Someone should start up a vegetarian Fast Food franchise. I mean, think about it. Most of the food you can get quickly and convieniently nowadays is stuff like burgers and tacos and stuff. I think that if someone made a vegetarian fast food franchise they'd do quite well. But they'd have to have shakes of some kind! I don't know, maybe tofu-type ones, or something... I had some tofu-ice cream stuff this one time. It was pretty good. Anyway, yeah, I think that would go a long way to getting people to eat less meat.
'Course, then again, I also said someone should start up a candy/ice cream shop with a drive-through 'cause I love candy. Though, that would adversely affect the nations waistlines... Anyway, the vegetarian one would be a good idea, in my opinion...
Originally posted by Zorvan Originally posted by AlexAmore Originally posted by wardog250 Plants can't feel pain, you would know this if you took science/anatomy.
Actually, I think botany would be more appropriate.
I know that. If you read the whole thread you would see someone corrected me. In response I think somoene would need a course in anatomy anyways so they could compare the anatomy of animals compared to plants.
______________________________ "When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!" -cheer leading, flag waving American
Yesterday I had the Quad stacker from Burger King for lunch, four 1/8 pound patties and 5 stips of bacon (probably artificial). It was damn good, I am 16, male, 6 feet 3 inches tall and I weigh 155 lbs. I'm not planning on stopping with the meat any time soon, I prefer to enjoy my food.
Originally posted by fizzle322 Whine about the cattle industry all you want but...
Cold beer and kebabs roasted over a spit still taste pretty damn good to me.
Keep your rice cakes, I'll take meat thanks.
*sigh* I always have to read these random posts about "But meat is so good" without taking anything into consideration. It's like tastebuds>everything.
Trust me vegan food can be extremely good.
______________________________ "When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!" -cheer leading, flag waving American
Originally posted by AlexAmore Originally posted by Zorvan Originally posted by AlexAmore Originally posted by wardog250 Plants can't feel pain, you would know this if you took science/anatomy.
Actually, I think botany would be more appropriate.
I know that. If you read the whole thread you would see someone corrected me. In response I think somoene would need a course in anatomy anyways so they could compare the anatomy of animals compared to plants.
You are right,WansumBier beat me to it. Also, I agree that anatomy would be needed to make a fair comparison.
Oh, and before you finally beat me to it, have you noticed I have contributed absolutely nothing of importance or value to this thread?
My personal opinion is that the traditional mans meal is meat and potatoes. They are inseperable. They grew up together. They are very close indeed, sometimes touching intimately on my plate when they think I'm not looking. How could I ever justify separating them to the exclusion of one or the other? That would just be cruel.
Actually studies have been done about life expectancy and found that vegetarians/vegans live just as long as meat eaters.
Then I suggest you stop reading stupid studies . Evolution. Vegetarians DO NOT live as long as people with balanced diets. There is no two ways about this.
Once again, how many of the old folk you know are vegetarian? The answer is zero. None. Nada. Not a single old person you know is vegetarian. All the evidence in your life totally disputes this theory. While I applaud your ability to research your opinions, I suggest you apply a test of common sense to each thing you read.
The oldest living people you have ever met all have regular diets.
I suggest you stop wasting your time reading other peoples "studies" and learn to think for yourself.
Originally posted by Gautam How many elderly Vegetarians have you met? Do the maths.
Uh...about half my family, buddy. Just because you've never met them personally doesn't mean they don't exist. Like just because I've never met a lesbian in person does not mean that homosexuality in females is just a lie cooked up by the liberal media. I'm not saying that vegetarianism promotes a healthier lifestyle, but I have met elderly vegetarians before - my grandmother was nearly eighty before she died. Her husband, eighty-five.
It's funny, though, a similar point was expressed by a chick I met through my sister, who asked me, "Show me someone who eats meat who isn't morbidly obese?" God, choke.
