I can tell you what pi$$es me off when it comes to comparing WoW (or ANY other MMORPG in that matter) & GW:
Its when the wannabe-fanbois of GW tries to be as "cool" (in lack of better word cause I am not english) as the true hardcore RolePlayers in REAL MMORPGS!
Its like when you see those cheesy karate-morons aged 12 who is sexually addicted to Bruce Lee, and think they gonna be like him when they grow up. Makes me SICK!
Dunno if I wanna laugh or be angry.... Anyways, very ashamed.
Look here: Please, I do NOT want to be compared with the GW players... Anyone understand that?
Wouldnt it be lovely if this GW forum and the whole game was removed from this site....?
Originally posted by Phoenixs Originally posted by Elnator Originally posted by Phoenixs People don't like calling GW a mmo because you will never get more than about 100 people together in the same "world". Either it's the instances out in the wilderness with your party, or it's Town_Instance_143 and so on. You are always in a instance.
I don't think any mmo released this year will come close to the numbers Wow has. Maybe it will never happen again. All big upcoming names in the mmo genre are not destined for big subscribtion numbers. Vanguard is too hardcore. Age of Conan is too mature. Maybe WAR. But I doubt that though. I think it will be more advanced than the instant gratification kids like. GW won't reach it either I think Maybe a couple of million. Maybe that is why arena net is turning the game into a eastern "Omg, Win 1 million $!" game. It starts to remind me of games like RyL and many of the asian free to play mmo's.
Sorry, WoW is instanced too. Not to mention it's broken up into separate servers with only about 3k players on each, some with much fewer. So how is that any different? The ONLY major difference between GuildWars and more traditional MMORPG's is that once you leave town it's just your group in the instance, nobody else. But in town you are able to play with anyone. And moving between instances is both possible, and common practice so while, yes, it's instanced, you aren't forced into just 1 instance in the cities/towns. You can move between instances with ease. So arguing that instancing somehow makes it 'not an MMO' is silly. DDO is even more instanced and they call THAT an MMORPG. LOL
Wow has instanced Dungeons and battlegrounds that's it. All players on 1 server can meet up if they want. That is what defines massive for me. Thousands of players that can meet up on one spot. Without going through immersion breakers like changing to Ironforge version 234. In GW all players can never meet each other. They can chat. But they can never see each other. Instance changing works if you are just a couple of people. Not even that works always. There is a limit for how many 1 isntance takes. You get situations like "Let's meet in Town_132" "oh Town_132 is full" "Then we have to find another" "I think Town_34 has some free spots" Stuff like that totally breaks the immersion for me. I don't call DDO a mmo either. Because of all the instancing. In the end it doesn't matter what you call them. But I won't call games like GW and DDO mmorpg's. I won't play them either. Because the instancing kills the game for me.
Point of fact: If all players on 1 server meet in one place in WoW the server will crash. Period. So, no, all players cannot.
As far as whether you want to "call" them an MMORPG or not doesn't make them not one. They fit the definition of an MMORPG. Its a broad definition for a class of game: One where large numbers of people play in a role playing environment online. Whether you like it or not GuildWars, while it is more accurately defined as a CORPG, is an MMORPG.
Just because you don't like calling it one doesn't mean it's not. And it certainly doesn't mean it doesn't belong on the site.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
Originally posted by Elnator Originally posted by Abraxos Truth be told, WOW is a genetic MMORPG freak. No one is ever going to grab those numbers again for a long time or even come close. I'm looking forward to several MMORPGs and have cancelled my WOW account but I realistically doubt any of them will see 6 million subscribers. As said already, Guild Wars isn't a MMORPG. It doesn't have even close to the amount of content that is available in WOW or even EQII for that matter. The only reason they hit a million people is because they are
You claim Guild Wars isn't an MMORPG because exactly what? It's got 1.5 million players. In towns/cities they can all play together, crafting, roleplaying, forming guilds, getting quests, finishing quests, selling items to npc's, buying items from npc's, joining/leaving/forming parties, etc. So 1.5 million players PLAYING together: Massively Multiplayer
It's played Online
In it you creacte a customized character who fills a role in a group and you can even 'roleplay' that character depending on what your personal prference is. So it's an RPG
So how is it NOT an MMORPG? I'll be the first to jump right in and say it IS a CORPG because it is marketted as such but saying it's *not* an MMORPG is silly. It's not a *traditional* MMORPG but that doesn't mean it's not one at all.
By my own personal definition it does not offer enough content, RPGing, or expansive immersiveness as in huge cities, dungeons and a full world feel. It felt very linear to me. You could do quest in various orders but overall it felt very linear with a very boxy console Fable like feel to it.
It doesn't really matter to me what it is called except that I think it should be compared to Dungeon Seige or Fable before it is compared to WOW. Granted I did not get to the PvP portion because I lost interest before that but from the questing PVE side it feels much more like a PSII game than a MMORPG. I think because you are not charged monthly for it that this is OK but now other similiar games are trying to push GW like games at us for a subscription price ie: D&D Online. It actually reminded me of Asheron's Call 2 more than any other MMORPG I've tried.
Overall point is that a lot of people who never played any other MMORPGs are trying Guild Wars because it is free and I think it is misleading for them to think that all other MMORPGs are like it.
ive tryed lots of " real mmorpgs " i like the feeling of a huge map .. but for my daily fun i prefer guildwars , its team work oriented .. i can log in and be playing a random pvp battle 4 vs 4 , or i can go to town and chill out till something cool to do apears .. or i can start my own bizare goal and invite people to go with me , map exploring etc .
those real mmorpgs make me feel alone in the desert
as for the linear feeling , i dont see any diference from the real mmorpgs to gw ..
the real mmorpg are linear too ... noob town , low level mobs .. the most distanced place from noob town , high level mobs ...
Originally posted by Abraxos Originally posted by Elnator Originally posted by Abraxos Truth be told, WOW is a genetic MMORPG freak. No one is ever going to grab those numbers again for a long time or even come close. I'm looking forward to several MMORPGs and have cancelled my WOW account but I realistically doubt any of them will see 6 million subscribers. As said already, Guild Wars isn't a MMORPG. It doesn't have even close to the amount of content that is available in WOW or even EQII for that matter. The only reason they hit a million people is because they are
You claim Guild Wars isn't an MMORPG because exactly what? It's got 1.5 million players. In towns/cities they can all play together, crafting, roleplaying, forming guilds, getting quests, finishing quests, selling items to npc's, buying items from npc's, joining/leaving/forming parties, etc. So 1.5 million players PLAYING together: Massively Multiplayer
It's played Online
In it you creacte a customized character who fills a role in a group and you can even 'roleplay' that character depending on what your personal prference is. So it's an RPG
So how is it NOT an MMORPG? I'll be the first to jump right in and say it IS a CORPG because it is marketted as such but saying it's *not* an MMORPG is silly. It's not a *traditional* MMORPG but that doesn't mean it's not one at all.
By my own personal definition it does not offer enough content, RPGing, or expansive immersiveness as in huge cities, dungeons and a full world feel. It felt very linear to me. You could do quest in various orders but overall it felt very linear with a very boxy console Fable like feel to it.
It doesn't really matter to me what it is called except that I think it should be compared to Dungeon Seige or Fable before it is compared to WOW. Granted I did not get to the PvP portion because I lost interest before that but from the questing PVE side it feels much more like a PSII game than a MMORPG. I think because you are not charged monthly for it that this is OK but now other similiar games are trying to push GW like games at us for a subscription price ie: D&D Online. It actually reminded me of Asheron's Call 2 more than any other MMORPG I've tried.
Overall point is that a lot of people who never played any other MMORPGs are trying Guild Wars because it is free and I think it is misleading for them to think that all other MMORPGs are like it.
Actually most of the people I know who play GW are folks who are tired of paying monthly fees for MMO's.... mostly vets of other games. I know that's why I do. And I've played just about every MMORPG on the "released" game list
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
I think that Guild Wars, and all of the other Guild Wars titles will be very successful, as they already are, for years to come. I think people are getting tired of WoW. GW doesn't get as boring as fast. I think that Guild Wars will be one of, if not the most, successful MMORPG's ever. It is free, fun, awesome graphics, and very interactive with the environment and an active communnity.
Originally posted by Navonod_7 I think that Guild Wars, and all of the other Guild Wars titles will be very successful, as they already are, for years to come. I think people are getting tired of WoW. GW doesn't get as boring as fast. I think that Guild Wars will be one of, if not the most, successful MMORPG's ever. It is free, fun, awesome graphics, and very interactive with the environment and an active communnity.
Originally posted by Navonod_7 I think that Guild Wars, and all of the other Guild Wars titles will be very successful, as they already are, for years to come. I think people are getting tired of WoW. GW doesn't get as boring as fast. I think that Guild Wars will be one of, if not the most, successful MMORPG's ever. It is free, fun, awesome graphics, and very interactive with the environment and an active communnity.
