper rogue, resetting both 10 and 50 second trap cooldown to near instant with exposure passive.

    You want build that doesn't need basic skill? well, both barbarian and rogue can do that

    You want build that doesn't need core skill? slap edgemaster aspect and go nuts 5 acive 1 basic skill

    lot's of build variety are available on Diablo 4, all you need to do is to actually play the game, like the rest of $666 million dolar buyer

    Actually, I am dedicated to them making a proper sequel to Diablo. This game is trash in the current state.
    You mean if the game isn't trash then it will generate $6666 instead of $666, or a Diablo series where you are the only one who play it?
    The problem is you need to be level50+ and make it to Tier3!

    I had a blast playing my Druid through the Campaign, but the moment it was finished and I hit level45 it all started to fall apart.

    No matter what I do, the RNG gods are against me and I am unable to get any good drops. Grinding dungeons, Legion events, even occasional World Boss Event. All I am getting are late level 30ish gear, all the while I keep leveling up and my character is feeling weaker and weaker.

    I am now level 48 with the Druid and everything just feels like a slog now. Everything takes way longer to kill now and Elite packs in overworld and dungeons almost one shot me.

    It's the same thing on my Barbarian, but that one quickly got worse. I had a breeze leveling though Act.1 to 5 in the Campaign, but I had to use every ounce of skill to make it through the end of Act.6 and finally kill Lilith, without getting one-shotted by elite packs. 
    Here too, when I got past level40, gear drops became total arsesh!t and now at level48 it's simply no longer fun to play this character.

    The whole level scaling is just a disaster in this game! If you unlucky with gear drops, your character just keeps on leveling to the point it starts to suck the fun out of the game, due to increased difficulty spikes thanks to said world level scaling!


    People shouldn't have to join a group with a high level character carrying through the Tier2 Capstone dungeon, so you can finally get into Tier3 and finally get some better gear!

    Nor isn't everyone a no-life streamer/youtuber who can play 24/7 in Tier1-2, grinding dungeons to get the perfect rolls on gear to finally make a build work somewhat to get you through said capstone dungeon!


    Even though Diablo 3 had world scaling too, it worked way better and the loot tables were also much better. I had way more fun leveling characters through each season and was able to ramp up the difficulty Tiers quickly for more challenge while leveling, because my character was actually getting stronger with each level, with actually getting better gear and unlocking more skills!
    In Diablo 3 it was also much easier to get gear with good stats, since it was way easier to craft new gear with new stats or use enchanting to reroll bad stats.


    There is a lot of good stuff in Diablo 4 and in general I had a ton of fun playing through the Campaign!
    But there are some serious issues that needs to be addressed, like the ones I mention above.
    Post edited by JeroKane on
    Gorwe
  • ArchandesArchandes Member UncommonPosts: 41
    edited June 2023
    Please kindly explain about "bad loot" since you get showered by yellow/ legendary by the time you reach level 30+++ by just roaming around and spamming event.

     my rogue can mow down curator with half baked gear on lv 50, and elias w fire resist gear at lv 61 and my rogue doesn't use meta build at all back then and most likely my druid will likely do the exact same thing tomorrow.

    The key is to either outlevel/outgetared the boss minimum level (isn't that hard to do) or ask your friend/discord for a help. If you want to do it all solo & undergeared...then simply master your build and git gud.


  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 7,098
    edited June 2023
    Archandes said:
    Please kindly explain about "bad loot" since you get showered by yellow/ legendary by the time you reach level 30+++ by just roaming around and spamming event.

     my rogue can mow down curator with half baked gear on lv 50, and elias w fire resist gear at lv 61 and my rogue doesn't use meta build at all back then and most likely my druid will likely do the exact same thing tomorrow.

    The key is to either outlevel/outgetared the boss minimum level (isn't that hard to do) or ask your friend/discord for a help. If you want to do it all solo & undergeared...then simply master your build and git gud.


    The amount of loot isn't the problem nor is my skill with ARPG's. I have played D2 and D3 a ton, Grim Dawn, PoE, etc. So I know my way around in ARPG's.

    The problem is that everything that drops now is crap and at least 8-10 levels below my current level.
    I don't get any level40+ items currently on my Barbarian! None! Even though both my Druid and Barbarian are level 48 at the moment. That is the issue.
    I have been farming non-stop in both T1 and T2. Makes no difference.