That's the first I've ever heard of then. Unilke lesbians, of which I know plenty. I've heard of 100 year old chain smokers and whiskey drinkers, but never a 100 year old vegetarian. My aunt finally gave up vegetarianism aged 65. Health reasons. She is a nurse and had managed to balance her vegetarian diet for many many years, but in the end it's going to get you.
I was around in the 80's mate, I've met thousands and thousands of vegetarians. I'm no stranger to the hippy circuit either. I have friends who make a living wholesaling vegetarian foods. Not personally having met a geriatric vegeterian might not lead you to believe that none have ever existed, but it should give you a pretty good idea of exactly how successful a diet it is. As I said, do the maths. What you have personally experienced is a great place to start when applying common sense to a subject. Second hand knowledge of the internet isn't necessarily so smart; since I have also heard of people abducted by aliens and read numerous serious scientific studies that say crop circles are the imprints made by flying saucers when they land. I have even heard WMD have been found in Iraq and can provide numerous links to prove it.
I remember when vegetarian options were found on every menu and provided as an option for every school dinner. Where girls all used to flame against meat eaters and the best sellling T shirt said "Meat is Murder". Pop stars that ate meat never got to no.1 and one in five restaurents were vegan. 5 years later, all over. Just another city fashion like white gloves, whistles and Global Hypercolour in the 90's..
In the end, the girls all got pregnant and had to start eating responsably, the old hippies got to the stage in life where they were williing to compromise their principles if it meant they got to go on living. Everyone grew up. And that my friends is the root of it. Sooner or later you will get old and your teenage rebellions will eventually burn themselves out. Enjoy them while you are young, if you are a vegetarian in ten years time, let me know, and I'll send you £20.
be a vegan be a meat eater in the end we all die live how you want and let others live how they want. opinions everyone has them but doesnt mean anyone listens.
Originally posted by baff Originally posted by Gautam How many elderly Vegetarians have you met? Do the maths.
Uh...about half my family, buddy. Just because you've never met them personally doesn't mean they don't exist. Like just because I've never met a lesbian in person does not mean that homosexuality in females is just a lie cooked up by the liberal media. I'm not saying that vegetarianism promotes a healthier lifestyle, but I have met elderly vegetarians before - my grandmother was nearly eighty before she died. Her husband, eighty-five.
It's funny, though, a similar point was expressed by a chick I met through my sister, who asked me, "Show me someone who eats meat who isn't morbidly obese?" God, choke.
That's the first I've ever heard of then. Unilke lesbians, of which I know plenty. I've heard of 100 year old chain smokers and whiskey drinkers, but never a 100 year old vegetarian. My aunt finally gave up vegetarianism aged 65. Health reasons. She is a nurse and had managed to balance her vegetarian diet for many many years, but in the end it's going to get you.
I was around in the 80's mate, I've met thousands and thousands of vegetarians. I'm no stranger to the hippy circuit either. I have friends who make a living wholesaling vegetarian foods. Not personally having met a geriatric vegeterian might not lead you to believe that none have ever existed, but it should give you a pretty good idea of exactly how successful a diet it is. As I said, do the maths. What you have personally experienced is a great place to start when applying common sense to a subject. Second hand knowledge of the internet isn't necessarily so smart; since I have also heard of people abducted by aliens and read numerous serious scientific studies that say crop circles are the imprints made by flying saucers when they land. I have even heard WMD have been found in Iraq and can provide numerous links to prove it.
I remember when vegetarian options were found on every menu and provided as an option for every school dinner. Where girls all used to flame against meat eaters and the best sellling T shirt said "Meat is Murder". Pop stars that ate meat never got to no.1 and one in five restaurents were vegan. 5 years later, all over. Just another city fashion like white gloves, whistles and Global Hypercolour in the 90's..
In the end, the girls all got pregnant and had to start eating responsably, the old hippies got to the stage in life where they were williing to compromise their principles if it meant they got to go on living. Everyone grew up. And that my friends is the root of it. Sooner or later you will get old and your teenage rebellions will eventually burn themselves out. Enjoy them while you are young, if you are a vegetarian in ten years time, let me know, and I'll send you £20.
