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WoW's UI ripoff of AC2?
Thillian
Member UncommonPosts: 3,156
This thread is a reflection to all that are smashing Lotro on its forum general discussion about how it copied WoW's interface. Look at those two pictures. The frist one is from WoW, the one below is from Asheron's Call 2 released in 2002. Same minimap, health/mana pool bar position, same skill panel same inventory same options panel position.
REALITY CHECK
Comments
Unreal UI is a ripoff of Quake
Starcraft UI is a ripoff of Command and Conquer
Windows UI is a ripoff of MacOS
etc...
Heh, pretty much. If a UI works and is user-friendly, people will copy it. Nothing wrong with that, its about gameplay being different, not the UI.
WoW is inspired by Asherons Call 2 more than people think. Things like talent trees, dungeon locks and world bosses were all in AC2 before they cropped up in WoW
Heh, pretty much. If a UI works and is user-friendly, people will copy it. Nothing wrong with that, its about gameplay being different, not the UI.
*whispers* psst don't tell anyone, the gameplay is the same as well.
Anyway this topic is about the UI not about gameplay. There has been lots of threads on LOTRO forum that they copied UI from WoW. So I wanted to bring some light into it (Asheron's call 2 same engine as lotro, same company)
And please don't bring out those predictable arguments like why then AC2 died and WoW has milions of subs.
REALITY CHECK
What does it matter? Look at any successful product and there are obvious similarities.
Take Automobiles for example. Many cars have very similar appearance, designs and engineering.
There have been so many topics like this one. Most people really don't care but they keep popping up...
Edit: That's a good one Radav
Um, like, who cares?
And Asheron's call 2 was -not- the first game to use a similar interface, so at least do some more research before finding the "first" game to use a similar UI.
And really, aside from the mini map being round and the buttons being along the bottom, they really aren't THAT similar.
Even WordPerfect for DOS used buttons at the bottom of the screen (closer to the keyboard you know)
And I suppose I should mention that Star Trek on the Honeywell DPS 6 also had a mini map in the same location, and buttons along the bottom. Of course there was no mouse control back then....
Is this what we have become as a community? This is not a slam against the OP, they make a valid point. The bitter defense and unrelenting attacks that some make against any MMO other then the one they are currently playing cannot be good for the industry and will drive new comers away. Would you want to get into a hobby where, on the surface, there seems to be so much division? When did this attitude begin? Is WoW the cause of this attitude or is it because of the general poor state of the industry today?
What's the big deal? Like others have said, If a UI works others will copy it. I would think the games that the UI's are copied from should feel somewhat flattered that another company would want to incorporate their UI into that other companies game inplace of part or all of their own. Seems to be smart thinkin to me.
WOW is a ripoff of AC2, and now they copy things from DDO and LOTRO like voice chat..., and wanna bet they waiting for book 11 LOTRO patch to see how turbine implemented housing and guild houses to ripoff that too?
Who cares since they do it so much better. To the victor go the spoils. You only make me want to log in tonight.
When oh when will people stop the "rip off" threads and realize that EVERYONE rips off EVERYONE else?
No offense to the OP, I don't mean to sound like a jerk...
but honestly, you can search any forum on MMORPG.com and find tons of threads with "rip off" in them.
So the answer to your question, "WOW's UI ripoff of AC2?" is YES, of course they did. They'd be stupid not too.
How many FPS games have nearly the same interface?
How many RTS?
Are they still good games? That's all that matters. It doesn't matter what they "ripped off" from other titles, as long as you enjoy playing the game and think it's worth your invenstment of time and money..
then does it really matter who it ripped off?
The answer should be "no" by the way.
Just my opinion...
As to the topic, if a UI works why change it? All cars have 4 wheels, dont see many 3 wheel or 5 wheels cars do you.. and why because 4 wheels works.
Regarding voice chat:
An MMO game development team has finite resources. They can't have every single possible feature you can possibly hope for in the initial design specficiation. The beauty of a subscription model is that you can add features at a later date.
You'd have to be extremely cynical if you think that WoW is just ripping off other MMOs, and that it would never implement voice chat if LOTRO online didn't have it. There are dozens of online games with voice chat.
Claiming that Blizzard are just ripping other MMO companies off is quite ridiculous.
Regarding interfaces:
Interfaces in games become standardized in all genres. Most first person games now have WASD keys for movement, noone is ripping anyone off, they're just adopting standards. And standards get refined. Despite the fact that AC2 died a grizzly death, it's visual interface obviously set the standard to follow. Blizzard tweaked it, it's not the same (that's not a mini-map in AC2 btw, it's a compass - no maps involved)
Again, people claiming rip off are making a ridiculous argument.
