You also give up any claim that any use by SOE and/or its Third Party Providers of any User Content violates any of your rights, including but not limited to moral rights, privacy rights, rights to publicity, proprietary or other rights, and/or rights to credit for the material or ideas set forth therein.
They'd be hard pressed to present chat between two people in tells as "User Content" in court.
All they have done is made it so if you make a custom UI or some other improvement to the game and they decide to integrate it, they don't have to compensate or even credit you for it.
Also, here in California for example, a contract removing your legal rights is non-enforceable and will be tossed out as invalid the minute it hits the court system.
This is why I NEVER type anything in game, if I can not use Voice Chat to say it, it doesnt get said.
At least for now they can not log voice conversations.
Still pisses me off to the point Im strongly considering canceling my accounts just to make a statement.
Any organized boycott just gimme the nod.
I have 3 all inclusive accounts and spend around $100 a month on LON. Maybe alone I wont bring them down, but enough people like me pulling their accounts we could sure make them take notice.
This is why I NEVER type anything in game, if I can not use Voice Chat to say it, it doesnt get said. At least for now they can not log voice conversations.
Still pisses me off to the point Im strongly considering canceling my accounts just to make a statement. Any organized boycott just gimme the nod. I have 3 all inclusive accounts and spend around $100 a month on LON. Maybe alone I wont bring them down, but enough people like me pulling their accounts we could sure make them take notice.
Nice try but that won't work with SOE as that ToS covers all there Station Games.
Seriously, some guys reading some old game tells like "hey hun i'm so blue 2day cause he didnt want to slep with meme, hun".. so what? It's not like they're going to call you and laugh at you just because you confessed something personal and whatsoever. People on the streets don't even care about random people's sex lives, why would "scientists" care about even less interesting stuff?
Also learn what you actually do when you use message programs or play online games. Some stuff aren't supposed to be said near any techonological gadget AT ALL.
EDIT: For people who gave away CC info by game tells... You know you deserve it.
Ultima Online 98~04 Dark Age of Camelot 03~07 Final Fantasy XI 04~06 Guild Wars 05~08 World of Warcraft 04~05 Unsuccessful Tries: DFO/EQ2/DRaja/Rag/Req/RYL/9D/Cabal/KO/PSU/RF/GE/TO/TR/DDO/EVE/LoTRO/L2/RZ/SWG/VG
Really only account info is 'personal' data. Chat logs are completely the companies. The question is how much of that 60TB is account info? Probably not that much.
I'd be embarrased if anyone found out i'd played any of SoE's games.
I really don't think they are. The Eula would not be enforceable in most European countries and there is such a thing as privacy which should just be respected, especially very volatile data like in-game tells.
I can't begin to imagine how much of that data is personal but I would assume a great deal is very personal info about these players. Data which, without any real approval or notion on the player's part, is now in the hands of people who have no business whatsoever with these people's private lives but are now able to access this data and probably even distribute it under themselves and who knows who else.
We're not talking about 1 phone call either, we're talking about 400.000 players here, all from different countries and nationalities.
Whether it is right or wrong to give away data, i am thinking they are in their legal right to do so else they would not have done it, it does not help SOE's image.
A lot of peeps hate SOE already from the SWG episode and recent ingame store episode. So why they choose to sell/give data now is beyond me.
Maybe it is their way of getting back at their customers for all the bad things that have been said about them in the past lol!
Regardless, this is a wrong move by SOE, more so for making it public, at the end of the day they need good press not bad.
I am kind of ashamed of you all. When you should be mourning the future cyber friends that will be too weary to venture into the chaos alone... here you are crying about the past.
We are reaching a point in America I think where people are so bored with right to privacy and freedom that some give it up without a care. And why not, as it has been some time since we have fought within our own borders for such ideals.
Some of the comments here are sad. Privacy is something that should be protected and preserved, not whored out to whoever has the money to exploit it.
There's also no mention of a contract between parties when this info was released. So anyone who was given this info is allowed to distribute it now.. or what?
Are we going to find cyber chat and personal credit card data and what not online soon, who's going to get the blame then? I don't see any mention of a contract, so this info is now public domain?
It's irresponsible on SoE's part, that's all I can say.