Yeah, you're right there - sorry about getting a bit high and mighty there. But I definitely see where you're coming from though.
I guess the thing was that where you saw vegetarianism grow from the fad, I kinda saw it as the norm. Like I said, I grew up in a vegetarian household and wasn't really introduced to meat until I first went to school, where I saw someone eating bologna and asked him what it was. Since I knew grandparents and great-grandparents, and still know them, I just happened to say, "Yeah, there're old vegetartians." But I guess it's kinda like, and excuse me for using such a cliché, cancer survivors. "Yeah, Lance Armstrong beat cancer, so it's possible. But is it probable? That's another question."
But I'm going on comparing cancer to vegetarianism. I like how you mentioned the fad of vegetarianism, because that's one of the things that pissed me off. Because after that, everyone started assuming that you had to be vegetarian because it was the vogue thing to do. I mean, much like what the Spice Girls did to the UK, the vegetarianism vogue did more harm than good, I feel. When I bring up that I'm vegetarian to my friends, they're like, "Oh, you're the hippie, right? Have to fight for the chickens, right?" And the only thing I can do is say, "Yep, you know me, save the gay whales for Jesus."
God, PETA gave us such a horrible name, seriously.
You are right,WansumBier beat me to it. Also, I agree that anatomy would be needed to make a fair comparison.
Oh, and before you finally beat me to it, have you noticed I have contributed absolutely nothing of importance or value to this thread?
My personal opinion is that the traditional mans meal is meat and potatoes. They are inseperable. They grew up together. They are very close indeed, sometimes touching intimately on my plate when they think I'm not looking. How could I ever justify separating them to the exclusion of one or the other? That would just be cruel.
At least from the about the 1700's. The potato is not native to Europe and when it was first brought across the Atlantic by the Spanish many Europeans would not eat it because the leaves are poision (nightshade family).
But you are right!!! they make a hell of a pair NOW!!
What is up with the double print?
I shoot for the curve... anything above that is gravy.
I have never seen a terrorist yet there are news stories about them. I guess I will think for myself and conclude that terrorists don't exist because I don't know them. I have never seen an atom either. I bet all those scientists are lying. Just like they lie about vegetarians living just as long. I bet we didn't go to the moon either. I wasn't on the spaceship so clearly we didn't. I havn't ever been to Iraq either, I bet it doesn't exist and the government is just spending the money on something else. In fact, I have never even been in space I bet the earth is actually flat. Do you see where going with YOUR experience over science can lead? It is basically more idiotic than the hardcore religous people that say dinosaurs weren't real. At least they are basing it on religion rather than ignorance. That way of thinking sets us back 1000 years.
Your mind is like a parachute, it's only useful when it's open. Don't forget, you can use the block function on trolls.
Originally posted by baff Originally posted by Gautam How many elderly Vegetarians have you met? Do the maths.
Uh...about half my family, buddy. Just because you've never met them personally doesn't mean they don't exist. Like just because I've never met a lesbian in person does not mean that homosexuality in females is just a lie cooked up by the liberal media. I'm not saying that vegetarianism promotes a healthier lifestyle, but I have met elderly vegetarians before - my grandmother was nearly eighty before she died. Her husband, eighty-five.
It's funny, though, a similar point was expressed by a chick I met through my sister, who asked me, "Show me someone who eats meat who isn't morbidly obese?" God, choke.
I was around in the 80's mate, I've met thousands and thousands of vegetarians. I'm no stranger to the hippy circuit either. I have friends who make a living wholesaling vegetarian foods. Not personally having met a geriatric vegeterian might not lead you to believe that none have ever existed, but it should give you a pretty good idea of exactly how successful a diet it is. As I said, do the maths. What you have personally experienced is a great place to start when applying common sense to a subject. Second hand knowledge of the internet isn't necessarily so smart; since I have also heard of people abducted by aliens and read numerous serious scientific studies that say crop circles are the imprints made by flying saucers when they land. I have even heard WMD have been found in Iraq and can provide numerous links to prove it. OK so all of a sudden all studies on the internet are false propaganda? That's very convienent for you.