"GW doesn't get as boring as fast." true, for me it got boring ever faster.
otherwise, your other obvious statements are true.
That was referring to Navonod_7's post in particular.
This is a silly topic anyways, I have lost count of how many threads there are about GW vs wow and vice-versa. WTH does it matter anyways? Why don't u try both and see what you enjoy best? And what's with this rage against wow anyways? How many other succesfull mmos are out there and u silly children keep picking on wow and their community??
U know what's funny, I might be wrong, but the wow community doesn't even really debate this topic. It's like wasting all this time comparing things that aren't even the same. It seems the rage is all coming from this side.
I am no fanboy, wow just happens to be the game I'm playing at the moment because so far not much else has satisfied me. I do play GW sometimes over the weekend before u star shooting crap at me.
If you really want, I can drop here some facts to which GW, so far, has no rebuttal:
- mounts (that's right, riding a horse alongside other people all around the huge persistent world is fun, don't believe me?)
- 8 different species (I see, maybe you don't like variety)
- 7 universal professions + 2 different faction-specific professions
- auction house (yup, u can play it just like the real thing, buying underpriced stuff and selling high)
- multiple crafting professions (don't like it?? U just like to kill and fight?? Well, other people like it quite a bit FYI, so add one more point to wow for "what else is there to do in this game anyways?")
- long distance travelling by flying (do I really need to say that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun?? Well then, let me tell you that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun)
- Email (including emailing of items and money) (no need to meet/wait for anyone to log in, just email whatever u need to tell/give them)
- vast persistent world, meaning that never is your character bound from going anywhere by "glass walls", and giving the sensation that the world around your character really is huge and true to scale, since u actually have to travel the distances and not jump to another location (do you even understand how much of a difference this makes in the perception of the game environment???? It's huge for roleplaying)
having said that, how the hell do you people dare comparing GW to wow in such a strict way??? They are NOT THE SAME KIND OF GAME!
Originally posted by britoca Originally posted by Navonod_7 I think that Guild Wars, and all of the other Guild Wars titles will be very successful, as they already are, for years to come. I think people are getting tired of WoW. GW doesn't get as boring as fast. I think that Guild Wars will be one of, if not the most, successful MMORPG's ever. It is free, fun, awesome graphics, and very interactive with the environment and an active communnity.
"GW doesn't get as boring as fast." true, for me it got boring ever faster.
otherwise, your other obvious statements are true.
That was referring to Navonod_7's post in particular.
This is a silly topic anyways, I have lost count of how many threads there are about GW vs wow and vice-versa. WTH does it matter anyways? Why don't u try both and see what you enjoy best? And what's with this rage against wow anyways? How many other succesfull mmos are out there and u silly children keep picking on wow and their community??
U know what's funny, I might be wrong, but the wow community doesn't even really debate this topic. It's like wasting all this time comparing things that aren't even the same. It seems the rage is all coming from this side.
I am no fanboy, wow just happens to be the game I'm playing at the moment because so far not much else has satisfied me. I do play GW sometimes over the weekend before u star shooting crap at me.
If you really want, I can drop here some facts to which GW, so far, has no rebuttal:
- mounts (that's right, riding a horse alongside other people all around the huge persistent world is fun, don't believe me?)
- 8 different species (I see, maybe you don't like variety)
- 7 universal professions + 2 different faction-specific professions
- auction house (yup, u can play it just like the real thing, buying underpriced stuff and selling high)
- multiple crafting professions (don't like it?? U just like to kill and fight?? Well, other people like it quite a bit FYI, so add one more point to wow for "what else is there to do in this game anyways?")
- long distance travelling by flying (do I really need to say that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun?? Well then, let me tell you that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun)
- Email (including emailing of items and money) (no need to meet/wait for anyone to log in, just email whatever u need to tell/give them)
- vast persistent world, meaning that never is your character bound from going anywhere by "glass walls", and giving the sensation that the world around your character really is huge and true to scale, since u actually have to travel the distances and not jump to another location (do you even understand how much of a difference this makes in the perception of the game environment???? It's huge for roleplaying)
having said that, how the hell do you people dare comparing GW to wow in such a strict way??? They are NOT THE SAME KIND OF GAME!
GuildWars is better than WoW. In my opinion Because I hate WoW, find it boring. Found the Graphics to be abhorrent to me (I HATE cartoon style graphics). On the other hand I enjoy playing Guild Wars
Oh and there is that whole: "I saved a bunch of money by not paying a monthly fee" aspect to it too.
In your first year in WoW you will spend $230 on the game. In your second you will again spend over $200 for the game if you buy the expansion... otherwise you will 'merely' spend $180.
In GuildWars you will spend $30 in your first year in the game (you can get it for $30 now). In your second you will again spend about $30 IF you choose to buy the expansion, otherwise you will spend.... $0.
So for me GuildWars is a better game than WoW. However that's subjective. One of my best friends loves WoW and plays it all the time and considers the $300+ he's spent on it so far a 'good investment' (Personally I think he's nuts, I have much better things to spend $300 on)
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
Originally posted by Elnator Originally posted by britoca Originally posted by Navonod_7 I think that Guild Wars, and all of the other Guild Wars titles will be very successful, as they already are, for years to come. I think people are getting tired of WoW. GW doesn't get as boring as fast. I think that Guild Wars will be one of, if not the most, successful MMORPG's ever. It is free, fun, awesome graphics, and very interactive with the environment and an active communnity.
"GW doesn't get as boring as fast." true, for me it got boring ever faster.
otherwise, your other obvious statements are true.
That was referring to Navonod_7's post in particular.
This is a silly topic anyways, I have lost count of how many threads there are about GW vs wow and vice-versa. WTH does it matter anyways? Why don't u try both and see what you enjoy best? And what's with this rage against wow anyways? How many other succesfull mmos are out there and u silly children keep picking on wow and their community??
U know what's funny, I might be wrong, but the wow community doesn't even really debate this topic. It's like wasting all this time comparing things that aren't even the same. It seems the rage is all coming from this side.
I am no fanboy, wow just happens to be the game I'm playing at the moment because so far not much else has satisfied me. I do play GW sometimes over the weekend before u star shooting crap at me.
If you really want, I can drop here some facts to which GW, so far, has no rebuttal:
- mounts (that's right, riding a horse alongside other people all around the huge persistent world is fun, don't believe me?)
- 8 different species (I see, maybe you don't like variety)
- 7 universal professions + 2 different faction-specific professions
- auction house (yup, u can play it just like the real thing, buying underpriced stuff and selling high)
- multiple crafting professions (don't like it?? U just like to kill and fight?? Well, other people like it quite a bit FYI, so add one more point to wow for "what else is there to do in this game anyways?")
- long distance travelling by flying (do I really need to say that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun?? Well then, let me tell you that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun)
- Email (including emailing of items and money) (no need to meet/wait for anyone to log in, just email whatever u need to tell/give them)
- vast persistent world, meaning that never is your character bound from going anywhere by "glass walls", and giving the sensation that the world around your character really is huge and true to scale, since u actually have to travel the distances and not jump to another location (do you even understand how much of a difference this makes in the perception of the game environment???? It's huge for roleplaying)
having said that, how the hell do you people dare comparing GW to wow in such a strict way??? They are NOT THE SAME KIND OF GAME!
GuildWars is better than WoW. In my opinion Because I hate WoW, find it boring. Found the Graphics to be abhorrent to me (I HATE cartoon style graphics). On the other hand I enjoy playing Guild Wars
Oh and there is that whole: "I saved a bunch of money by not paying a monthly fee" aspect to it too.
In your first year in WoW you will spend $230 on the game. In your second you will again spend over $200 for the game if you buy the expansion... otherwise you will 'merely' spend $180.
In GuildWars you will spend $30 in your first year in the game (you can get it for $30 now). In your second you will again spend about $30 IF you choose to buy the expansion, otherwise you will spend.... $0.
So for me GuildWars is a better game than WoW. However that's subjective. One of my best friends loves WoW and plays it all the time and considers the $300+ he's spent on it so far a 'good investment' (Personally I think he's nuts, I have much better things to spend $300 on)
yeah, the monetary issue is very subjective. If you go to a bar twice /month, u will probably spend over $15. If you go to the movies twice / month, you will probably spend the $15 right there also. If you have netflixs, likewise. If you have cell phone, likewise.
So there are all thse little goods and services in life that we already pay for and are benefitting from and no one seems to get all rallied about. Any game with a subscription has it value. Wow is a good service for me, it brings me entertainment, several hours each night. It's actually more wastefull to go out for dinner anytime, anywhere than spending the money on wow. Just think of the number of hours I get of gameplay for the $15 I pay. What matters is whether or not u can find the same thing for free or cheaper.
I insist on saying that GW is excellent value, off course, but it lacks many features that me and other players enjoy very much in a game. So point is, what's the good of being "free" if it doesn't have half the stuff I'd like in a game? It's like saying "GW is an excellent cheap 1-seat car for your family", u see what I mean?
