Originally posted by Aldaron Originally posted by Kyoruto I personally think its funny (Not saying you bro) but those people with signs that say "God hates gays". It brings the question. Why would he create something he hates? Does he get distracted and then poof a gay person. Then he goes "Oh damn it not another gay I hate those!"
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay? I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way. Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay. I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
Originally posted by Xexima Originally posted by AlexAmore Originally posted by Aldaron Originally posted by Kyoruto I personally think its funny (Not saying you bro) but those people with signs that say "God hates gays". It brings the question. Why would he create something he hates? Does he get distracted and then poof a gay person. Then he goes "Oh damn it not another gay I hate those!"
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
God created your mind, body, and spirit and everyone else's including every single person you will meet. God created your conscious and unconscious. Basically what i'm saying is because everything is God's creation including your ability to make decisions and recieve influence then God being omnipotent should know the future of His creations inside and out. I thought you were an agnostic... but anyway
I believe there is a God, but I don't claim to understand God. Agnostic means i'm half atheist and I think atheism is even more of a faith than anything, because you have to believe nothing created everything.
______________________________ "When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!" -cheer leading, flag waving American
Exactly, God lay down the rules and give you free will to do whatever you want with your life. He is the one who will judge you in the end, not other people. People are not born good or evil, they are given a free will to decide what they want to do with their lives. What they do with thelr lives is based on the experiences they have through out their lives. This combined with free will causes them to decide what type of life they choose to live. People chose to live their lives the way they see fit.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Exactly, God lay down the rules and give you free will to do whatever you want with your life. He is the one who will judge you in the end, not other people. People are not born good or evil, they are given a free will to decide what they want to do with their lives. What they do with thelr lives is based on the experiences they have through out their lives. This combined with free will causes them to decide what type of life they choose to live. People chose to live their lives the way they see fit.
Wow we almost went a full month without a gay topic.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Originally posted by upallnight Originally posted by Aldaron Originally posted by Kyoruto I personally think its funny (Not saying you bro) but those people with signs that say "God hates gays". It brings the question. Why would he create something he hates? Does he get distracted and then poof a gay person. Then he goes "Oh damn it not another gay I hate those!"
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay? I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way. Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay. I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
Maybe you could (as well as other people) have taken something in you saw, or taken something in the wrong way at any point in your life and it seeped into your subconscious and you "accepted" it in someway thats maybe associated with homosexuality. It might not even have to do with sexuality...
Originally posted by UnknownForce Originally posted by upallnight Originally posted by Aldaron Originally posted by Kyoruto I personally think its funny (Not saying you bro) but those people with signs that say "God hates gays". It brings the question. Why would he create something he hates? Does he get distracted and then poof a gay person. Then he goes "Oh damn it not another gay I hate those!"
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay? I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way. Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay. I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
Maybe you could (as well as other people) have taken something in you saw, or taken something in the wrong way at any point in your life and it seeped into your subconscious and you "accepted" it in someway thats maybe associated with homosexuality. It might not even have to do with sexuality...
You need to stop trying to find something wrong here. There isn't anything.
There is lots and lots of Scientific evidence that basically says that most Homosexuals don't have a choice. They're born with it. Doesn't make them any less equal than Hetrosexuals. You need to give up this whole sin thing. I'm not very religious at all, but if I were a god, I wouldn't Create something Exactly the way I didn't want it, and give it no choice to change. It makes absolutely no sense. Therefore, I doubt God sees Homosexuality as the ultimate evil. However, I don't even claim to understand God or even religion for that matter, so please, if you can enlighten me, do so.
We barely remember who or what came before this precious moment; We are choosing to be here right now -Tool, Parabola
Originally posted by UnknownForce Originally posted by upallnight Originally posted by Aldaron Originally posted by Kyoruto I personally think its funny (Not saying you bro) but those people with signs that say "God hates gays". It brings the question. Why would he create something he hates? Does he get distracted and then poof a gay person. Then he goes "Oh damn it not another gay I hate those!"
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay? I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way. Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay. I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
Maybe you could (as well as other people) have taken something in you saw, or taken something in the wrong way at any point in your life and it seeped into your subconscious and you "accepted" it in someway thats maybe associated with homosexuality. It might not even have to do with sexuality... Or maybe I'm gay and I'm sexually and emotionally attracted to males because my brain is wired that way.
Who knows. All I can tell you is that it's not a choice. And as much as I didn't just choose to be gay I also can't just choose to be straight.
And you're half right. It's not all sexuality. It's also who I fall in love with. I have never felt the emotion towards a girl that I feel towards men. Not even remotely close. You may think that it's possible to change that, but if you do just imagine yourself changing to love men instead of women. It's just as complex a thing for me to do.