______________________________ "When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!" -cheer leading, flag waving American
Originally posted by modjoe86 I just dont get it I guess. Humans are omnivores. Meat isn't unhealthy. What am I missing here? All the rest of the posts in this thread.
Thanks for bringing this discussion back to square one.
______________________________ "When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!" -cheer leading, flag waving American
I vote everyone eats Fish! It's better for you anyways. And fruits. Lots of fruit.. And water! Filtered of course. Take calcium pills, cows milk is actualy bad for you!
Originally posted by modjoe86 I just dont get it I guess. Humans are omnivores. Meat isn't unhealthy. What am I missing here?
Okay, let me play Devil's Advocate for a moment here. First, let me say that I am happily a meat-eater. That said the problem isn't that meat isn't unhealthy, it's that the current STANDARDS of meat is unhealthy. They are crammed full of steriods, chemicals, and crap we really don't need to eat.
It's generally easier right now to get truly organic fruits and vegetables (if you're bored enough go out in your backyard and grow some. You can make a nice controlled environment there.) Getting truly organic and unaltered meat products is a bit harder though. Unless you want to try to raise a cow in your backyard then do "the duty" when the time comes up :P
I believe we are omnivores. I've read article after article arguing this from prominent scientists on both sides of the debate so that goes round and round even to this day. Of course, vegetarians are going to believe THEIR sources are more reliable than the omni's and vice versa, but that's really just a biased perspective.
The problem is that a lot of the arguements on either side of the debate are really...crap for the lack of a better word. I've heard people argue (even in this thread) that meat-eaters tend to be more overweight than vegetarians but that's really a bad arguement and it's not generally using similar people in the study. Vegetarians are generally more concerned about their health to begin with. It would be more fair to compare a vegetarian and omnivore that are BOTH fitness nuts. That would give better results. But polling off the streets are rediculous. Personally, any extra weight I may have doesn't come AT ALL from the meat I eat. My vice and downfall is pasta, which will kill your weight faster than any meat out there
Then I hear arguements that vegetarians are "missing" essential nutrients in their diet. Okay, well maybe there would be a distinct difference between a vegan and a vegetarian here. But with a truly vegetarian diet they're not missing a single thing. I've heard protein argued time and again. There are beans that carry more protein pound for pound than meats. Iron? Try your dark greens. Calcium? Lots of places to get this.
Truthfully, I don't think vegetarianism is any more healthy than omnivorism if both are done with proper balance and moderation along with excerise. The keys are balance and moderation. Junk foods make you fat, not meat. You can be a vegetarian or an omnivore and eat too many bags of chips and still be overweight and out of shape. I just think most people who choose to be a vegetarian are already paying more detailed attention to their diet thus making them more healthy to begin with. If an omnivore paid the same attention to their health they'd probably be pretty similiar (I say pretty similar because genetics and metabolism are still pretty uncontrolled to make for a clean slate to judge from).
"What is it I have against Microsoft, you ask? Well, you know how you feel when you wait for an MMO to come out and when it does you feel like you've paid to play it's beta test for another 6-9 months before anything even thinks of working the way it should? Being a network engineer you feel that way about anything Microsoft puts out."
Originally posted by AlexAmore Originally posted by modjoe86 I just dont get it I guess. Humans are omnivores. Meat isn't unhealthy. What am I missing here? All the rest of the posts in this thread.
Thanks for bringing this discussion back to square one.
I read all the posts in the thread...and I found the arguments unconvincing. Thanks for being a patronizing elitist.
Originally posted by modjoe86 I just dont get it I guess. Humans are omnivores. Meat isn't unhealthy. What am I missing here?
It isn't really meat in general that is unhealthy. It is what they are putting into the meat today. Sure, I love a good New York 8oz, straight from the butcher, but what the fast food joints do to it is unhealthy.
