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When will we get past the point and click grind of MMO's ?
lune
Member Posts: 8
Some of the first games I played on the computer were doom, quake.. decent 1 and 2... moved into warcraft and starcraft for a while and then found asheron's call. That was the first MMO i ever played and was stuck in it for over a year... took a couple years off games and then played WOW.
I've tried a lot of the beta's and trials for MMO's and they all seem to be the same point and click where you want to walk and then select your target and start pressing buttons until your target dies... then move on.
WOW/AC have the W A S D and straffing movement / jumping that makes your character feel like you are really in control... in AC you could actually dodge attacks by moving but it seems like the rest of the games including WOW are all based on gear/skills/math to determine if you hit or miss your target
what I am trying to get at is... CAN SOMEONE PLEASE point out some existing or upcoming games that feature a movement/combat system similar to FPS that allows you all of the benifits of an MMO but a combat system that involves the skill of the RL PLAYER and not their willingness to grind away XP or instances for gear...
i want to be able to run around my enemy while i am doing ranged or melee damage to them
i am tired of clicking on a target and pressing a positive or negative skill on them and then picking the next target and doing the same
THAT GETS REALLY OLD REALLY FAST.. ESPECIALLY WHEN THE GAME IS A NEVER-ENDING GRIND FOR GEAR FEST...
I've tried a lot of the beta's and trials for MMO's and they all seem to be the same point and click where you want to walk and then select your target and start pressing buttons until your target dies... then move on.
WOW/AC have the W A S D and straffing movement / jumping that makes your character feel like you are really in control... in AC you could actually dodge attacks by moving but it seems like the rest of the games including WOW are all based on gear/skills/math to determine if you hit or miss your target
what I am trying to get at is... CAN SOMEONE PLEASE point out some existing or upcoming games that feature a movement/combat system similar to FPS that allows you all of the benifits of an MMO but a combat system that involves the skill of the RL PLAYER and not their willingness to grind away XP or instances for gear...
i want to be able to run around my enemy while i am doing ranged or melee damage to them
i am tired of clicking on a target and pressing a positive or negative skill on them and then picking the next target and doing the same
THAT GETS REALLY OLD REALLY FAST.. ESPECIALLY WHEN THE GAME IS A NEVER-ENDING GRIND FOR GEAR FEST...
Comments
Tabula Rasa - has fps-ish targeting, dmg inflicted is based on character modifiers, the point of the game is to NOT mash buttons for special abilities.
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SWG - 1st Gen MBH (Closed)
EVE (Closed)
WoW (61 Orc Hunter - Blackwing Lair)
GuildWars (Boring...)
There is also PlanetSide (basically just the FPS part, certifications don't really count as skills to me) and World War II Online (not sure).
The grind is the 2nd biggest reason (after poorly designed game economies) that causes farming to flourish in modern MMO's. If playing the game was actually fun, who in thier right mind would deprive themselves of the fun. Farming flourishes because the economy allows it and the game grind is as enjoyable as chewing broken glass, broken glass that came from old womens phlem jars.
So when will we get over the "grind" pretty damn soon I hope because something BIG needs to change in MMO design or we are going to be having this same discussion for ever.
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"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
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"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
It seems that you'd rather play on console. You don't have to worry about they keyboard and mouse at all there.
Personally, I want to keep the keys free of hard binds, because I really like the depth a contextual interface brings to the table. I really don't mind if movement is simplified via point and click, because to tell you the truth, if I wanted the sort of game that WASD emulates, I'll just pick up Metal Gear, or Tomb Raider.
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"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
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SWG - 1st Gen MBH (Closed)
EVE (Closed)
WoW (61 Orc Hunter - Blackwing Lair)
GuildWars (Boring...)
One day, a lead designer will ask to see the day's results of the current game he/she's working on. After reviewing the day's work they'll think to themselves:
"I can't publish this! This is the same garbage that ruins an MMO!"
And thus, "grinding" will cease to be... or so the prophecy foretells.