    Only my Druid has a one lvl43 weapon and one level42 chest piece (which dropped in the last Act.6 dungeon towards Lilith endboss fight). This was over a week ago, before I rolled a Barbarian and started leveling that one.
    Lilith is the endboss in Act.6, with the entire dungeon being marked as level45+ content, yet drops only lvl40 items. 5 levels below what Act.6 recommended level is!
    That is how broken the loot tables are in this game.
    Since Tier 1 and 2 are up to level50, it should be raining level 45+ drops now both my Characters are level 48! Yet it doesn't. 99% of the drops are level 38 or lower, with an occasional level40 drop.
    This makes no sense, when the entire game world is now scaled to 48+ and all the mobs having a power level of 48+.
    I am even doing some Stormholds now, which are now scaled to level50 and the drops in there are also 10 levels lower!  It's a complete joke!

    A lot of people are actually complaining about this and I guess I am also unlucky to arrive at level48 at this moment now, after all the nerfs Blizzard has been doing so far post-launch.

    A lot of the leveling guides you can find online, which I have been looking at for some guidance. Most of these were made pre-launch/just after launch, before all the nerfs that have hit the game the last two weeks and have not been updated.
    Only Endgame builds are being updated constantly, as that is where these people (who write these guides) are at.
    Those are completely useless below level50, since they require Legendary Aspects and Paragon for synergy to work well.

    Either way. That isn't really the issue. The skill trees are easy to understand and it's not that hard to make a good build that works well.
    So that is not really the issue and the builds I have been running were good and performed well, as long as my gear drops kept matching up and were level appropriate. Which they were up to level40!

    Another solution would be to just farm gold and then try to reroll some of the useless attributes on my gear to try boost my Attack power and Armor values (or simply stats that benefit my build), but that is also broken in Tier1/2, since I have all Legendary gear now and you cannot enchant (reroll) attributes on this gear in Tier1/2, because it requires and ultra-rare ingredient that you can only get from Helltides!

    This is yet another stupid problem in this game!
    Why the hell would my level 34-42 Legendary gear require ultra rare ingredients from Tier 3 to be able to enchant?!
    Tier 3 is level50+, so any gear below level 50 should not require ingredients from Tier3/4. That is just stupid / lazy design from Blizzard.

    Also, overleveling yourself beyond level50 in Tier1/2 is stupid, horribly slow and not going to help you much, if you don't get any better gear.
    It just highlight the problems of the current level scaling implementation in the game and shortsightness of Blizzard.

    Blizzard needs to fix the level40-50 bracket loot tables! Pure and simple!
    As the loot tables so far have been fine up to level40 and was pretty much always getting level appropriate drops.

    If they fix this and I am actually getting level appropriate drops (lvl45+), this would pretty much fix most of the issues I am currently having.

    Post edited by JeroKane on
    Gorwe
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Item equip level is almost meaningless in this game. I had the same "WTF?" reaction when I saw drops in the early levels that were 8 or 10 levels below me.

    Once you start playing in T4 and have drops that are regular, sacred, or ancestral all at the same equip level but with vastly different gear scores ranging from under 600 to over 800 that really drives home the point that equip level means absolutely nothing.

    In T1 and T2, yes there is some correlation between equip level and power but even there you're better off ignoring level and just looking at affixes and gear score.

    Itemization is not broken but it does take some getting used to.
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  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 7,098
    edited June 2023
    Iselin said:
    Item equip level is almost meaningless in this game. I had the same "WTF?" reaction when I saw drops in the early levels that were 8 or 10 levels below me.

    Once you start playing in T4 and have drops that are regular, sacred, or ancestral all at the same equip level but with vastly different gear scores ranging from under 600 to over 800 that really drives home the point that equip level means absolutely nothing.

    In T1 and T2, yes there is some correlation between equip level and power but even there you're better off ignoring level and just looking at affixes and gear score.

    Itemization is not broken but it does take some getting used to.
    EXACTLY! It's no issue in Tier 3 and 4, due to going after Sacred and Ancestral gear and them working differently.

    It is an issue in Tier 1 and 2, as having gear equipped 8-10 levels below you (especially in Tier 2) will have a significant impact on your damage output and survivability.
    Especially if, on top of low level gear, you are also unlucky with the bad/useless attribute rolls, which suck big time in this game. As class builds benefit greatly (if not depend) on getting gear with skill attributes that synergize with your build.