You could google your credit card details and find out I suppose. But ironically that would then circulate them if they werent previously available. Its like the cat in a box.
Playing polished, lag free, feature complete games is carebear. Whining about a game you hate but still play is hardcore man!
There's also no mention of a contract between parties when this info was released. So anyone who was given this info is allowed to distribute it now.. or what? Are we going to find cyber chat and personal credit card data and what not online soon, who's going to get the blame then? I don't see any mention of a contract, so this info is now public domain? It's irresponsible on SoE's part, that's all I can say.
Again, it is irresponsible for people to spill that kind of information into an online game. I don't care if you had to tell the Pope himself your private information through a PM. If someone leaks the log and your info is stolen you only have yourself to blame.
Seriously people, quit blaming everyone else for your own stupidity. You can cry all your want about your privacy rights but didn't we learn when we were children that crying fixes nothing?
It's a Jeep thing. . . _______ |___| \_______/ = |||||| = |X| \*........*/ |X| |X|_________|X| You wouldn't understand
There's also no mention of a contract between parties when this info was released. So anyone who was given this info is allowed to distribute it now.. or what? Are we going to find cyber chat and personal credit card data and what not online soon, who's going to get the blame then? I don't see any mention of a contract, so this info is now public domain? It's irresponsible on SoE's part, that's all I can say.
Again, it is irresponsible for people to spill that kind of information into an online game. I don't care if you had to tell the Pope himself your private information through a PM. If someone leaks the log and your info is stolen you only have yourself to blame.
Seriously people, quit blaming everyone else for your own stupidity. You can cry all your want about your privacy rights but didn't we learn when we were children that crying fixes nothing?
It doesn't excuse SoE's actions. The reason this data is given to these people is exactly because it is very volatile and private data which is normally not accessible by normal means, which is why I can't believe they are getting away with this. Well, for now, I'm sure some people will raise an eyebrow.
We are reaching a point in America I think where people are so bored with right to privacy and freedom that some give it up without a care. And why not, as it has been some time since we have fought within our own borders for such ideals.
Some of the comments here are sad. Privacy is something that should be protected and preserved, not whored out to whoever has the money to exploit it.
Don't act like this truth is brand new.
Those who sacrifice essential liberties, for temporary security, deserve neither and will get none - Benjamin Franklin
I really don't think they are. The Eula would not be enforceable in most European countries and there is such a thing as privacy which should just be respected, especially very volatile data like in-game tells.
I can't begin to imagine how much of that data is personal but I would assume a great deal is very personal info about these players. Data which, without any real approval or notion on the player's part, is now in the hands of people who have no business whatsoever with these people's private lives but are now able to access this data and probably even distribute it under themselves and who knows who else.
We're not talking about 1 phone call either, we're talking about 400.000 players here, all from different countries and nationalities.
If you reveal personal information in a public place that does not grant you any protection just because the information was personal. I agree with you completely that information about the account holder is off limits but people chatting in the game (a commercial product owned by SoE) should have absolutely no expectation of privacy. In fact in that situation you should have an expectation that you're being monitored.
First of all, just because it is stated in their tos or eula or whatnot does NOT make it legal.
Had they written in their eula that they at any time could enter your house, rape your cat, seel your kids to slavery, steal all you cash and poke you in the eye does NOT mean they can do that and get away with it.
Some things are non-negotiable, regardless of what you put down on paper.
I do not however think we have heard all sides of this story yet, and I would like to before I make up my mind.
If it turns out though that anything I write in ANY chat in a SOE game will be instantly harvested and sold to whoever wants that information, legal or not I think I am forever done with SOE.
And to be honest so should everyone.
All other things aside, privacy laws, moral and or ethical viewpoint I am fairly certain that are financial laws in place here that could end this.
As in it not being legal to charge you for supplying your information for them to sell?
Can not say how things work in the USA, people seem to have very little rights there in regards to corporations.
In Sweden though, and several other european countries, this is wildly illegal.
No matter how many thousands of clauses you add to your "contract".
Then again, I would like to hear the full story here.
Legal or not, not even SOE is this stupid I hope.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This next sentence from the link does put this topic in a complete different perspective.
Thanks to a partnership with Sony, a team of academic researchers have obtained the largest set of data on social interactions they've ever gotten their hands on: the complete server logs of Everquest 2, which track every action performed in the game.