Also, this post was also based on peoples beliefs that eating meat is wrong. You have to respect people's opinion, even if it may not be the healthiest way of life.
Also, I have now made a vow to eat meat only when forced to, I.E. dinner.
Originally posted by Tuutob Originally posted by modjoe86 I just dont get it I guess. Humans are omnivores. Meat isn't unhealthy. What am I missing here?
It isn't really meat in general that is unhealthy. It is what they are putting into the meat today. Sure, I love a good New York 8oz, straight from the butcher, but what the fast food joints do to it is unhealthy.
Also, this post was also based on peoples beliefs that eating meat is wrong. You have to respect people's opinion,
even if it may not be the healthiest way of life. All the nutrients you get from animals come from the ground like plants. I cut out the middle man (err...animal) and I get it straight from the original source (healthier) while missing out on the high cholesterol, high saturated fats, high oxidants, Antibiotics (animals are highly medicated), hormones (Europe is banning them....while USA will probably add more thanks to the industries)....ect
The plant based diet has no cholesterol, low in saturated fats, low in oxidants, high in antioxidants, high in fiber....ect Also, I have now made a vow to eat meat only when forced to, I.E. dinner.
______________________________ "When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!" -cheer leading, flag waving American
Originally posted by Gautam Like I said, I grew up in a vegetarian household and wasn't really introduced to meat until I first went to school, where I saw someone eating bologna and asked him what it was.
Ugh, what a lousy way to be introduced to meat. Were they fresh out of Spam?
When I bring up that I'm vegetarian to my friends, they're like, "Oh, you're the hippie, right? Have to fight for the chickens, right?" And the only thing I can do is say, "Yep, you know me, save the gay whales for Jesus."
Ironicly, I have a t-shirt that says "Nuke all the gay whales for Jesus"
God, PETA gave us such a horrible name, seriously.
Agreed. I really don't care what people eat but if they suck up too much Peta they start wandering around spouting questionable quasi-science fueled by paid spokesmen and talking about how damn great it is. Nothing like a shot of high horse to piss off everyone who isn't in the club.
Originally posted by modjoe86 Originally posted by AlexAmore Originally posted by modjoe86 I just dont get it I guess. Humans are omnivores. Meat isn't unhealthy. What am I missing here? All the rest of the posts in this thread.
Thanks for bringing this discussion back to square one.
I read all the posts in the thread...and I found the arguments unconvincing. Thanks for being a patronizing elitist.
Oh, and well said Mal.
Being a patronizing elitist is one of the mandatory requirements to be a member of Peta.
Comments
Actually, I think botany would be more appropriate.
Someone should start up a vegetarian Fast Food franchise. I mean, think about it. Most of the food you can get quickly and convieniently nowadays is stuff like burgers and tacos and stuff. I think that if someone made a vegetarian fast food franchise they'd do quite well. But they'd have to have shakes of some kind! I don't know, maybe tofu-type ones, or something... I had some tofu-ice cream stuff this one time. It was pretty good. Anyway, yeah, I think that would go a long way to getting people to eat less meat.
'Course, then again, I also said someone should start up a candy/ice cream shop with a drive-through 'cause I love candy. Though, that would adversely affect the nations waistlines... Anyway, the vegetarian one would be a good idea, in my opinion...
Whine about the cattle industry all you want but...
Cold beer and kebabs roasted over a spit still taste pretty damn good to me.
Keep your rice cakes, I'll take meat thanks.
Actually, I think botany would be more appropriate.
I know that. If you read the whole thread you would see someone corrected me. In response I think somoene would need a course in anatomy anyways so they could compare the anatomy of animals compared to plants.
______________________________
"When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!"
-cheer leading, flag waving American
I like beef in muh belly!
===============================
Trust me vegan food can be extremely good.
______________________________
"When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!"
-cheer leading, flag waving American
Actually, I think botany would be more appropriate.
I know that. If you read the whole thread you would see someone corrected me. In response I think somoene would need a course in anatomy anyways so they could compare the anatomy of animals compared to plants.
You are right,WansumBier beat me to it. Also, I agree that anatomy would be needed to make a fair comparison.
Oh, and before you finally beat me to it, have you noticed I have contributed absolutely nothing of importance or value to this thread?
My personal opinion is that the traditional mans meal is meat and potatoes. They are inseperable. They grew up together. They are very close indeed, sometimes touching intimately on my plate when they think I'm not looking. How could I ever justify separating them to the exclusion of one or the other? That would just be cruel.
Then I suggest you stop reading stupid studies . Evolution. Vegetarians DO NOT live as long as people with balanced diets. There is no two ways about this.
Once again, how many of the old folk you know are vegetarian? The answer is zero. None. Nada. Not a single old person you know is vegetarian. All the evidence in your life totally disputes this theory. While I applaud your ability to research your opinions, I suggest you apply a test of common sense to each thing you read.
The oldest living people you have ever met all have regular diets.
I suggest you stop wasting your time reading other peoples "studies" and learn to think for yourself.
It's funny, though, a similar point was expressed by a chick I met through my sister, who asked me, "Show me someone who eats meat who isn't morbidly obese?" God, choke.
That's the first I've ever heard of then. Unilke lesbians, of which I know plenty. I've heard of 100 year old chain smokers and whiskey drinkers, but never a 100 year old vegetarian. My aunt finally gave up vegetarianism aged 65. Health reasons. She is a nurse and had managed to balance her vegetarian diet for many many years, but in the end it's going to get you.
I was around in the 80's mate, I've met thousands and thousands of vegetarians. I'm no stranger to the hippy circuit either. I have friends who make a living wholesaling vegetarian foods. Not personally having met a geriatric vegeterian might not lead you to believe that none have ever existed, but it should give you a pretty good idea of exactly how successful a diet it is. As I said, do the maths. What you have personally experienced is a great place to start when applying common sense to a subject. Second hand knowledge of the internet isn't necessarily so smart; since I have also heard of people abducted by aliens and read numerous serious scientific studies that say crop circles are the imprints made by flying saucers when they land. I have even heard WMD have been found in Iraq and can provide numerous links to prove it.
I remember when vegetarian options were found on every menu and provided as an option for every school dinner. Where girls all used to flame against meat eaters and the best sellling T shirt said "Meat is Murder". Pop stars that ate meat never got to no.1 and one in five restaurents were vegan. 5 years later, all over. Just another city fashion like white gloves, whistles and Global Hypercolour in the 90's..
In the end, the girls all got pregnant and had to start eating responsably, the old hippies got to the stage in life where they were williing to compromise their principles if it meant they got to go on living. Everyone grew up. And that my friends is the root of it. Sooner or later you will get old and your teenage rebellions will eventually burn themselves out. Enjoy them while you are young, if you are a vegetarian in ten years time, let me know, and I'll send you £20.
be a vegan be a meat eater in the end we all die live how you want and let others live how they want. opinions everyone has them but doesnt mean anyone listens.
oh AND COWS FARTS KILL THE OZONE....... lol
It's funny, though, a similar point was expressed by a chick I met through my sister, who asked me, "Show me someone who eats meat who isn't morbidly obese?" God, choke.
That's the first I've ever heard of then. Unilke lesbians, of which I know plenty. I've heard of 100 year old chain smokers and whiskey drinkers, but never a 100 year old vegetarian. My aunt finally gave up vegetarianism aged 65. Health reasons. She is a nurse and had managed to balance her vegetarian diet for many many years, but in the end it's going to get you.
I was around in the 80's mate, I've met thousands and thousands of vegetarians. I'm no stranger to the hippy circuit either. I have friends who make a living wholesaling vegetarian foods. Not personally having met a geriatric vegeterian might not lead you to believe that none have ever existed, but it should give you a pretty good idea of exactly how successful a diet it is. As I said, do the maths. What you have personally experienced is a great place to start when applying common sense to a subject. Second hand knowledge of the internet isn't necessarily so smart; since I have also heard of people abducted by aliens and read numerous serious scientific studies that say crop circles are the imprints made by flying saucers when they land. I have even heard WMD have been found in Iraq and can provide numerous links to prove it.
