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My thoughts on Open RvR
crysent
Member UncommonPosts: 841
lately I've noticed a lot of complaints or bad reviews against WAR, while many things pointed out in these I believe are correct I disagree with the views on Open RvR being a failure.
I currently play WAR and am enjoying myself, I play a lvl 32 White Lion on Sylvania. When it comes to Open RvR I figured from day 1 it really wouldent be popular until people really started hitting 40 and that's still what I believe. I know personally when I log on it's to level, and level quickly. I'm a pvper at heart and really try to reach max level and then dive into the major pvp aspects of a game. Organzing a siege is not what I want to spend my time doing right now.
It's not that my server is a ghost town, it's not, Sylvania is alive and thriving and while there are plenty of keep sieges during peak hours I really think that given another month or so things will REALLY start to pick up as more and more people hit lvl 40 and are more interested in sieging.
I do think that certainly open RvR does need some tweaks and I think they are working on it, they have said numerous times that they understand the situation and are making changes to make open RvR more rewarding.
Last I remember when DAOC came out RvR wasn't very populated or popular, espcially after a month after release. When Shadowbane came out guilds wernt working on sieging eachothers cities within the first month, there were some exceptions but on my server people were just leveling and trying to build things up and get good equipment.
Given a month or two, as more people hit lvl 40 and start wanting there guilds to hold keeps and given a little tweaking on mythics part I really think open RvR will pick up and be quite enjoyable, I'm not sure where everyone's expectation that Open RvR would be full from day 1, thats not the nature of that sort of PvP, people dont want to siege a castle when there 10 levels below the other players involved and at this point in the game there is still a large spread of levels. Many people in low 30s, upper 20's, handful of 40's etc.
Just give it some time.
Comments
Teh zone control is either bugged or assinsine.
That means that the T4 campaign is either bugged or assinine.
Mythic will not tell me how the zone control work. They give me nothing, I give them no time. Simple as that.
They have given me no reason to believe they are competent in that regard. And the behavior of the T4 campaign over the last 4 weeks has given me every reason to bleieve they are incompetent in that regards.
So no I won't give time. They haven't shown anything but crappy mechanics in regards to the campaign. And when asked for an explanation they completely ignored 5 different 20 page long threads. Sorry no, I am not that big of a chump.
Why a small cadre of MMO fans insist that everyone should be a chump that makes poor purchasing deicisions is beyond me. Its like they were the product of an abused home or something. Stop making excuses.
i came to the game not for pve or scenarios but open rvr
why design a game to be fun after 200 hours of play rather than a game that hooks you from the get go
why are the rvr areas empty not just due to lack of players but due to lack of any content in them
a bo that noone cares about
why not a few towns in rvr to fight over i wouldn't care if the town reset right after it was capped but at least
it would be something in the rvr area that resembles any measure of fun
edit why are there heroes guarding a "war camp" if it is not attackable it should not be a war camp it should be called a safe camp
WAR does disappoint me on some levels, however I do believe its true that people are jumping the gun on their belly aching. The games barely been out over a month, and people expect the content and polish of a game thats been out half a decade.
Its folly, this generation of MMO'rs suffer from lack of patience and instant gratification addiction.
WAR does disappoint me on some levels, however I do believe its true that people are jumping the gun on their belly aching. The games barely been out over a month, and people expect the content and polish of a game thats been out half a decade.
Its folly, this generation of MMO'rs suffer from lack of patience and instant gratification addiction.
Lack of polish in T4 would be one thing. But complete lack of sanity and broken class mechanics are another.
The zone control is not sane. And it apparently is heavily based on both Scenarios and PvE to such an extent that actually fighting in ORvR lakes is close to pointless. This is retarded. I refuse to play a PvP game that requires me to grind PvE public quests over and over for ever and ever in some crazy simulation of hell. And in addition actually forces not encourages but forces people to abandon the RvR lakes in favor of the scenarios in order to get zone control.
And they wonder why the RvR lakes are empty. Hello its because they are worthless. They don't do jack. You are literally forced to abandon the RvR lakes to get zone control it is stupid beyond belief. Did they even sit down and think about it for a moment?
The AoE insta gib goes through walls and doors. It kill people en masse and make T4 fighting a complete joke. It has almsot no counter other than Cleansing flare which requires at least 14 poitns in Asuryan and is only available ot AM and is not a reliable counter anyway.
T4 is not un-ploished. T4 is broken. Flat out broke. It can be fixed, but it broken.
lack of polish and content could be overlooked if the game was fun from the start
half the time you hear it's not about the trip it's about the journey
other half you hear the game doesn't start till end game
i still believe a pre-made 40 server (won't happen i know) would be the most popular rvr server Mythic would have because probably 1/2 of the 200 thousand people that have quit would come back to play if the end game is fun
but a 200 hour boring grind will never get them or me back in the game
Let me ask you something, what guild were/are you in, and how big is it?