Molest us not with this trash!
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Define RIP-OFF and Inspiration
You failed in your MMO life.
All canceled. Waiting on Warhammer Online : Age of Reckoning.
Actually I have no idea what you or anyone else is talking about when you say WoW's UI is a ripoff of someone elses. My UI looked like that maybe for 1 week, then I used someone elses then changed it again and now I am finally on a UI I put together myself.
I dont know why these posts even still come up, every game has borrowed from every game thats ever been made. It so funny how anyone who doesnt like WoW or stopped playing WoW wants to come in here and constantly bash the game for something. The way I figure it is if you have that much time to sit there and bash WoW apparently you dont have another game to play so your pissed off because the rest of us are enjoying WoW.
Out of every 100 men, 10 should not be there,
80 are nothing but targets, 9 are the real fighters.
Ah, but one, ONE of them is a warrior,
and he will bring the others home.
-Heraclitus 500BC
Gosh, of course IT DOES MATTER if something is ripoff of something else or not. Only progress moves the gaming forward. NEW IDEAS IS WHAT WE WANT, not copying what was here ten times before.
The fact that wow copied all of its features from previous releases and IS succesful means besides the fact that the community is ignorant, but also makes a precedence for future games. Thats why LOTRO for example is a mix of everything that was here already, bringing almost nothing new. Do YOU GUYS REALLY WANT THIS?
I feed sad if you do, I want progress I want new ideas I want to play something I didnt play before. It's just your luck that WoW was first for you and you didnt play EQ1 or AC2 before otherwise you would feel the same as you feel when you tried LOTRO after WoW.
Thanks for attention.
REALITY CHECK
Its more or less understood that to play RTS games a mouse is best, For MMO's a UI with buttons at the bottom, HP/Avatar and map at the top corners. It works... so why change it?
Plus WoW did not copy all its features from others games.. alot of what we see in WoW was in diablo including the UI, and Diablo was out even b4 EQ1.
Just because something is new does not in anyway make it better.
REALITY CHECK
But they have improved the interface. They absolutely have not "just copied it", it's not the same.
As an example, like I said before, AC2's "mini map" in the corner, isn't actually a map at all, it's just a simple compass. The WoW mini-map shows terrain details, such as gaps in walls, mountains, lakes, buildings, and stuff like that - it's a map! The AC2 thing is a compass, two similar, but different things. What a good idea by blizzard, to take this interesting compass design, and improve it by merging it with a map.
Not completely new, but to deny it's not an improvement is silly.
Your argument is crit for 40,000 of points of Logic damage
Still waiting for your Holy Grail MMORPG? Interesting...
Let's try another approach. Certainly everything can be improved.
But sometimes change is slow. And change just for change sake is rarely helpful.
Take an example. That thing with all the keys in front of you. The QWERTY keyboard started life in the 1870s. Why? Typists were jamming keys due to typing too fast with the older ABCDEF keyboards (the mechanical rods were intertwining). Over the last 100+ years many people have attempted to come out with "new" keyboards but the QWERTY still remains. Partly because some of us know how to touch type so why learn a new keyboard? The letter layout is logical and everyone knows where each key is (Logical due to the spellings of the English language).
So same with game interfaces.
Let's try another approach. Certainly everything can be improved.
But sometimes change is slow. And change just for change sake is rarely helpful.
Take an example. That thing with all the keys in front of you. The QWERTY keyboard started life in the 1870s. Why? Typists were jamming keys due to typing too fast with the older ABCDEF keyboards (the mechanical rods were intertwining). Over the last 100+ years many people have attempted to come out with "new" keyboards but the QWERTY still remains. Partly because some of us know how to touch type so why learn a new keyboard? The letter layout is logical and everyone knows where each key is (Logical due to the spellings of the English language).
So same with game interfaces.
Indeed.. people like familiarity, changing something such as a UI because "you can" is not always a good thing.. players can get confused and frustrated due to the buttons etc being not where they expect them to be. does not mean all UI must be a copy of each other but they MUST share most aspects... and it must be all clear at its function... I never once reached for the manual when I started WoW, when I fired up EQ2 I was spamming chat becuase it was not clear what I could do after a level up etc.. hell I had to ask where the "logout" button was. ROFL.I just got the new Medal of Honor Airborne game and I find realy frustrating that I have to use the scroll arrows in the online lobby to move the list as I cannot drag the scroll bar. ARRGGG!!!! Something so basic.. but it makes a difference.
It wasn't a compass, it was a map in the same way WoW was. It was a radar. Its been in lot of other games so don't see any significance to either AC2 or WoW.
Edit: I do seem to remember a moving map in that game, so either it was a late addition or maybe was the actual map.