And really, don't try to use some psychoanalytical stuff on me or anyone else when it comes to this. If it were something as simple as a misinterpretation in my life somewhere, then wouldn't I be able to recognize that from my adult vantage point and know where things were perceived differently? I understand that some behaviors can be changed through learning new habits, but this is something much deeper than being racist, or associating spiders with fear, or feeling closed in on an elevator.
Why is it so hard for people to just listen to us and give us the credit to know something like that. I have thought about this a lot. After all it's my life. I have had to deal with a lot of rejection, fear, and self-esteem problems because of it. After going through all that it seems that if this weren't me naturally that I would have broken down by now, but it doesn't go away. Just like you being a heterosexual would never just go away.
Originally posted by AlexAmore God created your mind, body, and spirit and everyone else's including every single person you will meet. God created your conscious and unconscious. Basically what i'm saying is because everything is God's creation including your ability to make decisions and recieve influence then God being omnipotent should know the future of His creations inside and out.
ok...He knows the future of his creations. What's your point? If they're going to turn out disobeying him, what's the point of creating them, right?
Beats me.
I've always thought, "Since God knows everything, why did he create Satan?" I'm not God. I don't know. If you're asking me to give you an answer, I can't.
All I know is that people/beings are created, and given a free will. Just because they use that free will to do something that is evil or disobedient to God's plan, does not mean that God intended them to do as such.
Originally posted by Xexima I thought you were an agnostic... but anyway
First off, Kyoruto was just trying to be funny. Second of all, according to the teachings of Jesus, God doesnt "hate" anyone, he just disapproves of what they do.
Ok. I'll give you that, God doesn't hate anyone. Never said otherwise.
Can you prove that babies are not just born gay?
Sexual psychology does not come around until further in the humans development. So yes, it can be accurately said that you aren't, "born gay".
No. The same thing goes the otherway.
What, being born straight? It depends how you look at it. Again, sexual psychology does not come until later in the humans development. But nature has been set up as such that the opposite sexes to be naturally attracted to each other so as to work as the progenitors of the human race. Without that, there would be no desire to procreate, and we'd end up extinct.
It is just stubborn and idiotic to try to argue either side, because you have no information to back it up. Now, don't say that God doesn't make people gay as fact, because you can't prove that. Beliefs =/= facts.
Here...YHVH, YHWH, Yahveh, Yahweh, Jehovah, etc. Doesn't make people gay, and that's a fact. I don't know what god you believe in, so...
Also, I don't understand why people say that it is not possible that there is a god, because that is equally as stubborn.
Originally posted by upallnight
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
Look above for reference.
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay?
I don't? I never said I did.
I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way.
Don't need to feel it to know. It's the natural urge to procreate and continue the species - If you believe in evolution(which I don't. Just trying to cover bases), then you can say it was something that was bred into us over millions of years so we wouldn't become extinct.
If you believe in God...Well, kind of the same thing. Except it was just put into us so we wouldn't become extinct.
Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay.
I never picked to have a bad temper. Never made a conscious decision.
And boy, when I was younger, did I have a bad temper. In fact, looking back, I feel kind of bad.
On the other hand though, I did make a conscious decision to change my bad temper, to control it. Everyone has their own demons to battle, that was just one of many that I have had to deal with - And yes, I know you'll probably be offended that I refer to you being gay as a "demon to battle", but that's how I view it as.
I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
Firstly, I never said anything about what "gay people" think. I just said they weren't born gay. So now I'm making assumptions about what you think because of it? That's a bit of a stretch.
Secondly, who's story am I suppose to believe? I've read of cases of people who claimed to of been fully involved in the homosexual lifestyle, and then later made a conscious decision to change that, and get married to a person of the opposite sex, that they loved, etc. etc.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
"Fear not death; for the sooner we die, the longer shall we be immortal."
Originally posted by upallnight And you're half right. It's not all sexuality. It's also who I fall in love with. I have never felt the emotion towards a girl that I feel towards men. Not even remotely close. You may think that it's possible to change that, but if you do just imagine yourself changing to love men instead of women. It's just as complex a thing for me to do.
May I ask, out of curiosity.
If a gal would be forthcoming, direct, behaving like a "male", would you still feel that way?
I am not gay myself, but nothing turn me down more than a girl who EXPECT to be impressed, conquered, treated like a queen, been "understood", entertained and so on...and let's be honest, I FEEL that 95% of the women are like that! (not a statistic, I can be wrong there, it is how I feel and why I prefer my computer ). In fact, to be polite with these gals, I usually talk about the weather, it make them go away.
