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reimbursement after boot.ini [Eve-Online Acts Like Virus]
cosy
Member UncommonPosts: 3,228
in EVE Online
anyone that loosed the boot.ini and need to reinstall XP have made petition for free subscription ?
edit:
now alot of question come on my head
have CCP tested the parch ? on XP ? how come they dont see that bug ?
boot.ini bug reported on 12/03
http://eve-search.com/thread/648131
(thx nicoli)
BestSigEver :P
Comments
Nope, doubt we'll get much beyond a free month (if that)
What few seem to remember is in the past, upgrading your exisiting Microsoft operating system to a new one sometimes hosed up your computer so bad you had to reformat and start completely over. No reimbursement was forthcoming in that situation, none is required here.
Quite whining, you play a hardcore pvp game, you should be able to struggle through this "hardship".
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
ppl dont have only eve on the hdd
there come the bad part . . .
BestSigEver :P
Yes, the bad part is that there are too many people out there that never or rarely backs up their data, and solve any windows problem by wiping their HD and do a complete reinstall, rather than doing a little bit of research on what the problem might be. Seriously, all that was lost was the boot.ini file. You don't have to gank the entire contents of your HD to fix that.
I'm a big ol' fluffy carewolf. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
yep, people keep saying CCP destroyed my pc I want to sue them!
When all CCP did was accidentally delete the boot.ini file in the main directory, instead of in the eve directory.
As for testing... usually when your testing, your testing the PROGRAM your working on, not the os. This bug would not have appeared till after a reboot, and if MMO coding is anything like what I do atm... you dont reboot often.
This was a nasty little mistake, but an easy one to fix.
Yes, the bad part is that there are too many people out there that never or rarely backs up their data, and solve any windows problem by wiping their HD and do a complete reinstall, rather than doing a little bit of research on what the problem might be. Seriously, all that was lost was the boot.ini file. You don't have to gank the entire contents of your HD to fix that.
Exactly so, and if you have SP2 (which I thought everyone running xp did) you shouldn't have the problem.But for christ's sake don't reformat your computer!
~dai
is soo easy when u know what was the problem
but when u wake up turn on the pc what u say "WTF happen to my computer baaaaaah"
u dont have internet to read this info, what do u think ?
and u read after that was eve that deleted a boot.ini, what u should done to the man that make the parch and dont tested that properly on that moment on that exactly moment ??
BestSigEver :P
Ok anyone who's read the manual for their PC should have seen the important note in the booklet that says: "Always backup your data before installing new software."
I sympathize with folks who got hosed but the fact of the matter is that, in the grand scheme of things, this was a very very minor glitch.
Why?
1) You won't lose data
2) your files aren't exposed
3) you are not at risk of any kind
What DOES happen?
You, or a tech, has to copy the boot.ini.backup from your C:windowspss folder to c: and rename it back to boot.ini
Takes all of 30 seconds if you haven't already rebooted.
Takes all of 5 minutes if you have rebooted by just booting from a valid XP CD and running the recovery console and using the command prompt option to copy the files using DOS.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
What exactly should they reimburse you for? Are they going to buy you a new boot.ini file for your computer? I think putting in the Windows CD and using the repair option should have hopefully fixed that. What exactly did you loose of monitary value from your computer?
Currently Playing: Nothing (waitinf for WAR)
Retired: AC2, EVE, DAoC, EQ, WoW
If you lost your operating system you have every right to whine. This was a nuclear mistake on EVE's part. I will never forget my first few days playing EVE , you would ask for help in local and get nothing but wise asses. Well geuss not much is changed EVE . EVE has to have one of the worst player bases i have ever had the pleasure to gank.P
if u buy a tv and in some way the tv bow up and put on fire your house and lose some furniture some brushes that make your kids, the fire man when put off the fire make rest of electronic that u have on house useless
u still get the walls the house if some one come and ask u "What exactly did you loose of monetary value from your house ?" what u make ?
is the same on a PC
BestSigEver :P
As I have said many times already, CCP did NOT have express permission from Microsoft to change one of their propietary system files and was STUPID to name one of their files the same name in the first place. Many people have only 1 computer and little to no real computer knowledge. Most of you flamers coming here seem to forget that MMORPG.COM is a site that consists mainly of computer savvy members and that the members of this site are a minority in the computer world we know today. When something of this magnitude occurs, the normal person has NO idea how to handle it other than take it into a shop to fix it, thus costing alot of money for what we know is a minor fix, and also what any competent person knows a computer tech will charge through the nose for.