I sleep with a pillow under my gun.
But beyond that will we ever get passed the click on hotbar (hit hotkey) for special moves etc, auto combat and all the rest? I dunno. Age of Conan seems to be trying it and I think DDO has a more action based gameplay then what the majority of other mmos on the market offer, also Tabula Rasa is going the route of a more shooter based mmo.
I think, from what I have been reading, that Age of Conan and Tabula Rasa (dependant on their relative success at launch) may very well herald the start of the 2nd generation of mmos. Sure developers have been trying to label their games as 2nd generation for awhile now, but hte truth of the matter, simply put, is that graphical upgrades and minor tweaks do not a second generation make.
http://www.speedtest.net/result/7300033012
See I credit the game designers with enough intelligence and skill to properly secure thier economies.
Im surprised how many people dont.
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"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
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"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
MMO games played or tested: EQ, DAoC, Archlord, Auto Assault, CoH, CoV, EQ2, EVE, Guild Wars, Hellgate: London, Linneage II, LOTRO, MxO, Planetside, SWG, Sword of the New World, Tabula Rasa, Vanguard, WWIIOL, WOW, Age of Conan
/rant off.
How do you get rid of grinding? Make a skill-based MMO. These are the only kind of MMO I can play, because I hate grinding with a passion. UO is old and dying, EVE Online is too boring for many and character progression/training has little to do with a player's dedication, and I'm not sure of any other current releases (Saga of Ryzom maybe?).
However, Darkfall might come out in a couple of years, if it doesn't turn into Vaporware. That game is pretty heavily PVP-oriented though. Lots of room for greifers, so if you can't handle that playstyle it probably isn't for you.
I don't know why developers don't make skill-based games. Perhaps because you don't have to play for months on end to get a high-end character (less money for them).
The modern MMORPG is simply not worthy, of the acronym RPG. The straight grind and lack of atmosphere leave me with no choice. From this day forth, World of Warcraft, Everquest 2, and all the games like them shall be referred to as PIGCRAP. People In Guilds Constantly Raiding And Power-leveling
A.) Typing is a neccesity for communicating with players online (especially for consoles, since there is no TS/Ventrillo).
B.) MMOs do not do very well on consoles because they're the same game only with a CONTROLLER! Do you know how terrible it would be to play most MMOs on a console? Press X once and your person attacks for you. It's not like a live-action RPG (alla Fable). Now having a live-action MMO would be something to see... and something a LOT of people would be interested in. But you'll have to talk to the fearful developers about that one.
Perhaps its a matter of terminolgy, but MMORPG stands for Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing game. In my mind such games should be about your character's skills, weapons, armour, and other equipment. Otherwise, the game is merely a persistent Halo world.
I know people enjoy the massive FPS, but by definitey they aren't really MMORPGs. At least that's how I look at it.
One game that I know about that is like free move is Rakion, but that game is mostly PvP based, but it is still very fun.
Guild Wars 2 is my religion
"what I am trying to get at is... CAN SOMEONE PLEASE point out some existing or upcoming games that feature a movement/combat system similar to FPS that allows you all of the benifits of an MMO but a combat system that involves the skill of the RL PLAYER and not their willingness to grind away XP or instances for gear..."
DDO is close. In another thread people are gushing about an upcoming MMO that has manual blocking. DDO already has this. Also, if someone shoots an arrow or throws a fireball at you, you can manually dodge it.
I've read a number of posts lately talking about the freedom of movement during WoW fights. I don't see it. Yeah, you can move around if you want, but most things still auto-hit you as well as have a larger-than-life threat range. If you're fighting a giant in DDO and anticipate he's about to swing at you, you can do a quick backflip to get out of his reach and then flip forward to whack him. You *can* just stand there and push buttons like in any other game, but you won't be getting the best out of your character, and in fact you can design your character's abilities (feats and skills) with the intention of constantly moving during fights.
Enjoy!
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The Chronicles Of Spellborn might be what you're after, take a look www.tcos.com
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