Not to be the harbringer of bad news, because I myself am pulling for AoC (and I hardly pull for MMO's), but...a video was released stating that general beta was happening soon. Considering this game is 4 months from launch, we should be seeing some major changes coming in or we'll then really have the right to raise questions and maybe call a fallback.
And yeah, the combat system in AOC is completely different than the static auto attack. Looking at it for the first time, I actually said out loud "wow....pretty good." I dont have high standards but I dont have low ones either, and AoC is looking pretty good. Graphics are good, combat looks realistic -realistic is the key here - youre not going to have someone swinging a giant hammer like its a baseball bat. Quite frankly taking in the consideration of the physics of the giant hammer fighting, I think that segment looked near perfect. I think alot of people have been groomed by other MMO's *cough* WoW *cough* that they expect some fancy fireworks show that they get when they grind.
If you take a look at the combat in AoC and compare it to a single player game...lets say..maybe like Morrowind or Oblivion, you'll see that the gameplay is surprisingly similar. (There is no auto attack) Now take away the pretty lights from WoW's melee animations and compare them to AoC....WoW doesnt even come close to AoC's graphics and animations. You guys gotta look past the shallow end of it all and look deeper.If anything, you should be happy that the dreaded auto attack has been taken away in favor of a more controlled, dynamic approach. AoC isnt meant to be a game for kids, like the light shows that Blizzard puts on for them - theres a reason why Funcom states "This is a mature game made for mature gamers."
Originally posted by ZuMonster The "It's beta" excuse is used every time. Rarely is the thing complained about any different come gold.
With that said, there wasn't enough to the videos to pull my judgement one way or another. It was damn pretty though.
If the "it's beta" card is still getting played a month or so before release, then I think people can point to blatent fanboi-ism. It's got 4 months, plenty of optimization to be done, so while I dislike the card, I dont mind it since it does have some validity, but I just dont like seeing it broken out all the time.
It definitely has a enough time to change if they use the time wisely. All I am saying is that it's close enough to appointed release that "It's beta" shouldn't protect it from all negative commentary. I don't think anyone should be writing the game off just from this. But solely from these videos. Combat looks run of the mill. Sorry. Like I said though, I think there is more yet to be seen.
Originally posted by ZuMonster It definitely has a enough time to change if they use the time wisely. All I am saying is that it's close enough to appointed release that "It's beta" shouldn't protect it from all negative commentary. I don't think anyone should be writing the game off just from this. But solely from these videos. Combat looks run of the mill. Sorry. Like I said though, I think there is more yet to be seen.
Nope, I agree that people should not protect something from constructive criticism. Best way to fight nay sayers, is fact, and until the game is in beta, that's going to be limited. Unless you are willing to accept what the dev's have to say as is. Some will, some wont.
I see things with the game a little differently, but again, that's what is awesome about everyone having different opinions, there isnt one almighty game out there for everyone. To me, the standard whack-a-mole combat that we've seen in MMO's for the last 10 years is pretty much run of the mill, and AoC is something different, but again, like I said, that's just my opinion.
As far as the beta thing, yeah, it's played way too often, and constructive criticism is always a good thing, as long as people realize it can be constructive, and those who are offering realize that their criticism is just an opinion, and it may not make it the game for them...
I think people who have questions or concerns, will have many of them answered during the E3 to Leipzig GC in August. I'd get the feeling that will be the large flow of info, and even if it isnt everything, it'll be quite a bit.
I love how so many people judge a games content and combat system by watching 30 seconds of beta footage that features level 5 newbies fighting with no special moves or combos to use. Just strait Q, 1, 2, 3, E.
Seriously!
Guys, you are your own worst enemies. I've come to the conclusion that game companies shouldn't even have betas until the game is supposed to go live and they just need a stress test.
let the game actually come out. Then make your decision.
As far as the combat goes, it seems to me that it is "slow" because they are hefting large metal swords. These are large hunks of metal, not finely tuned katanas. The fighting looks fine to me.