And I feel the reason why they got it or obtained it is far more intresting then questioning why SOE gave 60tb away.
I wonder if OP has actualy read the articel, it's pretty intresting, so thanks atleast for sharing that. Shame on the direction OP seems to wanted to go with this topic, which to me has nothing at all to do with the linked articel.
Comments
Think you'll find its the people who KNOw they've giuven out CC info and are currently shitting bricks
Locklain: lol im not getting hostile , just highlighted for Zorvan the only really relvant info in the thread for him.
Playing polished, lag free, feature complete games is carebear. Whining about a game you hate but still play is hardcore man!
They'd be hard pressed to present chat between two people in tells as "User Content" in court.
All they have done is made it so if you make a custom UI or some other improvement to the game and they decide to integrate it, they don't have to compensate or even credit you for it.
Also, here in California for example, a contract removing your legal rights is non-enforceable and will be tossed out as invalid the minute it hits the court system.
This is why I NEVER type anything in game, if I can not use Voice Chat to say it, it doesnt get said.
At least for now they can not log voice conversations.
Still pisses me off to the point Im strongly considering canceling my accounts just to make a statement.
Any organized boycott just gimme the nod.
I have 3 all inclusive accounts and spend around $100 a month on LON. Maybe alone I wont bring them down, but enough people like me pulling their accounts we could sure make them take notice.
Haha! I love it!
_______
|___
\_______/
=
|X| \*........*/ |X|
|X|_________|X|
You wouldn't understand
Nice try but that won't work with SOE as that ToS covers all there Station Games.
I wonder why you people care..
Seriously, some guys reading some old game tells like "hey hun i'm so blue 2day cause he didnt want to slep with meme, hun".. so what? It's not like they're going to call you and laugh at you just because you confessed something personal and whatsoever. People on the streets don't even care about random people's sex lives, why would "scientists" care about even less interesting stuff?
Also learn what you actually do when you use message programs or play online games. Some stuff aren't supposed to be said near any techonological gadget AT ALL.
EDIT: For people who gave away CC info by game tells... You know you deserve it.
Ultima Online 98~04
Dark Age of Camelot 03~07
Final Fantasy XI 04~06
Guild Wars 05~08
World of Warcraft 04~05
Unsuccessful Tries: DFO/EQ2/DRaja/Rag/Req/RYL/9D/Cabal/KO/PSU/RF/GE/TO/TR/DDO/EVE/LoTRO/L2/RZ/SWG/VG
Really only account info is 'personal' data. Chat logs are completely the companies. The question is how much of that 60TB is account info? Probably not that much.
I'd be embarrased if anyone found out i'd played any of SoE's games.
I really don't think they are. The Eula would not be enforceable in most European countries and there is such a thing as privacy which should just be respected, especially very volatile data like in-game tells.
I can't begin to imagine how much of that data is personal but I would assume a great deal is very personal info about these players. Data which, without any real approval or notion on the player's part, is now in the hands of people who have no business whatsoever with these people's private lives but are now able to access this data and probably even distribute it under themselves and who knows who else.
We're not talking about 1 phone call either, we're talking about 400.000 players here, all from different countries and nationalities.
Whether it is right or wrong to give away data, i am thinking they are in their legal right to do so else they would not have done it, it does not help SOE's image.
A lot of peeps hate SOE already from the SWG episode and recent ingame store episode. So why they choose to sell/give data now is beyond me.
Maybe it is their way of getting back at their customers for all the bad things that have been said about them in the past lol!
Regardless, this is a wrong move by SOE, more so for making it public, at the end of the day they need good press not bad.
I am kind of ashamed of you all. When you should be mourning the future cyber friends that will be too weary to venture into the chaos alone... here you are crying about the past.
Stars have nothing to do with anything. I've had stars for being active and lost them for inactivity, so what.
Tut tut. Glad i didnt play any SOE products.. certainly won't be trusting them with any future ones.
We are reaching a point in America I think where people are so bored with right to privacy and freedom that some give it up without a care. And why not, as it has been some time since we have fought within our own borders for such ideals.
Some of the comments here are sad. Privacy is something that should be protected and preserved, not whored out to whoever has the money to exploit it.