I remember when vegetarian options were found on every menu and provided as an option for every school dinner. Where girls all used to flame against meat eaters and the best sellling T shirt said "Meat is Murder". Pop stars that ate meat never got to no.1 and one in five restaurents were vegan. 5 years later, all over. Just another city fashion like white gloves, whistles and Global Hypercolour in the 90's..
In the end, the girls all got pregnant and had to start eating responsably, the old hippies got to the stage in life where they were williing to compromise their principles if it meant they got to go on living. Everyone grew up. And that my friends is the root of it. Sooner or later you will get old and your teenage rebellions will eventually burn themselves out. Enjoy them while you are young, if you are a vegetarian in ten years time, let me know, and I'll send you £20.
Yeah, you're right there - sorry about getting a bit high and mighty there. But I definitely see where you're coming from though.
I guess the thing was that where you saw vegetarianism grow from the fad, I kinda saw it as the norm. Like I said, I grew up in a vegetarian household and wasn't really introduced to meat until I first went to school, where I saw someone eating bologna and asked him what it was. Since I knew grandparents and great-grandparents, and still know them, I just happened to say, "Yeah, there're old vegetartians." But I guess it's kinda like, and excuse me for using such a cliché, cancer survivors. "Yeah, Lance Armstrong beat cancer, so it's possible. But is it probable? That's another question."
But I'm going on comparing cancer to vegetarianism. I like how you mentioned the fad of vegetarianism, because that's one of the things that pissed me off. Because after that, everyone started assuming that you had to be vegetarian because it was the vogue thing to do. I mean, much like what the Spice Girls did to the UK, the vegetarianism vogue did more harm than good, I feel. When I bring up that I'm vegetarian to my friends, they're like, "Oh, you're the hippie, right? Have to fight for the chickens, right?" And the only thing I can do is say, "Yep, you know me, save the gay whales for Jesus."
God, PETA gave us such a horrible name, seriously.
Oh, and before you finally beat me to it, have you noticed I have contributed absolutely nothing of importance or value to this thread?
My personal opinion is that the traditional mans meal is meat and potatoes. They are inseperable. They grew up together. They are very close indeed, sometimes touching intimately on my plate when they think I'm not looking. How could I ever justify separating them to the exclusion of one or the other? That would just be cruel.
At least from the about the 1700's. The potato is not native to Europe and when it was first brought across the Atlantic by the Spanish many Europeans would not eat it because the leaves are poision (nightshade family).
But you are right!!! they make a hell of a pair NOW!!
What is up with the double print?
I shoot for the curve... anything above that is gravy.
Your mind is like a parachute, it's only useful when it's open.
Don't forget, you can use the block function on trolls.
It's funny, though, a similar point was expressed by a chick I met through my sister, who asked me, "Show me someone who eats meat who isn't morbidly obese?" God, choke.
I was around in the 80's mate, I've met thousands and thousands of vegetarians. I'm no stranger to the hippy circuit either. I have friends who make a living wholesaling vegetarian foods. Not personally having met a geriatric vegeterian might not lead you to believe that none have ever existed, but it should give you a pretty good idea of exactly how successful a diet it is. As I said, do the maths. What you have personally experienced is a great place to start when applying common sense to a subject. Second hand knowledge of the internet isn't necessarily so smart; since I have also heard of people abducted by aliens and read numerous serious scientific studies that say crop circles are the imprints made by flying saucers when they land. I have even heard WMD have been found in Iraq and can provide numerous links to prove it.
OK so all of a sudden all studies on the internet are false propaganda? That's very convienent for you.
______________________________
"When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!"
-cheer leading, flag waving American
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I shoot for the curve... anything above that is gravy.
______________________________
"When Saddam flew that plane into those buildings, I knew it was time to kick some Iranian ass!"