I have 2 questions/observations after watching these videos. I'll take what was said earlier in this thread as true, which it may not be: first video showed a lvl 5 char that had no combos, only basic directional attacks, other videos showed lvl 13 chars that had one combo.
1) The combat looked very boring, this is of course obvious, the chars are new and have no, or only one combo, so of course combat won't be exciting. My question is: Why do I need to play it? I assume this is the single player part, where once you get to lvl 20 you can start a char at lvl 20(and join mmo part) right away. But still, why do I need to spend the first 5 lvls with nothign but directional attacks? Would a quick tutorial or 1-2 levels not be enaugh for people to learn how to fight using directional attacks instead of usual mmo's auto-attack. Then I have to go from lvl 5 to lvl 13 with nothing but the same directional attacks that I've been spaming for the first 5 lvls. Untill I get the first combo (we'll assume that said combo is better than normal directional attacks. Once I get the first combo I'll go to lvl 13+ spaming that one combo over and over with some directional attacks now and then... How is that fun?
The good ol "Sure the game isn't fun right now, that's because you are low lvl, just get to level x, that's where the game gets awesome" Doesn't really work too well. If people are bored with your game, they may not stick around untill lvl x to see if the game gets better. And surely, using the same directional attacks and one-2 combos you get untill lvl 20 doesn't sound like fun at all. Granted after that you can skip it and go to lvl 20 directly, but where is the fun? What in this game would grab your attention if you never seen/herd of it before? It seems in the first 20 levels the only reason anyone would play that long is to get to the "fun" part of the game, and feeding players boring gameplay with the promise of awesome fun ahead is not the best design.
2) For a game whose one of the main selling points is fps like real time combat they seem to do an extreamly poor job of promoting it. Do they not have at least one person on their team that has become pretty good with combos and dodging/whatever? Why not show a high lvl character played by a skilled player doing some high lvl pve (or better yet pvp) Showing off all kinds of different combos and how in combat dodging works. That would make people excited and show that the real time combat is as fun as devs make it sound. Instead we get videos of low lvl chars played by people, who seemingle never seen the controls before (that actually goes for most games it seems, not just aoc) In those videos released there were nothing that would make people go "wow, that's awesome!" So, why show low lvl chars that have no combos? Spaming directional attacks with no combos is, imo, even more boring than wathcing a char auto attack. So, why even show it? Where is the in combat dodging? He showed a char dodge (jumping from side to side) but never used it during combat...
I just don't understand, if the game's major selling point is it's new and innovative combat system, can they not release at least one video showing a high lvl char played by a skilled player that actually shows the potential and all the fun things that you can do in aoc? Combos/dodging etc etc. Is there a decent reason as to why they don't do it? I mean, watching a high lvl char using all kinds of different combos and dodging incoming attacks would make me a lot more excited about aoc's combat system. Instead I get to watch a newbiew char using the same directional attacks (about as exciting as auto attacking with no other abilities used) and be told that "it's a low lvl char and it's beta, it will be much better!" Would be nice to actually *see* how the combat playes at high lvls with many combos and decent player skill instead of being told how people *think* it will be.
Very good post!
I think these videos are very poor and lowered my interested very much! There is no Excuse "this is beta". This is just a fanboi statement. U truly believe what we have seen will drastically change in the 4 month to come? Just let me say: LOL
After watching ... iv canceled my preorder. Tired of grinding mob camps, no thanks ... sigh
hmm, there was something very sad about those movies. All other ones i have seen have made me jump in my chair. This just looked like WoW with better graphics
I will still try it sonce there is noother to play.......
Your actually going to say that Spellborns animations are better? I haven't seen anything real recent form them, but from what I have seen, you must be joking.
After starting like that, but in essense agreeing with me lateron, you must be the one who is joking.
Wow, these new videos look worse than any previous ones.
The NPC animations are horrible. They keep walking and swinging long after they've passed the player. They really need to either make the AI much better, or make it so that when you swing you don't take a step forward. Actually that's exactly what they need to do. When you swing your weapon you shouldn't move at all unless you're pressing a direction to move. And it looks like just the swing animation moves the character and the NPCs forward. That'll be a huge pain since you can't turn once in the animation, and you have to wait until the animation is over.
Also the walking animation in the first two videos kind of looks like a penguin walking. He sort of waddles back and forth. If this is motion capture animation, they didn't pick a very good person to motion capture.
Also the footslide in the first video after the player picks up the loot is really bad. I mean we're in beta here. I see another delay in the future for this game if this is what the latest videos look like.
And I was starting to have a renewed hope for this game after some of the more recent videos. These are just bad though.
--------------------------------------------- I live to fight, and fight to live.
Well first of all, i'll start by saying that Conan is not my cup of tea, and that no matter how good/bad their video can be, i'm going to move my guild to War Hammer online.
Now we have that out of the way...
I fail to see why people bash those conan video so much. I've been playing MMO's for a decade, and watching the development of all the mainstream one in early stage, beta and release. What we have here in those Conan's video doesn't justify all that bashing what so ever. There is nothing that can't be fixed at release, and even it this current state, certainly nothing that should make you cancel your pre-order... That's complete rubbish to react in such way.
To make it short: If you have been a follower of this game and like the game play and everything, there is NOTHING in this video that should make your hype meter go lower. If that's the case, you need mental help FAST. If you are perfectly sane, that means you're just another of those stupid troll trying to jump at the throat of a competitor the minute you find an angle that is not playing to it's advantage. To justify yourself to buy the "other" game? Pffft... Go play in the traffic and spare us your rotting and useless comments.
Best regards.
What deserves to be done, deserves to be "well" done...
Well first of all, i'll start by saying that Conan is not my cup of tea, and that no matter how good/bad their video can be, i'm going to move my guild to War Hammer online. Now we have that out of the way... I fail to see why people bash those conan video so much. I've been playing MMO's for a decade, and watching the development of all the mainstream one in early stage, beta and release. What we have here in those Conan's video doesn't justify all that bashing what so ever. There is nothing that can't be fixed at release, and even it this current state, certainly nothing that should make you cancel your pre-order... That's complete rubbish to react in such way. To make it short: If you have been a follower of this game and like the game play and everything, there is NOTHING in this video that should make your hype meter go lower. If that's the case, you need mental help FAST. If you are perfectly sane, that means you're just another of those stupid troll trying to jump at the throat of a competitor the minute you find an angle that is not playing to it's advantage. To justify yourself to buy the "other" game? Pffft... Go play in the traffic and spare us your rotting and useless comments. Best regards.
With the exception of a few posts, it seems that most people are simply expressing disappointment at these "latest" videos because they expected better. You wouldn't be saying what you're saying if all of the comments for 7 pages were "Awesome videos" but since people are saying "Bad Videos" you think they're either just trolling or that they're insane?
I agree that canceling your pre-order or anything that drastic is a bit much, but simply putting down your opinion about the animations, and offering suggestions to make them better, or saying that you're disappointed with the videos is far from trolling or even "bashing." The developers read these forums and comment on these forums.
If the least a complaint does is cause them to go and rethink an animation that they've selected and perhaps make it better, than this "bashing" has served it's purpose.
Saying something is "stupid" or "retarded" would be bashing. Saying something looks subpar, and suggesting how to make it look better is simply constructive criticism.
--------------------------------------------- I live to fight, and fight to live.
Yep, i agree with that. Those who can fit the hat on their heads can apply my comments for them. I'm not saying people should just eat whatever stuff they are thrown, far from it... I'm myself is a big voucher for pushing devs to the walls and force them to produce good stuff and to boycott their product whenever they are sub par. I just thought some of those comments we're over board, and just trying to put the game down. My post was definitely not oriented toward "positive" criticism.
What deserves to be done, deserves to be "well" done...
Second is the fact that all the videos released to date are run in DirectX9 we have to wait till we see the HD version of the game for the aw-inspiring graphics.
All we have seen to date are the low res version of the game set on low settings with incomplete animation. The HD version running in DirectX10 will have better dynamic lighting, reflections, and particle effects. At least hold off till wee see a more complete game with HD screen shots and videos, that is where it will stand the test.
The newly released videos at IGN are HD--they look great; very sharp. Go watch them.
Oh yeah they are... cool.
Everything else I wanted to say Fion and Ghost12 said.
This event was a hands on event for press, which is why of course they don't look as experienced. We have discussed adding a low level combo so that people learn that earlier while still using the oar. (We actually have one already)
PvP coverage will be coming soon.
Combat, Control, Class Distinction Designer for Age of Conan
This event was a hands on event for press, which is why of course they don't look as experienced. We have discussed adding a low level combo so that people learn that earlier while still using the oar. (We actually have one already)
PvP coverage will be coming soon.
One of the posters above had a good suggestion: get a video of someone who knows what they're doing playing. Have them tackle something high-end so people can see what they'll be working toward.
I doubt the occasional bad-gameplay-video is going to hurt AoC much, but I think a really great gameplay video could do quite a bit that's helpful. A lot of people really want to like the game--but you've got a lot of strong competition already in place and coming out around the same time.
Apply lemon juice and candle flame here to reveal secret message.
Yep, i agree with that. Those who can fit the hat on their heads can apply my comments for them. I'm not saying people should just eat whatever stuff they are thrown, far from it... I'm myself is a big voucher for pushing devs to the walls and force them to produce good stuff and to boycott their product whenever they are sub par. I just thought some of those comments we're over board, and just trying to put the game down. My post was definitely not oriented toward "positive" criticism.
Sorry if my post seemed harsh or unnecessary, I just thought you were making a blanket statement.
And to the fact that PvP coverage is coming soon. "Hell, it's about time."
--------------------------------------------- I live to fight, and fight to live.
I used to be very hyped on AOC, however the more video's i see and information being released the more i am not liking the game. My rating has gone from a 10 down to a 5. However the more video's i see on Warhammer Online the more i am impressed.
I'm looking forward to AOC greatly and these vids scared me a bit.
- RUnning animation- they all have fused lumbar vertebrae. They are not rotating the trunk at all when they run. Looks very stiff and unnatural.
- Wolf animation- horrid
- SPells- look good but where is the kind of active interface similar to what melee combat looks like? No spell weaving? How is spell casting doing to be different from other MMO's. It really looks like push button casting like we have all seen the last ten years. Also the spell effects look overdone for the setting IMO.
- Blood - I'm all for realistic violence in these games but it looks like they are splashing buckets of blood on each other. The blood also doesn't stain the ground or bodies. There are also no loping off of limbs or heads. Anyone remember those RTS games Myth? Lots of blood and guts on the ground good stuff.
- Collision detection- this is another thing that I really like about COH that WAYYY too many games ignore. I want to feel like I am in the world.. walking thru enemies and other players does not make sense. It is lazy coding.
I sure hope it isn't as bad as it looked on those vids, cause I"m kinda bummed right now.
Comments
Not to be the harbringer of bad news, because I myself am pulling for AoC (and I hardly pull for MMO's), but...a video was released stating that general beta was happening soon. Considering this game is 4 months from launch, we should be seeing some major changes coming in or we'll then really have the right to raise questions and maybe call a fallback.
And yeah, the combat system in AOC is completely different than the static auto attack. Looking at it for the first time, I actually said out loud "wow....pretty good." I dont have high standards but I dont have low ones either, and AoC is looking pretty good. Graphics are good, combat looks realistic -realistic is the key here - youre not going to have someone swinging a giant hammer like its a baseball bat. Quite frankly taking in the consideration of the physics of the giant hammer fighting, I think that segment looked near perfect. I think alot of people have been groomed by other MMO's *cough* WoW *cough* that they expect some fancy fireworks show that they get when they grind.
If you take a look at the combat in AoC and compare it to a single player game...lets say..maybe like Morrowind or Oblivion, you'll see that the gameplay is surprisingly similar. (There is no auto attack) Now take away the pretty lights from WoW's melee animations and compare them to AoC....WoW doesnt even come close to AoC's graphics and animations. You guys gotta look past the shallow end of it all and look deeper. If anything, you should be happy that the dreaded auto attack has been taken away in favor of a more controlled, dynamic approach. AoC isnt meant to be a game for kids, like the light shows that Blizzard puts on for them - theres a reason why Funcom states "This is a mature game made for mature gamers."
The "It's beta" excuse is used every time. Rarely is the thing complained about any different come gold.
With that said, there wasn't enough to the videos to pull my judgement one way or another. It was damn pretty though.
If the "it's beta" card is still getting played a month or so before release, then I think people can point to blatent fanboi-ism. It's got 4 months, plenty of optimization to be done, so while I dislike the card, I dont mind it since it does have some validity, but I just dont like seeing it broken out all the time.
It definitely has a enough time to change if they use the time wisely. All I am saying is that it's close enough to appointed release that "It's beta" shouldn't protect it from all negative commentary. I don't think anyone should be writing the game off just from this. But solely from these videos. Combat looks run of the mill. Sorry. Like I said though, I think there is more yet to be seen.
Nope, I agree that people should not protect something from constructive criticism. Best way to fight nay sayers, is fact, and until the game is in beta, that's going to be limited. Unless you are willing to accept what the dev's have to say as is. Some will, some wont.
I see things with the game a little differently, but again, that's what is awesome about everyone having different opinions, there isnt one almighty game out there for everyone. To me, the standard whack-a-mole combat that we've seen in MMO's for the last 10 years is pretty much run of the mill, and AoC is something different, but again, like I said, that's just my opinion.
As far as the beta thing, yeah, it's played way too often, and constructive criticism is always a good thing, as long as people realize it can be constructive, and those who are offering realize that their criticism is just an opinion, and it may not make it the game for them...
I think people who have questions or concerns, will have many of them answered during the E3 to Leipzig GC in August. I'd get the feeling that will be the large flow of info, and even if it isnt everything, it'll be quite a bit.
Guys, you are your own worst enemies. I've come to the conclusion that game companies shouldn't even have betas until the game is supposed to go live and they just need a stress test.
let the game actually come out. Then make your decision.
As far as the combat goes, it seems to me that it is "slow" because they are hefting large metal swords. These are large hunks of metal, not finely tuned katanas. The fighting looks fine to me.
Ditto
Always do the right thing
Very good post!
I think these videos are very poor and lowered my interested very much! There is no Excuse "this is beta". This is just a fanboi statement. U truly believe what we have seen will drastically change in the 4 month to come? Just let me say: LOL
I will still try it sonce there is noother to play.......
After starting like that, but in essense agreeing with me lateron, you must be the one who is joking.
--
Delanor
Wow, these new videos look worse than any previous ones.
The NPC animations are horrible. They keep walking and swinging long after they've passed the player. They really need to either make the AI much better, or make it so that when you swing you don't take a step forward. Actually that's exactly what they need to do. When you swing your weapon you shouldn't move at all unless you're pressing a direction to move. And it looks like just the swing animation moves the character and the NPCs forward. That'll be a huge pain since you can't turn once in the animation, and you have to wait until the animation is over.
Also the walking animation in the first two videos kind of looks like a penguin walking. He sort of waddles back and forth. If this is motion capture animation, they didn't pick a very good person to motion capture.
Also the footslide in the first video after the player picks up the loot is really bad. I mean we're in beta here. I see another delay in the future for this game if this is what the latest videos look like.
And I was starting to have a renewed hope for this game after some of the more recent videos. These are just bad though.
---------------------------------------------
I live to fight, and fight to live.
Well first of all, i'll start by saying that Conan is not my cup of tea, and that no matter how good/bad their video can be, i'm going to move my guild to War Hammer online.
Now we have that out of the way...
I fail to see why people bash those conan video so much. I've been playing MMO's for a decade, and watching the development of all the mainstream one in early stage, beta and release. What we have here in those Conan's video doesn't justify all that bashing what so ever. There is nothing that can't be fixed at release, and even it this current state, certainly nothing that should make you cancel your pre-order... That's complete rubbish to react in such way.