There's also no mention of a contract between parties when this info was released. So anyone who was given this info is allowed to distribute it now.. or what?
Are we going to find cyber chat and personal credit card data and what not online soon, who's going to get the blame then? I don't see any mention of a contract, so this info is now public domain?
It's irresponsible on SoE's part, that's all I can say.
You could google your credit card details and find out I suppose. But ironically that would then circulate them if they werent previously available. Its like the cat in a box.
Playing polished, lag free, feature complete games is carebear. Whining about a game you hate but still play is hardcore man!
Again, it is irresponsible for people to spill that kind of information into an online game. I don't care if you had to tell the Pope himself your private information through a PM. If someone leaks the log and your info is stolen you only have yourself to blame.
Seriously people, quit blaming everyone else for your own stupidity. You can cry all your want about your privacy rights but didn't we learn when we were children that crying fixes nothing?
_______
|___
\_______/
=
|X| \*........*/ |X|
|X|_________|X|
You wouldn't understand
Again, it is irresponsible for people to spill that kind of information into an online game. I don't care if you had to tell the Pope himself your private information through a PM. If someone leaks the log and your info is stolen you only have yourself to blame.
Seriously people, quit blaming everyone else for your own stupidity. You can cry all your want about your privacy rights but didn't we learn when we were children that crying fixes nothing?
It doesn't excuse SoE's actions. The reason this data is given to these people is exactly because it is very volatile and private data which is normally not accessible by normal means, which is why I can't believe they are getting away with this. Well, for now, I'm sure some people will raise an eyebrow.
sony is pathetic. why do people do business with them?!
Don't act like this truth is brand new.
Those who sacrifice essential liberties, for temporary security, deserve neither and will get none - Benjamin Franklin
I really don't think they are. The Eula would not be enforceable in most European countries and there is such a thing as privacy which should just be respected, especially very volatile data like in-game tells.
I can't begin to imagine how much of that data is personal but I would assume a great deal is very personal info about these players. Data which, without any real approval or notion on the player's part, is now in the hands of people who have no business whatsoever with these people's private lives but are now able to access this data and probably even distribute it under themselves and who knows who else.
We're not talking about 1 phone call either, we're talking about 400.000 players here, all from different countries and nationalities.
If you reveal personal information in a public place that does not grant you any protection just because the information was personal. I agree with you completely that information about the account holder is off limits but people chatting in the game (a commercial product owned by SoE) should have absolutely no expectation of privacy. In fact in that situation you should have an expectation that you're being monitored.
As long is its not credit card info and such I could care less.
that's pretty crap. No idea if it's illegal or not but mmo players might take exception to this and take their business elsewhere.
First of all, just because it is stated in their tos or eula or whatnot does NOT make it legal.
Had they written in their eula that they at any time could enter your house, rape your cat, seel your kids to slavery, steal all you cash and poke you in the eye does NOT mean they can do that and get away with it.
Some things are non-negotiable, regardless of what you put down on paper.
I do not however think we have heard all sides of this story yet, and I would like to before I make up my mind.
If it turns out though that anything I write in ANY chat in a SOE game will be instantly harvested and sold to whoever wants that information, legal or not I think I am forever done with SOE.
And to be honest so should everyone.
All other things aside, privacy laws, moral and or ethical viewpoint I am fairly certain that are financial laws in place here that could end this.
As in it not being legal to charge you for supplying your information for them to sell?
Can not say how things work in the USA, people seem to have very little rights there in regards to corporations.
In Sweden though, and several other european countries, this is wildly illegal.
No matter how many thousands of clauses you add to your "contract".
Then again, I would like to hear the full story here.
Legal or not, not even SOE is this stupid I hope.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This next sentence from the link does put this topic in a complete different perspective.
Thanks to a partnership with Sony, a team of academic researchers have obtained the largest set of data on social interactions they've ever gotten their hands on: the complete server logs of Everquest 2, which track every action performed in the game.
And I feel the reason why they got it or obtained it is far more intresting then questioning why SOE gave 60tb away.
I wonder if OP has actualy read the articel, it's pretty intresting, so thanks atleast for sharing that. Shame on the direction OP seems to wanted to go with this topic, which to me has nothing at all to do with the linked articel.