Also, everyone really needs to stop the childish bickering with wow. I mean, did we attack you people? Did I organize a massive DNS attack on GW's servers or something? Am I ruining your GW experience when I play wow? Seriously, comparing GW to other games is totally fine with me, but thread after thread after thread of "gw this, and wow that".... it's just bumb
One more thing, if you're a hardcore GW player, from what I read here in the forums, u exhaust the map fairly quickly. The devs are also planning releases each 6 months (from what I read/hear). This means that the game you are buying has a novelty factor of about 6 months. So if you are always buying these expansion packs every six months, it adds up to about 2 x $45/game = $90/year. $90/12 months = $7.5 /month, which is half of a regular monthly fee. Granted, it's cheaper than a top monthly fee game, but not nearly as "free" as everyone seems to be arguing for in these forums.
I normally don't like responding this way, but I feel prompted to do so now. Please excuse me.
- mounts (that's right, riding a horse alongside other people all around the huge persistent world is fun, don't believe me?)
True, but GW also doesn't need them with the map fast travel. There's simply no need for mounts, thus, they're not included.
- 8 different species (I see, maybe you don't like variety) Actually, this bugs me, too. But, there've been rumors of new playable species being included in future chapters, so that's still open. - 7 universal professions + 2 different faction-specific professions I may not know much about WoW, but I was under the impression that most of those professions were like "Cook" and "Merchant". Please correct me if I'm wrong on that. But, how many of those professions were available at the start? I'm all for more variety, though, and eventually, GW will have a larger selection. Since factions, we're at 8 total professions, with 8 potential subclass options for each.
- auction house (yup, u can play it just like the real thing, buying underpriced stuff and selling high) While it is true that we currently have no auction house (one is being planned, but there's other more important things to be implemented first), that doesn't mean that you can't buy-low-sell-high. I know a good number of people over at GuildWarsGuru that do this exact thing by just sitting in specific towns waiting for a good deal to come by. They buy low, then resell high, and make a killing off of it. GWG is also an auction site, so you can still do your whole auction thing there, even though it's not totally in game.
Again, don't get me wrong, I'd like to have an actual auction house in GW. But, time will tell. - multiple crafting professions (don't like it?? U just like to kill and fight?? Well, other people like it quite a bit FYI, so add one more point to wow for "what else is there to do in this game anyways?")
I don't disagree with you entirely on this point, but it's also a matter of game style. This simply does not fit in with the GW theme. If it *were* suddenly implemented, it'd be a mess. - multiple resource gathering professions (likewise)
Also, likewise. No need for something that helps a thing that isn't there. - long distance travelling by flying (do I really need to say that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun?? Well then, let me tell you that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun)
Yeah, it does sound like fun. But, just like mounts, with the map fast travel, there's simply no need for something like this beyond a money sink. - Email (including emailing of items and money) (no need to meet/wait for anyone to log in, just email whatever u need to tell/give them)
I've actually been wanting a messenging service added to GW. I think that there should be an in-game method for this, at the very least for notes and such. I'm a little wary of having the item sending thing, but maybe I'm just old fasioned. - vast persistent world, meaning that never is your character bound from going anywhere by "glass walls", and giving the sensation that the world around your character really is huge and true to scale, since u actually have to travel the distances and not jump to another location (do you even understand how much of a difference this makes in the perception of the game environment???? It's huge for roleplaying) What you're saying is true. I do kind of hate it when I bump into a random "Invisible Wall". Bugs me for a bit, then I figure out how to go around it. But, I don't understand how that adds to a persistant world. I thought a "Persistant World" is one that doesn't change when something happens. But, I'm new to all this MMO terminology, so Persistant World probably doesn't mean what the individual words mean.
having said that, how the hell do you people dare comparing GW to wow in such a strict way??? They are NOT THE SAME KIND OF GAME! I agree whole heartedly with that last statement. I think that the main reason that people compare them is because these are the two best games on the market. Each has flaws and strengths, and each is good for different reasons. I've been wanting to try WoW so that I can better compare it with GW, and because it sounds like a fun game. And, when all is said and done, that's the only thing that really matters.
Originally posted by VGJustice - mounts (that's right, riding a horse alongside other people all around the huge persistent world is fun, don't believe me?)
True, but GW also doesn't need them with the map fast travel. There's simply no need for mounts, thus, they're not included. (etc)
Well, now there's an intelligent response! (seriously, not being sarcastic)
"True, but GW also doesn't need them with the map fast travel. There's simply no need for mounts, thus, they're not included." Well, yes, u are correct. I point that out to show that my problem (emphasis on the "my") with the game is the warp travelling system itself. Not that warping occasionally isn't bad, but the fact that u do not have to travel anywhere, ever, eliminates all the other "fun" means of travelling, be it either horseback riding or flying. Since it does that, it also means that the world doesn't really project itself into the mind of the gamer, in other words, the game world is not "imagined" all together, at once in the head of the gamer as a single, giant map extending way off into the distance. I'm sorry, it just doesn't do it for me.
In GW, when you u think of say.... Ascalon, you do not think of the distance between where u are and where Ascalon is, because there is none. There's only a double-click to warp there. It's a dot on the map, somewhere, it doesn't even matter how it relates geographically to other areas, because u also warp to those areas.
In a persitent game world, the distance does exist in-game and, necessarily, in your mind, so it creates a better sensation of "virtuality" inside your head.
In wow, when I think of say... Ironforge (a large city in wow) and I am all the way on the S edge of the other continent (there are 2), I immediatly start tracing out the path I need to undertake to get there. First, I "see" the distance I need to walk/horseback ride to the nearest flight point and I think out the best way to avoid danger on the way there (I check the map on what areas to avoid), then I ride the griphon to the arrival flight point. On the way there, I see the ladscapes as I fly over the distances, then I wait for the boat by the pier (and I can do a bit of fishing while waiting), then I ride the boat to the other continent, then I fly the griphon again, and finally, I arrive at Irongforge. There is a travelling process. It's not just about the arrival, it's about the journey, and it really creates a better illusion from my perspective. Granted, sometimes it's a tad annoying when u just want to get there ASAP, but I mean, it's part of the game, it makes it more "real".
I know this doesn't mean much for someone whose goal in a game is to log in and combat and fight, etc. However, there are many players, including myself, that play the game for that purpose alone, the creation of this "virual world" inside your head. (my friend called me a "virtual tourist", I like that) There is warping in wow also by the way, but u can only do it once/hr and to one single pre-designated destination.
The glass walls per-se don't have necessarily anything to do with the world being persistent or not. It's more a sign of a badly finished world environment than anything else. I understand u cannot walk anywhere because the game structure doesn't work like that. You necessaruly have to stick to a path to induce combat, since the game is combat oriented, I understand that. But the pervasive existence of these invisible walls everywhere is what ruins it, and I mean, they are everywhere, even in places where they are absolutely uncalled for. They really ruin the immersive feel when u can't even climb a small dune to have a look at the desert.
It ticks me off when people come around and just bluntly state that all these things "don't matter", that chopping wood doesn't matter, that fishing don't matter, that gathering resources don't matter etc. That's just utterly silly, at least they should have a mind fair enough to say "they don't matter TO ME".
One more aspect: personally, as far as immersion goes, wow doesn't even rank that high. It hardly compares to the pre-CU SWG, so I'm not here defending the wow game, more defending the genre/gamestyle of a persitent world and all the other features.
Enjoy your gaming ladies and gentleman
ps: trying to unbolden the text, but for some reason it's stuck on bold font, sorry, hence, the subsequent edits
Yeah, the monetary issue is very subjective. If you go to a bar twice /month, u will probably spend over $15. If you go to the movies twice / month, you will probably spend the $15 right there also. If you have netflixs, likewise. If you have cell phone, likewise.
So there are all thse little goods and services in life that we already pay for and are benefitting from and no one seems to get all rallied about. Any game with a subscription has it value. Wow is a good service for me, it brings me entertainment, several hours each night. It's actually more wastefull to go out for dinner anytime, anywhere than spending the money on wow. Just think of the number of hours I get of gameplay for the $15 I pay. What matters is whether or not u can find the same thing for free or cheaper.
I insist on saying that GW is excellent value, off course, but it lacks many features that me and other players enjoy very much in a game. So point is, what's the good of being "free" if it doesn't have half the stuff I'd like in a game? It's like saying "GW is an excellent cheap 1-seat car for your family", u see what I mean?
Also, everyone really needs to stop the childish bickering with wow. I mean, did we attack you people? Did I organize a massive DNS attack on GW's servers or something? Am I ruining your GW experience when I play wow? Seriously, comparing GW to other games is totally fine with me, but thread after thread after thread of "gw this, and wow that".... it's just bumb
One more thing, if you're a hardcore GW player, from what I read here in the forums, u exhaust the map fairly quickly. The devs are also planning releases each 6 months (from what I read/hear). This means that the game you are buying has a novelty factor of about 6 months. So if you are always buying these expansion packs every six months, it adds up to about 2 x $45/game = $90/year. $90/12 months = $7.5 /month, which is half of a regular monthly fee. Granted, it's cheaper than a top monthly fee game, but not nearly as "free" as everyone seems to be arguing for in these forums.