I am just wondering, are you really gay? Or is it how women behave in general? Maybe it is their psychological and intellectual values that you can't stand. Anyway, just asking...
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
Originally posted by Anofalye Originally posted by upallnight And you're half right. It's not all sexuality. It's also who I fall in love with. I have never felt the emotion towards a girl that I feel towards men. Not even remotely close. You may think that it's possible to change that, but if you do just imagine yourself changing to love men instead of women. It's just as complex a thing for me to do.
May I ask, out of curiosity.
If a gal would be forthcoming, direct, behaving like a "male", would you still feel that way?
I am not gay myself, but nothing turn me down more than a girl who EXPECT to be impressed, conquered, treated like a queen, been "understood", entertained and so on...and let's be honest, I FEEL that 95% of the women are like that! (not a statistic, I can be wrong there, it is how I feel and why I prefer my computer ). In fact, to be polite with these gals, I usually talk about the weather, it make them go away.
I am just wondering, are you really gay? Or is it how women behave in general? Maybe it is their psychological and intellectual values that you can't stand. Anyway, just asking...
It's the male anatomy too. I look at a picture of a guy (meaning I have no idea how he acts) and I am sexually attracted to him (especially if he has a nice chest and stomach, that drives me nuts). I look at a picture of a girl (again, meaning I have no idea how she acts), and nada. No attraction to women. I'm just not. And the love comes next. I am first sexually attracted to a guy, then later if he is my type we may hit it off emotionally and try dating. It's really no different than a straight couple.
Originally posted by Aldaron Originally posted by AlexAmore God created your mind, body, and spirit and everyone else's including every single person you will meet. God created your conscious and unconscious. Basically what i'm saying is because everything is God's creation including your ability to make decisions and recieve influence then God being omnipotent should know the future of His creations inside and out.
ok...He knows the future of his creations. What's your point? If they're going to turn out disobeying him, what's the point of creating them, right?
Beats me.
I've always thought, "Since God knows everything, why did he create Satan?" I'm not God. I don't know. If you're asking me to give you an answer, I can't.
All I know is that people/beings are created, and given a free will. Just because they use that free will to do something that is evil or disobedient to God's plan, does not mean that God intended them to do as such.
Originally posted by Xexima I thought you were an agnostic... but anyway
First off, Kyoruto was just trying to be funny. Second of all, according to the teachings of Jesus, God doesnt "hate" anyone, he just disapproves of what they do.
Ok. I'll give you that, God doesn't hate anyone. Never said otherwise.
Can you prove that babies are not just born gay?
Sexual psychology does not come around until further in the humans development. So yes, it can be accurately said that you aren't, "born gay".
No. The same thing goes the otherway.
What, being born straight? It depends how you look at it. Again, sexual psychology does not come until later in the humans development. But nature has been set up as such that the opposite sexes to be naturally attracted to each other so as to work as the progenitors of the human race. Without that, there would be no desire to procreate, and we'd end up extinct.
It is just stubborn and idiotic to try to argue either side, because you have no information to back it up. Now, don't say that God doesn't make people gay as fact, because you can't prove that. Beliefs =/= facts.
Here...YHVH, YHWH, Yahveh, Yahweh, Jehovah, etc. Doesn't make people gay, and that's a fact. I don't know what god you believe in, so...
Also, I don't understand why people say that it is not possible that there is a god, because that is equally as stubborn.
Originally posted by upallnight
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
Look above for reference.
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay?
I don't? I never said I did.
I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way.
Don't need to feel it to know. It's the natural urge to procreate and continue the species - If you believe in evolution(which I don't. Just trying to cover bases), then you can say it was something that was bred into us over millions of years so we wouldn't become extinct.
If you believe in God...Well, kind of the same thing. Except it was just put into us so we wouldn't become extinct.
Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay.
I never picked to have a bad temper. Never made a conscious decision.
And boy, when I was younger, did I have a bad temper. In fact, looking back, I feel kind of bad.
On the other hand though, I did make a conscious decision to change my bad temper, to control it. Everyone has their own demons to battle, that was just one of many that I have had to deal with - And yes, I know you'll probably be offended that I refer to you being gay as a "demon to battle", but that's how I view it as.
I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
Firstly, I never said anything about what "gay people" think. I just said they weren't born gay. So now I'm making assumptions about what you think because of it? That's a bit of a stretch.
Secondly, who's story am I suppose to believe? I've read of cases of people who claimed to of been fully involved in the homosexual lifestyle, and then later made a conscious decision to change that, and get married to a person of the opposite sex, that they loved, etc. etc.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
I don't believe those stories of people changing. I have never known a gay person to change. I have known some bisexual people who were sexually attracted to the same sex, but not emotionally. They were however emotionally able to fall in love with the opposite sex. Maybe that's where the mix-up occurs. There is a gray area between straight and gay for some people. I think maybe those people may have a resentment for the gay community because they can't go back once they make that decision to be "healed". So they show that resentment by putting us down and saying that what they've done we all can do.