    They did this way better in Diablo 3 with the crafting system, plus it was much easier to enchant (aka reroll) bad attributes on gear.
    So even during leveling, it was fairly easy to get gear with decent beneficial attributes to help optimize your build, due to the accesible crafting system, helped by an easier (cheaper) enchant system.
    So it was way more fun and easier leveling up and increasing difficulty Tiers.

    This has been highlighted by various youtubers, that it's much harder to get good gear in this game + legendary aspects that you need to make your build work at higher levels/endgame. Unless you play 24/7.

    No doubt done on purpose, where Blizzard pretty much guaranteed to have a plan to introduce "convenience" items to the Cash Shop in the near future to help players along, like in their mobile DI game. ;)

    Seriously, I don't see the majority of players sticking around beyond Season 1.
    A lot of the Standard Edition buyers will probably not even try Season 1 and buy a battle pass, seeing the grind involved, doing renown again, etc.

    Most might stick around to level 60, maybe 70 at most, until the grind and uphill battle simply becomes too much.


    I already start to feel the burn-out kreeping in myself, with two characters at Level 48 now, not even made it into Tier 3 and slowly loosing the motivation to log in, now I finished the Story Campaign twice (which was amazing by the way! Much better than D3 story campaign).
    Simply because right now it's just a boring slog of a grind, with bad useless drop after bad useless drop.  It just sucks the motivation out of you.
  • ArchandesArchandes Member UncommonPosts: 41
    Around level 40++, what you should look at your gear is not min level required, but the gear level instead because max gear level <WT3 is around 620. This mean 500 GS should act as a softcap (i think it's around 36+ character level gear) that allow you to take down curator and ascend to WT3.

    As for gear enchantment, you can fully upgrade your gear (level 3 require yellow gear mats, level 4 require legendary mats) to make your life easier when fighting curator, but i won't recommend it since it's a waste of material

    The key to get strong on early game is simply by abusing aspect of might and aspect of disobedience. These 2 aspect will catapult your defense sky high, allow you to eat nearly everything that should instakill your character. Also don't forget to match your gem (if you have any) with boss damage type, since it will greatly reduce their main dmg/

    For low leveling gear, i recommend doing event on zone that has a bit higher level than your character since it will drop high level gear that has the same/higher level than your current level. Yea it's weird but if you want huge boost then this is the only way.
  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 7,098
    edited June 2023
    There really is something off in the level 40-50 bracket and it's indeed weird.

    Like I said, I had absolutely no problem leveling up my Druid and Barbarian to about level 43 or so. ( Druid plays much better in lower levels now compared to Open beta weekends, though Barbarian was still a slog at times ).

    After that, gear drops became bad and both my characters started to feel weaker with each level up. Monsters became harder to kill and especially Elites became much stronger with each level up.
    Level scaling really started to hit me smack in the middle of my face! Frustrating the hell out of me.

    Just as an example. I finished the Campaign at around level 43 with my Druid and he felt really powerful (all the bosses and Lilith were a breeze/almost too easy), as I had some gear items with really good attributes that synergized with my build really well.
    When I switched to Tier 2, I still managed well with some small tweaks in my build, but then when I leveled up a couple levels to around level 46 (my good gear items were legendary and in high lvl20's / early level30's) I started to get one-shotted by Elite's as the level of my gear lagged too much behind, so I was forced to replace it with higher level gear ( still only lvl38-40 ) with terrible rolls on them, just to stay alive, but lost my good synergy stats in the process.
    My survivability improved somewhat, but even simple monsters took ages to kill and in Dungeons, with big mob packs with multiple elites, they just suddenly started to hit much harder at level 46.... I was forced to drop back down to Tier 1.

    I tried the capstone dungeon at Level 48 and I didn't even make it past the first two packs of Elites. Ran out of all 9 potions within 10 seconds. That's how hard they hit!
    Even though I managed to clear dungeons and Stormholds (which are level50) in Tier 2 (though frustrating long slog, but I did manage to clear them without dying a single time. That's why I dropped back to Tier1. It was just not efficient and not fun).

    This is these sudden difficulty spikes in the scaling people keep complaining about!