1) You state a bunch of services that people are willing to pay for. The arguement there is "if you go to the bar twice a month you will pay $15. No I won't. I can go to a bar with my friends, have fun with them and not spend a time. Why? Because I'm not a big drinker. I might occasionally buy 1 beer at a bar but typically I just drink water. And if the bar charges for water (yah some of 'em do) then I just don't drink while we're there. And besides, if someone is willing to pay for the services of the bar? That's great. That means it has enough value for them that it's worth the money. That, as you said, is subjective.
2) You state that something like cell phones are worth the money to people. Yep, they are. But I can't exactly get an equivalent to cell service for free. If I could, I would. I do, however, grab the most cost efficient service I can find with the features I demand. Again, subjective.
3) I never attacked WoW. This was a civil discussion. I've never attacked a wow player during the entire time. I have however watched WoW players try to say that GW doesn't qualify as an MMORPG, etc... When it most certainly does. Maybe not as deep or complex (overall) as WoW... but it's still an MMO and is a very fun one for the folks who play it. I think WoW has nice features but personally I hate it. I'd rather play mario on the XBox with my daughter than even think about playing WoW. That said, I haven't "attacked" WoW on these forums, or any other, in any way shape or form. It's a decent game, I've said that numerous times. I personally don't like it.
4) You state that it's easy to get bored with GuildWars... no biggie, it's easy to get bored with WoW as well... What's your point? It's easy to get bored with ANY mmorpg.
The key here is value comparisons. GuildWars offers me most things I look for in an MMORPG... So does WoW... then I try to determine if there's any major turn off for me: Guild Wars has none... WoW does (I hate... detest... despise... the graphics)... So that one is a no brainer.
Now lets move to an MMORPG that I do enjoy, alot: DAOC...
I recently started playing guildwars.... up till 2 weeks ago I hadn't tried it since the beta. I liked it ok then but it was a beta and I don't buy games based on a beta. I've played DAOC on and off for the past 5 years. I played it for over a year, then took a break, then came back for a couple months, then took a break, and recently came back for another 6 months. Then a friend gave me Guildwars since he had a spare copy on his birthday. So I tried it.
Mind you: I really like DAOC... Personally I think it's the best commercial MMORPG currently on the market I'm not going to get into a debate over it. That's my personal opinion and I'm entitled to have it. God knows I've played enough of them to know what I like and what I don't. Only two other games have ever existed that I liked better: UO Classic (pre EA) and SWG pre NGE both of those are gone from the commercial market.
So I had to decide, since I don't really have time for more than 1 MMO anymore being a dad, husband and technical manager for a very large network ties up most of my time. I sat down and weighed the pros and cons. The bottom line was:
Is DAOC enough "Better" for me than Guild Wars to justify paying $180 a year to play it?
I decided it wasn't. Why? Because for free I get almost everything most MMORPG's have to offer. I don't get housing... no big deal, I don't REALLY care about that. I don't get to be a crafter, no big deal, I always pay crafters to do stuff for me anyway, the difference is that in Guild Wars I don't have to wait hours for one to log on. I get to get my own 'magic components' to put on my equipment and I can do it myself without having to pay some jacktard a fortune to do it for me too... so that's bonus. Sure I don't get to wander around in the world and bump into every player in the game while doing so. That REALLY doesn't bother me because when I play an online game the only people I really give a crap about are my guildies and my groupmates. In GuildWars I can play with both and communicate with both the entire time I'm playing, regardless of if I'm in an instance or not. So that's not a problem either. So yeah, the world is instanced... but the cities aren't. The world is big, fun to explore, has interesting sights to see and is filled with adventure. The Quests are solid and fun to do as well....
So I had to decide: Is what DAOC gives me that GuildWars does not give me WORTH the extra $180 a year I have to pay to play DAOC?
The answer, sadly, came back: "No, it's really not." It's a fun game... but when I realized that with that extra $180 a year I could buy a whole lot of things we NEED around the house or even for the PC I kind of went "well crap it just makes no sense to pay that much extra when I *like* both games and one is free and one is not.
If I liked a game enough BETTER than guild wars I'd pay for it. But as long as Guild Wars offers me enough to keep me happy when playing it, what the heck is the point of sinking $180 a year into another one?
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online. Sig image Pending Still in: A couple Betas
Elnator, thanks for the post (I'd quote but it's already really long). I think your 2 first points are redundant, though I agree with them.
Then I need to apologize to you about the "attacking wow" part. I know you didn't, and that was a general comment thrown out to the masses.
Anyways, it's good to see that we finnally are starting to agree that we disagree about what makes a game valuable/worth playing. It really is up to each played to decide that. If these games (GW/wow) even had a vast number of commonalities, then yeah, we could go ahead with statements such as "the mounts in GW suck, becuase they really rubberband too much in the map, and wow's are smoother. But wow's are uglier, and GW's better, yadda, yadda, yadda". But they are so not even close to each other.
We can do that, obviously, with certain things, maybe group combat, instancing, quality of loots, pvp, and even combat mechanics/availibility of skills. But those things count less than 50% when I select a game for myself, so it's almost a mute point for me. So when I see people making such a big deal about those, for me it reads as if people are utterly ignoring the other 50% of the game. The side professions, the resource gathering, the travelling, etc. Some even go to the point of ridiculing it as if it didn't matter to a game's quality. I mean, I hate pvp personally, but I don't go arround saying that a game doesn't need pvp to be an awesome game. A game with no pvp is an awesome game for myself only (actually it would be neutral since I don't get involved in pvp, and so it doesn't affect me, but for simplicity, let me state that to make my point) and the little niche in which I am a part of, it is most definetly not an overall awesome game.
Anyways, all I really wish was that people would just recognize that. That when it comes down to it, between these great 2 games, it's about personal gamestyle, preferences, and needs.
My first long post above I was very upset because it just seemed the tone of the discussion was very much about game-bashing and not about discussing differences between the games (with exceptions, I know, hats off to those who are fair)
To everyone: I recognize that they are both great games, and it's ok if you don't like one or the other, just don't call people names, or try to ridicule what they enjoy in a game or not, or try and carve statements in stone about which of these games is better or worst. They cannot be compared like that. All it does if bring unecessary conflicts into the gaming community. Just be glad we have 2 games that cater to different people. We're all here to have fun with this stuff, ya know?
----------------------------- In GW, when you u think of say.... Ascalon, you do not think of the distance between where u are and where Ascalon is, because there is none. There's only a double-click to warp there. It's a dot on the map, somewhere, it doesn't even matter how it relates geographically to other areas, because u also warp to those areas. ---------------------------
i desagree with this
its true you can dobble clic , but you can also walk .. you havent done the end game quests so you havent experienced the long distance walks we have to make to do them .. if you had played 2000 hours in this last 12 months , im sure you had the distance in your head , and even what mods you have to face in the way.
when the map title came i realize i had 80% of the map open , i been working hard to open the rest of the map , i got to 90% now , lot of new areas i didnt see after 12 months playing .. its not clear on the map what i still need to explore to get to 100% , ive been doing 5 hour walks with the guildies , sometimes to find a small corner that gives me 0.1 of map.
guildwars gives features like warping and low level cap , imo is to give a fake impression of completion to casual players . people that dont have time to play 5 hour runs , dont feel they are missing all the game as to give .
you have the pre made bread , doeant mean you cant make your own bread.
Originally posted by Valowlife Will guild wars overthrow wow or will woow keepp guild wars down all people who want to discuss it come here.
title is wrong, since Guild Wars is not an MMO, its just a multiplayer RPG, all instance, and one city where u sell/buy stuff.
So instead of channels like in Diablo2 that you'd join and then create your game or start a new game, you have a town in 3D where ppl meet.
that is why there is no lag, and thats why it has no monthly fee. If it was not instanced, and would be seamless like WoW or EQ, than you could call it MMO.
I wush there was a way to have more than just one hotbar in gw:f tho.
And sometimes its a little confusing , they just abandon you and let you wander around. And theres no explanation at the creation stage as to what pvp only char and roleplay char is and means.
Originally posted by Darktongue I wush there was a way to have more than just one hotbar in gw:f tho. And sometimes its a little confusing , they just abandon you and let you wander around. And theres no explanation at the creation stage as to what pvp only char and roleplay char is and means.
true , i guess its part of the game to find out
ill give you a hint
RPG chars you keep for ever
PVP chars you delete and make new depending on what the team needs at that moment
Originally posted by jodasse 2 different games...but guildwars has more potential than wow and is getting better every day ! GW is also much more original
Huh? I'm not a huge WoW fan but IMO guild wars has far less potential. There really isn't much to the game, it is made easy for people to exploit, and has nothing the way of crafting or role playing. It's a race to get to level 20 and then it's farm and fight. Rinse -Repeat.
