Originally posted by iskareot Originally posted by LilT
Originally posted by LordCaptain Approving content and approving changes to the system are diffrent things. I honestly don't think LEC knew what the NGE was going to do to the fluff of the game.
That's what i think, too. The only people who could tell you exactly what the drastic changes the nge made to the game are the players and the developers. You try talking to your dad or your girlfriend about interdependency between players and sandbox vs. quests and they'll think you're talking a different language. Try talking with an LA producer about it and they'll probably react the same way. They'll probably understand the difference between a game that is "more starwarsy and iconic" and one with faster combat then one without those things. How can someone who doesnt know the intricacies of a game redesign it? Do you think Mr. Torres thought about those interdepencies, or did he just see more lightsabers?
I think that when LA looked at the nge to approve it, they saw more emphasis on star wars and a "ground breaking" combat design, they didnt see what it would do to the community or entertainers or the economy or interdependency. It was soe's responsiblity as developers to see that.
I think LA said hey, make this thing more action packed, make it more accessible. What they probably did not say was "Hey, take out all but 9 professions, remove decay, make a loot based economy, and for gods sakes redesign the ui and make the camera an off the shoulder view. Oh and make sure you do it right after you put out the expansion, that'll really go over well".
In my view 90% of the problem is soe, and the statement by Brenlow makes me more certain.
We did tell them , we sent letters, emails and had dialog -- Myself having some with Smedley, he thought so different of the NGE... he was so wrong and we told him.
I gave it my best shot too, I told him in depth what was going to happen, what did happen and how bad it was...
He did not want to think that.
At least now saying "I told you so", does feel pretty good considering his postion..lol
Amazing how much power many pissed off people have over a corporation like SOE, Coca-cola, ect. ect. You can take all the risks you want but in the end if you lose more than you gain the effort was in vain.
Oh yeah.. in the brief coorespondance I has with Smed he used phrazes like..
"We had to do this"
"It was for the good of the game"
Now he's saying that the difficulties between $OE and LA were the mitigating factor. Now that's slinging a cover-your-ass line of B.S. that would be hilarious if it weren't so transparent.
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Originally posted by Shayde Oh yeah.. in the brief coorespondance I has with Smed he used phrazes like..
"We had to do this"
"It was for the good of the game"
Now he's saying that the difficulties between $OE and LA were the mitigating factor. Now that's slinging a cover-your-ass line of B.S. that would be hilarious if it weren't so transparent.
Sure he is, He has gold feaver and the gold is DC comics online. It's like someone who was mayor of a small city who ran it bankrupt, into a getto, but is now running for governor and needs your support. Push the small city problem under the rug, blame it on city council and move on to greener pastures.
Originally posted by tillamook Originally posted by Shayde Oh yeah.. in the brief coorespondance I has with Smed he used phrazes like..
"We had to do this"
"It was for the good of the game"
Now he's saying that the difficulties between $OE and LA were the mitigating factor. Now that's slinging a cover-your-ass line of B.S. that would be hilarious if it weren't so transparent.
Sure he is, He has gold feaver and the gold is DC comics online. It's like someone who was mayor of a small city who ran it bankrupt, into a getto, but is now running for governor and needs your support. Push the small city problem under the rug, blame it on city council and move on to greener pastures.
AHHHHH.. the Marion Barry defense!
Now he just needs to yell "That bitch LA SET ME UP!!!"
Shayde - SWG (dead) Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled - Some deluded SWG fanboi who pities me. I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too. 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Originally posted by LordCaptain Originally posted by Elnator Originally posted by LordCaptain lol. I don't know. I think LA has been in the gaming industry to at least understand ALITTLE about it :P On a side note, I can't belive he reads Wheel of Time. When he first mentioned it two things went through my head: 1st: A Wheel of Time MMO! Finally. This is what I have been waiting for for 7 years of playing WoTMUD. 2nd: SoE? Why does it have toi be SoE? Anyways, It's not happening. And I will have to agree with Smed. Get well soon Jim Rigney...
Point of fact: LEC has done ZERO MMORPG's. SOE has done 5. Of those 5 only ONE has the problems that SWG does. That would be: SWG.
Do the friggen math people. I'm not saying SWG's problems are solely at the feet of LEC... but ya'll who wish to bash SOE from hell to high water need to realize just WHO is in charge of SWG when all is said and done. And, just a clue, it's not SOE.
Point of Fact: LEC has been in the gaming industry long enough to know something about it. And the fact that they haven't done an MMO before only points more to the fact that SOE screwed over Galaxies.
LEC gave it over to SOE to make and implement with LEC overseeing their IP. SOE made the game, SOE implmented the game, SOE messed over the game. LEC isn't happy about it.
I also find it suspicious that SOE only did this to one of their games. Does it point to LEC behind it? No. It points to the fact the Galaxies was the most "Out-there" MMO they had. It was the most diffrent and it needed to be brought in and made "Better" because that was obviously why it was failing...
