Originally posted by Jade6 Some of the attitudes in this thread worry me though; for example, the idea of allowing companies to take legal action against those who play their game in a certain way. Gold farmers are not selling ingame items (one can't sell what does not exist), they are selling their time; time which the company does not and should not own. I shudder to think of the consequences of allowing companies to sue people over the use of their spare time. What's next, prison sentences for missing an episode of "Friends"? Firing squad for anyone who has played a competitor's game in the past? Btw, ps_man... if your fun comes from showing off with your gear, no matter how hard you "worked" for it, I would be willing to argue that gold farmers are doing everyone else a favor by ruining that sort of "fun".
Btw, ps_man... if your fun comes from showing off with your gear, no matter how hard you "worked" for it, I would be willing to argue that gold farmers are doing everyone else a favor by ruining that sort of "fun".
Welcome comrade!
Stalin and Lennon congratulate you on your proper understanding of communist doctrine. The people's peasants and workers will rise and unite to overthrow the capitalist pigs who play MMOGs to show of their hard earned items!
Then we will redistribute the wealth and all will benefit collectively. We will assign everyone their tasks and you will obey without question and be happy fulfilling your proper place in the new world order of MMOG gaming.
1. to everyone saying that there is no point baning ppl for selling ingame items becouse it will still go on.....
thats just stupid.. so we souldent take action agienst child abusers since it will go on anyway?
2. i often here stuff like: why souldent we be allowed to sell our stuff?
lets make one thing clear... u dont own anything u farm in an mmo. u pay money to play on the server but u are not buying any chars or items u find.. u are possibly renting them so u dont have any right to sell anything that isent urs.
Originally posted by WendoXXX i just want to get 2 things said.
1. to everyone saying that there is no point baning ppl for selling ingame items becouse it will still go on..... thats just stupid.. so we souldent take action agienst child abusers since it will go on anyway?
2. i often here stuff like: why souldent we be allowed to sell our stuff? lets make one thing clear... u dont own anything u farm in an mmo. u pay money to play on the server but u are not buying any chars or items u find.. u are possibly renting them so u dont have any right to sell anything that isent urs.
Might would actually listen to what you have to say if you would learn to A) use capital letters from time to time and actually spent the extra fraction of a second to actually spell the word "you".
Get out of Kindergarten and then we will listen to your dribble.
Edit: Thank you Jorev for pointing out my own spelling flaws. I did however at least attempt to spell it in full and not be lazy and type something like u instead of you.
-------------------------------- Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Originally posted by neuronomad Might would actually listen to what you have to say if you would learn to A) use capital letters from time to time and actually spent the extra fraction of a second to actually spell the word "you".
Get out of Kintergarden and then we will listen to your dribble.
You misspelled Kindergarten.
I am not a fan of people who won't take the time to spell out words but he is from Sweden so maybe he deserves a break. Maybe not. Screw him.
"We feel gold selling and websites that promote it damage games like Vanguard and will do everything possible to combat it." Brad McQuaid Chairman & CEO, Sigil Games Online, Inc. Executive Producer, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes www.vanguardsoh
Originally posted by WendoXXX i just want to get 2 things said.
1. to everyone saying that there is no point baning ppl for selling ingame items becouse it will still go on..... thats just stupid.. so we souldent take action agienst child abusers since it will go on anyway?
2. i often here stuff like: why souldent we be allowed to sell our stuff? lets make one thing clear... u dont own anything u farm in an mmo. u pay money to play on the server but u are not buying any chars or items u find.. u are possibly renting them so u dont have any right to sell anything that isent urs.
That is completely way off target. Its not even close to a rational comparrison. If you don't see the difference......
I'm 1000% against gold farming but to put it in the same category as an actual hidious crime.......just not even close to same thing. Selling currency is not illegal. Its a breach of a user agreement. You are not ever going to see people being haul off to court over it or the police picking them up at their homes. The other case you will.
Torak said... I'm 1000% against gold farming but to put it in the same category as an actual hidious crime.......just not even close to same thing. Selling currency is not illegal. Its a breach of a user agreement. You are not ever going to see people being haul off to court over it or the police picking them up at their homes. The other case you will.
Currently Playing - Vampire Bloodlines, Oblivion Favorite overall game - Neverwinter Nights AND Vampire Bloodlines Favorite MMO - ex-Lineage 2 fanboi to bad NCSoft let the bots take it over Most Anticipated games - Neverwinter Nights 2
The MMORPG community has sacrificed Freedom, Depth and Diversity for fast leveling and easy, NPC directed Kill Task Played - L2, WoW, DAoC, AC, EQII, SWG, CoX, SoR, PS, FFXI, AC2 Threw the disk out for - DDO, RFO
I'm done with the main discussion here, but I just couldn't pass this up.