WAR does disappoint me on some levels, however I do believe its true that people are jumping the gun on their belly aching. The games barely been out over a month, and people expect the content and polish of a game thats been out half a decade.
Its folly, this generation of MMO'rs suffer from lack of patience and instant gratification addiction.
Lack of polish in T4 would be one thing. But complete lack of sanity and broken class mechanics are another.
The zone control is not sane. And it apparently is heavily based on both Scenarios and PvE to such an extent that actually fighting in ORvR lakes is close to pointless. This is retarded. I refuse to play a PvP game that requires me to grind PvE public quests over and over for ever and ever in some crazy simulation of hell. And in addition actually forces not encourages but forces people to abandon the RvR lakes in favor of the scenarios in order to get zone control.
And they wonder why the RvR lakes are empty. Hello its because they are worthless. They don't do jack. You are literally forced to abandon the RvR lakes to get zone control it is stupid beyond belief. Did they even sit down and think about it for a moment?
The AoE insta gib goes through walls and doors. It kill people en masse and make T4 fighting a complete joke. It has almsot no counter other than Cleansing flare which requires at least 14 poitns in Asuryan and is only available ot AM and is not a reliable counter anyway.
T4 is not un-ploished. T4 is broken. Flat out broke. It can be fixed, but it broken.
Actually they in fact did increase RvR xp 100%.
If you dont mind me asking what guild are/were you in? Im finding the people with the biggest complaints are often the solo players.
Let me ask you something, what guild were/are you in, and how big is it?
server ungrim i think that the name haven't signed on in a couple weeks
Annihaltion guild 135+ when i joined and 50+ on at a timewhen i joined, with 3-5 on at a time when i left
we would as a guld go to the rvr areas and find them empty so we would get our 200 renown for taking if we could find 1 to cap and 200 renown for defending if you could ever call it that
we would do a few PQ's not what i came for sorry
maybe a pq in the rvr area would work but the pve in this game i won't go into
group scenarios might not be bad if you didn't go against pugs but to que and know you would win got to be boring real quick also
also i tried order and tho i should not let the looks bother me i could not play a HE (male characters look like female) and the runepriest i just didn't care to play so i ended up rolling a shaman
I don't agree with this many people think the game is fun in T1 and T2. In fact a large portion of T3 people are parking their characters and rolling alts.
Solo or guilded.
Weve had completely different experiences it seems, my guild on Anlec is about the same size, and I have a blast playin it with my guildies each and every day.
As a gamer from EQ, I guess I see the social aspect of a game as being as important as the game itself.
Everything is better if you have better company to be around. Be it a funeral, or an MMO.
WAR does disappoint me on some levels, however I do believe its true that people are jumping the gun on their belly aching. The games barely been out over a month, and people expect the content and polish of a game thats been out half a decade.
Its folly, this generation of MMO'rs suffer from lack of patience and instant gratification addiction.
Lack of polish in T4 would be one thing. But complete lack of sanity and broken class mechanics are another.
The zone control is not sane. And it apparently is heavily based on both Scenarios and PvE to such an extent that actually fighting in ORvR lakes is close to pointless. This is retarded. I refuse to play a PvP game that requires me to grind PvE public quests over and over for ever and ever in some crazy simulation of hell. And in addition actually forces not encourages but forces people to abandon the RvR lakes in favor of the scenarios in order to get zone control.
And they wonder why the RvR lakes are empty. Hello its because they are worthless. They don't do jack. You are literally forced to abandon the RvR lakes to get zone control it is stupid beyond belief. Did they even sit down and think about it for a moment?
The AoE insta gib goes through walls and doors. It kill people en masse and make T4 fighting a complete joke. It has almsot no counter other than Cleansing flare which requires at least 14 poitns in Asuryan and is only available ot AM and is not a reliable counter anyway.
T4 is not un-ploished. T4 is broken. Flat out broke. It can be fixed, but it broken.
Actually they in fact did increase RvR xp 100%.
If you dont mind me asking what guild are/were you in? Im finding the people with the biggest complaints are often the solo players.
I am not tlaking about the renown xp. T4's gameplay mechanics are broken. Both the small sscale fighting because of the insta big and a few other issues and the large scale because the campaign mechanics are literally insane.
I helped found the largest Order guild on a low population server that was outnumbered 3:1 or 2:1 by destruction. We have taken and defended keeps multiple times in T2 and T3, T4 is still fairly empty on this server. We have even taken every single T2 keep and kept them for 2-3 hours.
I also play characters on Skull throne but do not play in a guild there.
Problem isnt mythic, but players. Everyone is soloing quests and not balancing the game. I been playing since Beta, did the whole Collectors Edition Launch and I just NOW reached level 20. Lvl 15 was made doing nothing but RvRing. The gae has more sides to it and the majority of the players are doing Solo quests, your playing a MSO and not a MMO. When you realize what you need to do and what others need to do, you will find this game to benefit in more areas then most games out there now.
Blaming Mythic for the lack of knowledge from other players or saying RvR sycks, cause PLAYERS dont want to do it, is insane. I ran through T1 area and found 1, just 1 enemy and its funny cause I am order and destruction usually is the controlling realm.
When players stop being idiots and start exploreing all aspects of the game, then RvR will explode. Plus, if your not doing Open RvR, your not RvRing, let alone MMOing.
I don't agree with this many people think the game is fun in T1 and T2. In fact a large portion of T3 people are parking their characters and rolling alts.
Solo or guilded.
if you enjoy pve or scenarios over and over t1 may be fun but when you are in a rvr area for 2 hours and noone to fight it gets boring so my game ended up go to rvr area noone there except the party i'm in so we que for scenario
scenario ends go to rvr lake noone there reque for scenario
rinse repaet
hate to bring it up but if i wanted instance pvp or pve i would not have quit WOW 2 years ago
also to your last reply to me i stated we as in more then me went to look to fight in the rvr area not solo me and 6-12 guilid mates would go to the area and be like WTF noone here
another blame the player not the game blame me all you want , but the fact is several hundred thousand of us found out quick where the cancel button was
My guild has specific enemies (the Elite) when we show up, so do they, when both our guilds are there, other people show up as well.
Ive had no problems finding RvR, in fact my main problem is deciding what Im going to do with my time when I log on.
Im rather confused as to why other people are having problems with it, Ive participated in large scale, 50+ keep sieges in the last week.
another blame the player not the game blame me all you want , but the fact is several hundred thousand of us found out quick where the cancel button was
Im sorry but I do blame the player, as well as the WoW infection that turned the social aspect of MMOing into a console based solo the whole game attitude.
There is no question that the RvR lakes are highly server dependent. T1 on low population servers can be completely empty. Especially Blighted Isles.
Even the more populace servers are hit and miss. Some like to say well my server is popping so its fine. Well that is not good enough when at least 50% of the server are not popping. And i am being conservative with 50%.
So while I do not disagree with what you are saying, I will still say there are a number of people who do think T1 and T2 are fun.
But anyone who says RvR lakes being empty is not a problem is being silly. And it extends all the way down to T1 on many servers. Generally this is only remedied when there are active and aggressive RvR guilds on a server. And on Low population servers that is still not enough, because there are simply not enough people to cover the zones and you only have roving squads.
There is no question that the RvR lakes are highly server dependent. T1 on low population servers can be completely empty. Especially Blighted Isles.
Even the more populace servers are hit and miss. Some like to say well my server is popping so its fine. Well that is not good enough when at least 50% of the server are not popping. And i am being conservative with 50%.
So while I do not disagree with what you are saying, I will still say there are a number of people who do think T1 and T2 are fun.
But anyone who says RvR lakes being empty is not a problem is being silly. And it extends all the way down to T1 on many servers. Generally this is only remedied when there are active and aggressive RvR guilds on a server. And on Low population servers that is still not enough, because there are simply not enough people to cover the zones and you only have roving squads.
Were all playing within the same confines, only it seems on some servers the players simply dont want to take it upon themselves to RvR.
So if RvR is fine on some servers, and not others, why arent you blaming the apathetic players?
another blame the player not the game blame me all you want , but the fact is several hundred thousand of us found out quick where the cancel button was
Im sorry but I do blame the player, as well as the WoW infection that turned the social aspect of MMOing into a console based solo the whole game attitude.
Good luck with that. You will never get a good game if you have designers who believe that.
The old saying "Lead, Follow, or get out of the way". This is often misapplied/misunderstood in the context of MMOs. The designers have to lead, because most people either want to follow or get in the way. Only a select few will naturally attempt to lead and only a very small percent of those will actually lead effectively.
The developers must lead or the game fails. Period.
The numbers are just not right if you put the burden on the players. There are not enough effective leaders. There never are in any endeavor.
There is no question that the RvR lakes are highly server dependent. T1 on low population servers can be completely empty. Especially Blighted Isles.
Even the more populace servers are hit and miss. Some like to say well my server is popping so its fine. Well that is not good enough when at least 50% of the server are not popping. And i am being conservative with 50%.
So while I do not disagree with what you are saying, I will still say there are a number of people who do think T1 and T2 are fun.
But anyone who says RvR lakes being empty is not a problem is being silly. And it extends all the way down to T1 on many servers. Generally this is only remedied when there are active and aggressive RvR guilds on a server. And on Low population servers that is still not enough, because there are simply not enough people to cover the zones and you only have roving squads.
Were all playing within the same confines, only it seems on some servers the players simply dont want to take it upon themselves to RvR.
So if RvR is fine on some servers, and not others, why arent you blaming the apathetic players?
Because that is not practical. Nor are they truly apathetic. They are willing, they are just not leaders.
the vast majority of people need to be inspired, they are not the ones who do the inspiring. This is a fact of life.
another blame the player not the game blame me all you want , but the fact is several hundred thousand of us found out quick where the cancel button was
Im sorry but I do blame the player, as well as the WoW infection that turned the social aspect of MMOing into a console based solo the whole game attitude.
Good luck with that. You will never get a good game if you have designers who believe that.
The old saying "Lead, Follow, or get out of the way". This is often misapplied/misunderstood in the context of MMOs. The designers have to lead, because most people either want to follow or get in the way. Only a select few will naturally attempt to lead and only a very small percent of those will actually lead effectively.
The developers must lead or the game fails. Period.
The numbers are just not right if you put the burden on the players. There are not enough effective leaders. There never are in any endeavor.
Players make the game, Im sorry, the whole concept of a sandbox is around because of exactly that.
Having the developers take the lead is hand holding theme park play.
I actually think WAR suffers from too much hand holding.
There burden SHOULD go on the players.
Im sorry but I do blame the player, as well as the WoW infection that turned the social aspect of MMOing into a console based solo the whole game attitude
Mythic makes a game that locks everyone away from the world and they admit they have a problem because of it , but i'm the 1 that is anti-social
hell i was 1 of the few that was trying to be social and not be c;losed off but when you have no enemy in
this game outside of senarios it's hard to have fun
another blame the player not the game blame me all you want , but the fact is several hundred thousand of us found out quick where the cancel button was
Im sorry but I do blame the player, as well as the WoW infection that turned the social aspect of MMOing into a console based solo the whole game attitude.
Good luck with that. You will never get a good game if you have designers who believe that.
The old saying "Lead, Follow, or get out of the way". This is often misapplied/misunderstood in the context of MMOs. The designers have to lead, because most people either want to follow or get in the way. Only a select few will naturally attempt to lead and only a very small percent of those will actually lead effectively.
The developers must lead or the game fails. Period.
The numbers are just not right if you put the burden on the players. There are not enough effective leaders. There never are in any endeavor.
Players make the game, Im sorry, the whole concept of a sandbox is around because of exactly that.
Having the developers take the lead is hand holding theme park play.
I actually think WAR suffers from too much hand holding.
There burden SHOULD go on the players.
This attitude that you just described is the classic failure of leadership. Just because the game has a number of Rear Admirials and Captains does not mean the developers are not the Admiral. It is the Admiral's responibility to create an environment where Captains flourish and a select few become competent Rear Admirals.
another blame the player not the game blame me all you want , but the fact is several hundred thousand of us found out quick where the cancel button was
Im sorry but I do blame the player, as well as the WoW infection that turned the social aspect of MMOing into a console based solo the whole game attitude.
Good luck with that. You will never get a good game if you have designers who believe that.
The old saying "Lead, Follow, or get out of the way". This is often misapplied/misunderstood in the context of MMOs. The designers have to lead, because most people either want to follow or get in the way. Only a select few will naturally attempt to lead and only a very small percent of those will actually lead effectively.
The developers must lead or the game fails. Period.
The numbers are just not right if you put the burden on the players. There are not enough effective leaders. There never are in any endeavor.
Players make the game, Im sorry, the whole concept of a sandbox is around because of exactly that.
Having the developers take the lead is hand holding theme park play.
I actually think WAR suffers from too much hand holding.
There burden SHOULD go on the players.
This attitude that you just described is the classic failure of leadership. Just because the game has a number of Rear Admirials and Captains does not mean the developers are not the Admiral. It is the Admiral's responibility to create an environment where Captains flourish and a select few become competent Rear Admirals.
What good is leadership if all the soldiers say, "I dont wanna, taking initive is too hard, hold my hand and que me up for a fight, I dont wanna go find it myself.......
posted by arcken
What good is leadership if all the soldiers say, "I dont wanna, taking initive is too hard, hold my hand and que me up for a fight, I dont wanna go find it myself.......
but if the Admirals says you can go to the rec room and stay in the A/C or you can go out in the hot sun and dig ditches which are the soldiers going to choose
Admirals rarely give choices they command so far Admiral Mythic is like the officer that wants to be liked
and those officers rarely get the respect of the soldier