This is being played of as a minor incident, but truth be known it is far from minor. CCP showed negligence across the board by first naming the file after a pivotal system file and secondly not even properly testing the update in the first place. They showed legal negligence in their actions and YES a case could be brought against them and they would lose. No EULA allows a company to change system files on a persons computer. The EULAs only pertains to the programs themselves and any related files associated with that program, it does not cover parts of a system outside the scope of the original program. A class action lawsuit could easily be filed against CCP, but since the company is located in Iceland nothing would probably come of it as international cases of this sort take years usually to resolve due to differing laws and such.
If you lost your operating system you have every right to whine. This was a nuclear mistake on EVE's part. I will never forget my first few days playing EVE , you would ask for help in local and get nothing but wise asses. Well geuss not much is changed EVE . EVE has to have one of the worst player bases i have ever had the pleasure to gank.P
Im sure you did so much ganking your first few days. And if you still play you cant talk trash about a player base you are part of. And if you dont play, its because you couldnt hang.. go play wow nub, there probably wasnt anything good in your can anyways.
Ive been playing Eve since closed beta, ive never had a problem getting help from anyone in the game, you might not get a response in local, but if your in a starting npc corp, you sure will get some help on those channels.
Eve made a mistake. Big deal. /wrist. emos.
In anycase it will surly cost certain people money to get their system back up and running again and surly EVE will loos paying customers over this. Im, affarid it is only a matter of time before the EVE fan base starts trying to say it never happen and wheres your tinfoil hat.
EVE online has to have the worst player base i have ever had the pleasure to gank. P
When installing any software you are taking on the responsibility of what it does to your computer, the company itself is promising that it will work the best it can. They promise nothing else.
Hell my windows doesnt even work properly, when it has to be reformatted i lose all my data, can i sue microsoft for this? no.
Thats why when you use any installer it will say you should back up your system before hand. You have no chance in hell to win a case against a company for a honest mistake.
Also alot of programs share similar file names. This is not the only game you will find a boot.ini file in.
I think it is funny watching all the fanboys come here and try to downplay something that could be a trainwreck for CCP to deal with. And also think it's funny watching CCP pretty much skirt the issue and treat it as little more than a speed bump on their highway.
I think it is funny watching all the fanboys come here and try to downplay something that could be a trainwreck for CCP to deal with. And also think it's funny watching CCP pretty much skirt the issue and treat it as little more than a speed bump on their highway.
CCP has done more for the programming community than any other game company in existance. I happen to be a python programmer and ive read several boots and seen several events where they have contributed to a community that they didnt profit from. I wish every game company could care as much as CCP about their playerbase, their work, and communities they helped them get started.
This is a big problem yes. Is it worth sueing over. No. Will a clash action suit come from this issue. Hah. No.
You are warned when you install software to backup your system. Thats the only warning they need to give. Yes, i support CCP in this issue, because they have earned it.
Yes, the bad part is that there are too many people out there that never or rarely backs up their data, and solve any windows problem by wiping their HD and do a complete reinstall, rather than doing a little bit of research on what the problem might be. Seriously, all that was lost was the boot.ini file. You don't have to gank the entire contents of your HD to fix that.
Exactly so, and if you have SP2 (which I thought everyone running xp did) you shouldn't have the problem.But for christ's sake don't reformat your computer!
Please do not post false information. ALL versions of XP, including home and media center and even 64bit version are affected, yes, even SP2. This has nothing to do with the version of XP but rather where the C: partition is located on the hard drive. If it's partition 0 you are unaffected. If it's anything later then you are. The reason for this is if the C: drive is on partition 0 Windows will automatically recover and the boot.ini will be automatically rebuilt on any system where the C: is on the first partition.
However several computer vendors (Dell, Gateway, Compaq) actually create a restore partition first (it's a few meg in size) then the main partition where the C: resides. So anyone who bought their system from Dell, Gateway, Compaq and possibly HP is likely affected if they're running an out-of-the-box installation.
I really hate it when people who don't know how computers work post nonsense during a issue.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
When installing any software you are taking on the responsibility of what it does to your computer, the company itself is promising that it will work the best it can. They promise nothing else.
Hell my windows doesnt even work properly, when it has to be reformatted i lose all my data, can i sue microsoft for this? no.
Thats why when you use any installer it will say you should back up your system before hand. You have no chance in hell to win a case against a company for a honest mistake.
Also alot of programs share similar file names. This is not the only game you will find a boot.ini file in.