Let me get this straight. In your sig, you appear to complain about games that are fast and easy, and you appear to complain about the use of bots. Games that are other people find fast and easy and FUN shouldn't affect you, right? Just like gold buying shouldn't affect my fun? I mean, the game is frakkin' DESIGNED to be that way and you are complaining about it. And bots? C'mon, using bots aren't illegal. A lot of people have fun through the use of bots, just like a lot of people enjoy spending real money for in-game gold and services. And let's be honest here, since you and I are on the same page now: there will always be people who use bots and 3rd-party addons to enhance their gaming... there's just no point in trying to stop it.
/me sniffs the air. Yeah, I think I smell hypocrite.
Originally posted by neuronomad Originally posted by WendoXXX i just want to get 2 things said.
1. to everyone saying that there is no point baning ppl for selling ingame items becouse it will still go on..... thats just stupid.. so we souldent take action agienst child abusers since it will go on anyway?
2. i often here stuff like: why souldent we be allowed to sell our stuff? lets make one thing clear... u dont own anything u farm in an mmo. u pay money to play on the server but u are not buying any chars or items u find.. u are possibly renting them so u dont have any right to sell anything that isent urs.
Might would actually listen to what you have to say if you would learn to A) use capital letters from time to time and actually spent the extra fraction of a second to actually spell the word "you".
Get out of Kindergarten and then we will listen to your dribble.
Edit: Thank you Jorev for pointing out my own spelling flaws. I did however at least attempt to spell it in full and not be lazy and type something like u instead of you.
Might would actually listen to what you have to say if you would learn to A) use capital letters from time to time and actually spent the extra fraction of a second to actually spell the word "you".
Get out of Kindergarten and then we will listen to your dribble.
Edit: Thank you Jorev for pointing out my own spelling flaws. I did however at least attempt to spell it in full and not be lazy and type something like u instead of you.
First off im sorry for being terrible at spelling and that im lazy when it comes to using capital letters and not using "you" and instedd using "u".
Well back to the topic... ofc child abusers cant be compered to ppl selling ingame cash for real money i was simply trying to make my point that was that it cant be seen as ok only becouse it cant be stopped. Well anyhow its like 01;40 now and i just got home from a party so im going to bed. Still my standing is that selling ingame stuff for real money ruins the game.
Still my standing is that selling ingame stuff for real money ruins the game.
But WendoXXX it is still my opinion that while I don't agree with Gold buying either that selling ingame stuff for real money may ruin the game for some (or heck maybe even the majority) but there are others that it doesn't ruin the game for and adds to their enjoyment. So to say that it ruins the game is really only a mater of opinion. Games like FFXI and L2 seem to have the worst time with farmers, yet there are still many, many people out there that enjoy these games so to say outright that selling/buying ruins a game is a matter of opinion, at least in my opinion.
-------------------------------- Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Well being a old L2 player myself may have somting to do whit how i feel about in but anyhow i also see mmos like some kind of competition and ppl buing stuff still feels like cheating. But as you say its a matter of opinion and i guess we can agree to disagree.
Originally posted by WendoXXX But as you say its a matter of opinion and i guess we can agree to disagree.
To this we can agree on.
One final comment, I do agree that in regards to PVP in MMOs that gold buyers have an unfair advantage. My opinion of being indifferent towards how people wish to play the game is in regards to the PVE aspect of MMOs. As far as PVE I think as long as people aren't harassing other people then how they wish to play is there buisness.
But in regards to PvP I completely understand why people say that it breaks the game. In most games I haven't seen any real issues with holding my own against twinked characters say in EQ2 for example. But in WoW I completely agree that PvP is affected when you get Twinked characters at the end of each BG bracket that have hundreds and hundreds of gold worth of enchants and gear.
If the game was more skill based instead of gear based I would say, oh well. But with WoW being so gear based I completley agree that in regards to PvP gold buy and selling is affected.
As far as PVE though a lot of people talk about economies getting screwed up I still believe that there are natural checks and balances that keep this from truely happening.