-cheer leading, flag waving American
And fruits. Lots of fruit..
And water! Filtered of course. Take calcium pills, cows milk is actualy bad for you!
And we'd all be alittle more healthy.
Independant, Shinto, Lesbian, and Proud!
Okay, let me play Devil's Advocate for a moment here. First, let me say that I am happily a meat-eater. That said the problem isn't that meat isn't unhealthy, it's that the current STANDARDS of meat is unhealthy. They are crammed full of steriods, chemicals, and crap we really don't need to eat.
It's generally easier right now to get truly organic fruits and vegetables (if you're bored enough go out in your backyard and grow some. You can make a nice controlled environment there.) Getting truly organic and unaltered meat products is a bit harder though. Unless you want to try to raise a cow in your backyard then do "the duty" when the time comes up :P
I believe we are omnivores. I've read article after article arguing this from prominent scientists on both sides of the debate so that goes round and round even to this day. Of course, vegetarians are going to believe THEIR sources are more reliable than the omni's and vice versa, but that's really just a biased perspective.
The problem is that a lot of the arguements on either side of the debate are really...crap for the lack of a better word. I've heard people argue (even in this thread) that meat-eaters tend to be more overweight than vegetarians but that's really a bad arguement and it's not generally using similar people in the study. Vegetarians are generally more concerned about their health to begin with. It would be more fair to compare a vegetarian and omnivore that are BOTH fitness nuts. That would give better results. But polling off the streets are rediculous. Personally, any extra weight I may have doesn't come AT ALL from the meat I eat. My vice and downfall is pasta, which will kill your weight faster than any meat out there
Then I hear arguements that vegetarians are "missing" essential nutrients in their diet. Okay, well maybe there would be a distinct difference between a vegan and a vegetarian here. But with a truly vegetarian diet they're not missing a single thing. I've heard protein argued time and again. There are beans that carry more protein pound for pound than meats. Iron? Try your dark greens. Calcium? Lots of places to get this.
Truthfully, I don't think vegetarianism is any more healthy than omnivorism if both are done with proper balance and moderation along with excerise. The keys are balance and moderation. Junk foods make you fat, not meat. You can be a vegetarian or an omnivore and eat too many bags of chips and still be overweight and out of shape. I just think most people who choose to be a vegetarian are already paying more detailed attention to their diet thus making them more healthy to begin with. If an omnivore paid the same attention to their health they'd probably be pretty similiar (I say pretty similar because genetics and metabolism are still pretty uncontrolled to make for a clean slate to judge from).
"What is it I have against Microsoft, you ask? Well, you know how you feel when you wait for an MMO to come out and when it does you feel like you've paid to play it's beta test for another 6-9 months before anything even thinks of working the way it should? Being a network engineer you feel that way about anything Microsoft puts out."
I read all the posts in the thread...and I found the arguments unconvincing. Thanks for being a patronizing elitist.
Oh, and well said Mal.
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Also, this post was also based on peoples beliefs that eating meat is wrong. You have to respect people's opinion, even if it may not be the healthiest way of life.
Also, I have now made a vow to eat meat only when forced to, I.E. dinner.
Also, this post was also based on peoples beliefs that eating meat is wrong. You have to respect people's opinion,
even if it may not be the healthiest way of life.
All the nutrients you get from animals come from the ground like plants. I cut out the middle man (err...animal) and I get it straight from the original source (healthier) while missing out on the high cholesterol, high saturated fats, high oxidants, Antibiotics (animals are highly medicated), hormones (Europe is banning them....while USA will probably add more thanks to the industries)....ect
The plant based diet has no cholesterol, low in saturated fats, low in oxidants, high in antioxidants, high in fiber....ect
Also, I have now made a vow to eat meat only when forced to, I.E. dinner.
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I read all the posts in the thread...and I found the arguments unconvincing. Thanks for being a patronizing elitist.
Oh, and well said Mal.
Being a patronizing elitist is one of the mandatory requirements to be a member of Peta.