Don't get me wrong, that's all some people need but it's hardly ever going to get the same sort of buzz WoW has. But you're right they are 2 different games.
Originally posted by britoca Elnator, thanks for the post (I'd quote but it's already really long). I think your 2 first points are redundant, though I agree with them.Then I need to apologize to you about the "attacking wow" part. I know you didn't, and that was a general comment thrown out to the masses.Anyways, it's good to see that we finnally are starting to agree that we disagree about what makes a game valuable/worth playing.It really is up to each played to decide that. If these games (GW/wow) even had a vast number of commonalities, then yeah, we could go ahead with statements such as "the mounts in GW suck, becuase they really rubberband too much in the map, and wow's are smoother. But wow's are uglier, and GW's better, yadda, yadda, yadda". But they are so not even close to each other.We can do that, obviously, with certain things, maybe group combat, instancing, quality of loots, pvp, and even combat mechanics/availibility of skills. But those things count less than 50% when I select a game for myself, so it's almost a mute point for me. So when I see people making such a big deal about those, for me it reads as if people are utterly ignoring the other 50% of the game. The side professions, the resource gathering, the travelling, etc. Some even go to the point of ridiculing it as if it didn't matter to a game's quality. I mean, I hate pvp personally, but I don't go arround saying that a game doesn't need pvp to be an awesome game. A game with no pvp is an awesome game for myself only (actually it would be neutral since I don't get involved in pvp, and so it doesn't affect me, but for simplicity, let me state that to make my point) and the little niche in which I am a part of, it is most definetly not an overall awesome game.Anyways, all I really wish was that people would just recognize that. That when it comes down to it, between these great 2 games, it's about personal gamestyle, preferences, and needs.My first long post above I was very upset because it just seemed the tone of the discussion was very much about game-bashing and not about discussing differences between the games (with exceptions, I know, hats off to those who are fair)To everyone: I recognize that they are both great games, and it's ok if you don't like one or the other, just don't call people names, or try to ridicule what they enjoy in a game or not, or try and carve statements in stone about which of these games is better or worst. They cannot be compared like that.All it does if bring unecessary conflicts into the gaming community. Just be glad we have 2 games that cater to different people.We're all here to have fun with this stuff, ya know?
this is a one year old war ... ive been fighting wow fans in this forum for one year now you cant imagine the number of threads here saying wow is better then gw. we are having our litle payback time now .. in the end this is just a forum pvp fight , nothing else. we are old of knowing they are diferent games
i love guildwars , i hate wow fanboys , but if i had no job and a credit card , i would play wow , eve and gw
wow becose i like classic mmorpgs too eve becose i love sci fi games and gw becose its the best game on planet for me
LOL wow this makes me laugh SO HARD. you seriously think gw has a chance against WoW? compare the users. Gw is pretty much pvP and not much of a long storyline/level WoW has MORE players, has variety use for PvP,RPg,and normal gameplay. WoW has mounts, a bigger world to explore,quests that are WORTH doing. quests that is not GROUP DEPEDENT,varies skills that helps in more then just a one pointer. WoW also has instances for varias groups and storyline is good and makes actual sense. you can freelay out plays and have fun more then jsut guildwars.. such as duels belive me WoW has taken over Gw long time ago.. GW is pretty much a PvP game now. edit: i love guildwars also but just does not a good long game play.. to me it is almost repeating short gameplay.. tho the factions has made a GREAT improvent for the storyline!
Originally posted by xuinasha LOL wow this makes me laugh SO HARD.you seriously think gw has a chance against WoW?compare the users.Gw is pretty much pvP and not much of a long storyline/levelWoW has MORE players, has variety use for PvP,RPg,and normal gameplay.WoW has mounts, a bigger world to explore,quests that are WORTH doing.quests that is not GROUP DEPEDENT,varies skills that helps in more then just a one pointer.WoW also has instances for varias groups and storyline is good and makes actual sense. :Dyou can freelay out plays and have fun more then jsut guildwars.. such as duels belive me WoW has taken over Gw long time ago..GW is pretty much a PvP game now.edit: i love guildwars also but just does not a good long game play.. to me it is almost repeating short gameplay..tho the factions has made a GREAT improvent for the storyline!
thank you for joining us here
just want to say , we have 1 on 1 in guildwars now
Originally posted by xuinasha LOL wow this makes me laugh SO HARD. you seriously think gw has a chance against WoW? compare the users. Gw is pretty much pvP and not much of a long storyline/level WoW has MORE players, has variety use for PvP,RPg,and normal gameplay. WoW has mounts, a bigger world to explore,quests that are WORTH doing. quests that is not GROUP DEPEDENT,varies skills that helps in more then just a one pointer. WoW also has instances for varias groups and storyline is good and makes actual sense. you can freelay out plays and have fun more then jsut guildwars.. such as duels belive me WoW has taken over Gw long time ago.. GW is pretty much a PvP game now. edit: i love guildwars also but just does not a good long game play.. to me it is almost repeating short gameplay.. tho the factions has made a GREAT improvent for the storyline!
OLOL WOEW U MAKE ME LAUGH SO HARD!!1!!1!
Please learn to form a text properly. That's just a mess.
EDIT: Oh, and also learn to compare. GW isn't comparable to any other games.
This is the best signature ever. Well, it is really up to you to decide. :x
WoW is very addictive, matter of fact it is so addictive that i would say it fails at being a game.
WoW is very polished, propably the most polished MMO to date, but when you get down to it, the endgame gameplay brings you right back to good old everquest.
before launch Blizzard promised item parity between casual items and raid items. (raid items supposed to have graphical bells n whistles) and what do we have now: raids, to get anything done. faction grinds that take longer to accomplish than raids, for subpar items. the insane pvp honor grind. most time consuming of them all, a fulltime job in it s own right, if you want to get the top items - that are still subpar to raid items heh.
if you want to give up your social life and cut back at work, yeah go for it, you too can be successful in WoW. you might be bored due to the endless grind, but hey you will get über items for it!~
there s way more people that smoke, than people that play WoW. does that mean smoking is a good thing to do for you ?
Comments
I can tell you what pi$$es me off when it comes to comparing WoW (or ANY other MMORPG in that matter) & GW:
Its when the wannabe-fanbois of GW tries to be as "cool" (in lack of better word cause I am not english) as the true hardcore RolePlayers in REAL MMORPGS!
Its like when you see those cheesy karate-morons aged 12 who is sexually addicted to Bruce Lee, and think they gonna be like him when they grow up. Makes me SICK!
Dunno if I wanna laugh or be angry.... Anyways, very ashamed.
Look here: Please, I do NOT want to be compared with the GW players... Anyone understand that?
Wouldnt it be lovely if this GW forum and the whole game was removed from this site....?
Make us care MORE about our faction & world pvp!
Wow has instanced Dungeons and battlegrounds that's it. All players on 1 server can meet up if they want. That is what defines massive for me. Thousands of players that can meet up on one spot. Without going through immersion breakers like changing to Ironforge version 234. In GW all players can never meet each other. They can chat. But they can never see each other. Instance changing works if you are just a couple of people. Not even that works always. There is a limit for how many 1 isntance takes. You get situations like "Let's meet in Town_132" "oh Town_132 is full" "Then we have to find another" "I think Town_34 has some free spots" Stuff like that totally breaks the immersion for me. I don't call DDO a mmo either. Because of all the instancing. In the end it doesn't matter what you call them. But I won't call games like GW and DDO mmorpg's. I won't play them either. Because the instancing kills the game for me.
Point of fact: If all players on 1 server meet in one place in WoW the server will crash.
Period. So, no, all players cannot.
As far as whether you want to "call" them an MMORPG or not doesn't make them not one. They fit the definition of an MMORPG. Its a broad definition for a class of game: One where large numbers of people play in a role playing environment online. Whether you like it or not GuildWars, while it is more accurately defined as a CORPG, is an MMORPG.
Just because you don't like calling it one doesn't mean it's not. And it certainly doesn't mean it doesn't belong on the site.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
It's got 1.5 million players. In towns/cities they can all play together, crafting, roleplaying, forming guilds, getting quests, finishing quests, selling items to npc's, buying items from npc's, joining/leaving/forming parties, etc. So 1.5 million players PLAYING together: Massively Multiplayer
It's played Online
In it you creacte a customized character who fills a role in a group and you can even 'roleplay' that character depending on what your personal prference is. So it's an RPG
So how is it NOT an MMORPG? I'll be the first to jump right in and say it IS a CORPG because it is marketted as such but saying it's *not* an MMORPG is silly. It's not a *traditional* MMORPG but that doesn't mean it's not one at all.
By my own personal definition it does not offer enough content, RPGing, or expansive immersiveness as in huge cities, dungeons and a full world feel. It felt very linear to me. You could do quest in various orders but overall it felt very linear with a very boxy console Fable like feel to it.