But I can tell you, I have never known a gay person who has changed. And I've known plenty who have tried, including myself. If you're gay, you're gay. I couldn't expect you to understand it because you're not going through it. And I could understand hearing those stories of people changing and it confusing you. But how many of those stories are there? And of those people that say they "changed" how many of them are able to stay that way?
I can tell you about 2 friends I have who went through two seperate christian conversion programs. One of them says it scarred him for life and he hates them now. The other said it just didn't do anything and that mostly what they did was try to change the behavior. Behavior is one thing, but who you bond with emotionally is another. You can say you're in love with someone, but eventually if you're not that is going to fall apart. And end up hurting somebody who actually was in love.
Originally posted by Aldaron Originally posted by AlexAmore God created your mind, body, and spirit and everyone else's including every single person you will meet. God created your conscious and unconscious. Basically what i'm saying is because everything is God's creation including your ability to make decisions and recieve influence then God being omnipotent should know the future of His creations inside and out.
ok...He knows the future of his creations. What's your point? If they're going to turn out disobeying him, what's the point of creating them, right?
Beats me.
I've always thought, "Since God knows everything, why did he create Satan?" I'm not God. I don't know. If you're asking me to give you an answer, I can't.
All I know is that people/beings are created, and given a free will. Just because they use that free will to do something that is evil or disobedient to God's plan, does not mean that God intended them to do as such.
Originally posted by Xexima I thought you were an agnostic... but anyway
First off, Kyoruto was just trying to be funny. Second of all, according to the teachings of Jesus, God doesnt "hate" anyone, he just disapproves of what they do.
Ok. I'll give you that, God doesn't hate anyone. Never said otherwise.
Can you prove that babies are not just born gay?
Sexual psychology does not come around until further in the humans development. So yes, it can be accurately said that you aren't, "born gay".
Some scientists argue otherwise.
No. The same thing goes the otherway.
What, being born straight? It depends how you look at it. Again, sexual psychology does not come until later in the humans development. But nature has been set up as such that the opposite sexes to be naturally attracted to each other so as to work as the progenitors of the human race. Without that, there would be no desire to procreate, and we'd end up extinct.
What I was talking about was that you cannot prove that people are born with their sexuality any more than you can prove that they choose it.
It is just stubborn and idiotic to try to argue either side, because you have no information to back it up. Now, don't say that God doesn't make people gay as fact, because you can't prove that. Beliefs =/= facts.
Here...YHVH, YHWH, Yahveh, Yahweh, Jehovah, etc. Doesn't make people gay, and that's a fact. I don't know what god you believe in, so...
No, that is not fact. There is no proof that their is a god, and therefore, there is no proof that he created anyone, gay or strait. Just for the record, I'm an agnostic.
Also, I don't understand why people say that it is not possible that there is a god, because that is equally as stubborn.
Originally posted by upallnight
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
Look above for reference.
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay?
I don't? I never said I did.
Yes you did. You said that gays choose to be, and that is telling him how he thinks.
I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way.
Don't need to feel it to know. It's the natural urge to procreate and continue the species - If you believe in evolution(which I don't. Just trying to cover bases), then you can say it was something that was bred into us over millions of years so we wouldn't become extinct.
If you believe in God...Well, kind of the same thing. Except it was just put into us so we wouldn't become extinct.
Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay.
I never picked to have a bad temper. Never made a conscious decision.
And boy, when I was younger, did I have a bad temper. In fact, looking back, I feel kind of bad.
On the other hand though, I did make a conscious decision to change my bad temper, to control it. Everyone has their own demons to battle, that was just one of many that I have had to deal with - And yes, I know you'll probably be offended that I refer to you being gay as a "demon to battle", but that's how I view it as.
I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
Firstly, I never said anything about what "gay people" think. I just said they weren't born gay. So now I'm making assumptions about what you think because of it? That's a bit of a stretch.
Secondly, who's story am I suppose to believe? I've read of cases of people who claimed to of been fully involved in the homosexual lifestyle, and then later made a conscious decision to change that, and get married to a person of the opposite sex, that they loved, etc. etc.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
Originally posted by AlexAmore I believe there is a God, but I don't claim to understand God. Agnostic means i'm half atheist and I think atheism is even more of a faith than anything, because you have to believe nothing created everything.
You can look at it as half atheist, but the other half is theist. You could also think of it as giving the possibility that their is a higher being, and that there is no higher being.
Untill there is proof there is a god, or that there isn't one, I will continue to keep my mind open to it.
It's the male anatomy too. I look at a picture of a guy (meaning I have no idea how he acts) and I am sexually attracted to him (especially if he has a nice chest and stomach, that drives me nuts). I look at a picture of a girl (again, meaning I have no idea how she acts), and nada. No attraction to women. I'm just not. And the love comes next. I am first sexually attracted to a guy, then later if he is my type we may hit it off emotionally and try dating. It's really no different than a straight couple.
I still want to ask one last question if you will indulge. Is it the anatomy or the fitness? If you see a gal that is more muscular than Governator Arnold and she could lift you with 1 arm, you feel something special or nada still? (Personnally I prefer slightly fat gals that ain't muscular but with a tomboy extreme attitude, yet I just wanna ask)
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
People have to stop looking at homosexuality as some sort of disease. It isn't. There is absolutely nothing wrong with gay people and they shouldn't have to constantly be looking over their shoulders or defending themselves both physically and verbally against naysayers and skeptics. No one chooses to be straight or gay. Straight men don't just wake up one day and say to themselves "I think I'm going to choose to like women". Its the same for gays.
And if there is a God, and if he is as understanding and loving as religious people claim he is, then he isn't frowning upon homosexuals. In fact, he's probably frowning upon all of the "religous" people who look down on homosexuality. If judgement day comes for you religous folk, I can be pretty sure God would frown upon homophobes moreso than homosexuals. And if that isn't true, then God isn't as fair and just as he's cut out to be.
As for the attacks in San Diego; idiots like that enrage me and embarass me to no end. How can we be living in the so-called greatest country in the world if we attack our own people simply because they live their lives in a different manner? Gays aren't going to do anything to you, and to actively seek them out to do them harm it retarded, stupid, idiotic, moronic... I just can't stand people like that. And to all the people who are open about their homosexuality, I commend you for your courage. Hopefully one day society will no longer frown upon you for who you are. You have my support.
Starting to find it pretty funny the word gay cannot be used in a subject on this site without it going back to the very same religious debate that will never reach an end.
Anyway, i'm not going to add to the religious debate, but i saw someone mention family guy,
are you aware the creator of family guy is gay? it's true, and when you think of it quite obvious with the amount of showtunes and gay characters and comments.
Just thought id make some gay hating family guy fans worlds crumble, heheh He keeps it on the down low because he doesn't want it to impact his success.
Comments
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay? I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way. Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay. I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
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Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
God created your mind, body, and spirit and everyone else's including every single person you will meet. God created your conscious and unconscious. Basically what i'm saying is because everything is God's creation including your ability to make decisions and recieve influence then God being omnipotent should know the future of His creations inside and out.
I thought you were an agnostic... but anyway
I believe there is a God, but I don't claim to understand God. Agnostic means i'm half atheist and I think atheism is even more of a faith than anything, because you have to believe nothing created everything.
______________________________
"When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!"
-cheer leading, flag waving American
He is the one who will judge you in the end, not other people.
People are not born good or evil, they are given a free will to decide what they want to do with their lives. What they do with thelr lives is based on the experiences they have through out their lives. This combined with free will causes them to decide what type of life they choose to live.
People chose to live their lives the way they see fit.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
He is the one who will judge you in the end, not other people.
People are not born good or evil, they are given a free will to decide what they want to do with their lives. What they do with thelr lives is based on the experiences they have through out their lives. This combined with free will causes them to decide what type of life they choose to live.
People chose to live their lives the way they see fit.
Wow we almost went a full month without a gay topic.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay? I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way. Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay. I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
Maybe you could (as well as other people) have taken something in you saw, or taken something in the wrong way at any point in your life and it seeped into your subconscious and you "accepted" it in someway thats maybe associated with homosexuality. It might not even have to do with sexuality...
eye dun haf sig
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay? I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way. Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay. I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
Maybe you could (as well as other people) have taken something in you saw, or taken something in the wrong way at any point in your life and it seeped into your subconscious and you "accepted" it in someway thats maybe associated with homosexuality. It might not even have to do with sexuality...
You need to stop trying to find something wrong here. There isn't anything.
There is lots and lots of Scientific evidence that basically says that most Homosexuals don't have a choice. They're born with it. Doesn't make them any less equal than Hetrosexuals. You need to give up this whole sin thing. I'm not very religious at all, but if I were a god, I wouldn't Create something Exactly the way I didn't want it, and give it no choice to change. It makes absolutely no sense. Therefore, I doubt God sees Homosexuality as the ultimate evil. However, I don't even claim to understand God or even religion for that matter, so please, if you can enlighten me, do so.
We barely remember who or what came before this precious moment;
We are choosing to be here right now -Tool, Parabola
Ok, ok. Family Guy, is just a cartoon. There really are not babies born with dictatorial complexes with a hate for the family matriarch, and bent on world domination - So building on that, babies are not gay - No one is born gay.
God did not create gay people; he gave everyone a free will - By your logic, you could say that "Why did God create Stalin, or Hitler?"
Completely illogical.
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay? I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way. Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay. I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
Maybe you could (as well as other people) have taken something in you saw, or taken something in the wrong way at any point in your life and it seeped into your subconscious and you "accepted" it in someway thats maybe associated with homosexuality. It might not even have to do with sexuality...
Or maybe I'm gay and I'm sexually and emotionally attracted to males because my brain is wired that way.
Who knows. All I can tell you is that it's not a choice. And as much as I didn't just choose to be gay I also can't just choose to be straight.
And you're half right. It's not all sexuality. It's also who I fall in love with. I have never felt the emotion towards a girl that I feel towards men. Not even remotely close. You may think that it's possible to change that, but if you do just imagine yourself changing to love men instead of women. It's just as complex a thing for me to do.
And really, don't try to use some psychoanalytical stuff on me or anyone else when it comes to this. If it were something as simple as a misinterpretation in my life somewhere, then wouldn't I be able to recognize that from my adult vantage point and know where things were perceived differently? I understand that some behaviors can be changed through learning new habits, but this is something much deeper than being racist, or associating spiders with fear, or feeling closed in on an elevator.
Why is it so hard for people to just listen to us and give us the credit to know something like that. I have thought about this a lot. After all it's my life. I have had to deal with a lot of rejection, fear, and self-esteem problems because of it. After going through all that it seems that if this weren't me naturally that I would have broken down by now, but it doesn't go away. Just like you being a heterosexual would never just go away.
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Originally posted by upallnight
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
Look above for reference.
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay?
I don't? I never said I did.
I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way.
Don't need to feel it to know. It's the natural urge to procreate and continue the species - If you believe in evolution(which I don't. Just trying to cover bases), then you can say it was something that was bred into us over millions of years so we wouldn't become extinct.
If you believe in God...Well, kind of the same thing. Except it was just put into us so we wouldn't become extinct.
Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay.
I never picked to have a bad temper. Never made a conscious decision.
And boy, when I was younger, did I have a bad temper. In fact, looking back, I feel kind of bad.
On the other hand though, I did make a conscious decision to change my bad temper, to control it. Everyone has their own demons to battle, that was just one of many that I have had to deal with - And yes, I know you'll probably be offended that I refer to you being gay as a "demon to battle", but that's how I view it as.
I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
Firstly, I never said anything about what "gay people" think. I just said they weren't born gay. So now I'm making assumptions about what you think because of it? That's a bit of a stretch.
Secondly, who's story am I suppose to believe? I've read of cases of people who claimed to of been fully involved in the homosexual lifestyle, and then later made a conscious decision to change that, and get married to a person of the opposite sex, that they loved, etc. etc.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
"Fear not death; for the sooner we die, the longer shall we be immortal."
May I ask, out of curiosity.
If a gal would be forthcoming, direct, behaving like a "male", would you still feel that way?
I am not gay myself, but nothing turn me down more than a girl who EXPECT to be impressed, conquered, treated like a queen, been "understood", entertained and so on...and let's be honest, I FEEL that 95% of the women are like that! (not a statistic, I can be wrong there, it is how I feel and why I prefer my computer
). In fact, to be polite with these gals, I usually talk about the weather, it make them go away.
I am just wondering, are you really gay? Or is it how women behave in general? Maybe it is their psychological and intellectual values that you can't stand. Anyway, just asking...
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
May I ask, out of curiosity.
If a gal would be forthcoming, direct, behaving like a "male", would you still feel that way?
I am not gay myself, but nothing turn me down more than a girl who EXPECT to be impressed, conquered, treated like a queen, been "understood", entertained and so on...and let's be honest, I FEEL that 95% of the women are like that! (not a statistic, I can be wrong there, it is how I feel and why I prefer my computer
). In fact, to be polite with these gals, I usually talk about the weather, it make them go away.
I am just wondering, are you really gay? Or is it how women behave in general? Maybe it is their psychological and intellectual values that you can't stand. Anyway, just asking...
It's the male anatomy too. I look at a picture of a guy (meaning I have no idea how he acts) and I am sexually attracted to him (especially if he has a nice chest and stomach, that drives me nuts). I look at a picture of a girl (again, meaning I have no idea how she acts), and nada. No attraction to women. I'm just not. And the love comes next. I am first sexually attracted to a guy, then later if he is my type we may hit it off emotionally and try dating. It's really no different than a straight couple.
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ok...He knows the future of his creations. What's your point? If they're going to turn out disobeying him, what's the point of creating them, right?
Beats me.
I've always thought, "Since God knows everything, why did he create Satan?" I'm not God. I don't know. If you're asking me to give you an answer, I can't.
All I know is that people/beings are created, and given a free will. Just because they use that free will to do something that is evil or disobedient to God's plan, does not mean that God intended them to do as such.
Originally posted by Xexima
I thought you were an agnostic... but anyway
@aldaron:
First off, Kyoruto was just trying to be funny. Second of all, according to the teachings of Jesus, God doesnt "hate" anyone, he just disapproves of what they do.
Ok. I'll give you that, God doesn't hate anyone. Never said otherwise.
Can you prove that babies are not just born gay?
Sexual psychology does not come around until further in the humans development. So yes, it can be accurately said that you aren't, "born gay".
No. The same thing goes the otherway.
What, being born straight? It depends how you look at it. Again, sexual psychology does not come until later in the humans development. But nature has been set up as such that the opposite sexes to be naturally attracted to each other so as to work as the progenitors of the human race. Without that, there would be no desire to procreate, and we'd end up extinct.
It is just stubborn and idiotic to try to argue either side, because you have no information to back it up. Now, don't say that God doesn't make people gay as fact, because you can't prove that. Beliefs =/= facts.
Here...YHVH, YHWH, Yahveh, Yahweh, Jehovah, etc. Doesn't make people gay, and that's a fact. I don't know what god you believe in, so...
Also, I don't understand why people say that it is not possible that there is a god, because that is equally as stubborn.
Originally posted by upallnight
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
Look above for reference.
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay?
I don't? I never said I did.
I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way.
Don't need to feel it to know. It's the natural urge to procreate and continue the species - If you believe in evolution(which I don't. Just trying to cover bases), then you can say it was something that was bred into us over millions of years so we wouldn't become extinct.
If you believe in God...Well, kind of the same thing. Except it was just put into us so we wouldn't become extinct.
Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay.
I never picked to have a bad temper. Never made a conscious decision.
And boy, when I was younger, did I have a bad temper. In fact, looking back, I feel kind of bad.
On the other hand though, I did make a conscious decision to change my bad temper, to control it. Everyone has their own demons to battle, that was just one of many that I have had to deal with - And yes, I know you'll probably be offended that I refer to you being gay as a "demon to battle", but that's how I view it as.
I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
Firstly, I never said anything about what "gay people" think. I just said they weren't born gay. So now I'm making assumptions about what you think because of it? That's a bit of a stretch.
Secondly, who's story am I suppose to believe? I've read of cases of people who claimed to of been fully involved in the homosexual lifestyle, and then later made a conscious decision to change that, and get married to a person of the opposite sex, that they loved, etc. etc.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
I don't believe those stories of people changing. I have never known a gay person to change. I have known some bisexual people who were sexually attracted to the same sex, but not emotionally. They were however emotionally able to fall in love with the opposite sex. Maybe that's where the mix-up occurs. There is a gray area between straight and gay for some people. I think maybe those people may have a resentment for the gay community because they can't go back once they make that decision to be "healed". So they show that resentment by putting us down and saying that what they've done we all can do.
But I can tell you, I have never known a gay person who has changed. And I've known plenty who have tried, including myself. If you're gay, you're gay. I couldn't expect you to understand it because you're not going through it. And I could understand hearing those stories of people changing and it confusing you. But how many of those stories are there? And of those people that say they "changed" how many of them are able to stay that way?
I can tell you about 2 friends I have who went through two seperate christian conversion programs. One of them says it scarred him for life and he hates them now. The other said it just didn't do anything and that mostly what they did was try to change the behavior. Behavior is one thing, but who you bond with emotionally is another. You can say you're in love with someone, but eventually if you're not that is going to fall apart. And end up hurting somebody who actually was in love.
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ok...He knows the future of his creations. What's your point? If they're going to turn out disobeying him, what's the point of creating them, right?
Beats me.
I've always thought, "Since God knows everything, why did he create Satan?" I'm not God. I don't know. If you're asking me to give you an answer, I can't.
All I know is that people/beings are created, and given a free will. Just because they use that free will to do something that is evil or disobedient to God's plan, does not mean that God intended them to do as such.
Originally posted by Xexima
I thought you were an agnostic... but anyway
@aldaron:
First off, Kyoruto was just trying to be funny. Second of all, according to the teachings of Jesus, God doesnt "hate" anyone, he just disapproves of what they do.
Ok. I'll give you that, God doesn't hate anyone. Never said otherwise.
Can you prove that babies are not just born gay?
Sexual psychology does not come around until further in the humans development. So yes, it can be accurately said that you aren't, "born gay".
Some scientists argue otherwise.
No. The same thing goes the otherway.
What, being born straight? It depends how you look at it. Again, sexual psychology does not come until later in the humans development. But nature has been set up as such that the opposite sexes to be naturally attracted to each other so as to work as the progenitors of the human race. Without that, there would be no desire to procreate, and we'd end up extinct.
What I was talking about was that you cannot prove that people are born with their sexuality any more than you can prove that they choose it.
It is just stubborn and idiotic to try to argue either side, because you have no information to back it up. Now, don't say that God doesn't make people gay as fact, because you can't prove that. Beliefs =/= facts.
Here...YHVH, YHWH, Yahveh, Yahweh, Jehovah, etc. Doesn't make people gay, and that's a fact. I don't know what god you believe in, so...
No, that is not fact. There is no proof that their is a god, and therefore, there is no proof that he created anyone, gay or strait. Just for the record, I'm an agnostic.
Also, I don't understand why people say that it is not possible that there is a god, because that is equally as stubborn.
Originally posted by upallnight
How can you claim to know if a gay person is born that way or not?
Look above for reference.
I don't claim to know what it's like being straight, so how can you know what it's like being gay?
I don't? I never said I did.
Yes you did. You said that gays choose to be, and that is telling him how he thinks.
I would never be so bold as to say I understand what drives a straight person to desire the opposite sex because I have never felt that way.
Don't need to feel it to know. It's the natural urge to procreate and continue the species - If you believe in evolution(which I don't. Just trying to cover bases), then you can say it was something that was bred into us over millions of years so we wouldn't become extinct.
If you believe in God...Well, kind of the same thing. Except it was just put into us so we wouldn't become extinct.
Yet you're going to say you understand what I'm made of?
If I was not born this way then I can promise you there was never EVER a conscious decision on my part in any second of my life where I picked being gay.
I never picked to have a bad temper. Never made a conscious decision.
And boy, when I was younger, did I have a bad temper. In fact, looking back, I feel kind of bad.
On the other hand though, I did make a conscious decision to change my bad temper, to control it. Everyone has their own demons to battle, that was just one of many that I have had to deal with - And yes, I know you'll probably be offended that I refer to you being gay as a "demon to battle", but that's how I view it as.
I have never made that decision. And I can tell you with complete honesty that I have never been attracted to females and wanted them as a partner to love in my life. I have always been attracted to the same sex.
If you want to know what gay people think instead of making wrong assumptions then why don't you just ask us? We tell you all the time that we didn't choose this, yet people still act like we don't know enough about our own minds and bodies to know who we are.
Firstly, I never said anything about what "gay people" think. I just said they weren't born gay. So now I'm making assumptions about what you think because of it? That's a bit of a stretch.
Secondly, who's story am I suppose to believe? I've read of cases of people who claimed to of been fully involved in the homosexual lifestyle, and then later made a conscious decision to change that, and get married to a person of the opposite sex, that they loved, etc. etc.
I would never insult you by telling you what you are thinking, so why do you try to deny what we tell you? We're not here saying this just to lie to people. It's scary enough telling the truth, so why would we lie to you?
You can look at it as half atheist, but the other half is theist. You could also think of it as giving the possibility that their is a higher being, and that there is no higher being.
Untill there is proof there is a god, or that there isn't one, I will continue to keep my mind open to it.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
And if there is a God, and if he is as understanding and loving as religious people claim he is, then he isn't frowning upon homosexuals. In fact, he's probably frowning upon all of the "religous" people who look down on homosexuality. If judgement day comes for you religous folk, I can be pretty sure God would frown upon homophobes moreso than homosexuals. And if that isn't true, then God isn't as fair and just as he's cut out to be.
As for the attacks in San Diego; idiots like that enrage me and embarass me to no end. How can we be living in the so-called greatest country in the world if we attack our own people simply because they live their lives in a different manner? Gays aren't going to do anything to you, and to actively seek them out to do them harm it retarded, stupid, idiotic, moronic... I just can't stand people like that. And to all the people who are open about their homosexuality, I commend you for your courage. Hopefully one day society will no longer frown upon you for who you are. You have my support.
Anyway, i'm not going to add to the religious debate, but i saw someone mention family guy,
are you aware the creator of family guy is gay?
it's true, and when you think of it quite obvious with the amount of showtunes and gay characters and comments.
Just thought id make some gay hating family guy fans worlds crumble, heheh
He keeps it on the down low because he doesn't want it to impact his success.