-------------------------------- Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
i think people who say no are just jelous couse rich people in rl can also be better in vl this way
anyway spending extra cash to get little better in a game is just stupid but if people like to waste their money why should they get banned? well to get the mass of low budget players happy! cosue both "rich" and low budget palyers(children/students etc) pay the same and there are way less "rich" people playing so keeping the mass of low budget people happy should be better for the business
anyway i dont care couse i dont paly to show off how much time i wasted for beeing lil better in a game...
So basicly ppl sould have the right to play the game however they want right? That sould in that case also include 3th party programs... i mean think about it whats the differense really. 100 high lv bots in a lowbe zone killing everything in sight completly ruining the zone for players or 100 employes for some asian company doing exactly the same or even worse?
you know that this is unreal? the farmes are mainly in high end areas also i dont think so negative about it couse i never had problems with players who stole my mobs dunno perhabs im just lucky
basically my first comment tried to say "i think its bad for the company but i dont care couse i had no problem with this so far"
Actually farmers in my experiens farmers actually always stay in lower areas atlest in l2. Back when i was playing it u couldent even see a mob in sertain areas couse deleveled farmers wiped the place clean. Then we got the classic spamming also... always fun to se some lv 1 spamming the entire chat whit some bloody website url
worst think that happened was that once someone whispered me in wow with a gold offer i told him i would sell him my gold cheaper and i saw him never again:D
only real cheaters i saw was araund 1 year ago when i tested mu after a friend told me he got it yesterday -there were hackers who 1hited every mob right after they spawned and some caused a disconnect if you came near them positive site was you could party them and lvl fast since the game was horrible grind it was really neat
Well WoW got there little "soulbound" thing going on so the market really aint that big there. Only thing ppl basicly can buy is mats and gold but thats only used for enchants in endgame and farming for some enchants and its so easy a 5 year old child could do it. So basicly WoW will never be overrunned whit farmers but iv seen it happand in L2 and it sucked. But ppl have the right to there own opinion but remember... selling items is cheating however u look at it since its forbidden.
do you know if the phrase "yea hereby i declare i dont sell the items of x couse the belong to the company z and therefore i sell my time needed to archieve item / gold amounz y"
is also illegal? couse when i thought about selling my whole wow version together with the account wich was forbidden in the contract but allowed by a higher court in germany i saw it nearly everywhrere on ebay
Originally posted by Aison2 do you know if the phrase "yea hereby i declare i dont sell the items of x couse the belong to the company z and therefore i sell my time needed to archieve item / gold amounz y"
is also illegal? couse when i thought about selling my whole wow version together with the account wich was forbidden in the contract but allowed by a higher court in germany i saw it nearly everywhrere on ebay
first the higher court in germany is worthless in this diskution since the topic isent abou putting ppl in jail or w/e its about banning them. I dont care about some legal contract the only thing that matters is that u are not allowed to sell items. Say u play WoW and sell some bloody mooncloth or whatever for us dollars u can call it what ever u want but it still breaks the rules so its the same as playing soccer and taking the bloody ball in ur hand and running saying "i sould be able to play any way i want.."
THE GAME COMPANIES SHOULD SELL THIER OWN MONEY! (e.g. Roma Victor)
In addition to this, each game company should have its own service set up that allows players to pay an additional fee to have thier characters UBERED or whatever, instantly.
These services should be cheaper than the average costs on ebay and the sweat shop dealers.
Originally posted by hedgewan The answer is simple.
THE GAME COMPANIES SHOULD SELL THIER OWN MONEY! (e.g. Roma Victor)
In addition to this, each game company should have its own service set up that allows players to pay an additional fee to have thier characters UBERED or whatever, instantly.
These services should be cheaper than the average costs on ebay and the sweat shop dealers.
yes! and u should be able to pay cash to go into god mode!
Originally posted by hedgewan The answer is simple.
THE GAME COMPANIES SHOULD SELL THIER OWN MONEY! (e.g. Roma Victor)
In addition to this, each game company should have its own service set up that allows players to pay an additional fee to have thier characters UBERED or whatever, instantly.
These services should be cheaper than the average costs on ebay and the sweat shop dealers.
You don't get it.
The point of disallowing and banning gold farmers is to prevent the economy and game experience from being ruined for those of us who want a fair and level playing field. Roma Victor does not solve this by monopolizing the Ebay market themselves. Then they will manipulate the game mechanics to encourage purchasing their in-game money as they have stated on their website, in order for that kind of revenue system to succeed.
"We feel gold selling and websites that promote it damage games like Vanguard and will do everything possible to combat it." Brad McQuaid Chairman & CEO, Sigil Games Online, Inc. Executive Producer, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes www.vanguardsoh
Comments
i just want to get 2 things said.