It doesn't really matter to me what it is called except that I think it should be compared to Dungeon Seige or Fable before it is compared to WOW. Granted I did not get to the PvP portion because I lost interest before that but from the questing PVE side it feels much more like a PSII game than a MMORPG. I think because you are not charged monthly for it that this is OK but now other similiar games are trying to push GW like games at us for a subscription price ie: D&D Online. It actually reminded me of Asheron's Call 2 more than any other MMORPG I've tried.
Overall point is that a lot of people who never played any other MMORPGs are trying Guild Wars because it is free and I think it is misleading for them to think that all other MMORPGs are like it.
there are many free mmorpg out there ..
ex ... silkroad
persistent world , huge world feeling , loot stealing , its perfect ..
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/setView/overview/gameID/218
ive tryed lots of " real mmorpgs " i like the feeling of a huge map .. but for my daily fun i prefer guildwars , its team work oriented .. i can log in and be playing a random pvp battle 4 vs 4 , or i can go to town and chill out till something cool to do apears .. or i can start my own bizare goal and invite people to go with me , map exploring etc .
those real mmorpgs make me feel alone in the desert
as for the linear feeling , i dont see any diference from the real mmorpgs to gw ..
the real mmorpg are linear too ... noob town , low level mobs .. the most distanced place from noob town , high level mobs ...
if its not random , its linear
Guild - http://lightness.goodforum.net/
Blog - http://www.pierrecarlier.com/
It's got 1.5 million players. In towns/cities they can all play together, crafting, roleplaying, forming guilds, getting quests, finishing quests, selling items to npc's, buying items from npc's, joining/leaving/forming parties, etc. So 1.5 million players PLAYING together: Massively Multiplayer
It's played Online
In it you creacte a customized character who fills a role in a group and you can even 'roleplay' that character depending on what your personal prference is. So it's an RPG
So how is it NOT an MMORPG? I'll be the first to jump right in and say it IS a CORPG because it is marketted as such but saying it's *not* an MMORPG is silly. It's not a *traditional* MMORPG but that doesn't mean it's not one at all.
By my own personal definition it does not offer enough content, RPGing, or expansive immersiveness as in huge cities, dungeons and a full world feel. It felt very linear to me. You could do quest in various orders but overall it felt very linear with a very boxy console Fable like feel to it.
It doesn't really matter to me what it is called except that I think it should be compared to Dungeon Seige or Fable before it is compared to WOW. Granted I did not get to the PvP portion because I lost interest before that but from the questing PVE side it feels much more like a PSII game than a MMORPG. I think because you are not charged monthly for it that this is OK but now other similiar games are trying to push GW like games at us for a subscription price ie: D&D Online. It actually reminded me of Asheron's Call 2 more than any other MMORPG I've tried.
Overall point is that a lot of people who never played any other MMORPGs are trying Guild Wars because it is free and I think it is misleading for them to think that all other MMORPGs are like it.
Actually most of the people I know who play GW are folks who are tired of paying monthly fees for MMO's.... mostly vets of other games. I know that's why I do. And I've played just about every MMORPG on the "released" game list
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
Guild - http://lightness.goodforum.net/
Blog - http://www.pierrecarlier.com/
-virtual tourist
want your game back?
true, for me it got boring ever faster.
otherwise, your other obvious statements are true.
That was referring to Navonod_7's post in particular.
This is a silly topic anyways, I have lost count of how many threads there are about GW vs wow and vice-versa. WTH does it matter anyways? Why don't u try both and see what you enjoy best? And what's with this rage against wow anyways? How many other succesfull mmos are out there and u silly children keep picking on wow and their community??
U know what's funny, I might be wrong, but the wow community doesn't even really debate this topic. It's like wasting all this time comparing things that aren't even the same. It seems the rage is all coming from this side.
I am no fanboy, wow just happens to be the game I'm playing at the moment because so far not much else has satisfied me. I do play GW sometimes over the weekend before u star shooting crap at me.
If you really want, I can drop here some facts to which GW, so far, has no rebuttal:
- mounts
(that's right, riding a horse alongside other people all around the huge persistent world is fun, don't believe me?)
- 8 different species
(I see, maybe you don't like variety)
- 7 universal professions + 2 different faction-specific professions
- auction house
(yup, u can play it just like the real thing, buying underpriced stuff and selling high)
- multiple crafting professions
(don't like it?? U just like to kill and fight?? Well, other people like it quite a bit FYI, so add one more point to wow for "what else is there to do in this game anyways?")
- multiple resource gathering professions
(likewise)
- long distance travelling by flying
(do I really need to say that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun?? Well then, let me tell you that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun)
- Email (including emailing of items and money)
(no need to meet/wait for anyone to log in, just email whatever u need to tell/give them)
- vast persistent world, meaning that never is your character bound from going anywhere by "glass walls", and giving the sensation that the world around your character really is huge and true to scale, since u actually have to travel the distances and not jump to another location
(do you even understand how much of a difference this makes in the perception of the game environment???? It's huge for roleplaying)
having said that, how the hell do you people dare comparing GW to wow in such a strict way??? They are NOT THE SAME KIND OF GAME!
-virtual tourist
want your game back?
true, for me it got boring ever faster.
otherwise, your other obvious statements are true.
That was referring to Navonod_7's post in particular.
This is a silly topic anyways, I have lost count of how many threads there are about GW vs wow and vice-versa. WTH does it matter anyways? Why don't u try both and see what you enjoy best? And what's with this rage against wow anyways? How many other succesfull mmos are out there and u silly children keep picking on wow and their community??
U know what's funny, I might be wrong, but the wow community doesn't even really debate this topic. It's like wasting all this time comparing things that aren't even the same. It seems the rage is all coming from this side.
I am no fanboy, wow just happens to be the game I'm playing at the moment because so far not much else has satisfied me. I do play GW sometimes over the weekend before u star shooting crap at me.
If you really want, I can drop here some facts to which GW, so far, has no rebuttal:
- mounts
(that's right, riding a horse alongside other people all around the huge persistent world is fun, don't believe me?)
- 8 different species
(I see, maybe you don't like variety)
- 7 universal professions + 2 different faction-specific professions
- auction house
(yup, u can play it just like the real thing, buying underpriced stuff and selling high)
- multiple crafting professions
(don't like it?? U just like to kill and fight?? Well, other people like it quite a bit FYI, so add one more point to wow for "what else is there to do in this game anyways?")
- multiple resource gathering professions
(likewise)
- long distance travelling by flying
(do I really need to say that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun?? Well then, let me tell you that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun)
- Email (including emailing of items and money)
(no need to meet/wait for anyone to log in, just email whatever u need to tell/give them)
- vast persistent world, meaning that never is your character bound from going anywhere by "glass walls", and giving the sensation that the world around your character really is huge and true to scale, since u actually have to travel the distances and not jump to another location
(do you even understand how much of a difference this makes in the perception of the game environment???? It's huge for roleplaying)
having said that, how the hell do you people dare comparing GW to wow in such a strict way??? They are NOT THE SAME KIND OF GAME!
GuildWars is better than WoW.
In my opinion
Because I hate WoW, find it boring. Found the Graphics to be abhorrent to me (I HATE cartoon style graphics). On the other hand I enjoy playing Guild Wars
Oh and there is that whole: "I saved a bunch of money by not paying a monthly fee" aspect to it too.
- In your first year in WoW you will spend $230 on the game. In your second you will again spend over $200 for the game if you buy the expansion... otherwise you will 'merely' spend $180.
- In GuildWars you will spend $30 in your first year in the game (you can get it for $30 now). In your second you will again spend about $30 IF you choose to buy the expansion, otherwise you will spend.... $0.
So for me GuildWars is a better game than WoW. However that's subjective. One of my best friends loves WoW and plays it all the time and considers the $300+ he's spent on it so far a 'good investment' (Personally I think he's nuts, I have much better things to spend $300 on)Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
true, for me it got boring ever faster.
otherwise, your other obvious statements are true.
That was referring to Navonod_7's post in particular.
This is a silly topic anyways, I have lost count of how many threads there are about GW vs wow and vice-versa. WTH does it matter anyways? Why don't u try both and see what you enjoy best? And what's with this rage against wow anyways? How many other succesfull mmos are out there and u silly children keep picking on wow and their community??
U know what's funny, I might be wrong, but the wow community doesn't even really debate this topic. It's like wasting all this time comparing things that aren't even the same. It seems the rage is all coming from this side.
I am no fanboy, wow just happens to be the game I'm playing at the moment because so far not much else has satisfied me. I do play GW sometimes over the weekend before u star shooting crap at me.
If you really want, I can drop here some facts to which GW, so far, has no rebuttal:
- mounts
(that's right, riding a horse alongside other people all around the huge persistent world is fun, don't believe me?)