Honest mistake?Don't make me laugh, anyone in their right mind coding a program that is constantly updated as Eve is, has no business duplicating names of major system files. Check any coding and programming 101 guides and you will learn that. There is too many chances for problems and look what happened. Also, any statement you agree to that says you are responsible for someone else's actions is not legal in the court of law. They are put there just to keep the average person from doing anything when something does happen. The company committed negligence and broke the contract (EULA) by altering part of the computer system it had no legal or contractual right to do and this makes them liable for any damages that might have occurred from their actions.
Overreacting much? Deleting the boot.ini on a Windows XP system is the equivalent of having the power button on that TV you're talking about fail so that once turned off, the TV won't turn back on again until fixed.
The TV didn't catch fire. The house didn't burn down because of the TV. But YOU decided to torch the house and burn it all down, then get a new TV as the solution to the problem. You can't blame CCP because you had a waaah waaah moment and decided to do something stupid rather than go out, breathe some fresh air, then find someone... a friend... family member... work place... public library... anything with internet access... so that you could figure out what the problem might be.
I'm a big ol' fluffy carewolf. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
Taram sorry to say for many people this is not minor mistake it is huge. If you have a dell or some of the new stor brand PC's they ship with no operating system CD. These systems have 2 copys on your hard drive. I know for dell you can reload by pressing ctrl and tapping f11 during boot but this will result in you looseing all other data. You will revert your system back to the day you bought it from the store. Now you can call your PC vendor and ask for a OS disk if your under warrenty or call a tech or maybe a freind who has a OS disk you can borrow for a repair boot.In anycase it will surly cost certain people money to get their system back up and running again and surly EVE will loos paying customers over this. Im, affarid it is only a matter of time before the EVE fan base starts trying to say it never happen and wheres your tinfoil hat.
EVE online has to have the worst player base i have ever had the pleasure to gank. P
Actually DELL systems do ship with CD's. I own 3 Dell systems. All came with CD's. No they're not generic XP CD's but they can be used the same way. That's how I fixed mine.
As I said, it's not a HUGE problem, any technician should be able to fix this in seconds and most won't even charge for it. But yeah, if people wind up getting charged CCP should at least give them free game time, as I posted in another thread. My point is this: People are blowing this way out of proportion. The only way someone can lose data from this is if they go off the deep end and reformat the hard drive. Even just re-installing windows won't harm their data in any way. Though they may have to reinstall their applications as well.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
Yes, the bad part is that there are too many people out there that never or rarely backs up their data, and solve any windows problem by wiping their HD and do a complete reinstall, rather than doing a little bit of research on what the problem might be. Seriously, all that was lost was the boot.ini file. You don't have to gank the entire contents of your HD to fix that.
Exactly so, and if you have SP2 (which I thought everyone running xp did) you shouldn't have the problem.But for christ's sake don't reformat your computer!
Please do not post false information. ALL versions of XP, including home and media center and even 64bit version are affected, yes, even SP2. This has nothing to do with the version of XP but rather where the C: partition is located on the hard drive. If it's partition 0 you are unaffected. If it's anything later then you are. The reason for this is if the C: drive is on partition 0 Windows will automatically recover and the boot.ini will be automatically rebuilt on any system where the C: is on the first partition.
However several computer vendors (Dell, Gateway, Compaq) actually create a restore partition first (it's a few meg in size) then the main partition where the C: resides. So anyone who bought their system from Dell, Gateway, Compaq and possibly HP is likely affected if they're running an out-of-the-box installation.
I really hate it when people who don't know how computers work post nonsense during a issue.
Taram, from some of the posts I have seen, even traditional setups with single HDDs have been affected. Whatever CCP is trying to tell people has been wrong, this screwup is affecting pretty much any system except for Vista which changed the bootmanager completely.
Class action law suite eh?
Did CCP screw up? Yes.
Should CCP have done a better job? Yes
However mistakes happen. This was a problem with an easy fix. Few people with limited pc knowledge got screwed over. However... the level to which they were screwed was not CCP's fault.
Lets say you get a new floor put in. The contractor is supposed to sand the hardwood floors, but forgets to, and you get a splinter in your foot.
Instead of removing it yourself, or having someone you know remove it, you call 911, ride the ambulance to the hospital, and then demand anesthesia for the procedure.
Afterwards the hospital gives you a 10,000 bill, and you try and put it off on the contractor.
Did you get screwed? Yes. By the big box computer place you took your pc too and paid way over price for it. Is it fair? No.
Ask for a month free from CCP, and then call the manager of Bestbuy or Compusa. Explain to them what happened, the fix for it, and ask them to explain to you why they charged you 100.00 for a 5 minute fix. Explain to them this would be rather bad for business if someone were to place a call to a local news station, and I think you will get unscrewed rather quickly.