To make it short: If you have been a follower of this game and like the game play and everything, there is NOTHING in this video that should make your hype meter go lower. If that's the case, you need mental help FAST. If you are perfectly sane, that means you're just another of those stupid troll trying to jump at the throat of a competitor the minute you find an angle that is not playing to it's advantage. To justify yourself to buy the "other" game? Pffft... Go play in the traffic and spare us your rotting and useless comments.
Best regards.
What deserves to be done, deserves to be "well" done...
With the exception of a few posts, it seems that most people are simply expressing disappointment at these "latest" videos because they expected better. You wouldn't be saying what you're saying if all of the comments for 7 pages were "Awesome videos" but since people are saying "Bad Videos" you think they're either just trolling or that they're insane?
I agree that canceling your pre-order or anything that drastic is a bit much, but simply putting down your opinion about the animations, and offering suggestions to make them better, or saying that you're disappointed with the videos is far from trolling or even "bashing." The developers read these forums and comment on these forums.
If the least a complaint does is cause them to go and rethink an animation that they've selected and perhaps make it better, than this "bashing" has served it's purpose.
Saying something is "stupid" or "retarded" would be bashing. Saying something looks subpar, and suggesting how to make it look better is simply constructive criticism.
---------------------------------------------
I live to fight, and fight to live.
Yep, i agree with that. Those who can fit the hat on their heads can apply my comments for them. I'm not saying people should just eat whatever stuff they are thrown, far from it... I'm myself is a big voucher for pushing devs to the walls and force them to produce good stuff and to boycott their product whenever they are sub par. I just thought some of those comments we're over board, and just trying to put the game down. My post was definitely not oriented toward "positive" criticism.
What deserves to be done, deserves to be "well" done...
The newly released videos at IGN are HD--they look great; very sharp. Go watch them.
Oh yeah they are... cool.
Everything else I wanted to say Fion and Ghost12 said.
This event was a hands on event for press, which is why of course they don't look as experienced. We have discussed adding a low level combo so that people learn that earlier while still using the oar. (We actually have one already)
PvP coverage will be coming soon.
Combat, Control, Class Distinction Designer for Age of Conan
community.ageofconan.com
I doubt the occasional bad-gameplay-video is going to hurt AoC much, but I think a really great gameplay video could do quite a bit that's helpful. A lot of people really want to like the game--but you've got a lot of strong competition already in place and coming out around the same time.
Apply lemon juice and candle flame here to reveal secret message.
Perhaps it will be wise to add 10 or more combos so gameplay can be more interesting for those who want more complex pvp and pve.
Sorry if my post seemed harsh or unnecessary, I just thought you were making a blanket statement.
And to the fact that PvP coverage is coming soon. "Hell, it's about time."
---------------------------------------------
I live to fight, and fight to live.
I used to be very hyped on AOC, however the more video's i see and information being released the more i am not liking the game. My rating has gone from a 10 down to a 5. However the more video's i see on Warhammer Online the more i am impressed.
I'm looking forward to AOC greatly and these vids scared me a bit.
- RUnning animation- they all have fused lumbar vertebrae. They are not rotating the trunk at all when they run. Looks very stiff and unnatural.
- Wolf animation- horrid
- SPells- look good but where is the kind of active interface similar to what melee combat looks like? No spell weaving? How is spell casting doing to be different from other MMO's. It really looks like push button casting like we have all seen the last ten years. Also the spell effects look overdone for the setting IMO.
- Blood - I'm all for realistic violence in these games but it looks like they are splashing buckets of blood on each other. The blood also doesn't stain the ground or bodies. There are also no loping off of limbs or heads. Anyone remember those RTS games Myth? Lots of blood and guts on the ground good stuff.
- Collision detection- this is another thing that I really like about COH that WAYYY too many games ignore. I want to feel like I am in the world.. walking thru enemies and other players does not make sense. It is lazy coding.
I sure hope it isn't as bad as it looked on those vids, cause I"m kinda bummed right now.