- 8 different species
(I see, maybe you don't like variety)
- 7 universal professions + 2 different faction-specific professions
- auction house
(yup, u can play it just like the real thing, buying underpriced stuff and selling high)
- multiple crafting professions
(don't like it?? U just like to kill and fight?? Well, other people like it quite a bit FYI, so add one more point to wow for "what else is there to do in this game anyways?")
- multiple resource gathering professions
(likewise)
- long distance travelling by flying
(do I really need to say that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun?? Well then, let me tell you that flying around the map is a whole lot of fun)
- Email (including emailing of items and money)
(no need to meet/wait for anyone to log in, just email whatever u need to tell/give them)
- vast persistent world, meaning that never is your character bound from going anywhere by "glass walls", and giving the sensation that the world around your character really is huge and true to scale, since u actually have to travel the distances and not jump to another location
(do you even understand how much of a difference this makes in the perception of the game environment???? It's huge for roleplaying)
having said that, how the hell do you people dare comparing GW to wow in such a strict way??? They are NOT THE SAME KIND OF GAME!
GuildWars is better than WoW.
In my opinion
Because I hate WoW, find it boring. Found the Graphics to be abhorrent to me (I HATE cartoon style graphics). On the other hand I enjoy playing Guild Wars
Oh and there is that whole: "I saved a bunch of money by not paying a monthly fee" aspect to it too.
- In your first year in WoW you will spend $230 on the game. In your second you will again spend over $200 for the game if you buy the expansion... otherwise you will 'merely' spend $180.
- In GuildWars you will spend $30 in your first year in the game (you can get it for $30 now). In your second you will again spend about $30 IF you choose to buy the expansion, otherwise you will spend.... $0.
So for me GuildWars is a better game than WoW. However that's subjective. One of my best friends loves WoW and plays it all the time and considers the $300+ he's spent on it so far a 'good investment' (Personally I think he's nuts, I have much better things to spend $300 on)yeah, the monetary issue is very subjective. If you go to a bar twice /month, u will probably spend over $15. If you go to the movies twice / month, you will probably spend the $15 right there also. If you have netflixs, likewise. If you have cell phone, likewise.
So there are all thse little goods and services in life that we already pay for and are benefitting from and no one seems to get all rallied about. Any game with a subscription has it value. Wow is a good service for me, it brings me entertainment, several hours each night. It's actually more wastefull to go out for dinner anytime, anywhere than spending the money on wow. Just think of the number of hours I get of gameplay for the $15 I pay. What matters is whether or not u can find the same thing for free or cheaper.
I insist on saying that GW is excellent value, off course, but it lacks many features that me and other players enjoy very much in a game. So point is, what's the good of being "free" if it doesn't have half the stuff I'd like in a game? It's like saying "GW is an excellent cheap 1-seat car for your family", u see what I mean?
Also, everyone really needs to stop the childish bickering with wow. I mean, did we attack you people? Did I organize a massive DNS attack on GW's servers or something? Am I ruining your GW experience when I play wow? Seriously, comparing GW to other games is totally fine with me, but thread after thread after thread of "gw this, and wow that".... it's just bumb
One more thing, if you're a hardcore GW player, from what I read here in the forums, u exhaust the map fairly quickly. The devs are also planning releases each 6 months (from what I read/hear). This means that the game you are buying has a novelty factor of about 6 months. So if you are always buying these expansion packs every six months, it adds up to about 2 x $45/game = $90/year.
$90/12 months = $7.5 /month, which is half of a regular monthly fee.
Granted, it's cheaper than a top monthly fee game, but not nearly as "free" as everyone seems to be arguing for in these forums.
-virtual tourist
want your game back?
--~~--
Play Guild Wars? Go here - http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Main_Page
And go here for the new official Guild Wars Wiki! http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Main_Page
Well, now there's an intelligent response! (seriously, not being sarcastic)
"True, but GW also doesn't need them with the map fast travel. There's simply no need for mounts, thus, they're not included."
Well, yes, u are correct. I point that out to show that my problem (emphasis on the "my") with the game is the warp travelling system itself. Not that warping occasionally isn't bad, but the fact that u do not have to travel anywhere, ever, eliminates all the other "fun" means of travelling, be it either horseback riding or flying. Since it does that, it also means that the world doesn't really project itself into the mind of the gamer, in other words, the game world is not "imagined" all together, at once in the head of the gamer as a single, giant map extending way off into the distance. I'm sorry, it just doesn't do it for me.
In GW, when you u think of say.... Ascalon, you do not think of the distance between where u are and where Ascalon is, because there is none. There's only a double-click to warp there. It's a dot on the map, somewhere, it doesn't even matter how it relates geographically to other areas, because u also warp to those areas.
In a persitent game world, the distance does exist in-game and, necessarily, in your mind, so it creates a better sensation of "virtuality" inside your head.
In wow, when I think of say... Ironforge (a large city in wow) and I am all the way on the S edge of the other continent (there are 2), I immediatly start tracing out the path I need to undertake to get there.
First, I "see" the distance I need to walk/horseback ride to the nearest flight point and I think out the best way to avoid danger on the way there (I check the map on what areas to avoid), then I ride the griphon to the arrival flight point. On the way there, I see the ladscapes as I fly over the distances, then I wait for the boat by the pier (and I can do a bit of fishing while waiting), then I ride the boat to the other continent, then I fly the griphon again, and finally, I arrive at Irongforge.
There is a travelling process. It's not just about the arrival, it's about the journey, and it really creates a better illusion from my perspective. Granted, sometimes it's a tad annoying when u just want to get there ASAP, but I mean, it's part of the game, it makes it more "real".
I
know this doesn't mean much for someone whose goal in a game is to log
in and combat and fight, etc. However, there are many players, including myself, that
play the game for that purpose alone, the creation of
this "virual world" inside your head. (my friend called me a "virtual
tourist", I like that)
There is warping in wow also by the way, but u can only do it once/hr and to one single pre-designated destination.
The glass walls per-se don't have necessarily anything to do with the world being persistent or not. It's more a sign of a badly finished world environment than anything else. I understand u cannot walk anywhere because the game structure doesn't work like that. You necessaruly have to stick to a path to induce combat, since the game is combat oriented, I understand that. But the pervasive existence of these invisible walls everywhere is what ruins it, and I mean, they are everywhere, even in places where they are absolutely uncalled for. They really ruin the immersive feel when u can't even climb a small dune to have a look at the desert.
It ticks me off when people come around and just bluntly state that all these things "don't matter", that chopping wood doesn't matter, that fishing don't matter, that gathering resources don't matter etc. That's just utterly silly, at least they should have a mind fair enough to say "they don't matter TO ME".
One more aspect: personally, as far as immersion goes, wow doesn't even rank that high. It hardly compares to the pre-CU SWG, so I'm not here defending the wow game, more defending the genre/gamestyle of a persitent world and all the other features.
Enjoy your gaming ladies and gentleman
ps: trying to unbolden the text, but for some reason it's stuck on bold font, sorry, hence, the subsequent edits
-virtual tourist
want your game back?
1) You state a bunch of services that people are willing to pay for. The arguement there is "if you go to the bar twice a month you will pay $15. No I won't. I can go to a bar with my friends, have fun with them and not spend a time. Why? Because I'm not a big drinker. I might occasionally buy 1 beer at a bar but typically I just drink water. And if the bar charges for water (yah some of 'em do) then I just don't drink while we're there. And besides, if someone is willing to pay for the services of the bar? That's great. That means it has enough value for them that it's worth the money. That, as you said, is subjective.
2) You state that something like cell phones are worth the money to people. Yep, they are. But I can't exactly get an equivalent to cell service for free. If I could, I would. I do, however, grab the most cost efficient service I can find with the features I demand. Again, subjective.
3) I never attacked WoW. This was a civil discussion. I've never attacked a wow player during the entire time. I have however watched WoW players try to say that GW doesn't qualify as an MMORPG, etc... When it most certainly does. Maybe not as deep or complex (overall) as WoW... but it's still an MMO and is a very fun one for the folks who play it. I think WoW has nice features but personally I hate it. I'd rather play mario on the XBox with my daughter than even think about playing WoW. That said, I haven't "attacked" WoW on these forums, or any other, in any way shape or form. It's a decent game, I've said that numerous times. I personally don't like it.
4) You state that it's easy to get bored with GuildWars... no biggie, it's easy to get bored with WoW as well... What's your point? It's easy to get bored with ANY mmorpg.
The key here is value comparisons. GuildWars offers me most things I look for in an MMORPG... So does WoW... then I try to determine if there's any major turn off for me: Guild Wars has none... WoW does (I hate... detest... despise... the graphics)... So that one is a no brainer.
Now lets move to an MMORPG that I do enjoy, alot: DAOC...
I recently started playing guildwars.... up till 2 weeks ago I hadn't tried it since the beta. I liked it ok then but it was a beta and I don't buy games based on a beta. I've played DAOC on and off for the past 5 years. I played it for over a year, then took a break, then came back for a couple months, then took a break, and recently came back for another 6 months. Then a friend gave me Guildwars since he had a spare copy on his birthday. So I tried it.
Mind you: I really like DAOC... Personally I think it's the best commercial MMORPG currently on the market I'm not going to get into a debate over it. That's my personal opinion and I'm entitled to have it. God knows I've played enough of them to know what I like and what I don't. Only two other games have ever existed that I liked better: UO Classic (pre EA) and SWG pre NGE both of those are gone from the commercial market.
So I had to decide, since I don't really have time for more than 1 MMO anymore being a dad, husband and technical manager for a very large network ties up most of my time. I sat down and weighed the pros and cons. The bottom line was:
Is DAOC enough "Better" for me than Guild Wars to justify paying $180 a year to play it?
I decided it wasn't. Why? Because for free I get almost everything most MMORPG's have to offer. I don't get housing... no big deal, I don't REALLY care about that. I don't get to be a crafter, no big deal, I always pay crafters to do stuff for me anyway, the difference is that in Guild Wars I don't have to wait hours for one to log on. I get to get my own 'magic components' to put on my equipment and I can do it myself without having to pay some jacktard a fortune to do it for me too... so that's bonus. Sure I don't get to wander around in the world and bump into every player in the game while doing so. That REALLY doesn't bother me because when I play an online game the only people I really give a crap about are my guildies and my groupmates. In GuildWars I can play with both and communicate with both the entire time I'm playing, regardless of if I'm in an instance or not. So that's not a problem either. So yeah, the world is instanced... but the cities aren't. The world is big, fun to explore, has interesting sights to see and is filled with adventure. The Quests are solid and fun to do as well....
So I had to decide: Is what DAOC gives me that GuildWars does not give me WORTH the extra $180 a year I have to pay to play DAOC?
The answer, sadly, came back: "No, it's really not." It's a fun game... but when I realized that with that extra $180 a year I could buy a whole lot of things we NEED around the house or even for the PC I kind of went "well crap it just makes no sense to pay that much extra when I *like* both games and one is free and one is not.
If I liked a game enough BETTER than guild wars I'd pay for it. But as long as Guild Wars offers me enough to keep me happy when playing it, what the heck is the point of sinking $180 a year into another one?
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
Elnator, thanks for the post (I'd quote but it's already really long). I think your 2 first points are redundant, though I agree with them.
Then I need to apologize to you about the "attacking wow" part. I know you didn't, and that was a general comment thrown out to the masses.
Anyways, it's good to see that we finnally are starting to agree that we disagree about what makes a game valuable/worth playing.
It really is up to each played to decide that. If these games (GW/wow) even had a vast number of commonalities, then yeah, we could go ahead with statements such as "the mounts in GW suck, becuase they really rubberband too much in the map, and wow's are smoother. But wow's are uglier, and GW's better, yadda, yadda, yadda". But they are so not even close to each other.
We can do that, obviously, with certain things, maybe group combat, instancing, quality of loots, pvp, and even combat mechanics/availibility of skills. But those things count less than 50% when I select a game for myself, so it's almost a mute point for me. So when I see people making such a big deal about those, for me it reads as if people are utterly ignoring the other 50% of the game. The side professions, the resource gathering, the travelling, etc. Some even go to the point of ridiculing it as if it didn't matter to a game's quality. I mean, I hate pvp personally, but I don't go arround saying that a game doesn't need pvp to be an awesome game. A game with no pvp is an awesome game for myself only (actually it would be neutral since I don't get involved in pvp, and so it doesn't affect me, but for simplicity, let me state that to make my point) and the little niche in which I am a part of, it is most definetly not an overall awesome game.
Anyways, all I really wish was that people would just recognize that. That when it comes down to it, between these great 2 games, it's about personal gamestyle, preferences, and needs.
My first long post above I was very upset because it just seemed the
tone of the discussion was very much about game-bashing and not about
discussing differences between the games (with exceptions, I know, hats
off to those who are fair)
To everyone: I recognize that they are both great games, and it's ok if you don't like one or the other, just don't call people names, or try to ridicule what they enjoy in a game or not, or try and carve statements in stone about which of these games is better or worst. They cannot be compared like that.
All it does if bring unecessary conflicts into the gaming community. Just be glad we have 2 games that cater to different people.
We're all here to have fun with this stuff, ya know?
-virtual tourist
want your game back?
-----------------------------
In GW, when you u think of say.... Ascalon, you do not think of the distance between where u are and where Ascalon is, because there is none. There's only a double-click to warp there. It's a dot on the map, somewhere, it doesn't even matter how it relates geographically to other areas, because u also warp to those areas.
---------------------------
i desagree with this
its true you can dobble clic , but you can also walk .. you havent done the end game quests so you havent experienced the long distance walks we have to make to do them .. if you had played 2000 hours in this last 12 months , im sure you had the distance in your head , and even what mods you have to face in the way.
when the map title came i realize i had 80% of the map open , i been working hard to open the rest of the map , i got to 90% now , lot of new areas i didnt see after 12 months playing .. its not clear on the map what i still need to explore to get to 100% , ive been doing 5 hour walks with the guildies , sometimes to find a small corner that gives me 0.1 of map.
guildwars gives features like warping and low level cap , imo is to give a fake impression of completion to casual players . people that dont have time to play 5 hour runs , dont feel they are missing all the game as to give .
you have the pre made bread , doeant mean you cant make your own bread.
Guild - http://lightness.goodforum.net/
Blog - http://www.pierrecarlier.com/
title is wrong, since Guild Wars is not an MMO, its just a multiplayer RPG, all instance, and one city where u sell/buy stuff.
So instead of channels like in Diablo2 that you'd join and then create your game or start a new game, you have a town in 3D where ppl meet.
that is why there is no lag, and thats why it has no monthly fee. If it was not instanced, and would be seamless like WoW or EQ, than you could call it MMO.
I wush there was a way to have more than just one hotbar in gw:f tho.
And sometimes its a little confusing , they just abandon you and let you wander around. And theres no explanation at the creation stage as to what pvp only char and roleplay char is and means.
true , i guess its part of the game to find out
ill give you a hint
RPG chars you keep for ever
PVP chars you delete and make new depending on what the team needs at that moment
Guild - http://lightness.goodforum.net/
Blog - http://www.pierrecarlier.com/
Don't get me wrong, that's all some people need but it's hardly ever going to get the same sort of buzz WoW has. But you're right they are 2 different games.
this is a one year old war ... ive been fighting wow fans in this forum for one year now
you cant imagine the number of threads here saying wow is better then gw.
we are having our litle payback time now ..
in the end this is just a forum pvp fight , nothing else. we are old of knowing they are diferent games
i love guildwars , i hate wow fanboys , but if i had no job and a credit card , i would play wow , eve and gw
wow becose i like classic mmorpgs too
eve becose i love sci fi games
and gw becose its the best game on planet for me
Guild - http://lightness.goodforum.net/
Blog - http://www.pierrecarlier.com/
LOL wow this makes me laugh SO HARD.
you seriously think gw has a chance against WoW?
compare the users.
Gw is pretty much pvP and not much of a long storyline/level
WoW has MORE players, has variety use for PvP,RPg,and normal gameplay.
WoW has mounts, a bigger world to explore,quests that are WORTH doing.
quests that is not GROUP DEPEDENT,varies skills that helps in more then just a one pointer.
WoW also has instances for varias groups and storyline is good and makes actual sense.
you can freelay out plays and have fun more then jsut guildwars.. such as duels
belive me WoW has taken over Gw long time ago..
GW is pretty much a PvP game now.
edit: i love guildwars also but just does not a good long game play.. to me it is almost repeating short gameplay..
tho the factions has made a GREAT improvent for the storyline!
thank you for joining us here
just want to say , we have 1 on 1 in guildwars now
ahh and factions is out
Guild - http://lightness.goodforum.net/
Blog - http://www.pierrecarlier.com/
WOEW U MAKE
ME LAUGH SO
HARD!!1!!1!
Please learn to form a text properly. That's just a mess.
EDIT: Oh, and also learn to compare. GW isn't comparable to any other games.
This is the best signature ever. Well, it is really up to you to decide. :x
WoW is very addictive, matter of fact it is so addictive that i would say it fails at being a game.
WoW is very polished, propably the most polished MMO to date, but when you get down to it, the endgame gameplay brings you right back to good old everquest.
before launch Blizzard promised item parity between casual items and raid items. (raid items supposed to have graphical bells n whistles) and what do we have now:
raids, to get anything done.
faction grinds that take longer to accomplish than raids, for subpar items.
the insane pvp honor grind. most time consuming of them all, a fulltime job in it s own right, if you want to get the top items - that are still subpar to raid items heh.
if you want to give up your social life and cut back at work, yeah go for it, you too can be successful in WoW. you might be bored due to the endless grind, but hey you will get über items for it!~
there s way more people that smoke, than people that play WoW. does that mean smoking is a good thing to do for you ?