Again... No mistake CCP screwed up, and for those that got nailed should get a month free or maybe three months. But the real criminals are Geek Squad and other big box stores that raped you on price.
You are so far off-base it's hilarious. First, your example with the splinter would cost the Contractor and second the Bestbuy situation would get you nowhere as there is normal accepted industry fees for ANY type of computer tech work. Learn a bit of law before coming here, and oh btw, I do know contract law from having to have 4 years of total for a business management degree. CCP is indeed contractually liable for their actions here as it is generally accepted they would know what they were doing when releasing this update to the public after it was not tested properly.
Trainwreck for CCP? Try trainwreck for the whole PC gaming industry if someone manages to win a multi million dollar lawsuit against CCP over this. What CCP has done is just a small screwup compared to what havoc other games have wreaked on PCs. Watch PC MMO subscriptions jump into the $30+ range while the rest of the gaming industry moves over to consoles where they can't screw up somebody's personal documents and get sued over it.
I'm a big ol' fluffy carewolf. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
Yes, the bad part is that there are too many people out there that never or rarely backs up their data, and solve any windows problem by wiping their HD and do a complete reinstall, rather than doing a little bit of research on what the problem might be. Seriously, all that was lost was the boot.ini file. You don't have to gank the entire contents of your HD to fix that.
Exactly so, and if you have SP2 (which I thought everyone running xp did) you shouldn't have the problem.But for christ's sake don't reformat your computer!
Please do not post false information. ALL versions of XP, including home and media center and even 64bit version are affected, yes, even SP2. This has nothing to do with the version of XP but rather where the C: partition is located on the hard drive. If it's partition 0 you are unaffected. If it's anything later then you are. The reason for this is if the C: drive is on partition 0 Windows will automatically recover and the boot.ini will be automatically rebuilt on any system where the C: is on the first partition.
However several computer vendors (Dell, Gateway, Compaq) actually create a restore partition first (it's a few meg in size) then the main partition where the C: resides. So anyone who bought their system from Dell, Gateway, Compaq and possibly HP is likely affected if they're running an out-of-the-box installation.
I really hate it when people who don't know how computers work post nonsense during a issue.
Taram, from some of the posts I have seen, even traditional setups with single HDDs have been affected. Whatever CCP is trying to tell people has been wrong, this screwup is affecting pretty much any system except for Vista which changed the bootmanager completely.
Ok I'm going to explain this slowly 1 more time:
The patcher that was broken (since been fixed) wiped out boot.ini on ALL instances of XP (or Win2k) unless they have EVE installed on a drive other than C:. If they have EVE installed somewhere else (D/E/F etc) the patcher would not wipe out the boot.ini since it would be referencing
or whatever other letter..
The kicker is that only systems which are running modded installs of some form (either C: is on a different partition or they had a funky boot.ini) are negatively impacted. Anyone who has their C: on Partition ZERO of the hard drive probably didn't even notice the file was gone before rebooting. If they did CHECK before rebooting they would notice it was gone but rebooting wouldn't hurt them because if the C: is on partition 0 the system already can find the bootstrap files to autostart the hard drive and OS. The OS automatically checks for Boot.ini and if it can't find it goes directly to c:windowspss and pulls the backup to restore it.
The reason a system with a non standard install of windows is affected is because either they have renamed the windows directory or C: is not on partition 0. Thus the OS cannot boot because the default boot partition is 0 sine no bootable files are there in a non-standard install the OS cannot initiate an auto-recovery since there is no OS to start. NOTE: If you have an "out of the box" installation from DELL, Gateway, Compaq or HP you probably do NOT have C: on partition 0 as they create a restore partition on 0 and the OS on the next partition. Thus they are affected.
Hope this clears any confusion. YES, all installs of XP/Win2k are affected. But only 'nonstandard' ones are negatively impacted by it though if you do detect it before windows does it's better to be safe and go ahead and restore the file yourself rather than risking windows having a heart attack
Like I said, I think CCP really screwed up here. But it's better to be part of the solution than part of the problem. You can read all you want. I'm a Systems and Network Engineer and have dealt with crap like this a zillion times. It's not the end of the world but people putting out false information doesn't make the situation any better. I'm not saying people don't have a right to be pissed. I do think people screaming about class action lawsuits, etc, are over-reacting though. CCP should credit folks game time and, in worst case situations where someone had to pay to get their system fixed they probably should reimburse them.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell