This review is flawed and just pure bad. As someone said this review is just a pore attemt to please the angry horde on MMORPG.com
Just an example on things that are wrong or twisted of the truth..
There is for instance voice overs after 20 that has been patched in game ..
The computer spec's mentioned for the game is simply exaggerated, I have never lagged in this game, not in the way that is mentioned in the review at least. You need a good computer, but not a monster computer, and that is if you care to play the game in it's highest modes.
The mages in the game has Spell Weaving in regards to the melee combat system wich is not mentioned. Instead the review sais mage classes are all the same as any other MMO, besides if you wan't a mage and still care to use the combat system try a Bear Shaman or a Herald Xlotli
Nice review, but what is with the constant jabs at the player base? I mean, no disrespect, but it could be you, not them, that’s the problem. I mean, shall we start including opinions on the player base of all games in official MMORPG.com Reviews? They would just about all read the same way. Do the writers here know about this thing called the internet? Its almost a pointless thing to include, as every single person will have a different experience. 9 times out of 10, most people that say "This community sucks", walked in and started pissing on the drapes. As far as PvP consequences go, the system is on the test server. I understand you can’t review what you have not played on live. But it’s on the way, and I hope for all those that are not playing, you amend or re-review the game when it goes live. Why didn't john do this review, seems every review on this site now is done by someone else, makes it hard to gauge anything in the articles. Review from internet user #36579241 is about as useful as an official review as the 5 threads in the games forums by the same title.
I agree with your point about the internet, but then again, the pvp rules were supposed to be in the game at release, not 6 months down the road, just like the directx 10 which isn't even on the test server yet,
The current pvp servers are notoriously known as huge gankfests, well I guess huge is not a good word to use any more, but still I agree the author should have pointed out the problems he sites with the playerbase lie with the pvp servers.
The basic fact is that Funcome knew the game was unfinished yet released it anyway, exactly like they did with AO. When you reinforce a bad reputation with another fine example of it, you deserve every bit of negative publicity that comes your way.
I really find it a shame, as I grew up reading the Conan books and so hoped they could provide us with a half decent game. That may still come to pass, but the vast majority of us will never find out because we have just had enough from Funcom.
And you think that when they put that HUGE background AOC wallpaper that they do it for free ? I'm not saying they are paid to write review, but they are certainly paid by the game they are reviewing. In my book you can't be credible if you get money from the same guy you review.
Ya know, I was trying to stay out of this thread. I really was, but this just takes the absolute cake and I just feel like I HAVE to comment on it.
We have LOTS of advertisers here at MMORPG.com. That's how we're actually able to offer you a service ironically so that you can come here and complain about it. These companie sbuy advertising space, not because they're buying positive press, but because we get a lot of daily hits from MMORPG players who might potentially see their ad and maybe check out their game. That's actually the principal of advertising.
Now, on to your accusation, or at least implication, that this particular review was bought...
Is that a joke? Seriously, I just need to knwo if you honestly think that a company would pay for a review score of 6.0. Even if we WERE the kind of site to offer our integrity for sale (which we are not), don't you think that someone paying for a review might want something a little bit better than a 6.0?
I am honestly tired of constantly hearing these kinds of accusations. MMORPG.com has always been a company that keeps advertisers and content separate but let me ask you this: If you go around throwing out these wild accusations, even when they're totally undeserved and in this case absolutely and totally ludacris, what motivation does a company have to actually continue to operate on the up and up?
Damned if we do, damned if we don't. Fortunately, we here at MMORPG.com are gamers first and the idea of accepting money for a review is frankly repulsive.
STradden I'd like to ask at what point in time this review was written because a lot of your issues and things you said seem out of date or based upon word of mouth.
Also, Do you actually spend any amount of time on these forums? The MMORPG.com forums are 10x worse than any game endorsed community I"ve seen (besides wow's) It's full of angry, bitter people with nothing positive to say about anything. The only feedback they can offer is "This game sucks because I said so" or "This game sucks because I played it 2 years ago and will go on the assumption that absoutely nothing has changed"
And you think that when they put that HUGE background AOC wallpaper that they do it for free ? I'm not saying they are paid to write review, but they are certainly paid by the game they are reviewing. In my book you can't be credible if you get money from the same guy you review.
Ya know, I was trying to stay out of this thread. I really was, but this just takes the absolute cake and I just feel like I HAVE to comment on it.
We have LOTS of advertisers here at MMORPG.com. That's how we're actually able to offer you a service ironically so that you can come here and complain about it. These companie sbuy advertising space, not because they're buying positive press, but because we get a lot of daily hits from MMORPG players who might potentially see their ad and maybe check out their game. That's actually the principal of advertising.
Now, on to your accusation, or at least implication, that this particular review was bought...
Is that a joke? Seriously, I just need to knwo if you honestly think that a company would pay for a review score of 6.0. Even if we WERE the kind of site to offer our integrity for sale (which we are not), don't you think that someone paying for a review might want something a little bit better than a 6.0?
I am honestly tired of constantly hearing these kinds of accusations. MMORPG.com has always been a company that keeps advertisers and content separate but let me ask you this: If you go around throwing out these wild accusations, even when they're totally undeserved and in this case absolutely and totally ludacris, what motivation does a company have to actually continue to operate on the up and up?
Damned if we do, damned if we don't. Fortunately, we here at MMORPG.com are gamers first and the idea of accepting money for a review is frankly repulsive.
Oh we support you Stradden. Nobody really thinks that MMORPG take money for reviews. BUT, you have to clean up this mess of an review though. Your reviewer seem to have had something equivalent to a late night out the day before making it. Patch 2.0 AoC could not have been researched very well, because Jef is very much wrong in many of his most important statements (I mentioned some before). Post launch word of mouth is simply not good enough for a review like this.
STradden I'd like to ask at what point in time this review was written because a lot of your issues and things you said seem out of date or based upon word of mouth. Also, Do you actually spend any amount of time on these forums? The MMORPG.com forums are 10x worse than any game endorsed community I"ve seen (besides wow's) It's full of angry, bitter people with nothing positive to say about anything. The only feedback they can offer is "This game sucks because I said so" or "This game sucks because I played it 2 years ago and will go on the assumption that absoutely nothing has changed"
First question: The review was writtenapproximatey two weeks ago and was based on current gameplay.
Actually, I do spend quite a bit of time on these forums, but this wasn't a review of the MMORPG.com forums. We're not going to hesitate to criticize any aspect of a game simply because something here at the site doesn't match up. That would be like not criticizing a game's graphics because the images here at the site don't match up. It's apples and oranges, friend and to be clear, I'm not sure he was talking about the forum community in his review, but rather the community in-game.
This was a review of Age of Conan and any MMO review that doesn't include something about the community is probably missing something. In this case, the reviewer had a difficult experience with the in-game community. Whatever the reason, that was his experience. While I personally may not have chosen the wording that Mr. Reahard did to make his point, this was how he chose to make his point and I, nor he, will make any apologies for that. My job as editor isn't to censor out aspects of a review that I think that our community won't like any more than it is my job to filter out things that the game companies won't like. This is how we remain objective.
I am truly sorry if your opinion differs from that expressed in the review. No one is saying that you have to fully or even partially agree with what was written in the review, but Jef was given this project with the understanding that he would give his opinions of his play experience. Despite what some people will tell you, that is what a review is. Reviews are opinion based. You, as the reader are free to agree or disagree with as much of what was said as you like. That's your perogative.
First question: The review was writtenapproximatey two weeks ago and was based on current gameplay. ... I am truly sorry if your opinion differs from that expressed in the review. No one is saying that you have to fully or even partially agree ...
Sorry Stradden, but I think this is not exacly a matter of just opinions.
Offenses and misinformation are totally unacceptable in a profissional review.
If the reviewer cant hold himself and has to be agressive and offensive, please, aim for the producers and not consumers, every MMO has nice/polite peole and offensive people, the reviewer just showed he is at the same level of the agressive people he found ingame (and the offensive people that usually post in these forums)... this could be just a server/occasion.
Are you OK with this kind of offensive and elitist posture around here?
The reviewer is not in the position of lable an entire comunity, it is just bad for MMORPG as a serious site.
The information about the emotes is just wrong, is not a matter of opinion.
I dont care about the rating, I was disapointed with a lot of ingame issues, but there are a couple of serious issues in this review aswell.
This review is flawed and just pure bad. As someone said this review is just a pore attemt to please the angry horde on MMORPG.com Just an example on things that are wrong or twisted of the truth.. There is for instance voice overs after 20 that has been patched in game .. The computer spec's mentioned for the game is simply exaggerated, I have never lagged in this game, not in the way that is mentioned in the review at least. You need a good computer, but not a monster computer, and that is if you care to play the game in it's highest modes. The mages in the game has Spell Weaving in regards to the melee combat system wich is not mentioned. Instead the review sais mage classes are all the same as any other MMO, besides if you wan't a mage and still care to use the combat system try a Bear Shaman or a Herald Xlotli
/junker
I am totally agreed with you on this. This review is a discrace. This game blows lots of others mmo's right back to the scratch table. How the hell can AOC get a lower score than for an example Matrix Online ????? Come on, Who the hell bought this review ? After this, mmorpg.com have dropped some stepes on my ladder.
It doesn't matter if "not all of them are like that" because the majority of them are. When you take a look at the community, you can't walk up to every person and say "Hello sir/madam, I'm working on a review for MMORPG.com about Age of Conan; I would like to talk to you for about 15 minutes to get to know you better;" it just doesn't happen. When you judge a community, you have to look at it as a whole group: not by every single person that logs into the game.
Take RuneScape for example (best example there is, really): when you log on RS you will get blown away with the rediculous crap that floods the public chat. Now, not everyone in RS is immature and talks about the crazy relationships of eight year old dating over the interwebz; but that is the impression you get after playing awhile. A large amount of how you base the community comes off what you hear in general chat and discussions that take place (as they very well should be), who you met while grouping, and the discussions that go on in the forums. Vanguard is a good example of a helpful community: as mature discussions usually take place and people are very helpful; while RS is the perfect example of a bad. You have to realize that the community is a big part of the game and has to be looked at in general: not by certain people that you meet.
Just because you're not a bad part of the community doesn't mean it doesn't exist. The majority of the community is pretty bad (and that you cannot deny), and it should not be overlooked in a review.
'nuff said
__________________________________________________ In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
The majority of the comunity in all MMOS is unpleasant, as an user, it is ok for you to come here and say, the comunity of game "x" is a total " ", but as a serious reviewer, do you think it is ok to label any game comunity in a offensive and disrespectful way? He could mentioned comunity issues in a different way, Im sure of that.
About the Emotes, again, it is misinformation, not an opinion.
A clear review of the community issues withou labels/offenses would be better for sure.
To tell the truth it would be better for MMORPG.com and the reviewer and not to any game community.
When there are offenses and pure misinformations in a review like that, it is not the game community or the game itself that look bad, but the credibility of this site and the reviewer.
Actually the more I think about it, saying the game has a 'Community' could be misconstrued as well, because that word has it's own meaning's and implications.
Here is my revision:
Cons
Grind-heavy Mid to High Level Progression
Lack of PVP Risk/Reward
Player Base
Post-20 Quest Content
Under-Developed Crafting, Social Games
Also, I am thinking the community should be allowed to write their own Official AOC Review. This is how we do it. Someone start an AOC Official Review Post, and give the following subjects: Graphics, Music, Gameplay, Performance, PVE, PVP, Crafting. Each poster will then post one paragraph on the subject they liked about the game the most. We could all then vote on which posts we liked the best and put them together like a collage to make a post that will make everyone happy.
I was surprised to see Stradden was the author of this review. He seems extremely bitter at the playerbase and the haters of the game. It seems like he is trying to convince the reader he is somehow above all the insults all the while slinging a lot mud himself. Overall, I'm about as impressed with this review as I was with Conan.
The comments on the maturity of the playerbase are worthwhile in a review. Having played many mmogs over many years you really CAN determine the quality of experience you'll have based on the amount of immature 'asshat-ery' that goes on in the game.
And no, such an observation is not a matter of subjective opinion - an experienced mmoger can determine quite quickly whether a game attracts an audience of friendly helpful care bears or whether (as in the example of RuneScape) it's largely populated by children struggling with puberty and gender identity.
I'm not really used to being called a neanderthal in a review given by a legitimate site.
It is quite clear that the reviewer was not calling everyone who plays AoC a Neanderthal. Just a section of the player base who exhibit anti-social tendencies.
It is also interesting that you instantly associated yourself with the Neanderthals...
I'm not really used to being called a neanderthal in a review given by a legitimate site.
It is quite clear that the reviewer was not calling everyone who plays AoC a Neanderthal. Just a section of the player base who exhibit anti-social tendencies.
It is also interesting that you instantly associated yourself with the Neanderthals...
In balance I think I agreed with the review 100%
Cons
Grind-Geavy Mid to High Level Progression
Lack of PVP Risk/Reward
Neanderthal Player Base
Post-20 Quest Content
Under-Developed Crafting, Social Games
Sorry there's nothing in this that excludes anyone, it's a blanket statement given to the whole playerbase. So yes I felt he was including me in it as well, he didn't say otherwise now did he?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I enjoy coming to MMORPG.com to read up on upcoming games as well as the ones already released that are revisited. I have come to realize that internet forums, whether they are official or not, tend to attract a lot of negative complaints, reviews and comments. I understand that it is ok to write about your experiences but it just seems so many go out of the way to bash an mmo. I seen it here and on other mmo official forums like AoC. Not everyone will like the same MMO on the other hand some will like certain MMOs while others will not.
Lets take a step back people, and look a bit more in detail on what was said in this review apart from opinions like AoC players are not nice or I don't like itemization. Let us look on stements that are just wrong in a binary/logical way. Errors that can be defined as either TRUE or FALSE. These issues are not about opinions, they are reduced to a mathematical level. Lets try and do this and see what kind of conclusion we can come to. I found several statements I could apply this logic on, but I would like to talk about the 3 below in particular.
1. Jef says there is no PVP reward system in AoC. FALSE
PvP reward has been in AoC since patch 2.0 that came out 6 weeks ago!!
2. Jef says there are poor possibilities for RP in AoC, few emoticons. FALSE
There are more emoticons in AoC than any other game (Ctrl+Y) for emoticon UI. This hase been in place since launch.
3. Jef says FPS of AoC is low on a 3K $ Rig in graphics intensive environments/conditions. FALSE
A 2 K $ Rig as of today runs AoC (high) with FPS 30 or higher in the most graphics intensive places in the game (Like the Villas). This change also came like 6 weeks back. it was a dramatic change from pre patch 2.0!!
4. Jef says also that there are no voice overs after level 20 apart for the destiny quest. FALSE
FC started to patch in many more voice overs since mid July in fact. I admit I am not aware of the totall number of voiced quests by now, but the point is that an official reviewer can't use information he is not sure about.
There are other things as well, but I purposely leave them out so that you can look on something as apriori as MMORPGs FUps above. There is absolutely no way Jef could say what he said in this review unless he didn't play AoC in more than 6 weeks. My question is now, MMORPG people how can you defend a review like this? This review is a joke. Do you really want to support BS like this in a Game reviewing forum like MMORPG? I would think NO. We want reviews of our games to be handeled with more professionalism than this. So burry your AoC war hatchet for a while and let right be right. It is our job to tell MMORPG when they Fck it up. As a reviewer it is MMORPG's responsibility to do the necessary research before review of any game. Otherwise the whole review is just BS from beginning to end. Right now I don't even believe anybody backstabbed Jef wherever he supposedly logged on.
You can't just ignore the playerbase. It doesn't matter if "not all of them are like that" because the majority of them are. When you take a look at the community, you can't walk up to every person and say "Hello sir/madam, I'm working on a review for MMORPG.com about Age of Conan; I would like to talk to you for about 15 minutes to get to know you better;" it just doesn't happen. When you judge a community, you have to look at it as a whole group: not by every single person that logs into the game. Take RuneScape for example (best example there is, really): when you log on RS you will get blown away with the rediculous crap that floods the public chat. Now, not everyone in RS is immature and talks about the crazy relationships of eight year old dating over the interwebz; but that is the impression you get after playing awhile. A large amount of how you base the community comes off what you hear in general chat and discussions that take place (as they very well should be), who you met while grouping, and the discussions that go on in the forums. Vanguard is a good example of a helpful community: as mature discussions usually take place and people are very helpful; while RS is the perfect example of a bad. You have to realize that the community is a big part of the game and has to be looked at in general: not by certain people that you meet. Just because you're not a bad part of the community doesn't mean it doesn't exist. The majority of the community is pretty bad (and that you cannot deny), and it should not be overlooked in a review. 'nuff said
There is nothing wrong with commenting on the player base of a game. Slamming a community for spamming chuck norris/murlock jokes is fine. Complaining about no one using the chat channels or ridiculing noobs asking basic questions is fine. Crying about getting killed "for no reason" on a ffa pvp server and calling the player base neanderthal,whiney,maladjusted,short attention spanned,etc is pathetic.
I actually found that the community was the best part of this game. When i was playing there was no reward for killing other players, so maybe 20% of all people i met were hostile. That added to immersion because you never let your guard down, always looking at people while you are passing by them, trying to figure out are they going to kill you or not.
Maybe thats changed now but in the first month it was fun.
People are fussing over stupid things like voiceovers (always skiped the dialoge, whateveryou choose outcome will be the same), or dx10 (what this game really needs is better underwater environment) when therer is so customization of yout character, items suck, inventory icons bland too, no crafting and no fun.
And everybody says that the best part of the game was from lvl1 to lvl20. Onyl good thing in that part i could find was the destiny quest and it was bugged then. Maybe because i was aquilonian, but 20-40 was really good.
I played AoC to level 80 twice on pvp servers, calling the player base a quote "Neanderthal Player Base" is the understatement of the year......I think your review was spot on, and the anti-reviewers posting here are the perfect example of the mentality of the player-base in AoC. Neanderthal, LOL, why do I get the feeling that these people are the cavemen in the Geico commercials. :P
AoC, so easy even a Neanderthal can bitch about it, Too funny.
Comments
This review is flawed and just pure bad. As someone said this review is just a pore attemt to please the angry horde on MMORPG.com
Just an example on things that are wrong or twisted of the truth..
There is for instance voice overs after 20 that has been patched in game ..
The computer spec's mentioned for the game is simply exaggerated, I have never lagged in this game, not in the way that is mentioned in the review at least. You need a good computer, but not a monster computer, and that is if you care to play the game in it's highest modes.
The mages in the game has Spell Weaving in regards to the melee combat system wich is not mentioned. Instead the review sais mage classes are all the same as any other MMO, besides if you wan't a mage and still care to use the combat system try a Bear Shaman or a Herald Xlotli
/junker
I agree with your point about the internet, but then again, the pvp rules were supposed to be in the game at release, not 6 months down the road, just like the directx 10 which isn't even on the test server yet,
The current pvp servers are notoriously known as huge gankfests, well I guess huge is not a good word to use any more, but still I agree the author should have pointed out the problems he sites with the playerbase lie with the pvp servers.
The basic fact is that Funcome knew the game was unfinished yet released it anyway, exactly like they did with AO. When you reinforce a bad reputation with another fine example of it, you deserve every bit of negative publicity that comes your way.
I really find it a shame, as I grew up reading the Conan books and so hoped they could provide us with a half decent game. That may still come to pass, but the vast majority of us will never find out because we have just had enough from Funcom.
Ya know, I was trying to stay out of this thread. I really was, but this just takes the absolute cake and I just feel like I HAVE to comment on it.
We have LOTS of advertisers here at MMORPG.com. That's how we're actually able to offer you a service ironically so that you can come here and complain about it. These companie sbuy advertising space, not because they're buying positive press, but because we get a lot of daily hits from MMORPG players who might potentially see their ad and maybe check out their game. That's actually the principal of advertising.
Now, on to your accusation, or at least implication, that this particular review was bought...
Is that a joke? Seriously, I just need to knwo if you honestly think that a company would pay for a review score of 6.0. Even if we WERE the kind of site to offer our integrity for sale (which we are not), don't you think that someone paying for a review might want something a little bit better than a 6.0?
I am honestly tired of constantly hearing these kinds of accusations. MMORPG.com has always been a company that keeps advertisers and content separate but let me ask you this: If you go around throwing out these wild accusations, even when they're totally undeserved and in this case absolutely and totally ludacris, what motivation does a company have to actually continue to operate on the up and up?
Damned if we do, damned if we don't. Fortunately, we here at MMORPG.com are gamers first and the idea of accepting money for a review is frankly repulsive.
Cheers,
Jon Wood
Managing Editor
MMORPG.com
STradden I'd like to ask at what point in time this review was written because a lot of your issues and things you said seem out of date or based upon word of mouth.
Also, Do you actually spend any amount of time on these forums? The MMORPG.com forums are 10x worse than any game endorsed community I"ve seen (besides wow's) It's full of angry, bitter people with nothing positive to say about anything. The only feedback they can offer is "This game sucks because I said so" or "This game sucks because I played it 2 years ago and will go on the assumption that absoutely nothing has changed"
Ya know, I was trying to stay out of this thread. I really was, but this just takes the absolute cake and I just feel like I HAVE to comment on it.
We have LOTS of advertisers here at MMORPG.com. That's how we're actually able to offer you a service ironically so that you can come here and complain about it. These companie sbuy advertising space, not because they're buying positive press, but because we get a lot of daily hits from MMORPG players who might potentially see their ad and maybe check out their game. That's actually the principal of advertising.
Now, on to your accusation, or at least implication, that this particular review was bought...
Is that a joke? Seriously, I just need to knwo if you honestly think that a company would pay for a review score of 6.0. Even if we WERE the kind of site to offer our integrity for sale (which we are not), don't you think that someone paying for a review might want something a little bit better than a 6.0?
I am honestly tired of constantly hearing these kinds of accusations. MMORPG.com has always been a company that keeps advertisers and content separate but let me ask you this: If you go around throwing out these wild accusations, even when they're totally undeserved and in this case absolutely and totally ludacris, what motivation does a company have to actually continue to operate on the up and up?
Damned if we do, damned if we don't. Fortunately, we here at MMORPG.com are gamers first and the idea of accepting money for a review is frankly repulsive.
Oh we support you Stradden. Nobody really thinks that MMORPG take money for reviews. BUT, you have to clean up this mess of an review though. Your reviewer seem to have had something equivalent to a late night out the day before making it. Patch 2.0 AoC could not have been researched very well, because Jef is very much wrong in many of his most important statements (I mentioned some before). Post launch word of mouth is simply not good enough for a review like this.
First question: The review was writtenapproximatey two weeks ago and was based on current gameplay.
Actually, I do spend quite a bit of time on these forums, but this wasn't a review of the MMORPG.com forums. We're not going to hesitate to criticize any aspect of a game simply because something here at the site doesn't match up. That would be like not criticizing a game's graphics because the images here at the site don't match up. It's apples and oranges, friend and to be clear, I'm not sure he was talking about the forum community in his review, but rather the community in-game.
This was a review of Age of Conan and any MMO review that doesn't include something about the community is probably missing something. In this case, the reviewer had a difficult experience with the in-game community. Whatever the reason, that was his experience. While I personally may not have chosen the wording that Mr. Reahard did to make his point, this was how he chose to make his point and I, nor he, will make any apologies for that. My job as editor isn't to censor out aspects of a review that I think that our community won't like any more than it is my job to filter out things that the game companies won't like. This is how we remain objective.
I am truly sorry if your opinion differs from that expressed in the review. No one is saying that you have to fully or even partially agree with what was written in the review, but Jef was given this project with the understanding that he would give his opinions of his play experience. Despite what some people will tell you, that is what a review is. Reviews are opinion based. You, as the reader are free to agree or disagree with as much of what was said as you like. That's your perogative.
Cheers,
Jon Wood
Managing Editor
MMORPG.com
Sorry Stradden, but I think this is not exacly a matter of just opinions.
Offenses and misinformation are totally unacceptable in a profissional review.
If the reviewer cant hold himself and has to be agressive and offensive, please, aim for the producers and not consumers, every MMO has nice/polite peole and offensive people, the reviewer just showed he is at the same level of the agressive people he found ingame (and the offensive people that usually post in these forums)... this could be just a server/occasion.
Are you OK with this kind of offensive and elitist posture around here?
The reviewer is not in the position of lable an entire comunity, it is just bad for MMORPG as a serious site.
The information about the emotes is just wrong, is not a matter of opinion.
I dont care about the rating, I was disapointed with a lot of ingame issues, but there are a couple of serious issues in this review aswell.
...
I am totally agreed with you on this. This review is a discrace. This game blows lots of others mmo's right back to the scratch table. How the hell can AOC get a lower score than for an example Matrix Online ????? Come on, Who the hell bought this review ? After this, mmorpg.com have dropped some stepes on my ladder.
You can't just ignore the playerbase.
It doesn't matter if "not all of them are like that" because the majority of them are. When you take a look at the community, you can't walk up to every person and say "Hello sir/madam, I'm working on a review for MMORPG.com about Age of Conan; I would like to talk to you for about 15 minutes to get to know you better;" it just doesn't happen. When you judge a community, you have to look at it as a whole group: not by every single person that logs into the game.
Take RuneScape for example (best example there is, really): when you log on RS you will get blown away with the rediculous crap that floods the public chat. Now, not everyone in RS is immature and talks about the crazy relationships of eight year old dating over the interwebz; but that is the impression you get after playing awhile. A large amount of how you base the community comes off what you hear in general chat and discussions that take place (as they very well should be), who you met while grouping, and the discussions that go on in the forums. Vanguard is a good example of a helpful community: as mature discussions usually take place and people are very helpful; while RS is the perfect example of a bad. You have to realize that the community is a big part of the game and has to be looked at in general: not by certain people that you meet.
Just because you're not a bad part of the community doesn't mean it doesn't exist. The majority of the community is pretty bad (and that you cannot deny), and it should not be overlooked in a review.
'nuff said
__________________________________________________
In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
Mike 470
The majority of the comunity in all MMOS is unpleasant, as an user, it is ok for you to come here and say, the comunity of game "x" is a total " ", but as a serious reviewer, do you think it is ok to label any game comunity in a offensive and disrespectful way? He could mentioned comunity issues in a different way, Im sure of that.
About the Emotes, again, it is misinformation, not an opinion.
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I suggest taking the word 'Neanderthal' out of the review and putting in it's place 'Polite and Courteous' when characterizing the community.
If not 'Polite and Courteous', perhaps 'Kind and Generous'.
Any other ideas?
Iam sorry Terranah, but your joke is just silly.
A clear review of the community issues withou labels/offenses would be better for sure.
To tell the truth it would be better for MMORPG.com and the reviewer and not to any game community.
When there are offenses and pure misinformations in a review like that, it is not the game community or the game itself that look bad, but the credibility of this site and the reviewer.
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Then when reviewing the community, let's take out "Neanderthal" and just have "Community". That way no one's feelings get hurt.
Actually the more I think about it, saying the game has a 'Community' could be misconstrued as well, because that word has it's own meaning's and implications.
Here is my revision:
Cons
Grind-heavy Mid to High Level Progression
Lack of PVP Risk/Reward
Player Base
Post-20 Quest Content
Under-Developed Crafting, Social Games
Also, I am thinking the community should be allowed to write their own Official AOC Review. This is how we do it. Someone start an AOC Official Review Post, and give the following subjects: Graphics, Music, Gameplay, Performance, PVE, PVP, Crafting. Each poster will then post one paragraph on the subject they liked about the game the most. We could all then vote on which posts we liked the best and put them together like a collage to make a post that will make everyone happy.
That may be a good idea Terranah and would probably reflect the reality of a mmorpg.
About AOC, I still think the lack of more zones and the lack of development of the 3 cultures are big issues.
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I was surprised to see Stradden was the author of this review. He seems extremely bitter at the playerbase and the haters of the game. It seems like he is trying to convince the reader he is somehow above all the insults all the while slinging a lot mud himself. Overall, I'm about as impressed with this review as I was with Conan.
Very well written and intelligent review.
The comments on the maturity of the playerbase are worthwhile in a review. Having played many mmogs over many years you really CAN determine the quality of experience you'll have based on the amount of immature 'asshat-ery' that goes on in the game.
And no, such an observation is not a matter of subjective opinion - an experienced mmoger can determine quite quickly whether a game attracts an audience of friendly helpful care bears or whether (as in the example of RuneScape) it's largely populated by children struggling with puberty and gender identity.
considering he wasn't the reviewer it would be surprising indeed. As mentioned in the OP and the review, it was done by Jef Reahard aka jedijef
It is quite clear that the reviewer was not calling everyone who plays AoC a Neanderthal. Just a section of the player base who exhibit anti-social tendencies.
It is also interesting that you instantly associated yourself with the Neanderthals...
In balance I think I agreed with the review 100%
It is quite clear that the reviewer was not calling everyone who plays AoC a Neanderthal. Just a section of the player base who exhibit anti-social tendencies.
It is also interesting that you instantly associated yourself with the Neanderthals...
In balance I think I agreed with the review 100%
Cons
Grind-Geavy Mid to High Level Progression
Lack of PVP Risk/Reward
Neanderthal Player Base
Post-20 Quest Content
Under-Developed Crafting, Social Games
Sorry there's nothing in this that excludes anyone, it's a blanket statement given to the whole playerbase. So yes I felt he was including me in it as well, he didn't say otherwise now did he?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I enjoy coming to MMORPG.com to read up on upcoming games as well as the ones already released that are revisited. I have come to realize that internet forums, whether they are official or not, tend to attract a lot of negative complaints, reviews and comments. I understand that it is ok to write about your experiences but it just seems so many go out of the way to bash an mmo. I seen it here and on other mmo official forums like AoC. Not everyone will like the same MMO on the other hand some will like certain MMOs while others will not.
Lets take a step back people, and look a bit more in detail on what was said in this review apart from opinions like AoC players are not nice or I don't like itemization. Let us look on stements that are just wrong in a binary/logical way. Errors that can be defined as either TRUE or FALSE. These issues are not about opinions, they are reduced to a mathematical level. Lets try and do this and see what kind of conclusion we can come to. I found several statements I could apply this logic on, but I would like to talk about the 3 below in particular.
1. Jef says there is no PVP reward system in AoC. FALSE
PvP reward has been in AoC since patch 2.0 that came out 6 weeks ago!!
2. Jef says there are poor possibilities for RP in AoC, few emoticons. FALSE
There are more emoticons in AoC than any other game (Ctrl+Y) for emoticon UI. This hase been in place since launch.
3. Jef says FPS of AoC is low on a 3K $ Rig in graphics intensive environments/conditions. FALSE
A 2 K $ Rig as of today runs AoC (high) with FPS 30 or higher in the most graphics intensive places in the game (Like the Villas). This change also came like 6 weeks back. it was a dramatic change from pre patch 2.0!!
4. Jef says also that there are no voice overs after level 20 apart for the destiny quest. FALSE
FC started to patch in many more voice overs since mid July in fact. I admit I am not aware of the totall number of voiced quests by now, but the point is that an official reviewer can't use information he is not sure about.
There are other things as well, but I purposely leave them out so that you can look on something as apriori as MMORPGs FUps above. There is absolutely no way Jef could say what he said in this review unless he didn't play AoC in more than 6 weeks. My question is now, MMORPG people how can you defend a review like this? This review is a joke. Do you really want to support BS like this in a Game reviewing forum like MMORPG? I would think NO. We want reviews of our games to be handeled with more professionalism than this. So burry your AoC war hatchet for a while and let right be right. It is our job to tell MMORPG when they Fck it up. As a reviewer it is MMORPG's responsibility to do the necessary research before review of any game. Otherwise the whole review is just BS from beginning to end. Right now I don't even believe anybody backstabbed Jef wherever he supposedly logged on.
There is nothing wrong with commenting on the player base of a game. Slamming a community for spamming chuck norris/murlock jokes is fine. Complaining about no one using the chat channels or ridiculing noobs asking basic questions is fine. Crying about getting killed "for no reason" on a ffa pvp server and calling the player base neanderthal,whiney,maladjusted,short attention spanned,etc is pathetic.
I actually found that the community was the best part of this game. When i was playing there was no reward for killing other players, so maybe 20% of all people i met were hostile. That added to immersion because you never let your guard down, always looking at people while you are passing by them, trying to figure out are they going to kill you or not.
Maybe thats changed now but in the first month it was fun.
People are fussing over stupid things like voiceovers (always skiped the dialoge, whateveryou choose outcome will be the same), or dx10 (what this game really needs is better underwater environment) when therer is so customization of yout character, items suck, inventory icons bland too, no crafting and no fun.
And everybody says that the best part of the game was from lvl1 to lvl20. Onyl good thing in that part i could find was the destiny quest and it was bugged then. Maybe because i was aquilonian, but 20-40 was really good.
I played AoC to level 80 twice on pvp servers, calling the player base a quote "Neanderthal Player Base" is the understatement of the year......I think your review was spot on, and the anti-reviewers posting here are the perfect example of the mentality of the player-base in AoC. Neanderthal, LOL, why do I get the feeling that these people are the cavemen in the Geico commercials. :P
AoC, so easy even a Neanderthal can bitch about it, Too funny.
"I want Evercrack on Steroids"