The MMO market is an entirely different beast than the single player or regular multiplayer enviroment.
Whatever one wants to say about SOE, they are good at marketing when they choose to be. LEC just thinks the product will market itself as star wars. Most the time they are right, but the MMO market involves more intricacies.
Originally posted by CastleGoob I think its has come to the point where the "blame Game begins" Each person will try to steer the garbage ship (that would be SWG) Away from there port. Knowing full well they added to this garbage. Lucas arts will say we wanted the game improved not gutted SOE will say we wanted to improve the game but lucas arts tied our hands And so forth an so on. Im still un decided who was to blame for this. My gut re action is Smedley but then i think its instinct to just hate him
I can't even blame any of them for doing that.
It is called saving your ass... human factor etc..
______________________________ I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process..... SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
Comments
That's what i think, too. The only people who could tell you exactly what the drastic changes the nge made to the game are the players and the developers. You try talking to your dad or your girlfriend about interdependency between players and sandbox vs. quests and they'll think you're talking a different language. Try talking with an LA producer about it and they'll probably react the same way. They'll probably understand the difference between a game that is "more starwarsy and iconic" and one with faster combat then one without those things. How can someone who doesnt know the intricacies of a game redesign it? Do you think Mr. Torres thought about those interdepencies, or did he just see more lightsabers?
I think that when LA looked at the nge to approve it, they saw more emphasis on star wars and a "ground breaking" combat design, they didnt see what it would do to the community or entertainers or the economy or interdependency. It was soe's responsiblity as developers to see that.
I think LA said hey, make this thing more action packed, make it more accessible. What they probably did not say was "Hey, take out all but 9 professions, remove decay, make a loot based economy, and for gods sakes redesign the ui and make the camera an off the shoulder view. Oh and make sure you do it right after you put out the expansion, that'll really go over well".
In my view 90% of the problem is soe, and the statement by Brenlow makes me more certain.
We did tell them , we sent letters, emails and had dialog -- Myself having some with Smedley, he thought so different of the NGE... he was so wrong and we told him.
I gave it my best shot too, I told him in depth what was going to happen, what did happen and how bad it was...
He did not want to think that.
At least now saying "I told you so", does feel pretty good considering his postion..lol
Amazing how much power many pissed off people have over a corporation like SOE, Coca-cola, ect. ect. You can take all the risks you want but in the end if you lose more than you gain the effort was in vain.
"We had to do this"
"It was for the good of the game"
Now he's saying that the difficulties between $OE and LA were the mitigating factor. Now that's slinging a cover-your-ass line of B.S. that would be hilarious if it weren't so transparent.
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Sure he is, He has gold feaver and the gold is DC comics online. It's like someone who was mayor of a small city who ran it bankrupt, into a getto, but is now running for governor and needs your support. Push the small city problem under the rug, blame it on city council and move on to greener pastures.
I think its has come to the point where the "blame Game begins"
Each person will try to steer the garbage ship (that would be SWG) Away from there port. Knowing full well they added to this garbage.
Lucas arts will say we wanted the game improved not gutted
SOE will say we wanted to improve the game but lucas arts tied our hands
And so forth an so on.
Im still un decided who was to blame for this. My gut re action is Smedley but then i think its instinct to just hate him
Sure he is, He has gold feaver and the gold is DC comics online. It's like someone who was mayor of a small city who ran it bankrupt, into a getto, but is now running for governor and needs your support. Push the small city problem under the rug, blame it on city council and move on to greener pastures.
AHHHHH.. the Marion Barry defense!
Now he just needs to yell "That bitch LA SET ME UP!!!"
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Do the friggen math people. I'm not saying SWG's problems are solely at the feet of LEC... but ya'll who wish to bash SOE from hell to high water need to realize just WHO is in charge of SWG when all is said and done. And, just a clue, it's not SOE.
Point of Fact: LEC has been in the gaming industry long enough to know something about it. And the fact that they haven't done an MMO before only points more to the fact that SOE screwed over Galaxies.
LEC gave it over to SOE to make and implement with LEC overseeing their IP. SOE made the game, SOE implmented the game, SOE messed over the game. LEC isn't happy about it.
I also find it suspicious that SOE only did this to one of their games. Does it point to LEC behind it? No. It points to the fact the Galaxies was the most "Out-there" MMO they had. It was the most diffrent and it needed to be brought in and made "Better" because that was obviously why it was failing...
The MMO market is an entirely different beast than the single player or regular multiplayer enviroment.
Whatever one wants to say about SOE, they are good at marketing when they choose to be. LEC just thinks the product will market itself as star wars. Most the time they are right, but the MMO market involves more intricacies.
I can't even blame any of them for doing that.
It is called saving your ass... human factor etc..
______________________________
I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process.....
SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE
Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1