1. to everyone saying that there is no point baning ppl for selling ingame items becouse it will still go on.....
thats just stupid.. so we souldent take action agienst child abusers since it will go on anyway?
2. i often here stuff like: why souldent we be allowed to sell our stuff?
lets make one thing clear... u dont own anything u farm in an mmo. u pay money to play on the server but u are not buying any chars or items u find.. u are possibly renting them so u dont have any right to sell anything that isent urs.
Which FF Character Are You?
Get out of Kindergarten and then we will listen to your dribble.
Edit: Thank you Jorev for pointing out my own spelling flaws. I did however at least attempt to spell it in full and not be lazy and type something like u instead of you.
--------------------------------
Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Quit: Eden Eternal, Wakfu, DDO, STO, DCUO, Sword 2, Atlantica Online, LOTRO, SWTOR, RIFT, Earthrise, FFXIV, RoM, Allods Online, GA,WAR,CO,V:SoH,POTBS,TR,COH/COV, WOW, DDO,AL, EQ, Eve, L2, AA, Mx0, SWG, SoR, AO, RFO, DAoC, and others.
www.twitter.com/mlwhitt
www.michaelwhitt.com
You misspelled Kindergarten.
I am not a fan of people who won't take the time to spell out words but he is from Sweden so maybe he deserves a break. Maybe not. Screw him.
"We feel gold selling and websites that promote it damage games like Vanguard and will do everything possible to combat it."
Brad McQuaid
Chairman & CEO, Sigil Games Online, Inc.
Executive Producer, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
www.vanguardsoh
--------------------------------
Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Quit: Eden Eternal, Wakfu, DDO, STO, DCUO, Sword 2, Atlantica Online, LOTRO, SWTOR, RIFT, Earthrise, FFXIV, RoM, Allods Online, GA,WAR,CO,V:SoH,POTBS,TR,COH/COV, WOW, DDO,AL, EQ, Eve, L2, AA, Mx0, SWG, SoR, AO, RFO, DAoC, and others.
www.twitter.com/mlwhitt
www.michaelwhitt.com
i feel bad for those slaves as working and living on a Job to farm gold
Phantasy
lol yea no sh** dude lets all start selling online currency maybe then there wont be a demand for it.
That is completely way off target. Its not even close to a rational comparrison. If you don't see the difference......
I'm 1000% against gold farming but to put it in the same category as an actual hidious crime.......just not even close to same thing. Selling currency is not illegal. Its a breach of a user agreement. You are not ever going to see people being haul off to court over it or the police picking them up at their homes. The other case you will.
I'm done with the main discussion here, but I just couldn't pass this up.
Let me get this straight. In your sig, you appear to complain about games that are fast and easy, and you appear to complain about the use of bots. Games that are other people find fast and easy and FUN shouldn't affect you, right? Just like gold buying shouldn't affect my fun? I mean, the game is frakkin' DESIGNED to be that way and you are complaining about it. And bots? C'mon, using bots aren't illegal. A lot of people have fun through the use of bots, just like a lot of people enjoy spending real money for in-game gold and services. And let's be honest here, since you and I are on the same page now: there will always be people who use bots and 3rd-party addons to enhance their gaming... there's just no point in trying to stop it.
/me sniffs the air. Yeah, I think I smell hypocrite.
Might would actually listen to what you have to say if you would learn to A) use capital letters from time to time and
Get out of Kindergarten and then we will listen to your dribble.
Edit: Thank you Jorev for pointing out my own spelling flaws. I did however at least attempt to spell it in full and not be lazy and type something like u instead of you.
First off im sorry for being terrible at spelling and that im lazy when it comes to using capital letters and not using "you" and instedd using "u".
Well back to the topic... ofc child abusers cant be compered to ppl selling ingame cash for real money i was simply trying to make my point that was that it cant be seen as ok only becouse it cant be stopped. Well anyhow its like 01;40 now and i just got home from a party so im going to bed. Still my standing is that selling ingame stuff for real money ruins the game.
Which FF Character Are You?
But WendoXXX it is still my opinion that while I don't agree with Gold buying either that selling ingame stuff for real money may ruin the game for some (or heck maybe even the majority) but there are others that it doesn't ruin the game for and adds to their enjoyment. So to say that it ruins the game is really only a mater of opinion. Games like FFXI and L2 seem to have the worst time with farmers, yet there are still many, many people out there that enjoy these games so to say outright that selling/buying ruins a game is a matter of opinion, at least in my opinion.