    Yes yellow gear you can enchant in Tier 1/2, but Legendary gear you cannot enchant in Tier 1/2, as they require materials from Helltides (when I checked on my Druid)!

    In Tier 3 it might become easier, since you get access to Paragon and glyphs to really optimize and help your build. Plus you can start obtaining Sacred gear.

    Again which you cannot do in Tier 1/2.

    Either way. Right now... the scaling is really OFF in level 40-50 bracket. Especially 45+!
    It wouldn't surprise me that this might be the (unintended) effects of all the nerfs Blizzard has done to the classes in the game on almost daily basis, just to tone down the power of the 24/7 youtube/streamers runnning overpowered endgame builds, without testing the effects of these nerfs in the lower levels.  Which has become typical Blizzard arrogance and incompetence really.  Scrambling and panicking on the handful of diehard 24/7 streamers and screwing over the majority of more casual players with blanket nerfs without testing. /shrug

    PS. You just have to look at the reported stats. The vast majority of players are still stuck in Tier 1/2.
    Only a small fraction of the playerbase actually made it to Tier 3/4 so far.

    Post edited by JeroKane on
  • ArchandesArchandes Member UncommonPosts: 41
    edited June 2023
    strange, so far all my 500 legendary gear only need basic mats for upgrade. reroll isn't that important on T2, and if you want it that bad then simply use yellow gear -> reroll for better stat -> imprint legendary.

    As for spongy enemies, my druid also experience it on low level because my stat distribution were messed up. Once i found that i only need crit chance/damage  + willpower for DPS since my shred spit lightning on critical hit, everything start to melt after that.

    Even when fighting 45++ enemy with bunch of 35 gear in WT2, so far i can still manage to survive hordes while alt tabbing left and right.
  • JeroKaneJeroKane Member EpicPosts: 7,098
    edited June 2023
    Archandes said:
    strange, so far all my 500 legendary gear only need basic mats for upgrade. reroll isn't that important on T2, and if you want it that bad then simply use yellow gear -> reroll for better stat -> imprint legendary.

    As for spongy enemies, my druid also experience it on low level because my stat distribution were messed up. Once i found that i only need crit chance/damage  + willpower for DPS since my shred spit lightning on critical hit, everything start to melt after that.

    Even when fighting 45++ enemy with bunch of 35 gear in WT2, so far i can still manage to survive hordes while alt tabbing left and right.
    I had that gear that boosted the right stats and synergized well with my Druid, but that stopped after level 45+, since this gear became too low level due to level scaling!
    So I was forced to replace it with higher level gear with bad rolls and so far, after days of grinding I have not been able to get better drops with the right rolls to help my Druid nor my Barbarian.
    Leveling my Barbarian was far worse and much more of a struggle, as I was unlucky the entire way with bad drops!

    That is the issue, when you make these specific synergies important in the game, which is fine and actually fun to tinker with (was no different in Diablo 3 or any other good (A)RPG for that matter).
    So I know this, I have forced myself through some good youtube videos to help me find out the right attributes/stats I need on my gear to synergize with my Druid and Barbarian builds, but then I need to get those friggin' drops to make it work!
    And yes I have Aspects, but they don't help much if the gear itself has bad attributes and lagging 6-10 levels behind your current level!
    Aspects only help you so much, unless you are extremely lucky to get one of the really good Legendary aspects in an early drop! But then beware! You can only imprint it once! So not recommended to waste on non-sacred/ancestral gear!

    The whole level scaling only makes this worse! With all that grinding, you keep leveling up and if you don't get the right drops you become weaker and weaker with each level up!
    This is well known by now and one of the MAIN complaints people currently have with this game!

    If you have the RNG gods against you, which I unfortunately have right now on both my characters (most likely also compounded by wonky loot tables in 40-50 range and all the nerfs Blizzard has done last two weeks), you simply get screwed over by the level scaling!

    The level scaling implementation in this game just sucks balls! Pure and simple.

  • ArchandesArchandes Member UncommonPosts: 41
    Again, still kicking 45++ enemy left and right with 500 gear level over here. Also, my legendary weapon is actually a yellow one that got rerolled for willpower (no Helltide material needed) then imprinted for better effect.

    I guess each people has their own problem, none of my clan or even my brother who barely woke up when playing the game since he got job + side job throughout the week  encounter any problem with this game scaling system.
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