--------------------------------
Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Quit: Eden Eternal, Wakfu, DDO, STO, DCUO, Sword 2, Atlantica Online, LOTRO, SWTOR, RIFT, Earthrise, FFXIV, RoM, Allods Online, GA,WAR,CO,V:SoH,POTBS,TR,COH/COV, WOW, DDO,AL, EQ, Eve, L2, AA, Mx0, SWG, SoR, AO, RFO, DAoC, and others.
www.twitter.com/mlwhitt
www.michaelwhitt.com
Which FF Character Are You?
One final comment, I do agree that in regards to PVP in MMOs that gold buyers have an unfair advantage. My opinion of being indifferent towards how people wish to play the game is in regards to the PVE aspect of MMOs. As far as PVE I think as long as people aren't harassing other people then how they wish to play is there buisness.
But in regards to PvP I completely understand why people say that it breaks the game. In most games I haven't seen any real issues with holding my own against twinked characters say in EQ2 for example. But in WoW I completely agree that PvP is affected when you get Twinked characters at the end of each BG bracket that have hundreds and hundreds of gold worth of enchants and gear.
If the game was more skill based instead of gear based I would say, oh well. But with WoW being so gear based I completley agree that in regards to PvP gold buy and selling is affected.
As far as PVE though a lot of people talk about economies getting screwed up I still believe that there are natural checks and balances that keep this from truely happening.
--------------------------------
Currently Playing: Guild Wars 2 and Path of Exile
Quit: Eden Eternal, Wakfu, DDO, STO, DCUO, Sword 2, Atlantica Online, LOTRO, SWTOR, RIFT, Earthrise, FFXIV, RoM, Allods Online, GA,WAR,CO,V:SoH,POTBS,TR,COH/COV, WOW, DDO,AL, EQ, Eve, L2, AA, Mx0, SWG, SoR, AO, RFO, DAoC, and others.
www.twitter.com/mlwhitt
www.michaelwhitt.com
anyway spending extra cash to get little better in a game is just stupid
but if people like to waste their money why should they get banned?
well to get the mass of low budget players happy!
cosue both "rich" and low budget palyers(children/students etc) pay the same and there are
way less "rich" people playing so keeping the mass of low budget people happy should be
better for the business
anyway i dont care couse i dont paly to show off how much time i wasted for beeing lil better in a game...
Pi*1337/100 = 42
Which FF Character Are You?
you know that this is unreal? the farmes are mainly in high end areas
also i dont think so negative about it couse i never had problems with players
who stole my mobs
dunno perhabs im just lucky
basically my first comment tried to say "i think its bad for the company but i dont care couse i had no problem with this so far"
Pi*1337/100 = 42
Which FF Character Are You?
worst think that happened was that once someone whispered me in wow with a gold offer
i told him i would sell him my gold cheaper and i saw him never again:D
only real cheaters i saw was araund 1 year ago when i tested mu after a friend told me he
got it yesterday
-there were hackers who 1hited every mob right after they spawned and some
caused a disconnect if you came near them
positive site was you could party them and lvl fast
since the game was horrible grind it was really neat
Pi*1337/100 = 42
Which FF Character Are You?
"yea hereby i declare i dont sell the items of x couse the belong to the company z
and therefore i sell my time needed to archieve item / gold amounz y"
is also illegal?
couse when i thought about selling my whole wow version together with the account
wich was forbidden in the contract but allowed by a higher court in germany
i saw it nearly everywhrere on ebay
Pi*1337/100 = 42
Which FF Character Are You?
The answer is simple.
THE GAME COMPANIES SHOULD SELL THIER OWN MONEY! (e.g. Roma Victor)
In addition to this, each game company should have its own service set up that allows players to pay an additional fee to have thier characters UBERED or whatever, instantly.
These services should be cheaper than the average costs on ebay and the sweat shop dealers.
Which FF Character Are You?
You don't get it.
The point of disallowing and banning gold farmers is to prevent the economy and game experience from being ruined for those of us who want a fair and level playing field. Roma Victor does not solve this by monopolizing the Ebay market themselves. Then they will manipulate the game mechanics to encourage purchasing their in-game money as they have stated on their website, in order for that kind of revenue system to succeed.
"We feel gold selling and websites that promote it damage games like Vanguard and will do everything possible to combat it."
Brad McQuaid
Chairman & CEO, Sigil Games Online, Inc.
Executive Producer, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
www.vanguardsoh